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Gargoyles

The Phoenix Gate

Comment Room Archive

Comments for the week ending December 25, 2006

Index : Show Images

Hey, Happy Holidays!! I hope that you all have a great time!
Phoenician - [theoneandonlyphoenician at yahoo dot com]
Pheon

Wanted to wish you all a safe and happy holiday!

I'm waiting for my daughter to fall asleep so I can get to work :D

Siren - [Click my name for Hunter's Moon Trailer!]

I hope everyone's having a nice Christmas so far. :)

Off-topic, the Gargs IRC chat is available. Directions on my LJ, for anyone who wants to pop in.

KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
"Ignore me!" - Venture Bros.

Merry Christmas guys! I hope everyone has a safe and happy holiday season...and of course that all those who don;'t have it yet get their coveted Gargoyles CDs and comics from santa this year :)

See you all soon!

MAui
Sandy Claws??

Jurgan: Thanks for that summary. I don't know anything about running a con, and while I've heard that didn't stop the first one, I really don't think I have the attention span to take on such a leadership role myself. (An IRC channel, on the other hand, I can do.) But now that I know the prodding needs to be directed at the lowest level, the would-be volunteers, well... I know. And Knowledge Is Power! Or is it, Knowing Is Half The Battle!?

*wanders off muttering catchphrases to himself...*

Vid the Kid
Does this font make me look fat?

Vid the Kid: I don't know a lot of details, but basically, if you want the convention to come to your city, you have to say "I'll run it." A con can't take place unless locals are willing to put in a lot of effort in helping it go smoothly. To do that, you need to show up at one of the existing cons in person and put a bid in. If you can't make it to someone else's con, then there's not much reason for them to believe you have the determination to run your own. And as gratifying as I'm sure it is that you believe the mayor of the city is somehow involved, I'm sure a con our size is barely a blip on their radar. So, in short, if you want the con to come to your city, start making plans to come to another one and find as many people locally as you can to help run it. That's about all I know, but others can tell you what to do next.
Jurgan - [jurgan6 at yahoo dot com]
"What? I'm saying I'd rather kiss you than die- it's a compliment!" -Aang, from Avatar: The Last Airbender

Hey, wih the new Previews listing of Gargoyles #4 solicited, what do you all think about the change in artists? I'm curious about Gordon Purcell's art for the book. Can he adapt the style of the cartoons art? Like I'm familiar with his art on X-Files and Star Trek comics. But he's more of the standard comic artist. But he's got to also be an improvement as well in terms of getting the book out and his experience in comics. I'm just wondering can he adapt the style of the cartoon? I've never seen his work look like that before. Can he do it? And is anyone surprised by the replacing of previous artsist David Hedgecock (hope I got his name right)? I mean his art wasn't the best, but somtimes it wasn't so bad. But it did look always out of proportion to some extant and very amateurish. I know SLG is a small comic publisher and they wouldn't have the a-list art talents neither. But Davids art for Gargoyles wasn't the right choice. And if he was the reason issue #2 was delayed, than he really shouldn't have done the book if he can't handle the schedule timing. Our criticisms of the art and that long delay, I think, may have caused the change in artists. Can't help but wonder if Greg feels sorry for Dave. He seemed so happy to have him as the artist on the comic. Whats're your thoughts? Was it the right choice or wrong choice? Is it unfair to Dave? I too feel sorry for him. To be in his shoes and knowing your out is not the best feeling in the world, assuming these are the reasons from an SLG editorial standpoint. But maybe we're being premature about this and Gordon could be just a fill in for one issue (thats a big "if").
Willie - [wab at shaw dot ca]

I tried to find it at local comic book shops, but nil. I'm gonna have to order it online
Siren - [Click my name for Hunter's Moon Trailer!]

I'm going to comment on a few things here:
BID FOR CONVENTIONS:
Who exactly makes the bid for a convention? Who initiates the process? The mayor of a city? The owners/managers of the facility where the convention is to be held? Staff of the convention itself?

IRC CHAT:
In case anyone here prefers primitive IRC chat over primitive HTML/PHP chat, I've started a new Gargoyles IRC channel. (The only other one that's been mentioned anywhere online was on a server that is no longer available.)

Channel name:
#Gargs
Server:
irc.nightstar.net
Server info:
http://www.nightstar.net/

COMIC COLORING:
I agree that some of the coloring in Issue #2 is too dark. As an amateur photographer who likes taking urban night shots, I can tell you that nighttime is quite a colorful time, once your eyes adjust.

Vid the Kid
Does this font make me look fat?

Demonskrye: I discussed this the other night with D. Taina after she sent me some images from Issue 2 (still waiting to receive my copies). I found myself recalling Greg's commentary from "Awakening," when he mentioned the colors of the Gargoyles universe. Even though it's at night, it's not dark because it's still intended to be hopeful, I think that was basically what he had said. If the images I have seen of Issue 2 are any indication, this colorist now just doesn't capture that. Hopefully, the new colorist will come closer to it.

And as far as the pencils are concerned, I guess it's wishful thinking of me to hope that in Issue 3, Hedgecock will have cured Demona of her afro. *sigh*

Harvester of Eyes
"'Hungry Hungry Hippos'? Blast you, Claus, you porcine double-crosser! And to think I was actually nice!" -Stewart Gilligan Griffin

As an early christmas present, Todd Jensen brings us a review of Clan-Building: The Journey, the second issue of the new SLG comics. As with the previous one, I still need a synopsis to go with the review, plus this time I need the remaining credits. I know a lot of people out there have this issue (and the previous one) - can one of you send me a short summary about what happens in the comic to post on the GFW? (Yes, I know I could copy&paste from the TGC episode 'the journey', but that's not going to help for future issues, so why start NOW?)

Speaking of summaries - a couple of Season 2 and 3 episodes still lack one. To be precise, I still need 4 episodes of Season 2 (3 of those unclaimed, one claimed by Harvester of Eyes) and 3 episodes of Season 3 (claimed by D. Taina).

Guandalug la'Fay - [guandalug at gargoyles-fans dot org]
It has been said that the world is a strange place. This is not true. The world is a VERY strange place.

Were they able to draw any conclusions?
Vaevictis Asmadi

BLAQTHORNE - Yes. I don't have cable, but a friend of mine taped it and sent it to me.
Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!

Willie> Thank you for the info. It's a shame that they can't have it printed domestically.

Battle Beast> You're in Tijuana? :P

Todd> I probably asked this when it aired a while back, but did you watch the multi-parter the History Channel did last year (or earlier, I forget exactly when) where they try to figure out who the actual King Arthur was?

Blaqthourne & Crimson Fury
Music Selection: Gladiator OST

"I found something interesting when I picked up my copy of issue 2: Anyone know why the comic, produced by a company based in San Diego, is printed in Canada?"

Majority, if not all comic books (as well as tpb's, hc's, graphic novels) are printed in Canada by a printing group called Quebecor.
Some info off wikipedia:
Quebecor World Inc. is the second largest commercial printing company in the world, with 39,000 employees around the world. Quebecor World Inc. TSX: IQW is a subsidiary of Quebecor Inc. based in Montréal, Quebec. It comprises a huge number of small and large print shops throughout the globe and claims to be the largest commercial and industrial printer in the world. In 1999, Quebecor Printing merged with World Color Press in a US$2.7bn deal to create Quebecor World, a name meant to reflect the global stature of the company. These two companies shared a similar history of growth through mergers and acquisitions.

Willie - [wab at shaw dot ca]

WHAT DID i MISS??? Having fun at the happiest place on Earth!!!

Later!

basttle Beast - [1313 Harbour Boulevard, Anaheim Caifornia, USA (Actually Canada)]
That is all i will say.

