A Station Eight Fan Web Site
So the #Gargoyles20 U.S. Tour continues. Stop #3 is CONvergence in Minneapolis, Minnesota. (Well, actually in Bloomington, Minnesota, but close enough.) http://www.convergence-con.org
This is a big one for us. It includes a number of events that we used to do at the old Gathering of the Gargoyles Conventions, which ran from 1997-2009. And I know a bunch of Gargoyles fans will be attending, so it'll also be a reunion of sorts.
My schedule for the long weekend is quite packed - which is just how I like it!
THURSDAY, JULY 3, 2014
2:00pm - 3:00pm GARGOYLES RADIO PLAY AUDITIONS
Ever wanted to be in a radio play? Now is your chance! We are holding auditions for a live performance at CONvergence! You don't even have to be a fan of Gargoyles to enter. You just have to know how to read! Casting: Myself and Jennifer Anderson (Talent Coordinator on The Spectacular Spider-Man and Young Justice). Casting decisions will be posted by 7:00pm on Friday, July 4th. ATRIUM 7.
3:30pm - 4:30pm BUFFYVERSE TEN YEAR ANNIVERSARY
Okay, so Gargoyles ISN'T the only show celebrating an anniversary. The Buffy/Angel universe has been off the air for ten years. Let's reminisce and talk about the impact these shows have had on TV fantasy since their cancellation. Panelists: Myself, Tim Lieder, Cetius d'Raven, Madeleine Rowe, Mark Goldberg. EDINA.
7:00pm - 8:00pm OPENING CEREMONY
If it's not exactly a magical invocation, it is nonetheless our official kick-off for the convention! Join CONvergence mascot Connie as we welcome our Guests of Honor, give out some awards (including the Mark Time and Ogle winners), and get this party started. Panelists: Myself, Amy Berg, Emma Bull, C. Robert Cargill, Sarah Clemens, Scott Lynch, Marina Sirtis, Frank Paur, Matthew Ebel, Dawn Krosnowski, Greg Guler, Rob Callahan, Windy Bowlsby, Michael Lee. MAIN STAGE.
9:00pm - 10:00pm GREG WEISMAN'S FANCY BASTARD PIE COMPETITION
Geek Partnership Society is excited to host the Greg Weisman Fancy Bastard Pie Competition at CONvergence 2014! It is open to all CONvergence members who wish to participate. The goal is to make a pie that Greg Weisman, herein to be known as "Fancy Bastard", likes best. The winner will be told super-secret Young Justice spoilers. Find out [some of] what would have happened in Season 3! (But winner must swear to secrecy to claim prize.) See below for some helpful hints.* CABANA 110.
FRIDAY, JULY 4th, 2014
11:00am - 12:00pm GARGOYLES RADIO PLAY AUDITIONS
Ever wanted to be in a radio play? Now is your chance! We are holding auditions for a live performance at CONvergence! You don't even have to be a fan of Gargoyles to enter. You just have to know how to read! Last chance to audition! Casting: Myself and Jennifer Anderson (Talent Coordinator on The Spectacular Spider-Man and Young Justice). Casting decisions will be posted by 7:00pm on Friday, July 4th. ATRIUM 7.
12:30pm - 1:30pm FROM TV TO COMICS
We'll discuss the TV shows that expanded into the comicverse, such as Buffy, Smallville, Young Justice and Gargoyles. Did they succeed? Were any of the comics improvements on the shows? How did canon change during the transition? Panelists: Myself (Gargoyles, Young Justice), Shawn van Briesen, Jonathan Palmer, Greg Guler (Gargoyles), Karine Charlebois (Gargoyles, Bad Guys), Christopher Jones (Batman Strikes, Young Justice, Bad Guys). PLAZA 2.
2:00pm - 3:00pm SIGNING
Myself, Christopher Jones (Young Justice, The Batman Strikes, Parallel Man) and Greg Guler (Gargoyles, Phineas and Ferb) will be holding a signing session. Both Chris and Greg always have an array of stuff (books, prints, etc.) to sell and sign. But this time I'm pretty darn prepared as well. First off, I'll be selling and signing copies of my first novel RAIN OF THE GHOSTS for $10 cash, which includes the book, a personalized signature and signed copies of the original development character designs by Kuni Tomita for the television version of Rain that never was. In addition - and by popular demand - I am selling and signing an array of my animation teleplays for $20 cash from such series as Gargoyles, Team Atlantis, DC Showcase (Green Arrow), Men in Black: The Series, The Spectacular Spider-Man, The Batman, Batman: The Brave and the Bold, Roughnecks: Starship Troopers Chronicles, W.I.T.C.H., Young Justice and even the 2009 Radio Play "The Spectacular Spider-Man Meets Gargoyles". I'll also sign anything else you bring and put in front of me for FREE - especially if you buy my book. ;) CONVERGENCE CENTRAL.
3:30pm - 4:30pm CREATING GARGOYLES
This is what we used to call (at the Gathering) the Rocky Horror Gargoyles Show. The creators of Gargoyles show clips and tell stories of how the show came to be. Lots of visual aids. Panelists: Myself (Creator, Supervising Producer/Story Editor, Writer), Frank Paur ( (Supervising Producer/Director), Greg Guler (Lead Character Designer). ATRIUM 6.
7:00pm - 8:00pm TIME TRAVEL THEORY
Let's assume for a moment that Time Travel is possible. This panel will explore the theories behind such technology. We'll explore quantum realities, temporal anomalies and all other challenges our theoretical time travelers will be face! [Now, I suggested this panel, but then they went and put some actual scientists on the damn thing. So I may quickly be embarrassed into silence.] ;) Panelists: Myself, Nicole Gugliucci, Jim Kakalios, G. David Nordley, Amy Berg. ATRIUM 4.
8:30pm - 9:30pm GARGOYLES Q&A
Join the cast and creators of the "Gargoyles" series and SLG companion comic books to ask and talk about the property. And, as always, Cosplayers are welcome! Panelists: Myself (Creator, Supervising Producer/Story Editor, Writer), Christopher Jones (Bad Guys guest artist), Marina Sirtis (voice of Demona and Margot Yale), Frank Paur (Supervising Producer/Director), Karine Charlebois (Gargoyles Guest Artist, Bad Guys Artist), Greg Guler (Lead Character Designer, Gargoyles Guest Artist). MAIN STAGE.
SATURDAY, JULY 5th, 2014
9:30am - 10:30am GARGOYLES SIGNING
Myself, Marina Sirtis (voice of Demona and Margot Yale) and Frank Paur (Supervising Producer/Director) will be holding a signing session. Again, I'll be selling and signing copies of my first novel RAIN OF THE GHOSTS for $10 cash, which includes the book, a personalized signature and signed copies of the original development character designs by Kuni Tomita for the television version of Rain that never was. In addition - and by popular demand - I am selling and signing an array of my animation teleplays for $20 cash from such series as Gargoyles, Team Atlantis, DC Showcase (Green Arrow), Men in Black: The Series, The Spectacular Spider-Man, Roughnecks: Starship Troopers Chronicles, W.I.T.C.H., The Batman, Batman: The Brave and the Bold, Young Justice and even the 2009 Radio Play "The Spectacular Spider-Man Meets Gargoyles". I'll also sign anything else you bring and put in front of me for FREE. CONVERGENCE CENTRAL.
11:00am - 12:25pm GARGOYLES RADIO PLAY REHEARSAL
This is a closed session - for those who were cast in the Radio Play - led by Myself, Jennifer Anderson (Talent Coordinator on The Spectacular Spider-Man and Young Justice) & Marina Sirtis (voice of Demona, Margot Yale and Queen Bee). ATRIUM 6.
12:30pm - 1:30pm GARGOYLES RADIO PLAY PERFORMANCE
Fans and professionals - including Myself (voice of Donald Menken and Lucas "Snapper" Carr), Jennifer Anderson (Talent Coordinator on The Spectacular Spider-Man and Young Justice), and of course, Marina Sirtis (Deanna Troi from Star Trek TNG and the voice of Demona, Margot Yale and Queen Bee) - perform a LIVE, ORIGINAL Gargoyles radio play! ATRIUM 6.
2:00pm - 3:00pm GARGOYLES BIOLOGY AND CULTURE
A "what if" panel about the biology and culture of the Gargoyles universe. Creators and performers speculate about anything and everything going on outside the frames of the TV series. Panelists: Craig A. Finseth moderates Myself (Creator, Producer) and Greg Guler (Lead Character Designer). ATRIUM 7.
3:30pm - 4:30pm RAIN OF THE GHOSTS
I'll be reading from and talking about the world and characters of my novel "Rain of the Ghosts" and its sequel, "Spirits of Ash and Foam," which comes out July 8th, 2014, one week after the convention! ATRIUM 3.
7:00pm - 8:00pm ONE ON ONE WITH GREG WEISMAN
Hal Bichel will moderate a one-on-one panel with Myself. PLAZA 2.
