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Hey Greg I've recently been re watching Gargoyles and just reached I'll be Met by Moonlight. I noticed that one of the Gargoyles greeting them at the castle in the first two minutes looks a lot like the Creature from the Black Lagoon or Abe Sapien from Hellboy having more fish fin like wings and aquatic features unlike any other Wyvern clan Gargoyle I've seen from the show and comics. So my questions are
1) Is this guy really "Scottish stock" same as the rest of the main Gargoyles?
2)if yes do his features come from some sort of mixed heritage?
3)Could he be related to the Loch Ness clan?
4)Or am I'm just reading too much into a character's design?
It's been a long time since I saw the episode, so I'm not sure who you're referring to. It's possible that a Loch Ness Gargoyle joined the Wyvern Clan generations before the massacre and the laying of the Avalon eggs. But I'd have to see which Gargoyle you're referring to in order to make a judgement.
When Demona had the Phoenix Gate(Vows), why didn't she use it to transport some of the members of her clan to present day Scotland instead of bringing her younger self to the year 994?
How would that suit her one-track-mind plans?
How many gargoyles lived in the Wyvern Clan? Including Demona's Clan and Avalon Clan.
You can't include those two clans, because most weren't ever part of the Wyvern Clan, unless you count eggs. The Wyvern Clan had about 40 gargoyles in it after the Wyvern Split Clan split off.
There's a red gargoyle on the opening credits of the show that looks kinda like Brooklyn. Although I won't asume anything (my headcanons will remain headcanons forever) I was wondering if there's something interesting you can tell us about said gargoyle :)
It's been a while. So... no. Sorry. Not off the top of my head.
I'm working on a paper for my interdisciplinary research class, and the focus is on medievalism in modern media, with topics of our own choosing. I couldn't turn down the opportunity to return to my childhood roots with "Gargoyles"! My topic focuses on why the medieval is used in the show (for instead, instead of antiquity, like Roman times), and how that particular era gave it such success in terms of audience and impact.
If it's no burden to answer, I was wondering:
1. Why was medieval Scotland chosen as the first setting and location for the original gargoyles?
2. Was there any specific appeal, personally or for the purpose of storytelling, that drew you to it?
3. Was it a conscious, debated decision to choose the medieval era and Scotland, or was it more of an intuitive decision that was there from the start?
4. How important has historical accuracy been between the show and comics (on a scale of unnecessary to absolute)?
Thank you in advance!
1. A big part of the reason had to do with suspension of belief. We wanted the characters to speak English, so the audience could understand them. We wanted a European country, because Europe's where the classic tradition/image of Gargoyles sprang from. (We'd explore similar traditions in other countries later in the series.) So if we're looking at English speaking countries in Europe, that narrows it down considerably. Scotland felt like it was more in the hinterlands than England. A rougher/tougher tradition and location, which seemed to fit. Now, of course, I realize that no one was speaking modern English in medieval Scotland, but that's where the suspension comes in. It's just a bit easier to ignore this point in Scotland, then it would have been in, say, France.
2. I'm a Britophile. Love Shakespeare. King Arthur, etc.
3. The even "One Thousand Years Ago..." had it's appeal. The medieval setting and it's statuary seemed to make more sense, fit the tone better, than something classical, like ancient Greece or Rome. And again, the "classic" image of Gargoyles is on medieval churches and castles anyway.
4. Historical accuracy was initially not very important. But it wound up being EXTREMELY important. We found, while researching City of Stone, that - by accident or sheer dumb luck - we had not been inconsistent with the history. From that point on, we strove to be as accurate as possible.
Hi Greg, I have a question about traditional gargoyle culture and lifestyle--that is, their culture/lifestyle as it existed before being exposed to a ton of human interaction and influence. I realize these details likely vary from clan to clan and from century to century, but for instance, the Wyvern clan.
How might the Wyvern clan have lived prior to forming its alliance with the humans who then built the castle? We get some sense of this in the series: communal, leader and second, etc. But:
1. Aside from the rookery, would the area where the clan lived have contained some structures or shelter of any kind that the gargoyles built?
