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Gargoyles

The Phoenix Gate

Comment Room Archive

Comments for the week ending June 28, 2004

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Lily-Doll>>Not sure what you mean....
JJ Gregarius - [Email here]
Tampa, FL, Neither-Here-Nor-Therbia
Sunday, June 27, 2004 08:46:45 PM
IP: 4.247.209.147

LILY DOLL - That option is still there, in the "Web Site" entry blank.

I watched my tape of "Lighthouse in the Sea of Time" this afternoon, but I'll wait until the room clears before writing about it here.

Todd Jensen
St. Louis, MO
Sunday, June 27, 2004 06:08:48 PM
IP: 4.244.12.176

Lovely to see people coming back.

And I see the comment room has changed over night too. There's no option to put in a link or the other information it used to offer.

Kinda different.

Lily Doll - [lilmidnightlily@yahoo.com]
Sunday, June 27, 2004 01:39:55 PM
IP: 67.35.197.33

I saw "Pendragon" the other day and have a quick observation.

Did anyone else notice that whenever Griff was wide-eyed or in awe, his eyes became deformed?

JJ Gregarius
Tampa, FL
Sunday, June 27, 2004 01:12:17 AM
IP: 4.247.128.239

Nickerous> Yeah.. I'm not too sure why I'm back, either.. besides one day I thought "I wonder what's up with Gargoyles?" so I goto s8.org, see it's redesigned, and find the comment room and here I am... lol

I did that a few months ago with Aimee's place.. heh.. I knew she had gotten married, but I was trying to see if her forums were still up.. and a-nope on that.. lol I didn't think to look for s8 at that time.. lol

I guess what prompted me coming back was seeing a poster set and sticker set in the Thrift store.. lol... they weren't there the next time I went back (like.. 3 days later!!!)

sigh...

hmm.. ok.. *glides out*

Patricia Lovelady - [sabre0link@hotmail.com]
Montevallo, AL, USA
Sunday, June 27, 2004 01:00:31 AM
IP: 216.77.181.157

Metamorphisis: Wish I remembered more of what I thought when I first saw the episode. I did believe that Severius was dead, but I think it was more because the wierd death seemed to match his personality than anything else.

The Pack: I liked them, particularly because they never got 'stale'. It was always something different.

DVDs: Exosquad. Yeah it was great. Wish I had seen more of the episodes. I managed to get a few off Kazaa a couple months ago.
I doubt I would buy a DVD of it, but I might rent it when I have an evening to burn.
Other old Disney shows? I don't know. Do they have their own annual convention?

Resurngance of kid stuff from 10 years ago: Kinda freaky to see that stuff comimg back. Wonder what it is?

Nick: Looking forward seein' them once you get them up.

CKayote - [CKayote@worldnet.att.net]
Orlando, FL
Saturday, June 26, 2004 09:49:40 PM
IP: 65.244.171.25

Punky>Oh yeah!! That tv series with the big hampster that sounds like Gurgi from Black Cauldron. I wonder which season is the episode when Cherry locks herself in the freezer, lol.

Music Videos>I've been slacking on them somewhat. No new Gargoyles. My inspiration has been solely in Spirit videos. Though I did make one about whales too.

Siren
Saturday, June 26, 2004 06:35:46 PM
IP: 65.33.112.117

GATHERING UPDATES

Art Show:

First, we need to announce that our Art Show is FULL! All 24 panels were reserved, and that makes us happy. This will be a full show indeed! We apologize to all the other artists who would have liked to participate in the Art Show, but we have no more room for you.

However, you can still shine as an artist by renting your spot in Artist Alley. There are 5 periods during which you can reserve a table to sell commissions and prints of your work. The periods are as follows:

Friday: 10:00 AM to 1:30 PM
1:30 PM to 5:00 PM
Saturday: 10:00 AM to 1:30 PM
1:30 PM to 5:00 PM
Sunday: 10:00 AM to 2:00 PM

These table spaces are free of charge, you just need to reserve them in advance. All you have to do is email Cindy at artshow@gatheringofthegargoyles.com or Karine at
conchair@gatheringofthegargoyles.com to select your Artist Alley spot!

Get those prints ready, and replenish you art supplies! You'll need them.

Masquerade / Cosplay:

Have you chosen a costume yet? Remember, the Disney DVD crew is going to be in attendance, so show your fan spirit at the Gathering Masquerade by dressing up as your favorite "Gargoyles" character. This year, in addition to the traditional masquerade and cosplay awards, an special prize will be given for the costume judged Best Canon Character. So don't just plan to sit there. Get creative and do your best to dazzle us in Montreal!

Registration:

The Gathering 2004 wants YOU! It's still not too late to pre-register or book that hotel room. There are still 11 days left to reserve your hotel room at the Delta Centre-Ville (deadline is July 6 at noon) and 20 days left to pre-register for The Gathering 2004 (deadline is July 15). Don't forget to reserve your seat at the banquet, either. Only a very limited number of seats will be availabe at the door, so reserve your spot by July 15!

- The Gathering Staff

Patrick
Saturday, June 26, 2004 05:20:04 PM
IP: 68.170.199.45

Everyone is in Green this week, so I'll change. ;)

ANYONE WHO HAS NOT BOOKED THE HOTEL FOR THE CON: Get moving! I just booked the hotel, and they just told me that Thursday night is completely booked solid! (For the Con Rate.) Sooo..I can only imagine the other nights are not far behind!


Please guys, don't delay!

