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Demona Taina writes...
In Hunter's Moon I (or was it two?) Xanatos said: "It looks like this Mr. Carter could cause a bit of trouble for our old friend Goliath," referring to the reporter, Jon Canmore in disguise. But something dawned on me this morning, and I can't tell you how hard I laughed when I realized that this "Jon Carter" could actually be an inside joke of the episode Vendettas! When I realized that Xanatos' could've been referring to the bazooka causing Goliath trouble! So, was it an inside joke of the infamous Mr. Carter, Vinnie's banana cream pie bazooka? Because I very much doubt that it was a coincidence!
BTW, Vendettas is one of my favorite episodes! It's so funny!! And I love how everything falls into place as if it was written as a whole! Thanks again for such a wonderful show that still brings joy to my days. :)
Greg responds...
It wasn't a coincidence. It was a throwaway.
Anonymous writes...
Regarding John Castaway/Jon Canmore, how exacly did he make contact with the Illuminati?
Greg responds...
I'm not revealing the specifics right now, though I will say that the Hunters and Illuminati have been aware of each other for quite some time.
Fiona Seckari writes...
Dear Mr. Weisman,
I have a questoin for you, and I am fully aware that you will probably exercise you're right to not answer it because it is a question that could possibly involve a lot of writting, that you haven't given any thought to, don't feel like answering, or just be stupid. So, I thank you so much for you're time :) and for such a kick'n show :) and for the super hot character of Puck :D so here's my question:
In "The City of Stone" flashback after Mac Beth successfully wins the battle against Duncan, he exilles Prince Canmore. What happens to him right after the guards take him away? Do they put him on a boat straight to England? Does he get an escort? Does he get to pack? Do they feed him? Does he try to escape again?
2. Is the Prince Canmore in "The City of Stone" full name Malcom Canmore III ?
I realize I am probably just being curious about silly stuff in a really awesome show, but I'm so curious about it I just have to ask! Plus, even if curiousity killed the cat, satisfaction brought her back! LOVE YA!
Greg responds...
1. Well, I doubt he took a boat from Scotland to England. He was probably escorted there, with messengers sent ahead so that the English would expect his arrival. Did they feed him en route? Yes. Did he get to pack? I don't know. Probably not. Does he try to escape? No. I think at this point he goes to England and tries to win the English over to his side.
2. Canmore = Malcolm III = Malcolm Canmore = Maol Chalvim III = Ceann Mor = Big Head
Vashkoda writes...
You said in a chat in '97 that, "in my mind, he [Jon Canmore/Castaway] approached the Illuminati, who for their own reasons, funded the Quarrymen."
1a) How and for how long did he know that the Illuminati really existed? b) Do the other Canmores know about the Illuminati (before Robyn joins the Redemption Squad)?
2) How did he know where to find the Illuminati? I found your statement that *he* was the one to approach *them* rather interesting, as I would have assumed that it's usually the Illuminati who establish first contact with someone.
3) Does Castaway become a member of the Illuminati?
Greg responds...
1a) I think the Canmore's have known for quite some time. The Hunters and the Illuminati may have been useful to each other from time to time.
b) I would think so. At least to some extent.
2. But this wasn't first contact. All he needs is a contact. The message would work its way up the pyramid, so to speak.
3. I don't know.
Shadowman writes...
Hello Greg,
Im a big fan of the gargoyles and all and I was wondering if the gargoyles were still on the air would you bring back the Hunter? and few other questions.. how many Hunters were in the gargoyle history? I know they were 1 in the ancient times and 3 in the present and McBeth was kind of one... and the other question if you did brought back the Hunter what kind of look would he have? a High Tech-ish look more beyond what the 3 Hunters had?
Greg responds...
I don't know exactly how many hunters there have been. We've shown a sampling, including Gillecomegain, Duncan, Canmore, the Renaissance Hunter, Charles Canmore, Jason Canmore, Robyn Canmore, Jon Canmore. And, as you said, briefly, Macbeth. Fiona Canmore would have appeared in Team Atlantis, had that show gone forward, and Robyn would have continued as the Hunter in Bad Guys (though she'd largely be hunting other bad guys, not gargs) had that show gone forward.
There are more Hunters in the past, including some specific ones that I have in mind. But I won't pretend I've run the entire Canmore line from Canmore to Jon out in my head and listed every single one.
As for moving forward, I see the Hunters waning in favor of the waxing Quarrymen. But I'm not talking in absolutes.
F7 Addict writes...
I was sitting down watching Hercules-The ani.series. It ended and I started watching the credits(a habit I've formed since working at a movie theater). When what to my wandering eye should appear but Jon Weismen. Any relation?
Greg responds...
YEP. My kid brother. His name and my sisters', though not their personalities, were used for the two younger Hunter siblings, Robyn & Jon Canmore.
