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Can halflings with a Gargoyle and a Third Race parent have children with humans - or human/Third Race halflings with Gargoyles?
With or without the aid of magic or advanced science?
I would like to make a few questions about The Children of Oberon's weakness: Iron.
1) Why they are vunerable to it to begin with?
2) Is iron COMPLETLY inmune to their magic, or only highly resistent to it?
3) If so, how much iron composition other substances (like Steel) would need to be at least resistent to their magic?
4) If a Children of Oberon turn itself into a creature stronger than an average Gargoyle, would he/she be able to break a iron chain with it's bare hands?
5) If the Children of Oberon can't affect iron with magic, how did Oberon managed to do things like levitating Xanatos' laser-gun, shockwave several robotic gargoyles and melt a lamppost with his bare hands?
1. Maybe because most iron comes from outer space? (Honestly, I don't know. They just are. Like Mon-El's vulnerable to lead.)
2. Iron is immune, but if you can pick up a pair of wood tongs with your magic, you can use the tongs to pick up the iron rod. (Or something like that.)
3. Any iron in an alloy adds resistance, but if you're looking for a numerical value, you've asked the wrong guy.
5. Depends what they are made of. And also look at the answer to question two. A mighty wind is a mighty wind and can blow anything out of it's path. If Oberon can create a wind, it blows.
Did Demona carefully think through her Operation Clean Slate plan? If the virus was meant to eliminate all human beings, wouldn't that kill Macbeth, as well? If so, that would mean that by her killing him she would be engineering her own death due to their magical link.
Greg Weisman says:
"Good question. Keep in mind that magic isn't an exact science. The Weird Sisters told Macbeth and Demona that 'When one lives both live.' Demona used the magic Praying Gargoyle statue to insure she would survive the fullfillment spell. So would Macbeth have survived? Probably. She knows about the mortality link. She would not want his death at her hands if that resulted in her own. Towards Macbeth, her impulse should not be murderous by necessity. And mindset has a real effect on magic results. However, Demona isn't the most stable and rational of characters. She certainly has murderous feelings toward Macbeth. And if their linking spell 'perceived' the death of all humanity as a successful attempt to kill Macbeth, then it might very well have killed her as well. Did she consider this? Maybe.
Maybe it was a risk she was willing, even eager to take. Maybe somewhere underneath it all, she's a bit suicidal. Could she die with the idea of leaving behind a human-free 'paradise' where her daughter could live in safety? Remember, Moses led the Israelites to the Promised Land, but he was not allowed to enter it himself. Maybe that's how Demona felt about it.
Then again, maybe not. Very provocative question."
[Response recorded in the Station 8 "Gargoyles" FAQ, Section VI.]
1. What is the difference between a wizard/witch and sorcerer/sorceress in the Young Justice Universe?
2. What is an alchemist in the Young Justice universe?
3. Is it more difficult for a magic user to use nonverbal spells then verbal spells on Earth 16?
4. What type of magic users are Zatanna and Zatara before he become Doctor Fate?
5. What were the main influences in how you decided to portray magic in Gargoyles and Young Justice?
1. There is none.
2. Someone who practices alchemy.
3. Depends on too many factors to answer cogently.
4. These seem like semantic concerns that I'm not sharing.
5. Mostly logic.
Hi Mr. Greg Weisman,
I have been a fan of yours since Gargoyles. One of the things that interest me is the basic structure of the themes and world building in the series. One of the styles I see continue to pop up in your series is the relationship between science and sorcery. This is something I have been a fan of in comics like Iron Man and Fantastic Four (specifically Dr. Doom versus Reed Richards). I love the simple explanation that energy is energy.
1. Now I didn't see much of this argument come up in your Spectacular Spider-Man series, because Peter debunked Mysterio, but can you say that you ever planned to and who you would've used to explore that science versus mystic aspect?
2. I am upset that directors such as Jon Favreau and Shane Black have knocked down the very idea of Mandarin showing up as not to approach the so-called mystic aspect. Though, it could be be alien in origin or something, as they claim and prove that even super-science isn't allowed in the MCU. Have you read and understand the Iron Man comics specific to Mandarin and Tony's relationship to science versus sorcery? Was it influential at all in your writing?
1. Well, we had Calypso. I'm not going to get into much beyond the fact that we would have explored her character more.
2. I'm not sure specifically to what you're referring. I've read comics from the 60s, 70s and 80s with Iron Man and Mandarin. Probably nothing more recent than that. In any case, I don't think it influenced me much if at all.
I forget to include a question mark on the last post,I try to write proper English so writing a declarative statement on site where you ask questions is quite embarrassing.
But since I do not want to waste your time are the terms magic/sorcery used in your shows different from each other or are they just the same thing.
I think of magic as the substance and sorcery as the manipulation of that substance. But I'm not sure if we've been terribly consistent about it. (And you forgot a question mark again.) ;)
I just wanted to ask something about the gargoyles episode The Gathering part 2.
Was Xanatos wearing an iron suit?If the suit is iron,how was Titania able to freeze him?
His helmet was off.
In "Golem", when Vogel reads the spell to transfer Renard's consciousness into the Golem, was he reading Hebrew in the original alphabet or a Latin alphabet transliteration?
I don't know. I'd have to look at the episode to see if it's visually obvious.
First and foremost, I probably should've looked more carefully when asking the previous question, and I'm sorry for that.
I've checked around the archives, and taken a better look, and haven't found an answer for this.
Sevarius stated once that if a Gargoyle didn't go through stone sleep, they would have to eat several cows in order to get the energy they need. Demona doesn't go through stone sleep anymore, so how does she get the energy she needs for when she becomes a gargoyle once more?
I'm not sure you're quoting Sevarius correctly, but in any case... magic compensates for Demona's lack of stone sleep.
I have a question for you about the half-mortal, half-Third Race hybrids. I know that the Children of Oberon cannot use their magic directly on iron. But can half-mortal hybrids use Third Race magic to directly affect iron?
No. Unless they're using mortal magic.
In "Heritage" Natsilane battles Raven using a shield and spear. In the course of the battle, we see Nick wield the shield almost as if it was a magical force field and he shoots some sort of lighting bolt from the spear.
Are the spear and shield themselves magically powerful? Or are the just ordinary battle gear that have channeled magic because they are being used by Natsilane the Chief of this Haida tribe? In other words, is the magic coming from the tools themselves or from Natsilane due to his heritage?
How about all of the above?
How does magic work in the Young Justice cartoon? Is it similar to how it worked in Gargoyles?
There are rules, if that's what you're asking. But you'll have to watch and see for the specifics.
Hello again Greg,
A while ago, before I got a hold of Clan Building vol. 2, I asked you this question:
<<Following up on what Clark asked, how is it that such a powerful artifact, the Phoenix Gate, is used by such a simple incantation that even Goliath, certainly no trained sorcerer, quickly learned it? Maybe I'm conditioned by role-playing games to assume that more powerful magic will always be harder to learn than relatively weak magic, but it seems quite strange to me that the Phoenix Gate incantation, and for that matter the incantation to enter Avalon, are so quickly learned when they seem to be quite powerful spells.>>
<<It has to do with the nature of the Gate and of Avalon. I don't want to go into too many details (particularly on the former) when we're so close to the release of the Trade.>>
Reading the vol. 2 trade paperback nicely cleared up for me why the Phoenix Gate is so easy to use and just how dangerous it is! In fact it makes me wonder whether the "incantation" is really an incantation in the usual sense... However, the other half of my question doesn't relate to the Gate, and if there was something in the trade paperback that answered my question... I missed it. Now that the three trades have been out for a while and the Phoenix Gate's nature has been (partially) revealed, I hope that you are in the mood to answer the other half of my question:
What is the reason that the Avalon incantation used by the Magus and Tom, seemingly a quite powerful spell, is so easy to use and to learn? Angela and Goliath seemed to pick it up rather easily.
Thanks and have a nice day.
I feel I've pretty much answered this. Reread everything above. All the clues are there. And if the answer isn't clear -- well, then good. ;)
Hello Greg. Congratulations on clearing out that gigantic queue, and thank you for opening for more questions.
I have a question or two in response to answers you gave relatively recently here.
Rebel asked you if Lexington and Hudson got to watch the sun rise in London due to jetlag, and you said yes.
That must have been an awesome and memorable experience for them. I remember Hudson remarked at the end of The Mirror that he wished he could have seen the sun, just once, before changing back into a gargoyle. Goliath actually spent a whole day awake thanks to the Eye of Odin, but I don't imagine he's eager to describe that particular experience to the others...
I wonder about Brooklyn, Katana, and Nashville, too -- whether they ever saw the sun. Unless the Phoenix took care to deposit them during the same time of day that it plucked them from every time it moved them, they probably experienced at least some jetlag. For that matter Goliath, Angela, and Bronx must have had jetlag during the World Tour. Or did Avalon compensate for that somehow?
Avalon and/or the Phoenix compensates magically in a way that a commercial jet cannot.
I still don't understand how magic works in the world of the Gargoyles?
Human magic seems to be incantation based, but mystical beings/creatures also could use incantations or thought magic at whim?
Is there a difference between magic users' power if they speak a spell versus just thinking of it, kind of like the old English belief in word magic?
I was watching the Magus fighting against the weird sisters and it looked like they were evenly matched with the Grimorum giving the Magus an advantage over them.
The Magus got a lucky shot in, basically, if you're talking about his confrontation with them outside Avalon.
Beyond that, the rest of your question has been answered. Check out the ASK GREG Magic archive.
In "The Gate" and "Tyrants", Brother Valmont summons up fiery arrows with the word "Saeth". Is this word an invention of yours, or an actual word from some ancient language (presumably Gaelic, by the look of it)?
1. Does Demona absorb thermal energy while in human form, the way other gargoyles absorb thermal energy while in "stone" form?
2. If not, how has Demona adapted?
For the Mayan Clan, those who wear the magical prevention-turn-to-stone pendants, how does sleep work for them, or is it no longer needed? Also, to follow this how do they contain their gargoyle strength with out stone sleep?
See the archives.
Hey, I was just curious as to the exact incantation and the proper spelling of it for the Phoenix Gate, I've seen many different versions and I just want to know which is the true one. I've scoured the archives and I've seen nothing on that specific topic and I apologize if I missed it. Thanks so much!
Deslagrate muri tempe et intervalia.
(I'm kinda amazed I remember that.)
Did all the foreign people & gargoyles in "The Green" & "Bushido" that got to speak know how to speak English or are Goliath, Angela, & Elisa for some reason trilingual? (It just piqued my curiosity that you couldn't really have everyone speak English without some explanation for dubbing purposes.)
This also kinda raises a question on why the Emir read the scroll to capture Anubis in English instead of Arabic. (Unless the scroll weren't written in Arabic. Was it?)
There are two ways to interpret things. One is that the Gate compensated, and Elisa, Goliath and Angela were magically adjusted to the local lingua without them even being aware of the change. It's also possible that the folks at the other end were speaking English.
Can no magic, in the Gargoyle Universe, bring the dead back to life? Even Oberon's? I ask cause I remember while Anubis said he wouldn't bring the Vizer's son back to life (it would upset the natural order) I don't remember if he ever said he couldn't.
Anubis didn't say either way.
(And it was the Emir's son.)
G2009 Radio Play - Act Three
Norman Osborn was a fool. So obsessed with the power of science, he kept the Crown of Thorns in this vault as if it was just another souvenir – albeit an expensive one – to hang upon his wall. But with the Crown and the Spear of Destiny together, I now have the power to force all of humanity to its knees.
These are Christian icons, Demona. Not every human being is a Christian.
Not every human being speaks Latin, but that didn't stop me from using a Latin spell to turn a city-full of humans to stone. The magic I wield is potent beyond measure. Mine is the Kingdom and the Power and the Glory. No human may resist. No human will be spared. None will be spared who oppose me. Just look at this fool…
Her name is Obsidiana.
Of course it is. For she wears the mystic Obsidian pendant fashioned by human sorcerers. Even that is enough to put her in my thrall. She has relinquished her gargoyle birthright.
I have relinquished nothing.
Demona waves the Spear of Destiny, and Electro rises and blasts Goliath back into the wall.
Yes, I'm surprised you're unaffected… since you reek of humanity. The stink of your human whore is in your hair, on your lips, everywhere. And nothing in this world will give me more pleasure, Goliath, than watching your detective on her knees to me, as she draws her service revolver and thanks me with tears of joy in her eyes… before gratefully blowing out her own brains.
That will never be.
No? My power expands with every second. I doubt she's far away.
You will not harm Elisa.
Goliath advances on Demona. Electro blasts away, but Goliath will not be stopped…
No one ever said you weren't persistent, Goliath. But what do you hope to gain?
(through gritted teeth)
I will turn these forces back upon you.
Impossible. I am the last true gargoyle left on this world. The Crown's magicks cannot touch me.
So you believe. But I am not the only one who reeks of humanity. Am I… Dominique?!
Goliath grasps the crown. The thorns bite into his hands, drawing blood. They struggle for control of the immense power…
691. GOLIATH, DEMONA
<roaring to the heavens>
Goliath's intervention – and his complete immunity to the Crown's effects – creates the smallest of fluctuation in Demona's control. In a haze, Spider-Man lifts his arm…
He shoots off a web, yanking the bloody crown from Demona's head.
There is a massive explosion of mystic energy and light! Demona, Goliath and Electro collapse.
The Spear… the Crown…
Gone. I think they… blew up. Calypso's gone too. But I'm betting that's just a talent of hers. And I'd guess she's taken Kraven and the pussycat with her.
But the Big Bad's still here…
Leaving behind, as always, nothing but a handful of thorns…
Goliath, Spider-Man and Demona sit. Jonah, Elisa, Matt and George STAND.
While Goliath helps Obsidiana, Spidey webs up Demona, Electro and Ock. In the outer vault, Zafiro and the Trio recover, finding only an unconscious and de-venomed Eddie Brock. Outside, the bad guys have all been beaten. Goblin and Vulture, their tech badly damaged, barely manage to fly away. Carnage and Jupiter are once again Cletus and John.
I'm here, Johnny. Your old Pop's here…
Call an ambulance, Elisa. Old Man Dracon said something about seeing a light. Then he collapsed. A stroke or something. I've been giving him C.P.R.
Matt… Matt! You can stop. Stop. He's gone.
You're gargoyles are flying off, Detective.
Really? Not sure I see 'em myself. But is that Spidey web-slinging away?
You think? I must have missed him?
Are you all blind?! They're right over there!
714. GEORGE, MATT, ELISA (UNISON)
Oh, give it a rest, Margot…
Elisa, Matt, George, Margot and Jonah sit. Peter, May, Harry and Gwen STAND.
Back at the bus…
I'm back. And not a single decent picture to show for my efforts.
Well, you tried your best, Peter. I'm sure Mr. Jameson will appreciate that.
Oh, yeah. He's a sweetheart that way.
Emily Osborn watches as her son finally emerges from the bathroom.
Hey, Gwen. I feel much better.
Harry, Gwen, Peter and May sit. Jonah and Robbie STAND.
Later that night, at The Bugle…
Whaddayou mean I can't publish it?! How else can I make them all pay for what they did to Johnny!
You can't publish because the authorities refuse to comment. We have no pictures or statements to corroborate a story that includes gargoyles, a dead Green Goblin and everything except the kitchen sink. No one will believe it. I was there, and I don't believe it! Print this, Jonah, and The Bugle becomes the next Daily Tattler.
Ms. Brant, call the bomb squad. BECAUSE I'M ABOUT TO EXPLODE!!
Jonah and Robbie sit. Gwen, Peter, Kong, Curt, Harry, EMILY OSBORN and Mary Jane STAND.
Later still, aboard OsCorp's private jet en route to Miami…
I still can't believe we ran into you in the airport parking lot, Doctor Connors.
Yeah, and we're so sorry you got mugged.
Dude, they took your shoes?! That's hilarious! <laughs>
Yes, well, I just really appreciate the ride back to Florida…
Anytime, Doctor C. Anytime.
Harry, could I have a moment… in your father's office?
Uh, sure, Mom.
Curt, Kong and Gwen sit.
734. MARY JANE
736. MARY JANE
Tiny. Cute enough, but it's like talking to a tree stump.
Tried to warn you.
738. MARY JANE
Just say we'll spend the week as a threesome, okay, Tiger.
740. MARY JANE
Not that kind of threesome.
Mary Jane and Peter sit.
Meanwhile, Harry follows his mother Emily into the jet's private office.
I know you were playing at being the Goblin, Harry.
What?! Mom, that's crazy! I was in the bathroom…
Don't lie to me, baby. You hired the worst chauffer in the city to delay our progress. You had a secret hatch installed in the bus bathroom, so you could slip in and out undetected. And you left a pre-recorded "vomit tape" with voice recognition software. All very impressive for a sixteen-year-old. But you need to understand… the Green Goblin is not what your father wanted for you.
I have no idea what Dad wanted for me…
Then let him tell you…
She slips a DVD into the computer and Norman Osborn appears on screen…
NORMAN OSBORN STANDS.
Harry, my son. If you are watching this, then I am dead. And I have instructions…
Norman, Emily and Harry sit. Big Man, Blackie and SHARI STAND.
Meanwhile at the Big Man's office, he and Blackie Gaxton are visited by Shari, a young woman wearing a pendant depicting an eye atop a pyramid…
750. BIG MAN
Nine. Any problems?
753. BIG MAN
Not particularly. Ms. Destine was ready to believe I could find Dracon and the others useful.
And that faux Goblin was happy to believe I'd been fooled into thinking he was the real thing.
Blackie removes his false face, revealing that he is actually the Chameleon in disguise.
Just as he was happy to believe I was the real Blackie Gaxton. But I'm still not sure why the Society wanted all this…?
Isn't it enough to know the Illuminati appreciates your efforts?
CHAMELEON and Big Man sit. THAILOG, BRENTWOOD, Homunculus #1, Homunculus #2 And Homunculus #3 STAND.
Shari leaves Lincoln's office and pulls out her cellphone…
Dial Nightstone Unlimited.
The Spear? The Crown?
Waiting for you to send to Duval.
Brentwood capture little robot. Use it to control other little robots. When bright light shine, robots take spear and crown.
What should we do with the Homunculi?
Set them free. Maybe they'll get their own series some day.
767. HOMUNCULUS #1
Free, free, set them free…
768. HOMUNCULUS #2
On basic cable and DVD…
769. HOMUNCULUS #3
Homunculus #3, Homunculus #2, Homunculus #1, Shari, Thailog and Brentwood sit. Elisa and Goliath STAND.
At the castle, Elisa's cell rings.
Maza… Yeah, Captain Stacy said you might call. Sure, he's right here.
She hands the phone to Goliath, who doesn't quite know how to hold it. She takes it back and puts the call on speaker.
Hey, Goliath. It's your Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man.
You protect your… neighborhood.
Just like you do the super-hero thing without the tights.
Spider-Man, I think this is the beginning of a beautiful friendship.
Hey, I was just gonna say that. You saw that movie too?
God, I love you… <kiss>
Elisa, Goliath and Spider-Man sit. Kafka STANDS.
And finally – yes, finally – we end where we began. In the offices of Dr. Ashley Kafka at Ravencroft. She's on the phone to her Board of Directors.
After all that tsuris, little has changed. Otto and Eddie are still disassociative. Max still needs a cure, and John still wants power. Cletus? He just keeps repeating, "I got a taste now," over and over. Yes, we lost Dominic, I'm afraid. But we do have a new patient…
783. KAFKA (CONT)
Just wait until the sun goes down…
Dominique and Kafka sit.
NEXT: I finally get back to answering questions...
Following up on what Clark asked, how is that such a powerful artifact, the Phoenix Gate, is used by such a simple incantation that even Goliath, certainly no trained sorcerer, quickly learned it? Maybe I'm conditioned by role-playing games to assume that more powerful magic will always be harder to learn than the weak magic, but it seems quite strange to me that the Phoenix Gate incantation, and for that matter the incantation to enter Avalon, are so easily learned when they seem to be quite powerful spells.
It has to do with the nature of the Gate and of Avalon. I don't want to go into too many details (particularly on the former) when we're so close to the release of the Trade.
Thank you again Mr. Wiseman for answering these question from your fans. I have two related questions for you this time.
1. In regards to stone sleep, I had always imagined that the Gargoyles always biologically shift into "stone". The Gargoyles wiki talks about how when gargoyles are "stone" they are not actually stone but just really hard material that resembles stone. Assuming this is all true, I was wondering if then in the case of a broken statue, if you would be able to see the internal biology of the gargoyle such as bones, organ, blood vessels, etc. Granted they would be stone, but would they still be there?
2. This relates to Cold Stone and the stone pieces of his make-up. It was stated in the show that Cold Stone is made up of stone from three different gargoyles. Assuming that the various parts of the gargoyle anatomy would still exist in a stone state, would these not be visible upon inspection of Cold Stone's body?
3. When Demona turned the citizens of Manhattan to stone in City of Stone, was their stone sleep the same or similar to the Gargoyles? More importantly did their anatomy stay in tact like I am imagining the Gargoyle's do when they undergo stone sleep?
I have a lot of cool, though slightly morbid imaginer in my head about all of this. As always, I look forward to your response.
1. Given that the organic, stone-like substance is all the same color and consistency, it would be very difficult to discern specifics, but in theory, yes.
2. I'm not sure what you're asking. But I think the answer is yes.
3. I'm really not getting the distinction you're making here. Totally different process with the humans in City of Stone. They were magically turned to stone, but I don't see how that changes anything. You saw their facial features turn to stone. Within their bodies, their heart, liver, etc. also turned to stone. What did you USED to think happened?
I have a question about language and translations.
Concerning the language "issue" in the Avalon World Tour, and the fact that everybody encountered by the travellers seems to speak English, you once wrote,
<<"Avalon compensates when it sends people to where they need to be...">>
From your response to my "Reunion" review, long ago, it appears this is still the case in canon-in-training. But is this also why Angela can apparently speak English? She seems to speak English in Manhattan. At least, she and Elisa understand one another. It also seems that something was happening when Tom came to New York, and spoke to Morgan and Elisa. Likewise, King Arthur is able to speak to Griff and the Manhattan Clan. And the Avalon clan and their human parents had no trouble talking to Elisa. King Arthur, Tom, the Magus, and Katherine all went to Avalon before the Norman Invasion of England, so they cannot possibly have learned anything resembling modern English before they went there.
1. What is the reason that Angela, Tom, and King Arthur can communicate with modern English speakers?
2a. Do they notice they (or the people they are talking to) are speaking a different language?
b. Did Elisa, Goliath, and Angela notice the language changes during the World Tour?
3. Yes or no: Is this effect(s) on Angela and/or King Arthur permanent?
1. Again, I'm reduced to the notion that Avalon compensates.
2a. They don't seem to.
2b. They didn't seem to.
3. Seems to be.
In the "City of Stone" Part 1. How does Demona restrain Owen into a chair when shes speaking the "Stone By Night" spell?
This has been answered before. I'll refer you to the ASK GREG archives and to my ramble on that episode.
Is the way that a member of 3rd race uses magic versus the way that a normal human uses magic akin to the way a chess prodigy plays chess versus the way a learned man plays chess?
No. It's more akin to the way a master chess player plays chess and the way a master checkers player plays checkers. The board looks the same, but it's a totally different game.
I just watched a rerun of "Mark of the Panther" and it made me wonder about the exact interactions between lycanthropes and gargoyles in the gargoyles universe. I'll just limit it to a few questions, though.
1. Is Demona techinically a were-goyle/were-human? And is it possible for her to pass this condition on either through natural heredity or exchange of blood?
2. Can gargoyles become lycanthropes? If so, what gargoyle features would they retain, if any, when in wereform?
3. Is it possible to clone a lycanthrope and have the copy retain the original's 'abilities'?
Thanks a ton for taking the time to read this! I really appreciate it!
1. Technically, "werewolf" means man-wolf, or so I'm told. So I guess Demona is technically a were-gargoyle. I guess. As to her passing it on by blood exchange, no. As to her passing it on via heredity, I'm not answering that at this time.
2. Gargoyles are as vulnerable or NOT as anyone.
Since Demona turns into a human by day, courtesy of Puck in "The Mirror" (awesome episode), would she still lay eggs like a normal gargoyle or have liveborn offspring? Would it depend on her form at the time? What she mated with?
