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Rewatched the "Avalon" triptych on DVD today. A few new observations.
The Magus's lyre in the "flashback on Avalon" scene looks a lot like Merlin's lyre in "A Lighthouse in the Sea of Time". Obviously not the same one, but evidently both wizards share a common taste in musical instruments.
Princess Katharine and the Magus's telling Elisa "Little is known of the Sleeping King" struck me as all the more appropriate since in 995, nearly all the major works on King Arthur had yet to be written (Geoffrey of Monmouth's "History of the Kings of Britain", the oldest extant start-to-finish account of Arthur's life, wouldn't be written for over a hundred years). There were one or two, like Nennius's "Historia Brittonum", but that was about it.
A detail that I hadn't spotted before: a couple of gargoyle-like sculptures were "guarding" the bridge leading to Arthur's resting-place within the Hollow Hill.
King Arthur and Goliath have both used a mace while fighting Macbeth (Goliath did so in "Enter Macbeth") - one of a few points in common they share (others are awakening in the modern world from a long enchanted sleep, and having scheming illegitimate sons).
The Archmage's boast that he could destroy Goliath with "just a word" struck me as apt, since all the "enhanced Archmage"'s spells were one-word ones ("Vessel", "Revert", "Ice", etc.).
It's difficult not to smile at Elisa's "Souvenirs" question after Season One of "Young Justice". Fortunately, she was asking it in a lighthearted tone.
Certain elements run through my work, I suppose...
I remember reading your response to a Gargoyles question about Tom's, Katherine's, and Magus's ages. You said that in 994, the Magus was 28, Katharine was 18, and Tom was 8. Katherine was a full ten years older than Tom was, so when did they start developing feelings for each other and when did they begin a relationship? Obviously, the flashback was shown that Tom was a full grown adult by the time he entered a romantic relationship with Katherine. Did they ever feel bothered by the huge age gap between them? Was their relationship ever met with disapproval because of it, even if Tom was an adult? I know it was a different period back then, so marriages between couples with age gaps were pretty common.
I'm surprised that depicting a relationship with two people with a ten-year age gap was approved by the network back then. I fully support Katherine and Tom's relationship, though! :D They were both adults when they got into their relationship, so there's nothing wrong with it, even though other people may not agree.
They didn't become romantic until he was full grown. It did trouble them, Katharine especially, but ultimately they got past any concerns. I'm not sure who was there to disapprove. The Magus didn't feel he had the right to disapprove, and the young gargoyles already regarded them as parental figures.
And we had no network to tell us no. We were syndicated in Season Two.
1. This is something I've never really understood, but if Princess Katharine disapproved so heavily of the Gargoyles, why did she even bother to continue the alliance with them? Regardless of what they did for the castle, she was unappreciative and acted as though they were nothing but monsters, getting offended so much by even the mention of one of them. If she had such a problem with the gargoyles, why didn't she want to get rid of them, like saying killing them in their sleep? Okay, that would probably be too bloodthirsty even for her at that time, but still, she certainly acted like she would much rather have them gone all together, so why didn't she end their alliance as soon as she succeeded her father?
2. Would you say that Katharine's later change in character was due mostly to the Captain's betrayal? Not really because she had mistreated the gargoyles, but the fact she mistreated someone who gave her his loyalty and in return she immaturely snubs him. She can't put the betrayal on anyone but herself because she ended up alienating someone who served her faithfully and who was in fact an important member of her court. Basically, the whole thing just made Katharine see what a horrible leader she had been. And of course Goliath rescuing of her, while losing his whole clan also made an impact on her, making her see he wasn't a savage as she believed him to be.
3. Why exactly did the Captain chase after Katharine and Hakon, when he knew that the latter's intention was to kill her? Did he want to talk him out of it because she had more value alive or did he actually want to save her out of some bit of honour? Why didn't he try to make a run for it before the gargoyles got to him? The fact that Goliath found him with Hakon is how he put two and two together over his betrayal
4. The Magus had a spell in place to stop the gargoyles in case they got out of hand, but why didn't he make any kind of counter measures for the Vikings? Granted, he's not that powerful, but seems like he might still be a theart with the Grimorum. Did the Captain make sure to neutralise him before the attack began?