Anonymous writes...
As of 1996 are there any hunters besides Jason, Robyn, Jon and Fiona?
Greg responds...
Not officially. But there may be other Canmores. And Fiona was retired by that time. Largely.
Anonymous writes...
Since Jon and Robyn were named after your siblings why didn't you name Jason after yourself?
Greg responds...
Too arrogant even for me.
Gipdac writes...
You said Fiona was a hunter, was her twin-brother?
Greg responds...
Yes.
Gipdac writes...
1) Did the "Renaissance Hunter" (the one from 1495) have a name?
2) If yes, what was it?
Greg responds...
1. Yes.
2. Blank Canmore.
Zarok writes...
If given the chance would Robyn Canmore continue to hunt Demona
Greg responds...
I tend to think not, but some things are situational.
Gipdac writes...
What is Fiona Canmores' twin brother/Charles Canmores father/Jason, Robyn, Jon's grandfather's name?
Greg responds...
Ugh. I'm fairly certain that Fiona's twin brother is named Jackson. But I've charted so many Canmores that I get confused sometimes, and I don't have that chart with me. I can't remember for sure. Ask me again later.
(But I'm pretty sure that Jackson is Fiona's twin brother. That Jackson was the father of Aron who was the father of Charles who was the father of Jason, Robyn & Jon. And I know Fiona's great-grandfather was Angus.)
Anonymous writes...
Monmouths
What do the Monmouths think of gargoyles in 2198? Are they pro-gargoyle?
Greg responds...
Generally.
Anonymous writes...
How did Gillecomgain become such a good assassin? He was a peasant by birth. What ever happened to his father?
Greg responds...
1. Practice, practice, practice.
2. Hee, hee, hee.
Anonymous writes...
1.Did Jason, Jon and Robyn receive any training at hunting gargs? Who did they receive it from?
2.Do the Canmore siblings know of Fiona? What do they think of her?
3.Were the similarities between the Canmore siblings and the Phantom (kit walker) intentional? I mean both are from families who are obsessively hunting the Demon/fighting crime for hundreds of years and both have their parents killed when they were young?
4.Who was the Canmore siblings' mother? What happened to her? Is she still alive?
Greg responds...
1. Yes.
1a. The Canmore Clan.
2. Yes.
2a. When?
3. Not particularly.
3a. My familiarity with the Phantom is limited at best, I'm afraid.
4. Not saying at this time.
Anonymous writes...
How did Fiona stay alive for so long?
Does she still hunt gargs in 1996?
Greg responds...
Not saying.
Anonymous writes...
I just noticed that Charles Canmore's Hunter costume was most similar to Jon Canmore's Hunter costume was this symbolic of both men unable to give up the tradition of the hunt while Robyn and Jason it seems were able to give up the hunt? If not why did the two costumes of Charles and Jon resemble each other?
Greg responds...
Each and every Hunter costume is a variation on the original's basic theme.
Some of what you've noticed may be due more to coincidence rather then intent. Otherwise you'd have to ask the costume's designers.
Gipdac writes...
*Macbeth/Demona/Hunter/2198*
1) Do the Canmore siblings (The Hunters) know about Macbeth (What, with his still being alive and all)?
2) Have they ever tried to hunt him?
3) Does Macbeth have any descendants living by 1996?
4) Do the Canmores (at least the ones descended from Jon) still hunt Demona in 2198?
Greg responds...
1. Not saying.
2. Not saying.
3. Not saying.
4. There are no more Canmores, at least not of that line. But the Castaways still hunt her. Her and all gargoyles through the Quarrymen.
Ambrosia writes...
Hi, Greg!
*Greatly* enjoyed the radio play. Thank you so much!
So...
Did the cut scene of Hunter's Moon III between Elisa and Jason in the decimated clock tower actually happen in the gargoyles universe, just off camera?
Greg responds...
Uh... I'd like to think so, yes.
Greg "Xanatos" Bishansky writes...
Since Aaron mentioned it in his Gathering Diary, I figured now would be the time to ask.
I bought a copy of "The Hunter's Moon" Part 3 Radio Play script at the auction. I don't want to post it on the internet without your permission, so may I put it up?
I'll understand perfectly if you'd rather I didn't. I'll abide by your decision.
Greg responds...
Up to you. But thanks for asking.
Lord Sloth writes...
Hunter's moon part 1 questions:
1) When Jason said he had heard of alligators in the sewers, and Elisa said she could tell him stories, was she talking totaly about gargoyles, or has she ever had an experience with an alligator in a sewer? What would she have told him if the thiefs hadn't interupted?
2)Why do Demona's thugs need to steal DI7 disenfectant if it was a comonly used cleaner? Why not just buy it?