I knew I should have kept my mouth shut
Wingless

My husband picked up my copy of issue #2 from the comic store yesterday. A few thoughts:

If Gordon Purcell ends up taking over art chores long term starting with issue #4, I personally will welcome the change. Hedgecock may be improving a little, but he's still widly inconsistant. I fully expected the characters to look different from the way they did on the show when the comic came out. But the art in issue 2 has characters that look different from panel to panel. I checked out Purcell's site and he seems like a solid artist with a good amount of industry experience, which is probably just what the book could use.

My main problem with the coloring on this issue is how dark it is. Yes, I know the book takes place exclusively at night, but that doesn't mean I should have trouble figuring out what the dark blob I'm looking at is supposed to be. I've seen somics before where colorists haven't accounted for the difference between how a page looks on the computer and how it prints. I don't know that that's the case here, but I'm hpoing this issue gets resolved so I can sort out the Quarrymen from the background.

Storywise, I had already read the script for "The Journey" (still haven't seen it), so I knew pretty much where we were going. It was nice seeing the trio again and setting up what I'm guessing will be their story arcs for the next couple of issues. I kind of wonder if anyone new to the Gargoyles universe was at all confused about the relationship between Lex and Fox, but aside from that, most things seemed pretty clear cut. Yeah, the newbies would have no clue who MacBeth and Margo Yale are, but they don't really need to. My one concern is that I still feel like the story might be going a little too fast, espcially in terms of Elisa and Goliath. It feels like we're going to go directly from Goliath saying he doesn't regret the path his journey has taken and Elisa pretty much agreeing to "This isn't working and we should start seeing other people and gargoyles". I do trust Greg's storytelling instincts, so I'll wait and see how it plays out. But it still strikes me as odd that a relationsip that took so long to develop will go on hiatus after just one date.

Demonskrye

Elisa's Date: The more I think about it, the more I like the idea of Elisa/Morgan. Jason in many ways is too similar to Goliath -- embattled, extraordinary. Capable of being great -- and of going completely wrong. Morgan represents stability, calm, normalcy. Not grand passion, maybe, but a real break from the world of clones, mutates, gargoyles and supervillains. It's not important that she has great chemistry with Morgan; she's not proposing marriage. But he would represent the possibility of exploring normal life. I suspect Jason is a little more likely though.

Drraagh: It's a cool idea. But was "Vows" in Greg's mind this early? I suppose it's possible.

Ed

WINGLESS> Somehow I doubt it will be a clone of Elisa. I think the real Elisa breaks his heart. This has to be the Double Date story.

So far, we know this story involves Goliath, Elisa, Thailog, Delilah, Jason or Morgan (one or the other), Demona, the White House, not to mention the rest of the cast.

An Elisa clone is one ingredient too many, and I think the story is stronger if the REAL Elisa breaks his heart.

Greg Bishansky - [<---- The 11th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"They spent so much time looking at Janet Jackson's tit, I actually thought Osama bin Laden was hiding in it." - Lewis Black

Re; Elisa breaking Goliath's heart. If Thailog is involved, I suspect It might also involve an actual clone of her causing the heartbreak. Knowing how twisted Thailog can be, it's just like something he'd do to knock Goliath off kilter so he can achieve his objective. That's just my theory
Wingless

Yay, christmas break begins today. No more school for two weeks. (Even though it began yesterday because my hands arent in good condition right now) Anyway.....ill think of something related to post later, sorry
Warcrafter - [grafixfangamer1 at sbcglobal dot net]
Humans are such easy prey for a gargoyle!

TODD > Merlin might still have a teacher, though, even if he uses Halfling magic as you suggest. He could have had a Fae mentor, just like Alex being tutored by Puck.

Greg W. joining the Wiki staff > That's awesome.

Vaevictis Asmadi

DPH - While the series has never officially stated when Merlin was born, the legends (and at present, we have no evidence that Greg was planning on contradicting them) do make it clear that it was at some point in the 5th century. According to Geoffrey of Monmouth, Merlin was born at some point during the reign of Vortigern, who was the King of Britain two reigns before Arthur (the intervening monarchs being Aurelius Ambrosius and Uther Pendragon); when Vortigern encountered Merlin as a boy, Merlin's mother was still alive, and even testified before him (Vortigern) about how a mysterious figure (Oberon, of course, from the Gargoyles Universe perspective) fathered him (Merlin) upon her. From that, Merlin would have to have been born at some point in the 5th century. (I certainly doubt that Greg would so casually contradict this part of the story.)

We don't know precisely how old Merlin would have been when Arthur was born, however. He pops up as a child (though of unspecified age) at the tail end of Vortigern's reign, and a reading of Geoffrey suggests that there weren't that many years between that event and the conception of Arthur. On the other hand, Geoffrey later on wrote a second book about Merlin (much less well-known than his History of the Kings of Britain) which claimed that Ambrosius (who apparently reigns for only a short while in the History of the Kings of Britain) reigned for twenty years. At this point, we don't have enough data to engage in much speculation.

Incidentally, I visited the GargWiki site this morning to see if the new information from #2 had been incorporated (Macbeth's book about gargoyles, Margot's link to the Gargoyle Task Force), and was pleasantly surprised to discover that Greg Weisman has joined the staff of editors for it and has included a few corrections here and there.

Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!

Sorry to double-post. I just read this review:
http://www.silverbulletcomicbooks.com/reviews/116633416538337.htm

I quote "Subplots in Gargoyles clue the new fan to the supporting cast and allay faithful fan suspicion about Xanatos, the former Big Bad on the animated series, and Fox, Xanatos' lieutenant and paramour.".

Since when was Fox Xanatos's lieutenant instead of his equal?

dph_of_rules
Whatever happenned to simplicity?

Todd - Not to sound mean, has GW ever spelled out when Merlin was born? Aside from the legends, who is to say that Merlin wasn't centuries old when he encountered King Arthur?

Oberon & Titania were divorced longer than they were married - how can we be so sure about that? They were divorced for 1,001 years. 1001 years - 996 ad yields . . 5 bc. If they were married before/around 5 bc, they might have been married longer than they divorced. On the other hand, living on oh so boring Avalon being married to 1 person for a couple of centuries might have gotten to Titania.

dph_of_rules
Whatever happenned to simplicity?

HARVESTER - So far, Greg's made no revelation as to who Merlin's tutor was. In the medieval romances about Merlin, he's given a mentor-figure named Blaise, but it is unclear whether Blaise actually taught Merlin magic (in those same works, Merlin's magic stemmed from his superhuman ancestry on his father's side and was presumably something that couldn't actually be taught). I doubt that Greg's going to be saying anything more on the subject until he actually comes out with a story or two involving Merlin for the comic.
Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!

Marvel Comics> I have them all. The are kinda corny, I think the art is weak, and they are often pretty boring. The only stories I thought were good were the Elisa-Wrongful conviction one and the Demona worshipped by the Ninjas one. The new comics are superior in every way. Better covers, better art, better stories, better dialogue, etc. All my own opinion of course.

SLG comic> This is fun, but honestly I don't want to speculate much yet. I kinda want to be surprised with each turn of the page. Call me nostalgic, but I miss having a new episode of gargoyles come on tv every afternoon knowing that anything could happen. I guess that is the one bad thing about Ask Greg. A lot of surprises are spoiled for us.
On the other hand, one of the best things about two months between issues is that we will have all that time to chat and speculate in here, something we couldn't really do between episodes.

Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Cold does not bother us..." -Goliath "Reawakening"

Drraagh: What an interesting idea. :)
Samuel - [AnglOfHellOAOL dot com]
Noodles, anyone?

