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Was the inclusion of the Scroll of Thoth in "Grief" a references to the Conan stories/Cthulhu Mythos?
Not that I know of. Thoth is an Egyptian diety. We were doing an ep set in Egypt.
In the Gargoyles Universe, the fay are vulnerable to cold iron. Now, the obvious reasons for this are: a) they needed some sort of "kryptonite" to keep them from unbalancing things, and b) it's a traditional part of faerie mythology (and I'd read about that problem of theirs with cold iron long before "Gargoyles" came out, and even used it in an Arthurian fantasy novel that I'm still writing). But, did you ever develop a "within-the-story" rationale for why iron has such a drastic effect upon Oberon's Children?Odin got swallowed by the fenrir wolf in Ragnarvak. Can you tell us how he survived?
dial-72.max1.ken.cyberlynk.netNot right now.
You've indicated that many of the Greek gods (though not all of them) were "New Olympians" - well, before they became *New* Olympians. Now, the Greek gods were particularly noted for their humanlike appearance, especially in contrast with such cases as the animal-headed gods of ancient Egypt (such as Anubis) or the multi-armed gods of India. They all looked like normal humans (if better-looking, with the exception of Hephaestus), and were depicted thus in classical art.
The New Olympians, on the other hand, nearly all seem to have a not-fully-human appearance, fitting more into the category of the animal/human hybrids such as minotaurs, centaurs, sphinxes, echidnae, and other such beings of the Greek myths. The only one of them that looked human all the way was Proteus in his regular form. So, were the Greek gods of Olympus less anthropomorphic in the Gargoyles Universe than the artistic depictions of them by Phidias and the rest claim? Or are there more "human-appearing" New Olympians out there that we didn't get to see during the episode? (Given that the New Olympians only showed up in one episode of the series, that does seem quite possible, I'll admit; there wouldn't have been that much time to introduce them).
Jove is very humanesque. And aside from the flaming 'do, so is Helios. And except for the wings, so is Boreas. It's a pretty big mix.
But also, I never said ALL of the Greek gods were pre-New New Olympians. Some of them were Children of Mab.
You'd said that Oberon does have siblings... A brother, a sister or both? And would he/she/they be characters from mythology or original characters?
Btw, do you plan to add any member of the third race which hasn't be seen in Mythology/Shakespeare/literature, but who is fully your own creation?
I'm certainly not beyond creating original characters. But that would be a second choice. If the goal is to include all that's out there, I've still got a lot of "characters" to cover before I need to start adding my own.
You recently said that you believed that most of the events in Norse mythology took place before Oberon passed his non-intervention edict. Actually, I can't help wondering myself, as something of a Norse mythology buff, how much difference that the edict would have made where the traditional events in the Aesir's lives were concerned, since most of the stories about them don't portray them as interacting with mortals, but rather with their traditional frost giant enemies (especially in the case of Thor) and the frost giants' monster-allies such as the Fenris-wolf and the Midgard Serpent. Odin's the only one of the Norse gods who really struck me as much of a "meddler" in mortal affairs (as in his deciding which side would win a battle, and often having the better warriors lose so that they would go to Valhalla and he could have them in his army come Ragnarok). So would Oberon's Law have really put that much of a cramp in the Aesir's legendary deeds?
Maybe not. As usual, I'd have to take things case-by-case.
Greg, did Oberon erase every obvious trace of his presence in New York during the Gathering. I imagine he would show up on a few video surviellance cameras or in real time photos from overhead satellites.
No. I doubt he bothered.
In "Ill Met By Moonlight" Oberon mentioned that he too spent the millennium with the mortals. Since I'm sure a question about what he did would be one of those "novel length responses", was anything he did significant with regard to the master plan (i.e. something we would have seen eventually)?
Whats the deal with the aging thingy for children of oberon, like gargoyles, it takes them twice as long than a human or something like that. so like how many years would it take for oberons children to grow up to be like a teanager maybe?
Since they have complete control over their appearance, discussing their "age" is rather moot.
Is there 'prophecy' in the Gargoyles universe? So far all the pieces of prophecy we've seen are either related to time-travel (Archmage, etc), or are ambiguous in nature (Weird Sisters in 'City of Stone', Puck in 'Future Tense').
Were the Weird Sisters (for example) making a true prophecy concerning Macbeth and Duncan, or simply saying something and then manipulating events so that it took place?
And was Puck aware that parts of his 'dream' would indeed take place (other than Alex's name ofcourse which he could have been informed of as Owen)?
Paragraph one, I don't understand.
Paragraph two, both.
Paragraph three, both.
If you had enough episodes, would you have eventually have written in The Jewish-Christian God? If so, how would you have explained how Annibus was lord of the dead. (He would be a false god, according to Christians and Jews)
I honestly don't know. But keep in mind, Anubis never claimed to be a god.
And I'd tend to leave the big G above the fray. He works in mysterious ways after all.
Is there any logical reason that Owen did not include a giant iron bell in the castle defenses? I know this would have ruined the drama of the battle. But it is hard to accept the fact that it never occured to any of the defenders during the battle with Oberon.