3a) Where do the hunter trio get the money for all their technoligy? I'm guessing stealing, but I dunno. b) did they get their airship from cyberbiotics? How? c) Have they ever hunted and or killed a gargoyle(s) before?
4) Did older hunters use real raven's or halks (or whatever that mech bird was) when hunting Gargs?
5) why didn't Gilcomgain's <sp?> scratches bleed a bit more when he was talking to his daddy?
Greg responds...
1. Nothing. Been a while since I saw this, but I believe that she was talking about gargoyles. And she wouldn't have told him anything.
[I should note that I am currently on vacation at my in-laws using their web-tv. The keyboard is stiff and various keys, the r in particular, stick. I don't think I have the patience to put up with this for long.]
2. It wasn't commonly used. It was in work to be commonly used.
3. They have a substantial Canmore Trust. The ship's designers have not been revealed. They have been hunting Demona since they were kids. Whether or not they had also hunted and/or killed other gargs has yet to be revealed.
4. Yes.
5. As opposed to when?
Anonymous writes...
Did you develop the character of Fiona Canmore before Team Atlantis? If so what were your original plans for her?
Greg responds...
No. I developed her brother before Team Atlantis. When that opportunity arose, I just gave the brother a twin sister.
FYI, if you're interested in learning more about Fiona...
Come to G2002.
(Waves to Siryn.)
Mara writes...
Hi! It was great seeing you again at this year's Gathering. (Insert tons of compliments, comments and the like, regarding that event).
Anyway, you wrote:
I don't have any more plans for the pie gun.
But I have very specific plans for the guy the pie gun was named after.
And I just, belatedly, realize that Carter is the alias that Jon Canmore uses in Hunter's Moon. If I remember correctly, that in your plans, Castaway was NOT Jon Canmore... is he (Canmore) the one you are referring to?
It always seemed to me that Jon having access to TV, via being a newscaster, had more influence to the public at large than being the head of an obvious Klan rip-off.
So, be oblique and witty about this?
Greg responds...
No, in my development Canmore was definitely Castaway.
It's the people who took over from me who didn't seem to want to acknowledge that.
... as for the original to Mr. Carter.... I'm not in the mood to reveal that right now...
But, hey, Mara, where's your Gathering diary, huh?
Anonymous writes...
Is Fiona named after a relative of yours?
Greg responds...
Nope.
Gipdac writes...
1) Do the Canmore siblings (The Hunters) know about Macbeth (What, with his still being alive and all)?
2) Have they, or any other Canmores, ever tried to hunt him?
3) Does Macbeth have any descendants living by 1996?
4) Do the Canmores (at least the ones descended from Jon) still hunt Demona in 2198?
Greg responds...
1. Not saying.
2. Not saying.
3. No.
4. Yes.
Gipdac writes...
How does Jon Castaway (Canmore) die?
Greg responds...
Mortally.
Jim R. writes...
1. In "Journey" you introduced John Castaway. Would he be involved in any way, in any of your spinoffs? The reason I ask is, I know he won't be alive in 2198. (Maybe his great grandson or some relative) But other than 2198 are you planning anything more with him?
2. Since I know you only worked on one episode of TGC, would you personally (should your spinoffs come back to TV) ignore what has taken place in the remaining episodes of the TGC seeing how you were not involved in their creation? Or were some of the TGC episodes ideas yours which you were planning before your contract ran out? I don't think some episodes can be completely ignored. However I hated that in TGC, they killed off the clones. What is your take on this?
3. By the way, since the Gathering 2001 is over, may I ask if there was any petitioning done to jumpstart Gargoyles and make it TV-borne again? If so, how'd it go?
Greg responds...
1. Yes.
2. I've answered this before too. My current thinking, which is not etched in stone, is to ignore what I don't consider canon. Enough time has passed and any new episodes would need to stand on their own two feet anyway. If anyone's confused about contradictions between TGC and the new stuff, they can check out the internet site that we will have to clarify all this stuff.
3. I didn't see any petitions. Feel like starting one? I'd focus on DVD's for now.
Incidentally, your post here should theoretically have been broken up into three posts, since your questions were on three separate topics. I haven't reminded people of that in a while. I ignored the rule breaking this time, but don't make a habit of it.
Vashkoda writes...
Hi Greg. CrzyDemona revealed what she'd discovered when you invited her to the recording of one of the "Team Atlantis" episodes. So Fiona is a Canmore, and she'll have some kind of encounter/involvement with Demona in Paris? I'm wondering....
1a) Since Jon, Jason and Robyn's father died hunting Demona at Notre Dame, and Fiona was born in 1888, is Fiona a part of their branch of the Canmore family? b) What is her relation to the Canmore trio we know (I'm assuming the obvious, but I'd like confirmation).
2) Does this mean that the "Gargoyles" and "Atlantis" universes are one and the same?