Form at the time.
Gargoyles when always turn to stone to 'sleep' but Why? and what sort of effect does the removal of such sleep (such as Puck's 'human form spell on Demona) do to their bodies? Demona turned into a Gargoyle when the sun went down, but does it mean she has a human or a Gargoyle sleep cycle, or does the change 'restore' her body as if she slept?
As I've noted before, Puck's magic compensates to some extent for Demona.
Dear Greg, I am curious, what are Thailog's opinions on magic?
Here's more scattered, random reactions to the comics, in lieu of actual reviews. So because I already posted a lot about it in the comment room, and I'm lazy, I'm skipping a review of 3-5 for now and going on to review the latest issues that I bought. Starting with #6, others coming later. How many times can I post in a row without being rude?
SPOILERS (if you haven't got #6 yet)
The art in this issue mostly looks really good, once I got used to the pencils, but Lexington and Brooklyn and some of the early frames of Angela looked wrong.
I noticed that the pictures of Gabriel and Iago were copied directly from specific shots in the animated series. That's interesting, they were immediately recognizable and I thought it was cool, it indicates that the artists are getting a hold of the episodes and paying attention to the art in them. I do wonder if they are supplied with the character model sheets, though.
I'm surprised that you changed the Avalon situation so that the magic does not translate. It is definitely cool to see the language issue addressed, but I thought that the magic translateion was more probable than that every single person they met on the other Tour stops spoke English, and well. Now I wonder how Angela, Tom, and King Arthur are able to communicate with English-speakers.
Lots of new mysteries. How do the Illuminati know about that World Tour stop? And what "seeds" were "sown" at that time? No doubt Xanatos is up to something...
Landing in a giant cooking/laundry pot is definitely a new way to travel.
Shari feeding Thailog grapes while he's dressed like a Roman emperor is... intereting. She should be careful about taunting him, though.
I'm a bit disappointed that we didn't see real yetis, but since All Things Are True, they are probably out there somewhere.
I enjoyed all the issues I've read so far and although this wasn't quite as fun as some of the others, it was still good.
SPOILERS (if you haven't got #6 yet)
I'm not sure I DID change the rules here. They were sent to speak to Coldstone, not Master Dawa or Sangpo.
This day in Gargoyles' Universe History....
Just before dawn, the gargoyles are attacked by "Macbeth". After sunrise, David Xanatos kidnaps Hudson's sleeping body and replaces it with a stone statue. At sundown, the other gargoyles awaken and believe that Macbeth has used sorcery to keep Hudson asleep. Goliath & Lexington search for a cure, while Brooklyn & Broadway protect the statue from "Macbeth". Meanwhile, Xanatos reveals that in his bid for immortality, he plans to use Hudson to test the Cauldron of Life. And on Avalon, the Archmages and their allies launch their attack on the Avalon Clan.
I scoured the appropriate archives and couldn't find the answer, so here goes nothing: feel free to snark me if you already answered it, and I'll go a-hunting some more.
So Oberon's Law works both as an actual restriction on ability (as in it can't be broken) but also as a rule (as in it can be bent), but I'm curious as to how halflings like Alex and Fox might be affected by Oberon's Laws. How tightly are halflings expected to adhere to Oberon's edicts and does it change depending on whether Oberon knows they exist?
Oberon seems to make some distinction depending on situation, as in the line: "As I see it, Fox has turned out to be regrettably human, and so we cannot interfere in her life. But the boy is of our blood..." He stands as the interpreter of his own laws, but now that Fox has proven that she is less "regrettably human" than he originally thought, does this change what laws Fox might have to obey? The non-interference rule is tricky for full blood children, and I can only imagine the loopholes are even easier to find when you're half mortal, but would there still be some applicable scenarios for Fox and Alex where this rule that can't be broken might apply? Like perhaps with the Phoenix gate-- would Alex be able to take the gate, or would someone have to give it to him? I'm especially curious about Alex, seeing as Oberon considers him "of our blood" and that Alex will be trained to use his powers.
I am likewise curious about Merlin. In order to guide the boy Arthur to become King Arthur, did Merlin have to "bend" the rules at all? Or did the No Interference rule not apply to him? What about the halfling New Olympians?
I wonder perhaps if there is some natural loophole in not knowing the law exists or not knowing the law applies to you. Or in Oberon not knowing you exist or that the law applies to you. With neither Fox nor Oberon knowing Fox was a halfling, that in itself might have been enough of a loophole for her. Now that they both know, I suppose it's all up for interpretation: whether or not Fox thinks the rule applies to her and (probably more importantly) whether or not Oberon think the rule applies to her. Ditto for Alex, and I can see how the "rules" that might not apply to Fox might still apply to him.
I imagine this is a matter of degrees and semantics. But maybe not, so I thought I'd ask.
The rule is magically enforced. Oberon doesn't need to know about you to enforce it. You don't need to know about Oberon to have it enforced. But -- as we've seen -- loopholes abound. The trickier you are the easier it is to find loopholes. Bloodline -- or blood purity, so to speak -- has nothing to do with it.
This day in Gargoyles' Universe History....
Lex finishes fixing the motorcycle, and Brooklyn takes it for a ride. He is attacked by a motorcycle gang that destroys the bike. Demona comes to his aid and convinces him that humans are a danger to the clan. He agrees to help her make Goliath see the truth through magic. Xanatos' jail sentence is officially recorded. It immediately becomes clear to Elisa that he will only have to serve half of his sentence, after time off for good behavior. Elisa finds a good home for the gargoyles in the Clock Tower above her precinct house.
Everyone converges at PackMedia Studios. Xanatos puts an end to the broadcast, but the spell is still in force. Macbeth attacks Demona, but she escapes. Goliath and Xanatos agree to team up to defeat Demona and end the spell. At dawn, the gargoyles all turn to stone. At the same time, the transformed humans become flesh again, without any memory of what had happened to them. Owen informs Xanatos that they need to set the sky on fire to break the spell. They begin preparations to do just that. When Elisa learns that the broadcast originated at the Xanatos-owned PackMedia Studios, she confronts Owen at the Eyrie Building. Both turn to stone at sundown. Shortly thereafter, the gargoyles arrive.
5:38am EST - [withheld]
This day in Gargoyles' Universe History....
Macbeth sees enough of the broadcast to realize what Demona is up to. Elisa goes to the Clock Tower to wait for the gargoyles to awaken. At sundown, Owen, Fox and Elisa (as well as most of the humans in Manhattan) turn to stone. The gargoyles awaken at sundown and discover Elisa and the other stone humans. (Thailog also awakens at sundown. With no one at the castle to warn him, he watches Demona's spell on television and immediately turns to stone. He will remain stone in the television room, 24 hours a day until the spell is broken. But he has had his first exposure to Demona.) The gargoyles stop at Robbins' house. Being blind, he was unaffected by Demona's spell. They begin to search the city for Demona, who's on a killing spree, destroying stone humans in the streets. Separately, Macbeth and Xanatos also seek Demona.
5:37am EST - [withheld]
This day in Gargoyles' Universe History....
The city honors Peter Choy and Rosaria Sanchez. Terrorists take hostages (including Brendan & Margot) at a bank. The gargoyles intervene and have their first encounter with the Weird Sisters. Wolf sees television coverage of the bank robbery and decides that he and the Pack are going to turn to a life of crime. Meanwhile, Demona and Xanatos initiate their plan to secure immortality by stealing a minute of life from everyone who watches their hijacked broadcast. However, Demona was fooling Xanatos, and actually succeeds in using the broadcast to turn everyone who watches into stone at night. Owen, Fox, Elisa and most of the humans in Manhattan see the broadcast. Xanatos does not watch.
5:36am EST - [withheld]
In "Possession", Puck said soul transference required voluntary cooperation to work. I have questions about what constitutes 'voluntary' cooperation for enabling soul transferance to work:
1)In the case of a man having a gun to his head and told if he doesn't cooperate with soul transference, he would die, would the soul transference work?
2)In the case of a man seeing his family/people that he care about on a tv with a gun pointed to head(s) and told if he doesn't cooperate with soul transference, one person/people will die, would the soul transference work?
3)In the case of man who believes that either he or somebody who cares about will die without actual proof if he doesn't cooperate, would the soul transference work?
Thank you for taking the time to respond to this question.
As usual, I'm not too interested in hypotheticals.
We know that there is faerie magic and mortal magic. Mortal magic seems mostly to be used by humans. Is it less common for gargoyles to study magic than humans? If so why?
Seems less common, but that may simply be because there are fewer gargoyles period.
Not so much a question, but an answer. Some time ago someone wondered why the Emir bothered to translate the Ancient Egyptian Papyrus of Thoth into English (or Arabic, since Avalon seemed to be translating everything for them) instead of reading it in Egyptian.
The Egyptian language has not been spoken aloud in 1,500 years. The Egyptians did not have Heiroglyphs for vowels so no one knows how the words were really pronounced. Cat and Cut, Ham and Home. They'd all be spelled the same in Egyptian and context was the only way to tell them apart.
If he hadn't translated it, the spell could have gone terribly wrong. Ironically it did anyway. Jackal-Anubis anyone?
Anyway that's my two cents, hope it helps.
It very much does. Thank you!!
This day in Gargoyles' Universe History....
Xanatos and Owen make a third attempt to transfer the souls of Iago and Desdemona into independent robot bodies. It too fails. Later, David and Fox go out for the evening, leaving Alexander in Owen's care. Owen decides to teach Alexander his first lesson in magic. Owen transforms into Puck, then glamours himself and Alexander into dead-ringers for Goliath and Hudson. They "liberate" Coldstone from the Eyrie and take him to the Clock Tower. There, "Goliath" convinces Angela and Broadway to allow the souls of Desdemona and Othello to take up temporary residence inside their bodies. Coldstone is emptied of all three souls, and the Iago soul secretly enters Brooklyn. "Goliath" and "Hudson" then depart, leaving "Brooklyn" in charge. Iago convinces Othello and Desdemona to try out their new bodies. He then follows them to the Statue of Liberty, where he hints that they might keep Broadway and Angela's bodies for themselves. Meanwhile, Puck and Alexander enter Coldstone's body; they grab Lex, tie him up in a corner and gag him.
If a gargoyle saw and herd the spell in City of Stone whould he stay stone at all times.
Yep. He might have a few seconds here and there, but yep.
If Latin and Hebrew are magical becose of thare age and that the spells where originaly righten in them, why dosn't the Emir in "Grief" read the Egyptian spells in Coptic (the Ancient Egyptian language).
Latin and Hebrew are no more magical than modern languages, but many spells were written originally in those languages. Obviously, for whatever reason, the Emir had his spell translated into English. You may ask, why the heck would he do that? And it's a DARN good question, you know? Darn good. Darn. Good. Darn.
Is there any special requirement for the learning of magic (besides the obvious time, preparation and practice)? That is, is everyone capable of performing sorcery if they learn how?
Some would have a greater aptitude than others, I would think, but sure.
I know you've said that Demona cast a spell on the Manhattan Clan right before they woke up in the 20th century that allowed them to understand modern English. My question is, how does Angela understand modern English? I would assume that she grew up speaking Old English, as she was raised by Tom/the Magus/Katharine.
Avalon compensates when it sends people to where they need to be...
Oh, and by the way, Demona casting a spell is just a possible answer to the original modern English question. Not a definitive answer.
im foggy on the episode titles because ive just watched both DVD releases but ive noticed in some episodes when the Gargoyles turn to stone any object they are holding turns to stone as well eg. Demonas gun, Hudsons sword however when Hudson turns to stone holding Merlins scrolls they remain unchanged is this a simple continuity error or was there a greater plan?
also Sevarius says that the way the Gargoyles have enough energy to fly is by storing solar energy in their stone form however Demona can fly after Puck changes her so she can be human by day, continuity error or greater design?
This is ALL in the archives...
The humility spell affects clothes and whatever at the moment they consider "part of their uniform". So Hudson's sword is inconsistent, depending on his mindset at sunrise.
Puck's magic compensates for Demona.
In response to a question Todd Jensen asked in July of 2003 that you responded to December 14 of 2004, about the spell of the Magus being broken when the castle rose above the clouds... it seemed to me that the only way this would make sense is if it WAS in fact necessary for the gargoyles to be in the castle when it was above the clouds for the spell to break. Maybe the terms of the spell were something to this effect, implying that the gargoyles home had to rise above the clouds? and in order for it to be considered their home they've got to be there? I mean, otherwise, seems pretty arbitrary just to include a clause about some random castle in the Grimmorum.
If the spell would be broken when the castle rose above the clouds no matter where the gargoyles were in relation to it, this creates a number of problems. a) assuming that Xanatos did not somehow magically assemble the entire Caslte Wyvern atop the world's tallest building in a single afternoon, wouldn't they have woken up at some point during the construction? b) if you're going to say, "well no, the entire castle had to be assembled for the spell to be broken"... I say to that.. what constitutes the "entire" castle? It also seems entirely implausible that they would be able to assemble the whole thing exactly brick for brick... probably some got worn away, stolen or whatever over 1000 years or so. and the caslte isn't a perfect replica anyway unless of course Prince Malcolm installed the elevators and the secret motorized compartments for storing laser guns back in 994 AD.
At any rate, it only really makes sense if somehow there was in fact some truth to Xanatos' lie, and that the gargoyles DID in fact need to be sitting on top of Castle Wyvern for the spell to break. Maybe after being frozen for so long they're considered part of the arhitecture.
I'm sorry, what's the bone of contention here?
I was wondering, I have been looking around for my answer, and I couldn't find but ONE part of it.
I'm simply wondering if you could post the magic spells that are spoken in Latin here. I'd love to see them. Like when Magus turns the clan into stone, or the spell to part the mists into the Isle of Avalon etc. The only one I could find in this page was the spell to make the Phoenix Gate work.
"Deflagrate muri tempi et intervalia!" Which means, "Burn down the walls of time and space!"
Thank you for your time.
I can't remember off the top of my head all the spells we used, and I'm not going to go script by script through 65 scripts to find them all...
But here are the two you specified...
Dormiatis dum castellum super nubes ascendant.
Vocate venti fortunate,
Ex ricae Oberonis,
Et hic navis frugum regate,
Ad orae Avalonis.
about the Humility Spell the Roman Magus cast on the Gargoyles species...
1. were any gargoyles aware that this spell was being cast? did any gargoyles object to it?
2. would this spell been possible without The Phoenix Gate, Eye of Odin and Grimorum?
3. is this spell common knowledge to gargoyles today? for instance, if Elisa asked Goliath why his clothes, etc turn to stone with him at dawn, would he know the reason?
4. does the spell cover gargoyle beasts as well?
1. Some were aware. I'm not going to start telling the story here in this format however.
3. I think it's inconsistent common knowledge. But, no, I don't think Goliath is aware of it. Not sure though.
4. In theory, but in practice... not much to cover, you know?
1.In Hunter's Moon why did Demona use a carrier virus to spread the detergent? Why not a bacteria seeing how they are more resilent abd there has been more research in using bacteria to produce certain compounds while viruses generally seemed to be used to insert genes.
2.How exactly did Demona hope to stop the carrier virus from mutating the chemical that it was suppose to carry especially since the component like the detergent would have killed the hosts and thus the virus thus there would have been a lot of selective pressure for the virus to not kill the host so that the virus could reproduce more in the human?
1. Maybe Demona isn't as up-to-speed as you are.
2. Uh... huh? Magic?
Greg, what is definition of 'magic'?
Check a dictionary.
This has always bothered me as i happen to love languages. What is the incantation and translation used to open up the firey ball for the Phoenix Gate? and is it in Latin or another language?
It's an ancient dialect of Latin. I call it that, since despite our best efforts we seem to have gotten the proper latin wrong.
"Deslagrate muri tempi et intervalia!" translates to "Burn down the walls of time and space!"
<Shaman: It is all around you, a dimension parallel to this one, a world of the mind and the heart. >
Since it's called the DREAMtime can regular people access the Dreamtime without Shamans by just falling asleep since it is a dimension of the mind and the heart.
<Shaman: Ah, you have returned. Why not bring your other guests into the light? Ah, you are from the Dreamtime. >
What exactly is the connection between the Dreamtime and Avalon. The shaman says the gargoyles and elisa are from the Dreamtime so is there some kind of connection between the two or was the Shaman just mistaken.
1. Frankly, I'm not sure we got the entire Dreamtime thing right, though we tried. I'll be honest, I'm not too clear on the Australian Aboriginal concept. So any answer I give is based on my limited, very limited understanding of it. One shouldn't regard me as an authority on the subject.
In theory... I guess, anyone should be able to access the Dreamtime. But that doesn't make it easy to do without training. Is this in fact the plain of dreams that we all visit nightly? Not sure. But the idea intrigues me.
2. My gut reaction is that the Shaman was mistaken. But I'm also open to the notion that there is a connection between Avalon and the Dreamtime. I like the ambiguity.
After watching Temptations again (in english... YEEEEAH) I still can't figure that spell thing out. So, I can, but the one thing still puzzles me:
Elisa re-used the spell to act as if it destroyed itself, or better put, as if it was never cast. However, the spell is not broken. It acts like Goliath would, but it is still there. So, here comes my question:
Will you ever use the fact, that the spell was never broken again? Will it be mentioned again in future EPs? Or will it even be broken?
Of course all this are "masterplan" questions, but maybe there's something you had in mind with it...
I pretty much see it as a dead issue. Elisa created a condition that nullified the spell's effects without actually cancelling the spell itself -- and then destroyed the page, so that no one else could counteract her cleverness.
If someday I came up with a dead brilliant idea, I'm not morally opposed to resurrecting the notion. But it would have to be more interesting than "Goliath is again under someone's control".
Sorry if these has been answered already, but I've been wondering about them for a while, mostly becuase I know that you mentioned that the stone form of the Gargoyles is something that should be highlighted as biological, not magical.
1. How is it determined what inanimate objects in contact with the gargoyles turn to stone when they sleep? Their clothing turns to stone with them, but Hudson's sword remains a sword. I also remember in "Long Way to Morning" Demona's gun also turned to stone.
2. Sevarius surmised that the Gargoyles get the energy they need to use their wings by storing solar energy in stone form. Then since "The Mirror", how does Demona recharge on solar energy? The same question goes for the gargoyles of "The Green".
1. The new search feature works great. It hardly took me ANY time to find the following in the archives...
"Response recorded on April 22, 2004"
This is in the archives over and over. At the time of transformation, if Hudson is thinking of his swordÂ as part of his uniform, it will turn to stoneÂ with the rest of his Â clothesÂ per a spell cast during the time of Caesar Augustus. If he's thinking about it as a separate weapon (or whatever) it won't. He doesn't even have to be conscious of the decision.
2. Magic compensates.
Hey Greg, I'm a fan of Gargoyles and I just stumbled upon your website. So to get to the point I was wanting to know if you could tell me all the encantations/spells used in the show. I find them all really cool. I especially like Puck's spells (most likely because he's my favorite character).
Thank you very much!
You know, I'd just have to go through all my tapes and/or scripts and transcribe them. And since it's been nearly two years since you posted, and I'm not even sure if you're still checking the site, I'm gonna pass on that chore.
Besides, just watch the eps and you can do it.
But I'm glad you liked the spells and Puck.
i must thank you for the awesome revelations abouit the Praying Gargoyle you gave us at G2K2! definitly one of my favirote talismans!
1. how did Demona learn of the Praying Gargoyle?
1b. how did Demona learn it was buried under Paris?
1c. how did Demona know it had regenarative powers on holy ground?
2. how long does it take the Praying Gargoyle to rebuild itself after being smashed?
3. is it a coicidence that the Praying gargoyle has these regenerative powers that are awfully similar to a gargoyle's "concrete cure-all"?
4. what is the Praying Gargoyle made of? stone? stone skin? something else?
5. until "Hunters Moon" did anyone of the Manhatten Clan know anything about the Praying gargoyle or that it even existed?
6. do the London, Ishimura or Mayan Clans have any knowledge of the Praying gargoyle before 1996?
i could go on, but thats enough, for now, thanks Greg! you rule!!!
1. Honestly don't know at this point.
1b. See above.
1c. See above.
2. 60 years.
4. Very astute question. Ingredients include an Atlantean Crystal, Gargoyle Skin and some powerful magic mojo.
5. I don't think so.
6. I'm not committing to an answer to this question until I figure out the answer to question 1.
Me again! I hope I'm not being picky or anything, but I wanted to ask you a question about Hudson's sword. . . sometimes when Hudson turns to stone, so does his sword, but other times it doesn't.
Why is this?
(What sorcerey is this!?)
This is in the archives over and over. At the time of transformation, if Hudson is thinking of his sword as part of his uniform, it will turn to stone with the rest of his clothes per a spell cast during the time of Caesar Augustus. If he's thinking about it as a separate weapon (or whatever) it won't. He doesn't even have to be conscious of the decision.
GREG THE SLAVE SPELL THAT DEMONA DID ON GOLIATH IT WONT WORK ANY MORE RIGHT BECAUSE DEMONA SAID IT WAS NOT FOREVER SO IT MUST BE OVER RIGHT
Demona said it was not forever? When?
As far as I know, it doesn't work because, (a) Elisa commanded Goliath to not let it work and (b) the page that was used to control Goliath was destroyed so that no one could countermand Elisa's command. Technically, I believe the spell is still in force.
1) The eye of Odin awake the possessor's hidden personality?
2) Does Goliath when putting on it become an abatar, but that it would pass Lexinton, Broadway, Hudson or Brooklin if they put it to him? Would it pass them the same thing or another thing?
Please give me your opinion Greg.
I hope you understand me because my English is not very perfect because I am Spanish.
Thank you for your attention.
1. It emphasizes it, brings it to the surface, etc.
2. I'm sorry, but I really don't understand what you are trying to ask. Are you asking if the others would manifest the exact same thing as Goliath did? If so, the answer is no. Everyone is unique.
Do you happen to know the spell that Demona cast in Hunter's Moon? If not, and you all didn't make one up, well, I and a whole lot of other gargoyles and Gargoyle fans would love it if you could.
I don't think we bothered researching any more Latin then we absolutely needed to. (And it seems we didn't do a great job on the Latin we did research.)
Be my guest.
This is, admittedly, a slightly silly question, but - does the humility spell that the Roman Magus put on the gargoyle race apply to gargoyle beasts as well, or exclusively to gargoyles? (Admittedly, it's likely to be a moot question, since I've never seen any sign of gargoyle beasts wearing clothes - and I certainly wouldn't advise trying to dress up Bronx in anything).
I guess it might apply to a collar or even a leash, but that would have to come from a beast who really liked his collar.
What's the incantation for the Phoenix Gate? Thank you.
Deslagrate muri tempi et intervalia.
The above is from memory. But I think it's right, i.e. what we used on the show. I've been told that the Latin is wrong, however. <shrugs>
How can Thailog and the Clones be cured of the clone virus when they're solid stone, and incapable of intraveneous injection? If science is a kind of magic, as Titania mentions in 'The Gathering' two-parter, no mage could meddle with it.
1. Don't take what Titania said too literally. She was making an analogy, not writing a treatise.
2. Keep in mind, you're talking Goliath Chronicles.
William Cain writes...
In the episode "Temptation", Goliath is placed under the a spell that makes him a slave to whom
Ever holds the Grimorum. OK. (A few point then my question and hopefully an answer.)
Point 1.The confines of the spell were that he would obey whoever held the book.
Point 2. In order to free Goliath from the zombie like state Elisa told him to act as is he was not placed under the magic spell.
Point 3. Demona took the actual counter spell.
I just don't feel that her having him act normal would cancel the effects of the magic as for him running around like a zombie yes but not the magic control its self but… I will leave that to you.
My question is if Demona was to take the book again could she take control over Goliath once more or are the effects of the spell no more?
Thank you for your Time
Here are my points:
1. Whoever held the spell. Not the book. At the end, Elisa was holding the spell.
2. Demona did not have the counterspell. She took other spells, like the one to summon Puck.
3. After Elisa issued her command, I'm betting they destroyed the spell. But who knows? (Well, I do. But I'm not telling.)
recorded on 08-30-01
Okay here is my thoughts,
How is a spell a tangible anything? How can you hold a spell?