MAui
Saturday, June 26, 2004 04:47:00 PM
IP: 67.71.18.129

Going back to "Leader of the Pack" for a moment, am I the only one here thinking it was a little hypocritical of TD to edit out the part where Lexington blows a hole in Coyote 1.0, and yet later on shows Talos getting impaled by Prodeus, Coyote 2.0 getting impaled by a beam and later run over by a train in "Upgrade", etc... Coyote 1.0 getting blasted in the chest was pale in comparison to the deaths of its successors. Same thing goes for Goliath punching the Macbeth robot in the chest after it "kills" Hudson.
Vertigo1
TN, USA
Saturday, June 26, 2004 03:50:07 PM
IP: 207.65.41.89

WHOO HOOOO! I completed my 5th Gargoyles music video only minutes ago (literally) and I have to say that I am VERY happy with this one. It may not be my favorite (that first one has that honor....I think it does anyway....there's something about your first) but, it is a close second. It is definately the longest. It clocks in at a whopping 5:25 and weighs in at an enormous 350MB. Hopefully, I can set up a website someday to showcase these videos. This all started as some space filler on my special features dvd, but has grown into something monstrous. If I can't get a website up, maybe somebody would be gracious enough to host them for me. Problem is, they are big files (big videos too...I can go fullscreen with little or no pixelation), and I'm still using dial-up internet. Not a good combination.

Patricia> I know what you mean. I stepped away from Gargoyles several years ago and picked up with Transformers. It was about 2 years ago that I came back to Gargoyles. When I started making vcds and dvds, the first thing I wanted to do was to get my Gargoyles episodes off those VHS tapes they had been on for 7-8 years.

Nickerous - [nickerous@yahoo.com]
SC, USA
Saturday, June 26, 2004 03:15:14 PM
IP: 66.220.74.74

Siren's Punky Brewster DVD> Well, actually, yes toon. They apparently put a few episodes of the Saturday morning series on the DVD as extras. (The one where Punky has a magical gremlin friend voiced by Frank Welker.) We were very surprised by that addition when we saw the DVD at the store.
Demonskrye
Saturday, June 26, 2004 02:02:52 PM
IP: 209.150.45.114

I always wondered about Duck Tales and Gummi Bears. Always liked those cartoons when I was younger.

It'll be amazing the things you can get on DVD. My son Talon will be able to appreciate the same cartoons I did when I was younger.

Now the only problem, having the funds to buy all the DVDs of your favorite shows before they run out of print.

Lily Doll
Saturday, June 26, 2004 01:09:22 PM
IP: 67.35.197.13

Xanatos and Severius went to great lengths to that whole thing. It goes to show you just how smooth and controlling Xanatos can be. I never thought he was a clone. I just figured he had been wearing make-up to age himself. That or he got a huge dose of Botox :P
Siren
Saturday, June 26, 2004 10:39:56 AM
IP: 65.33.112.117

Since Sevarius was old the first time we saw him and he was younger all the rest of the times (after he died) I had figured that he (a geneticist) just had some clones. Also because of what the guy said at the end of 'Monsters' about him having a lot of lives (can't remember exactly what the quote was)
Dernhelm - [springsprite@email.com]
Okla. City
Saturday, June 26, 2004 05:21:23 AM
IP: 68.12.196.86

It sounds like everything's going good around these parts... I didn't know Disney was going to release Gargoyles on DVD... I found that out after I went "hmm.. I wonder what's up with Gargoyles..."

heh..

I'm not sure why it was soo easy for me to 'drift away' from here... I seem to do that with every interest.. I have to drift away before I realize I miss it.. in the case of Gargoyles.. it's been a few years O_o

I wish I had something better to say, period... something to say at all.. but... :\

Have fun in Montreal! I won't be there.. class and all... maybe next year.. depending... depending on how things go with jobs..

It's good to still see some people around, though... *nods* very nice... :)

Patricia Lovelady - [sabre0link@hotmail.com]
Montevallo, AL, USA
Saturday, June 26, 2004 01:14:13 AM
IP: 216.77.181.147

With all the My Little Pony toys coming back and LOOKING like ponies again (Not those anorexic things they brought out several years ago). I am hoping they may release the old movies and series. Not that crappy series that Disney use to air.
Not toon, but I got Punky Brewster's season 1 on DVD recently. All the old school stuff is coming out now, lol

Siren
Saturday, June 26, 2004 12:03:02 AM
IP: 65.33.112.117

Trying to cover various things:

DVD/Board Game> I forgot about the Lilo and Stitch one, but as I recall, that was meant as a DVD game rather than just a DVD with a game included. Since I imagine Disney will be marketing "Gargoyles" as a straight DVD of the series, I agree that the board game returning is unlikely.

Todd> My mistake then. Out of curiousity, was did Jackal actually say the line in response to? I imagine it was something with Hyena and Coyote, but I don't remember what.

The Pack> Not generally my favorite characters, but they're still interesting. I think splitting them up worked out well, as the group was getting to the point where it felt natural for them to go their seperate ways. Wolf is the only character who didn't much interest me. Not even wolfifying him or making him Hakkon's ancestor did it for me, partly since I think "Vendettas" is one of the two worst episodes.

Other Stuff on DVD> I got the Jem DVD after a friend of mine got me interested in the show. It's a very good DVD, which will probably leave those with GI Joe and Transformers box sets wondering why they didn't get a series bible and select episode commentary.

I also have the old series Ninja Turtles DVD. From what my boyfriend remembers, this is the best looking portion of the series and probably the only episodes you'll ever need. It also has some episodes from a little seen revamp of the show, but they're pretty ugly and poorly written from what we watched.

Siren, it's possible the My Little Pony rights are available, but I haven't heard anything about a release. While I don't think there'd be a huge market, I didn't expect the Jem DVD either, so there may be a chance. Thundercats may still be tangled up; I believe the toy rights are, which is why we haven't seen a relaunch of the action figures alongside Transformers and GI Joe.