Greg responds...
Let's start with the fact that Crzy got in a bit of trouble for revealing what she did. She's lucky I love her so dearly.
The reason she got in a bit of trouble, is because I GOT IN A BIT OF TROUBLE. Team Atlantis is coming out in the fall of 2002. We are way jumping the gun by talking about it now.
Having said that, both Tad Stones (the Executive Producer of Team Atlantis) and Greg Guler (the character designer of Team Atlantis) kind of went on about the show at the Gathering. So now I'm in less trouble. But I'm reluctant to reveal very much more before G2002, when Tad has agreed to throw all of us a rather large bone.
But for now, I'm not going to reveal anything else that's in the episode.
Fortunately for you Vash, you've asked questions that aren't answered in the episode.
1. Fiona is the twin sister of Jason, Robyn and Jon's grandfather. That is, she's their great aunt. Is that the obvious answer you were assuming?
2. No. But they overlap in Paris in 1920.
By the way, Vash, it was fun seeing you at the Gathering. :)
Corrine Blaquen writes...
How would Macbeth react to the Canmore siblings? They are, after all, descendants of his arch-nemeses, and overall the family hasn't proven to be very honorable.
Greg responds...
He'd not be fond of them.
Vashkoda writes...
Just in case you haven't revealed who she is yet:
1) Is Fiona a blood relative to one or more "known" characters in the Gargoyles universe? ["known" being defined as a character(s) who was/were either shown in the show or who you have previously identified and discussed having plans for]
2) In which spinoffs do you have plans for her to appear in?
3) To which of the three surviving Earth races does she belong?
Greg responds...
1. Yes.
2. Gargoyles. Bad Guys. Maybe TimeDancer. Maybe Pendragon. Maybe New Olympians. Maybe Gargoyles 2198 in a flashback. Not Dark Ages.
3. Human.
Anonymous writes...
Who exactly is Fiona?
Greg responds...
A Canmore.
(And I'm only revealing this because someone ALREADY let the cat out of the bag. Naughty, naughty and you know who you are.)
Todd Jensen writes...
You've mentioned before that most humans in the Gargoyles Universe don't realize that the gargoyles are sentient beings, but see them merely as animals. Was the term "Hunter" for the various individuals from Gillecomgain down to the Canmores who were deliberately seeking out and destroying the gargoyles a reflection of this? As in, the gargoyles being perceived of as merely wild animals, like the everyday targets of hunters?
Greg responds...
Yes. Very much so. (But admit it, you knew that.)
"Farinelli" writes...
I was wondering what the translation of Gillecomgain's name would be.. Do you know?
Greg responds...
No. Is there a translation?
Anonymous writes...
Why did the Malcom Canmore's descendents start hunting Demona? I mean Demona didn't do anything to them?
Greg responds...
How do you know?
Anonymous writes...
You said that in the future the Castaways and Monmouths would be in conflict with each other so who does Jon marry somebody to have kids or does he adopt kids to continue his line? If he marries who does he marry?
Greg responds...
Not answering that now.
matt writes...
hey Greg!
what did Titania whisper to Fox in "The Gathering"?
where will Arthur and Griff find Merlin?
who is Lexington's mate?
how will Goliath and Elisa have a child?
did Iago have a mate? does he have a kid on Avalon?
what are the answers to 74 and 517 in the G2198 contest?
where do Jade and Turquesa go when they leave Avalon?
will Puck's prophecy from "Future Tense" come true?
how will Macbeth and Demona die?
will Jason Canmore ever be healed from his injuries?
will Xanatos and Fox have anymore children?
who will Delilah end up with?
and please fell free to describe the origens, workings and all available information concerning the Illuminati, the Korean Clan, the Space Spawn, locations and dates of Brooklyn's Timedancing, the story behind Hudson's death, the Redemption Squads adventures, Una's childhood, how the Banche regains her voice, Demona/Angela relationship, the economy of Ishimura, and what your favirote color is...
just kidding! April Fools!!!
Greg responds...
I will answer one of those questions.
"No."
Have fun guessing which one.
Thanks for warning me that it's April 1st, by the way.
As it's June when I am, I could have easily gotten fooled by the posts that follow, I imagine.
Duncan Devlin writes...
I just watched "The Journey" for the first time--amazing, huh.
Some questions about the Stonecutters.
1) Since the show was in a completely different time slot, was John Canmore and the Pie Guy supposed to be inside jokes?
2) Why were the Hunter slashed reduced to being part of the larger symbol instead of beingm like the old 3-slice masks. (As I write this, I think its ABC's fault)?
Greg responds...
I assume you mean the Quarrymen.
1. Inside jokes? Well, I wanted people to enjoy the episode even if they hadn't seen those characters before, but no, not inside jokes.