-a spell is- a spoken word or form of words held or entrusted to have magic powers : The book or page that a spell is written on, isn't it just that a book or a page that has a spell written on it? What makes the paper or the book special? Couldn't any book or paper with a spell written on it be somehow endowed with the ability to flow with magic?
If Demona knows word for word the spell and wrote it on a legal pad (just as a reminder) couldn't she read it and being that she can channel magic be able to cast that spell?
Elisa holding the page to break the spell was quite a strectch of reason for me. Even though magic is quite illogical in the nature of itself. Gargoyles handled magic quite realistically. You said that you knew but wouldn't tell if the spell was broken but you revealed you think that most likely it would be. I do not see how the spell would be broken. He is still under the spell. But the spell is masked by itself acting as if it wasn't controlling him, allowing him to controll himself. Yet if Demona were to grab that spell and commanded the spell to stop masking itself, by the terms of the spell it should have to comply. It only makes sense.
The piece of paper with the spell on it. The Page. Not the book. That's the point, I was making as I believe you understand. And what makes that page special is the terms of the (verbal) spell itself. The spell (verbal) wanted to give the spell-caster a means of holding and/or transferring control of the slave. By giving that control to the person who held the document, the spell defined its own terms.
And no, I never said that the spell was broken or at least never meant to. I was referring to the page. And whether or not that page was destroyed, i.e. whether or not this paper control device could fall into the wrong hands, so to speak.
Finally, as I've noted before. You cannot simply read a spell and do magic. Becoming a spell caster takes years of practice. It's not just the words. It's about conduits and hand motions and control of emotion and thought and concentration. The caster is manipulating energies. The words are only a piece of the puzzle. Can't do the spell without them. But having the words on a legal pad isn't sufficient.
Elisa cannot do mortal magic. Neither can Goliath or Xanatos or even Owen when he's Owen. No training.
If Oberon were to be killed, or even removed from rulership of Avalon, would the third race be freed from his Law, or not? (I know this seems like a "duh" question, but I thought I'd ask and be sure)
It depends on who takes over.
1.Who created the Pray Gargoyle?
2.Were they human or gargoyle?
3.What was it's original purpose?
1. The Atlanteans.
2. Human, largely.
3. To protect their allies, the Gargoyles.
since halloween is coming soon, i've decided to make a grimorum for my costume and put some of the spells in it. But besides that, i'm curios. were and how exactly did you come up with the latin spells and poems? did you bring a latin team in to make all the spells? Who thought up the poems? Did they actually get some of the latin spells actually from old spell books that you might have heard about?
It's been a long time, and I know I've answered this question before, so you may want to check the archives for a response that was made when events were fresher in my memory.
But briefly -- no, of course, we didn't take the spells from real spell books. We made up the spells in English and then my story editors went to various sources for a translation. From what I've been told since, our sources were not that great, and there are mistakes in the Latin for almost every spell ripped from the Grimorum. Deslagrate for Deflagrate, I think was one example of an error.
(As far as I know, the Hebrew spells from "GOLEM" were correct. Not in a magic sense, but in a translation sense. Hebrew, being an ancient but still living language, was easier going for an accurate translation.)
We had better luck with the spells of the Children of Oberon, which could be in English, as long as they rhymed. Some of the rhymes are pathetic -- but even that adds to the fun, I think. As for who came up with them, it was either the writer on the individual episode, the story editor or me. (Or some combination.)
Speaking of magic spells, let me cast one on all of you...
HUMANS LOVE A CONVENTION HEARTY!
SO ASK GREG! COME ON LET'S PARTY!!!
That's right, we're bearing down on the Seventh Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles. This year's convention dedicated to the GARGOYLES series is taking place where it all began -- in MANHATTAN -- home of Goliath's Clan. The con staff is planning a fantastic event... and announced guests include Thom Adcox, the voice of Lexington, Character Designer Greg Guler and yours truly.
If you've been to the Gathering before, you know just what a blast it can be. And if you've never been -- here's your shot. I've mentioned this before, but if you'd like to see Gargoyles return in some way, shape or form, the single best thing you can do is to attend this con. Tell your friends. Bring your family. Come to Manhattan and glide along with us...
Check out the info at
1.Just curious how can the Stone of Destiny talk? Can we assume that the stone couldn't talk? If so then who gave it the ability to talk?
2. Who gave it its other abilities including the ability to teleport people?
1 & 2. You heard it talk, so it's a safe assumption it was talking. Beyond that, I'd rather not say. You're assumption that someone else gave it the power of speech, etc. is not a safe one, though I'm not saying it's innacurate.
Happy New Year
1.Can Golem, Talos, Coyote or the other science/magical based AI in the Gargoyles Universe use the Phoenix Gate, Eye of Odin or Grimorum?
2.What about Cagney or the Loch Ness monsters? Does the Eye of Odin work on them?
3.In one of your old posts you said there was a kind of magic called telikinetics so what is it?
3. Are you asking me to define telekinesis?
I was just reading the FAQ, and came across this
"During the time of Caesar Augustus, gargoyles would come to his court, and when they awoke at night their clothes would be torn to shreds. Augustus was a man of strong "family values," and in AD 10, he had a powerful mage (the original Magus) cast a Spell of Humility on the race. As a result, anything they considered "theirs" would turn to stone with them if they were in physical contact with it at sunrise."
Okay, but in The Mirror Hudson (I think) said you have to both hear and see magic. Dose this mean that the entire gargoyles race was in at the casting of the Spell of Humility and was in Rome? (I guessing the Magus cast the spell in Rome)
Most magic has that requirement, but some spells are more powerful. Particularly when you combine the Grimorum with the Eye of Odin and the Phoenix Gate.
1.You've said that there was someone prior to the archmage who joined together the grimorum, phoenix gate and eye of odin so when did this happen?
2.How did he integrate the grimorum into it? I know he didn't swallow it.
3.What did he do with the power?
1. Not saying.
2. That was only necessary for our Archmage because he was entering Avalon.
3. Entertaining stuff, I tell you.
1. Where do you suppose Macbeth acquired the Will-O-The-Wisp he used in "Pendragon"? b. Had he had it in his possession for long?
2. Are they still around in some abundancy, or was the one Macbeth had a definite rarity?
3. They don't seem to be sentient, but they do as they are instructed, and possess sensory abilities, right? Do they possess cognitive abilities as well?
4. Where did the Will-O-The-Wisp evolve from, Earth or Avalon (acknowledging that the two are linked)?
5. If the answer to No. 4 is Earth, what caused the Third Race to assume Avalon? b. If the answer to No. 4 is Avalon, were the Will-O-The-Wisps able to then go in between Avalon and Earth?
6. Did the Will-O-The-Wisps possess any kind of community?
7. We know the Third Race is the youngest, but what about the Will-O-The-Wisps? Do they predate gargoyles?
1. There's a story in that, I'm sure.
2. Relatively rare. But not unique.
3. Everything's relative, right?
4. Probably Avalon. (But I think you have some prepostion confusion in there.
5. Yes, clearly. Since the only one you ever saw wasn't on Avalon.
6. You need to view them as the magical equivalents of what humans call animals (when they aren't including themselves). In that context, many animal species have communities of a sort.
7. Maybe. Probably. Haven't thought about it.
Why didn't Alisa ever get to learn any magic? or any of the gargoyles?
*matt adds that its Elisa, not Alisa*
No aptitude. Not their style. Not that easy. Etc.
Is the Holy Grail powered by fay magic? If not what?
What does Grimorum Arcanorum mean?
"Magic Book", I believe.
You said that the Grimorum was brought from 995 to the 1970s by Brooklyn, Mary and Finella, and we already know the Phoenix Gate spent a thousand yeas, half with Goliath and half with Demona, but were you ever going to show the history of the Eye of Odin?
Care to give a brief synopsis of the history of the Eye?
No. Check Norse mythology for its early history. But it's more fun and practical to chart these things in stories than just to write them out here.
Who made the praying gargoyle?
If you come to G2002, you'll find out.
Why doesn't Nokkar's people know of magic? I mean humans who are probably a younger race than the N'kai figured it out why can't the N'kai?
Define "know of". Define "figured it out".
Could a regular human wizard with no magical augmentation cast a lightning spell or fireball spell without a conduit?
Potentially. Especially if that's the ONE spell they've REALLY, REALLY studied. But it would be more difficult and also limit their ability to do anything else.
In "Future Tense" at the end of the illusion Elisa yells "No, not now!" and the illusion disappears and she becomes Puck. So my question is:
1. What was Puck referring to when he said that?
b. Was it Oberon's Law because Goliath realized that what he was experiancing was an illusion and the law dictates that Oberon's Children can not interfer in mortal lives and thus so forced the illusion to end?
c. Or was it another law that has to do with mortals willingly handing over talismens to Oberon's Children, kinda saying that if your intentions are discovered the game ends?
1. That Goliath had figured him out when he was so close.
b. More or less.
c. More or less.
We see in the episode "Avalon Pt3" the Magus uses Avalon's magic to transform the Iron Knights into iron chains. We also know that the Fae can tap into Avalon's magic too and we also know that Avalon's magic can effect iron. So this is my question.
1. Can the Fae use Avalon's magic to effect iron too like the Magus can?
2. If the answer is no. Why can't they?
2. The Magus was a mortal conduit for the magic. It's one of the reasons that what he did killed him. He was adapting the island's magic to something it was not supposed to do.
i just watched "Awakening 1 and 2" and wow, i love these eps, particularly "Awakening 1" its beautiful!
anyway, i was wondering some things about the sleep spell:
1. would the sleep spell work on a human? could a human be put to sleep for a thousand years?
2. what is the spell's peculiar attachment with the castle? the spell says "until the castle rises above the clouds", but what if the Magus tried this spell on some rogue gargoyles? would they still sleep til Castle Wyvern rose above the clouds? what if the gargs live in another sort of structure, like the Mayan Pyramid? would the spell still work? i just don't quite understand the spells need for a link to the castle. could Magus have changed the spell to say "sleep until the sky burns or whatever"?
3. was the sleep spell in the Grimorum when Magus first acquiered it? was that spell in the Grimorum there when the Archmage first acquiered it?
i guess the Grimorum being transported through time by the Phoinex gate over 900 years really helped it to be presearved, eh?
1. The spell would work on humans. But we age while we sleep. So we'd die long before the castle rose above the clouds.
2. Open ended spells require more power, more energy. Setting a limit (no matter how unreasonable the limit may seem) makes casting the spell easier. Certain spells were written or adapted to certain limits. The Magus may also have adapted the spell to his needs. But basically, it was the equivalent of "til Kingdom come".
3. I imagine so.
1 How was demona's virus destroyed? Who destroyed it?
and what Happened to:
2 the medishi tablet
3 the praying gargoyle fragments
1. Don't know and don't much care. After the Hunter's Moon, the virus was largely harmless. Destroying it wasn't difficult. It could be poured down the drain.
2. Not saying.
3. Definitely not saying. ;)
Was the archemage influenced by someone, apart from his future self, to take the three talismans and his plans to take over avalon and the world? sorry if this is a weird question, but I was wondering about that for a long time
He had wanted the three items of power for some time because he had read about their joint use before.
The Avalon take-over seemed the idea of his future self. But of course that future self only learned it from his future self. So one might ask, who came up with the actual idea. Was it born of the time stream, whole?
I'm just 17, and I got the tootsie rool thing right away.
Anyway, I read some more unsatisfactory responces so I'll just restate some of them.
1)For the ill met by moonlight questons you didn't answer one cause I called Angela "Angie", But why should that keep you from answering? Anyway the question again is:
2)When Goliath, Gabreil and ANGELA fall into the water being filled with lava, why isn't it too hot to survive? If you don't know, just say so.
3)And I didn't understand your answer about Oberon giving Goliath immunity to his magic. Didn't he take that away in the Gathering, or does he just temporarily set it aside when it suits him? b) Is Goliath and clan immune to his arts by the end of the Gathering?
P.S.and, you right. I have a very dirty mind, so I'll just imagine Brooklen says what I want him to.
1. Sloth. Let's start by saying I don't actually owe you an answer to anything. If I'm not in the mood, I may just try to be funny. I may fail. But I could use a bit less 'tude, dude.
2. Like here, for example.
3. He never took the immunity away, he just interpreted the edict. He never uses his magic DIRECTLY against Goliath or the clan.
b. Depends on who's doing the defining. Since it's Oberon, he was, is and will always be immune.
P.S. I've forgotten what this refers too, but maybe that's just as well.
In your latest Random Stuff, you said you thought Michael Reeves' thing about Demona casting a spell on the gargoyles the night before they woke up would make them switch to modern English...that doesn't work:
They were speaking and reading modern English syntaxicly (is that a word, syntatically) and verbally in the 10th century when they should have been speaking and reading Middle English. The familiar form of you (thou) wansn't even close to being uttered.
However, it could just be that "Awakenings" was just made into modern English so we could understand it; sort of like if an American wrote a novel about Russians, the characters' dialogue would be in English, but we're just supposed to know that it is really Russian. Get it? Is that what we were supposd to assume what was going on?
I just had trouble accepting the rambling as a concrete reason behind the Gargoyles' language.
If you buy into Michael's explanation, then yes, I think you have to assume that the tenth century sections were translations for the viewers' benefit. I haven't STUDIED Michael's idea or thought about it's ramifications. So I'm not saying that the idea is canon (there's that word again) in my head yet. But I think it has promise.
As I've mentioned before, originally it was a cheat that we thought we could live with artistically.
1a.In some cultures knowing the name of a person gives you power over it so is this true in the gargoyles universe?
1b.If so is that why the Archmage and Magus are called by their titles because of their names?
1. It can be true. It certainly can't hurt.
b. Perhaps... ;)
1)So could the Magus cast any spell he had memorised ealier without the help of the Grimorum or Avalon? The way I understood it, he needed a conduit to cast any spell.
2)So then why didn't Tom or Goliath do it without a conduit?
1. A conduit helps. Also certain spells are designed intentionally to be more difficult then others. More difficult to do, and more difficult to remember.
2. Tom and Goliath aren't sorcerers. But memorizing one incantation and using it over and over again isn't too hard. Jumping back and forth between multiple complex spells is a much different thing.
In the episode "Temptation", Goliath is placed under the a spell that makes him a slave to whom
Ever holds the Grimorum. OK. (A few point then my question and hopefully an answer.)
Point 1.The confines of the spell were that he would obey whoever held the book.
Point 2. In order to free Goliath from the zombie like state Elisa told him to act as is he was not placed under the magic spell.
Point 3. Demona took the actual counter spell.
I just don't feel that her having him act normal would cancel the effects of the magic as for him running around like a zombie yes but not the magic control its self but… I will leave that to you.
My question is if Demona was to take the book again could she take control over Goliath once more or are the effects of the spell no more?
Thank you for your Time
Here are my points:
1. Whoever held the spell. Not the book. At the end, Elisa was holding the spell.
2. Demona did not have the counterspell. She took other spells, like the one to summon Puck.
3. After Elisa issued her command, I'm betting they destroyed the spell. But who knows? (Well, I do. But I'm not telling.)
How ofter does the London clan use magic? Are there any spellcasters besides Una? If so are they more skilled than her?
I'm not going to quantify it.
And I'm not going to tie my hands one way or another on her clanmates.
What is the famous words used to activate the Phoenix Gate?
From memory, which may not be too reliable:
Desligrate muri tempe et intervalia!
If the past is fixed in the Gargoyles universe, how does that affect those that can see the future? Can they change something that has yet to happen or are any efforts they make futile?
Any 'sight' is generally subject to interpretation.
But who said ANYONE can see the future?
Puck said that he couldn't take the Phoenix Gate from Goliath--Goliath had to "fork it over". Is the same true for other Avalonian magical objects? I may be remembering this incorrectly, but didn't Odin physically attack Goliath and try to take back the Eye? And does this rule only apply to Children of Avalon? If so, it would explain why the Weird Sisters had to use Demona and MacBeth to steal the talismans for them (were you consciously doing this so as not to break the rule you would establish later about the Gate in "Future Tense"?)
Odin may have been an exception, as the EYE could arguably belong to him.
But the general rule of non-interference prevented Puck or the Sisters from just magically or otherwise stealing anything themselves.
Prior to the 'arrival' of the fae as a species on the planet, did any of the earlier races use magic?
1a) Why does Oberon need a tracker to find Puck(a fellow fey), when both Titanya and the Wierd Sisters were able to locate the Gargoyles in the clock tower? b)Why could Oberon sence Titanya and not Puck? c)How was Budicca able to track Owen from the Park to the castle? Had Owen been frolicking in the park earlier?
2a)Did Titanya want things to end up as they did from the begining? b) If she did, how was she sure Puck would of shown up? c) If she didn't, then should I assume she wanted Gargoyles to help take the baby, and it wasn't reverse pyicoligy?
3)Why were nither Rinard, Vogel, nor the Gargoyle's put to sleep? Am I right in thinking Titanya protected them?
4)How did Rinard know about the danger? Did Xanatos or Titanya ask him for help?
5a) Why would the people of manhaten, think this was all a midsummer night's dream, with all the car crashes, injuries and, probably, deaths that occured? b) Would not all that damage break the non-interferance law?
Good luck with these, for all our sakes.
1a. He was in the mood. Besides, Puck is better at hiding.
1b. Puck is not his wife/soulmate.
1c. It's a magic flute, man. Just flow with it!
2a. So she says.
2c. I'm not going to interpret it for you.
3. Renard and Vogel were not in Manhattan when the spell was first cast. Also they had an energy field around the bridge.
4. Yes. Xanatos informed him.
5a. That's Oberon's interpretation.
5b. From his point of view, he didn't cause the damage. He was merely taking the mortals out of a conflict that would have interfered with their lives. The damage was a minor repercussion.
Why is it that the Magus, whose trained all of his life for using magic, could not cast spells without the grimorim (except for tapping it from Avolon), while Tom (and I assume Goliath to) can easily use the incantation to get to Avolon?
Memorizing one simple incantation is hard enough. The Magus was certainly capable of that.
But without the Grimorum to harness, focus and inform his efforts, managing much else was impossible.
Another thing I REALLY wish I had seen at the Gathering is Keith David wielding a sword and quoting from Othello.
I heard that Michael Reaves has a brilliant (because it's simple) solution for how Goliath, Hudson and the Trio could speak modern English upon waking at the castle. Demona used a spell from the Grimorum on them the night before they woke up. Perfect. They'd never even have to know that there was a change in the language. I love it. (Wish I had thought of it.)
Since you said you had plans for something as religious as Faust in the Gargoyles universe, did you have any actual solid plans for the Spear of Longinus/Destiny?
1. maybe it was hard to see on the show, but in "The Green" are the magic pendants themselves made out of the different stones (Sapphire, Obsidian, etc.) or are they all made out of something else? if they are made of something else, what is it?
2. you've said that the pendants will be passed down along with the name of the garg who wears it, but does the actual color of the garg matter? for instance, can only a red gargoyle wear and use Zafiro's pendant? i know it sounds stupid that the magic would only work with skin color, but i don't see any evidence why it wouldn't... afterall, Bronx is blue like Obsidiana and he was ok using the her pendant, but if he had picked up a pendant of a different color than he, would it have still worked?
3. when Jackal knocked that tree on Obsidiana and her wing was all twisted and wounded looking until she turned to stone, had he actually broken the bone in her wing? i'm aking this cuz i think its one of the only times that stone sleep cures a major physical injury in the series...
1. The former. One is Sapphire. One is Jade. One is Obsidian. And one is Turquoise.
2. No, the color of the garg doesn't matter. Zafiro in the twentieth century is red. The Zafiro of the twenty-second century is blue. (At least in my head.)
3. I'd have to see it again.
what would happen at dawn if Demona put on a Mayan sun amulet? would she turn to a human or remain a gargoyle?
I think she'd turn human. But I don't think she'd be able to nap.
1a. Do the Fae tap into Earth's Magic?
1b. If yes, lets say a Fae somehow finds himself on Mars, would he be weaker then normal or completely powerless, or not effected at all?
2. How come Oberon could throw Xanatos magically when his magic is powerless against iron? (The Gathering pt 2)
3. In your opinion, who would win in a fair battle, Q or Oberon?
4. When did the Mab/Oberon war happen? Could you please give me an estimated date like c. 1000 BC-500 BC.
1b. I'm not big on hypotheticals.
2. He grabbed his head.
3. I have no interest in this question.
4. It is forbidden.
Are there any people in the gargoyles univers, born and raised in present day that,m for one reason or another practice magic
Did the Medici tablet belong to the real Medici family? What did they use it for?
Who created the Praying Gargoyle? How powerful is its magic?
I'm not saying.
You'll get a clue at G2002.
Potentially, very powerful.
Fey magic and metals: I've noticed that most of the magical items forged by fey magic (the Eye, the Gate, and Puck's flute) are made of gold. Iron, of course, seems to have a disruptive effect on fey magic. Is there a particular reason why the fey chose to forge their talismans out of gold and not some other metal (except iron, obviously).
At the end of "Temptation", Elisa tells (commands?) Goliath (under the spell) to always act as if he was not under a spell. I'm assuming this means for all spells and not just that particular one he was under. If this assumption is correct, how would Goliath be affected by Puck's spells in "The Mirror"? I want to say there are other times he's been under a spell, but I haven't seen too many episodes on Toon Disney yet (I just got the station) and I'm cursed with a poor memory.
You're assumption is incorrect.
She didn't (couldn't) give him full magical immunity. She didn't have that kind of control. She simply ordered the slave to act FOREVER as if he wasn't one.
How did the spear of light allow Rory to change into his Cuchulain form?
The short answer is magic.
What was that thing in Pendragon? Was it a actual dragon or was it a gargoyle seeing that it was protecting the sword?
Neither. It was a stone statue brought to life by powerful magicks.
In the Gargoyles Universe how much truth is in horoscopes?
All things are true.
1.)The South American Clan, their stones they wear around their neck...Is that stone fae magic, or something different?
2.)Whom gave them this power?
3.) And why only them? I understand to protect their forest, but other clans could benifit from it. Wyvern would have.
1. No. Human sorcery.
2. A Mayan wizard.
3. Well, sure. But this was done centuries ago. Fed Ex was not yet in business.
In the Wierd Sisters incantation on Macbrth and demona they say "forever and eternal bound" so my quetion is
1) Can the Wierd Sister undo their spell
2) Can anyone else (with the exception of D and M killing each other)
2. Doubt it.
Does Demona sleep? How can she manage to be human during the day and still have energy to spare in being a gargoyle at night? Despite the fact she and MacBeth are magically linked, Demona is not immortal, so how does she acquire the energy to stay conscience 24 hours a day?
I think Dominique must sleep some. And I think Puck's magic compensates some.
Hi, Greg. I know you've been asked at least twice on the changes to Demona's reproduction cycles after the Puck spell, but I could use a little more clarification on the subject.
1a) I remember somebody asking how her daily transformations affected her reproductive cycle and you responded thusly...
"No. But as I said, I think the magic would compensate for a pregnancy... ON THE HUGE ASSUMPTION that she ever gets pregnant."
That's what I would like a little more info on. What if Demona had relations with another gargoyle and she happened to be in her 20-year fertility cycle and she DID become become pregnant?
1b) What would happen to the potential child inside of her created from that fertile union considering the fact that she is full gargoyle at night and full human during the day?
1c) Would it be born or hatched?
1d) Considering the father is full gargoyle, would Demona's human transformations cause it to be a hybrid? Or would it be born/hatched full gargoyle and turn to stone like any other gargoyle?
2) How do her changes affect when she is fertile? As you've explained, female gargoyles only come into season once every 20 years. But humans are fertile almost all of the time. At least, from what I know.
3) This is not likely to happen knowing Demona, but what if she had relations with a human, while she was in her human form, naturally, and she actually became pregnant? Would it be born human or what?
4) I hope this isn't too off topic, but let's say that Puck cast the same spell of daily human transformation on a male gargoyle. How would it effect him reproductively? Would it change him at all?
Thank you, Greg. I hope my questions haven't burdened you in any way.
1a. What's the ACTUAL question here? What if she did become pregnant? Then she'd be pregnant.
1b. I'm not an obstetrician. What kind of details are you looking for?