Ah, Exo-Squad. My boyfriend recently experienced some nostalgia for both toyline and show and ended up buying the complete series on VHS from an eBay seller. (We only do this with shows that are completely unavailable and replace bootlegs with new copies if said show recieves release.) Haven't watched it all yet, but it's really well written. Lack of any current tie-ins or a wide fanbase mean it probably won't get re-release, but one can always hope.

I have several friends who are foaming at the mouth for a DuckTales DVD. I'd love to see Gummi Bears and TaleSpin myself. Since it's Disney and they do seem inlcined to empty their vaults onto DVD lately, I think these may be a possibility, especially if "Gargoyles" does well.

Fae Genetics> I agree with the idea that fay-mortal flings resulting in magicly gifted children is probably rare. There could be many people like Fox who have powers that they're unaware of and will continue to be unaware of unless (I think) they are both made aware of them and put into excedingly stressful situations. (I'm not sure Fox would have been able to use her power if she didn't believe in magic in the first place and know even on a subconcious level that she might have fay powers.) I also agree that the fairly large number of Greek-born hybrids (a.k.a. New Olympians) is probably due to the high number of "dealings" between the mortals and the gods in ancient Greece. Greg may have already said something on this, but ti's possible that their unique forms reflect the various guises the local fey took when "writing letters to the stork" with mortals. (I fullly expect to be kicked over to the adult chat room now.)

Metamorphosis> I think one of the things that makes Xanatos such an effective villain is that the audience does want to believe him. I'm sure I knew the first time I saw "Awakening" that both he and Demona were going to be villains, but I wanted to believe both of them had the clan's best interests in mind. I think I may have felt Xanatos's betrayal a bit too accutely, as it caused me to doubt his motives on just about everything until around the end of season 2. I don't think I believed that he really loved Fox until "The Gathering".

OK, that seem like quite enough. Keep up the chatting.

Demonskrye
Friday, June 25, 2004 11:38:22 PM
IP: 209.150.45.114

Watched my tape of "Legion" this afternoon. This is one episode where it wasn't until the second time that I saw it (or so) that I realized what was going on with Coldstone in the early stages when he kept on "switching personalities". The first time around, I thought that he was simply undergoing short-term memory loss when he started acting strangely at the clock tower. It wasn't until later viewings, when I knew about him being made up of three gargoyles, that I realized that he had switched from being run to Othello to being run by Desdemona at the clock tower, which explained "his" bewilderment at Goliath calling "him" "brother".

Also on later viewings, I noticed the scarab logo on RECAP that had also appeared on Xanatos's tracking device in "Awakening" - a nice subtle preparation for the revelation at the end that RECAP had been doing Xanatos's dirty work in the episode all along.

One of my favorite bits in the episode: Goliath meeting the Xanatos program inside Coldstone, who's explaining to Goliath about how the virus is devouring everything. As the virus starts breaking into the castle and starts going after Goliath, the Xanatos program says to him, "Careful. You may be next." Goliath hurls himself angrily at the Xanatos program, which simply teleports out of the way in the nick of time. Very Xanatosian, and a lot of fun to see.

My favorite "first-time viewing" memory from this episode remains the fact that they named Coldstone's other two gargoyle-selves "Desdemona" and "Iago" - I got the reference at once when I saw the names in the credit, and was delighted and amused by them.

I still sometimes think that it's a pity that we never saw Xanatos doing something with that virus in the series; I was expecting it to resurface as a tool for him later on, and it never did. (In fact, I even decided to remedy that while I was on the TGS staff, and therefore had Lexington use the virus to neutralize the device that was protecting the Unseelie Court from iron bells during its attack on the castle.)

Todd Jensen
St. Louis, MO
Friday, June 25, 2004 06:55:31 PM
IP: 4.244.12.183

Meto> I always thought Sevarius was dead; I never realised that it was a ruse. I never got the end of the ep; I thought that the "best genecist on the planet" was Sevarius' son, Sevarius Jr. I also thopught that he said "I was particularly proud of my DADSY."

Thus, I thought the first guy died and his son took his place. It wasn't untill I watched the ep several dozen times before I got it right.

Elisa should have kicked Xanatos in the ball right there at the end of the ep... not literally of course, but she should have done SOMETHING to REALLY make him sweat so he's thinkin', "Oh, $#!t, I really **** up this time!"

And Derek. Poor naïve Derek. He is sooo trusting of Xanatos because, you know, "He's not the reincarnation of Snivley Whiplash!" (One of my favorite lines; I am not sure if it is from this ep or Her Brother's Keeper"). Derek still trusts Xanatos, and then has the gall to think that he's the only one who can help him.

Poor naïve Derek.


That is all I will say.

Battle Beast
CanadaFriday, June 25, 2004 12:56:32 PM
IP: 142.59.132.116

The Pack>I didn't mind them too much. Fox, Hyena, Jackal, and Dingo always seemed interesting in their own ways. Wolf was the regular old, brawn, kill-em all kinda guy. Though they gave him a better dynamic later by making him an ancestor of Hakkon, which was kinda cool.
Siren
Thursday, June 24, 2004 11:00:12 PM
IP: 65.33.112.117

Z -- fey genetics>> Interesting effects may happen once the fey inheritance spreads throughout the population, especially if that inheritance is in the form of descrete "genes." I rather doubt the fey inheritance would be found in people's DNA, though.

CKayote >> Well, then I know that at least one Golden Knight will be up in Montreal. What is "Golden Knight" in French, le Chevalier d'Or?

The Pack>> While I don't like the Pack eps. in general -- too much like other "action" cartoons -- I have to admit that they introduced some fascinating characters such as Fox and Dingo.