2. No, it wasn't ABC's fault. I don't think there's a fault at all. It wasn't supposed to be DEAD obvious that Jon Canmore and John Castaway were the same person. That is, I wanted to play fair with old fans, but I wanted a mystery for new ones.
Anonymous writes...
Who is Fiona?
Greg responds...
Not Nought.
Todd Jensen writes...
In the list of characters' ages that you printed just now to Mel Celestial (from King Arthur all the way down to Thailog), you included a certain "Fiona". Who is she? I don't recall anyone by that name in the series.
Greg responds...
Really?
Must be a reason for that, don't you think?
Todd Jensen writes...
One amusing little historical note about Canmore, which I must confess spooks me a little. In actual history, two of his sons, both of whom became Kings of Scotland after him, were named Alexander and David. In the context of "Gargoyles", I must confess that I find that a bit on the creepy side.
Greg responds...
You and me both, buster.
One of the many freaky little things leaking into our reality from the Gargoyles Universe.
Anonymous writes...
Is Jason Canmore your Mary Sue character?
Greg responds...
I'll say it again. Huh?
Corrine Blaquen writes...
What is Canmore's mother, Duncan's wife's, name?
Greg responds...
I can't remember. Can't even remember if I ever knew. Todd?
Heather N. Allen writes...
City of Stone...what a great miniseries! Not one of my specific favorite sets of episodes, but I love how everything storywise came together ('what a tangled web we weave'!) I ADORE continuing story lines, which is why I never got into many 'sitcom' cartoons. (I DO admit having a weakness for "Freakazoid", though...)
And thanks for explaining that whole screw up with Demona looking too old in that 'new' scene with the Captain of the Guard. That has always annoyed the heck outta me, but I wasn't thinking along the lines of the poor animators trying to keep things straight. Considering I want to go into some type of animation, I feel guilty for not being more thoughtful! ^_^
Now, on to some questions/musings/etc...
"If it turns out short, we can add the bit about 'Birnam Wood coming to Dunsinane', which I've left out for now."
1>You planned to use this witches' prophecy from the play in the show? How were you going to fit it in exactly?
This was one of my favorite ironies in the play (now that I've read it!), right next to the prophecy about Mac not being killed 'by a man of woman-born'. And if you think about it, that irony _was_ portrayed in the series. Demona isn't woman-born, and she certainly ain't a man! ^_~
"He gets in his helicopter heading for Studio, with Derek at pilot."
2> You mean you didn't have "Metamorphosis" planned out at this point in time? Or were you just confused? Or am I just confused...?
"Duncan goes to destroy them starting with Demona."
3> Whoa, hold on! I just thought of something...how'd Duncan know about Gil's feud with Demona specifically? Did Gil tell him? And did he pass on the legend of "The Demon" down to Canmore? How did the Eternal Hunt for the Demon get passed down (I mean, how did future Canmores specifcally know to hunt HER?)
"Duncan is killed in some way. (Preferably the same way Find & Gil bought it.)"
4> Well, we know he DIDN'T die this way. How did that whole magical orb thing come into the picture? Who's idea was it? (Yours? Mr. Reaves?)
"...To Demona, who is having a grand old time with the 'stoners'..."
"...She's practically giddy, talking to herself and the 'stoners'..."
"...In the skies above Manhattan, Xanatos & Goliath fly abreast for a moment as they 'pass gas'..."
>No questions here, I just thought that was funny. ^_~
>Hmm...I just ran this by spell check, and it suggested "manatees" for "Xanatos". How the heck do you get _manatees_ outta that?! There's no "X" in manatees! Sheesh!
Ciao, thanks again!
~H\A~
Greg responds...
1. Honestly, I no longer remember exactly. But it would have been part of Canmore's attack on Castle Moray. The one where Demona switched sides.
1a. I liked that irony too.
2. We didn't have the order of things planned out at that time. We knew Metamorphosis was coming. Didn't yet know where it would fall.
3. He didn't. (Now I think one of us IS confused.) She was hunted (a) because she was the only one left (as far as they knew) and (b) because of a little mishap with Canmore and one of his sons that I haven't told you about yet.
4. I don't remember. I'm guessing Michael (or Lydia or Brynne). Maybe they remember. Come to the Gathering this June in L.A. and ask them. All three will be there. (End of plug #562 in a series.)
5. Gotta keep myself amused, you know.
Chapter XXII: "City of Stone, Part One"
Time to Ramble on "City of Stone, Part One", which I watched the other night with my family....
Story Editor: Michael Reaves
Story: Michael Reaves
Teleplay: Brynne Chandler Reaves & Lydia Marano
Well, over a year had passed since we had revealed in "Enter Macbeth" that Macbeth had named Demona. Now we were gearing up to explain that little tidbit of info. I'm curious to know how many people were still focused on that before the "PREVIOUSLY ON GARGOYLES..." reprised it.