1c. Ahh, well, that would depend on timing to some extent. Most likely, Demona would lay an egg, before "Dominique" had the chance to come to full term.
1d. Again, timing is a factor.
(BUT LET ME REITERATE, that all this is based on the HUGE ASSUMPTION that she ever gets pregnant.)
2. Again, what's the question? I.e. what's the question that you haven't already answered within your question.
3. Again, it would depend on timing. And on the assumption that she knows nothing about birth control.
4. Does it change HER at all? Maybe I'm dense, but I don't really understand.
1) Why did Odin's eye contain his magick and power? How did he come to lose the eye? Other fae have lost great parts of their perceived bodily mass seemingly without any loss of their magickal abilities (Anansi and Bean Sidhe).
2) Why didn't Odin call upon the Aesir or his magical servants to help him retrieve the eye? You said that since Goliath possessed the eye that Odin did not feel that he was breaking Oberon's law; so then, why not call upon Thor or the Valkryies (spelling)?
3) Are there any other fae body parts out there that function as potent magickal talismans? If so, what are they?
1) The eye didn't contain his power. It linked to it. He traded the eye for a drink from Mimir's pool of wisdom.
2) The Children of Oberon tend not to travel in packs these days. Besides, him retrieving his eye isn't interfering. Asking Thor, assuming Thor survived Ragnarok, is a whole other kettle of Aesir.
3) Yeah, like I was going to answer that.
How is it that the Stone of Destiny can talk?
How is it that you can?
I know the above seems only to be a smart-ass response, but think about it.
Iron is obviously harmful to the fey--even deadly. However I don't understand why it is that once Puck and the Sisters were wrapped in iron chains, they followed the orders of whoever captured them. It's not like they weren't able to use magic to free themselves, as Puck was obviously able to cast spells for Demona. I don't see why they couldn't do something simple like turning themselves into mortals or teleporting away and leaving the chains behind. Similarly, I don't see why Oberon couldn't use his powers to escape from the bell (unless the bell shorted out his magic completely, but then I don't understand why this is more harmful than being in direct contact with iron chains).
Any clarification would be appreciated!
You're just being too literal minded. The iron bell sent out waves of ANTI-MAGIC against a creature of pure magic.
The chains created a bondage/servant situation.
Or come up with your own explanation.
do the pendant wearing gargoyles in Guatemala have to sleep as a human does to rest their bodies or does the pendant's magic cover that too?
They have to rest periodically. Sometimes they nap as humans do. Sometimes they take off the pendants and sleep as stone. But the magic also helps compensate. SO ALL OF THE ABOVE, I guess.
1a) Which race and civilization (or "clan" if they were gargoyles) created the Cauldron of Life? b) Which was the Cauldron made of--mortal, fairy, or some other magic? c) If it was made of mortal magic, did the mortal energies have any adverse effect on Puck when he dipped in his hand (other than the petrification itself), or was he spared any possible additonal effect because he was in mortal form as Owen?
2a) When the Cauldron's iron was reforged into the Coyote robot, was its ability to turn objects to stone lost? b) Did the Cauldron have any magical abilities other than petrification? c) Did the magic in the Cauldron's iron really make it more effective at capturing the Coyote fae, or would regular iron have been just as effective? If the Cauldron was made with mortal magic, did these mortal energies play a part in its effectiveness as a prison for fey?
3) What did Xanatos do with the magical iron after that Coyote robot was disabled?
1a. That's a story in its own right.
1b. Mortal, largely.
1c. No adverse effects on Puck.
2a. Not necessarily.
2b. Not necessarily.
2c. Didn't hurt.
3. Wouldn't you like to know?
In the episode, "The Mirror", why did Elisa act as if Goliath had turned back into a gargoyle when he already was one of course, whenever she was transformed into one? Vise versa when the clan was transformed into humans, why did they act as if they always had been humans? What I mean to say and what I always got confused about is, that Puck's spell shouldn't have made them forget what they were. When Elisa was transformed I would have expected her to be a little shocked at first, and then calm whenever she realized that she and Goliath were now of the same species, but she would still long to become human again deep inside.
I mean why are you setting limits on Puck?
The whole point was that NOBODY noticed the transformation. When all of Manhattan was transformed, the former humans didn't run around panicked and screaming over their new bodies. The transformation was so complete they thought they had always been that way. Same with Elisa and the gargs until logic forced them to take a closer look at it.
Anyway, it worked fine for me. If it makes you feel any better a lot of my staff originally agreed with you. They thought I was nuts. But most vindicated me later.
Where did you get the name Grimourum Arcanorum
Michael Reaves came up with that. But I think it's simply Latin for "magic book".
does Demona have to sleep? i figure that when she is human her garg side sleeps and when she is gargoyle her human side sleeps. if this is true where does she get the solar energy from to support her gargoyle form?
Magic compensates to some degree, but she does sleep as a human periodically.
What language is the Grimorum written in? I imagine the spells are in Latin, but what language did the Magus use to recount the story of the gargoyles?
Most (but not all) of the Grimorum is in Latin. The Magus used Latin as well, which was in those days the language of scholars.
I thought the skiff was blown up at first, but i remembered that only happened in the "Future Tense" episode, which I suppose wasn't real to Goliath. But no one could accidently go to Avalon, because one would first have to recite the Latin to reach it. I got you on this one buddy. :)
can you answer this,cause their is no scientific way about it(maybe magic,anyway)
a gargoyles flesh and bone turns to stone in the day,but how is it their clothing does as well?
The clothes thing is magic. Part of a modesty spell cast in the year 10 A.D.
Why did Xanatos find he Grimorum Arcanorum?
Did Dmona help him finding the book?
Why? Do you mean how?
And, no, Demona wasn't involved in finding the book, just in interpreting it once it was acquired.
Do you think our technology will progress further than the magic of Oberon's children? When will Oberon's children reach the limitations of their magic? Would any of them possibly decide to live amongst us mortals and begin thinking scientifically, like an outcast fae, that would prefer sceince over sorcery?
1. Apples and oranges.
2. Who says they will?
3. To some extent, Titania has done this already.
Greg, i have some questions about the "Praying Gargoyle". i know you'll probably answer, "I'm not telling" to most but we'll see:
1. Who created the Praying Gargoyle or was it always in existence? Is it a gargoyle magic as the Grimorum is human magic and the Eye and Gate are fae magics, or is a human or fae majic? does that make sense?
2. Why was the Praying Gargoyle created?
3. What are the abilities of the PG? is it some sort of gargoyle protector? if so. does it have any other abilities?
4. How did Demona know about the PG? where did she keep it during the 15 years before Hunter's Moon?
5. Was the PG always kept at Notre Dame? if so, why there?
6. You do plan on doing a background story of the PG, right? esspecially if you don't answer these questions!
7. the PG is one of the only magic talismans that we never got to see hardly at all in the show or know anything about. is there a reason for this?
1. It was created. It makes sense, but the answer is more complex than that.
2. To protect the protectors.
3. It depends on how it is used.
4. She kept it in her townhouse. She learned about it decades before.
5. No. Demona left it there for safe keeping.
6. Yes. Plans more immediate than you can know. *Though, as usual, the answers will raise more questions.*
7. Uh... Cuz Goliath broke it?
One question that I found myself reminded of because of your piece about "you have to both see and hear magic in order for it to affect you" in "City of Stone". Now, I very much liked the concept because of it giving established rules for how magic works in the Gargoyles Universe, helping to give it its feeling of verisimilitude. But at the same time, I've occasionally wondered about just how universal that particular rule is.
First off, faerie magic clearly doesn't always follow this rule. In "The Mirror", Puck was able to transform humans into gargoyles and gargoyles into humans when they weren't able to see or hear him. In "The Gathering Part One", Oberon was able to put the whole city to sleep even though, again, the affected people were clearly not all seeing and hearing him. Of course, the above rule probably was only meant to apply to human magic anyway, so these exceptions don't count.
But the area that I do sometimes find myself wondering about is the Roman Magus's "spell of modesty" that you mentioned, back in the days of Caesar Augustus. Because it affected every gargoyle on the planet, including their descendants. But nearly all the gargoyle clans that we know of are from areas that weren't part of the Roman Empire: Britain (which was partly conquered by Rome, but only after Augustus's lifetime), the Far East (never a part of the Roman Empire), and Guatemala (beyond ancient Rome's very knowledge). Obviously, the gargoyles in those regions didn't see or hear the Roman Magus when he cast the spell, but were affected by him. (I assume that it was probably a very unusual, even unique case, though of course, I doubt that you feel ready yet to explain it to us). A small mystery that I thought that I'd mention here.
Mortal sorcery, yes. Not fae magic.
As for the modesty spell. Well, uh, hey, um, well, that was one darn POWERFUL magus. (Must have had the backing of ALL of Rome's Standard's and Practice's Executives.)
But seriously, he had help. The Archmage wasn't the first guy to combine magical artifacts.
1) When the Archmage used the Eye Of Odin, the Phinex Gate, and the Grimorum was he more powerful than the Weird Sisters.
2) In Avalon part 2, the future Archmage told the past Archmage to use Avalon as a base for when he took over the world. If the wierd sisters found out about this would they have become enemies of the Archmage.
2. No, not when they were in erinyes mode.
Are some languages more arcane or magical than others?
No. But some spells were written long ago.
is a blind man immune to fay magic as well as human magic? how different are fay and human magic?
Very. And it depends on the nature of the spell as it is cast.
1.What kind of magic powers the Holy Grail? Fay magic? Location magic?
2. Who made the Holy Grail?
1. There are other categories. Talisman magic for one.
2. In this case, it's less about who made it and more about what happened to it.
What makes some languages(Latin, Hebrew) etc more magical than others(modern English)?
Their older and the given spells were WRITTEN in them originally.
You said that Wyvern and St. Damiens were both built over "a nexus of energy"/"holy ground".
1) Will New Camelot also be built over such a "nexus"?
2) Is Avalon just one REALLY big nexus?
3) Is the "mystic energy" that flows from these nexuses of a general "earth magic" nature, or is it specific--depending on the nexus--for either "fae" or "mortal" magic?
4) You said that the Megalith Dance and the other ruins "sorta"/"not really" were the reason why the Archmage came to Wyvern. Was it then the nexus that drew him there?
5a) You called such places "holy ground". Do you also have plans of incorporating the traditional belief that undead creatures hate holy ground into the series? (I know you have plans for vampires, which is why I wonder) b) If so, and if you answered yes to #2, does that mean that such creatures cannot go to Avalon?
6) Who can detect these "nexuses"? Does it depend on profession (priest, wizard) or race (fae, gargoyle, human, lost), or is the ability randomly and equally dispersed among earthlings?
1. Parts of it.
3. More the former, but there can be elements of one or the other or all of the above.
4. Not exactly.
5a. I always have plans.
5b. I don't always reveal my plans.
6. Very little in the Gargoyles universe is Random. That's not necessarily a good thing. But you're stuck with it.
1) Can Puck also be summoned by Oberon's Mirror?
2) Was Titania's Mirror meant to be used to summon Puck only, or could it summon any fae if you knew how?
3) If so to the former, what makes Puck connected to the Mirror?
1. In theory.
2. It's something of a generic portal.
3. See 2.
Did New Olympian scientists ever try to explain the workings of magic scientifically, seeing how it's a tech-driven society but has knowledge of magic?
To some extent.
1a) Would there be any point in the future when the practice of mortal magic becomes more common than it is at the time of "The Journey"?
b) If so, roughly how long would it take for such a revival to come to pass? (decades, years, centuries?)
2a) Why is it so dangerous to mix fae and mortal magic? Energy is energy, right? And both fae and mortal magic are presumably of earthly origin. So what makes them so incompatible? b) What are the actual consequences of mixing the two?
3) The Archmage was able to bring the Grimorum to Avalon by "bending the rules", and so bypassed Oberon's Law. But in the end, he was still using the Eye to control the Grimorum, and hence, was "mixing magics". Why didn't this have any (visible) consequences?
4a) You've mentioned "ghost magic" before. Would it fall under the "mortal magic" category, or is it a completely different form of magic? b) If it's different, is it safe to mix with mortal or fae magic?
5) Which is the Megalith Dance powered by--fae or mortal magic?
6a) Do any New Olympians possess (or are capable of practicing) "fae" magic? b) Do any New Olympians practice "mortal" magic?
1a. Maybe a tiny bit -- but not until WAY beyond 2198.
2a. Different frequencies maybe. Feedback. I don't know exactly. Just is.
b. BOOM. Usually. Or some other backfiring.
3. The Eye is a bit more flexible. It WANTS to "help".
4a. Another category, I think, maybe, sorta.
b. Not recommended, but less dangerous.
5. Not telling its origin right now.
6a. Maybe, but it's more internalized as "powers" generally.
b. Maybe, but not many. They're a technology driven society.
Do you personally believe magic similar to the way magic is portrayed in the Gargoyles universe exists in real life?
I believe in everything. But that doesn't change the pragmatic way that I generally lead my life.
A more careful rephrase of the earlier question, which got a rather good smart-ass answer:
Just what is it that makes Oberon and Mab so powerful magically? Is it acquired power? Is it luck? Does it come just from being the ruler of Avalon? Does it come from, for lack of a better word, genetics?
A lot of it is "genetics". A lot is WILL. A lot is about natural magical loci. Some is acquired. And you could call it all luck on at least some level.
1) Are you considering bringing back the Grimorum in some way (or parts of it, if not the whole book)? I can't help but feel sorry for all those wizards who spent their lives writing spells in that thing, only to have it eaten and destroyed by the Archmage.
2) Was the Grimorum the most powerful/comprehensive book of human sorcery in existence? How would Una or Macbeth's magic books rate against it?
3) Will Brooklyn ever meet the original Magus who created the Grimorum?
4) Did Merlin contribute any spells to the Grimorum?
5) Were copies of the Grimorum ever made?
1. It felt like a device (in both senses of the word) that had served its purpose, run its course. Flashback uses, sure. But I felt done with it in the presense.
2. Yes. But there are individual spells of greater power on things like the Medici Tablet.
3. Maybe. ;)
4. Maybe ;)
Is the Phoenix Gate called the Phoenix Gate because it will be destroyed and recreated or is it something else ?
It's mostly about the flame effect, but it's also about its circular/cyclical nature.
1a) Are/were there any living phoenixes in the Gargoyles Universe? b) If so, were/are they a separate species, or are they Children of Oberon or a form of gargoyle?
2a) Did the forging of the Phoenix Gate have anything to do with (an) actual phoenix(es)? b) If so, was whatever involvement they/it had, voluntary?
3a) Was Princess Katharine's mother ever aware of the powers of the Gate? b) ...was the Normand ambassador? c) Was Malcolm ever aware that he was going to receive the Gate?
4a) When the Gate was broken in half, did it become *completely* nonfunctional, or did some residual magic remain? b) When it was whole again, was it as good as new?
5) What is the immediate source of the magic/energy that the Gate draws on?
6a) Why is the incantation for an Avalonian magical artifact in Latin? b) Is that particular incantation necessary, or can the Gate be activated some other way?
b. Not saying.
2a. Maybe. If the Gate was forged. Which it wasn't.
c. He was informed after it was stolen.
5. Ambient time stream need. (Generally measured in Farquars.)
6a. Necessary for a human to harness it.
b. When free, the gate travels about on its own, as Brooklyn learns to his chagrin.
1) Has Demona already used all the spells available in the pages she tore from the Grimorum?
2) Did Elisa or the others do anything special with that page from the Grimorum with the spell that enchanted Goliath? If Goliath must obey anyone who holds it, couldn't someone say, "I negate the last command", and have Goliath fall right back under its spell? Even if that isn't the case, I would think that the possibility was enough that they would take certain precautions with it. Just wondering.
1. All but one.
2. They burned it.
What would have happened to Puck if he broke the rules and simply taken the Pheonix Gate?
He couldn't. It's not just a rule. It's Oberon's Law.
How did the Banshee get around Oberon's non-intervention edict when she kidnapped Goliath, Elisa, and Angela, and took them to Cairn na Culainn for interrogation?
Her excuse was she thought they were agents of Oberon. The scent of Avalon was upon them, so she thought she wasn't interfering with mortals. Just with Oberon. Of course, she did this at her own peril. But there was nothing magical preventing her from doing it.
Are there any planets in the Gargoyles universe which totally lack native magic sources?
In an infinite universe there are infinite possibilities.
You've said that the reason the gargoyles turned to stone under the magus's spell is because it put them to sleep, and that's how gargoyles sleep. But what about una's spell in MIA?
That wasn't a sleep spell. It was a lose consciousness spell. There's a difference.
Just what is magic in the Gargoyles Universe? How can it be described as a natural force?
It's an energy that can be harnessed in numerous ways.
I recently rewatched my tape of "Eye of the Beholder", and thought that I'd ask you a question concerning it. In the course of the series, three successive characters, Fox, the Archmage, and Goliath, all wear the Eye and are all transformed by it. When the Archmage and Goliath wear the Eye, the transformation is immediate (for the Archmage, a "super-sorcerer" and for Goliath, an "Odinized gargoyle"), and stays that way until the Eye is removed. Fox, however, didn't immediately turn into a "werefox" when she wore the Eye, but shifted back and forth from one form to the other, being sometimes human, sometimes "werefox". Why did Fox's transformation by the Eye follow a different pattern than that of the Archmage and Goliath?
Awareness and need and desire.
1) Do fae grow weaker magically as they grow older?
2) Is there any limit to how powerful a fae can grow unaided by any magical artefacts?
3) How seriously can fae be hurt by human magic?
4) If gargoyles could develop their own sorcery, would the magic they utilise be identical to human magic?
5) Did the Zeroth/Lost Race use magic?
6) Do the New Olympians use magic these days?
1. Generally, no.
4. Identical? Garg sorcery + human sorcery = mortal sorcery.
5. Zeroth? Who's that?
Hi Mr.Weisman or Erin or Benny,
Is Goliath immune from spells affecting his actions? In Temptations he was cured by Elisa from Demona's controlling spell. "I want you to act from now on as if you were never under a spell" Does this not mean his actions can not be altered by magic? In Future Tense this holds true. Only the setting was magic, his response to them was not. His action to not give Puck the Gate was not influenced by magic because by law Puck wasn't supposed to, but then, He tried to control Goliath's actions with magic(by assuming Elisa's form and the whole FT situation). I can think of an exeption-when he was wearing Odin's eye. But his nature was amplified there, not altered. Any Insights? Thanks to the Weisman (mostly you, Greg) family for answering our questions. When is your wife going to join in on the fun?
And my wife put her foot in the water at G2K.
You've probably answered this, but I was reading your mirror memo, and I remembered the bit where Puck says, "Does this look like Aladdin's lamp? I have limits."
Does that imply that:
1. Aladdin's lamp exists in the Gargoyles universe.
2. It *does* have enough power to wipe out all the humans on earth.
1. Probably. But it was mostly a Disney in-joke.
2. Uh... Hmm... Well....
If Jackal/Anubis had succeeded in 'bringing the gift of death to the world', how would the powers of death affected Macbeth and Demona? Could it cancel out their immortality spell? In short, which is greater, the power of an immortality spell cast by the Weird Sisters, or the power of a Death God like Anubis?
More hypothetical/quantifying questions from LSZ.
I feel guilty because you're sincerity shines through in the questions you ask. Unfortunately, my mind just doesn't work that way.
To me, these things aren't quantifiable. They aren't cut and dry. There are a myriad of situational answers that your hypothetical doesn't address. Sorry.
Read your "Temptation" Ramble, and there were a few things that I would love to point out about that episode.
First off: I loved the leather jacket and HOW brooklyn folded his wings under his arms. He really did look good in that episode. ^_^
Second: The bike. It was a cool bike! BUT, the bikers when they see it say: "Cool Hog." Now, okay people who don't know much about motorcycles would refer to any bike as a hog, but these Biker's would know better. A Hog is a Harley Davidson...and Lex's creation looked nothing like a Harley. I dunno if that was you, or somebody else. But oh well, it was still a cool bike.
Third: The spell. Now Elisa says: "I want you to act, FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE, as if you weren't under a spell." Wouldn't that in sense nullify some future spells on the big guy? I mean sure, Puck's spell worked well, cause he still ACTED like he wasn't under a spell. Were you maybe planning on keeping with this for future continuity?
oh, and I LOVE your little analizations (sp?) of the episodes. It really lets us get more into your head, and into the world of the Gargoyles.
The 'hog' reference was ultimately my responsibility. (Obviously, I know next to nothing about motorcycles.) Though Michael and Brynne Reaves (the story editor and writer) can share some of the blame.
As for the spell, it would have to be a case-by-case thing. But most spells would not be affected.
On to the serious stuff! All have to do with Iron and the Avalon
The Human body, Earth, and all other natural organisims can cleanse themselves.
Avalon is natural, if magical.
We know that Avalon's magic can effect Iron, it's just the fey in that respect.
But if Iron was dumped into Avalon and the fey couldn't remove it, could Avalon itself process the iron out of it's system?
Would Avalon remove it in the first place since suposedly it does no harm?
How long would this take?
If Iron was dumped there?
First answer my question. What if it wasn't?
Alright, in Hunters Moon, my personal favorite episode, Demona almost unleashed a magical disease that would have killed all sentience. Gargoyles would be immune to it's effects thanks to the Praying Gargoyle.
Now we all know Goliath smashed the statue and saved the world. But what if this was not the case...
1. All humans would have died. Macbeth is obviously human. Would this not have qualified as death at Demona's hands, thus killing Demona (oops)?
2. If not, would she fall prey to it when she turned into human form? How would this work?
3. Would this spread to Avalon and/or the isle of the New Olympians?
4. How would it affect... Oberon's Children?
5. ...New Olympians?
6. ...Gargoyle clones?
7. Any other effects?
Thanks for your time. Love your rambles, by the way, look forward to next season's rambles.
More hypothetical questions... YAY!
1. I've answered this many times before. Try looking through the Demona or Macbeth archives. Briefly, it would depend on Demona's intent.
2. I'm sure she thought she was safe.
3. No reason why it wouldn't spread to New Olympus. No reason why it would spread to Avalon.
4. Potentially not at all.
5. Kill most of them probably.
6. Not at all.
7. Anyone who asks hypothetical questions based on untread pathes would die. :)
Story Editor: Brynne Chandler Reaves
Writer: Lydia C. Marano
Arguably the best single episode of the series. The animation is fluid, dynamic and very strong. The writing is sharp, even quite funny over and over. And yet, dramatically the story is still potent. It really advances the Goliath & Elisa romance arc. Changes Demona permanently. And introduces Puck -- and by extension, the entire third race: The Children of Oberon. All in a mere 22 minutes.
It's also very gratifying for me. A bit of a vindication. As you may have seen from the memos I wrote to Brynne & Lydia, there was some considerable resistance to the notion that none of the characters would notice their own personal change from one species to another. Most of my collaborators thought the idea was way too complicated to pull off. I argued that it might seem complex, but in fact it would play cleaner on screen -- and funnier and more directly to theme. In my mind, another title for this episode could have been -- had we already not been using it for our Werefox episode -- "Eye of the Beholder", because all the transformed characters really noticed was when someone else was "OTHER". Being a monster or being "normal" was based on their point of view, not any objective look in the mirror. [As it is, the title is the kind I like. Simple, objective and yet metaphoric. At one point, it was titled: "Mirror, Mirror". But we simplified it even more.]
But anyway, when the human Brooklyn, Lex and Broadway are confronted by "Gargoyles", the scene is an intentional mirror of the scene from AWAKENING, PART ONE where Brooklyn says, "If they think we're beasts and monsters..." Again, this is playing with the idea of "beasts and monsters" being merely in the eye of the beholder. The species have reversed, but the situation is exactly the same simply because the Trio remain in the minority. I suppose that's one thing that X-Men's mutants have in common with the Gargs. Both are a metaphor for being part of a minority. Feared almost automatically.
On the other hand, when Elisa is transformed, she believes that Goliath & Co. have been transformed into something like her. I think her immediate reaction is very telling about how she ALREADY felt about Goliath at that point. She's thrilled. She throws her arms about him. Now they're the same species. There's no impediment to their love. What's interesting is that if you stopped and asked Elisa under normal circumstances whether she would wish for Goliath to be transformed into a human, the answer would most certainly be "No." She knows that being a Gargoyle is fundamental to who he is. You can't change that without changing him -- and yet in that instant, in that unguarded moment, her desire to be with him overwhelms that rational knowledge. She's just happy.