5. Okay, I understand that this needed to happen in order to set up the basically entire plot of the show, but the Magus decision to curse the gargoyles for indirectly causing what he mistakenly believed to be Katharine's death just seemed so…….ludicrously rash.
I know Hakon said he was going to kill her and Magus was probably letting his own feeling of love cloud his mind, but by all account he really didn't know what had happened to her. I mean she did manage to make a run for it and a minute later Magus was screaming for someone to help her. He then just, somewhat stupidly, assumed she had been killed, even though he never heard a scream, nor did he try to look for her body to confirm that she was in fact dead. After he got free of his ropes, he doesn't seem to hold out even a desperate shred of hope that she may still be alive or that there may still be chance to save her, even though he had no real confirmation of death.
As soon as he sees the gargoyles, he pretty much writes Katharine off as dead and blames it on them. I just find it hard a bit hard to shallow that Magus would just so readily assume that the women he loved was dead without even seeing it happen. Did it all really just amount to him overacting because of his feelings for her? Seems to me like his personal prejudice of the gargoyles probably played a role in it as well, since that would make his accusation of them more justified. They're the monster, so it makes sense that they killed her, even if it's indirectly. As soon as he sees them, he directs all his anger toward them. Even later when Goliath shows up, he's more than ready to do the same to him, but then sees Katharine is safe and he becomes truly horrified by what he's done to the gargoyles. I would say he's even more horrified by the fact he did it all on such an emotional overreaction. Is this close to what he was feeling? It's kinda the interpretation that I take from it, but I'm curious if there is some more justification for the Magus rashness?
1. Katharine was hardly about throwing away all her father's policies. If he put it in place she maintained it. I think she was smart enough to see the gargoyles as, at minimum, a necessary evil - as long as they were clearly being controlled by the Captain or the Magus or some human she could trust.
2. All of the above, I suppose. But I'm happy to leave that to each viewer's interpretation.
3. I'd have to view it again, but my memory was that they were running and hoping not to get caught.
4. The latter. Can't cast many spells without your magic book.
5. Listen again, There was a scream after she ran, which to the Magus sounded like a death scream, like Hakon had caught up to her and killed her. I know this scream is there. Because I made sure to put that scream in there for just that reason. So, on the one hand, I don't disagree with your interpretation, but it's not LUDICROUSLY rash, in my opinion. Just plain old regular rash.
We know that, when Elisa dies, she's going to receive a Wind Ceremony, despite being human, because she's a full-fledged member of the clan. With that in mind...
1)Is she going to be the first human to receive a Wind Ceremony?
2)If, back in the middle ages, the Captain of the Guard had died without betraying the clan, would he have been given a Wind Ceremony?
3)If the Magus hadn't asked specifically to stay in the Hollow Hill, would he have been given a Wind Ceremony?
4)What about Katharine and Tom? When they die, are they going to receive Wind Ceremonies?
1. That seems unlikely.
2. Odds are he would have received human burial.
4. No spoilers.
And here's two questions about the Magus. I read one of your answers stating that you have considered giving him a name.
1. If you have chosen a name for him, any chance you can tell us?
2a. Was the Magus born at Castle Wyvern or did he travel there to become the Archmage's apprentice.
2b. If he wasn't born there, where was he born?
1. If I have, I don't recall.
2a. No Spoilers.
2b. No Spoilers.
I have a couple of questions about the "teleport to Avalon" spell cast by the Magus and later Tom in "Avalon, Part One".
Tom was able to cast the spell without using the Grimorum. Can anybody who knows the incantation cast the spell, or was Tom a special case because he had previously seen and heard the Magus cast it from the Grimorum? Or was he a special case for some other reason?