City of Stone was a story I had conceived originally (but briefly) as a Direct to Video movie. My boss Gary Krisel rejected it. He felt that a movie featuring the Gargoyles needed to feature our heroes a LOT MORE than this story did. Nevertheless, he liked the concept of the HUNTER a lot. So I got him to agree to let us do City of Stone as a multi-parter for the series. And I promised that Michael and I would come up with a new Hunter story that focused more on our heroes. Thus Hunter's Moon was born -- as a Home Video, originally, and we had an ending to shoot at for the entire second season.
Meanwhile, I couldn't actually disagree with Gary too much. This was Demona and Macbeth's story. The origin of two of our major villains. We had some great animation on this from Koko in Korea. Not as strong as our WDTVJapan stuff, but still very good.
What was the terrorists' cause, you might ask? I'm not telling. At the time, I had no answer. We were vague on purpose. Since then, I've come up with an answer. Now I'm being evasive on purpose.
I love Matt as a hostage negotiator.
But not as much as I love Brendan & Margot as hostages. They're a hoot.
How fast was everyone on the uptake with the Weird Sisters? Those three little girls. Even before the gargs showed, one was saying something like: "Don't worry, it'll be over soon." Did you think they were odd then? Did you notice them?
I like Brooklyn's "Don't gush" line.
When the Weird Sisters tell Goliath they weren't talking about THAT terrorist, my six year old daughter Erin said: "I think they were talking about Demona." For Chanukah, I gave Erin a Kenner Brooklyn, Broadway and Hard-Wire Goliath (which I told her was a Goliath robot). My three year old son Benny got Goliath, Lex and Xanatos. So for the first time, while they watched they could play with the toys.
It's interesting to watch the first flashback SET. All sorts of old footage from Awakening Part One, mixed with new footage. It's all very seemless thanks to great editing by Bob Birchard. And it wasn't easy. Because there was considerable confusion overseas throughout City of Stone, in terms of which model of Demona to animate. We had her standard model. Plus one that was slightly older, for the second set of flashbacks in this episode. They were constantly mixing the models up. We'd call retakes whenever we could, but sometimes we decided just to make due. So you have the flashback from Awakenings, where Goliath tells Demona to stay behind. That's followed by us finally seeing what Demona and the Captain said to each other after Goliath left. No great revelation in that scene, but we figured it would be nice to finally reveal it. Plus we wanted to clarify things from Demona's point of view. But in some of those shots, Demona appears to have aged a bit.
We see Othello & Desdemona. We are allowed to do something in this episode that we couldn't really do for S&P reasons in Awakening. To personalize the victims of the massacre a bit. In Awakening, we only got to meet the survivors. Finally we meet the victims. Of course, we're still cheating a bit, since my excuse to S&P was that our audience already knew (1) that these two died and that (2) they survived in a sense in Coldstone. But it did, independent of previous episodes, allow the startling moment when Demona picks up a fragment of Othello's face. Of course, I tried to get tha fragment -- and all those fragments in the immediate vicinity -- to be the pieces that survived into Coldstone. I think that was semi-successful.
Demona's cowardice overwhelms the courage of her strongly held convictions. She flees. Benny: "The sun's gonna come up." Yep. She turns to stone, shedding a tear. That "TEARS OF STONE" image was so effective that I allowed it to repeat in the episode. Later, her tear drops onto the stone Goliath and seems to be coming from his eye. A nice visual variation on a theme.
Demona: "It worked! At last my clan is free of human rule!"
Erin: "No. It didn't work."
Later Erin sees Demona watching Goliath holding some smashed gargoyles' remains and crying "my angel of the night". Erin says: "He thinks that was her [Demona]." Now you may be wondering why I'm reprinting such obvious responses here. But they interest me. It really struck me this viewing that in this episode, despite the "Previously" segment and all the flashbacks, that you really would be lost if you were a new viewer. Is there anyone out there for whom City of Stone was your first Gargoyle experience? If so, I'd love to hear from you. Did you have a clue as to what was going on?
Demona's classic neurotic short-circuit: "What have I -- What have THEY done to you?" The motivation that writer's live for.
And a little hint of Avalon things to come, as we see Tom, Princess K and Magus depart with the eggs. How many people had given the eggs any thought since Xanatos told the gargs back in Awakening Two that they were the last of their kind? And did this little tidbit whet the appetite, or did you forget about it immediately? I was already planning the Avalon/Archmage/World Tour/Angela stuff.
Benny (out of nowhere) asks: "What happens if someone is frozen in the sky?" We discussed various possibilities. But we're still weeks away from getting around to seeing "The Price". So I didn't want to spoil that one for him.