At the museum, Elisa looks at herself in the mirror. She then moves, but the reflection holds. That was the idea of one of our board artists. A little clue that the mirror is magic. (It's not an animation error.)
Family Reactions #1
During that museum chase, my wife wanted to know why no alarms were going off. I figure Demona or the thieves just shut them off.
Erin didn't realize that that was Elisa dressed as a security guard at first. We were trying to withhold that information for a bit.
"Titania's Mirror", "The Children of Oberon", "Oberon sent me." We were laying groundwork to expand the entire series' base. But I don't know if back then I knew that much about what if anything I had planned specifically for Titania & Oberon.
Anymore than I knew then what I'd do with the "Dracula's Daughter" reference. But we try not to waste anything.
Coming up with that "Children of Oberon" name was a struggle. And so many people have asked me since whether or not Oberon is literally everyone's father, I almost regret landing on that choice. Our thought process is largely present in the episode when Goliath et al, go through various noms: Fair Folk, Dark Elves, Changelings, Shape-Shifters. Of course, at the time we were misusing the term Changeling. I think that was Odo's influence frankly, but I should have known better. I suggested "The Oberati". But the Reaves didn't care for that. I think they thought it sounded too much like an Italian sports car.
I do love the moment when Brooklyn cites Shakespeare's play as a sort of reference work on the Children. I hope we sent a few people to the library with that line. Did we?
I also love Hudson's line in response to Elisa's question: Are they real?
Hudson: "As real as I am, if the stories be true." It's full of delicious dramatic irony. If you can suspend belief on a bunch of gargoyles, then this shouldn't be a problem for you. I love things that work on multiple levels.
I also love Hudson's "Be careful what you wish for" line.
We were trying to show a bit here how Demona had managed to operate in the modern world up to this point. One of the thieves has clearly worked for Demona before without ever having laid eyes on her. Of course, showing Demona's M.O. here, was like giving it a swan song. Because after this episode, though she clearly doesn't realize it yet, her life is going to get MUCH easier. Being a human during the day is a great boon to all her scheming. I'm very curious about everyone's reaction to that? Shock? Amusement? I also tried to work very hard so that in that last two minutes of epilogue, everyone would get that she only was human during the day. I was very afraid that the audience would think she was permanently transformed into a human. Was anyone confused? Or was anyone surprised that Puck's revenge/gift STUCK? We wouldn't really explore the change until HIGH NOON. Had you forgotten about it by then?
Family Reactions #2
As Demona's casting the spell that will summon Puck. (Which I always thought was very cool, with the feather and all.)
Benny: "That's a magic mirror. Is Demona going in there?"
Erin: "Puck's gonna come out."
As I've mentioned before, during the writing of this story we figured out that Owen was Puck. So to play fair we dropped a hint here. Demona (who knows) says to Puck: "You serve the human. You can serve me." Puck changes the subject, replying "Humans [note the plural] have a sense of humor, you have none." This was done intentionally to distract the audience away from the hint we had just dropped. But obviously, in hindsight, it's a clear reference to Owen serving Xanatos. Anyone get it right off the bat? Anyone even take note of the line the first time? Originally, the line read, "You serve him, now you can serve me." With the "him" referring to Xanatos. But our S&P executive was afraid the "him" could be taken to mean Satan. I know that seems silly now. But keep in mind, we were very paranoid back then about the show being attacked for promoting devil worship. So we made the change.
Sensitive Broadway: "Maybe even love." It's a nice moment. Wistful.
Puck reminds Demona that the mirror isn't "Aladdin's lamp". At the time, the Aladdin series was still in production at Disney. So that's a bit of an in-joke.
And how about that: Demona is still carrying a torch for Goliath. On some level, she wants him more than almost anything. Yet she continually allows her hatred to get in the way. And the irony is, that at this point, pre-Vows it isn't yet too late for them. But her actions further serve to cement the Goliath/Elisa relationship. More now than ever before.
Puck/Brent Spiner is just fantastic. I love that "charming personality" line. And "You don't know what you're asking, believe me." And "I'll do EXACTLY as you asked." And "My mistake." And "A very long nap." He's just so rich.
Plus the boarding and animation on Puck is just great. As is the sound work that accompanies him zipping around.
I always wanted Puck to be the one character who could break the fourth wall and talk directly to the audience. Every time he appeared, we'd put a line or two in the script that was addressed to the audience. And every time, Frank or Dennis Woodyard would cut it out of the board. They didn't like breaking the fourth wall. (A lot of guys don't. I tried to do that with Max on Max Steel, but Richard Raynis and Jeff Kline wouldn't allow that either.) Oh, well....
Puck also establishes that Oberon's Children generally use rhyming spells instead of Latin or Hebrew or whatever. (Thus making life slightly -- but ONLY slightly -- easier on me and the writers.) But Puck isn't too formal: "Human's love a battle hearty, so does Puck, come on, let's Party!" Fun. (And I like Brooklyn's line, "Party's over." too.)
Family Reactions #3
When Elisa's transformed into a gargoyle.
Erin: "She looks cute." [I very much agree. Though I always wonder where her red jacket goes.]
Ben then asked why she was transformed.
Beth explained that Demona didn't want Elisa to be human anymore.
Erin then corrects my wife and explains that Puck is tricking Demona.
KIDS GET IT! Adults need to pay closer attention!
Goliath suddenly has lust in his heart:
G: "I never realized when you were human just how beautiful you were."
E (with a smile): "You mean you thought I was ugly?"
G: "Uh... careful! Updraft!!"
Man, that guy is smooth.
Anyway, that's one of my all-time favorite exchanges. I think it reveals so much. Somewhere underneath, Goliath has been attracted to who Elisa IS deep-down -- at least since AWAKENING, PART THREE. But he never thought of her as a potential love interest. He wasn't brought up liberally enough to think that way. After all, she has no wings, no tail. And those human shaped feet!
But suddenly, she's revealed as a FEMALE. Now, even when she goes back to being human, his perspective is permanently altered. Hers, however, is not. She's already consciously had those thoughts. Consciously rejected them. So at the end of the episode, he wants to discuss these (for him) new feelings -- but she does not. And the sun helps shut him up.
G: "That's not what I meant."
E: "But that's the way it is."
Another of my all-time favorite exchanges. (I'm really partial to things involving the G/E relationship. I know, I know, I'm a romantic sap.]
I also like the ongoing confusion. Elisa: "Everyone in Manhattan has been turned into... HUMANS!" Goliath: "No, no, no, no, no." And when the Gargoyles are changed into humans, Brooklyn is so sure that they've always been humans, it's funny. Like that moment in CITY OF STONE, when he's convinced that the "statue of Elisa" is a bad likeness of her: "They got the nose wrong."
FYI, there was an honest attempt, within the logical parameters of what our gargs looked like, to make their human versions resemble the actors who played them. Thus Goliath has darker skin than the others, because Keith David is African-American. (Though otherwise Goliath really looks like Conan to me.) The bald Lex has brown hair and the bald Broadway has blond like Thom Adcox and Bill Fagerbakke respectively. Brooklyn resembles Jeff Bennett but with Brooklyn's white hair instead of Jeff's blond. And Hudson looks like Ed Asner with a beard. More or less. Thom Adcox is the one who most looked like the human version of his character.
Cool little touches:
Demona nudges an unconscious Puck with her tail.
She continues to call Hudson, "Old Soldier". Her tenth century "name" for him.
Her line about the "gift of being a gargoyle". I love that superior attitude.
Lexington's "Fun, but weird" line.
Hudson wrapping the sheet over the mirror.
Elisa and Demona have a brief "cat-fight" as Gargoyles. Not quite as diverting as the one they'll have as humans in High Noon. But it was nice to put them on equal physical footing for a change. Let them have it out.
Demona mentions that Puck isn't too tired to make himself "invisible to the crowd". This was us trying to plug a hole in our story. We felt it would undercut the mob's reactions to our newly human heroes if they had the same reaction to seeing Puck. And yet Puck clearly looks more human than Gargoyle. More "other". So we slid that line in to avoid the whole problem.
FAMILY REACTION #4
Beth laughed at Hudson's very Scots reading of "No doubt about it." Which is pronounced more like: "No doot aboot it."
More sappy stuff (which I love):
Goliath's line: "I'll always be there to catch you."
Elisa completely forgetting her fear of flying in order to save the MAN she loves.
That brief moment when both Elisa and Goliath are humans at the same time.
Hudson's wistful line about seeing the sun, just once.
Although it had little to do with the metaphor, we couldn't really resist the notion of showing Bronx transformed into a dog. We picked the biggest dog we could think of, a Wolfhound type, though a bulldog might have been more reminiscent.
In the script, Demona smashes the mirror upon seeing her human reflection in the glass. But somehow the scene never got animated. So we added the sound of the mirror being smashed to the exterior shot at the end. This was important in order to give the story full closure. The initial point of the episode was to prevent Demona from getting Titania's Mirror. Structurally, therefore, I couldn't allow her to keep it.
But no fear, later we introduced Oberon's Mirror (clearly part of a matching set) in THE GATHERING, PART ONE.
I wonder what all those Manhattanites thought when suddenly they realized they were all barefoot.
Though I think it's one of our most rewarding episodes, it was a tough one to make come together. So after I received the first draft script on "The Mirror", I sent a second memo to Brynne. Here it is, UNEDITED:
Notes on "The Mirror" Script...
O.k. The problems here seems to be mostly my fault. I haven't been able to make clear to you guys how I want our characters to react when they've been changed. It's been clear in my head. And for me the logic flows backwards from a scene I want to see where an average-human-pedestrian-who-has-been-turned-into-a-gargoyle sees one of our transformed-into-human-heroes and screams: "Look at that monster!! It's like some kind of horrible... HUMAN!!" The key is that the bystander actually uses the word "HUMAN", and that he says it with the same kind of fear and revulsion that we would normally hear (in a more typical episode) being used for the word "GARGOYLE".
In order to get both the revulsion into the word "Human" and a strongly negative reaction to our heroes' new human appearance, the bystander needs to believe that being a gargoyle is the way it's supposed to be. Therefore when the bystander's appearance was changed his mind-set must have been changed as well.
Working backwards from that goal, how would our main characters react to being changed?
THEIR MINDSET WOULD CHANGE SIMULTANEOUSLY WITH THEIR APPEARANCE:
Elisa is the first to be transformed. Thus, ELISA'S REACTION to being changed into A GARGOYLE is the surprising statement:
"Goliath, You've been changed into a gargoyle!"
Reasoning: Goliath &co. were always "the other" to Elisa. But when she was transformed, her mindset changed with her appearance. So she now believes that being a gargoyle is normal. Since, Goliath &co. now look "normal" to her, she figures that they must have been magically changed from being "the other" into being "normal"--i.e. they have been transformed into gargoyles.
[I realize this seems byzantine, but ultimately it'll be the most straightforward reaction on screen, short of having everyone entirely self-aware from the moment they change, (which just isn't as much fun to me). See how it plays out in beat #11. (Also #9, 13, 14 and 21.) If you're still not clear, please don't hesitate to call me.]
Despite absurdist moments in this story, we must keep the tension and suspense running high, throughout.
--Don't reveal Elisa's presence at the museum until last possible second. Same with Goliath.
--Don't let Gargoyle's lose track of their objective for more than a line of dialogue here or there.
--Don't let the battle meander from place to place. Keep battle and chase scenes focused and specific.
WHAT THEY'VE BEEN WISHING FOR:
1. Get rid of humans, particularly Elisa.
2. Get rid of Goliath and Co.
3. Stop turning to stone during the day.
GOLIATH & ELISA'S WISH - To be together. (Elisa is slightly more self-aware than Goliath, but neither should specifically wish in dialogue to become the race of the other. It's too on the head.)
TRIO'S WISH - To assimilate.
CLARITY IN SCRIPT
O.K. TO USE: ELISA/GARGOYLE
DON'T USE: HUMAN/GARGOYLES
Even for me, these were too confusing.
In group scenes, LIST ALL CHARACTERS IF NECESSARY.
--Establish two security guards - but don't reveal that one of them is Elisa (or that Goliath is there).
--Demona breaks in and takes out the first guard.
--Second guard turns out to be Elisa, ready and waiting w/Goliath.
--Establish how much Demona hates humans in general, and Elisa specifically.
--Demona never gets as far as laser-grid around mirror.
--And while Goliath and Elisa are chasing her...
Maybe inter-cut w/...
--Thieves get past laser-grid to steal mirror.
4. Ext. Demona's house.
--The two thieves deliver mirror.
5. Int. Demona's house.
--Demona summons Puck.
6. Clock tower.
--Elisa arrives. They were duped. Mirror was stolen.
--Elisa's: So how bad is this? What can D do with that mirror?
--No one knows for sure, but it leads to the discussion of Oberon's Children.
--Refer here to Midsummer Night's Dream.
--Scotsmen called them "Fair Folk".
--Vikings called them "Dark Elves".
--Trio: Imagine what it would be like to shape-change. Fit in anywhere.
--Hint subtly at Elisa and Goliath's desires.
7. Demona's house.
--Make sure we know Puck's name here.
--Our Demona and Puck wish scene.
--Puck uses a rhyming spell.
--Puck's arms are pinned by chains, so magic energy comes out of his eyes.
8. Clock Tower.
--Elisa: All we can do is wait til Demona makes her move.
--Elisa transforms into a gargoyle.
9. Clock Tower.
--Everyone including Bronx is pretty stunned by Elisa's change.
--She seems happy though.
-- Elisa: "This is wonderful. Goliath, you've been transformed into a gargoyle!"
10. Demona's House.
--Puck tells her the deed is done.
--Demona wants to escalate. Every human in Manhattan.
--Puck again stresses difficulty of "big wishes".
--Demona yanks chain: "Answer truthfully. Can it be done?"
--Puck: Yes, but not from here.
11. Clock Tower.
--Bronx sniffs at Elisa.
--Goliath: "We've always been gargoyles. You're the one who's been changed."
--Elisa: "I've always been a gargoyle. I think I'd know it if I wasn't."
--Goliath: "How did we first meet?"
--Elisa: "I fell off a skyscraper; you glided down and caught me."
--Goliath: "If you always had wings, why would you need me to catch you."
--Elisa: "I can't glide with these."
--Goliath: "Yes, you can."
--AND OFF THEY GO.
--Hudson and Trio stare at each other for a beat and then follow.
--Bronx is left behind.
12. WORLD TRADE CENTER
--Puck and Demona materialize w/mirror.
--P: This is gonna take a while.
--He begins visually gathering magical energy. Just a little at first.
13. Flight over the city.
--Goliath NEVER LETS GO OF HER HAND, even after it's clear that she's gliding under her own "power", because she's afraid. She doesn't want to lose that contact.
--Goliath can't help staring at her: "I never realized when you were human just how beautiful you are."
--Elisa: "You mean you used to think I was ugly?"
--He doesn't have a good answer to this.
--Fortunately for him, she segues to: "This is so confusing. Have I always been able to glide like this?"
--[She's still hasn't quite grasped the situation.]
--Goliath: "No. No. Try to understand. You've been changed into a gargoyle. Follow me, I'll show you."
--They glides in low over the streets. Elisa sees the humans and freaks!! (Her freaking needs to be ambiguous. Goliath thinks she understands now. She doesn't really.)
--Goliath: "Maybe we should land somewhere and talk."
--Goliath, Elisa, Hudson and Trio come in for a landing.
--(Establish clothes line. Someone has left their laundry, including bedsheets, to dry in the warm night air.)
--Elisa: "Did you see? Everyone in Manhattan's been turned into a HUMAN?!!!"
--G: "...no, no, no..."
--He points at light show that seems to be gathering around one of the towers of the WTC.
15. World Trade Center.
--BIG LIGHT SHOW as Puck glows with magical energy.
--P: "This is really going to wear me out."
--D: "Quit complaining and do it already."
--Puck casts rhyming spell.
--Magical energy shoots from entire body to hit mirror.
--Spell reflects off mirror and hits giant hyperbolic sattelite dish. --Sattelite dish fires magic off across the whole city.
--Goliath & Co. have seen light show from WTC, (but not result).
--Goliath &Co. leave Elisa on the roof and head toward WTC.
--Elisa's not happy about it, but they don't give her a choice.
--And she's still phobic about flying alone, so she can't follow.
--Now that the light show has subsided, Demona wants to see her "empty city", but Puck is out of it.
--Goliath and co. attack. She's forced to flee with Puck, but without mirror.
--(Somewhere in here, Demona has to mention Puck's name.)
--To save herself, she tosses it. Hudson saves it.
--Goliath and Trio pursue Demona.
18. Downtown streets/subway/ whatever
--Even though she's being chased and is hampered by the unconscious Puck, Demona still comes in for a landing to see the results of her wish.
--She's furious as she sees the human/"gargoyles" going about their business.
--Use this chase (and this scene) to reveal the extent and absurdity of the change that hasn't really changed anything but the appearance of the people. Take us down into the subway, maybe.
--Demona ultimately uses the situation to get lost in a crowd.
--For the pursuers, Goliath and trio, it's like finding a needle in a haystack.
--Throughout scene, Trio may get wistful and a little distracted about being able to fit in.
--There are female "Gargoyles" walking by, catching trio's eyes.
--They have to remind themselves that this is wrong. And they're not entirely convinced that it is.
--But other "gargoyles" still shy away from trio because of how they are dressed. (Or how little they are dressed.)
--At any rate, the trio don't totally lose track of their objective: Demona.
--But Demona's gone.
--Goliath: Let's go get Elisa and plan our next move.
19. A deserted alley.
--Demona confronts a very worn-out Puck.
--D: I wanted you to destroy the humans, not give them the gift of being a gargoyle!!
--D: "Change the gargoyles back to humans."
--Puck: "O.K., o.k., give me a chance to catch my breath."
--He leans to look at his reflection in the side-view mirror of a car.
--The image in the mirror wavers.
--Goliath, Hudson, Trio and Elisa confer.
--They have the mirror.
--That was definitely one of Oberon's Children with Demona.
--Demona called him Puck.
--Elisa: In Shakespeare, Puck was a harmless trickster.
--Goliath: What's happened below isn't harmless. Come, we must continue to search for Demona and Puck.
--Elisa: "I'll never get the hang of leaping off rooftops."
--Goliath: "I will always be there to catch you."
--She hesitates. He takes off to set an example.
--A bolt of Magic shoots out of the mirror catching Goliath, Hudson and the trio.
--Goliath changes to human and falls.
--Elisa dives and catches Goliath. Overcoming her fear without thinking about it.
--Meanwhile, Hudson grabs a sheet off the clothesline and covers the mirror: "Don't want anything else jumping out at us from this thing!"
--Goliath doesn't understand why he fell.
--Suddenly he stares at her: "Elisa...You've changed back to normal!!"
--E: No. I haven't changed. You have. You're a human. You fell because, you don't have wings.
--Brooklyn: "We've always been humans."
--Hudson: "And we've never needed wings to glide before."
--Lex (the engineer of the group): "Wait a minute, we must have used wings. How else could we do it?"
--Goliath, sinking in: "Elisa's right. We're supposed to be gargoyles. And we're not. Everyone else should be human. But thanks to Demona and Puck, they're not."
22. Alley & Street.
--Puck is very weary.
--Demona asks if it's done.
--Puck says yes.
--Demona and Puck cautiously exit alley.
--Obviously, all the humans are still "Gargoyles".
--Demona turns on Puck. I told you to turn the gargoyles to humans.
--Puck: "Oh, you meant these gargoyles! I thought you meant Goliath and the gang. My mistake. Sorry."
--Demona: "You turned Goliath into a human?!!"
--She's ready to murdilate Puck. She pulls the chain tighter, crushing him.
--Puck: "Hey, hey, hey, You're missing the big picture, here. This is your big chance to get rid of Goliath. Now, while he's weak as any human."
--She stops, smiles.
23. Rockefeller Center. Some time later.
--Bronx runs into shot. [He has not been transformed yet.]
--A human/ "gargoyle" pedestrian bends over to pet the nice doggie and then runs away screaming when he sees the doggie's masters.
--Our "human" heroes now fully clothed (and looking cool) walk with determination right up to the center of Rockefeller Center. Hudson still has the mirror, covered in the bed sheet.
--(Elisa is not in sight.)
--Everywhere, pedestrian/"gargoyles" run screaming: "Ahhh, humans!! Run!!" "Oh, they're so ugly." "Keep away, you...you monster human, you."
--Hudson to Goliath: Are you sure this is a good idea?
--G: Demona must have done all this for a purpose. What else could it be except to leave us vulnerable to her attack. So we'll let her come to us, but we'll pick the place of battle. Here on the ground and in the open where her wings won't help her much.
--They take their stand. Not all the pedestrians have run. Some stop and stare, but they all keep their distance from these human monsters.
--Goliath instructs Hudson to unwrap the mirror.
--The instant he does, Puck and Demona fly out of it.
--BATTLE ROYALE (Needs real choreography.)
--Demona's armed with her plasma rifle.
--Gargoyle's are armed with medieval weapons.
--Battle is largely land bound.
--Puck's having a good time and helps Demona.
--His stunts can be darkly funny, i.e. they can be absurd, as long as they increase the danger to our heroes.
--Puck turns Bronx into a Russian Wolf-hound, just for fun.
--Some brave bystanders see Demona being attacked by all these monsters and run in to help.
--Trio are forced to battle them.
--These human/ "gargoyles" don't know their own strength, so fighting them isn't easy.
--Obviously at some crucial moment, Elisa (their secret weapon) flies in and takes on D.
--Demona should not instantly recognize Elisa.
--But when Demona does, she goes nuts. Elisa's presence (both the fact that she is alive and a gargoyle) is a double-edged sword. The best (psychological) weapon the good guys have, it throws Demona into a rage, which makes her doubly dangerous, but careless.
--Goliath and Elisa stand together to defeat D.
--Trio take on and scare off the "gargoyle" good samaritans.
--With Bronx's help, Hudson bags Puck with metal-mesh trashcan.
--Goliath promises to free Puck if he changes things back to normal.
--Puck complies. He'll start with the biggest job -- getting all the humans back to normal. (Fortunately, changing something back to its normal state is easier for him than the reverse.)
--Using rhyming spell, mirror and sattelite dish, Puck lets the magic fly.
--Elisa is human again.
--Puck needs a moment to recover.
--Elisa and Goliath have a brief moment.
--Elisa (self-depricating): "Well, I guess I'm back to my old ugly human self."
--G: "Never, to these eyes. But I'm curious. Am I handsome to you like this?"
--E: "You've always been handsome to me."
--PUCK: "Allright, enough of the mushy stuff!"
--He zaps Goliath, Hud, Bronx and Trio back into Gargoyles. (Note: he doesn't need the mirror, since they're all standing right in front of him.)
--Goliath frees Puck.
--Puck takes off with Demona through Mirror, taking mirror with.
25. Demona's house.
--Puck's grateful for a good time, enjoyed by all.
--He'll grant Demona her original wish: She won't turn to stone during the day.
--She's suspicious, for obvious reasons.
--He must SPELL OUT that she will still be her normal GARGOYLE self at night. But during the day, she won't have to sleep as stone.
--One last little rhyme spell.
--And he disappears through mirror.
26. Clock Tower.
--Final scene with Bronx, Hud, Trio, Goliath and Elisa. (This was really nice, as written.)
27. Demona's House.
--The sun is rising.
--We can only see Demona in sillouette.
--Until she turns to look at herself in the mirror.
--Which she smashes.
(The script I received had some odd page numbering. The title page was numbered as page one, some pages were skipped and had no numbers, and the last page was numbered 33. So I just renumbered it from the first page of script on through the last . The following notes therefore refer to my numbers. Call me if you have any questions.)
If Demona never gets the opportunity to destroy or turn off the laser-grid around the mirror, than we can leave it for the thieves to deal with and ditch all this dialogue and action revolving around alarms. Demona's meant to be a diversion.