8:30pm - 9:30pm SIGNING
Once again, I'll be selling and signing copies of my first novel RAIN OF THE GHOSTS for $10 cash, which includes the book, a personalized signature and signed copies of the original development character designs by Kuni Tomita for the television version of Rain that never was. In addition - and by popular demand - I am selling and signing an array of my animation teleplays for $20 cash from such series as Gargoyles, Team Atlantis, DC Showcase (Green Arrow), Men in Black: The Series, The Batman, Batman: The Brave and the Bold, The Spectacular Spider-Man, Roughnecks: Starship Troopers Chronicles, W.I.T.C.H., Young Justice and even the 2009 Radio Play "The Spectacular Spider-Man Meets Gargoyles". I'll also sign anything else you bring and put in front of me for FREE. CONVERGENCE CENTRAL.
10:00pm - 11:00pm BLUE MUG
Ever wonder about the sexual habits of Gargoyles? Ever wonder who was sleeping with whom among the Young Justice Team or the cast of Spectacular Spider-Man? Join us for for a late night peek at your favorite animated series. This panel will get blue! (So attendees will be carded!) Panelists: Myself, Christopher Jones, Mara Cordova (Last Tengu in Paris Artist). It is also rumored that Edmund Tsabard (an unfancy bastard and Last Tengu in Paris Writer) may make an appearance. EDINA.
SUNDAY, JULY 6th, 2014
11:00am - 12:00pm PROTOFEMINISTS IN SHAKESPEARE
Shakespeare portrayed several intelligent, independent, and self-aware women--Juliet, Lady Macbeth, Katharine, Beatrice, Viola, Rosalind. We'll discuss the problematic and the remarkably (for the era) fleshed-out aspects of their representation. Panelists: Myself, Elizabeth Bear, Ashley F. Miller, Joseph Erickson, Alexandra Howes. EDINA.
12:30pm - 1:30pm GARGOYLES FAN PANEL
It's the 20th Anniversary of Gargoyles. Come share your favorite moments from the show. As always, Cosplayers are welcome! Panelists: Daniel Mohr moderates Myself, Ryan Alexander, Robert Wagner, Maggie Schultz, Jennifer Anderson, Karine Charlebois. ATRIUM 6.
2:00pm - 3:00pm SIGNING
Myself and Greg Guler (Gargoyles, Phineas and Ferb) will be holding one last signing session. Greg G. always has an array of stuff (books, prints, etc.) to sell and sign. And I'll be selling and signing copies of my first novel RAIN OF THE GHOSTS for $10 cash, which includes the book, a personalized signature and signed copies of the original development character designs by Kuni Tomita for the television version of Rain that never was. In addition - and by popular demand - I am selling and signing an array of my animation teleplays for $20 cash from such series as Gargoyles, Team Atlantis, DC Showcase (Green Arrow), Men in Black: The Series, The Spectacular Spider-Man, Roughnecks: Starship Troopers Chronicles, The Batman, Batman: The Brave and the Bold, W.I.T.C.H., Young Justice and even the 2009 Radio Play "The Spectacular Spider-Man Meets Gargoyles". I'll also sign anything else you bring and put in front of me for FREE - especially if you buy my book. CONVERGENCE CENTRAL.
3:30pm - 4:30pm YOUNG JUSTICE
Creative minds behind the Young Justice TV and comic book series will talk about this fan favorite. We're planning some special surprises as well. And, as always, Cosplayers are welcome! Panelists: Myself, Marina Sirtis (voice of Queen Bee), Christopher Jones (Artist YJ Comic). MAIN STAGE.
5:00pm - 6:00pm CLOSING CEREMONY
It's not over 'til the gynoid sings - or something like that. Join CONvergence mascot Connie and our Guests of Honor as we say farewell to another convention. Shenanigans may ensue. Panelists: Myself, Amy Berg, Emma Bull, C. Robert Cargill, Sarah Clemens, Scott Lynch, Marina Sirtis, Matthew Ebel, Frank Paur, Dawn Krosnowski, Greg Guler, Windy Bowlsby, Rob Callahan, Michael Lee. MAIN STAGE
SEE?!! I told you there was a lot. And that's only the stuff that I'm doing. CONvergence is jam-packed with all sorts of pop culture nutritional goodness. So stop by and say hello!!
*In the interest of Full Disclosure, Fancy Bastard would like all to know that he especially likes the following pies:
BERRY (pretty much any kind of berry or a mix of same)
BANANA CREAM (herein to be known as the funniest pie)
Combinations of some of the fruit pies can be great. Contestants are welcome to try other pies at their own risk.
Fancy Bastard does NOT especially like the following pies:
Anything with Chocolate or Lemon or Meringue
Raisins in Apple Pie
Almost never Cherry, though he has tasted the rare exception...
Hey, Greg! Love Gargoyles, excited for Rain of the Ghosts, and I just reread the comics and have a question about the clones.
We know that if gargoyles A and B are cloned, the clones, C and D, will have photo-negative coloration. Now, let's say A and C are female, and B and D are male. Let's also say that A and B do not become mates, but C and D do. The egg, E, is not artificially sped up, but develops over the ten year period. When E hatches, will its coloring resemble that of A/B or C/D?
Just curious about the practical application of the clones. Also, I think a Gargoyles Kickstarter would be a great idea! Have a nice day!
Oy, that made my head hurt.
Well, first - you need to remember that the color change was a result of the accelerated aging, not of the cloning process.
So the assumption that C and D are photo-negative assumes that they were accelerated. Not a safe assumption, but for the sake of argument...
Would E's colors resemble A/B or C/D?
I do not know. I'd have to consult my Garg-science buddies.
Which part of the world did gargoyles first arise in? For example, humans apparently arose in Africa and then migrated almost everywhere else, and then evolved. I'm curious to know which continent gargoyles first came from. If you'd care to narrow it down even further, that'd be great, since a continent is a really big place.
I did a search to see if this had already been answered, but I didn't see anything. If you've answered it already and I missed it, my apologies.
what would be the science behind how goliath and his clan glide,and climb almost anything except solid steel?
Who said they can't climb solid steel?
I don't know the science. They glide on their wings. They climb with their claws. Do you need more science than that?
How can Thailog and the Clones be cured of the clone virus when they're solid stone, and incapable of intraveneous injection? If science is a kind of magic, as Titania mentions in 'The Gathering' two-parter, no mage could meddle with it.
1. Don't take what Titania said too literally. She was making an analogy, not writing a treatise.
2. Keep in mind, you're talking Goliath Chronicles.
If someone would bring a gargoyle by plain very far into eastern or western direction during he's stone, would his internal clock notice that or would it be a way for him to be awake at day?
It might be. Honestly, I'm not sure. We thought about that in our pilot when the gargs were being moved from Scotland to New York. But it was a non-issue there.
I was checking the archives, and I think I can explain why sometimes, the gargoyles turn to stone slowly, and sometimes just slowly solidify until they're completely in stone. In Awakening 1, Goliath and Hudson could've turned to stone slowly because they were struggling, so the body couldn't solidify as quickly. So it starts down and spreads throughout their bodies until they're trapped in stone. When they're sitting/standing still, the body can solidify at normal speed. Anyway, that's what I think makes sense. What do you think, oh wise Greg?
Oh wise Demona Taina, it makes sense to me.
if all the female gargoyles on Avalon only are able or ready to reproduce when the Earth 20-year cycle comes around wouldn't that mean that they would be laying their eggs within a very short time on Avalon? i mean, on Avalon that cycle would come around every 10 months! would the females on Avalon be ready to concieve after just laying an egg?
and lets say that its too soon to be laying another egg and they skip a cycle, that means that they will only lay two eggs in their lifetimes, and if that happened it would be bad for the Avalon clan. first of all, their population would never grow, in fact over time it would probably shrink due to the unequal distribution of males and females, a couple has to have more than two children for any population growth to occur. another problem is that over time (and may i remind you that time is way faster on Avalon) there would be a huge amount of inbreeding, esspecially as the population dropped.
so, the problem is, either Avalon females are birthing their eggs twenty four times faster than gargoyles typically do, or the Avalon clan is doomed to die out.
i'm a bit worried about the fate of the Avalon clan, whats going to happen with them and this problem?
1st paragraph... No.
2nd paragraph... I don't follow your reasoning here. They have the potential at least to have many MORE children on Avalon.
3rd paragraph... you can't see something between those extremes?
It's an issue. Fodder for stories. I'm not going to reveal the answer here. But don't worry too much about this. After all, they may not survive the return of Mab.
Okay, we've asked you this question before, and you've never really given a strait answer. Nothing says you will now, but here goes:
1) What happens to the stone sleep cycle of gargs in space?
I know the sleep is a biological process that's triggered by the sun. So, would they keep their normal cycle of 12 hours, or would the cycle change.
If you dont want to answer that question:
2) Have you yet figured out what happens to gargoyles in space, and you just dont want to tell us, or are you waiting for divine inspiration? :)
1. Don't know. Haven't tried it.
2. I'm not sure about divine. But there's a reason why Zafiro and Demona are the one's who join Nokkar, Guardian and LXM on 'the away mission' in space.
Gargoyles mate for life. Does that mean that once two gargoyles show interest in each other, and become intimate, that they've mated, and are officially forevermore monogamous?
If so, what happens if, over the years, the two gargoyles come to drift apart, or realize they have nothing in common? Do they stay together simply because of tradition? I take it there's no gargoyle equivalent of divorce. (Or at least there wasn't until Goliath and Demona kinda set precident).