2. Would there be areas designated for certain functions (like, a place where food is prepared and cooked -- assuming they'd cook food), or would the area they occupied be more fluid in how they used it?
3. Did the clan always stay in a certain area, or would they move around at all to different areas, depending on time or year or something?
4. Aside from the leader and second, were there any other specific jobs within the clan, for instance people whose responsibility was the hunt, or would everyone sort of participate in all clan activities?
5. Related to this, in what ways did the clan's lifestyle/behaviors change after they formed the alliance and the castle was built? I imagine, even if the humans were at first very enthusiastic about their new gargoyles allies, there must have been some culture shock (on both of their parts) with having to share the same space and live together.
Thank you for your time!
2. Tend toward the fluid, I'd think. But I'm sure habits become traditions over time.
3. Clan life centered around Wyvern Hill, but they hunted, etc., all around the vicinity.
4. Warriors were also hunters. And every gargoyle was a warrior first, though some had other interests. Desdemona, for example, was spiritual, the closest thing they had to a Warrior-Priestess.
5. I think you can see most of this in our pilot.
After the Wyvern massacre, Goliath sees the remains of a gargoyle on the place where Demona usually perched and thinks its hers. Did another gargoyle take the place she usually took?
Looks like it.
====SPOILERS FROM CLAN-BUILDING 2====
A lot of new faces were seen in Demona's clan in CB2 - and it sounds like some interesting facts were given out about the whole clan's relationships to Wyvern clan members during this last Gathering. So a couple questions:
1) Were all of the Gargates seen in the cell that Demona's Second/True/etc were part of from the Wyvern Split clan?
2) What year were these Gargates born in?
a - Demona's Second's Mate/Sacrifice
b - "Bro" the red Gargoyle Brooklyn spoke with.
c - Brooklyn's bioBrother, seen behind Brook and "Bro"
d - the little Green gargoyle standing next to True.
e - Bronx's parents
3) Was Sacrifice related biologically to any other Gargoyle we've seen from Wyvern? If so which?
4) The little Blue Gargoyle from City of Stone was not seen here (that I found). Where was he?
3. Don't know.
4. Another cell, probably.
My question is in the City of Stone episodes during the Flashbacks with Macbeth and Demona. Demona is shown having her own little clan but where did the other Gargoyles come from if Princess Katharine and The Magus take all the eggs to Avalon?
They came from other Scottish clans, including a clan that had relatively recently spun off from the Wyvern Clan.
If the whole Wyvern Clan survived the massacre and ended up in Manhattan, what would have you named the other members?
Joe Hypothetical. Jane Hypothetical. Hypothetical Doe. Hypothetical Smith. Hypothetical Jones. Jon Hypothetical. Etc.
This day in Gargoyles' Universe History....
Westminster Abbey, built by Edward the Confessor, is consecrated.
David Xanatos, who is scheduled to be released from jail in one week, is contacted by Macbeth, who offers to rid the castle of gargoyles.
Goliath and Tom the Guardian meet at Belvedere Castle in Central Park. Together with Elisa Maza and Bronx, they depart for Avalon, where they are introduced to the grown hatchlings of the Wyvern Clan, including Angela, Gabriel and Boudicca, and reunited with the Magus and Princess Katharine. Meanwhile, a recently transformed Archmage travels back in time...
1. Was the Camelot Clan founded before or after the Gargoyle Nation was established?
2. Was the Camelot Clan founded before or after the new Wyvern Clan?
1. Not saying now.
2. Not saying now.
(I'm sensing a theme. Are you?)
New Wyvern Clan
1. Would the new Wyvern Clan be founded before or after the Gargoyle Nation was established?
2. Have we seen any characters in canon material that will become members of the new Wyvern Clan?
3. Was the new Wyvern Clan founded before or after the Camelot Clan?
1. Not saying now.
2. Not saying now.
3. Not saying now.
This day in Gargoyles' Universe History....