This isn't really about any of the current discussions, but I started sitting down and re-watching Gargoyles since I've been watching a friend's kids over the holidays. One thing I noticed and I don't know if it's ever been talked about since I can't find it anywhere. I was watching Vows and there is the scene where Goliath meets up with Hudson on the tower. He gags him and then later comments "So you see Huds... I mean my mentor" and then goes to talk about how he was sent here by magic. Then in the Awakenings, when Hudson and Goliath are talking to Eliza about names, he asks if the river needs a name. She comments the river is named Hudson and Hudson looks back at Goliath with a look, which is originally taken as "Why must humans be like this?" or something to that effect. But, if you think about it, it could have been with some traces of that previous experience and the name that he was almost called back in time. I am likely over-thinknig it, but hey, with time travel, you never know.
Drraagh

I'd go with Jason as well. I mean with Morgan it would work if it was televised (With both him and Goliath sharing the same voice actor).

I recently gave Greg my comment on his story in JLA Showcase #1. I was just curious if anyone else in the comment room read it. If so, what did you think?

Antiyonder - [antiyonder at yahoo dot com]

If it is the Double Date, and I think it is (Halloween, Elisa breaking Goliath's heart, Delilah's face on the cover of issue 4), I have to admit, I am rooting for Jason as Elisa's date. He and Elisa have a lot of chemistry, that I never saw with Elisa and Morgan.

Morgan makes more logical sense though, since Jason would still be in the hospital this soon after "Hunter's Moon" as well as being under arrest. But, as a character, Jason is my preferance.

Well, no matter who Greg chose, I'm sure the story will be solid.

ED> Only 5 pages? Damn.

Greg Bishansky - [<---- The 11th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"They spent so much time looking at Janet Jackson's tit, I actually thought Osama bin Laden was hiding in it." - Lewis Black

Hey, in the UK, 22 pages is utter luxury. 5 pages is the base block (2 back in the day). If you can't tell a story worth reading in 5 pages, you might as well go home. And that's a wonderful thing -- because you can still tell great stories in 5 pages. Heck, painters have been using the old one-panel comic format for years to tell stories more complex and resonant than any 'Gargoyles' episode, love them though I do. But it takes talent and discipline and an ability to be ruthlessly concise and to say a lot with a little to do a story (well) in such a limited space. Frankly, I'm not grabbed by most American comics because so many of them move forward so lazily. Even the ones I like often inch forward, circling verbosely around their themes. Some characterise this as 'letting the story play out at its own pace' or 'unpacking' stories or what have you. But often this is just an excuse for baggy scripts. Reams of dialogue or big images which will be great portfolio stuffers for the people concerned, which are very nice, but which often have precious little to do with telling the story when you really get down to it.

But! Concise writing has never been Greg's downfall. In fact, it's his greatest strength. It was a source of constant awe and inspiration to me that his stories were always ruthlessly streamlined and efficient in 'Gargoyles'. Most pieces of dialogue served two, three or more purposes. The themes were tight and specific resonant and often bold. There were no unimportant characters or events. Everything mattered, no matter how small. There was a massive, vibrant cast AND even many of the more minor characters had dimensions, inner conflict, family relationships etc. all with very limited space and with an obligatory action sequence every episode to shift the toy figurines. His writing style is wonderfully lean and sleek -- utterly aerodynamic. So what do I care how much space he uses? 5 pages, 22 pages, 110 pages, it makes no difference to me. Whatever the size of the canvas, I know every bit of it will be forwarding the story. And that's all I want from the storyteller.

Harvester: Well, my disclaimer is that I've read maybe half a dozen straight-up 'Gargoyles' fanfics that weren't TGS in my lifetime -- and four of them were mine.

Ed

Is there a picture of the cover available online, or is it just in the Previews issue? 'Cos I'd definitely like to check it out. Either way, I'm really, really looking forward to seeing Thailog, as he is one of my more favoured villains. Of anything.

I still think, assuming this upcoming arc is the Double Date arc, which seems likely as per Greg B, that Morgan is the leading candidate. But I only think that because of the fact that I think Jason would still be in the hospital. Wouldn't he? He got shot through the spine... what, less than a month before this story takes place. I'd imagine him to be in the hospital, still, but I actually don't know. How long would one be in the hospital for such an injury?

I'm still rooting for him... 'Cos he was pretty. And he looked good with Elisa. And Morgan just seems a little too old. Anyone know how old he is? He's not on my timeline. (of info collected here)

Marvel> I'm personally not a big fan of Marvel in general, and I didn't much care for the storylines or art in the Marvel comics. But there were neat ideas. The Ninja story was odd, though.

And, as for my non-Gargoyles life, I'm starting college, FINALLY, at the end of January. I'm really excited. :)

Samuel - [AnglOfHellOAOL dot com]
Noodles, anyone?

Count me in as someone else who prefers multi-parters to single issues. It better fits the complexity of the universe.
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75 at gmail dot com]
"Well, did you KNOW it was a dog when you had sex with it?" -Upright Citizens Brigade.

Antiyonder> Greg himself said, at the Gathering, that's he's probably going to stick to multi-part comics. He talked about this at the Blue Mug A Guest.

And, just because Dan Slott does something, doesn't mean Greg is going to do it. I've read Dan Slott's stuff, and honestly, I was not impressed. I don't want "Gargoyles" to be one of those stupid "Adventures" comics that's based on an animated series of a comic book, but dumbed down for a younger readers.

Greg Bishansky - [<---- The 11th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"They spent so much time looking at Janet Jackson's tit, I actually thought Osama bin Laden was hiding in it." - Lewis Black

Thanks for the comic site, Vinnie. I'm definately going to keep an eye out for a set on ebay.
Antiyonder - [antiyonder at yahoo dot com]

Again, that's because they had to (re)introduce the main cast to us. Future issues won't have as much to reintroduced. Just like X-Men 2 was better than the first, because they got to jump straight into the story.

I hope didn't come off as bashing your opinion. I'm just thinking we should let issue 3 speak for the upcoming issues. As for the reason single issues are seldom done is because it's a guaranteed way to get readers coming back for more. Titles like Teen Titans Go and Spider-Girl prove the one issue format can work.

Dan Slott even had a way to tell single issue stories (Batman Adventures) and still have a story arc. That is to use subtlety on the subplots. I imagine Greg might try the same.

Antiyonder - [antiyonder at yahoo dot com]

Yeah, but there's not as much space in 22 pages to tell a story as complex as what we have come to expect from "Gargoyles".

It took two issues to re-tell "The Journey" for example, and I'd rather not see stories get condensed just to fit a single issue.

I read a lot of comics, and very rarely do you ever see single issue stories anymore. Some lament this, but I enjoy allowing stories more time to develop.

Greg Bishansky - [<---- The 11th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"I just love it when every thing goes according to plan. Heh heh heh Ha ha ha ha ha ha!" - Thailog

Greg B: <I'm not expecting any single issue stories in the comic.>

Well, one of the endearing qualities about the cartoon was that even though it usually told a story in half an hour (single episodes, I mean, not the multiparters), it was always part of a greater tapestry. And as far as comics are concerned, I actually think the medium would make it easier for multipart stories. Of course, you're more experienced with comics than I am, so you'd probably know better than me.

And as far as Thailog is concerned... yeah, I was honestly expecting to see Brooklyn's family before him. Can't wait to see how his surviving gets revealed to the clan.

Ed: <TGS or fanfic is different because it's done lovingly and is a sort of community thing.> Eeeeh, depends on the fanfic. I finally read a Demona/Robyn Canmore story out of curiousity, and now I want to find out which portion of my brain the memory is residing in so I can burn that portion out (I might lose a more precious memory in the process, but it's a risk I'm willing to take).

Todd: Has Greg ever said who trained Merlin in the Gargoyles universe? Oberon doesn't strike me as the type who'd be patient enough to be a good teacher, but I've been wrong before.

Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75 at gmail dot com]
"Well, did you KNOW it was a dog when you had sex with it?" -Upright Citizens Brigade.