And in that vein; should a gargoyle have an affair, then what happens if that affair is discovered? Does the unfaithful gargoyle and the one he/she had the affair with get banished from the clan?
Hope this hasn't been asked before.
Gargoyles mate in both sexual and ritualistic fashion. After that they GENERALLY (and that's the key word) remain monogamous.
They imprint upon each other biologically, and there are strong ties of custom to discourage a split. Affairs, I believe, are quite rare.
But as you noted, sometimes things don't work according to plan. Iago has clearly imprinted on Desdemona, though she is imprinted on Othello and he has imprinted on her.
Goliath and Demona imprinted upon each other, but maybe as a result of a thousand years, that imprinting didn't last. Goliath has clearly imprinted anew on Elisa. (BTW, I'm not sure I'm using the word imprinting correctly. I know it's generally used for babies to imprint on their mothers. But it's the closest thing I can think of.)
So there are issues of both biology and custom that discourage anything like divorce or cheating. But that doesn't mean it NEVER happens.
i'm going to try to guess the date you're reading this and i think it'll be a bit less then the current two month wait cuz i bet you'll try to catch up before the next contest so: is it August 8? lol, do i get another prize if i'm right?
by the way, your most recent batch of questions was extremely interesting and hilarious, as usual. esspecially Arthur's other Avalon adventure, and (LOL) masturbating gargoyles. its been a while since i've laughed that much!
ok, question time:
1. you recently said that if a gargoyle slept in caves for day after day after day they would begin to have ill effects from lack of sunlight, but you've said that the Korean and Loch Ness clans live in caves. so, did you mean that they sleep outside the caves, i guess?
2. do gargoyle eggs need sunlight ever or are they fine spending their ten year incubation in caves and rookeries?
maybe i'm just really tired or something and kinda giddy, but i'm still laughing about masturbating gargoyles. interesting you won't tell us about gargs going to the bathroom, but you'll tell us about them masturbating! LOL
Not even close. July 17.
1. I love it when people are DETERMINED to trip me up.
2. I'm not committing.
Shows where my heads at, I guess.
I was just skimming through the Garg Science archive, and I ran across a post by Faieq asking about colored irises, and whether or not gargoyles had them. She came to the conclusion that gargs had no irises, since the dim moonlight would be enough for them. I don't think that works, biologically, because sophisticated animals (humans included) have irises-- involuntary sphincters which control how much light enters the eye, constricting to prevent damage from too much light and expanding to let in more light in darkness. Gargoyles, like cats, probably have excellent night vision, being all noctournal and stuff, so they HAVE to have irises.
Maybe their eyes are just predominantly dark, like horses and dogs, with light blue eyes cropping up occaisionally.
Dunno why I went on so long. I was actually just checking for your next Gathering ramble (It's still June at this writing), and for some reason I just had to mention the horse/dog/iris thing.
Thanks for your time.
Thank you. Sounds reasonable.
you said gargoyle fetuses turn to stone inside their eggs to store energy. what do you mean? i doubt they would store energy collected from the sun seeing as how they are inside eggs deep inside a cave and probably don't see much sunlight. what energy are they storing?
thermal. And the shell is also made of that same organic stone.
(Like I know, geez.)
1) How long do female gargoyles carry their eggs?
2) Could a female gargoyle ever have a miscarriage while they were pregnant for their egg? Or if their egg dose not hatch is that considered a miscarriage?
1. About six months.
2b. I'm not sure that's the appropriate term, but the emotional result is the same.
Hi I'm back.
One time I asked you "Are gargoyles at day really heavier than at night? If they are, where does the wheight come from?", and you answered "I never said they were."
Actually, I got this information from a collection-card I found in the internet, and it says, at night he weighs about 130 and at day something about 900 kg.
1. Does it mean that this information is wrong or
2. Don't you want to say it this time?
1. Doesn't sound right.
any ideas yet why the English gargs have evolved to look like they do and so different from other garg clans?
btw, if you don't have an idea yet, i do! i really have a plausible and good idea why they look like that, but if you don't want to hear it...
I don't want to hear it. Sorry. Breaks the rules.
My idea hasn't changed much. I think that gargates have what I've dubbed a "chameleon mutation gene".
grrr, because anonymous had to bring it up again i thought i should once more say that i seriously doubt gargoyles evolved from dinosaurs, maybe they had a common ancestors or something, but it seems really unlikely that gargs are saurian descendants. i mean, look at the English gargs! they don't look anything like dinosaurs or even reptiles. i think its more likely that the English gargs evolved from lions, horses, and birds then other gargs evolving from dinosaurs, and Greg has said that they didn't. i think Gargs are so different from most higher life forms of life that the gargate family seperated from the rest of the animal kingdom far back in history, before dinosaurs, maybe even before reptiles!
sorry, i had to rant about that again...
"Why do the little things always frustrate me!" -Demona
geeeez, Greg, do YOU think gargs evolved from dinosaurs? i know you're not a biologist, but what do you think?
I know what gargs evolved from; I'm just not telling at this point. If you go back far enough, then all biological life evolved from the same basic source on this planet. Where and when gargates diverged is the issue. In a general sense, one could argue that it took place at a time of dinosaurs. But it depends on how you define the word dinosaur. As it is commonly used, as a catch-all term? Or scientifically?
I have a few questions about the gargoyles' healing abilities.
1a.) What are the limits of their healing abilities by stone sleep? What types of injuries or abnormalities are beyond its power to heal?
1b.) Can they heal the physical abnormalities that occur over the course of old age? Loss of vision, hearing, possible internal problems such as with the heart. Things like that.
2.) How does the severity of the injury determine how long it takes to heal? For example, a severe bruising and maybe a few small cuts caused by a beating by either fists or blunt objects compared to more lethal and grievous wounds and lacerations caused by either blades, guns or even another gargoyle's claws.
3.) I think you may have been asked this before, but what happens if an appendage is somehow broken off while in stone sleep such as a hand or a part of their tail or horns (if he/she has them)? Would it eventually regenerate the lost part or would it be gone for good?
4.) How severely do you have to injure a gargoyle until it causes a permanent scar? Example, Hudson's scar.
5.) Would partaking in stimulants like alcohol, smoking, drugs and caffeine cause permanent damage as it does in humans? Could they heal it to any degree?
1a. You want a list?
1b. Old age takes its toll eventually.
2. Most injuries heal over night, but depending on the severity, it may still leave the victim weak. Some injuries never heal. Like Hudson's eye.
3. No it's gone for good.
5. To some degree. But smoking is very insidious in my book, so in my universe it'd tend to be damaging.
Why Gargoyles have horns if they don't use them?
Who says they don't use them.
Our ancestors are apes and our distant ones are a bunch of rodents that resemble lemurs or rats. The ancestors of the gargoyles are lizards and dinosaurs. Who exactly are the ancestors of the fay? Blobs of energy or something else entirely?
All primates have common ancestors. It's not quite the same thing as saying OUR ancestors are apes.
All gargates have common ancestors. Calling those common ancestors dinosaurs is only accurate in a very general sense.
As to Oberon's Children, you've seen one of their ancestors on the series.
Hey again! Here's a Gargoyle health q.
1. Back in April, someone asked about the chance of Gargoyles getting viral diseases. So, what about mental disorders, birth defects and genetic diseases?
2. This probably falls under genetic diseases, but what about cancer? How would it affect them?
3. Now, here's probably a silly one. It sounds like one that might have been asked, but it's been awhile since I had the free time to check the archives. So, what would happen if a gargoyle lost a limb?
OK, enough with the morbid thaughts.
1. Possible, I suppose. But not common.
2. They have a strong healing factor that tends to preclude cancer.
i have a question about the process of gargs turning to stone, i've noticed that they turn to stone differently at different times. sometimes they convert to stone all at once, sometimes they do this fast and sometimes they do it slowly, and sometimes they turn to stone from the ground up or from one direction to another. my question is, why do they turn to stone different ways? is it because of their mindset at dawn or is it just random? i've noticed that they turn to stone slowly from the ground up when they don't want to turn to stone, like when Goliath and Hudson were returning to Wyvern the night of the massacre, or when Goliath was told Elisa was shot, or when Broadway was caught in midair at dawn. in a way are they trying to to forstall the change to stone and this causes the change to happen in a different way? am i looking at this way too hard, i don't think i am, the stone changing process just seems slower and more "forced" when the gargs are in distress or don't want it to be dawn...
i think thats all i have to say...
Well, the obvious real world answer is that we're using artistic license all over the damn place.
But in the garg universe, I think you've answered your own question. If they don't want to change, they can fight it for a few seconds. Slow the process a bit. But just a bit.
I loved the show, especialy the Goliath/Elisa story. But I have a question, I heard that gargoyles age at half the rate that humans do. Would that affect Goliath and Elisa's relationship as the years whent on?
(Oh yeah, and just a daft one...do gargoyles shave? Hudson is the only one with facial hair of any description, I just wondered...)
OK. That you very much. How are you today?
Some gargs shave, some don't.
And yes, the difference in their age rate would of course effect their relationship. But I'm not saying how.
Hello Mr. Weisman.
I don't come here often, but occasionally I'm struck by the urge to quiz you on something. I was browsing the questions you're fielding, and I was struck again by something I notice every time I visit this page. There seems to be some preoccupation here with "the mind of the other." I noticed another poster make reference to your interest in it (although I cannot find any record of your having initiated the discussion).
