Comment Room Archive : Gargoyles : Station Eight

I must admit, I'm enjoying the recent additions to Formspring. I've sent some messages to Shari and Merlin due to recent inspirations from playing Quest for Glory II and I'm trying to figure out how to mention the Final Fantasy character Gilgamesh and his obsession with finding Excalibur (along with any other really powerful sowrds) to Arthur and company. I find this interactivity much more interesting than the Twitter Theatre.

I also asked Lunette if she ever played Robot Unicorn Attack. You may all feel free to groan over that bad joke. Personally, I'm tempted to take on Sevarius myself, though I suppose that should be left to the person behind his Twitter account.

Incivis, you forgot Kai - his name means something along the lines of sea, ocean, or just "big water." Interestingly, you could make a case for all of the known Ishimura names being rather tied to Japanese culture as a whole. "Mountain" is certainly important to the culture (Fujiyama, anyone?), most ancient cultures found a lot of significance in the sky, and of course, as far as "big water" goes, it is an island nation. Even the one non-natural Ishimuran name we know of (Katana) is still intimately tied to Japanese culture.
Brainiac - [OSUBrainiac at gmail dot com]
There is balance in all things. Live in symmetry with the world around you. If you must blow things up and steal from those around you, THAT'S WHAT RPGS ARE FOR!
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 9:52:22 pm EDT from 174.101.242.133

Greg B> Yeah, I was thinking of your Edward example, but I thought you should be the one to tell that particular anecdote.

Aldrea> Yes, Ishimura is a good example, in a lot of ways. I've noticed that fans like to turn the Ishimura clan's robes into full-bore kimonos, when kimonos, though fine for human ceremonial purposes, would be difficult for gargoyles to wear because they would be too confining. It doesn't understand the gargoyles' needs.

As to the names of the Ishimuran gargoyles, they still fit the naming conventions in a way, because they might be names used for real Japanese people, but they also translate to simple nouns ("sky", "mountain", etc.), which gives them more of a "found" feel.

In theory, a gargoyle *could* possess a name like "Edward", but this would be much better if it were bestowed by humans and/or the meaning of that name were relevant to the gargoyle.
Incisivis - [incisivis@hotmail.com]
"No live organism can continue for long to exist sanely under conditions of absolute reality--even dragonflies and katydids are supposed, by some, to dream"--Shirley Jackson
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 6:11:53 pm EDT from 96.52.104.202

Greg B > Okay, I can see the rainforest clan (they came from the stones) and the London clan (based on their animals). But what about the Japanese clan? Kai, Yama, Sora; they seem like pretty common Japanese names (especially Sora, I see that one all over the place, for girls and boys). They don't seem terribly unique or like they have any meaning for the gargoyles.

And I agree that Edward is way too human for a gargoyle. Heck, I don't even like really human names for pets; I certainly wouldn't want to give one to a gargoyle.
Aldrea
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 6:01:26 pm EDT from 209.243.38.4

Algeron > The Coldtrio did eventually chose their own names for the most part: Coldstone, Coldsteel, and Coldfire. I certainly like that better than naming them after the Shakespeare characters (though I can totally see how annoying it would be to script them without giving them names).
Aldrea
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 5:57:18 pm EDT from 209.243.38.4

A lot of my issues are being addressed here just fine, thanks Incisivis.

But I remember several years back in the TGS CR, I really offended someone because he asked the room if "Edward" was a good name for a gargoyle, and I said no. I explained why I felt that way, and the individual in question left in a huff.

With the exception of Constance, every name we've had for a gargoyle has clear origins. You know why they have those names. Their names all mean something. They stand for something.
Greg Bishansky - [GBishansky@gmail.com]
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 5:52:35 pm EDT from 68.199.5.105

INCISIVIS> I'd say Gargoyles adopting names is more of a concession to the all too human creators and viewers. I remember Greg saying how hard it was to keep track of the Coldtrio in the scripts until they assigned them behind the scene "names", and it'd be awkward constantly refering to the characters as stuff like "the big green gargoyle". Hudson was totally right about humans, we NEED to name stuff.
Algernon
Man, 2010 was a crazy year. Remember when the monolith turned Jupiter into a star? Good times.
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 5:41:13 pm EDT from 86.40.14.144

Incisivis > We certainly don't want to start seeing gargoyle clothing lines, right? ;)

I guess the Japanese clan is the best example. They've lived next to humans for generations, humans who wear modern clothing, but the gargoyles stick to robes. That's what you mean, right? You don't wouldn't want to see them suddenly wearing jeans and whatnot just because the humans were.