JJ Gregarius
Tampa, FL
Thursday, June 24, 2004 10:40:22 PM
IP: 4.247.194.180

*a small, undescriptive person ahems and whispers something in MAui's ear, and she turns red* OH! Uh..

of COURSE! I MEANT to screw up the link! HA HA! Keep you all on your toes, eh? Yeah..well.

HERE'S THE REAL LINK!

MAui - [<--Go! I mean it for real this time!]
Thursday, June 24, 2004 10:14:12 PM
IP: 64.231.50.201

**Walks on in, dressed to the nines in his Michael Buffer Announcer's Suit(tm)**

If YOU and three friends are going to be at Gathering 2004 in Montreal, and you enjoy stiff, crazy competition, do what slogan says and GO 4 IT!

We are looking for willing quartets of winged warriors, ferocious Feyborn, marathoning mutants, growling gryphons and even humble humans to participate in the 2nd Clan Olympics!

The official invite can be found by following this LINKIE...**Points the microphone over in the direction of the link** where you and three of your trusted companions can register and be entered into one of the fiercest competitions in Gathering History!


Don't delay, for only the first EIGHT teams to register will be guaranteed to be a part of the competition for honor, bragging rights, and CHEAP PLASTIC MEDALS!

If you caught the zany events that transpired in 2002, that was just the beginning; for 2004 gives you More Points, More Chances, and More Surprises than before!

So hurry up, grab a Trio of your friends and make a Pack of Clan Olympians to take on this year's intense, insane, and incredible competition!

Will Clan Spoogens make a triumphant return?
How Many Teams Will Arcadia Form this year?
Can Clan Challanged form another championship squad?
What the Hell does "Spirit Counts" mean?!?

These answers and many more will be found out over the Gathering Weekend…
Don't be left in the sunshine, JOIN US!

CLAN OLYMPICS 2004 - SPIRIT COUNTS…

**Smiles, puts down the microphone and walks out**
Let's Get Ready To Ruuuuumblllllllle!

MAui - [<--GO! NOW!]
Thursday, June 24, 2004 10:11:11 PM
IP: 64.231.50.201

The official website for Serenity (the Firefly movie) opened yesterday. It's shiny. Go see. :)

(Clicky.)

Bud-Clare
Thursday, June 24, 2004 08:44:35 PM
IP: 66.67.201.63

Watched my tape of "Metamorphosis" this afternoon. This is one of my favorite episodes of "Gargoyles", especially because of the ending - Elisa proceeding to let Xanatos have it verbally, and then weeping back at the clock tower, struck me as very powerful stuff from the first time that I saw this episode.

This episode is also a testimony to just how cunning Xanatos is. I knew perfectly well, from when I first saw "Metamorphosis", what Xanatos was really like (the previous episodes of "Gargoyles" had all established that), and yet, I found myself actually believing that he was telling the truth about wanting to help Derek. When he refused to cage Derek, saying, "He's a man, not an animal", I gave him a mental standing ovation. And then, when it turned out that it was all a scam and that he'd intended for Derek to be mutated after all....

One of my favorite little bits: the gargoyles awakening on the clock tower in Act One, with little bits of stone falling on the man standing below to his startlement, and the pigeons flying off in a hurry. (It'd be kind of funny if they'd shown Bronx angrily barking at the pigeons as they fly away, though it might not have fitted the mood.)

Broadway refers to the Gen-U-Tech logo as a symbol, fitting in with his illiteracy at this point in the series.

And how many people, the first time around, were shocked to see Sevarius apparently dead - in a Disney cartoon? I know that I was. (Yet one more sign, as if we needed it after "Deadly Force", that this isn't your typical Disney animated series.)

Todd Jensen
St. Louis, MO
Thursday, June 24, 2004 07:54:28 PM
IP: 4.244.18.223

Another couple of DVD sets I'd like to see are all the Disney Afternoon shows. Gummi Bears, Ducktales, Chip and Dale Rescue Rangers, and Talespin. Am I missing any?
Siren
Thursday, June 24, 2004 07:41:55 PM
IP: 65.33.112.117

Lynati, I wish they would too. Exo Squad rocked, though it ended on a cliffhanger.
Paul Cousins
GA
Thursday, June 24, 2004 07:28:20 PM
IP: 68.220.45.200

CK>I emailed several weeks ago about my music videos to enter them, but I never got a reply. Could you let me know if they are okay to enter?
Siren - [sirengarg@yahoo.com]
Thursday, June 24, 2004 03:14:56 PM
IP: 65.33.112.117

I'd like to see some stats of attendance from since the Gathering first took place. Does anyone have this recorded? And the number of people registering at the event?

Call it my business side that wants to know.

I know you all have probably done reviews on episodes before. Have you ever compared old reviews with new reviews? Just to say that I wonder if you felt the same way over certain scenes now as opposed to a few years back.

Lily Doll - [lilmidnightlily@yahoo.com]
Thursday, June 24, 2004 11:41:16 AM
IP: 67.35.196.206

I'm waiting to see if Universal starts putting out its animated shows on DVD. Exo Squad in particular.
Lynati
Thursday, June 24, 2004 09:43:23 AM
IP: 64.216.140.140

CKayote > The order number doesn't mean anything. The software started numbering them at 1001, and it doesn't account for the people who've registered by mail or at last year's convention. You'll get a confirmation e-mail tonight. I process registrations in the evenings.

There's actually around 110 people registered as of the last time I checked the count. We'd really like to see that number grow, so to quote Rod Roddy, "Come on down!"