While the series was still active I saw you invoke this theme frequently whenever you emphasized the cultural shock that the gargoyles experienced in modern America, and I appreciated the fact that you treated our linguistic tendencies to "name everything" as a curious human social construction. It helped to push the idea that these creatures were _not_ human and that we could not understand their natures or their motivations from within the context of human sensibilities. I see there is some similar talk here of the fay, and the notion that their essential nature might be something that is sufficiently far removed from humans so as to be outside our understanding. All of this puts me in mind of the anthropomorphic problem that the SETI administration outlined for dealing with the idea of extraterrestrial intelligence's. Human beings have a tendency to ascribe human values to non human species, and beyond that have considerable difficulty in contextualizing "the mind of the other" without unconsciously resorting to the context of human sensibilities.
Which brings me to the reason for this post; because being a student of the sciences (and probably less attached to my humanity than most people), I have found reason to be extremely critical of some of the aspects of the way the anthropomorphic problem is treated within the natural sciences as it applies to non-human animals. Generally speaking, my problem is that some of the more archaic ethical distinctions that are made between humans and other animals have their foundation in the premise that the ascription of certain mental capacities ( reflection, emotion, etc.) are the ascription of _uniquely human_ qualities. The fact that this premise, itself, is socially constructed rather than informed by data, seems to be lost on at least most _social_ scientists. What is troubling me is that I have begun to observe this kind of thinking migrate into the popular domain through science fiction. I don't really follow sci fi, but I've seen star trek, and I have had occasion to see the half-dozen or so other popular sci fi programs that one can find on television. I see a trend wherein the heroes casual disintegration of a planet is commonly justified with the hazily defined and indistinct ethics of "It did not harbor any sentient life."
This trend is scaring the hell out of me; because the expression "sentient" is not really used within the scientific community, so it does not have any agreed upon definition attached to it and there is no objective data informing the idea of it. The word seems to have infiltrated popular culture, however, where it finds frequent expression. That's what's bothering me. I see a lot of the same hazy ethical reasoning on this board. A number of messages expressing the confusion that humans in your story were subject to when they "mistook the gargoyles for animals rather than sentient beings" and in doing so, justified a campaign to exterminate them.
I would hope that a reasonable group of people would be given pause by the almost casual disregard for life that is being demonstrated with the prioritization of one life over another based upon the presence or non-presence of this seemingly magical endowment. Because if I am reading the intentions of the contributors to this board accurately, then it would appear their position is that if the occupants of that clock tower had been a group of stray dogs or a family of polar bears, then annihilating them with a wire guided missile would have been perfectly reasonable. "It's all right. It didn't harbor any sentient life." I would encourage the fans that come to this site to give some thought to what it is they mean by "sentience." What is the content of this sentience? If it entails that a creature can react to it's environment, anticipate, reflect and emote, then it should be pointed out that what available data exists indicates that this capacity is only about as exclusive a domain as most land based vertebrates.
I guess they shouldn't have disintegrated that planet after all. I hope to encourage others to give this issue the thought that it requires. I am also hoping to elicit some commentary from you, on the matter of how you perceive "the mind of the other." What mental distinctions do you draw between humans and gargates or faeries. I would be interested in hearing you address the notion.
Thank you for writing. It certainly gets me thinking.
I'm probably as guilty as anyone of overusing, or rather overbilling the issue of "sentience". I think the concept has its uses. But it's probably used as a crutch too often.
Certainly, I don't want to see a family of polar bears, anthropomorphic or otherwise, blown up by a guided missile.
I don't much like the idea of destroying planets. In science fiction or otherwise.
As to this "mind of the other" concept...
Well for starters, I don't believe I did initiate the discussion of it -- unless you're including my constant admonishments to posters here that they are thinking like a human.
The previous post by Demoness and my response are a perfect example. She thinks Oberon is out of line. But she's thinking like a human, and a biased one at that. (I don't mean to pick on you, Demoness.) Oberon has a valid point of view. We may not like it, but it seems justifiable to me.
But the question of the mind of the other, was posted here initially by someone else. ( I can't remember who it was at this moment. ) I only just answered it in the last few days. Since you posted YOUR question, hopefully you've seen my response to that one.
And to reiterate, my response was that I'm still (in our universe) interested in the mind of US. Not the OTHER. But one way to explore that is to put ourselves in the shoes of the OTHER. Finding and describing and bringing the OTHER to life, whether as a Gargoyle or as a Child of Oberon, is for me an exercise in EXTRAPOLATION.
For example: If I was me, BUT I turned to stone every day AND I aged at half the rate I currently do PLUS most of my species had been exterminated 1000 years ago, ETC. -- then WHAT WOULD I BE LIKE?
For me, it's less about investing in species then in individual characters. Each with his or her own UNIQUE LIST of "extrapalatory parameters" (I just made that phrase up.)
It's really no different with a character like Elisa. After all, I'm a white Jewish male from California who has spent his entire adult life working in fiction. Elisa is an African-American/Native-American female from New York who's spent her adult life fighting crime. To understand her, I need to extrapolate.
However, in order to understand individuals of another species, I need to know more about that species. I need to envision the parameters that I will use to fully create their characters. So I've done that. In many ways, to me, gargoyle culture represent a kind of ideal. Not perfection, which doesn't personally interest me. But an ideal. Purpose. Loyalty. Oneness with the world they live in. Etc. I've borrowed things that I admired from multiple cultures and from my imagination, and I've tried to weave it into a coherent whole that fits the biology that I assigned them. These biological limits also create parameters for extrapolating character. Yes, the turning to stone thing. But also the group egg laying on a twenty year cycle. This naturally leads into the group child rearing thing. One is biological. One is cultural. But they are linked by extrapolation.
[Or... and I know this sounds silly but... perhaps they are linked by truth. By the fact that they exist in the Gargoyle Universe. As I've said many times before, sometimes this show flowed so well and easily, that it just seemed like I was tapping into something that existed. (But that's got nothing to do with this discussion, so let's ignore it.)]
And yet, from my point of view, all this is used to further illustrate the human condition. I don't think Oberon does or should think like us. But don't we all know a couple people with a little Oberon in them.
Keith David has said, as recently as seven days ago, that when he grows up he hopes to be like Goliath. And I personally think, that flawed as he is, Goliath is a wonderful role model. So we, as humans, can learn from Gargoyles. And we, as humans, can learn from Margot Yale as well. Maybe as a negative example. Maybe as something more down the road.
Ending Hunter's Moon with Jon Canmore becoming the human equivalent of Demona, was not an accident. They arrived at that point in two very different ways -- each, I hope, well informed by his or her species. (Or well extrapolated.) Nevertheless, the similarities between them are obvious and represent a "lesson" for us all.
All that stuff interests me MUCH, MUCH more than the exercise of creating something fully OTHER, just for the sake of achieving that.
Someday that may not be true. Aliens could land in Washington D.C. tomorrow and then comprehending the OTHER for the sake of understanding the OTHER will become a BIG priority fast. But for the time being, the human race is effectively alone in the universe. And before the aliens land, I'd like us all to get to know ourselves MUCH, MUCH better. In that sense, an Oberon, a Goliath, a Nokkar, are all just tools to that end.
The concept of sentience, comes in again, as I said, as a crutch. A convenient distinction between Bronx and Goliath, for example. Let's say you're from Russia. You don't speak English, and Goliath doesn't speak Russian. Still you have a hope that one or both of you may learn to speak the other's language. Dialogue is possible.
Bronx isn't ever going to speak Russian or English. That's the distinction. For what it's worth. In a moral sense, I'd say it's not worth MUCH at all. In a PRAGMATIC sense, we're not being honest if we don't admit it MEANS a lot.
Now. I don't think sentience is a WALL. Koko the gorilla can communicate in sign language. And I've got to say, I'm not sure that whales and dolphins aren't squealing complex philosophical discussions every day of the week. (Which is confusing because Dolphins have an eight day week, and whales have a thirty-seven day week. But what are you going to do?)
But even including a Bronx or a Cagney has value in the show. How do we respond to them. How do they respond to us? It's fun to do "The Hound of Ulster" and try to understand how an "animal" responds to various stimuli. It's still extrapolation. Now, with Bronx, I can cheat. I can keep him a beast and anthropomorphize him to my heart's content, because that species doesn't truly exist. I can make him as intelligent as I want. My goal there is to simply be consistent. Bronx can't start responding like Scooby Doo one day. You get the idea.
It's still about us understanding us and our place in the world. If in my own small way, I'm helping to open minds, helping to pave a bit of a way for when the aliens DO LAND, then great. But first and foremost, I'm asking us to KNOW OURSELVES.
Anyway, I feel like I'm starting to get repetitive. But this whole thread intrigues me. Feel free to post again with a follow-up. And everyone's welcome to join in.
1. do either Broadway or Lexington shave their heads? do either have hairy heads if they wanted to let it grow?
2. do some beast have hair in the same way that some gargs have hair and some don't?
1. I don't think so. But maybe.
1. are beast egss different from regular garg eggs in any way? like size, color, markings, texture, etc.
2. are most gargoyle rookeries pretty similar? a dark, humid cave as we saw in "Awakening"?