Besides, when it comes to clothes, why would gargoyles want to wear something so form fitting? You'd think they'd want the loseness of robes and loincloths and whatnot for flight and fight. Even Una of London's long dress struck me as a bit odd (except for covering up her legs from human eyes) because I could imagine it getting in the way of her flying.

And I see what you mean by the names. It's one thing to choose a name; it's another to be given it at birth.
Aldrea
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 5:39:17 pm EDT from 209.243.38.4

Aldrea> To be honest, I'm a little disappointed with gargoyles having adopted names so easily. It *does* remove a slight distinct detail from their culture. However, the names usually being derived from locations, Arthurian lore, or simple nouns makes them seem like "chosen" names, and so preserves some of that species background--it's not as bad as it could have been.

A lot of fan fiction, on the other hand, doesn't keep up this trend, and gives gargoyles names that humans would have been assigned from birth, usually without considering how the names' own meanings would have applied to gargoyles.

No one here is saying that a gargoyles' individual interest in human objects is what makes their species into "humans with wings". Lex's interest in technology is part of his character, and not something equally applied to all gargoyles.

When it comes to gargoyles dressing in human clothing, however, fanart treats it as an across-the-board occurrence, without considering the culture or development behind it.

Nashville is different, and easier to accept because he's canon while all the fanart isn't. Individual gargoyles adopting human clothing isn't really a big deal; it's just the conceit that all will adopt human clothing in exactly the same way, and permanently, which is the issuse.

It probably would not be a big deal in-universe to gargoyles if they all got human clothes with holes in them, but visually it's a bit boring for the people watching/reading. It makes the gargoyles just a bit less visually distinct from the humans they live alongside.

If the gargoyles would adopt human clothing, it would be preferable for them to be variations on human clothing that still preserve some distinction. Brooklyn's outfit from Future Tense is a good example, as were Sean Galloway's 2198 designs: they are modern, but not exactly like what humans wear. You can have that, alongside a few gargoyles like Nashville here and there, and many many other takes on gargoyle dress. As in all things, variation is the key.
Incisivis - [incisivis@hotmail.com]
"No live organism can continue for long to exist sanely under conditions of absolute reality"--Shirley Jackson
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 4:51:44 pm EDT from 129.128.81.143

Paul > But you could argue that all clothing, weapons, and armor gargoyles wear are man-made. I don't really believe their huge claws could handle the delicate task of making clothes. Weapons and armor maybe but not clothes.
Aldrea
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 4:15:52 pm EDT from 209.243.38.4

Even Hudson wears what looks to me like a leather jerkin. Of course, he's also one of the few gargoyles to use a man-made weapon, so it makes more sense for him than for any other gargoyle to take up human clothes or armor as well.
Paul - [nampahcfluap@yahoo.com]
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 3:56:29 pm EDT from 204.12.189.116

dph> Yeah, Xanatos hasn't been on any of the Forbes Fictional 15 lists since they started in 2005. I guess he's just not well known enough. The lists have some mainstays, but quite a few are from recent or popular series at the time of release. Only 5 characters have appeared on all the lists, and one of them is Scrooge McDuck.
Supermorff
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 3:53:53 pm EDT from 86.154.101.92

Greg B > What do you consider 'Humans with Wings' fanfic as oppossed to 'Gargoyles'? Nothing I've read has completely tossed away everything about gargoyle culture. I don't see the clothes as taking away from gargoyle cuture or even naming gargoyles, as clans outside of Goliath's began naming their members through the years.

Is Lex less of a gargoyle than any of the others in the clan because he is fascinated by technology and takes to it quite easily?
Aldrea (changing from Garg Girl)
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 2:23:31 pm EDT from 209.243.38.4

Well, on the fanfic discussion all I have to say is that anyone who prefers to write "Humans With Wings" instead of "Gargoyles" has no understand of or respect for the original series.
Greg Bishansky - [GBishansky@gmail.com]
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 2:12:39 pm EDT from 68.199.5.105

What the heck? David Xanatos and/or Xanatos Enterprises didn't make these lists:
http://www.forbes.com/lists/fictional15/2011/forbes-fictional-15.html
http://blogs.forbes.com/michaelnoer/2011/03/11/the-25-largest-fictional-companies/
dph_of_rules
Whatever happened to simplicity?
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 12:04:20 pm EDT from 70.247.72.181

JOSH> I found Greg's BOOM announcement doubly sad, not only does it dash our hopes of getting a Gargoyles comic out of BOOM but it also seems like BOOMS existing Disney comics (such as the excellent Darkwing Duck) might not be long for this world.