13 days left to reserve your hotel room at the Delta Centre-Ville (deadline is July 6 at noon).
22 days left to pre-register for The Gathering 2004 (deadline is July 15).
43 days left until The Gathering 2004 in Montreal, Quebec!

Patrick
Thursday, June 24, 2004 07:01:30 AM
IP: 68.170.199.45

First off, potentially big news! I registered for the Gathering this evening and it informed me I had payed for item number "001067". This could mean that I am the 1067th person to register or it could just be code.
Would Patrick or some else from the Gathering staff please confirm.?
Because if this does mean that around a thousand people attending, I know that will be a record.

Her Brother's Keeper: Didn't like it when I first saw it. I thought it was more of just a placeholder episode. I never expected the character of Derek to be followed up-on. I think it's a better ep in light of later episodes.

Reawakening: Always one of my favorites.

Leader of the Pack: When I first saw this one, I misinterperted quite a bit of it.
1)It wasn't clear to me that Xanatos was the actual employer of the Pack. At the time I thought he was simply manipulating them, and that later he brought them under his control. It wasn't until I read some Greg's rants and Ask Greg replies that I understood that he had been their ORIGINAL employer.
2)Probably because I didn't pick up on number 1, I didn't pick up on Fox and Xanatos' relationship. I thought he was just using her. It wasn't until Eye of the Beholder that I actually believed he loved her.
Lex lasering Coyote: I really liked that part. In my opinion, it was an obvious thing to include and it didn't 'feel' all that violent. But I'm thinking of violence in more of a shocking way.....

Fae genes in the populace: I wouldn't be surprised if a sizeable minority had some, distant fae ancestry. But I imagine people from certain regions would have more than others. The Greeks for example.

CKayote - [CKayote@worldnet.att.net]
Orlando, FL
Thursday, June 24, 2004 12:42:56 AM
IP: 65.244.171.25

Ok, Ok, So I missed "Long Way to morning" episode ramble, so here goes.

I happen to like this episode a lot. Hudson was one character that had to be explored early or we wouldn't know ANYTHING about him.

Hudson shows his true colors in this episode. Even when Goliath tells him to let him die, Hudson shrugs it off as hogwash.

And don't forget that Hudson carries Goliath EVERYWHERE in this ep. I mean, he isn't weak and feeble just yet. He goes toe to toe with Demona and doesn't waiver one bit!

Hudson has smarts - general knowledge skills - that Demona will never have. Hudson can follow horses; he can tell when bow strings are cut, etc. Heck, he even uses stone skin against the steel clan 'bot.

He might be lazy sometimes and likes to watch T.V., but when his clan needs him, they can count on him and he's not going to let them down.

Even the title of the episode has a double meaning, or at leasat I thought so... "Long Way to Mourning/morning"

Long time before Goliath will die / long time untill sunrise.

Good ep all around. Next up: The Price


Hey, anyone from Canada, just a question: One Monday, will it be Grits, Tories, Bloc, or NDP?

Curious to see what y'all think.

That is all I will say.

Battle Beast
bliss , Canada
Thursday, June 24, 2004 12:21:17 AM
IP: 142.59.132.116

Ok, Ok, So I missed "Long Way to morning" episode ramble, so here goes.

I happen to like this episode a lot. Hudson was one character that had to be explored early or we wouldn't know ANYTHING about him.

Hudson shows his true colors in this episode. Even when Goliath tells him to let him die, Hudson shrugs it off as hogwash.

And don't forget that Hudson carries Goliath EVERYWHERE in this ep. I mean, he isn't weak and feeble just yet. He goes toe to toe with Demona and doesn't waiver one bit!

Hudson has smarts - general knowledge skills - that Demona will never have. Hudson can follow horses; he can tell when bow strings are cut, etc. Heck, he even uses stone skin against the steel clan 'bot.

He might be lazy sometimes and likes to watch T.V., but when his clan needs him, they can count on him and he's not going to let them down.

Even the title of the episode has a double meaning, or at leasat I thought so... "Long Way to Mourning/morning"

Long time before Goliath will die / long time untill sunrise.

Good ep all around. Next up: The Price


Hey, anyone from Canada, just a question: One Monday, will it be Grits, Tories, Bloc, or NDP?

Curious to see what y'all think.

That is all I will say.

Battle Beast
bliss , Canada
Thursday, June 24, 2004 12:20:48 AM
IP: 142.59.132.116

Yes, I saw those too. I am hoping they bring out My Little Pony and Thundercats to DVD. Those were the two main shows I watched as a child.
Siren
Wednesday, June 23, 2004 11:18:17 PM
IP: 65.33.112.117

Siren, also the original Tranformers and GI Joe series are out on DVD Boxsets.
Paul Cousins
GA
Wednesday, June 23, 2004 10:54:36 PM
IP: 68.220.45.200

Talking about DVD sets, I never liked the show, but I saw Jem on DVD. One I do like they have now, the ORIGINAL Ninja Turtles series on DVD. Gargoyles is finally jumping on the bandwagon of other cartoon shows. Hopefully they will release the entire series *crosses fingers and toes*
Siren
Wednesday, June 23, 2004 07:35:13 PM
IP: 65.33.112.117

Well, this place is certainly moving again. Thank goodness for that.

DEMONSKRYE - Jackal's "Sicker than usual" line comes from "Upgrade", actually. (And this is coming from a guy whose idea of fun is altering Goliath's features in his stone sleep.)

Todd Jensen
St. Louis, MO
Wednesday, June 23, 2004 06:34:47 PM
IP: 4.245.18.213

Lots of catching up to do.

Lily Doll -
<Hear the rumor of the choice of Las Vegas for the next Gathering.>

Funny you should mention that as I have just returned from a week in Vegas.