Please don't refer to the Security Guard as Sarge or Old Soldier. I know it's just character stuff, but we don't have the space to give it context. It winds up confusing us as to who the guard really is.
Remember: Male gargoyle eyes glow white. Only female gargoyle eyes glow red.
Throughout script we use both "rooklings" and "hatchlings". I prefer "hatchlings". That way audience members who have missed the one or two references to the rookery, will still understand.
Goliath's getting wounded is problematic. We don't deal with it in the story. It's quickly forgotten. We don't want to play fast and loose with something like that.
Don't forget to give us some description of Puck. (He definitely should have pointed ears, for example. I added pointed ears to the description of the Weird Sisters in their true form.)
I don't know that we want to refer to all of Oberon's Children as "real mean". Seems blatantly racist.
When Demona summoned Puck earlier, she did it in Latin. So please make sure we name him here in this scene.
If you cannot rid me of all humans,
then at least rid me of that human --
We need the double entendre of Demona asking Puck to get rid of that
human-Elisa. ("Oh," Puck weasles to himself, "get rid of the human-Elisa. Make her a gargoyle-Elisa instead.")
Our Gargoyles shouldn't notice that anything has changed among the pedestrians below, until they get close enough to see. (From a practical standpoint, the idea of each person suddenly taking up more room, might be tough to get across in animation.)
Let's show at least one of the Human/"Gargoyles" looking at his or her reflection (in a store window or something) and preening. Totally unaware of the change.
Goliath says, "What sorcery is this?" twice in the episode. Let's skip both. He said this exact line in "Awakening".
Keep focus and imperative of THIS story. No one has time to stop for hot dogs or to deal with vandals. (So skip both incidents.)
Puck doesn't have to pretend that he did "exactly" as Demona commanded. He can have more attitude. "Hey, close enough." or "If you're going to split hairs..."
Again, let's not make Hudson an expert on Puck as an individual. We don't need him to identify Puck from tapestries. (And I doubt if his education has progressed to the point where he's read Shakespeare.) Plus, I'm not sure we have to label Puck as the "worst" of Oberon's children, either.
Gargoyles including Elisa/gargoyle CANNOT hover.
Also don't forget...
--Latin version of Demona's spell from Grimorum. (It doesn't have to rhyme.)
--Rhyming spell in English for what Puck does to everyone. (Needs to be vague enough so that Demona isn't immediately tipped off.) Doesn't need to be same spell each time.
--Somewhere in here, we need to justify why none of the human/"gargoyle" crowd reacts to Puck. Do they see him as a gargoyle, ala the Weird Sisters? Or is he invisible to them? Or can we get away with them just walking by and ignoring him?
--Make sure final page count will be within our page range (pp. 35-39) after Denise has conformed it.
THANKS. DON'T HESITATE TO CALL WITH ANY QUESTIONS.
Next up for my Ramblings is "The Mirror". What follows is the UNEDITED memo I sent to story editor Brynne Chandler Reaves regarding the first draft outline for that episode.
This is one I had very specific ideas on, so I may have been even tougher than usual. Oh, well...
Notes on "The Mirror" Outline...
Brynne, I hope you consider this flattering: I'm gonna be very tough on you here, because I think you can handle it. It's not just because of this outline, but because in general, I want you to be handing me cleaner, more finished pieces. Although the story is full of great ideas, there are logical and structural problems here that need fixing. As I've discussed, I want to be less "hands-on" so that the schedule keeps flowing and we all stay sane, but that means I need you to catch much more of this sort of thing before I ever see it.
One particular concern of mine (and not so incidentally of Gary Krisel's) is padded first acts, where nothing of substance happens until the cliffhanger. Each story dictates its own structure, so I don't want to make any hard and fast rules, but this is one thing you should be thinking about on every episode you edit or write. We can have a prologue scene or two. But we don't want to turn the whole first act into a prologue to events that only begin seconds before the commercial break.
Scene One is a nice prologue. So is Two, if it's brief. Three, Four and Five are padding. Six is good prologue, but by this time it feels like padding. Seven is problematic from a character/logic standpoint. Finally, we get going at Eight.
And opening acts aside, we need to beware of scenes that serve no function in the structure of the story. A real good character moment is worth a detour on occasion. But our stories have to be coming out of character anyway, so nine times out of ten, the detour shouldn't be necessary.
Ever since "Reawakening" we've tried to make the Gargoyles much more pro-active. But even by first season "survival-mode" standards they seem downright slow to act here. In scene Three, they suspect magical bad news is on the way. In scene Six, they confirm Demona's involvement. Yet in scene Ten, they go to the play in the park like nothing was wrong. Worse, in scene Sixteen, when the humans are transformed, the younger gargoyles actually think that the transformation is part of the play? They're more sophisticated than that. And instead of reacting like it's a problem, they just want "contact with their kind". I wouldn't mind a wistful line that summoned up their feelings about how this reminds them of their old lives when there were many gargoyles and/or that it's nice to be able to walk out in the open without everyone running away screaming, but they have to realize that this transformation is bad news. Then in scene TWENTY-TWO (that's the beginning of ACT THREE and a full fourteen scenes after Goliath battled Demona in the museum) they "are certain now that Demona is behind this". Who did they think was behind it for the last act and a half? This is a good sign that we're either short on structure, heavy on padding or both.
We must have a clear theme that involves at least one of the "good" gargoyles in every episode. We shouldn't have to dig deep for it. It's what focuses the events that dictate our structure. Today's theme is "Be careful what you wish for, you just might get it." It applies to Demona, obviously. But it applies to subconscious desires on the part of Goliath. And wistful, but conscious desires on the part of Elisa. And even (to a small extent) the desire of our young trio to assimilate. Emphasize the theme as much as possible.
GARGOYLES AND MAGIC
Please remember that the gargoyles are largely ignorant of the workings of magic. They have an advantage over humans in that they know magic exists. That's about it. Demona and Macbeth have had centuries to study it. Guys like the Magus and the Archmage dedicated their lives to studying it. Brooklyn, on the other hand, is no expert. I doubt he can even read Latin. And the GRIMORUM is not a textbook that would provide easy answers even if he could read it. It is, in essence, a cookbook. If a recipe is torn out, there's no way to infer very much about it from the remaining pages. Remember, the Magus had the sleep spell he used on the gargoyles, and even with that and all his training, he couldn't wake them up without the specific page that held the counterspell. HOW could Brooklyn find a list (scene 5) that matches Demona's list? WHY would the Grimorum list the items for one specific spell twice? HOW could he know the name (Scene Eight) of the entity being summoned?
Could the Grimorum tell them that Puck's spells must be reversed before dawn? Or how Puck frees himself? Unlikely. (Would Julia Child's cookbook feature recipes by the Frugal Gourmet?) But (if we assume Goliath reads Latin, and could make heads or tails of the Grimorum, without having to sit down and spend an entire week reading the thing cover-to-cover to find a helpful passage in a book which, as you noted, has no index) -- it is possible. We always skate by a few things in every script. But the more we have to skate, the thinner the ice in general. Something that normally would fit neatly beneath our audiences suspension of disbelief, becomes one more contrivance in a story that's got a few too many.
First off, she's not looking for an equal partner or ally. She's made that clear enough. That's exactly her problem with Xanatos. He always wants to know what's in it for him. He can't be easily controlled. He's fine if they have a mutual interest (resurrecting Goliath or Coldstone), fine if she can con him into helping her (as she does in "City of Stone"), but the latter isn't easy. Otherwise, they can't work together. They're goals are too diverse.
As for Macbeth, don't even bring him up. This story airs before CITY OF STONE. She hasn't seen Macbeth for decades probably. And it's been centuries since they worked together on anything.
None of this changes the story, but it's important to get her mind-set clear. She isn't summoning Puck as an ally. But as a slave.
And what does she want her slave to do? Basically, this episode is going to underline Demona's truly short-term thinking. She knows she wants humanity eradicated. But not what she'd do if she ever accomplished that goal. She's closed her heart to anything that doesn't serve her immediate short-term plans. (She's really, really screwed up.) At one point, Puck should offer her Goliath. He can make Goliath love her again. But she's so distracted by her hatred for Elisa in particular and humans in general, that she can't keep a positive thought in her head. Her monolithic and myopic fanaticism allow Puck to make a primate out of her, literally and figuratively.
First big note from Adrienne and ME: we cannot play this character like he's a demon. His summoning in particular came off as very satanic. Let's try to make it more fanciful and magical. One thing that would help avoid this problem, is to be clear about what Puck is. If we aren't clear, people might think demon or devil. If we are clear, they'll believe us. We've got to establish, not only Puck, but his entire magical race. They are the third sentient group that once populated our planet in addition to humans and gargoyles. We need a name for this race that we can be comfortable with. (We can say at some point that the Scots called them the Fair Folk; the Vikings called them Dark Elves. But neither name is great. There must be something that could work for us. "The Oberati" perhaps, after their king?)
Then we need to set some rules and limits. Particularly given what we know about the Weird Sisters (and about Puck's secret identity). Obviously, not all of these rules need to be spelled out in this script. But let's make sure we know them. Let's begin by saying that the Oberati can all shape-shift. But when they morph into a form, they're stuck with that form's limitations. No magic happening if they pose as human.
In their true forms, they have a lot of magic power, but a rule against the direct use of it in the world of man (witness the Weird Sisters more indirect manipulations). Maybe this is a command from Oberon which they are afraid, but not unable, to break.
An obvious exception to the rule occurs when they are enslaved by someone else who commands them to use their magic. They are off the hook responsibility-wise, so they can go to town. Thus, most cultures have wish-granting legends about Leprechauns or Djinn or whatever.
Conveniently, the Oberati are creatures of pure magical energy. When they cast a spell, the spell doesn't have the limitations imposed on the studied magic of human or gargoyle sorcerers. The subjects of their spells don't have to see and hear them to be affected. It's a more fluid, less structured form of magic. Magic to the Archmage is an art, craft or science to master. Magic to Puck is as natural (or super-natural) as breathing.
But even Puck must have his limits. Even magical energy should be finite. We MUST establish this fact, at least. If Demona asks to get rid of all the humans on the planet, Puck will have to admit that it's too much for him. Would she settle for all the humans on the island?
Did the Gargoyles meet or hear of Puck specifically, back in the tenth century? I doubt it. They lived fairly isolated lives out at Wyvern. And Puck didn't get famous until Shakespeare made him famous quite a few centuries later. Maybe they've heard stories about the Fair Folk, but again, let's resist the temptation to make Goliath or Brooklyn or Hudson experts on the subject. They seem pretty perplexed by the Weird Sisters in "City of Stone". That should define their reaction to Puck, whom they're meeting here prior to that story.
Why does Puck help Goliath turn stuff back to normal at the end? Well, for this episode's purposes, it'll probably work that Goliath holds the chain and issues a command. But Demona held the chain, and Puck always found a way to circumvent her commands. So why doesn't he do the same to Goliath? Two reasons, probably. First, it further annoys Demona, who he's peeved at for enslaving him in the first place. Second, once Puck is free, he can return to his secret identity, where he's been having such a good time. He wants things back to normal himself. Still in future appearances, we need to be sure that Puck doesn't turn into a personification of Deus ex machina.
Use it sparingly, but it's o.k. with me if Puck breaks the third wall and addresses the audience on occasion.
Finally, Puck's name. The Disney execs are of two minds on this. Bruce prefers Goodfellow. His main concern is the constant policing we'd have to do to make sure Puck doesn't ever come out Fuck. Ellen feels that Goodfellow has more association with Satan than Puck does and that Puck is safer on that level. I'm really torn. I tend to agree that Puck is a slightly more recognizable Shakespearean reference than Goodfellow, and thus stonger and safer. I also think the name suits the character. On the other hand, I think Goodfellow is an effectively ironic name for a character who is, for all intents and purposes, a villain. Part of me really wants to use both. Could the spell that enslaves Puck to Demona have something to do with her knowing his true name, Robin Goodfellow? Adrienne, I think, is on the fence with me. But I'm not sure. We should probably discuss this one last time before you go to script.
Think of the Wicked Queen's Magic Mirror times ten. It is a window, a doorway, a Peeping Tom.
HUMANS AS "GARGOYLES"
As we discussed, I don't think the humans notice they've been transformed. Some of the ridiculous fun of this episode should be to see them, walking around, going about their normal business, briefcases and subway tokens in hand, with no indication that anything is different. If they looked in a mirror, they'd preen as usual. They wouldn't freak out or recognize the change.
Although they have wings, I don't think it occurs to any of them to start gliding around the city. And if they see (the soon-to-be more self-aware) Elisa flying, it would be shocking: "Look, Mommy, that lady is flying!!" It's not that they'd see her suddenly as a gargoyle. (It'd be like seeing Superman. A normal enough looking person. He just happens to be leaping tall buildings with a single bound, which is, of course, unusual enough.)
When Goliath and clan walk among them as gargoyles, I don't think they see them as unusual. For once, looking like a gargoyle is normal. Like Halloween, in "Eye of the Beholder", it's another rare moment for our guys when they can be out in the open. (This may have been what you had in mind in scene 18. I wasn't clear.)
However, when Goliath and company enter their midst as "Humans", it should scare them. Once again, ugliness is in the eye of the beholder, and the "human" Goliath is still the monster. We should not skip this beat (as you planned to in scene 24). We should play it. It can be bitter, poignant and, yes, funny. (Appealing to Puck's dark sense of humor (and mine too, for that matter).)
ELISA AS A "GARGOYLE"
Like the other transformed humans, Elisa doesn't immediately realize she's been transformed. And looking in the mirror won't clue her in either. (And in any case, Elisa isn't the type to faint dead away.) In fact, she might turn to Goliath and suddenly ask, "Could you remind me why you guys are hiding up here in the clock tower?" Suddenly, they don't look so strange to her. Goliath is going to have to sit her down and talk her through the differences between humans and gargoyles. Her realization should play like a fog lifting.
And we probably should play out Goliath and Elisa both as gargoyles for an act. Maybe he teaches her how to fly. Maybe they're just about to get close enough to do the gargoyle equivalent of an embrace, when he's transformed to human. Get it so that we can all almost taste it. Then yank it away. (I know, I'm a cruel bastard.)
I also want to contrast Goliath's reaction to "gargoyle" Elisa with Elisa's reaction to "human" Goliath. He may say, "Elisa, I never realized how beautiful you are," because he always liked her for her inner beauty but, frankly, never found her physically attractive (no wings, no tail--shudder). And he's always made that mental distinction between the surface and what lies beneath.
Elisa never did. She recognized his inner beauty in episode three or four and ALWAYS thought he was handsome. Even before this episode, I think she's thought about the two of them and come to the inescapable conclusion that romance is impractical. Better keep it platonic. I think he's had those feelings, but has never connected to them mentally. (Look, no matter what the species, or how evolved the individual, he's still a guy. And guys are fundamentally stupid about this stuff.) Until this episode, it never crossed his mind that Elisa could replace Demona in his heart. The fact is she already has. But he never thought about it before now.
OUR GARGOYLES AS "HUMANS"
To be consistent, they shouldn't recognize the change until Elisa points it out to them. Maybe they were about to leap from the clock tower, and Elisa has to stop them and say: "Look, guys, you don't have wings anymore!"
But let's keep in mind that these guys are still heroes. NO WAY are they going to agree to step back because a gargoyle Demona is too tough for them now. Did Elisa ever step back when she was human? For that matter, there have been plenty of humans willing to go toe-to-toe with the gargoyles. Certainly Goliath is as brave as Macbeth or Wolf or Commando #3.
Also, I got confused in scene 29. Goliath has been transformed to human. That means human proportions. Sure, he'd be a big guy, but not as big as he was as a gargoyle. I don't know why armor would fit, say Broadway, and not him.
In contrast to our typical episodes, I think this one can have a more absurdist tone. Puck should both further the tone with his actions and undercut it with wry asides. Plus there'll be romantic stuff, also undercut, this time by Goliath's reaction to Elisa and the genuine frustration that comes from the situation's mutability.
GOLIATH BLAMES XANATOS...
For everything, it seems. In "Lighthouse" and to a lesser extent in "Leader", we've played the beat of Goliath mistakenly going to the castle to confront Xanatos for something that the latter had nothing to do with. I think by now, Goliath has learned his lesson. Particularly since the going's on here smack much more of Demona or Macbeth than Xanatos.
DEMONA'S HOME BASE
Let's get a clear sense of what this place is like. Particularly, how it is distinct from Macbeth's mansion: we've played his place like Wayne Manor. Dracon has the penthouse at the Park Manor Hotel. And Xanatos has this incredibly cool castle-on-a-skyscraper H.Q. Demona's home needs to be different from all of these and special in its own right. Also give us an at least approximate idea of where this thing is located. Gramercy Park, maybe?
SHAKESPEARE IN THE PARK
This was a great way to ground our Puck in Shakespeare, as opposed to Satan. No doubt about it. And no fault of yours, but I want to save this setting for a story that Michael and I have discussed involving Macbeth and an adaptation of Shakespeare's Macbeth. Plus, in this story, I want to play with Manhattan life going on, business as usual, despite the fact that everyone's been turned into a gargoyle. We can't do that if we limit ourselves to the Park and the closed Museum. I want to get this story out in the open. Have the "gargoyle" humans reacting in panic to the "human" Goliath and clan, the way they'd normally react to them as gargoyles. That's an opportunity we won't get in another story. We must take advantage of it. But having taken the story out of the park, we should work other Midsummer references into the script. Name the mirror after Oberon or Titania, perhaps.
1. A warm Midsummer's Night. Demona arrives at the museum with grand theft in mind. She's come to steal the Mirror of Oberon (or whatever we ultimately call it) which has just arrived from Ireland (or Italy or wherever). The first museum security guard is no problem. But the second security guard turns out to be Elisa -- undercover, prepared and not without back-up, i.e. Goliath. They suspected that the mirror would be a prize too tempting for Demona to resist. Demona seems particularly furious over Goliath's continued "partnership" with Elisa. SHE HATES HUMANS AND SHE REALLY HATES ELISA!! (Demona knows how Goliath feels about Elisa, even if the big lug hasn't admitted it to himself yet.)
2. Anyway, we get a big action sequence in the museum which leads to a chase outside. Demona gets away from them, but without the mirror. And because our heroes are so thoroughly engaged in these activities...
3. ...They are absent when two high-tech but very human cat burglars show up at the museum, seconds later, to crate up and steal the mirror. (The real security guard is still unconscious and thus unable to do anything about them.)
4. The two thieves arrive at Demona's townhouse (or whatever) with the crated mirror. Otherwise, the scene plays pretty much as you had it with the delivery men.
5. Inside her home, Demona wraps thick iron chains across the glass of the stolen Mirror. She summons Puck. He comes flying out through the glass and thus winds up wrapped in the iron chains. He spends almost the entire episode with the chains pinning his arms across his chest.
6. Back at the clock tower, Goliath and Elisa are feeling like grade-A dorks. Elisa's just back from investigating the museum crime scene. It's now clear that Demona's job was to take out security and, if necessary, act as a diversion for the real thieves. Now the big questions are, what can she do with this mirror and how bad is this going to get? Perhaps this is a place to discuss the Oberati. Hudson tells what little he knows about them.
7. Our Demona and Puck scene. If he ever wants his freedom he must serve her. He tries to discourage her: he'd make a lousy servant. She doesn't buy that. Puck works for "him". He can work for her, etc. (That whole exchange.) O.K., okay, what does she want? Freedom from her one great vulnerability -- turning to stone during the day. What good is that, he wonders. You think you're gonna be able to walk down 5th Avenue in broad daylight? I can if you obliterate all humans, everywhere. What am I, the Genie of the lamp? There are limits, kiddo. C'mon, what do you really want? She pauses, and an image appears in the mirror. It is Goliath (in the clock tower, but we're tight on him, so we aren't tipping the location). Puck: "How quaint, after all these centuries, you're still carrying a torch. Well, if that's what you want, I can make him love you again. Although it will be really hard, because you're not exactly Miss Lovable." And then, in the mirror, Elisa steps into the shot, and puts a hand on Goliath's shoulder. Demona goes ballistic. She knows her heart's true desire. Get rid of the human -- Elisa Maza. Puck: "That I can do." He fires a magical bolt into the mirror at the image of Elisa.
8. Back at the tower, Elisa has a hand on Goliath's shoulder, reassuring him that they'll stop Demona's scheme, whatever it is. Suddenly, she is surrounded by a magical energy that rips her away from Goliath. The gargoyles try to help her, but they can't get close. We should think for a moment that this is the end of Rico... uh, Elisa. And then there is a blinding flash of light that whites out the whole screen. Followed by pitch black darkness. Elisa is still there. We see her silhouette as our eyes adjust and the light returns slowly to normal. She says she's o.k. And then she steps into the light. Transformed into a gargoyle version of herself.
END OF ACT ONE
Now I have to apologize. I know I promised you this for Monday. It's two a.m. Sunday and this is as far as I got. There's a reason (an excuse). Monday is Corporate Seminar. And my last act as an executive (before becoming a full-time producer on Tuesday) is to pitch all our new development to Michael Eisner and Rich Frank. This is a twice yearly event that requires a lot of preparation, and I just ran out of time to get these notes done. Normally, I'd pull an all-nighter, but I need some sleep to face these guys tomorrow.
You gotta admit, that was a pretty good excuse.
So I have to leave this to you. You're mission, if you chose to accept it, (AND YOU REALLY HAVE NO CHOICE IF YOU EVER WANT TO GET TO SCRIPT) is to write up a quick beat outline of acts two and three for me based on the sketchy notes below. It doesn't have to be long. Two to four pages is fine. The amount of detail that I gave you for Act One is all I'm looking for.
Act Two should have Goliath filling Elisa in about the change she's undergone. Maybe take her flying. Maybe this is where we get the line about him never realizing how beautiful she was.
Demona should be temporarily fooled into thinking Elisa's dead, and flushed with success, she asks Puck to rid all of Manhattan of its humans. Bing, bang, boom. Everyone's a gargoyle. People on the subway in from Queens, change into gargoyles as soon as the E-train hits the first Manhattan stop. "Gargoyles" on the way home to Jersey change back to human as they cross the bridge in their cars. NO ONE NOTICES AT ALL.
But Demona doesn't know any of this yet. She wants a tour of what she expects to be an empty city. Puck is secretly eager to see his handiwork, so they step into the mirror, which transports them to the heart of the city. Times Square, maybe? 5th Avenue?
Meanwhile, Hudson, Goliath, Elisa and the trio are all hunting for Demona. They quickly notice the change in the populace. (Maybe the shock of this wide-spread change interrupts what might have been the only chance Elisa and Goliath had for a same-species clinch.) They all know it's bad news, but the trio can't help enjoying the ability to walk among gargoyles again. Even if they are gargoyles in business suits: New Yorkers who still won't give them the time of day. Still, would it be so bad if this didn't get fixed? Yeah. Probably.
When Demona figures out she's been duped, she demands that the gargoyles be changed back to humans. Bing Bang Boom. Goliath, Hudson and the Trio are human. (I'm torn about Bronx. I guess the big dog is o.k. It just seems outside the terms of Demona's request, even by Puck's loose standards.)
Was Goliath flying at the time or is this another interrupted clinch between him and Elisa?
Act Three opens with Elisa saving Goliath from plummeting to his death perhaps. Then she has to make him understand that he has been transformed as well.
We wind up with a very public battle featuring Elisa and our Newly Human heroes against Demona and Puck. It's complicated by the fact that the general populace (who are all now Gargoyles) perceive the human Goliath, Hudson and Trio (and Bronx?) as monsters attacking what to them seems to be a very normal-looking Demona.
Still in the end, good triumphs. Puck makes everything right at Goliath's command, (but let's make it clear that at least in part, he's doing this to spite Demona and/or to suit his own agenda). Elisa is changed to human, before Goliath is changed back, and we have another near-clinch, that Puck interrupts with good-humored spite by changing Goliath back into a gargoyle.
Goliath frees Puck and he vanishes with Demona, rescuing her from Goliath.
Turns out Puck had more fun than he thought he would so he feels like he owes Demona a favor. He'll give her her original wish. No turning to stone during the day. (BUT WE NEED TO MAKE IT PAINFULLY CLEAR THAT SHE WILL STILL BE HER NORMAL GARGOYLE SELF AT NIGHT.) He takes his leave via the mirror.