At this point, I'd say our best bet is that the commercial and creative success of BOOM's Disney Afternoon books might catch the attention of somebody at Marvel.
Algernon
Man, 2010 was a crazy year. Remember when the monolith turned Jupiter into a star? Good times.
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 11:59:07 am EDT from 86.40.251.11

I'm with Rebel. Sure, for clans that are still somewhat isolated from humans (the clan in the rainforest, for example), I can see that they wouldn't be wearing human clothes. But those who are much to humans...

I don't see their clothes as a huge part of their culture. It would be easy enough to find and adapt human clothes for gargoyles. Really, I figured the only reason the gargoyles in the show/comics kept their original clothes was because (as is typical of cartoons) the characters get one set of clothes and they wear that the rest of the show (like Elisa's red jacket being iconic for her).

Just out of curiosity, Incisivis, what are your thoughts on the gargoyles having names from here on out? That seemed like a huge part of their culture that was tossed out for the human idea of name. I would think you would object to that part of their culture being 'humanized'.
Aldrea (changing from Garg Girl)
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 11:57:32 am EDT from 209.243.38.4

Hello Gargoyles fans,
Greg posted a comment about the issues on publishing comics at BOOM Studios, which is still in Google Cache (sorry, can't hide it!)

Now I have to wonder, why was this removed? Did Greg have second thoughts? Fear of Disney or BOOM?

I was very disappointed when Boom announced there wouldn't be TaleSpin comics (at least Gargoyles got one for a while...) and I now can't wait for Boom Studios to lose the Disney licence, which sounds contradictory, but I don't think Disney/Marvel would release any Disney Afternoon books until the current ones end...

I know I'm dreaming, but could that post removal means there are actually plans for DA comics at Disney/Marvel?
Josh Holloway
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 11:28:26 am EDT from 69.22.172.114

While I don't like seeing Gargoyles wearing human clothes, I don't think it's unrealistic. Look at [SPOILER] Nash. He wears a human T-shirt and a pair of shorts. Very unlike typical Gargoyle clothes. [/SPOILER] And look at the London clan. No, they're not walking around in blue jeans or anything, but they aren't wearing loincloths either.

If we ever get more Gargoyles stories, particularly any stories that show us the Manhattan clan in the distant future, I wouldn't be surprised if at least some of the Gargoyles are wearing human clothing. Not because it is human clothing or because the gargoyle in question thinks it looks cool or anything, but because it is available. I don't think the average gargoyle really cares that much about what he or she is wearing. I think what they care about is whether the clothing fits, whether it is comfortable, whether it is practical, and whether it allows for a full range of movement. A lot of human clothing wouldn't fit all this criteria, but some of it would.

As future children are born to the clan, I find it hard to imagine someone going to buy a sewing machine, a bolt of old-fashioned leather, and sewing up a bunch of loincloths for the kids just for tradition's sake, when they could probably procure some light human clothing and cut tail and wing holes in it fairly easily. For instance I wouldn't be surprised at all if we end up seeing Tachi wearing some of Alex's hand-me-downs. *shrug* Maybe I'm wrong, who knows? Maybe everybody in the Manhattan clan knows how to sew with a needle and thread. But my feeling is that at some point, many Gargoyles will wear human clothes precisely because they aren't preoccupied with fashion. I have a hard time imagining a Gargoyle shunning a pair of shorts or a T-shirt because they "aren't Gargoyle clothes."
Rebel
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 11:27:24 am EDT from 71.77.70.195

ETA: I forgot about Nashville's outfit. His being canon makes all the difference. :P
Incisivis - [incisivis@hotmail.com]
"No live organism can continue for long to exist sanely under conditions of absolute reality--even dragonflies and katydids are supposed, by some, to dream"--Shirley Jackson
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 11:16:43 am EDT from 96.52.104.202

Thank you for your thoughts.

You were right about gargoyle nudity. Garg Wiki is currently down, but search the Ask Greg archive for information pretaining to the "Spell of Humility" to figure out the "in-story" reason why gargoyles wear clothes.