I'm not sure that the bell solution is that obvious to Owen. I think it was very clever of Titania to come up with something that generally a fae would have little interest in exploring.
And where would Goliath and Angela found a big iron bell?
In Walkabout, would Titania have revealed herself and magically intervened if Goliath and Dingo had failed to reason with Matrix?
What could Titania have done against Matrix?
I started to wonder about the 'Future Tense' episode...
1. What would have happened if Goliath had indeed given Puck the gate? After all he was dreaming the whole thing - would the real-life gate have just disappeared and been taken by Puck or something? Goliath waking up and finding it missing?
2. That thing about Puck not being able to take the gate, he having to be given it - is that again a law of Oberon's or something inherent in the nature of the Gate and/or fae?
3. And if the former, why when in other cases the fae could use just any flimsy excuse to bend Oberon's law, this one was so strictly interpreted that even 'Here you have it, take the gate' wasn't sufficient for Puck to take it?
1. Goliath would have physically taken the Gate from his pouch, held it out and let go. Puck would appear to take it. All very real. But it didn't happen.
2. It's a law, but I don't know if it's Oberon's law.
3. I'm not sure that their excuses were that flimsy. We always made an effort to bend the laws with a real rationale.
I was thinking about the Weird Sisters- I know artistic lisence is used all the time with characters, so I was wondering about these Three... In City of Stone, they come off as gentle guiders in Demona's life and remind Goliath of his own ideals... but in Avalon, they are nearly as bad as Demona in their thirst for vengeance. Though not nearly as violent, they make a pact with a sorceror (something they initially swore they wouldn't do) only in order to have revenge against the Magus and the others. This sounds a little contradictory of their characters. What I was wondering is: which is their real personality? Are they more like the Fates of Greek mythology who spin, measure and cut the thread of mortals' lives, or was their power exaggerated by human myth and, in fact, they're only typical, magical beings like Puck or Odin are? I suppose I'm asking how much power they really have...
I also wanted to say how much I love the show and hope that it'll come back some day... in any form. With the maddening popularity of shows like Mutant Turtles, it's refreshing to have an intelligent series like gargoyles to obsess over!
The Sisters are complex and have many aspects, not all of which have been revealed or conflated yet.
They're not quite as powerful (and/or powerless) as the mythological fates, but they have that aspect.
There was obvioulsy an ulterior motive to their actions in CITY OF STONE. But there may have also been an ulterior motive to their actions in AVALON as well.
A fresh effort to do the eight Arthurian survivors correctly.
1. King Arthur
3. The Lady of the Lake
4. Sir Percival
6. Morgan le Fay
8. The Green Knight (the one whom Gawain had that encounter with)
Thank you. Come again.
No, wait! Eight points. Eight out of eight. FINALLY, A WINNER! And Todd, I have to admit, I'm kinda glad it's you, since you've been the most dedicated to exploring the Arthurian angle here in ASK GREG.
As to the speculation of how they survived, well, I was gonna make another contest out of it, but I realized it would violate my NO IDEAS policy, so...
1. King Arthur Pendragon. Slept under a spell in the Hollow Hill.
2. Merlin. Son of Oberon by a mortal woman. Imprisoned in the Crystal Cave.
3. The Lady of the Lake. One of the Oberati.
4. Sir Percival. The Fisher King. Mr. Duval. Founder of the Illuminati. Spends a lot of time in Castle Carbonek, a sort of mini-traveling-Avalon, where time passes differently. Also uses the Holy Grail to maintain his youth, though at a very real physical cost, due to his, shall we say, sins.
5. Lady Blanchefleur. Percival's wife. Queen of Castle Carbonek. She lives there and uses the Grail. The only cost being her estrangement from Percival.
6. Morgana le Fay. A changling in the old-fashioned sense.
7. Nimue. A sorceress with connections to Merlin, the Oberati and Morgana. (Think about it.)
8. The Green Knight. An Oberati.
Anyway, the above revelations are a gift I'm giving all of you on Todd's behalf. Thank him. Todd, to claim your prize, have Gore or DemonaCrzy forward your e-mail address to me.
<Stares> There's quite a little more than the usual kind of questioning over here, isn't there? More of a discussion. Interesting... But rather than the 'shake up' commentary most are talking about, let me add my opinion on something different that was mentioned by Todd -- namely about Oberon (a fay) ruling over gods such as Odin.
On the whole I'd say that I have no problem with it - on the other hand I would have a bit of a problem if a god from a specific pantheon were to rule over all others - it might almost seem to imply that the specific pantheon and culture was more important than that of others. (I'd find it far more difficult to accept a universe where Zeus was superior to Odin for example...) Oberon and Titania from their beginnings in Shakespeare seemed more universal characters than any single mythological one; they were characters seemingly from Britain (Robin Goodfellow for example...) passing through Greece and discussing about events of India...
I agree. It was one of the reasons that I made Oberon & Titania's skin Blue and Green. I didn't want to imply that white "godlings" ruled the others.