The intro of Gillecomgain. Erin (who has seen these before once, long ago) suddenly remembers: "His face is gonna get scratched."
Now, back in the 20th century, Owen points out that Xanatos' tv override works for "Cable, as well." I always liked that.
I also like Demona's VERY convincing lie. At this point, we don't know how she's survived through the centuries. Maybe she did do it by stealing minutes of life from thousands of people. And maybe now, she and Xanatos will do the same on a citywide scale. I always thought it was a very elegant lie. What did you guys think? Did you buy it?
The "Watch or Listen but not both" stuff regarding the magic, wasn't just a convenient excuse to give us a Robbins expository scene later. I always felt that the magic our various sorcerors did couldn't be as simple as it seemed. Anyone who reads the spell out loud can do it? No. There are complex inflections, movements, etc. involved. Study and willpower, etc. This was an attempt on my part to demonstrate that it was about more than just being in range with someone who has a copy of a Grimorum page.
On the other hand, I do think we cheated a bit to trap Owen. That spell she reads is the City of Stone spell. Yet it seems to put Owen, of all people, into a trance. We talked about her nailing him some other way first. But it was too clumsy and time consuming, so we just cheated.
Gathering Clue: Demona to Owen: "You are the tricky one." And she wraps him up in iron cable.
Elisa's watching Casablanca. Great movie.
Phoebe is looking at Seline when she speaks to Luna. Like Demona aging, we had a hell of a time getting the overseas studio to keep the three sisters straight. I began to insist that each of their appearances on the storyboard was accompanied by a hair color chart. And once more, it's black for Seline, blonde for Phoebe and silver for Luna.
We also made a real effort to put subtle character distinctions between the three sisters. Seline is the hard case. Phoebe is the gentle one. Luna is the mystic. It was part of hinting that the Sisters would serve multiple purposes in the series. Some of which I still have not revealed.
Back to the past. The guard says "Maybe they won't come." Erin asks: "Maybe who won't come?" And then the gargoyles come. The guards are taken down, and Demona raises her mace into the air. Erin asks: "Are they dead?" And dad... equivocates.
I like that gargoyle (Demona's second) with the breast plate. John Rhys-Davies did his voice.
At this stage, Demona believes that these scattered gargoyles are all that are left in the world. A second later, three gargoyles she's never met show up. (Now, true, they're the Sisters. But I was trying to make a general point, hinting that sometimes characters make absolute statements when they flat out don't know what they're talking about. Audience members beware.)
Benny immediately figured out that the three old gargoyle females were the weird sisters, or as he put it: "They're the humans. The one's that disappeared." I.e. the kids that disappeared in the first sequence of the episode. That made me feel a little better. People are always telling me that I write stuff that is too adult for kids to get. I tell them that I try to write on multiple levels. So that the kids get what they need to get and that adults, etc. get more. But it's nice to get confirmation that the kids do get it on occasion. Particularly in an ep as complicated as this one.
Intro Findlaech, Gruoch, Bodhe and young Macbeth. I like how quickly they are all characterized in that scene. F is loyal. B is equivocal at best. Bodhe is already thinking about how to marry G off to advantage. "What about Macbeth? Is he a match for the lass?" Yeah, sure he's talking about chess. I came to have a great deal of contempt for the character of Bodhe. (Too be fair, I have no idea what the historical Bodhe's character was like.) And yet, almost simultaneously, I became fond of him too. He was SO human. SO flawed. SO afraid of the world. And yet SO desperate to tread water in it.
We also establish the "SIGIL OF MORAY" which will become an important prop throughout.
I like that little blushing moment of G & Mac's. But mostly, I like it because of B & F's reactions. Bodhe is suddenly nervous that Gruoch might, shall we say, lose something with Macbeth prematurely. Though he pushed them together, he now rushes to separate them. But it's too late. The connection has already been made. F just laughs.
Now... Enter the HUNTER. The Hunter got a sort of Steve Canyon intro. That is, he's been talked about by various people for the last few minutes, though we haven't gotten a look at him. (This was the technique used when Steve Canyon was first introduced in the comic strips.) Now he shows up, and I trust he isn't disappointing. Benny immediately says: "THat's the one that got scratched." Sharp boy. (Keep in mind, that we haven't yet seen the adult Gille, so we haven't seen his scarred face yet.)
I love this sequence. It's a great fight, full of great little touches, flourishes, etc. Great storyboarding work here.
Again, characters are revealed in a nutshell. Gruoch's already loyal. Bodhe's revealed to be a coward. Even when his daughter rushes downstairs, he stays above.
Findlaech dies. It's a classic Disney fall-to-one's-death death. But there is a difference. F is the good guy. Usually, that's done with the villain. Was anyone shocked?