"Long Way 'Til Morning" -
I've enjoyed pretty much every glimpse into the past that we get in any episode, and this one was no exception. Hudson was overdue for a feature episode, so shedding some light on his past was greatly needed. I particularly enjoyed getting to see two version of Demona - one fighting alongside Goliath and Hudson and one fighting against them. That made it all the more intriguing as whenever we were given more tidbits about her past in future episodes.

"Her Brother's Keeper" - I was never a big fan of this episode. In fact, I never really liked any of the episdoes that focused on Elisa's family (i.e. "Mark of the Panther", "Cloud Fathers", and "The Cage" to some extent). Brooklyn had a lot of good dry humor quips, but it was kind of too much of a good thing. It seemed like that was his only purpose in the episode.

"Reawakening" - Mr. Jaffe is another one of those characters that makes the show so complete. He really is an insignificant character, but they make the most of his brief time on stage and make him a sympathetic character. I have a feeling he would've gotten a few more cameos if the series had continued.

JJ -
<Given the long lives and long histories of the Fey, there may be an amazing number of people with Fey ancestry and some *small* Fey ability>

Yes, but at what age does the small percentage of Fay genes in a person become so miniscule that they are futile? Even Fox, who was a half-Fay needed to get incredibly pissed off to show any potency. Obviously Alex, who was the grandchild of a Fay, showed abilities as they were harnessed at a very young age. But would the potential for special abilities kind of fade away as they age?

"Leader of the Pack" - Like Todd, I'm not nearly as fond of Pack episodes. The fight scenes were interesting in "Thrill of the Hunt", but got old after that. I did enjoy this episode for all of its surprises surrounding Coyote. It also offers great continuity as the Pack are still in prison and of course the reference to "Enter Macbeth" that Todd mentioned. It also offers what is probably my favorite Hudson quote: "Well, come on, then; none of us are gettin' any younger."

Abby -
<It's the longest day of the year in the Northern Hemisphere>

I hate to be picky, but for the sake of accuracy, the summer solstice only the longest day of the year for people north of the line 23.5 degrees north of the equator, also know as the Tropic of Cancer. I believe that line runs through Mexico, North Africa, and India. Everyone between the Tropic of Cancer and the Tropic of Capricorn (23.5 degrees South) has two days that are equally long which occur sometime between the summer and winter solstices depending on how far from the equator you are. The longest day for everyone below the Tropic of Capricorn is the Winter Solstice, which I believe is December 21st or 22nd.

Peace

Z
Wednesday, June 23, 2004 01:13:10 PM
IP: 67.66.144.252

I don't believe the board game will make a comeback on the DVD, but they do still make them. Lilo and Stitch had a board game/DVD packaging together. I don't think they will do it, for money reasons. But packaging isn't a reason in this case.
Siren
Wednesday, June 23, 2004 01:05:56 PM
IP: 65.33.112.117

OK, I suppose I can pitch in to keep the room from getting quiet.

DVD Extras> It is nice to see Disney putting in some effort. In addition to the Gathering footage, I wuoldn't be surprised if we get a game of some kind. I'm not expecting the board game though, as it means more packaging and materials to produce so a) it's more costly for Disney and b) less of them will fit on a store shelf due to bulkier packaging. My guess is that Disney will go with the trivia-game-using-clips format that they seem to be very fond of. Now if we can just get some cast and crew interviews and a cover that doesn't hurt my eyeballs, we'll be all set.

"Leader of the Pack"> Nice ramble, Todd. Since I still don't have season two on tape, I can't add much from my several years ago viewing of the episode. I do remember the scene with Bronx on the sinking boat very clearly and having a moment of concern for the poor puppy. I also recall Jackal respondind to Hyena's...ummm....interest in Coyote with "Well that's sicker than usual." (I could be remembering wrong and transplanting this from another episode.) I thought it showed the dynamic between the siblings nicely. Jackal tends to be crazy in a more calculating way. Hyena is more just plain nuts, as shown by her...odd tastes.

Nothing more for now, but it looks like I might be back on a regular basis.

Demonskrye
Wednesday, June 23, 2004 12:40:08 PM
IP: 209.150.45.114

matt: Your description of the solstice is right. It's the longest day of the year in the Northern Hemisphere, and now the days will start getting shorter (although the nights getting longer would make gargoyles happy!).

Todd: Thanks for your continuing episode discussions. I watched "Re-Awakening" last night with some of your comments in mind (I like Xanatos'reference to "Frankenstein," "It's alive!"). Since I originally saw "Leader of the Pack" before this episode, when I first saw "Re-Awakening" I wondered whether the red figure that arrived in Times Square with Demona was another robot of that type, or Xanatos himself. (It does seem that I missed out on a lot of the mystery and development of the characters and plotline by seeing the shows in such a jumbled order, but such is life. It's fun to watch them in order to catch all that, like you are doing now.)

Abby
Minneapolis, MN
Wednesday, June 23, 2004 12:22:59 PM
IP: 161.225.1.12

I have to admit, I didn't think the blasting scenes were not that bad... the one where Coyote gets it in the chest. After all, it is a robot. Can't hurt a robot and you can always make more.

Sometimes I wondered if there was really a point to some of the antics of Xanatos. Or if he did some things just for the fun of it. After all, the rich are often terribly bored.

Lily Doll - [lilmidnightlily@yahoo.com]
Wednesday, June 23, 2004 11:58:55 AM
IP: 67.35.197.10

Summer Solstice> actually, if i'm not mistaken, i think that means the days are getting shorter in the north and longer in the south... the summer solstice is the longest day in the north, the peak of the longest days, so they should only be getting shorter now... right?
matt
Wednesday, June 23, 2004 11:45:22 AM
IP: 207.230.48.2

Thanks, Todd, for your annual summer episode review. It's the next best thing to Greg's rambles.