****Blaise oozes into the Room through the cracks in the wall.**** Back again!

ISSUE #4 PREVIEW> Oh, great--as if it isn't hard enough waiting until issue #3 is out in February, NOW I have to get all excited for the issue AFTER that. The one that won't be out until APRIL!
And it has Thailog! Woo-hoo!
I am curious about the mention that this next story will take us to the White House (outside of the Avalon Tour and flashbacks, it's the farthest any story would take us from New York). Also the mention of "the scattered clan" getting back together in time to save the day leaves me wondering in what way are they scattered?
For that matter, in what way does Elisa break Goliath's heart? Personally, I'm still not sure if it's the "Double Date."
I've said it before, but I don't see anything that indicates this next story to be Greg's "Double Date" story, at least in the way it was presented in "Ask Greg" (as something that takes place AFTER Elisa and Goliath have a discussion and decide they could never have a relationship, and acts as the catalyst that makes them realize they HAVE to be together). As Greg described it, I didn't think it would happen just yet. On the other hand, how he described it--taking place "after years of pussy-footing around"--was how he described it six years ago. He's done some work on the timeline since then. And Greg has always reserved the right to change his mind on any of the things he's revealed in "Ask Greg" that have not yet been "locked in" for an episode (or comic book). So, for all I know this next issue could very well be the "Double Date" in a slightly different form than what was originally described. Of course, I won't know either way for certain until I have read the comic. So, I'll just have to wait until February to know for sure.

MARVEL COMIC> I own five issues, and have read scans of all of them on-line.
The comics had some nice artwork, a mature tone at times (the two-part story telling how Elisa made detective by arresting a man she thought was a serial killer, only to discover in the present day that he was innocent), and were willing to try their hands at interesting characters (some more successful--Lavonne--than others--Dr. Phobos) and stories (the gargoyle worshipping cult of ninjas) while also trying not to contradict anything in the series.
Sadly, there were some shortcomings. Some characters were off-model (long-haired, blonde Bluestone, anyone?) or poorly dressed (anyone remember the checkered suit Owen wore in one issue, or the "surfer gear" the Trio donned?), dialogue was hit or miss ("Prepare for extinction, Demona!"), and despite best intentions, some things did contradict the series (there, no one knew Xanatos owned Gen-U-Tech until METAMORPHOSIS--in the Marvel comic, it was general knowledge since about Issue 1, according to some TV news reporter who was NOT Travis Marshall).
So it's a mixed bag, but I would have liked it to have continued, just to have seen Greg's "Coldstone in the Himilayas" (sp?) story.
Besides, it still beats most of the Disney Adventures comics.

TIMELINE REVELATIONS> Hmmm, if Merlin, was born in the 4th or 5th century...and Oberon and Titania got married AFTER that, but then divorced around 995...y'know, Oberon and Titania have actually been divorced longer than they've been married!

That's it until I have more I need to say. Until then, farewell. ****Blaise takes a deep breath...and inhales himself out of existence.****

Blaise
"Well, it's nothing very special. Try and be nice to people, avoid eating fat, read a good book every now and then, get some walking in, and try and live together in peace and harmony with people of all creeds and nations."--Monty Python's Meaning of Life

Hit submit too soon.

And, hey, if anything, we know that Oberon had to be in charge by the time of the Battle of Camlann, since he was the one who let Arthur sleep in the Hollow Hill, since he owed Merlin a favor.

So, yeah, I'm inclined to think that the war between Oberon and Mab occured between Merlin's birth and Morgana's birth.

Greg Bishansky - [<---- The 11th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"I just love it when every thing goes according to plan. Heh heh heh Ha ha ha ha ha ha!" - Thailog

Well, we do know that Oberon set up the non-interference rule pretty fast after he overthrew Mab.

Okay, not writing off my theory on Morgana just yet. I do like the idea that she's Merlin's half-sister.

Greg Bishansky - [<---- The 11th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"I just love it when every thing goes according to plan. Heh heh heh Ha ha ha ha ha ha!" - Thailog

DPH - According to Greg Weisman, Arthur's final battle and passing to Avalon were in 542. "Dark Ages" was scheduled to begin in 971, when Kenneth II became King of Scotland. So the interim would be a little over four hundred years.
Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!

Greg Weisman's revelation about where Oberon's overthrow of Mab took place on the timeline surprised me as well - and dynamited one of my own theories about Oberon and Mab.

I had the idea that Oberon's overthrow of his mother was connected to an event or trend that some historians and mythological scholars believe happened: originally, humans, it is thought, worshipped a Mother Goddess, but later on, they shifted to the worship of male gods, such as Zeus or Marduk, with myths about how the male god overthrew the Mother Goddess (such as Marduk slaying Tiamat). I had speculated that Oberon's deposing Mab could have given rise to this shift in the Gargoyles Universe, but if it took place after Merlin was born (somewhere in the 5th century A.D., long after this hypothetical shift is said to have taken place), that disposes of that theory.

On the other hand, Greg's mentioned earlier that Oberon let King Arthur sleep on Avalon because he owed Merlin a favor. I wonder if Merlin might have helped Oberon out in the war with Mab, and if that could have been the favor in question.

Morgan le Fay might still just possibly be Oberon and Titania's daughter; we don't know just how long after Merlin's birth Morgan was born (and swapped for Gorlois and Igraine's daughter) or when the war between Uther and Gorlois over Igraine took place; it's possible that Oberon and Mab had their war somewhere between Merlin's birth and Morgan's birth. Merlin's generally depicted in legend and art as middle-aged, at least, at the time of Arthur's conception, so it's possible that there was time enough for Oberon to defeat Mab and marry Titania in the interim.

Incidentally, Greg's revelation also indicates that Oberon wasn't cheating on Titania when he fathered Merlin after all (though that makes the story a bit less amusing, since I've often wondered whether Titania took a less-than-keen attitude towards Merlin, a la Hera's attitude towards Zeus's illegitimate offspring such as Heracles; remember, that was before he banished her from Avalon, and she was less sympathetic towards humans then).

The new revelations about the possible timing of the Oberon-Mab war also raises an interesting possibility. It's been theorized that, in the early 6th century, there was some sort of global cataclysm that helped usher in the Dark Ages (though I don't know if all historians have agreed on this or not). If Oberon's war with Mab was taking place about this time, could the cataclysm have been a side-effect of the war? I find it all the more tempting because of this passage in "A Midsummer Night's Dream", where Titania is talking about the consequences of her and Oberon's quarrel over the little Indian boy:

Therefore the winds, piping to us in vain,
As in revenge, have suck'd up from the sea
Contagious fogs; which, falling in the land,
Hath every pelting river made so proud
That they have overborne their continents.
The ox hath therefore stretch'd his yoke in vain,
The ploughman lost his sweat, and the green corn
Hath rotted ere his youth attain'd a beard.
The fold stands empty in the drowned field,
And crows are fatted with the murrion flock;
The nine men's morris is fill'd up with mud,
And the quaint mazes in the wanton green,
For lack of tread, are undistinguishable.
The human mortals want their winter here;
No night is now with hymn or carol blest.
Therefore the moon (the governess of floods),
Pale in her anger, washes all the air,
That rheumatic diseases do abound.
And thorough this distemperature, we see
The seasons alter: hoary-headed frosts
Fall in the fresh lap of the crimson rose,
And on old Hiems' thin and icy crown
An odorous chaplet of sweet summer buds
Is, as in mockery, set; the spring, the summer,
The childing autumn, angry winter, change
Their wonted liveries; and the mazed world,
By their increase, now knows not which is which.

If Oberon and Titania's marital squabble can cause this much damage, imagine what an actual war over the throne of Avalon must cause!