3. what was that smily green stuff that who-would-be-Broadway find and eat on the rookery wall?
4. what was causing the rookery to glow? was it that grenn smily stuff?
5. do all gargoyle eggs look like each other among the different clans? would a wise gargoyle be able to tell the difference between a London garg egg and a Guatemalan garg egg for instance?
2. More or less.
3. Uh, mold?
5. I doubt it.
are there any gargs out there who can naturally fly or are there any that perhaps have a rare talent among gargs and are able to fly?
oh, and this excludes the Coldtrio, Goliath with the Eye of Odin, and any other gargoyles inhanced by science or magic, i mean fly under their own natural power!
geeez, with you i always have to cover my bases... you're a sly one.
Not that I know of.
Hi there. I just found out some time ago that I love the show Gargoyles, although I have yet to see the last 13 eps.
Looking through this site, a lot of questions started coming to my mind. I have a lot, but they are pretty differnt amd it says I shouldn't post them all at once, so here is my first.
When Sevarius gives his genetics slide show, he said that gargoyles get the energy they need to fly by soking up solar energy while asleep. If he is right, how does this apply to gargs who turn to stone underground or if it's a cloudy day?
Are they more weak when they wake up, or was severius just incorrect?
Thanks, and once again, great show.
Sevarius was basically correct. But turning to stone underground one day isn't going to weaken a gargoyle perceptibly. If he or she is underground, day after day after day, that's a different story.
As to clouds... Ever gotten a sunburn on a hazy day? I have.
My last question brought some others--what is the average biological age a male gargoyle first produces enough sperm to fertilize an egg? For that matter, what is the average biological age a gargoyle(male or female) start puberty? And do some gargoyle males experience something similar to _ahem_ "wet dreams?"(Their stone while they're asleep, so does something like that happen while they're awake?) Thanks, and I hope my questions were not too offensive.(You know how some people are...)
I'm not offended.
But I also don't have the info here at home I need to give you ages.
I will say that fertility in females is a combination of maturity (i.e. the period between puberty and menopause) and cycle (i.e. matching the bio-flow of the planet).
As for wet dreams? You've stumped me. But masturbation? Sure.
you said that the cross-generational love between Yama and Sora isn't the norm, but isn't unheard of, so:
1. are there gargoyles (esspecially among the Ishimura clan) that are against relationships between non-rookery siblings?
2. have Yama or Sora ever wondered if perhaps they are biologically closely related, like brother/sister, uncle/niece? are they ever insecure about having a non-traditional relationship?
3. will they still be able to have 3 children if they want to? obviously, Sora being younger should be able to concieve 3 times, but are male gargoyles able to fertilize an egg at any time in their life? if they have 3 eggs, Yama will be a generation older than most the other fathers in the clan...
1. It's not that much of a taboo. Certainly not when the individuals are only one generation apart.
2. This isn't really an issue. As I've stated before, gargoyles have scent markers that unconsciously discourage them from an unhealthy incestuous relationship.
3. It should work out, depending on how long Yama's away from the clan.
Can stone sleep heal damages done to the nervous system such as to the spine?
The issue of gargoyles turning to stone being a biological and non-magical process seems important to you, and it does make a more interesting universe; it was also firmly mentioned in the Gargoyles' bible..so out of curiosity, if this fact was so important, why was it never mentioned in the series itself, when other biological details like the solar and aging thing were mentioned?
I probably thought of it as so self-evident that it didn't occur to me to mention it.
And/or it was nearly impossible to work into a conversation naturally.
I looked and looked for these questions, figuring they were asked already but didn't find them. I apologize if they was asked before...
1.)When the sun rises, do the gargoyle embryoes/fetuses turn to stone as well? Is it something right from the beginning or do they develop it in the egg through the years before hatching?
2.) Do the hatchlings use their hands or do they have an egg tooth as many birds and reptile species do? I'm sure the adults help them as well.
3.) Is the shell of gargoyle's egg hard like a birds or leathery like a reptile?
4.) Do gargoyles die in labor as humans do? Or is labor easier for them, as it is a little more round and they are usually larger.
1. Yes, to store energy.
2. Hands, wings, claws, feet.
3. After the first day, it is hard like stone.
4. Labor is marginally easier. But death from laying the egg is not unheard of.
Sorry, my fault.
I asked you: "What happens to a gargoyle if he is at the north pole during the long night in the winter? does he sleep like humans?".
You answered: "Over time, he or she would adapt.".
What I really was meaning with the "long night" was the polarnight(hope it is called that in English) when it is dark for a few months.
I get it. I got it.
Was there ever any gargoyle creatures like gargoyle cats, birds, besides gargoyle beasts and humanoid gargoyles
No. Assuming I understand the question. Which isn't necessarily a safe assumption.
how many eggs can a female garg beast usually lay in its lifetime?
More than three.
what is more rare among gargoyles, a gargoyle giving birth to twins or a female gargoyle being able to lay more than 3 eggs in a lifetime?
Both are extremely rare. EXTREMELY.
besides the gargoyles and the garg beast had you thought of any other gargates that once existed or perhaps still exist? like what they looked like and stuff...
On the eye color thing...
What biological and creative reason is it that females have red glowing eyes and males white?
I found this is a strange, but really cool thing on the show.
Well, behind the scenes, I think it was a result of Demona having glowing red eyes in the pilot and everyone else (i.e. the guys) all having glowing white eyes. I'm not sure I remember us planning it then. It just happened. Then we strove to be consistent.
Biologically, I dunno... hormones?
do baby gargs need to have diaper changes?
this question is a feeble attempt to find out if/how gargs go to the bathroom, sorry, couldn't resist!
I'm going to remain consistent and leave bathroom functions as a private matter.
Are gargoyles at day really heavier than at night? I ask this because I have no idea where the mass comes from when they are turning into stone. Do they pick up dust from the air during their petrifaction?
I never said they were.
would a biologist or Sevarius or someone be able to tell a sleeping gargoyle from a regular stone gargoyle? i would guess so since gargs don't actually turn to stone. would they be able to clone a garg from a few flakes of the sleeping gargs skin?
The outer layer of garg skin is dead skin that is shrugged off on awakening, so I doubt that a few flakes would do. I guess, if they took some sort of core sample (gross), or ran the thing through a catscan or something. But a cursory exam... I don't think so.
Unless the 'regular stone gargoyle' was obviously an anatomical impossibility.
Do Gargoyles suffer from diseases as we do?
Can a gargoyle get Polio? AIDS? Schistisomiasys? Meingitis?
Would the Dawn cure them of the disease, or would they die?
How does a gargoyle die? Sleep, Heart Attack, or from a disease?
Because of their stone healing factor, Gargoyles are largely immune from most diseases.
But I can't go through a disease by disease accounting.
As to death -- most don't die of natural causes. Most don't get the chance.
Why do the Ishimura gargoyles resemble the people of Japan?
I'm not sure they do, except in styles of hair and clothing.
Again, one could chalk it up to artistic license. Or maybe to the "chameleon mutation gene" I've speculated about.
By The Nine, you get asked alot of questions! Ok, this is a bit nerve racking here so let me think. Ok. What is the general life span of a gargoyle? As in how many years can they live if they aren't killed in battle?
Well, that's about all I can ask. Hope to see you again. It has been two years, right. Time for me is illrevelent.
About two hundred chronological years, though that's pushing it.
Did gargoyles originate from Asia? Afterall half of the eight clans originated there and in east Asia there is about three clans presently living there meaning that there might have been a large abundance of gargoyles clans living there and also the people in Ishimura don't fear the gargoyles meaning that gargoyles must have lived there quite along time for the humans to get use to them.
I'm not saying at this time. But in any case, you're logic above doesn't wash.
The survival of three clans in Asia hardly proves anything, as each clan survived for very specific reasons. And every one of the seven old clans have been in place for centuries. And at one point or another, all got along with humans. The Ishimurans managed to maintain the relationship, but it hardly suggests or guarantees a geographic origin in Japan.
After all, two clans also survived in Great Britain -- a much smaller area than all of Asia -- so by your logic, we might assume that Gargoyles originated there.
But I'm not confirming any of it. Asia, Britain or somewhere else? I'm not saying now.
1) Can gargoyles experience any of the sleep disorders defined by humans?
2) Does a gargoyle somehow feel (or otherwise notice) the difference between being unconscious during the night and being in stone hibernation during the day?
3) Can gargoyles oversleep or stay up past their bedtime?
1. Not exactly, but perhaps others or related problems.
2. Yes. Two different things. This is something Michael Reaves and I specifically discussed very early on. Should the Gargs turn to stone when knocked unconscious? We agreed they weren't similar states, really.
3. Not by much.
If a gargoyle took up smoking, would he or she experience health problems over time, or would the rejuvenating effects of the sun negate the damage?
To make a point, I'm going to say that smoking would have long term dilitorious (did I spell that right) effects.
I have read that the gargoyles are reptils, but Bronx is a gargoyle too. Bronx could be a reptil too, but, does this mean that Goliath, Demona, Brooklyn..., are from the same specie than Bronx?
The same if the humans are from the same specie than the dogs.
Gargoyles and Gargoyle Beasts are neither reptiles nor mammals (including dogs), though they share qualities of each.