Matt Bluestone meets with Martin Hacker and gets information about Mace Malone's stepson Jack Dane. Later, at the precinct house, Matt realizes that Elisa's lying to him about something. He gives her the opportunity to question Dane with him, but she passes. Meanwhile in Wyvern, Tom hikes to a nearby village and learns from the locals that the castle wasn't demolished, but taken apart and shipped, lock, stock & gargoyle, to Manhattan -- where it was placed at the top of a "skyscraper".
If there r 36 eggs in the avalon clan then how r there 80-100 in the wyvern clan wouldnt that mean that almost every female has to lay an egg. even the ones that have already had 3 eggs? (sorry if i missed something)
Me too. I've answered this before. Check the archives or the comment room.
This day in Gargoyles' Universe History....
Just before dawn, Goliath and Hudson discover that they have been following only a small contingent of Vikings; the rest must be preparing to attack the castle. The two gargoyles turn to stone before they can get back. Simultaneously, Demona nearly warns Othello and Desdemona, but changes her mind as she sees the Vikings approach. Instead, she hides at the foot of Wyvern cliff, where she turns to stone as the sun rises. Hakon attacks. The archers' sabotaged bows are useless, and the Captain opens the main gate, allowing the Vikings to enter Castle Wyvern, which is sacked. The humans, including Katharine, the Magus, Mary and Tom are led away bound. Hakon then sets about to destroy the gargoyles, including Othello, Desdemona, Iago and Hyppolyta. The Captain is "unable" to stop him. When the sun goes down again, Demona awakens to discover that the Wyvern Clan have been massacred. When she sees Goliath and Hudson returning, she cannot face them and flees before they can discover the massacre. The only other survivors seem to be the Trio and Bronx, who were in the Rookery. The survivors head for the Viking camp to take their revenge. When Hakon and the Captain hear the gargoyles approaching, they take Katharine as a hostage. The Magus mistakenly assumes that the Princess is dead. Blaming the gargoyles, he casts a spell on all but Goliath putting them to sleep "until the castle rises above the clouds." Meanwhile, Goliath confronts the Captain and Hakon atop a cliff. He rescues the Princess, and the two villains fall to their deaths. But when Goliath discovers that the rest of his clan has been turned to stone, he asks the Princess to watch over the eggs in the Rookery and asks the Magus to cast his spell one more time. Goliath is turned to stone with the others and placed atop Castle Wyvern. Demona later returns to the castle to find Goliath frozen in stone. She watches the Magus, Tom and Princess Katharine removing the eggs from Wyvern. She departs for good. Katharine dubs Tom the Guardian of the Gargoyle Eggs. Katharine, the Magus, Tom, Mary and the rest of Wyvern's human inhabitants take the eggs and leave the cursed castle to live under the protection of Katharine's uncle, King Kenneth II. Seconds later, three time travelers arrive in 994: the Demona of 1995 has brought the Demona of 975 along with the Goliath of 1995 to see the results of the massacre. But the 1995 Demona fails to convince the 975 Demona to take up her evil cause. The time travelers depart, returning to 975.
Xanatos proposes to Fox and gives her the Eye of Odin as an engagement gift. She accepts both his proposal and the Eye. Alexander Fox Xanatos is most likely conceived on this night.
This day in Gargoyles' Universe History....
Arthur is crowned King of Britain.
Hakon the Viking lays siege to Castle Wyvern, but is driven away by the Wyvern Clan of gargoyles. The Captain of the Guard invites Goliath and Demona to the celebratory feast. Princess Katharine is most seriously displeased. She demotes the Captain, declaring that from now on he will report to the Magus, who later prepares a spell to deal with the gargoyle clan, should they get out of hand. Seeing that Goliath will continue to tolerate human prejudice, Demona and the Captain find an excuse to temporarily lure the gargoyles away, so that the castle can be sacked and the humans taken away by Hakon, leaving Castle Wyvern to the gargoyles once more.
Michaelmas. Constantine III is so furious he initiates a plan to destroy all the gargoyles in Scotland.