(Of course, Greg's revelation must also mean that Shakespeare was engaging in an anachronism when he made Oberon and Titania a married couple in Theseus's day.)

Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!

GXB - <I guess, there goes my theory on Morgana's parentage.> As well as my theory that Merlin was bred for war. On the other hand, it does answer some questions. Atlantis's falling had nothing to do with the war between Queen Mab and Oberon.

Todd - Got a question for you. How much time between the end of King Arthur's reign in gargoyles and the start of things in the proposed Dark Ages spinoff?

That gives me ideas for another timeline question, but I'm saving that for later. My copy of issue #2 ordered off the website arrived today.

dph_of_rules
Whatever happenned to simplicity?

I enjoyed some of the Marvel comics.

The one that stood out most was The Blood From Stone one. It started off at a club with Beth Maza getting into trouble with a couple of guys. In the shadows, a vampire was sucking blood from her victim and watches the whole thing unfold. It was a nice touch to include her in the comics, since we hardly see her in the series. And a different side of her. We really don't know Beth well. Here we see her, a person who enjoys her free time and likes to party, but isn't stupid either. Broadway saves her in the end though.

Lavonne was the name of the human/gargoyle/vampire. And her story was when it got a little more adult. And the ending I thought was beautiful.

Much of the dialoge in the Marvel comic was cliche though, but I still enjoyed it.

I had kinda liked Venus, Goliath/Elisa's clone who is technically their daughter, and yet runs into Goliath's arms and kisses him, which made for some awkward humor. But it certainly missed Greg's touch.

The artwork wasn't bad either. Normal Marvel, X-Men like fodder. Certainly not as crisp as it is today with computers and all, but I kinda like the traditional way a lot too.

Siren - [Click my name for Hunter's Moon Trailer!]

Hmm, I wasn't aware that posting some statistics with absolutely no comment regarding any political position, or commentary about individual candidates, would be considered getting into politics. I was just simply making a point as to how "pretty nil" seems rather invalid.
Blaqthourne & Crimson Fury

To be fair, I think Raven would make a great antagonist for an early story. "Hunter's Moon" and "The Journey" are pretty intense and it seems a natural place for a trickster story to blow the cobwebs out. Also, the multi-trickster concept is my favourite of the ones that have been teased for the S3 that never was. But inevitably, #3 won't just be the next story in the series but the first all-new 'canon' story for nearly eleven years.

Jurgan: Thinking about the way we know Greg constructs stories, it actually makes perfect sense for this to be the same story. First new story, the leads front and centre: Goliath and Elisa. We know it's a double-date, so Delilah features. Goliath's ex: Demona. Delilah's ex: Thailog. Thailog & Delilah's monstrous relationship resonates with the theme of Elisa's struggle with the idea of dating across species. Because Elisa and Delilah are prominent, it makes sense that the Labyrinth clan feature. It all flows organically, much as we've seen in Greg's memos for past episodes on Ask Greg.

I hope Thailog's return wasn't the surprise ending to #3 or anything though.

Ed

JURGAN> The cover for issue four, and I don't have my scanner set up yet (I just moved) is featured in Previews. And, it has the faces of the main cast, and Thailog as silver and gold Halloween masks.

Issue 3 takes place on Halloween. This is a multi-part story.

Greg Bishansky - [<---- The 11th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"I just love it when every thing goes according to plan. Heh heh heh Ha ha ha ha ha ha!" - Thailog

I don't see why it "has" to be a mult-part story. That's not saying it won't be- I'm not betting one way or the other- but so far all we know to suggest it is multi-part is that issue four starts by saying Goliath has had his heart broken by Elisa. That presumably occurs at the end of issue 3. But that doesn't mean that issue four is a direct continuation of the same story, just because it references what happened in the last issue. Gargoyles always had good inter-episode continuity, while still making it easy for new viewers to jump onboard.
Jurgan - [jurgan6 at yahoo dot com]
"What? I'm saying I'd rather kiss you than die- it's a compliment!" -Aang, from Avatar: The Last Airbender

Exactly, this has to be a multi-part story. I wouldn't bank on seeing any single issue stories, and that's fine with me. The story should be allowed to breath and not feel rushed. Quality, not quantity and all that jazz.

The solicitation is really pimping Thailog in issue 4, but I would not be surprised to see him in issue 3 as well.

Was I expecting Thailog this soon? No, I wasn't. But I am psyched that we will be seeing him. I'd rather see him at this early stage in the comic than, say, Raven.

And, if Greg is sticking to his plan, Delilah will be in this story as well... as Goliath's date. Now, speculation over who Elisa's date is? Jason or Morgan?

Greg Bishansky - [<---- The 11th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"I just love it when every thing goes according to plan. Heh heh heh Ha ha ha ha ha ha!" - Thailog

I was initially put off by the phrasing "an adventure" suggesting it was something new, but I suspect this is deliberately phrased so it feels like a jump-on point and not 'just' a part 2. I recall reading that comic sales usually drop over the course of multi-part stories until some stunt is used to buck them up. I suppose emphasising the return of a major character like Thailog is what they're banking will prove a unique draw for #4. It will be interesting to see how long these stories run though. A 22-minute script translated into 55 pages of comic. Presumably the stories adapted from Greg's Season 3 plans would translate to 48 or 72 pages. But there aren't the same space restrictions in the comic that there are in a cartoon, and Greg's had a decade to get to know all the characters and stories in more detail than when they were originally conceived. I wonder if it'll be that long before one of these gets played out over 96 or 120. Good for trades.

Also, has anyone heard if Purcell will now also be doing #3? It would be a bit jarring for the artist to switch mid-story.

Jurgan: You're right. Conversely, if they were omnipotent, we'd have no reason to see the White House. They could just be controlling the world from a hotel somewhere. If the Illuminati is exerting control over the White House (and if they're as powerful as they're being billed, it would be astonishing if they didn't manage to sneak a few people in there), that could provide some very interesting dramatic tension.

One final thought on the SLG comic -- three cheers for the return of the Labyrinth clan. Talon is perhaps my favourite of the peripheral cast. 'Her Brother's Keeper', 'Metamorphosis' and 'The Cage' delivered a number of the show's most powerful emotional sucker punches, and 'Kingdom' was obviously a blast. I don't know whether we'll see very much of them, and it's probably best if these early stories concentrate on stories which favour the core cast simply for the benefit of the people we want to hop aboard who haven't necessarily followed the animated series.

Marvel Comics: You know... I got into 'Gargoyles' because of Greg Weisman's writing. While I'd support any 'Gargoyles' product actually out, I don't really find the idea of non-Greg comics all that compelling. TGS or fanfic is different because it's done lovingly and is a sort of community thing.

Ed

So, Greg just revealed that Merlin was conceived before Oberon and Titania were wed, and while Queen Mab still ruled the Fair Folk.

I guess, there goes my theory on Morgana's parentage. I always suspected that she was a daughter of Oberon and Titania, making her Merlin's half sister.

Greg Bishansky - [<---- The 11th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"On second thought, maybe wounding him isn't such a bad idea afterall." - Dr. Franklin

http://avalon.gargoyles-fans.org/ftp/pictures/comics/

Well if anyone would like to follow the link you can decide for yourself what you think of the old comic.

Vinnie - [tpeano29 at hotmail dot com]
Remember the old Gargoyles comics!