Cut back to Elisa and Goliath for emotional wrap up. Just before the sunrise which, as usual, separates them.
And back to Demona. Silhouetted against the rising sun. It's up, and she's not stone. Puck kept his word, she can't believe it. Then she sees her human self in the mirror, which she smashes, yelling NOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!! And fade to black.
Hello greg and Gorebash.
Punchinello, here, with another question. I was thinking recently of the phoenix gate. It had always seemed to me that the design of the gate was odd, in that it's form reflected a specific history. One that you never had the chance to elaborate upon. Or never chose to. Let me explain.
The gate was identifiable as one of three magical objects that played a role in the series. The Grimorim. The Eye of Odin, and the gate. Of these three, the origin of the book seemed to be the least perplexing. Even if you had intended to develop a more involved history for the book, had the series continued, one could still reasonably conclude that it was the product of many magicians, who passed it down over generations, each making their own contribution to the knowledge within the text. The revelation that the eye was the actual eye of Odin was well recieved by myself. I think there is actually some kind of precedent for the body part of a god or magical figure being represented within a culture by an artifact (but as the literal body part). I am uncertain what it is I recall, of this sort, but the Osiris myth and various christian mythos come to mind.
The gate was given no historical origin. The rather robust histories of the other two artifacts, and what you intended with the "Timedancer" series, (which I had no idea about prior to finding this web site) incline me to believe that something more was intended with the objects origin. Further, the gates physical appearance struck me as being more that the arbitrary design of one of the show's artists. It's appearance was strangely deliberate. The heraldric profile of the bird. It's form reminiscent of a shield? The gate seemed to have had some function. (Perhaps before it became the phoenix gate.) So...
Was the gate something with an origin you intended to elaborate on?
Was it possibly part of some larger artifact? (I had the notion in my head, that it was a component from some other fictional artifact. Something from the same mythos as the Arthurian legend, perhaps. That it had been broken off or otherwise removed.) If that were the case then...
Was the artifact from which it came something that we might recognize? That is, something not too obscure? Something with it's own surrounding mythology like Excalibur or the holy grail?
I am thankful for any insight you can offer. Otherwise I just wont be able to get to sleep tonight.
3. It depends on how you look at it. (But you're skipping over the obvious.)
My iron question, posted again because of the crash.
The obvious reason for why Oberon's Children are vulnerable to iron is: a) they need some sort of kryptonite to keep them from getting out of control, and b) it's an element that comes from legend. But did you ever work out an "internal rationale" for why cold iron has the effect on them that it does?
I can't remember my answer.
a and b are certainly true. But I think that iron ore may be something solid and ancient that pre-dates their evolution.
But honestly, I think it's more a and b.
In the Gargoyles Universe is fate a person (a fay) or an element like time?
In M.I.A Goliath says to Griff "Fate is conspiring against us." and "Maybe fate can somehow be... aaah..."*pushes Griff away* "cheated."
"Time is a river correcting it's course." Is fate also an invisible element like time correcting peoples lives and stories? Or is it one of Oberon's children, a trickster maybe?
Fate isn't a person. (I'm not sure what you mean by "element".) But that doesn't mean that there aren't fae connected to fate the way Anubis for example is connected to Death.
How did Goliath and the others learn that Demona and Macbeth can only be killed if one kills the other? Demona told Brooklyn in "Temptation" how she had been dealing with humans for hundreds of years, and Macbeth told Goliath in "Enter Macbeth" how he had named Demona, which she herself said in "Awakening Part 5" happened long ago. So I get how they could figure out both were immortal, but how exactly did they figure out the terms of the spell?
And another thing--if they knew that only Macbeth could kill Demona and vice versa, how come they thought Macbeth died in the crash in "The Price" and Demona died in the fire in "The Reckoning'?
From the Weird Sisters, after they were captured -- but before they were released -- in "Avalon, Part Three".
"The Price" took place before "Avalon". And they never said she was dead in "The Reckoning". Goliath simply acknowledged that he wasn't sure. I mean how many questions have I had to answer here about the rules of the whole Macbeth/Demona thing. If you all have some doubts about how that spell works, don't you think Goliath and Angela might also.
I was watching the episode "The Price" a while ago. Great work on it! It really had me fooled the first time I watched it. I believed that Hudson put a spell on Hudson until I saw him on that cage. Great animation, too. I think Goliath look incredibly handsome! I'm a big fan of him. :)
Xanatos took a piece of Hudson's stone skin and threw it in the Cauldron. Owen submerged his hand in the Cauldron of Life, it turned to stone. So, I was wondering... what if Xanatos had taken a bit of Hudson's brown skin and threw it in the Cauldron instead?
What if instead of turning the body to stone it would make it immortal?
After all, wasn't it obvious to Xanatos that using a piece of stone would turn the body to stone? (Sure, it would make him immortal, but obviously not alive; unless he would've been alive under that stone skin, was he?)
Thank you for your time!
A devoted fan
"...Hudson put a spell on Hudson"?
You mean sliced off some of Hudson's flesh? Ewwww. Not exactly X's style, eh what?
Anyway, no the recipee was specific. Gargoyle's STONE skin. And the result was intentional and ironic.
When I saw this the first time on GMTV, I was blown away. At least, for months after this was the episode I remembered. It had Brooklyn (whose name I took about 20 episodes to memorise for some reason), and more importantly - it had Demona. I loved Demona here, and I was delighted at the theme of betrayal that flows through here. There's a great sense of hurt. It's really gorgeous.
But watching it the second time and times after, I have to say that I was less impressed. Demona seems to have a stock of classic villainess threats that she doesn't really grow out of in this season. They were great first time, but I'd seen 'LONG WAY TO MORNING' just the episode previously (see my 'THRILL OF THE HUNT' comment) and heard very similar dialogue.
Also, I can't help feeling that the ending was a bit of a con. It was very clever, but the idea that all through CITY OF STONE, HUNTER'S MOON and whatever comes after Goliath is still under a spell from episode 7 (even one that is inactive) doesn't appeal to me much.
Well, it always was a cheat. Getting off on a technictlity. I thought we could get away with it, and in a way, I think it's sorta cool, from a trivia standpoint, but I was aware that some people wouldn't be pleased. Ah, well...
In City Of Stone, Xanatos said to Owen, 'I'm told mixing magics is dangerous', did he mean Demona's spell and Puck magic or something else
Yeah, Demona and Puck. Mixing mortal sorcery with Fae magic.
Okay, this is what I meant with my question about prophecy and the existence thereof...
Usually in mythology/etc when an oracle/prophet speaks of the future this is due to some special power he/she/it has. In the episodes we've seen so far though, people like the Archmage (and perhaps the Weird Sisters as well) could only prophesy through the mechanism of time-travel. The knew of the future because they had been there or talked with the people who had been there, etc...
So... is there in your universe prophecy which is not simply knowledge gained through time-travel?
Yep. (And I don't recall the Weird Sisters having done any time traveling -- except forward like the rest of us.)
I'm curious exactly how magic casting works. It seems to be established that humans and gargoyles need a magic object and/or a magic spell to do magic.
But Oberon's Children seem to not have to use spells. Although Puck seems to. How do you explain that?
How do you want me to explain it?
How about in writing?
Look, Fae magic and Mortal Sorcery are two different things. With Mortals, most of the magic comes from without. With Fae, most of it comes from within. Fae are made of magic.
After that clear distinction, the specifics depend on control, style, training, power, i.e. lots of factors. Anansi spins his spells. Puck rhymes his. Oberon is so powerful he just has to speak his will. But rhyming helps, so he does that too sometimes. Most Fae rhyme, but there are plenty of exceptions.
Mortals need something to gather and focus energy. A place, a talisman, a spell.
I'm not exactly sure if that answers your question. If you need more specifics, post again.
Hey Greg, I have some religious questions for you.
1. Since you are seemingly very well versed in religious doctrine, I'm curious as to how you feel about the Judeo/Christian scriptures that prohibit wizardry. Deuteronomy 18:9-18:12 (Let no one be found among you who sacrifices his son or daughter in the fire, who practices divination or sorcery, interprets omens, engages in witchcraft, or casts spells, or who is a medium or spiritist or who consults the dead. Anyone who does these things is detestable to the Lord) makes it quite clear that God brooks no wizards in his fold. Is there a conflict for you since so much of the myth Gargoyles is based on revolves around magic?
2. What about the uncanny resemblance between gargoyles and demons? Why do the two look so much alike? Did dybbuks manifest themselves in the form of gargoyles in order to sow discord with humanity, hence the current demonic stereotype and poor human/garg relations?
3. How do the Fae feel about the whole God business? They seem a rather worldly lot, though some might be old enough to remember biblical events.
4. Why is Percy still using the grail? The Holy Grail is a sacred artifact, not your run-of-the-mill magical maguffin. Why would it continue to grant its power to Duval, who has since proved unworthy? I know you said it was costing him a high physical price but I find it odd that it should be giving him any kind of benefits at all (Anybody see what happened to the bad guy in Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade?).
5. Last one. Is the Judeo/Christian God the supreme ruler of the Gargoyle universe? Given the plethora of Gods and Goddess on the show, I'm just wondering what your views on this are (I prefer to think that He's the one in charge, but I had to ask).
Thanks for your time, as always. Now I must return to the Vole Wars…
1. I'm clearly less "versed" than you seem to think. I won't comment on your citation in a vacuum. And I don't have a bible here in the office to check the context.
When you ask if I'm conflicted, I'm not clear on your question. Are you looking for my opinion on the bible? Personally, I think the bible is an astounding piece of literature with much to teach us. But I see the hands of man all over that book. And although it might lose me some fans, I cannot believe that God authored it. Inspired it maybe, but authored it, no. At any rate, I think many things in the bible are subject to interpretation. Often multiple interpretations.
2. Where do you get the idea that there is ANY resemblance between gargoyles and demons? From Medieval painters? Look, we haven't seen any demons in the series. We haven't seen any demons in the gargoyles universe. No angels either. I'm not saying whether they exist or not. But you're question assumes facts not in evidence.
3. The whole God with a capital G business? Like humans, every Child of Oberon is different. I try not to make monolithic generalizations.
4. Assumes facts not in evidence. A. Who says he's still using the grail? I said he still had it. B. And in any case, your question asked "Why". Why wouldn't he if he could? C. Who said the grail can "grant" power? D. If it can, who said it is? E. Who said Duval has proven unworthy?
And I certainly refuse to use "Last Crusade" as an authority.
I will say that the Grail is part of the reason that Percival and Blanchefleur are still alive. And that a price for that has been paid. But don't oversimplify.
5. As you may know, I'm Jewish. Most of my fellow Jews would not consider me to be religious, though that's something I might argue with. Personally, I believe in God with a captial G. Whether that means he's the Judeo/Christian God seems like a parochial question to me. Almost an elitist question. I also believe that God is REAL BIG on free will. His miracles are many but subtle, and all come with a free scientific explanation -- because if he simply manifested like George Burns on trial, then where's the free will? So why should things be any easier in the Gargoyles Universe. The Gargs believe in a God that is the sum total of all things. They are monotheists and animists all at once. I don't think that's inconsistent with Judeo/Christian beliefs, but I also don't think you're going to see any purely objective evidence on the show, ever. Take to the Gargoyles Universe what you will. And it should, if I'm doing this right, give you something back -- whatever you do, or don't, believe in.
Look, I know it seems like I'm blowing off your questions. I'm not. But try reading them with a fresh eye. They're almost impossible TO answer in a straightforward manner, because they are extremely complex, and yet they take for granted so many things as fact that have not been established either in the cannon or here at ASK GREG. These are all interesting topics and I encourage you to pursue them. But break your questions down. It'll help you avoid making assumptions.
By the way, what's a Vole?
Even though her lycanthropy was induced by the eye of Oden, would Fox have been subject to the normal limitations associated with werewolves/foxes? Would she have had a vulnerabilty to silver? Also could she, and did she pass on her lycanthropy by bightring someone. I realize that we already have Wolf, our favorite mutate
Werewolf. What possible reason would we need another.
I don't think so. Neither Wolf or Fox fit the traditional lycanthropic mode. Fara Maku and Tea are better examples.
In Huter's moon part three, Demona was going to cast a spell which would wipe out all life except gargoyles. But wouldn't she kill herself because, she would have killed Macbeth and she would have perished as well or would Macbeth be the only human alive? Would Demona's disease or plague have reached the shores of Avalon and killed tom and the Princess?
Both these points are debatable. I've answered the first one before. (Check the archives for a fuller answer.) It would depend on her mindset. It's possible her survival would have kept Macbeth alive.
I think it's unlikely that it would have hit Avalon.
Ok, I'll ask this again: Can a fae change a human or a gargoyle into an actual in-reality fae with all fae powers and weaknesses and so on, as big a species change as gargoyle-to-human?
Erin says: I think you got a point there. I think you are right.
Benny says: I love this candy. [He's eating PEZ.]
Greg says: No. Where would the energy come from unless the fae were permanently relinquishing all his powers.
A couple of questions about the point during "The Mirror" when Puck had temporarily turned all the humans in the city into gargoyles.
1. What happened to those humans entering and leaving Manhattan during the time that the spell was in effect?
2. What effect did the spell have on live broadcasts from New York going out to other parts of the U.S. or the world during that time? As in, did people watching such broadcasts away from New York suddenly see the humans in those broadcasts change into gargoyles, or did the spell somehow prevent this?
1. They automatically changed when entering and leaving the island. Because of the way the change was perceived, no one noticed.
2. Outsiders could have seen changes. But, hell, it's tv.
In the Gargoyles Universe, the fay are vulnerable to cold iron. Now, the obvious reasons for this are: a) they needed some sort of "kryptonite" to keep them from unbalancing things, and b) it's a traditional part of faerie mythology (and I'd read about that problem of theirs with cold iron long before "Gargoyles" came out, and even used it in an Arthurian fantasy novel that I'm still writing). But, did you ever develop a "within-the-story" rationale for why iron has such a drastic effect upon Oberon's Children?
Fairie magic doesn't "conduct" through iron.
But mostly it was the traditional legend thing.
Greg, you mentioned that earth is the well spring or source of power for the third race. They would need to find an alternative power source were they to leave it. What about existing spells?. If Macbeth or Demona ever left Earth in the coming centuries, would the various spells on them still be in effect. Is leaving earth essentailly pulling the plug on the power source that maintains their link of immortality or Demona's transformation.
Well-spring and power source are two different things, of course. The fact that they can use the magic in the earth as a power source, doesn't mean it is their SOLE power source.
And human/gargoyle (i.e. mortal) sorcery is a whole different animal.
Is there 'prophecy' in the Gargoyles universe? So far all the pieces of prophecy we've seen are either related to time-travel (Archmage, etc), or are ambiguous in nature (Weird Sisters in 'City of Stone', Puck in 'Future Tense').
Were the Weird Sisters (for example) making a true prophecy concerning Macbeth and Duncan, or simply saying something and then manipulating events so that it took place?
And was Puck aware that parts of his 'dream' would indeed take place (other than Alex's name ofcourse which he could have been informed of as Owen)?
Paragraph one, I don't understand.
Paragraph two, both.
Paragraph three, both.
On the subject of magical artifacts:
1) Demona was taking quite a risk in depending solely on the Praying Gargoyle to protect her kind from the fulfillment spell. My question: Did she have a backup plan in case it didn't work?
2) Is there a way (in the Gargoyles Univserse, of course) to determine the authenticity of a magical artifact before it needs to be used?
1. Obviously not.
Hi Greg. Did you walk into the World Tour with the intention that Goliath would loose all the items the Gargoyles had been safeguarding? I mean, by the time the travelers got home, Goliath had lost the Grimorum (destroyed), the Eye of Odin (recovered by Odin), and the Phoenix Gate (lost in time). I realize the Gargoyles picked up the Guatemalan Medallion along the way, but was the concept of Goliath returning home with none of these items a conscious decision on your part, or just the way things worked out? Thanks.
Yes. Conscious. That's why I had him guarantee that no one would ever use those items again. Arrogance, even heroic arrogance, deserves comeuppance. And I liked the irony that it was Goliath himself who first used the Gate and the Eye. No one takes either item from him. He chooses to use them.
Is there any logical reason that Owen did not include a giant iron bell in the castle defenses? I know this would have ruined the drama of the battle. But it is hard to accept the fact that it never occured to any of the defenders during the battle with Oberon.
I'm not sure that the bell solution is that obvious to Owen. I think it was very clever of Titania to come up with something that generally a fae would have little interest in exploring.
And where would Goliath and Angela found a big iron bell?
I started to wonder about the 'Future Tense' episode...
1. What would have happened if Goliath had indeed given Puck the gate? After all he was dreaming the whole thing - would the real-life gate have just disappeared and been taken by Puck or something? Goliath waking up and finding it missing?
2. That thing about Puck not being able to take the gate, he having to be given it - is that again a law of Oberon's or something inherent in the nature of the Gate and/or fae?
3. And if the former, why when in other cases the fae could use just any flimsy excuse to bend Oberon's law, this one was so strictly interpreted that even 'Here you have it, take the gate' wasn't sufficient for Puck to take it?
1. Goliath would have physically taken the Gate from his pouch, held it out and let go. Puck would appear to take it. All very real. But it didn't happen.
2. It's a law, but I don't know if it's Oberon's law.
3. I'm not sure that their excuses were that flimsy. We always made an effort to bend the laws with a real rationale.
You asked in a recent rambling about our responses to a number of the "permanent changes" in the course of the series. In the case of the ones that you cited, I can't really recall now how I responded to them at the time (for example, in the case of "Enter Macbeth", my attention was more grabbed by Macbeth's entrance into the series - particularly on account of his name, since that's always been one of my favorite Shakespeare plays - than by the gargoyles' forced relocation - and I was even more delighted in later episodes when we found out more about him and that he was *the* Macbeth).
However, I do recall two "changes" (if relatively small ones) that did startle me. The first was Owen's hand getting turned permanently to stone at the end of "The Price". The second was the destruction of the Grimorum Arcanorum in "Avalon", which particularly raised my eyebrows since that book had been around since the beginning of the series, so that I was astonished to see it go. (I might add that, from my subjective view-point, the end of the Grimorum came, in a sense, not so much when it self-destructed in "Avalon Part Three" as when the Archmage devoured it in "Avalon Part Two").
But when I did look back on them in retrospect, I found that I very much appreciated the changes. It was one of those things that gave "Gargoyles" a special feeling about it that I've so rarely seen in television animation. More like a televised novel, almost.
Thanks. That was the goal. I figure, hey, S**T HAPPENS. And some things you can't take back. Yeah, sure, I wasn't gonna leave all the gargoyles as humans for all the eps after "The Mirror"; after all, the show wasn't called "HUMANS". And of course, even the loss of the castle wasn't permanent, as Goliath predicted.
But some things can't be changed. Demona can't take back the massacre. History is immutable. And the Magus... well, he's gone. That's life. And death. And everything in between.
As for the two specifics you mentioned...
I wanted to get a rise out of all of you with Owen's hand. It was designed to shock. It was also a bit of a clue. And it flat-out amused the hell outta me.
As for the Grimorum, it honestly felt played out to me. (How many stolen spells could we pull out of our collective hat?) But I wanted to give it a memorable exit. I thought having it swallowed whole by the Archmage was pretty cool.
Hmmm, "HUMANS"... Maybe there's a spin-off idea there...
1. Would Oberon's Mirror work for doing the same sorts of magicks as Titania's (specifically the spell Demona used in "The Mirror" to summon Puck)?
2. If yes, then why did not Oberon simply yank Puck back through his mirror in "The Gathering pt1" instead of going after him?
2. Oberon does what he wants.
When Xanatos loses his "guinea pig" aka Hudson in "The Price" why would he allow Owen to test the Cauldron of life for him? Since Owen is Puck, and Puck being a Fey is naturally immortal what does this accomplish? If it worked Owen would be no different or did Owen set out to prove that it did NOT work?
Owen is human. He can turn back into Puck. But that's his only magical ability. It was a legitimate test. Besides, what did X have to lose?
Greg, thanks for taking these questions. I'm sure you've answered this before, but I can't find any mention of it in the archives.
You've stated that female gargoyles have a worldwide 20-year fertility cycle.
1. Does Demona conform to this cycle, or does her being forever 70(35) short-circuit that?
2. The last question applied for about nine hundred years. But now, what effect do Demona's daily transformations have on her reproductive cycle? I remember a question about this, but I think all you said was that Puck didn't design the spell with pregnancy in mind.
3. When Demona changes to a human, is it simply an exterior, cosmetic change, or does she become fully human internally? I'm betting the former, since she doesn't seem to have a belly button in human form, but that could be either an animation glitch or simply a detail too small to pick up.
4. If she does make a full change, does she have a human reproductive system, and all the monthly fun that comes with it?
1. Yes. She does. After all, until Puck, she conformed to the day/night cycle. But that doesn't mean she HAS to mate.
2. No. But as I said, I think the magic would compensate for a pregnancy... ON THE HUGE ASSUMPTION that she ever gets pregnant.
3. Fully human.
4. Yes, during the day.
What is the Stone of Destiny? Until now, I never gave it any thought, dismissing it as just another magical artifact... except no other magical object shown on Gargoyles had the ability to talk. What makes it so special?
Why did the Eye of Odin only transform Fox at night?
Who said it did?
In "Hunter's Moon" one of the requirement for Demona's spell to work was that it should be cast in "holy ground". For that reason she uses an abandoned church... The question I'm going to ask is a bit vague, but hopefully you'll understand it: what does this place's "holiness" as pertaining to the spell, derive from? Is it something all places of worship would have, even "pagan" ones? Does it derive from people considering it 'holy' or is an objective "gift" (so to speak) from the deity in question and thus unrelated to belief?
It's almost certainly something which you couldn't answer within the series (I think), but perhaps you could answer it here... :-)
I want to posit that some ground just is holy. Or perhaps more clinically, these locations act as a nexus of mystic energy. The fact that churches temples, etc. are often built on such spots is no coincidence. There may be a guiding force. A sense that this is a place of prayer. Of connection to God, or the Great Spirit or the Earth or WHATEVER.
Anyway, that's how I see the Gargoyles' Universe working.
You've stated that gargoyles, in your vision at least, came about naturally in the way that all other living things did, and were not creations of faerie or human magic. I certainly feel that that's the most probable explanation for them. But something that I would like to raise is this - in the Gargoyles Universe, would it even be possible to create a genuinely sentient race using magic?
My own feeling is that it isn't, based on what I saw in the series. Oberon, one of the most powerful magic-users in the Gargoyles Universe, animates a number of statues in "The Gathering Part Two" to aid him against Goliath and his clan, but the statues remained made out of stone rather than becoming flesh and blood, and showed no sign of true sentience in battling the clan, no more so than - say - the Steel Clan. The same thing was the case with Raven's "totem beasts" in "Heritage", who, when animated by him, remained made out of wood and also behaved more like automatons than like truly alive and intelligent beings. And in "Golem", the Golem that was created by Rabbi Loew likewise didn't come across to me as truly sentient, but just a walking clay statue - it never even spoke except when Renard was possessing it. (The Golem did show some dim signs of genuine awareness, but not on the level of a gargoyle, certainly).
So, what I'm basically asking here is - aside from your belief that gargoyles were not created by magic - would it even be possible in the Gargoyles Universe to magically create a truly sentient being or race? Or is such a thing beyond the capabilities of any being other than God?
I think it would be basically impossible to create sentience from scratch. Which doesn't mean that someone like the Golem or Matrix might not evolve into true sentience. (Neither is there yet, in my opinion.)
Just out of curiosity, did the Cauldron of Life transform Owen's arm in actual stone, or into the organic stone-like substance that Gargoyles become during the day?
Does the Third Race see human science as a type of magic?
I guess. Isn't it?
A thought about the Magus's death in "Avalon Part Three". He drained himself in that episode tapping into Avalon's magic to battle the Weird Sisters. What occurred to me recently is that this was a case of a human wizard tapping into a source of faerie magic. So - was this one reason why the Magus died? The danger of mixing magics which Xanatos mentioned in "City of Stone"?
Less that, than the fact that he was an old man channelling powerful forces, and using his own lifeforce to do it.