Macbeth is made High King of Scotland. He swears on the Stone of Destiny, to protect Scotland and serve her people. Macbeth names Demona and publicly rewards her and her gargoyles, welcoming them as his allies into his home and castle. Demona becomes his primary advisor. Thorfinn is rewarded with basic autonomy over Orkney, in practice if not in name.
Xanatos inspects his castle atop the Eyrie Building. He wants everything to be perfect before he attempts to wake the gargoyles.
Question about the gargoyle clans
You have said the Wyvern Clan was about 80, before it split, when the last rookery was laid. Is that 80 adults, or 80 total members, including children?
The reason I ask is this: that last rookery was 36 eggs, which means there were 72 gargoyles and garg-beasts of egg-laying age. If 72 of the 80 clan members were of egg-laying age, then ALL the children and older gargoyles in the entire clan (like Hudson and the Trio) only added up to 8 at that time. This seems very strange to me. Did something happen to them?
I know that you don't like numbers questions, but this seems important.
80 total members including children, but not including eggs. Having said that, it's really just a rough estimate that I will not be held to later. You're assuming that none of the 72 are dead. They ALL led a violent life in a dangerous time.
A few weeks ago, we had a discussion in the s8 cr about the size of gargoyle clans and what would/might constitute a full gargoyle clan.
1)Do you have a formal definition of what a full gargoyle clan is (in terms of size and/or egg laying capacity)?
1a)If so, would you share that definition with us?
I have no fixed definition, as location and resources define the appropriate size of any clan. So the "definition" would differ from place to place.
I think I've said in the past, that in Wyvern in the tenth century, a normal clan ranges from about 40-80 individuals (not including eggs).
Hi Greg. It's great to see Gargoyles back. Anyway, I have a question about when the Wyvern Clan split between 988 and 994. What I would like to know is why didn't the departing Gargoyles take any of the eggs with them? The new clan would have missed out on an entire generation of the clan. Or did they do something like take more of Bronx's generation(978) with them? I guess that would make sense. Thanks.
The why had to do with the difficulty of establishing a new rookery. Otherwise, I think you answered your own question.
What happened to the young gargoyles that were of Bronx generation? were they killed in the massacer or did they survive?
Greg Weisman says:
There were a lot of gargoyles you didn't see. Kids. Females. Beasts. We couldn't show them all, and frankly, I don't think they would have let us show the kids. Eight year olds getting massacred is a pretty tough thing to put into an afternoon cartoon show. To be honest, that wasn't an envelope I even thought to push.
You mentioned that the Wyvern Clan was created mostly from members of the Manhatten clan, who are themselves decended from the old Wyvern Clan. Does this mean that we would meet more survivors from the clan as the series progressed?
No, that's not what it means.
Where the young Gargoyles (Bronx's generation) of the Wyvern clan killed by Hakon and his vikings as well? Or did they somehow escape?
All that were there were killed except the guys you know about.
I am new to the Gargoyle World and just have one question. Who are the named members of Wyvern Clan. (I told you I was new). I have been trying to get them all straight but there are relations and mates and...yeah...You have probably answered this question a million times, but I do not want to search 1,000 questions about them.
Okay, so here I am, for some reason, rewarding your laziness...
The thing to keep in mind is that with the exception of Goliath, the Wyvern Clan had no names. But using names we NOW know them by...
There are others of course that you can spot in footage whose names we still don't know.
The Wyvern Clan generated three other clans: the Manhattan Clan, the Avalon Clan and the Labyrinth Clan.
And in the future a new Wyvern Clan will be founded.
Was the destruction of the other clans by humans, around the time of the Wyvern massacre, organized or just a "good" idea catching on?
I still get chills (and angry at Hakon and the Captain) when I watch that scene and hear the stone crumbling...
Just to be clear, I never wanted to give the impression that all over the world clans were being destroyed at the exact same time. But the mid to late Middle Ages were a dangerous time for gargoyles. But I'm sure some clans were destroyed centuries before the Wyvern Massacre and some clans were destroyed centuries after, and as we know some clans survived.