They are gargates.
In response to your question about a gargoyle using some form of timetravel to poof into a daylight situation, you said that it was something of a pavlovian response. Does this mean that Gargoyles can, if they chose to exert however much effort it took to do this, change their sleepcycles or their sleepques?
It is briefly possible. Not over anything resembling a long haul. Their biological internal clocks are fairly tyrannical and attuned.
in the London clan the feathered wings were the most common, and in the other clans the Goliath and Demona type wings were quite common, among the clans we've not see (Loch Ness, New Olympus, Xanadu, and Korea) are Lexington's wing type the most common? or are Desdemona's?
I'm not going to tie my hands by quantifying that at this time.
I have seen that the gargoyles when the sun go down are lives, and a little stone skin fall from their skin, are they more small??
No, they're shedding a thin layer of dead epidermus. Each day they regenerate while in stone.
warrioress's question reminded me of one i've been meaning to ask, i read somewhere that because of his smaller profile Lex and other gargoyles with similar wings can actually glide faster... any truth to this? i guess they should get an advantage cuz they can't really use their hands when gliding...
Can Demona get pregnant by a human at anytime? That is, is she fertile as a human at the same times as she is fertile as a gargoyle, or is she fertile like a regular human? What's Demona's fertility cycle as human and garg? (Garg's are only fertile every ten garg years, right?)
Garg's are only fertile every TWENTY years.
Human females, or so I understand it, are generally VERY fertile one week a month. Potentially fertile the week to either side. And even possibly fertile at all times. At any rate, it's sure as hell safer to think that way.
Demona is a human when she's human. A garg when she's a garg. But she's extremely unlikely to get pregnant at any time. Cuz she's Demona.
oh, and if i remember correctly, you said that March 21 was not only the Spring Equinox, and the possible hatch date for gargoyles, but its also your son's birthday, so, Happy Birthday Ben even though its belated by now... talk to you later!
Ben thanks you.
In the Gargoyles Universe, are there gargoyles without wings at all? Earthbound ones.
Garg beasts have no wings.
What happens to a gargoyle if he is at the north pole during the long night in the winter? does he sleep like humans?
Give a smart-ass answer if you want to, but I woud be pleased if you don't.
Over time, he or she would adapt.
Howdy, Greg! I'm not a regular visitor to this area, so I apolgize in advance if you've already been asked about this. I looked through the archived responses, but I might have missed something.
In the episode "Grief," Goliath mentioned that gargoyles age at half the speed of humans. Does that mean that a young gargoyle that has been alive for 20 years would only appear to be a 10 year old equivelant to a human child? Because if Jackel aged the Gargoyles for the same amount of years as he did Elisa, wouldn't they really have become half of what Jackel had intended? Aging 40 years ahead instead of 80? If it's true that they age at exactly half the rate of humans, I'm sure Angela would look worn and maybe a grey hair or two, but I doubt that she would look as near death as she did. Please clear this up for me. What is the exact rate that Gargoyles age when compared to humans?
Thank you. :)
You got the age rate correct, but not Jackal's intentions. He was going for OLD -- he was draining energy. He wasn't specifically saying, I want fifty years from Elisa and 100 from those gargs. Just I want them old.
Where did gargoyle race orignate from? Asia? British Isles?
Not saying at this time.
Does the gargs have problems with tooth decay?
I'm asking this because I'm in the middle of a root canal treatment, and it HURTS!!!
The Children of Oberon who are the gods of legends thus they must be the first race and they are made of pure magic. The gargoyles who are the second race have some magic in them since they can turn themselves and their equipment into stone. While humans who are the third race can't perform any feats of magic unless they have a spell book. So my question is the magic energy on the Earth diminishing?
Gargoyles are the first of these three. That is, the oldest. They don't do any magic themselves. Turning to stone is a biological process. Turning they're gear to stone was a human magical spell, inflicted upon them.
Humans evolved second.
The Children incubated in magic and "evolved" third.
In the Guatemala episode, Jackal carved his face into Goliath's in his dream. If a person were to do this to a Gargoyle and he woke up at dusk, what would happen?
so garg beasts reach adulthood by age 2, and live about as long as regular gargoyles? so, can they mate more often than regular gargoyles? i hope so cuz that could really save them from extinction given there are so few garg beasts left...
would Zafiro and Una's lack of claws on their feet cause them to have alot of trouble climbing walls/cliffs? if not, is it because gargoyles mainly use their arms when climbing a wall/cliff?
You use what you've got. And you find uses for what you've got.
in response to "The One":
i've been thinking an awful lot about gargoyle genetics and biology lately and i have some theories, not ideas, personal theories.
in evolution, the weak do not survive to pass on genes, and the strong do. among other things this makes most beings of a species very similar in appearence, at least from outside that species. gargoyles are different obviously, even us humans can see major differences among them, like the ones you mentioned. the reason for this, i think, is because they have bypassed evolution by not raising their young individually, but communally. the strong gargs help in raising the weak gargs and vice versa, this means that strong and weak gargs make it to adulthood to have their own children, this also means that weaker traits arn't dying off and any physical mutations that occur are accepted and continue on. generally though, gargoyles are pretty similar if you look at bone structure or DNA, its like dogs, we've selectively breed them to look different or be able to do different things, but a Poodle is virtually identical to a St. Bernard in its DNA. the fact that gargoyles don't keep track of who's kid is who's also means that occasionally two cousin's or second cousin's will mate and this may cause mutations that further vary what the species looks like.
as for the rookery generations, as Greg as said, there are never actually biological brothers and sisters among a generation, the closest relation is cousins, i even did the math and found that an uncle and niece for instance can't be in the same generation. i have another personal theory that gargoyles, to prevent much inbreeding, biologically find gargoyles attractive that are very different looking from themselves. i know alot of people would say, "What about who they love?" and i agree, but don't we all have some biological prefrences?
i have no idea why the London gargs evolved the way they did, i'm anxious to see Greg's answer to that one...
ok, i'm done with my ramble, what do you think Greg?
I like it. I like it.
There may actually be a cosmetic mutation gene in Gargoyle DNA.
I'm not saying there is, but I'm not ruling out the possibility.
1) How do you explain the vast genetic difference in the Gargoyle gene pool? e.g. demon like appearance of the scotish breed, a lower half of the body resembling a snake in the South American, animal-like appearances in the english.
2) Why is there a particular convergance of traits in the English gargoyles to resemble animals? It seems to serve no evolutionary purpose.
3) Since the Gargoyles don't keep track on who are their biological parents and given the nature of their isolated populations, it's highly likely that the Gargoyles have inbred over successive generations. (Even in clans they refer to each other as brother and sister) Do the Gargoyles have the same stigma on inbreding that the humans do? If so, how do they avoid it?
1. Check the archives. I'm tired of explaining it.
2. So you say.
3. I've answered this too. Sophisticated scent markers prevent inbreeding.
Heya, was reading through the Garg Science section, when I came upon this thought, correct anything I say if its wrong. First I'll state what I found, then I'll sum it up with what I came up with.
Females can conceive every 20 years. It takes 6 months for the eggs to develop and be layed. Then it takes 10 years for the eggs to hatch.
Going by this, there would be eggs hatching and eggs laid every ten years. So, in the rookery, every ten years, on the Equinox (I forgot spring or fall... most likely spring) there would be eggs hatching, AND eggs being laid.
So, basically, every 10 years, a different set of females would be conceiving. It'd go every-other-10-years.
Example: Female A conceives and lays an egg. Female B hatches from that egg, 10 years later. At this same time, Female C would lay an egg. 20 years later, Female B conceives and lays an egg. Females A and B are on the same cycle, while Female C is on a cycle set off by 10 years.
Or, to put it another way:
Female A lays an egg. Female B hatches 10 years later. Female A lays an egg 10 years later. Female B lays an egg 10 years later.
Basically: Mother and Daughter alternate on the 10 years. If Daughter has a child, then that child, Granddaughter, would be on the same cycle as Mother. If Granddaughter has a child, Great-Granddaughter would be on the same cycle as Daughter, and so on.
I just looked at how many times I tried to simplify what I was saying... a lot!
I hope I got whatever point I had across.
Here's a note: It's almost midnight here, so if things don't line up well, let me know :).
No. Because they are all on the same schedule. Half the females aren't laying while the other half are conceiving.
Eggs are layed every twenty years and hatch ten years later. Thus eggs hatch every twenty years too.
Mother's and Daughters don't alternate. For starters, because a ten year old gargoyle is only biologically five years old. Hasn't come close to hitting puberty yet. Even a twenty year old gargoyle is only ten biologically. Gargoyle females basically have three fertile cycles. At the ages of 40, 60 and 80 (biologically 20, 30 and 40). This puts them right in synch with their parents, cycle-wise.
Do gargoyles need to bathe, or are body odours etc disposed of via stone sleep?
Bathing helps periodically.
I am a little confused on Gargoyle Generations... let's see if this is correct.
Hudson - Gen 1
Goliath/Demona Gen 2
Trio/Bronx Gen 3--|
| |- from same gen, but different hatching
Angela Gen 3------|
Samson (Is that his name?) Gen 4
1) Is this basically a correct assumption?
2) Does a Gargoyle ALWAYS find a mate in his hatching? IE) did all the Avalon Gargoyles pair off?