Did Elisa, Goliath, and/or Angela cast the spell to return to Avalon during their World Tour, or did the boat take them back to Avalon on its own?
Hm. Good question. I'm going to posit that this was a very powerful spell, needing only an aural component. Once learned, it worked without assistance.
When the Magus handed over the Grimorum to Mary and Finella after casting the "teleport to Avalon" spell, why didn't he tear out and destroy the page with the teleportation spell? He had seen Hakon tear out and destroy another of the Grimorum's pages, so he knew that it could be done; and it would prevent Constantine from pursuing them to Avalon even if he did obtain the Grimorum.
The book was so holy to him, I don't think the thought occured. I mean, why not destroy the entire thing? It just wasn't the way he was trained.
1. Do the Captain of the Guard, Magus, Archmage, and Emir have first and last names?
1. The Captain's first name is Robbie.
1a. The Magus and the Archmage have first names at least.
1b. The Emir has first and last names at least.
In Avalon Part II, why do the Weird Sisters say they are "banished from [Avalon] by a magicians parlor tricks"? Did the magus do more than turn them into owls or was it part of Oberon's law?
Oberon's law kept them off the island. The Magus kept them at bay.
Hello Greg, I have a Gargoyles question. This is the first of a few questions on episode specifics that I've been building up over the years.
When I was reading the Avalon rambles and I came to the point of the Magus' death, this thought occurred to me: was he buried? I have this impression that you've said he was left in the Hollow Hill, and its magic prevents decay. Do Katherine and Tom view the Hollow Hill as a burial? It is tomb-like, or catacomb-like. But it does not strike me as being a burial in the six feet of dirt sense. I mean, he has no coffin.
It's a tomb.
Did you ever consider giving the Magus a name beyond his title as, well, Magus?
Hi Greg, this is a rather silly question...
I was watching the "Avalon" trilogy the other day, and it came to the part where King Arthur, Elisa, and the Magus arrived at Oberon's Palace after Arthur is awakened. Elisa introduces Arthur to Goliath and the others, and Arthur comments that he needs someone to tell him "what is going on".
So, here's the thing...I find it hard to believe that neither Elisa nor the Magus gave Arthur any background info on the walk back from the Hollow Hill. Were they talking at all? ( I know if I were personally taking a hike with King Arthur, I would be embarassed to say anything dumb and would just cast sidelong glances at him awkwardly lol).
I imagine Arthur was largely still in recovery mode from a LONG sleep.
There may have also been some delaying tactics on the part of Elisa and the Magus as they struggled to figure out exactly how to explain everything.
Mostly, my answer is "Use your imagination!" ;)
In the first flashback of Reawakening we see Demona and Goliath arguing as they head to a tower of the castle. At the top of the tower is the gargoyle known as Othello. We also find out that Magus is up there too, until he storms off once Goliath and Demona arrive. What were Othello and Magus doing up there on that tower together? Was Magus taking a breather up there and Othello happened to glide to the tower right at the same moment as Demona and Goliath arrived (which seems very coincidental)? Or were Magus and Othello talking/meeting there for a reason? And if thatâs the case, what were they talking about? I find this odd since Magus seemed to hate all the gargoyles at that point of time.
Thank you for your time and all that you do,
I'd have to watch it again.
I still don't understand how magic works in the world of the Gargoyles?
Human magic seems to be incantation based, but mystical beings/creatures also could use incantations or thought magic at whim?
Is there a difference between magic users' power if they speak a spell versus just thinking of it, kind of like the old English belief in word magic?
I was watching the Magus fighting against the weird sisters and it looked like they were evenly matched with the Grimorum giving the Magus an advantage over them.
The Magus got a lucky shot in, basically, if you're talking about his confrontation with them outside Avalon.
Beyond that, the rest of your question has been answered. Check out the ASK GREG Magic archive.