And what I meant by gargoyles "dressing like humans" is *not* the act of wearing clothing, but wearing clothing besides the loincloths, robes, light armour, tights, etc. that we normally see in canon. I'm talking about gargoyles in modern human clothing such as jeans, t-shirts, shorts, dresses, skirts, full kimonos, polka-dot boxers, and god knows what else. :P Most fanart seems to depict gargoyles that way, and it doesn't seem plausible that they would all be wearing modern human clothes.
Incisivis - [incisivis@hotmail.com]
"No live organism can continue for long to exist sanely under conditions of absolute reality--even dragonflies and katydids are supposed, by some, to dream"--Shirley Jackson
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 11:06:16 am EDT from 96.52.104.202

Incisivis > Just read your LJ post and I agree! Especially with the whole nuclear family thing. That hasn't popped up a lot in the fan fictions I've read but, when it has, it always came across as being considered better than the 'clan raising all the eggs as one family' technique.

The one thing I am questioning is the clothes issue. I always figured that, gargoyles living in such tight knit groups, they would be fine with nudity and that clothes came to them at the insistence of the humans when the two species began to live together. If clothes are already a human invention, I'm not sure what you mean when you seem to dislike the concept of gargoyles wearing clothes.
Garg Girl
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 10:01:50 am EDT from 209.243.38.4

Garg Girl> You read my mind. I've been complaining about this for a long time, and other similar traits applied to fandom. I even wrote a blog post about it: http://incisivis.livejournal.com/461366.html

Basically, yes, it doesn't make sense for a natural feature of the species to be shunned by the rest of its members, especially just for one gender.

It's part of a larger trend where Disney gargoyles are furnished with a lot of human traits, including dressing in human clothing and having nuclear families. I would guess it's probably meant to make the gargoyles easier to relate to, but it's a very weak way to handle them.
Incisivis - [incisivis@hotmail.com]
"No live organism can continue for long to exist sanely under conditions of absolute reality--even dragonflies and katydids are supposed, by some, to dream"--Shirley Jackson
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 9:24:09 am EDT from 96.52.104.202

Yes, that's come up a few times in here, and you're not the only one unhappy about that fanfic trend. You should see what Greg Bishansky has had to say about it (not to mention what he's had to say about fanfics presenting too soft a picture of Demona or Xanatos).
Todd Jensen - [merlyn1@mindspring.com]
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 9:08:28 am EDT from 4.244.210.199

A lot of fanfics I read have female gargoyles with beaks being really selfconcious of their looks. I don't think that's fair. As Greg has said, gargoyles find all aspects of physical traits appealing. Sure, perhaps some gargoyles might favor a certain physical trait appealing (like how some humans have an ideal image of their potential significant others) but I seriously doubt all gargoyles with a more humanoid face consider those with beaks ugly. That would be like writing a story about humans and everyone with blonde hair was considered horribly ugly by everyone else.

It's actually starting to bug me as it seems like such a common trend in gargoyles fanfiction. Thoughts?
Garg Girl
posted @ Sun, Apr 10, 2011 12:16:11 am EDT from 209.243.38.4

While the wiki is down, I'm even more searching for good pictures of Demona's Clan. I especially love the little blue beaked one and "Second". Does anyone have some good screenshots or even fanart of these? I already have some screenshots but not in the best quality.^^
M.
posted @ Sat, Apr 9, 2011 11:12:26 am EDT from 80.187.97.10

I would say that it's generally a mix of both my and Greg B.'s explanations, really. XD

On a more serious note, once the question-asking feature does come back on...Greg W. seems to consider it somewhat draconian, but I honestly don't see a problem with placing a blanket ban on rude or impertinent posts (on pain of deletion), the same way as is done for idea suggestions. If people can't express their complaints to one of the creators of the show in a calm and respectful manner, I fail to see why they should continue to have a largely unobstructed method of direct communication to him.
Masterdramon - [kmc12009@mymail.pomona.edu]
"Wild horses couldn't keep me away..." Mick Jagger of the Rolling Stones
posted @ Fri, Apr 8, 2011 11:55:57 pm EDT from 134.173.88.58

I kind of think Masterdramon's right. Fandom these days runs towards the fanatic way too often and what with the GIFT as "defined" by Penny Arcade, it's just so easy to run into blathering insane devotees on the internet. Personally, I've always been of the opinion that blind devotion to anything, from faith to fandom, does nothing but make one blind to new possibilities...and typically a grade-A jerk to boot.