Hi Mr Weisman.
First off, thanks for such a great show. I'm writing fan fiction at the moment, and am writing an Elisa and Goliath one. If I recall correctly you had something about them having children, or having to adopt one. I have a question about it, I hope you can answer for me.
1. If it were possible for them to have a child, either naturally, by magic or science. How long would Elisa be pregnant?
2. Anything else about the whole pregnancy thing you'd care to add.
Thanx for your time.
1. This is hypothetical on top of hypothetical, but I'd tend to think that Elisa would be pregnant nine months unless there was some scientific or magical explanation why not.
Hey Greg, keep up the good work if ya can!
1) If the Gargoyle eggs were put under the spell, could/would they have stayed as eggs and hatch in the 1990's?
2) If a Gargoyle were to die in his sleep (You said this was rare,) would his rock body just crumble, or stay as a statue and not awaken?
3) if hudson holds his sword, while turning to stone, will it turn to ston or not? (I am wondering this about anything they might hold)
I can't wait to see the movie/ and re runs, plus the movie 2! (the live action one, I think!)
1. Which spell? The Magus? I'm not sure how you tell an egg to sleep. And that's all it was, a sleep spell.
2. Stay as a statue, but it would no longer renew and would tend to crumble over time and weather -- assuming it was left alone. Not a safe assumption, by the way.
3. I've answered this before. It has to do with whether or not Hudson's mindset at the moment of sleep is that his sword is part of his uniform or something separate.
Another "Hunter's Moon" question; what was the original function of the Fulfillment Spell? It was in existence by 1495, and I seriously doubt that anybody living in the Renaissance or before, including the wizard who created that spell, could have foreseen the creation of industrial-strength detergents and genetically-engineered carrier viruses.
It was designed to fulfill the caster's desires. It was quite multi-purpose. But it was of limited power and scope.
Something that I've recently been wondering about Demona's genocide attempt in "Hunter's Moon". The plague that she used the Fulfillment Spell and Sevarius's carrier virus to create would have wiped out all of humanity if released, and the entire gargoyle race as well were it not for the protection of the Praying Gargoyle. Since humans and gargoyles are clearly not very closely related from a biological standpoint, a plague capable of wiping out both species must be very far-reaching in its range. So, if Demona had released her plague, would other species (say, most mammals) have been killed by it as well? Or did it only work on sentient species?
I think it was limited to sentience. How that would have effected chimpanzees, gargoyle beasts, dolphins, whales, etc. I'm not sure. Hard to say what a combination of science and sorcery would consider sentient. But I think rats, cats, dogs etc. were safe.
About garg clothing turning to stone you've given the explanation about the Magus of Rome casting a spell causing that to the whole gargoyle race...
1) Would that mean that he was a wizard of tremendous power (since he was able to cast a spell on a whole species) or did he simply have access to a spell or trinket of tremendous power? (the same way Demona had access to the praying gargoyle for example - the power that protected all the gargoyle race not being hers)
2) I know that the reason for this explanation was so as to explain the real-life standards & practices need of not having the gargoyles fly around naked, but still: did you ever plan to make an ep concerning the casting of this spell? Or would it be rather difficult to even approach the subject of gargoyle nudity? :)
1. I don't pretend to have worked out the details of it.
2. If I had gotten to do TimeDancer, I would have made a sincere attempt to try and do a light-hearted episode that covered this. Don't know whether it would have made it past Standards & Practices, but I would have given it a shot.
I have looked in all the archives and I don't think anyone has asked this(even though many have discussed some things about it), but since a is Gargoyle at night and human by day, does that mean that she could not have any offspring because of the constant switching?
I assume you're talking about Demona.
And I never said she couldn't have offspring because of Puck's spell. In fact, I'm pretty sure I've said that Puck's spell could compensate for a pregnancy.
Greg, I was the one who asked about the Demona/macbeth link carrying over to delilah, namely because if Delilah was created from half of Demona's DNA, would the link be part of her DNA or would it be connected to her in another way, like through her soul?
I don't see any connection existing there.
Judging from Sleipnir, as well as the brief appearance of a Pegasus-type animal in 'The Gathering I" and ofcourse from one's of various mythologies... is there a species of non-sentient "fay beasts"? Or is Sleipnir, Pegasus, Fenrir and so on all sentient fays which simply choose animal forms as their 'favourite' ones?
There may be fauna on Avalon. And the magic of the place may have had some small effect on them. Like sorcerous radiation.
But fauna would not have attended the Gathering. So any seeming beast you saw there, like Anansi for example, is one of the Children in a form of his or her choosing. (If you see a polar bear walking around the palace, the odds are it's Odin.)
Now Slepnir is another story. If the legends are true, then Slepnir's mother was the trickster Loki, and his father was an actual horse. Making Slepnir half-horse and half-fey. (Which might serve to explain his modern transition from eight legs to four.) I haven't decided 100% if that's the route I'm taking in the Gargoyles universe, but the notion is appealing.
And it would suggest that New Olympus is filled with all sorts of bizarre beasts who are the descendents of various unions between the fey and so-called lower animals.
Hi there, Greg! I have to take ONE little sentence to say, thanks for creating the show - and for not making me feel like a weirdo in fifth and sixth grade (to the present) for drawing strange, winged creatures and dark, shadowy figures patroling the night skies :) I hope you liked the picture I sent with Noel for you ^-^ Here's my lil' questions that have been BURNING me :)
1) When someone snatches Titania's mirror, and speaks the incantaion that Demona did in "The Mirror", is Puck REQUIRED to appear?
2) If so, supposing someone managed to snatch the Mirror from it's present place in Avalon, and spoke the incantation, would Puck have to appear, with the Spell Oberon cast upon him in effect?
3) In "The Reckoning", when Angela asked Goliath if Demona was dead, did he forget about the whole, Demona can't die unless MacBeth kills her and vice-versa? Or did he genuinely not know if she could survive that bad of an accident?
4) If Gargoyles get their strength to glide from the rays of the sun when they sleep, how can the Guatamalan Gargoyles glide if durring the day they don't sleep and harvest energy?
5) Is it true that if Gargoyles are even chipped durring their daily stone hibernation, they can't wake up?
Thanks for listening to my questions, I hope I'm not being a pain in the butt! ^-^
1. If they do it right, with all the bells and whistles, so to speak. Of course, Titania's Mirror was destroyed by Demona. But Oberon still has his mirror.
2. Yes, I think so. Particularly if Puck wanted to go.
3 - 5. I'm sorry, but questions on separate topics must be posted separately.
But you're not a pain in the butt.
Hi Greg, just one question that I've wondered about ever since I saw "Temptation." At the end, Elisa tells Goliath to act for the rest of his life as if he were not under a spell, the key word being 'a' as opposed to 'the spell' or 'this spell.'
Did you mean for this to be taken as though he could never be put under a spell again, and if so, to what extent? Puck was seen messing with Goliath's mind in "Future Tense." Did you ever plan on this one plot point being brought up again?
It wasn't meant to be generic. It refered to the spell in question.
So... is there faster-than-light travel or faster-than-light communications in the Gargoyles Universe? :-)
Again, the phrasing of the question makes it difficult to answer.
If you're asking me whether a species exists anywhere in the Gargoyles Universe that can get from point A to point B faster than light could conventionally travel the distance between those points, then the answer is yes.
For example... ever hear of the Phoenix Gate?
1) Is Anubis the chief Death God or something?
2) What would happen if all the Death Gods were destroyed somehow?
3) Is Osiris also a Death God, or just the Judge of the Dead, since traditionally Anubis is below him.
4) Are all of the Death Gods as careful with their powers as Anubis? In general anyway
1. "Chief"? No. I guess not.
2. Destroyed? That would release a lot of energy. My guess is someone or something would rise and take their place.
3. Osiris is a Death God. But he's a johnny-come-lately to that role. Anubis is more a part of the fabric of death. Less concerned with "Who's in charge". Osiris brought rank to the table and became the boss. Anubis, I believe is non-plussed about serving, leading, whatever. (I like Anubis.)
In "Grief," Anubis states that that which is dead and gone cannot be brought back. Why, then, was Demona able to bring the spirit of Coldstone (and those of Coldfire and Coldsteel) back from the dead? Was Anubis trying to say that he is under some sort of magical restriction similar to Oberon's law of non-interferece that prevents him from bringing back the dead, or something else entirely?
P.S. I wanted to thank you for answering my question regarding Hudson's feelings about Goliath and Elisa. Just to clarify, I didn't mean to imply that Hudson wasn't open-minded. I just remembered that you had stated a long time ago (I think in your rambling about gargs and sex) that you saw Hudson as being the one who would still hold on to the tradition of only taking one mate.
Anubis had a very strict policy. And he had the integrity to stick to it.
(And thanks for the clarification on Hudson. I just wish you had posted the Hudson P.S. seperately. I'd like to have on-going dialogue as part of ASK GREG. But when you attach a piece of an unrelated discussion to a question on a different topic, it makes archiving all this stuff a disaster.)
The big event here on next wednsday (11.08.1999), made me wonder:
Will Gargoyles break out of their stone shell during a full solar eclipse? (My bet would be 'No', but you're the boss ; )
That actually gives me another question: What makes the Gargoyles turn to stone? It isn't the rays of the sun, and I guess it won't be something magical, because it affects a complete race. (And they use magic to prevent them turning to stone)
I hope you find the time to answer.
Thanks a lot in advance.
As I've said before, Gargoyles operate on an internal biological clock that is in tune with the rising and setting of the sun.
That would suggest that an eclipse would have ZERO effect on them. But I must admit I've been toying with an eclipse story for some time. I haven't quite cracked it. But someday...
You've mentioned in the past that Elisa and some others might wear Odin's Eye. Odin has his eye back however. How does he lose it again?
When did I mention that?
And now for something almost completely different: (a) Was the Cauldron of Life inspired by the Celtic legend of the Cauldron of Bran (which could restore the dead to life)? (b) Would the Cauldron of Life have worked if the user had been completely submerged in/drenched with the waters (thus making the fact Xanatos melted it down for scrap rather ironic)?
a. It was inspired by multiple Celtic Cauldron legends. You'd have to ask Michael Reaves whether he had a specific one in mind.
b. It would have worked. It would have turned the whole body to stone.
I keep thinking of more things...
On Garg evolution...I think the most likely would evolve from dinosaurs.Birds also evolved too, from what I believe. They just took 2 different ends of the spectrum. Birds becoming smaller and more lightweight, gaining feathers and loosing scales. Gargs get are smaller dinosaurs, just not as small as birds. They are built with more muscle and kept
the pteridacyl wings ('scuse my spelling). Brooklyn is obviously evolved from one of them thingies I can't spell. Plus you have the South American Clan, they deffinetly look reptilian. And Ophelia, she looks much like a triceratops and any other horned/crested dino (which I absolutly love on her!!!!)
But also into consideration, the Britian Clan...Where did they come from? Are they too evolved
from dinosaurs???? Doubtful. They are set so far apart from the others, more mammilian. Are they
more evolved mammals? Is Griff just an evolved eagle that looks like a griffon or an evolved griffon? Is Leo an evolved Lion?
And is that Una's real horn or jewlry? Is she an evolved horse or unicorn?
Which brings something else to mind about gargoyles...How do their babies eat? Are gargoyles
mammals? I would deffinetly say, warm blooded. And they do seem very mammilian. So does that
mean, that if Demona had the chance to raise Angela, she'd be fed on breastmilk? If so, how did
Cathryn, Magus, Tom, and his mother feed 36 hatchlings?
Uh. It would have helped if you had numbered your questions....
In my head, Gargoyles are a separate classification which (in the past) I've nicknamed "Gargates". Both Gargoyles and Gargoyle Beasts evolved from this grouping, just as Primates include both humans and various apes. The Gargate-ancestor species go back to the time of the dinosaurs, so to answer your first set of questions, I'd have to ask you how you are defining the word "Dinosaur"? Colloquially, i.e. to include all species that existed during what we popularly think of as the age of dinosaurs, or are you using the term in a scientific sense, which would leave out a number of species that we generally think of as dinosaurs?
As for the various clans, appearances are superficial and can be deceiving. Leo has much more in common biologically with Goliath than he does with a Lion. Zafiro has much more in common with Griff, Leo, Una and Goliath, etc. then he does with a snake. All are Gargates. None are Mammals or Reptiles or Marsupials or Birds, though they may share a few characteristics with one or more of those groups. They are, I believe, warm-blooded, for example.
Una's horn is her horn. It's not jewelry. Though it was decorated.
Garg babies generally would drink milk from clan-mother breasts.
And yes, that did present Tom, Katharine and the Magus with a problem. Fortunately, they were on Avalon. And Avalon provided. Some trial and error was probably involved, but a replacement for breast milk was found...
Just a few quick questions.
1a. Is the Magus really ka-put?
1b.Is there a reason he happend to die on the sleeping kings alter?
2. Is the ArchMage also forever out of the picture?
3. What's your opinion on "Adult" Fan Art and Fan Fics? Yay or Nay?
1b. It seemed poetic.
2. Yep. At least moving forward. Flashback stories are always possible.
3. Separate topics require separate posts.
In the "Avalon" trilogy, the Archmage's arsenal consisted of himself, the Weird Sisters, Demona and Macbeth. Why did he feel the need to have Demona and Macbeth? I know he said they were canon fodder, but why did he even need canon fodder? Couldn't the Weird Sisters have just waved their hands and eradicated every single gargoyle and human on Avalon? Why did he build his assault around those two? For all the trouble that the Weird Sisters went through in obtaining them, it just doesn't seem that they were worth it. How the Archmage told the Sisters to "guide their paths", you would've thought that they were instramental in some way to his plans; that he specifically needed those two. But what's so special about them?
The answer requires looking at the situation on (at least) two levels.
Level One. Taken at face value, he did need cannon fodder. The Sisters had to be very careful how they operated, in order not to break Oberon's Law. And the Archmage had a few personal vendettas he wanted to deal with. So he needed Demona and Macbeth to handle some of the more mundane work of eradicating the enemy.
Level Two. Who said any of this was the Archmage's plan? Well, he did. But he was an arrogant bastard. So do you trust him? Where did he get the plan? By observing his future self carry it out. Where did his future self get the plan? By observing HIS future self carry it out. Maybe there's something larger going on here...
what are all the spells that they mentioned on the show and if you can tell me most important of all the phoenix gate spell
Do your own research, pal.
Sorry, I don't have that information at hand, and I'm not likely to go through all my scripts to check.
From memory, I believe the Phoenix Gate spell was...
"Deslegrate muri tempe et intervalia!"
But I wouldn't swear to it.
My sister and I have taped most of the episodes from the original series and we watch them daily. We came to the episode named "The Green" where Goliath and company reach the Guatemala clan. Now in that episode, the Guatemala clan never turn to stone. So I was wondering how they could still be living if the Gargoyles get their energy from the sun's ray's in the day? Thanks for your time.
Clearly, the magic of the pendants compensates in some way.
I have to admit I have not understood the death-god thing and the events of 'Grief' in their entirety.
1. While Anubis was captured, was noone able to die in the whole world, or only around Egypt?
2. If the former, how come, since there are other death-gods than Anubis? Were they also powerless while Anubis was captive?
3. If Anubis had remained captive, or even more so if Jackal had remained his avatar, how would the other death-gods have reacted to the situation?
1. Whole world.
2. Powerless, no. But the spell put DEATH itself in stasis. Leading to...
3. I think you would have seen something cataclysmic from the other Death-Gods. Can you picture Odin, for example, just sitting back?
Thank God, Avalon sent our four heroes to Giza.
It has been noticed by the residents of the S8 comment room that the gender of Ariel in Shakespeare's 'The Tempest' only appears as 'he' in a stage direction and is not referred at all within the main text itself. When you included Ariel, what would his/her gender be?
For that matter, may we assume that Shakespeare was inaccurate in portraying Prospero as abandoning his magic?
Ariel's gender... Don't feel like revealing that now. Sorry.
Shakespeare wasn't wrong. But Prospero found reason to start again.
Earlier remarks of yours about "Pendragon" implied that when Arthur and Griff finally did find Merlin, he'd join up with them as some sort of regular. Did you have any plans to keep Merlin's magic from making things too easy for Arthur and Griff in that case - i.e., making sure that Merlin wouldn't become a "deus ex machina" - or in this case, a "magus ex machina". We are talking about a wizard whose very name has become a synonym for "magic", after all. (I won't ask about the details of those plans; I'm just curious as to whether you'd found a way to address the problem).
As with most things, I'd deal with them on a case-by-case basis. But I also had a few ideas about how I'd play my version of the character (and his 20th/21st century persona) that would have made life a bit more interesting.
I hate Deus ex Machina. I wouldn't have made you suffer through it either.
I've got a question about the nature of magic in the Gargoyle's universe. Basically, is using magic something anyone can learn to do, or must one first have a natural ability for it? For example, if Elisa studied magic, would she be able to cast spells on a level with Demona, or would she never get the knack of it (assuming she has no "natural" ability)?
I would think that a certain natural aptitude would help. Almost anyone can learn to play the piano with enough study and practice, but how many will become virtuosos?
You said that Magic is part of the Earth, that Fey evolved from Earth's natural magic. So is this magic confined to Earth or is it Universal?
Would a Fey's power function off of Planet Earth?
I suppose it's universal, but powersources aren't always compatible.
Magic is magic, but just as an example, it took the Magus a lifetime to learn how to tap into Avalon's magic, and that despite his training in human sorcery.
Puck in space, a prospect I wouldn't hold my breath for by the way, would have a similar problem adjusting to a new powersource.
Since Wyvern's magic was strong enough to keep Hakon and The Captain on the earth plane for a thousand years, what effect might Avalon's stronger magic have on the Magus and the Archmage?
Oooooh, cool question.
But sorry. They're dead.
In Gargoyles, how did humans learn to use magic
in the first place?
In real life, how did humans learn to use fire?
Trial and error, I'd guess.
Actually getting to communicate with THE Greg Weisman, should I be in reverental awe or just hop-up-and-down giddy? Maybe both at the same time. Anyway, here goes my long-winded questions...
This may take a while, but yes, it does actually get to a question :)
While watching Gargoyles, I can't help but get shivers down my spine and goosebumps whenever someone starts chanting in Latin. Whether it's the actual chanting in Latin, the creepy music, or the animation, I don't know. Though I tend to think it's the Latin, because it's how I noticed the difference between the two types of magic in Gargoyles. When watching the Magus cast the spell of sleep on the gargoyles, or Goliath throwing the Phoenix Gate into the void, I always get goosebumps. On the otherhand, when Oberon, Titania, or Puck use magic, there was no tingly feeling, and that's when I finally noticed.
Humans and gargoyles (hencefore refered to as mortals, even though some aren't) always chant in Latin while using magic. Members of the Third Race (henceforth refered to as Fay) speak in plain english, although it's usually in the form rhyme/short poem.
Though there were exceptions, which all proved dangerous, sometimes fatal, as Xanatos said "I'm told mixing magics is dangerous anyway."
Now I start making assumptions, generally intelligent ones though.
First off that all mortal magic is in Latin, while Fay is in English or whatever other language they prefer at the time, or subliminal, not requiring speech.
I can think of three instances of a mortal using fay magic, and perhaps one of a fay using mortal magic, and one of a fay realizing not to get involved with mortal magic.
Let's start with the mortals. In Grief, the Emir uses the Scroll of Thoth to summon Anubis, of the Fay. I will now be brash enough to assume that the Scroll is of Fay origin, since:
a) It was powerful enought to summon Anubis, a Fay (though Demona summone Puck with a Latin spell that I assume was of mortal origin)
b) It was spoken in english, like other Fay magic.
c) If Anubis is Fay, it stands to reason that all the other Egyptian gods were also and since it's the Scroll of Thoth, an Egyptian god, it must be Fay in origin.
And in the end the Emir presumably dies, the usual fee for mixing magics.
Second scenario. In the Avalon Trilogy the Magus casts two spells, both in english, whereas he previously used Latin. Which brings me to my next assumption, "When in Avalon, do as the Avalonians do," or that you can't even use mortal magic on Avalon, it has to be Fay in nature.
And the Magus also paid the price for magic mixing.
Part Three. All the uses of the Eye of Odin were pretty ugly, Fox almost died, Goliath went nuts, and the Archmage died since without it's assumed Fay (it's Odin's eye, he's a Fay, it's Fay) power, he couldn't contain the mortal-magic Grimorum.
Are we seeing a pattern here or what?
Ok, I lied, one more mortal use that could have been dangerous. Fara Maku and Tea being were-panthers. Um, that's just plain dangerous. :)
The fay perhaps using mortal magic. While I don't know if the Cauldron of Life is of fay or mortal origin, it was dangerous to Owen (fay in human form) and would have been dangerous/fatal to both Xanatos and Hudson. Which leads me to believe the Cualdron is of Fay origin, Xanatos probably wanted to see if this mixing was indeed dangerous. And even though it was a Fay trying out Fay magic, it did alter Puck's human form, but his natural form is still fine.
And Owen/Puck was smart enough not to try reversing Demona's spell in City of Stone, since he knew she used mortal magic. Which re-enforces the belief that the Cauldron is of Fay origin, otherwise I doubt Owen would have gone ahead with dunking his hand. Even though it was a Fay using Fay magic, his human form still got chumped. I suppose this was a learning experience for the Puck, don't use Fay magic in mortal form.
1) So the question is: Are my assumptions correct? Please correct me if I've goofed anywhere, I'd love to know the real answers if I'm wrong.
2) The Emir used the Scroll of Thoth to summon Anubis and used the Papyrus of Thoth to become a vessel. Are they two different things or one thing refered to by two names.
3) Even though the Phoenix Gate is of Avalon origin, it's used by a Latin incantation. Ermmm, why? Wouldn't this be mixing magic?
4) Why did Elisa hand Tom her gun in Ill Met?
4a) How did Tom know how to hold it?
4b) Why did she call it a revolver in Sentinel? Semi-autos have a very hard time revolving. :)
4c) Speaking of that, is it full auto, or just semi?
5) Where does Xanatos aquire all his cool stuff? The Cauldron of Life, the Star of Arabia, the Coyote Diamond, the Eye of Odin, the Grimorum Arcinorum, etc... I know where he got the diamond, but why would anyone be selling the other stuff?
Well that's it for now, my brain's starting to go numb. Thanks for taking the time to read these.
1. Some of your assumptions are correct. Some aren't completely correct, but most are close enough.
Latin isn't the only language of magic. Hebrew works as well, we know. And they can't be the only ones. In theory, English could work, but it would take more than a literal translation to imbue modern English with the correct magical cadences.
The Cauldron, being iron, isn't Fay magic.
And Owen wasn't really at liberty to reverse Demona's spell or even to reverse the whole stone hand thing. He was bound by his pact with Xanatos.
2. The latter.
3. It clearly is. Don't you consider the Gate fairly dangerous?
As per our new rules, I invite you to resubmit your remaining questions as multiple separate posts.
A few more questions that I forgot to ask.
1. How did Oberon get around his non-intervention edict when he put everybody in Manhattan to sleep in "The Gathering"? I'd have thought that that definitely counted as interfering in the lives of mortals.
2. You said once that there were so few gargoyles left that there was a big question over whether they could survive. In your opinion, has Demona ever considered this? Has it ever occurred to her that even if she did succeed in wiping out humanity, it might come too late to save her species from extinction? I don't know that that would really make all that much difference to her, mind, since I have the feeling that her genocidal attempts are based more on revenge and an effort to avoid facing her own responsibility for the Wyvern Massacre, but I'd still be interested to know the answer to this one.
3. Does Thailog have an Oedipus complex? I mean, he tries to kill his "father" (Goliath - and also Xanatos and Sevarius), and his two choices of mate are first Demona, then a combined clone of Demona and Elisa.
4. I read once about a race of beings in Japanese legend called tengu, who had wings and sometimes taught humans bushido. Was this a partial inspiration for the Ishimura clan?
1. Not from Oberon's point of view. If they're asleep, then they won't witness the battle and his gigantic form won't be part of their consciousness. He won't have interfered. When you think of it that way, it kinda makes sense.
As per the new rules, I invite you to resubmit the rest of your questions as multiple separate posts. I hope you do.