Why didn't the Magus just throw the Grimorum into the body of water the group was in before entering Avalon or burn it with a torch before entering Avalon, instead of forcing Finella to go into a life of hiding from Constantine and forcing Mary to do the same AND abandoning her son?
And, how could Mary just abandon her son like that? I mean, I've heard of the "Parental Abandonment" trope being used for the sake of good drama (and it did turn out to be good drama in Gargoyles), but I find it a little ridiculous that she believed that leaving her only son at such a young age was the best course of action.
Oh, and here's that trope if you're interested (I <3 TVTropes):
Destroying the Grimorum isn't that easy. And given that fact, the need to protect it and thus protect Tom from being attacked on Avalon by Constantine made Mary's decision necessary. It wasn't abandonment at all. It was her staking out a defensive position to protect her son.
This day in Gargoyles' Universe History....
Anton Sevarius begins to clone Goliath.
The Magus passes away inside the Hollow Hill.
This day in Gargoyles' Universe History....
Macbeth and Demona attack the humans and gargoyles at Oberon's Palace, while the Magus faces off against the Weird Sisters at the Hollow Hill, and Goliath and Angela seek out the Archmage at the Grotto. At first things look grim, but Princess Katharine defeats Demona with help from Ophelia, the Guardian, Elisa Maza, Gabriel, Bronx and Boudicca. King Arthur Pendragon also defeats Macbeth, and the Magus captures the Weird Sisters, though it fatally weakens him. Goliath battles the Archmage, who uses the Phoenix Gate to bounce them around through Time and Space. But the Archmage cannot shake Goliath, and returns to the present, where Goliath succeeds in removing the Eye of Odin from his brow. Without the Eye, the energy from the Grimorum Arcanorum burns the Archmage to death from the inside out. The battle is over.
This day in Gargoyles' Universe History....
Goliath, Angela and Gabriel attempt to steal the Eye of Odin and the Phoenix Gate from the Archmage. They fail. Meanwhile, Elisa Maza and the Magus succeed in waking the Sleeping King, Arthur Pendragon.
This day in Gargoyles' Universe History....
Westminster Abbey, built by Edward the Confessor, is consecrated.
David Xanatos, who is scheduled to be released from jail in one week, is contacted by Macbeth, who offers to rid the castle of gargoyles.
Goliath and Tom the Guardian meet at Belvedere Castle in Central Park. Together with Elisa Maza and Bronx, they depart for Avalon, where they are introduced to the grown hatchlings of the Wyvern Clan, including Angela, Gabriel and Boudicca, and reunited with the Magus and Princess Katharine. Meanwhile, a recently transformed Archmage travels back in time...
Questions concerning Avalon Parts 1 - 3:
1) Will we see the adventures of Tom in any of the Gargoyles Spinoffs or main comic?
2) Will there be any repercussions for waking up King Arthur "early" and will we see those repercussions in the comics? If so, which comic?
3) Who's face is represented on the front of the Avalon boats?
4) Who's face is represented at the watery gateway to Avalon, where Magus turned the Weird Sisters into owls?
5) Do all 36 Avalon Gargoyles survive the Archmage's assault?
6) Any chance the magic in the sleeping hill will one day revive Magus or is he dead and gone forever?
1. Yes, eventually.
2. Yes. Pendragon, among others.
3. Not revealing that at this time.
6. Who am I to kill hope? Hope lives eternal. The Magus, on the other hand, is dead.
This day in Gargoyles' Universe History....
Quincy Hemings becomes White House Chief Steward.
Matt finds and confronts Mace Malone at Pine Lawn Cemetery. Malone offers Matt an Illuminati membership on the condition that he pass a loyalty test. As a show of good faith, Malone tells Matt about the gargoyles and Elisa's involvement with them. Matt stews about the information for most of the night, i.e. for most of his shift with Elisa. The ghosts of Hakon and the Captain hear Tom talking to himself. They discover that Goliath is possibly still alive. Tom returns to Avalon to discuss this latest news with the Magus and Princess Katharine.