Amusingly, this kind of thinking about anonymity leading to a loosening of morality/inhibition is further proof that there is nothing new under the sun. Look up the Ring of Gyges and you'll see what I mean.
Brainiac - [OSUBrainiac at gmail dot com]
There is balance in all things. Live in symmetry with the world around you. If you must blow things up and steal from those around you, THAT'S WHAT RPGS ARE FOR!
posted @ Fri, Apr 8, 2011 10:31:11 pm EDT from 174.101.242.133

TODD & MASTERDRAMON> I think of it like this: some people are just assholes.
Greg Bishansky - [GBishansky@gmail.com]
posted @ Fri, Apr 8, 2011 8:57:30 pm EDT from 68.199.5.105

MASTERDRAMON - That could be it. Thank you for your comments. (I hope I'd respond better if I'd seen "Young Justice", since I've seen many - though not all - of the animated series you mentioned. I've only seen a couple of clips from it on YouTube, but they looked impressive - I particularly liked the "date/place" captions, which reminded me a bit of "The X-Files".)
Todd Jensen - [merlyn1@mindspring.com]
posted @ Fri, Apr 8, 2011 8:01:43 pm EDT from 4.244.208.53

Todd: Among other things, I think it has more to do with the much longer and well-regarded legacy of acclaimed DC Comics adaptations in the past. Speaking for myself, "The Spectacular Spider-Man" was the first animated Marvel adaptation that I considered any more than mildly entertaining, whereas DC has "Batman: The Animated Series," "Superman: The Animated Series," "Batman Beyond," "Justice League," "Justice League Unlimited," "Teen Titans," "The Batman," "Batman: The Brave and the Bold," and the ever-increasing line of excellent direct-to-DVD original animated movies under their belt...not to mention Christopher Nolan's groundbreaking live-action films.

Taking a comment like the remarkably rude one that really set Greg W. off today for example, there's an expectation - after seeing Mark Hamill's and Kevin Michael Richardson's and Jeff Bennett's and John DiMaggio's and Jack Nicholson's and Heath Ledger's interpretations of the Clown Prince of Crime (particularly the first and the last) - that the Joker will look "cooler" than the comic artists depicted him. I can understand that view (being a huge fan of all those portrayals as well) even though I don't happen to agree with it, but unfortunately the raised expectations sometimes result in comments that are just plain mean-spirited.

In short, there are far too many fans of older, excellent DC adaptations who are eager to jump over any new interpretation and rant about how it sucks in comparison to what came before, and giving them a carte-blanche invitation to direct those rants directly toward a major showrunner on that new interpretation tends to produce a high level of ugly results in the days of the modern internet.
Masterdramon - [kmc12009@mymail.pomona.edu]
"Wild horses couldn't keep me away..." Mick Jagger of the Rolling Stones
posted @ Fri, Apr 8, 2011 7:56:10 pm EDT from 134.173.88.58

I was sorry to read in Greg's latest answers at "Ask Greg" today that so many of the "Young Justice" questions are rude and belligerent - far more than the "Gargoyles" or "Spectacular Spider-Man" questions. I wondered at first if some of the response came from "Young Justice" being linked to the DC Comics universe, but then I remembered that "The Spectacular Spider-Man" was also based on a major comic book property (Marvel, in this case), without receiving this kind of response. Maybe the DC Comics readers are less willing to accept changes to the property in adaptations than Marvel Comics readers are, but I'm not sure that's it. Whatever the cause, I'm sorry to see it - especially when it's directed at Greg Weisman.
Todd Jensen - [merlyn1@mindspring.com]
posted @ Fri, Apr 8, 2011 7:16:21 pm EDT from 4.244.208.53

Florgeysteve> I like pie.
Greg Bishansky - [GBishansky@gmail.com]
posted @ Fri, Apr 8, 2011 6:27:54 pm EDT from 68.199.5.105

I have an idea for a fan story comic which involves a group of human teenagers who discover that they arereally gargoyles put under a spell by Una as babies. What do you think of that idea?
Florgeysteve - [florgeysteve@yahoo.co.uk]
The wind carries my winged justice.
posted @ Fri, Apr 8, 2011 4:46:49 pm EDT from 81.174.233.149

Ah, a rare Gargoyles secret on LJ's Fandom Secret:
http://community.livejournal.com/fandomsecrets/667603.html
(#4)