I liked "Leader of the Pack" and thought it was a great start to the second season, mainly because of the surprising twists it introduced. I remember that when I first watched this episode, there were three different times when I nearly jumped out of my seat in shock.

First, was the introduction of Coyote. I knew right away that it was Xanatos; I recognized his voice. The surprising part was aboard the Pack's new vehicle when he took off his helmet. I knew there must be a reason for him to reveal himself to the Pack, but I didn't know what it must be and was intrigued to find out. His alleged desire for revenge didn't bother me because I knew he was just saying that to manipulate the Pack.

Second, of course, was when Bronx ripped half of Xanatos's face off and revealed him as a robot. Up until then I never had any doubt that Coyote and Xanatos were the same person. And for a brief second I thought that perhaps Xanatos had been a robot all along. This is the perfect type of surprise because, although one would never suspect the truth, it makes perfect sense.

The third shock came at the end. It was cool that Fox was paroled and that Xanatos was waiting for her. But when they kissed, that was a surprise. Just another indication that this wasn't one of your typical cartoon shows.

Phil - [p1anderson@go.com]
Wednesday, June 23, 2004 09:08:05 AM
IP: 134.215.241.133

I hope that this place will pick up a little soon. The room was silent for the twenty-four hours between Nickerous's post on Monday afternoon and my post on Tuesday evening, and the only person who posted after that was DPH. Maybe a lot of people here have simply been temporarily separated from their computers. Maybe, also, the release of the DVD this autumn may revive things a little.

DPH - Greg once explained why Xanatos chose Derek as a Mutate; it was a careful ploy to stop Elisa from making any moves against him. After all, if her own brother is now one of Xanatos's bodyguards (and the head of his Mutates), she's not going to attack Xanatos for fear of getting Derek injured in the process (or, worse, captured by the authorities and locked in a lab for study).

Todd Jensen
St. Louis, MO
Wednesday, June 23, 2004 07:11:55 AM
IP: 4.244.12.94

Todd - During my last viewing of Awakening Part 1, I could have swore I saw a dog. It was after the confrontation between Goliath and the princess. It was really brief. <Lexington blasts Coyote straight through the chest with a laser cannon - as Greg Weisman said, one of the most violent moments in the series.> And too bad Toon Disney cut that shot out of Leader of the Pack. < (One thing that surprised me when I saw it this time, however, is that the Pack went at Hudson one at a time, instead of all at once. Since when do they believe in fighting chivalrously?)> I had my own theory about that one. There's a danger in all 3 attacking at the same time, Hudson would simply duck out of the way and the 3 would wipe each other out. <I suspect that he'd finally fully understood that the door had closed permanently on their being his willing flunkies - which explains why he was focusing all the more on making his own gargoyles instead, such as the Mutates and Thailog.> Yea, but I'd still like to know why David Xanatos chose Derek Maza to become a mutate. We know that he thinks revenge is a sucker's game so that rules out the obvious motivation.

Hmm. Didn't we just pass the Summer Solstice? So the days should be getting longer for those of us in the Northern Hemisphere and the nights getting longer for those people in the Southern Hemisphere.




DPH
AR, USA
Wednesday, June 23, 2004 12:45:22 AM
IP: 67.14.195.34

Watched my tape of "Leader of the Pack" today. I've never enjoyed Pack episodes quite as much as other episodes of "Gargoyles" where the antagonist is someone like Xanatos or Demona or Macbeth, largely because the Pack tend to go for more simple plain-old fighting without any subtlety of characterization, but this one has some good moments in it.

Coyote gets introduced, of course, as one of the biggies. We even wind up with his trademark half-Xanatos half-robot head, thanks to Bronx. (I wonder what people seeing this one for the first time thought when they saw Bronx chewing his face off.) Not to mention, immediately after the Pack realize to their astonishment that it was really a robot instead of Xanatos, Hyena cries out eagerly, "Even better!" (That woman is *strange*, believe me.)

Fox shows how well-read she is in her literary references to Hyena at the beginning.

One little touch that I like: Brooklyn is still extremely bitter about Demona, but he's wise enough to realize that his desire for revenge could get him in trouble. Note the bit where he's telling Lexington about the danger of his letting his desire for revenge on the Pack consume him, and adds "I feel the same way [as you do about the Pack] whenever someone mentions Demona."

Brooklyn gets in a few of his usual quips such as, when the Pack show up in a dramatic fashion at the studio, "Now they know how to make an entrance!" or his "That was no lady" remark about Hyena. Then there's his little reference to "Enter Macbeth" in "Why is it that whenever you and I take Bronx out, we always wind up getting in trouble?"

One of my favorite bits during the fight on the ocean liner is when Hudson's having his show-down with Jackal, Hyena, and Dingo, and they're all looking at each other carefully, waiting for an opening, until Hudson says, "Well, come on, then; none of us are gettin' any younger." (One thing that surprised me when I saw it this time, however, is that the Pack went at Hudson one at a time, instead of all at once. Since when do they believe in fighting chivalrously?)

Lexington blasts Coyote straight through the chest with a laser cannon - as Greg Weisman said, one of the most violent moments in the series.

Another great scene: Bronx huddled on the last part of the sinking ocean liner that's above the waves, letting out a mournful howl, before Goliath swoops down and rescues him.