Marvel version> I have them, somewhere. Haven't read in years. I think there were a couple issues that stood out to me, but overall I think I read them with some confusion and like taking bad medicine. I really didn't like the last couple issues, what with the Elisa-goyle clone (oh, man I pretty much recoil when I think about her), their attempt to out-Sevarious Sevarious, and not as much humor. The only issue I liked was the one with the artificial vampire girl and Broadway. In hindsight, that may have been the only part they got right.
Asatira

I personally thought the marvel comic was terrible. Dumbed down TGC-esque stories. Xanatos's dialogue in issues 5 and 6 was atrocious.
Greg Bishansky - [<---- The 11th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"On second thought, maybe wounding him isn't such a bad idea afterall." - Dr. Franklin

I'm pretty sure issues 3 and 4 are part of the same story. Goliath had his heart broken by Elisa is mentioned, and we know issue 3 takes place on Halloween, so, this is probably all part of the Halloween Double Date.

I'm not expecting any single issue stories in the comic.

Greg Bishansky - [<---- The 11th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"On second thought, maybe wounding him isn't such a bad idea afterall." - Dr. Franklin

Off-topic> David and I were discussing this morning about finding out how to bid for a future con location.

Can someone help us out? Maybe leave an informative URL for us? Thanks. :)

KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
"Ignore me!" - Venture Bros.

Comic (Marvel) > I have the first nine issues or so, and I enjoyed them. The book also did a fine job of squeezing itself into the show's continuity. There's a real bittersweet Broadway story that I really liked. (Can't remember which issue, so get them all just to be safe.)
Scott Iskow - [smiskow at lycos dot com]

The President doesn't necessarily have to be a member of the Illuminati to work for them. He could equally well be a non-member who's getting periodic messages from the Society telling him to do this or not do this, if he knows what's good for him.

And I'd like to correct my earlier comment about Demona influencing Darth Vader, after discovering that the person who'd asked about this was thinking about the prequels, which came after "Gargoyles", so that it wasn't such a chronological absurdity. (Nevertheless, I very much doubt that George Lucas had "Gargoyles" in mind when he was doing the prequels.)

Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!

Greg B: Hey, it could be a lot worse. People could be doing what Remy Lebeau did in here last week.

Antiyonder: What I'm really looking forward to, going by what the preview for #4 said, is that the continuity in the storyline is back. One of the worst things about TGC (among a veeery long list) was the lack of continuity. Thank god Greg is back.

Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75 at gmail dot com]
"I'm here to eat candy canes and kick ass! And I'm all out of candy canes!" -Kevin Murphy as Santa Claus

In response to #3 dealing with the main story and Demona's appearance in 24 pages, don't forget that #4 will also center on Xanatos and his struggle with The Illuminati.

I imagine issues 1 and 2 was longer, well (re)introductions usually are.

By the way, how good are the Gargoyles Comics from Marvel? I know they aren't canon, but they seemed to be pretty good from some of the reviews I've read.

Antiyonder - [antiyonder at yahoo dot com]

"I hadn't expected the White House to really feature at all, though we know from Matt Bluestone (assuming he's reliable on this) that the president works for the Illuminati."

Keep in mind that Matt Bluestone didn't have a lot of hard evidence on the Illuminati at the time, so his beliefs were likely fueled by paranoia. Certainly the society would be trying to influence governments of all major nations, but that doesn't mean they have their own people in every office. Greg has said that, powerful as they are, they are definitely not omnipotent. Frankly, it'd be kind of boring if they were.

Jurgan - [jurgan6 at yahoo dot com]
"What? I'm saying I'd rather kiss you than die- it's a compliment!" -Aang, from Avatar: The Last Airbender

And once again, just for the illiterate among us.

"not to really go into politics"

Greg Bishansky - [<---- The 11th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"On second thought, maybe wounding him isn't such a bad idea afterall." - Dr. Franklin

Stupid questions in AG> I'm all for smart-ass answers.

1996 Presidential election results:
Popular vote: Clinton 49%, Dole 41%, Perot 8%
Electoral college: Clinton 379, Dole 159, Perot 0
States won: Clinton 31, Dole 19, Perot 0

I'd say 41% of the popular vote is a tad bit better than "pretty nil".

Blaqthourne & Crimson Fury
Music selection: Symphonic Suite Dragon Quest VII

Gorebash: Uh, I don't know if our other messages have gotten through, so I'm dropping you a line here in hopes you will see it. ...We really need that thing fixed over at TGS, as soon as you can manage it. *points at the TGS CR* The sooner the better. : P
Lynati - [Lynati_1 at hotmail dot com]

Hm, a halloween party, breaking and entering, Demona's appearance...can anyone imagine how this story will be told in 24 pages before moving on to the white house? XD
Warcrafter - [grafixfangamer1 at sbcglobal dot net]
Humans are such easy prey for a gargoyle!

Patrick: I try not to think about the prequels. Instead, I focus on just how sweet the beer I'll eventually drink from George Lucas's hollowed-out skull is going to taste.

Hmmm, Gordon Purcell's wiki entry doesn't say if he's related to Steve Purcell. I'm also wondering if this Thailog story will be a multi-parter. Sounds pretty heavy.

Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75 at gmail dot com]
"With claws that rake a furrow red, licensed to mutilate. From warm milk on a lazy day, to dawn patrol on hungry hate. No, the mouse police never sleeps..." -Ian Anderson.

I found something interesting when I picked up my copy of issue 2: Anyone know why the comic, produced by a company based in San Diego, is printed in Canada?

And to answer my question from earlier this week: No panty shots, at least none that I saw. Although there were at least 3 or 4 places where there could have easily been one.

Blaqthourne & Crimson Fury
Music selection: Symphonic Suite Dragon Quest VII

Well, I assume if Clinton lost Gargverse-1996, it wouldn't have been to Dole but to a fictional independent who captured the public mood exquisitely. I don't see it though.

The GWB comment now makes me suspect that the White House plot may not have much to do with the president (at least, not with him onstage).

Ed

Count me as another person who was surprised to see the mention of the White House in the Preview for #4; I didn't think that they were going to be moving the setting outside of Manhattan this early! I was also wondering about who the president would be or if they'd "shoot around it" (I doubt that they'll take the "Earthworm Jim" route and do a "generic president" to keep the comic book from seeming dated).

This talk about George Lucas modelling Darth Vader on Demona reminds me of the people who complain that J. R. R. Tolkien ripped off "Dungeons & Dragons".

I got the latest issue of "Realm (a magazine about British history) in the mail today, and it had an article about Gruoch entitled "The real Lady Macbeth", which pointed out how she wasn't that much like her Shakespearean counterpart. It said that she was noted for her generosity to the Church (she gave land to some monks living at Loch Leven), and accompanied her husband on a pilgrimage to Rome. (The pilgrimage I knew about before I read the article, but not the land grant to the monks.) It also mentioned how her son Lulach (the Luach of "City of Stone") briefly succeeded Macbeth as king before being done in by Canmore, with the comment that since he was nicknamed "Lulach the Fatuous" and "Lulach the Simpleton", maybe it was a good thing for Scotland. (On the other hand, those nicknames of his could have been more of Canmore's propaganda.)

Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!

Yeah, plus, not to really go into politics, but Dole's chances in 1996 were pretty nil to defeat Clinton.

And, there's this old one:


Anonymous writes...

Who is presently the president of the USA in the Gargoyles universe? Is he a member of the Illuminati?
Greg responds...

Presently, to my knowledge, George W. Bush is president.

Greg Bishansky - [<---- The 11th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"On second thought, maybe wounding him isn't such a bad idea afterall." - Dr. Franklin

I'd think Greg would have much more freedom with an original creation and since he can now exercise that freedom in the comic, I'd expect him to go with an original character. In hindsight, this Ask Greg response from some years back may hint in that direction:


Question received on Thu, January 06, 2000 12:55:25 PM
Greg "Xanatos" Bishansky writes...

How close is the world of "Gargoyles" to the real world? When I ask this I mean in the "Gargoyles" universe is Clinton the President. Is Giuliani (sp?) the mayor of NYC? Or would you create your own characters to fill the rolls of important well-known officials?
Greg responds...