Your thoughts on the fan that appears to enjoy fanfiction more than the original material?
Garg Girl
posted @ Fri, Apr 8, 2011 4:38:23 pm EDT from 209.243.38.4

I don't see a reason why Disney shouldn't release S2 vol 2. I refuse to believe the DVDs sold so low, that Disney made a loss of money. Actually this is some quick extra cash Disney could make, even it is not much. But in Disneys mind everything has to be at least a huge 10< million $ project to even being considered for a release.
They just have no idea what to do with Gargoyles:
Live-action or 3D/animated movie? Nice, but where to start? After the SLG comics? This would exclude those who have never seen Gargoyles or read the comics to enjoy it. Retelling the pilot? A ripoff and completely redundant. A new tv series? The tv series of Gargoyles is finished... for Disney. A comic? Yeah please, but Disney is bitchy with SLG and BOOM... Videogame? Would be nice too, but noone has got interest and Disney is likely going to play the license-bitch again...

Maybe there is hope for a 20th anniversary blu-ray release.
And since blu-rays can store more data, they could release the first two seasons on 4 or 5 discs. A blu-ray special edition package with both seasons, a soundtrack CD, the three SLG TPBs and a poster. I'd pay big money for that Disney...
GermanGargoyle
posted @ Fri, Apr 8, 2011 3:48:12 pm EDT from 91.52.90.15

Brainiac> My apologizes.
Anthony Tini
posted @ Fri, Apr 8, 2011 1:13:54 pm EDT from 159.240.11.167

It'll be their second park in China. They are doing it becuase they know, with over 1,000,000,000 people they can make a $#!*-load of money. I don't blame them, but I do hold a grudge that they won't release their properies (like Wingless said)... it's very frustrating. And unless someone, like perhaps SHOUT! Factory were to grab the rights to release the series in a complete series box...
Battle Beast - [Canada]
I DID IT!!! I WATCHED ALL 485 BEST PICTURE NOMINEES IN ONE YEAR!!!
posted @ Fri, Apr 8, 2011 1:07:12 pm EDT from 173.181.81.151

Wow! Quiet week in here.
Just heard Disney has started work on a multi billion dollar theme park in China! You'd think if they could do that, they could see fit to release some of their TV properties on DVD. I'm not just talking Gargs season 2 v.2 here. Where the heck is Aladdin or The Little Mermaid? Boggles the mind-especially considering the popularity of the movie entities connected to those shows. I've never seen a company that has so little clue or care so little about their own properties as Disney. Let's just have them rot in the vaults rather than have them avaialbe to the public on DVD or as MOD DVD or down loadable. It makes no sense.
Wingless
posted @ Fri, Apr 8, 2011 12:57:58 pm EDT from 99.246.10.54

<sigh> Even here I can't escape the constant mangling of my handle...I wonder if this is why DC's Brainiac became evil?
Brainiac - [OSUBrainiac at gmail dot com]
There is balance in all things. Live in symmetry with the world around you. If you must blow things up and steal from those around you, THAT'S WHAT RPGS ARE FOR!
posted @ Fri, Apr 8, 2011 8:22:45 am EDT from 137.183.232.23

Brianiac> I think this post supports you, in a way. (I searched on "iron" and found it on the first page.) http://s8.org/gargoyles/askgreg/search.php?qid=8507
Anthony Tini
posted @ Fri, Apr 8, 2011 12:30:03 am EDT from 70.15.81.119

Well, Greg's recent post about magic's use upon iron made me decide to post about this. Hopefully this will jump-start some conversation around here.

Out of both a desire to understand more about the origins of the Monkey Island series and to better understand the potential of the upcoming fourth Pirates movie, I just finished On Stranger Tides by Tim Powers. Has anyone else read that and noted the connection made within the story between the fall of magic in the Old World and the rise of iron technology could have just as much significance in the Gargoyles canon? Granted, mortal magic doesn't have issues with cold iron (as far as I've seen, at least), but the magic of Oberon's ilk certainly doesn't like its presence. Plus, since it's the development of science and technology (ie "modern" civilization) resulting in the abundance of iron, it adds the element of magic no longer being needed in the grand scheme of things for humanity. There's one section in particular that shows how things are in the mystical world of On Stranger Tides that really made me think of Gargoyles. It discusses how cold iron acts against magic on the same principle as adding brandy to wine in order to get sherry (a fermentation product stopping further fermentation). Basically, the middle of Chapter 23 just felt like it wouldn't be out of place in a Gargoyles tale dealing with why the Oberati and their magic can't stand iron.