Then we get the final scene where we discover what Xanatos's real objective was, and that the gargoyles were only a side-issue. It's worth noting that Xanatos makes no efforts to capture the clan in Season Two - the closest is when he captures Hudson in "The Price". All of his other schemes towards the gargoyles consist of simply test-running his latest gadgets on them (as in this episode or "Upgrade") or tricking them into doing his dirty work (such as "Metamorphosis" or "Vows"). I suspect that he'd finally fully understood that the door had closed permanently on their being his willing flunkies - which explains why he was focusing all the more on making his own gargoyles instead, such as the Mutates and Thailog.

Todd Jensen
St. Louis, MO
Tuesday, June 22, 2004 07:21:11 PM
IP: 4.244.12.142

Very exciting news about the dvd. I fully expected Disney to muddle through this release. Then again, the set is not out yet.....

Finished my 4th Gargoyles video last night. Very pleased with this one. Finished my 3rd video Sat night and then found inspiration for the 4th one early yesterday morning. Now, I need to find more music! More compatible music!

Nickerous - [nickerous@yahoo.com]
SC, USA
Monday, June 21, 2004 04:16:32 PM
IP: 66.220.74.192

I'm free at last! Finally finished this semester.
That's great news about the DVD, will be good to see. Just hope they'll release it over here too!
French in Quebec> A while ago I know, but thanks guys that made for an interesting read, just have't had chance to post any sooner.
'Is it just me, or are the nights getting *really* long?'> actually, ours are almost non-existant right now. (Simmer Dim tonight)

Sheltie
Monday, June 21, 2004 03:32:52 PM
IP: 213.122.110.126

HEY GUYS,

Since the room has cleared, I'm reposting this for anyone who missed the news. And it's...

BIG NEWS. SO BIG I'M LOCKING DOWN MY CAPS.

AS MANY OF YOU KNOW, THE FIRST SEASON OF GARGOYLES IS BEING RELEASED THIS YEAR ON DVD TO COINCIDE WITH THE TENTH ANNIVERSARY OF THE SERIES.

I'VE JUST BEEN INFORMED THAT DISNEY IS SENDING A VIDEO CREW TO THE GATHERING OF THE GARGOYLES, OUR ANNUAL CONVENTION, TO TAPE THE FANS, GUESTS, EVENTS, ETC. FOR THE EXTRAS SECTION OF THE DVD.

THAT MEANS IF YOU ATTEND THE CONVENTION THIS AUGUST 6-8 IN MONTREAL, YOU HAVE A CHANCE TO ACTUALLY BE ON THE DVD.

LET THAT SINK IN FOR A SECOND.

IF YOU'RE ALREADY SIGNED UP, GREAT. BUT IF NOT -- WELL -- WHAT ARE YOU WAITING FOR!!!!

CLICK MY NAME OR CHECK OUT THE CON'S WEBSITE AT:

http://www.gatheringofthegargoyles.com/

DON'T MISS THIS GATHERING!!!!!!!!
GREG WEISMAN
Monday, June 21, 2004 03:30:25 PM
IP: 209.178.135.128

Lily>That does bring up a good point. Games on DVD these days are on just about every family/children's dvd. From trivia to actual video games. I wonder if Disney plans any. Be it the board game or not. They had Gargoyle games on Toon Disney.com before. They could even add that to the DVD, though I hope something new will be placed. I also wonder if Gargoyles will have the same behind the scenes feature as they did on the VHS.

Which brings me to something else...Behind the scenes interviews and the board game both came on the VHS. Save for the deleted scenes about the eggs, Gargoyles had some of the same elements as DVDs.

Siren
Monday, June 21, 2004 12:10:46 PM
IP: 65.33.112.117

Hear the rumor of the choice of Las Vegas for the next Gathering. I hope to attend that one as I've never been to a Gathering. Surely I can plan ahead an entire year?!?!

Just for the fun of it, I played the game at the end of the video of the original video. Kinda hard to play by yourself but Button *The Kitten* didn't seem too interested in learning how to play. I thought it was nice to put something like that in there. Made picking up the video more fun.

Wonder if they will even bother with that for the DVD.

Lily Doll
Monday, June 21, 2004 10:59:25 AM
IP: 67.35.197.22

10th.
Leo
Monday, June 21, 2004 08:56:22 AM
IP: 68.231.241.236

In the interest of getting it over with, 9th!
Phil - [p1anderson@go.com]
Monday, June 21, 2004 08:44:34 AM
IP: 134.215.241.133

8th!

Wow, it's 8:00 and we are still in Top 10?

Siren
Monday, June 21, 2004 08:03:31 AM
IP: 65.33.112.117

*while on his daily search for his ID*

7th!

Alex Garg - [alex_garg@yahoo.com]
VA, USA
Monday, June 21, 2004 07:50:25 AM
IP: 141.156.136.9

rip off the wrong people and they send you to jail; rip off the right people and they say you show initiative...

oh. and #6. Is it just me, or are the nights getting *really* long?

Lynati
Monday, June 21, 2004 06:47:13 AM
IP: 208.190.202.175

Johnny 5 is alive!


ugh, can't believe i typed that since i've always hated that movie...

matt
Monday, June 21, 2004 01:40:45 AM
IP: 207.230.48.52

#4, great to be back online at home
DPH
AR, USA
Monday, June 21, 2004 01:10:38 AM
IP: 67.14.195.47

3rd!
The Sadistic Cow - [funkadelic_gnome@hotmail.com]
Monday, June 21, 2004 12:12:12 AM
IP: 69.157.1.143

Wow.. it's been a long time since I've been here...

#2 post for the week... right?

Patricia - [sabre0link@hotmail.com]
Montevallo, AL, USA
Monday, June 21, 2004 12:09:04 AM
IP: 216.77.181.135

First! *Plants a tree*
Wingless
Monday, June 21, 2004 12:07:22 AM
IP: 24.157.218.68