3) If the above is not true, then, would a Garoyle look to the next hatching, or would they be too young?
1. No, not at all.
2. Not necessarily.
3. It depends when he or she is looking. Yama and Sora are from different generations. But they didn't get together when she was a kid.
1. will Tom and/or Katherine live to see Gabriel, Opheila, and Boudikka and the other Avalon gargoyle's eggs hatch?
2. will the Avalon clan continue the naming of the hatchlings?
3. will they have a rookery or will they raise their eggs and hatchling's individually as humans do?
oh, and i was thinking about the Earth rythmn and its effects on gargs reproductive cycles on Avalon and i thought that maybe Avalon produces its own rythmn that may mimic or duplicate the rythmn of the Earth so that Opheila and the rest still lay eggs and hatch as if they were in the real world. afterall, from what evidence we've seen in the series and that you've given us, Avalon doesn't seem to be a place you can locate on Earth, just a theory...
1. Not gonna answer that.
3. Rookery. They know that much.
The cycles tie together. The math is excruciating for me, but I've managed it. I think.
you've said numerous times that Bronx mated and will mate again with Boidekka, but since Bronx was born a generation after the trio wouldn't he be way to young to mate? if the fertility cycle is different for beasts than can they mate and concieve more often in life than the standard gargoyles? i understand that Boidekka, being older than Bronx, is probably able to concieve, but Bronx just seems too young. does it matter that he is male, as in males can mate and concieve earlier in life than females?
Again, it depends how you're defining "mated". Do you mean "take a mate"? Do you mean "produce offspring"? Do you mean "have intercourse"?
Boudicca is older than Bronx. But Beasts mature faster than Gargoyles. The cycle is the same, but the maturity rate is different. Bronx is an adult and has been for years.
i have a question about when a gargoyle wakes up. in many times throughout the series we would see the gargs' eyes glow shortly before they would shed their stone skin and that makes sense to me because you've said that at sunset their entire body reverts to flesh except a thin layer over their skin, their eyes probably don't have this layer since that would probably be kinda painful to have stone flying out of your eyes. so we see the eyes first because it doesn't have to break out of a stone shell. am i at least roughly correct on this?
Roughly, but no, not really. There is a thin membrane of "organic-stone" over the eyes as well. The glow sometimes shines through the membrane. Or if the eyes were closed, they blink open first, and tiny bits of stone fall away to reveal the glow. Or something like that.
A few weeks ago Anonymous writes
<Are there any female gargoyles who are obese? How about muscular or extremely skinny? Are any females bow-legged?
Are there gargoyles with differnent wing and ear types than the types that were shown on the series?
You know how some gargoyles have a sharp elbow or knee spike that juts out, I was wondering if any gargoyles have them on both knees and elbows because it was always on or the other.>
To which you replied...
<Obese? Not likely, but possible, I guess.
Look, it's all sounding possible.>
Now why is not likely for a gargoyle woman to be obese? Must all of them be fairly skinny like Demona? I don't know man, it seems like a sexist notion of what the female form is supposed to be! Sorry if offends you but with the gargoyles anatomy being similar on the surface, this might boys the neanderthal idea of what female beauty is supposed to be, and girls an impossible standard to live up to. Now don't get me wrong I love the show. Another thing that yerked me. You have mentioned that the original Broadway was going to be a girl. But you changed your minds out of fear of feminist groups being concerned about the evil/fat issue among the two female characters.
Now I would think that feminist groups with all sorts of "agendas" as you put it would love to see a none picture perfect woman in the series. Trust me having the two main female gargoyles in the series model thing didn't exactly endear the show to them I'm sure ;)
Sorry if this sounds like a rant. I just wanted your honest thought on what I've said.
I didn't mean to say that garg FEMALES aren't likely to be obese. I was trying to say that gargs as a whole aren't likely to be obese. Broadway and Hudson may be overweight, but neither are obese. I said it was possible, and I meant it, but given the lifestyle that most gargs have, obesity isn't likely.
Sorry for the confusion.
among the British gargs would a female gargoyle that has the lion genes still have the mane that Leo has? i would think she would because Leo is not a lion and while he looks like one probably shares very few of the same characteristics of a lion.
i've also noticed that Maggie the Cat has lion genes and is the only mutate with hair and i assume this is because of the animal she was mutated from but of course Leo wasn't created from a lion...
There is a chameleonesque characteristic (metaphorically) to the various superficial gargoyle differences that seem so pronounced. That might suggest a female of Leo's type might look lioness-esque as opposed to Lion-esque. But it might not. I hate to tie my hand frankly, or rather I hate to tie the artists hands in advance.
no offense to anyone who has posted stuff about gargs evolving from dinosaurs, but i think that it is extremelly unlikely that they did. only Greg and God could convince me that they are saurian descendants.
dinosaurs were all wiped out!!!! what does a garg evolve from? bones? and as for the triceratops head frill and the pterydactyl wings and whatever else, why would all these dinosaurs mate with each other anyway? for that matter, pterydactyls arn't even dinosaurs!
gargs are far more likely to be related to the platypus, the bat, or some other mammal, not dinosaurs.
sorry if i seem like i'm ranting, but for some reason the dinosaur connection just really bugs me...
Gargoyles pre-date mammals in my mind. Whether they evolved from dinosaurs or beside dinosaurs is another question.
On 02-01-2001, you anwsered a question by Anonymous.
He/She wrote: How long is a female gargoyles' gestation period?
You replied: Didn't I answer this already? Check the Gargoyle Science archive.
I checked the Science archive, and then the entire archive, and the closest you have said is "6 months to a year".
So I pose these questions to you:
Have you refined your anwser to this question?
If so, how long is the gestation period for gargoyle females? (The time span the female gargoyle carrys the egg before laying it, for those non-scientifically inclined people reading this.)
And, when gargoyle females do end up laying their eggs, do they lay them on the same night or just generally around the same time?
See you at G2K+1!
About six months is as refined as I've got it.
And the laying takes place within a span of a couple nights.
1. When gargoyles are hatched, do they have any teeth? I would hope they didn't have teeth, because if the females breast-fed the hatchlings, I'm sure it wouldn't have been a very pleasant ritual to have gone through if the little ones did. OUCH times 10!! And wouldn't it have been a bit difficult for the hatchlings with beaks to breast-feed?
2. How helpless are hatchlings when they're first born? Are they almost as helpless as human babies? What is the average age a gargoyle hatchling learns to walk; also, to glide? Oh, and at about what age do hatchlings learn to talk?
1. Not sure. Not sure that there's consistency. Maybe no front teeth?
2. Almost but not quite. They can support their own heads for example. Walking on all fours comes fast. Walking upright takes much longer. Gliding can sometimes come before or after upright walking. Unfortunately, despite the fact that I have two kids of my own, I don't even remember or know enough about human development to give hard numbers I have confidence in.
I have some biological questions. Nothing too hard, I hope.
1-There are blood vessels in the gargoyle's wings membranes?
2-I know that Gargoyles are warm-blooded. Then, does they sweat? Or the wings are a natural radiator? (A lot of animals have them). And how about the beasts? (The dogs sweat by the tongue, you know?)
3-Some Gargs are furry, as Leo, Una & Griff. And about the non-furry Gargs, does them have any body hair? (And yes, I mean the Manhattan clan :-)
4-No, I will not ask if gargs go to the bathroom.
5-I don't know _why_ I'm asking this, but: does Gargs has nipples? They don't appear to have, but in "Leader of the Pack", Wolf rip his T-shirt and (I believe) he doesn't has also. S&P things?
6-At what age does the beasts become adults? In 1996 Bronx is biological 9 and Boudicca 20, and both look adults to me (they even mated).
7-A comment about the eggs; They hatch in ten years. Yes, It's a long time, but not too long: Some insects late 13 years to become adults. The eggs are slow, but they're not irreal.
1. I don't know.
2. Uh, I'm not sure.
3. Some, sure.
5. Not S&P. More like stylistic and design choices.
6. At age two.
Would a gargoyle be any different in space than a human? Does their physiology differ that much from ours if they were to be sent into space? And do gargoyles have a lesser tolerance for gravity then us seeing how they are more like birds and bats that have wings? (I would think their skeletal structure would be hollower than that of a human so they could generate lift)
As I've said before, nothing about Goliath's strength suggests a hollow skeleton to me.
Otherwise, there are going to be some differences. But not obvious stuff like gravity and oxygen and vaccuum.
you've said numerous times that there are no aquatic or amphibious gargoyles, however in "Ill Met by Midnight" as Katherine, Goliath, and everyone are arriving at the castle at the beginning of the ep there is a Avalon clan garg shown that looks extremely aquatic. he has what looks to be gills, fins, fishy looking eyes, webbed appendages, and on top of everything else is a aquamarine hue. i just thought i'd mention it...
I haven't seen that episode in a while. I'd have to look again.
And by the way, I've "said numerous times that there are no aquatic or amphibious gargoyles"? When? At any rate, it depends how you define "aquatic".
you told me once that the Mayan clan and any other clans native to the Americas migrated over the Bering Strait from Asia like humans did about 10,000 years ago. so, where did the gargoyle species evolve from? humans came from East Africa and spread out across the world, the gargs must have had a starting place too. what about the beasts, where did they evolve from?