I don't know for sure. I avoided that kind of thing so I wouldn't have to decide. I'd tend to lean toward keeping it more real. But if I had a really great story...


Of course, the White House could be featured without showing the president -- Martin Hacker kind of figures. And if the events of "Hunter's Moon" mark the big change in the Gargoylesverse general public compared to the real world, it's entirely possible that Clinton could be the sitting president but not the president-elect in 1996. But even given the timing of the clock tower bombing and the gargoyles revelation, I'm not sure how much of an effect it would have on the electoral landscape. If anything, these sorts of things seem to strengthen the guy in office short-term.

Ed

So, if the President is depicted, think it will be Bill Clinton, or a fictional character?
Greg Bishansky - [<---- The 11th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"On second thought, maybe wounding him isn't such a bad idea afterall." - Dr. Franklin

That makes sense.

The White House comment is what I find the most surprising -- and intriguing. I hadn't expected the White House to really feature at all, though we know from Matt Bluestone (assuming he's reliable on this) that the president works for the Illuminati. I figured it was the sort of thing that the cartoon would find too much of a hot potato to handle, and perhaps that would have been true were the series still animated.

I'd quite like to see the president feature. One of the great joys of the show was its ability to shine a light into the lives of kings and leaders, from the Scottish monarchy to Goliath and Demona as the figurative 'queen' and 'king' of the 'Gargoyles', Xanatos refers to NYC has his etc. It would be elegant to develop a modern political leader much as other monarchs and leaders have been explored.

And it also prompts the question of how the gargoyle issue would have affected people's voting intentions in the 1996 election (if at all).

Ed

ED> I think it does. We know issue 3 takes place on Halloween. And there was a cover image for this issue in Previews, if my scanner weren't in boxes right now, I'd scan it, which depicts the faces of most of the cast as gold and silver Halloween masks.

Plus, the bit about Elisa breaking Goliath's heart fits in with the Halloween Double Date Greg has talked about.

I just think it's awesome that Thailog is back. I wasn't expecting him so soon.

Greg Bishansky - [<---- The 11th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"On second thought, maybe wounding him isn't such a bad idea afterall." - Dr. Franklin

Cheers. His website has some quite nice pencils up for other comics.

I wonder if #4 is a new story. I'd expected the comic to follow the templates of 'Season Three' and so to run with 2 or 3 issues per story for at least the first thirteen stories, but this doesn't sound obviously connected to #3. Oh well, should be fun either way.

Ed

Here's his wikipedia page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gordon_Purcell
Greg Bishansky - [<---- The 11th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"On second thought, maybe wounding him isn't such a bad idea afterall." - Dr. Franklin

So who's Gordon Purcell?
Ed

So, I bought the new issue of Previews, and it had a solicitation for #4 of Gargoyles.

Here it is:

Gargoyles #4
by Greg Weisman & Gordon Purcell

Thailog's back in town! In an adventure that takes us from the Labyrinth to the Eyrie to the White House, the evil clone of Goliath is determined to collect on his debts. Can the scattered clan come together in time to stop Thailog and save Goliath? And does Goliath want to be saved, now that Elisa has broken his heart?
24pgs, FC..............................$3.50

Greg Bishansky - [<---- The 11th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"On second thought, maybe wounding him isn't such a bad idea afterall." - Dr. Franklin

"Every nation, in every region, now has a decision to make. Either you are with us, or you are with the terrorists." - George W. Bush, speech on September 21, 2001.

If you consider all the subtext as a whole, it's pretty clear who George Lucas was paralleling with Vader in the prequels.

Patrick - [<-- The Gathering 2007]

And another question about "when will the rest of the DVDs come out?"
Vaevictis Asmadi

"Boy, I hate stupid questions:"

There are no stupid questions, just stupid people.

Greg Bishansky - [<---- The 11th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"On second thought, maybe wounding him isn't such a bad idea afterall." - Dr. Franklin

Boy, I hate stupid questions:

"Do you think Demona influenced Darth Vader?

What I mean is, do you think when he saw City of Stone it influenced him to make the prequels?

Demona: If you are not my ally then you are my enemy!
Darth Vader: If you're not with me, then you're my enemy!

That line is way to similar to me. Sounds like a homage he thought people would pick up on."

Now, I know Lucas steals (or homages) from everything, but I really doubt he was consciously evoking Gargoyles when making one of the most commonly uttered sentiments in fiction history.

Jurgan - [jurgan6 at yahoo dot com]
"What? I'm saying I'd rather kiss you than die- it's a compliment!" -Aang, from Avatar: The Last Airbender

Sorry for the double post...
I told ya this is what he'd say,lol:

Haley writes...
What day,year,month was Brooklyn born.

Greg responds...
Brooklyn, Lexington & Broadway all hatched in 958 on or about the Spring Equinox... so around March 21st.

Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Cold does not bother us..." -Goliath "Reawakening"

Oh yeah, I should've known that from seeing Dogma. Very cool.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Cold does not bother us..." -Goliath "Reawakening"

Vinnie's name > There's more mythological significance to a name like Grigori, which was the name given to fallen angels. Wikipedia never lies.
Scott Iskow - [smiskow at lycos dot com]

I wonder why Greg changed the name for the comic...?
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Cold does not bother us..." -Goliath "Reawakening"

"He was never given a last name in the cartoon. He was just Vinnie. Greg on ASK GREG gave him the last name, Gregarino... and in the comic it became Grigori."

Hence, why Greg stated that most of what he typed isn't etched in stone.

Antiyonder - [antiyonder at yahoo dot com]

Greg B. can I ask you, what B5 episode is your sig quote from? I don't remember it but it looks like something from a funny situation.
Vaevictis Asmadi

He was never given a last name in the cartoon. He was just Vinnie. Greg on ASK GREG gave him the last name, Gregarino... and in the comic it became Grigori.
Greg Bishansky - [<---- The 11th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"On second thought, maybe wounding him isn't such a bad idea afterall." - Dr. Franklin

Samuel> "In the TV episode of the Journey, wasn't Vinnie's surname Gregorino?"

Actually, it was Gregarino.

But close enough. :P

KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra_582 at hotmail dot com]
"Ignore me!" - Venture Bros.

2 questions left in Ask Greg left from 2005.
Exactly 100 questions until the 1st Gathering 2006 journal, which happens to be mine. Precisely 276 questions until the last Gathering 2006 journal, which ironically also is mine.

As far as renaming Ask Greg, it's like renaming s8.

dph_of_rules
Whatever happenned to simplicity?

Q&A With Greg Weisman sounds nice.

In the TV episode of the Journey, wasn't Vinnie's surname Gregorino?

Samuel - [AnglOfHellOAOL dot com]
Noodles, anyone?

Ask Greg > How about "Q&A with Greg Weisman"?
Scott Iskow - [smiskow at lycos dot com]

How about just changing it to "Ask Greg(Not Ask Jeeves)"?

Sure it's a simple change but sometimes the simple solutions are the best.

Vinnie - [tpeano29 at hotmail dot com]
Remember the old Gargoyles comics!

We can't really re-name the site Ask Greg About Gargoyles, because he worked on other shows, huh? What about Ask Greg About Gargoyles and Other Works?
Vaevictis Asmadi

What is newsarama? (like the webaddress and in general)

:)

Samuel - [AnglOfHellOAOL dot com]
Noodles, anyone?