Hi Greg! Ditto what Jenna just said. I'm going to try to insert a question in here, tho'. Did the third race create Avalon, or did Avalon create the third race? If this question is hard to answer, could you tell me which appeared first? Thanks!
It's not quite that cut and dry... One didn't create the other.
One thing that I'm going to confess here, and it's that I'm still feeling somewhat taken aback at the discovery that the mythological gods in the Gargoyles Universe are subject to Oberon, a "mere" faerie king (though don't tell him that I called him that :) In traditional legend, Oberon wasn't a divinity, so seeing him have authority over gods like Odin feels a little strange to me still. It's like seeing an earl giving orders to a king. I know that in the Gargoyles Universe, Oberon does outrank the gods of mythology and that they were really "just" powerful faerie-folk, but it does feel a little odd to me all the same.
That is... an absolutely SHOCKING confession.
Look, I knew it was going to be controversial (relatively speaking). Frank Paur wasn't particularly comfortable with the idea, but I'm a fast talker.
The main motivation was that I wanted the Garg Universe to have a certain cohesion. I wanted it to be rich and expansive, but not completely arbitrary. So after a bit of tease and mystery, we reveal a feudal system.
And Oberon's lack of shall we say, press, didn't bother me. He was the big man behind the scenes. And although he's not exactly Mr. Maturity, I don't think that bothered him.
And of course, he did have at least one spectacular press agent. Guy named Will.
In Grief, the Emir used a spell (the Scroll of Thoth) to become the Avatar (eventually). Since Anubis is a Child of Oberon, are there any spells out there that could turn someone into an avatar for Oberon, Puck, Titania, or any of the other Children? Or, is it possible for someone to force one of the Children to do what Anubis did?
Thanks for your time.
Sure, it's possible.
I was wondering what Oberon did with himself during the thousand-year-long banishment? He obviously wasn't on Avalon because that's where Katherine, Tom, Magus and the eggs were... but he also seemed *completely* naive of the modern world- like when Xanatos or Elisa pulled their respective guns on him- he acted like he'd never seen such things before. Not to mention his comment in The Gathering, "Interesting what these mortals can acheive with their 'science'."
I think there's a big difference between his reaction to Elisa's gun and Xanatos'. With Elisa, he was reacting to the iron content in the weapon. With Xanatos, he was curious about its futuristic look and nature.
Likewise, I don't think Oberon had had much exposure to force fields. Have you?
I think Oberon was out and about all those years. He knew the modern world. But not everything about it.
Have Oberon and Titania ever been worshipped as gods, the same way other members of their race have? Shakespeare implies that Titania atleast was worshipped in India (not to mention that her name seems to imply that she was also worshipped in Ancient Greece and considered a Titan)...
Yeah, probably. But I haven't worked out their entire (very long) bios. Just pieces here and there.
Have the fay/gods sought and supported their worship from human, or is it something that just happened, but they never really cared about?
My guess is that it's different from case to case: if so, how about the gods we've seen in the series: Odin, Anubis, Banshee (I believe that Banshee was never "worshipped" exactly under that name, but her alternate form as Cromm Cruach (sp?) was; and -if Todd's correct in his guide- its worship was considered dangerous)
Case to case, definitely.
And Aris, I apologize, but it's late at night, and I just don't have the energy to run it down for each of those characters right now. Ask me again about them individually and I'll give it a shot.
Hi, I'm back with yet another Puck question, sorry I didn't get it in my early post.
1) In "The Gathering" Oberon seemed very upset that Puck didn't come, and even went so far as to go look for him himself instead of sending the Weird Sisters. Is there a reason for this? And would that reason be why he recieved such a harsh punishment?
2) I guess the first question really led to this one, are Titania and/or Oberon, Puck's parents?
1. Puck was Oberon's personal man-servant. Oberon considered Puck's disobedience a very personal betrayal.
Hi, this is the first time I've asked a question, so ignore me if I seem to babble a bit.
I'm a big Puck/Owen fan so my questions have to do with him.
1)Seeing as you really never got the chance to use the Puck/Owen thing much, I was wondering if you would have used this angle more later? (Did that make sense?)
2) In the "The Mirror", Demona mentioned that Puck had served the human (I think that was it), now he would serve her. Is this maybe a reference to Puck serving Shakespear?
(I only say Shakespear because thatr's the work he first appeared in right?)
3) I've long believed that Puck and Owen are one in the same. Owen being the tricksters more serious side. However I have also talked to people who thought Puck was a seperate personality from Owen's own and vice versa. Which is true?
4) In "The Gathering" Oberon didn't seem to know Puck was Owen. Is that an indication that Puck had made his "mask" so well even Oberon himself couldn't see through it?
All for now and it's been nice ummm...typing to you?
1. Yes and yes.
2. No. Xanatos.
4. I suppose. But Oberon wasn't focusing either.
Nice typing back...
1. Would Oberon's Mirror work for doing the same sorts of magicks as Titania's (specifically the spell Demona used in "The Mirror" to summon Puck)?
2. If yes, then why did not Oberon simply yank Puck back through his mirror in "The Gathering pt1" instead of going after him?
2. Oberon does what he wants.