Beasts and gargs have common ancestors. As for the location of their original evolution, I'll keep that to myself for the time being (while I figure it out).
You'd mentioned in the archive that gargoyles may be capable of having twins, yet it would be extremely, extremely rare. My question is, if a gargoyle did have twins, would they be born from the same egg, or would two eggs be laid?
It's so rare, I hate to answer this. But I'd say one egg.
But let me emphasize that I don't see this happening naturally more than once every few hundred years.
A question about rookery generations...
1. If the Wyvern massacre had not happened, would the Trio normally have been considered rookery parents to the eggs that would have hatched in 998? Or was the generation of the first rookery parents the one immediately older than them? (Goliath, Demona, ColdTrio, etc)
In short are rookery parents 40 or 60 years older than their first rookery children?
2. What if one of the gargoyles had mated really young (teen pregnancy) and contributed an egg by the time she was biologically 15? Ten years later would she *not* be considered a rookery mother even though she had biologically contributed an egg? Or would she be treated as an exception among her generation?
3. For that matter would Iago be considered a rookery father to the eggs simply because of his generation, even though he was mateless and hadn't contributed an egg himself? Or not?
2. Gargoyle females aren't generally fertile by age 30 (biological age 15). This decision, frankly, was probably S&P driven originally, but I'll stick with it now. Garg females generally lay three eggs in a lifetime at age 50, 70 and 90 (biological age 25, 35 and 45). This further separates them from human biology, which I kinda like. And keep in mind, sex drive isn't limited to fertile cycles.
3. First off, did I ever say Iago was mateless? But to answer your question, Iago would likely have been viewed as a Rookery Father (or at least Rookery Uncle -- though there would be no such terminology) UNLESS he made a personal point of not accepting that responsibility.
yes hi I was wondering if you could tell me why gargoyles satnd for on buildings and what are they? Are they god's creatures, like "angels" or are the devils creatures? if you could, could you email me at Danielse@gatorzone.com thank you for your time, Eric Daniels
Sorry, Eric. I cannot e-mail you from this site. It wouldn't be fair. I hope you'll check back here for your answer.
Gargoyles are certainly not the 'devil's creatures'. Nor are they angels. They're mortals like us of a different species. You're typo "satnd" makes it tough for me to know exactly what you're asking, but however you believe humans were created/evolved whatever, something similar happened with gargs.
Are there any female gargoyles who are obese? How about muscular or extremely skinny? Are any females bow-legged?
Are there gargoyles with differnent wing and ear types than the types that were shown on the series?
You know how some gargoyles have a sharp elbow or knee spike that juts out, I was wondering if any gargoyles have them on both knees and elbows because it was always on or the other.
Obese? Not likely, but possible, I guess.
Look, it's all sounding possible.
Are there any female gargoyles with wings like Lex's, or male gargoyles with wings like Desdemona's?
Are there any female gargoyles who have a beak like Brooklyn's? Or an overbite like Lex and Broadway?
Save Una, most females I have seen look pretty similar, no offense.
Sure, why not?
(And none taken.)
How long is a female gargoyles' gestation period?
Didn't I answer this already? Check the Gargoyle Science archive.
Between what ages are gargoyles able to reproduce? (youngest/oldest)
Do female gargoyles have menopause?
1. I don't have that info with me at the moment.
2. I imagine so.
would there be any biological problems with two gargs of different races (i.e. Guatemalan and London) mating and having a hatchling? i know interracial humans don't generally have any medical problems but i'm wondering if it is any different for gargs.
No. Despite appearances, the differences in garg terms are as genetically superficial as racial differences between humans.
ah, Jim, i almost got the last post of yesterday too!!! oh, well.
Greg, garg eggs take ten years hatch, why? that is a mean blow for nature to give the gargs. do the embryos inside the eggs turn to stone? even so, that is egual to five years in incubation! why does it take so long for these embryos to mature?
I don't know. Can you think of a reason?
[ Gargoyle Science Question: ]
This probably looks a little silly, but I was just rereading my last posting and decided to reverse my thoughts on the matter.
Because gargoyles mate for life, it is probably very important to them to have someone fill that role in their lives. In an isolated clan with an unequal number of each sex for one generation, there would be very little hope of finding a mate for some of the clan members. With no possibility of mating with the equivalent of a widow, this would doom the "left-over" clan members to a lonely life, with a great gap to fill. Would this feeling cause them to bond to one-another?
This explaination is probably much less romantic then the one you would give, but I feel that there must be something in the biology and culture of a species that will at least allow for any given behavior to exist (just as you said that you did not think gargoyles would be found with a particular pashion or talent for architecture, as this was not an area where their talents were likely to be useful).
I guess this was much more of a ramble then a question. But again I would be very interested in hearing your response.
Did I say that about architecture? Is that an exact quote?
See my previous response for my explanation.
[ Gargoyle Science Question: ]
I have been reading through the archives lately, and was surprised to see that you believe that there would be homosexual relationships between gargoyles. This is not because of any personal moral problems; I was just wondering about the background of it within this species.
According to your other posts, gargoyles mate for life, and are driven by biological urges tied to certain scents peculiar to their mates. I would assume that even though each gargoyle has a particular scent, females' scents would be much more similar to eachother then to the scent of any male (and vice-versa). Therefore, I don't understand how two members of the same gender would become attracted to one another.
Furthermore, gargoyles only mate once every 20 years, and only lay one egg at a time. Being a warrior race, there is a probably a fair likelihood that at least one of the parents has died before more then one or two eggs have been laid, making it hard to keep up a sustainable population. It would seem that it would be of great import to the clan to have as many mated pairs as possible.
I guess this was more of a comment then a question, but I would very much like to hear your response to these thoughts.
I think your logic is flawed. Not that I'm a biologist. But taking humans as an example, it seems to me that there are plenty of people who are biologically geared to being homosexual (scents and all). In the nature/nurture argument, I think nurture has very little to do with it, save adding a sense of repression, generally.
I mean if it ain't biology, it's reincarnation or something.
So if that's the case with humans, why wouldn't it be the case with gargoyles. I've even read about homosexual ducks.
As to your "Furthermore", keep in mind that gargoyle mates have sexual relations as often as they are in the mood. Females are only fertile every twenty years. That doesn't define their sex drives. Or the males'. And yes, I do think there would be a cultural imperative toward mating pairs. But maybe the cultural imperative to find a soulmate for life would be even stronger.
is it possible that Demona could lay an egg every twenty years since she is biologically a middle aged garg and (probably) still responds to those Earth rythm things? do gargs mate any time they want or only every twenty years? did Demona have sex with Thailog? sorry about the vulgar questions... :)
Gargoyles potentially have sexual relations more often than once every twenty years. Fertility and lust are two separate issues, not that they are mutually exclusive either.
In theory, Demona could lay an egg every twenty years, assuming she had a mate who mated with her when she was fertile. That hasn't been the case.
As to Thailog, to be blunt, the answer is almost certainly yes. But they broke up years before Demona would be fertile again.
You've said that gargoyles concieve eggs every twenty years and the eggs take ten years to hatch. What are the intervals for gargoyle beasts?
Hey Greg, I found this at IMDB and wondered what it was:
You and some others from Garg. are named. Just wondering.
'Nother question: How many eggs to gargs lay at once? Can it be more than one?
What's an IMDB?
One egg at a time.
1) If a Gargoyle dies at night, what happens to the remains, do they turn into stone? If they do turn into stone, do the reamins continue to rot at night?
2) How exactly do Gargoyles have eggs? Does the female carry the eggs for a term and then lay out those huge eggs? Or do they lay something small that slowly matures and get larger?
3) Are Gargoyles warm-blooded? Cold-blooded?
4) Where do Gargoyles get the extra bodily mass when they turn into stone?
1. I've answered this before. No. A dead gargoyle stays in whatever form it was in when last alive.
2. The female does carry the egg for a short term. The eggs are soft when laid, and don't get hard until the first sunrise after being laid. They stay hard after that, until the hatching.
3. Generally, I'd say they are warm-blooded. Though they might fall under a third category.
4. Who says they have extra body mass?
Hey Greg, i Was wondering, what's the maximum amount of eggs, that a gargoyle female can lay in a lifetime?
is it possible that the closest living relative of the gargates would be the platypus? i mean, if you compare them its interesting. both are warm blooded, egg laying while still nurse their young, have claws and beaks! they are probably even more similiar but i'm trying to remember the features of the platapi from a discovery channel show from a long time ago. this is probably a really stupid question but its really late and i can't tell. good night.
I suppose it's possible, but I'm not ready to call the platypus a gargate without more evidence than the relatively superficial things that you mentioned.
I was just wondering, if a gargoyles died in battle would they turn to stone, or stay in their flesh form? Because I belive that in "Future Tense" it showed Hudson in stone and he was said to dead, or was that just some type of a memorial? Just wondering....
That was a BRONZE memorial. Not stone. Metal. Not him. A statue.
When a garg dies, he or she stays in whatever form he or she was in when he or she died. Presumably, any garg that died in battle was flesh when he or she died. Thus they'd stay flesh.
was sevarius' theory of gargs storing solar energy ever confirmed? i assume it was.
I buy it.