The section of note is fairly large (not an entire chapter, but still a few pages), so I don't think I'll be transcribing it here. There's at least a few sources of the text online, but as the book's not public domain, I don't feel comfortable linking to them. Still, a Google search for "On Stranger Tides" and "Chapter Twenty-Three" should turn it up fairly easily for all who are interested.
Brainiac - [OSUBrainiac at gmail dot com]
There is balance in all things. Live in symmetry with the world around you. If you must blow things up and steal from those around you, THAT'S WHAT RPGS ARE FOR!
posted @ Thu, Apr 7, 2011 6:48:58 pm EDT from 174.101.242.133

Anthony> Thanks, I appreciate it!
Chip - [<------The League of Extraordinary Nerds Here!]
"An explanation of cause is not a justification by reason." C. S. Lewis
posted @ Thu, Apr 7, 2011 5:01:09 pm EDT from 96.35.210.85

Chip, e-mail me. I can provide you with the stone picture from #8 today, and I can scan and have you the other one from #9 tomorrow. My e-mail address is on my website.
Anthony Tini
posted @ Thu, Apr 7, 2011 3:51:37 pm EDT from 159.240.11.167

That stinks (about the wiki)

In somewhat related news, I attempted to do some image searches for Lunette, and found absolutely nothing...I was wondering if some kind person with a scanner would be so nice as to upload a pic of her (preferably the picture in the TPB at the end when the Londoners invite Hudson, Lex, CS, and CF to stay with them, but her stone pic in #8 would work too...or both.) Please? I'm attempting a collage of London gargoyles, and she's the only one missing.
Chip - [<------The League of Extraordinary Nerds Here!]
"An explanation of cause is not a justification by reason." C. S. Lewis
posted @ Thu, Apr 7, 2011 2:09:05 pm EDT from 96.35.210.85

Okay, I spoke with our webmaster for GargWiki.

The upshot is this: dracandros.com is using way too much CPU and the site providers want them to upgrade. Unfortunately the package they want them to upgrade to is about $180 a month, way out of either of their budgets. They're looking into some options, and we're discussing ideas.

Hopefully we'll be back soon.
Greg Bishansky - [GBishansky@gmail.com]
posted @ Thu, Apr 7, 2011 1:10:43 pm EDT from 68.199.5.105

Chip 'n' Dale Rescue Rangers #5 is out this week. Here's a preview: http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=preview&id=8235
Landon Thomas - [<- Gargoyles News Twitter Feed]
posted @ Thu, Apr 7, 2011 12:56:32 pm EDT from 128.101.32.234

Thirded?

I'm confused are we doing another countdown?
Matt - [Saint Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Uh, the good news is that his air supply is holding out..." "What's the bad news?" "The bad news is that he isn't breathing." - Vince Pelligrino and Avery Butler, ExoSquad
posted @ Wed, Apr 6, 2011 8:45:07 pm EDT from 99.92.109.252

Seconded.
L.T. Williams
posted @ Wed, Apr 6, 2011 3:54:04 pm EDT from 71.93.81.240

Thank you. I hope this will be solved soon. I already totally miss the wiki.
Anonymous
posted @ Tue, Apr 5, 2011 7:08:11 pm EDT from 80.187.102.23

ANONYMOUS> I contacted our webmaster, and hopefully he'll look into it.
Greg Bishansky - [GBishansky@gmail.com]
posted @ Tue, Apr 5, 2011 6:18:23 pm EDT from 68.199.5.105

Why is GargWiki down?
Anonymous
posted @ Tue, Apr 5, 2011 4:19:21 pm EDT from 80.187.102.23

ANONYMOUS> I suspect Greg might answer this question with a "no comment". I'm by no means an expert on the character. But from what I understand, there's not much difference between Billy and Captain Marvel personality wise, save perhaps for the wisdom of Solomon. Captain Marvel is basically, Billy Batson's idealised image of what an adult should be like.

Of course, how any of this applies to the Billy Batson of Earth-16 is an open question until we see some more of him. It's quite possible the League doesn't know about his secret identity.
Algernon
Man, 2010 was a crazy year. Remember when the monolith turned Jupiter into a star? Good times.
posted @ Tue, Apr 5, 2011 3:49:23 pm EDT from 86.41.129.67

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