I started a Gargoyles appreciation thread over at Newsarama, wherein I prompt people curious about Gargoyles to ask questions, and I prompt the fans to answer. I didn't want to just direct people to Ask Greg, because I thought it would be better to get them interacting with other fans, which in turn would be a more effective way to generate a buzz. Let's keep this thread going!
Scott Iskow - [smiskow at lycos dot com]

Yes Demon@, and beyond that fact that making a movie is different from making a book, some directors (like Peter Jackson) go much further and greatly change the personalities of the characters, for no apparent artistic reason.
Vaevictis Asmadi

Warcrafter: all movies based on books or comics are going to disappoint
big fans, because it is diferent to writte a book than making a movie; the autor of a book has no restrictions of space and time and its cheapest than making a movie full of special efects.
And a book would let you creat your own physical version of each character,and your own interpretation, and on a movie you will only be able to see the point of view of someone else.
After seeing the lord of the rings, i always have in mind: "Be carefull it may look like your friend...but its something else" ;)

Demon@ - [dot dot dot and where is the donkey??]

The first thing I woke up to this morning was the sad news that Joseph Barbera of Hanna-Barbera Cartoons passed away. He died of natural causes at the age of 95 with his wife at his side. Tom and Jerry was his first greatest achievement, if I read this correctly.

R.I.P. Mr. Barbera. Thank you for the cartoons.

Renee

Greg: Well, if you're willing to put up with it...
Jurgan - [jurgan6 at yahoo dot com]

I think that the main reason why we keep on getting the "Ask Jeeves"-style questions is because of the title: "Ask Greg". Unfortunately, I don't have any ideas for a more appropriate alternate title, so I suppose that we're just stuck with it until the people learn to pay more attention to the whole site.
Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!

Hmmm, there's actually a few comic reviews in there. It's a holiday mackerel.

Still waiting for mine to ship. I'll be surprised if I get it this year.

Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75 at gmail dot com]
"I'm here to eat candy canes and kick ass! And I'm all out of candy canes!" -Kevin Murphy as Santa Claus

Jurgan - Re: Ask Jeeves type questions. How about this for a solution... we let the questions get through to me, and I make a smart ass remark. It has the virtue of simplicity. And who knows? Once in a blue moon, my smart-ass remarks are funny.
Greg Weisman
Coping with silly questions at ASK GREG since before the turn of the century...

"Todd, some guy Donny Dyche posted an Idea for the double date scenario. At least, it looks to me like an idea."

I don't really think that counts as an original idea. All he said was that he thinks Elisa should go out with Morgan, and since Greg's already said it would be either Morgan or Jason, it's not anything that hasn't already been revealed. The multi-posts are annoying, though- go figure they'd immediately start spamming the site. And I know Greg has said not to delete questions that confuse him with Ask Jeeves, but I honestly can't see why. I guess it's not prohibited by the guidelines, and to prohibit irrelevant questions would require defining what's relevant. How would we do that? It can't just be Gargoyles, since Greg has worked on many other things. We probably can't even limit it to things Greg has worked on, though, since some fans occasionally ask questions like "what did you think of this movie" or "did you ever see so-and-so's version of Shakespeare?" Such questions aren't relevant to the site specifically, but they can be interesting. Maybe we would say that people can't ask factual questions about things not related to Gargoyles or Greg's work, but they can ask his opinions? But now we're getting a bit complicated, and having confusing rules isn't really a good idea. So I'm not sure how exactly we could go about narrowing the rules to eliminate Ask Jeeves style questions. Any ideas?

Jurgan - [jurgan6 at yahoo dot com]
"What? I'm saying I'd rather kiss you than die- it's a compliment!" -Aang, from Avatar: The Last Airbender

*Stops by to just browse* hm, nice to see we are getting along again :)

Nothing really to say except this......if you are planning to see Eragon and you have read the book, you may not want to see it, it may disapoint. You didn't hear it from me.

Warcrafter - [grafixfangamer1 at sbcglobal dot net]
Humans are such easy prey for a gargoyle!

Ask Greg> Todd, do you and/or Gore have enough contact with Greg to see if he'll agree to let you kill the "Ask Jeeves" style questions? It's not fun for him to answer, it's not fun for us to read, it's got nothing to do with the purpose of the site, and it's unlikely to get us any revelations about that 272 page "Gargoyles" history Greg's apparently sitting on.

Comic> Still haven't got mine. We've alternated between too busy and housebound due to holiday shopping and my husband getting a big job. I saw a copy at Newbury Comics but I'm waiting to pick it up at my local store, as they should be holding a copy for me and I want them to continue buying the book. Flipping through it, I didn't notice any great leap forward in the art quality, though closer inspection could still reveal something. I thought the coloring looked a little better, but again, I was just quickly flipping through it. I'm hoping to have my copy and some more polished thoughts on Wednsday, Friday at the latest.

Demonskrye

*sigh* I've ordered the comic from both the slavelabor graphics site and mycomics.com. For some reason, mycomics didn't put my credit card through (and it was supposed to ship today).

And I checked with my order on the slavelabor site and they don't even have any info up.

Anyone else having problems with these sites? I wish there was a comic store around here.

Purplegoldfish - [skydragonn at aol dot com]
visit my garg art and other stuff :)

Todd, some guy Donny Dyche posted an Idea for the double date scenario. At least, it looks to me like an idea.

He also posted about 3 completely random and useless/annoying comments that aren't even questions. Sigh. Do people even bother to read one word of the guidelines?

Vaevictis Asmadi

11 posts in Ask Greg left from 2005.
104 questions in Ask Greg until the 1st gathering 2006 journal.

dph_of_rules
Whatever happenned to simplicity?

Looks like Greg's started to get just a little exasperated about the way that people have been mistaking "Ask Greg" for "Ask Jeeves"....
Todd Jensen
Gargoyles - did for monstrous-looking statues what "Watership Down" did for rabbits!

The mos obvious "upskirt shot" I've ever scene would be in TGC episode "Genisis Undone". During the fight with "Little Anton" you get to see under his loin cloth.
Vinnie - [tpeano29 at hotmail dot com]
Remember the old Gargoyles comics!

I just reported the TGS upload at fanfiction.net. Let's see what comes of it.
Jurgan - [jurgan6 at yahoo dot com]

I saw something like that in another fandom, where someone started posting a very popular author's stories on ff.net without his consent. Write to the admin at ff.net and his account can, and almost certainly will, be revoked.
Jurgan - [jurgan6 at yahoo dot com]
"What? I'm saying I'd rather kiss you than die- it's a compliment!" -Aang, from Avatar: The Last Airbender

Does anyone know who has signed themselves up at fanfiction.net with the handle "TGS" and started posting the TGS Timedancer stories? 'Cause no one has been in touch with the TGS staff to discuss doing this, and it is a little...disconcerting.
Lynati - [Lynati_1 at hotmail dot com]

Juu-ban!!

Speaking of "upskirt" shots, wasn't there a shot of Goliath? I can't think of the episode off hand.
I have yet to get a chance to get to a comic shop. Quick question: Any panty shots? If I'm not mistaken, the only reason we got for the extended delay was due to some art issue. I would laugh if the panty shot in issue 1 actually WAS the reason for the delay.

Blaqthourne & Crimson Fury
Music selection: Furusato encore

ninth, dang I was off this week
Warcrafter - [grafixfangamer1 at sbcglobal dot net]
Humans are such easy prey for a gargoyle!

8th!!
dph_of_rules
Whatever happenned to simplicity?

Seventh!!
The Sadistic Cow
It's me and you against the world. So when do we attack?

Sixth!!
Phoenician - [theoneandonlyphoenician at yahoo dot com]
Pheon

**Sweeps Chameleongirl off her feet**

FIFTH! ^__^

Kythera of Anevern - [kythera (at) gmail dot com]
I do not suffer fools, gladly or otherwise.

Fourth!! :D

*Reserves a spot for Kyt*

Chameleongirl
Chameleon may changer her spots, but she refuses to do plaid.

doh! that was me :)
Ntripy

Third.
BrooklynX

2nd
Anonymous

FIRST!!!
BrooksBabe
"Those aren't tumors, you moron, that's your finger on the lens!"