I love how at this point, Macbeth is nothing but an annoyance to both Demona and the Hunter. I also love how complex Demona is. Under it all, she's really something of a romantic. She rescues the young lovers. Then can't believe she did it. She's trying to will herself to be cold. So that she won't feel anything. But it isn't natural. She's not a cold woman, though her plans often are. It's that divide that's generally gonna screw her up everytime.
When the Hunter first enters on Prince Duncan, we were supposed to (BRIEFLY) think he was there to attack the Prince as well. But I don't think that comes off even slightly.
And o.k., yes, Gillecomgain has a face to match the Hunter's mask. It's worse than Clark Kent and those glasses. Does Scotland really not know it's him? Believe it or not, that never even occured to me initially. (Yes, I'm a dope.) Now, I'll chalk it up to the notion that everyone figures he's TOO obvious a suspect. You can almost here the water cooler talk:
MacMorris: "Hey, MacTavish, have you ever noticed that that Gillecomgain guy has scars across his face just like the red marks on the Hunter's mask?"
MacTavish: "What are you saying, MacMorris? That Gillecomgain is so stupid, he'd wear a mask and then put his scars ON the mask? Not much of a disguise. Know what I think. I think the Hunter is trying to throw suspicion onto old Gilley."
MacMorris: "Oh, give me a break."
MacTavish: "Hey, pal, it worked with you."
I made a real effort to just have the Weird Sisters EVERYWHERE.
Back to the present. Someone dons a Hunter's Mask. How many knew it was Macbeth right away? I figured at the time that regular viewers would figure that out pretty darn quick. That didn't bother me. For them, I figured the mystery would be "WHY IN THE WORLD WOULD MACBETH DON A HUNTER'S MASK, WHEN THE HUNTER KILLED HIS FATHER?" I thought that mystery was at least as intriguing. Do you guys agree or disagree?
I also liked the variation on the mask. No eyes. Nothing. Modern technology.
Fox. Fox presented an interesting dilemma. What was Xanatos' attitude toward her in this? We already know he loves her. But he doesn't include her in the immortality thing with Demona. Why? Demona won't allow it? Or he thinks Demona won't? Or he doesn't fully trust D and won't risk Fox until he knows the set-up works?
And then he finds out that she did watch the broadcast. He had told her not to, but she did. He doesn't fill her in. (Not that there's much time.) Is he prepared to let her lose a minute from her life (as he believes has happened)? How would he have felt if Demona wasn't lying about that? At the end of her life, would an immortal Xanatos be desperate to give her that one minute back? Of course, given Fox's heritage, which I didn't know yet, it's possible, she'll outlive him by quite a bit. Course, anything's possible.
How's the cliff-hanger? We haven't seen the city yet, but we do get to see Owen, Fox and Elisa all turned to stone. We're so used to the Gargoyles in stone, but not humans. I thought it was sort of chilling. The more chilling, because we know from earlier in this very episode, what can happen when living beings are turned to stone. (The Wyvern Massacre.) Now we've seen this four-parter a bunch of times and we're used to it. But I'm curious as to how you all felt the first time you saw Part One.
Another interesting aspect, is that 3/4 of the threat is to characters that we consider to be villains. Or more than 3/4. In the past, young Macbeth has lost his father and is clearly at risk. And Demona is being hunted. In the present, Fox and Owen are stone. And Xanatos and Fox appear to be falling to their deaths. Sure, the clincher is Elisa. But I think it's a tribute to how well-rounded are villains are that we care what's going to happen to them. Can you imagine most cartoons making the death of the villains a cliff-hanger? People would simply cheer.
One little flaw: Elisa's facing the wrong way. It was easier to board that way, I'm sure. But I can't figure out why she would have been standing and facing that direction at sundown.
Comments welcome, as usual...
Vashkoda writes...
The Hunters had a mechanical bird with them when they attacked Goliath, Angela and Hudson.
1a) How did they acquire the bird? b) Which Hunter did it belong to?
2a) Were they the first Hunters to use a bird of any kind in their hunt for Demona? b) If not, how common was it, and what kinds of birds were used?
3a) Will Castaway use such a bird again? b) Will Robyn?
4) Did they really consider the bird to be all that useful? It was destroyed rather easily. Why didn't they use such a bird again?
Greg responds...
1a. Like most of their weaponry, they purchased basic tech and adapted it to their own use.
1b. Jon.
2a. No.
2b. Probably falcons.
3a. Maybe.
3b. Maybe.
4. They didn't have a surplus.
Faieq writes...
At the time of 'Hunter's moon' were Jason, Jon and Robyn Canmore the only descendents of Canmore? Do they have any other family out there that they are unaware of?
Greg responds...
There are probably a lot of Canmore descendants. They probably know some and don't know others, just like anyone. But they were the three who had carried on the tradition of the Hunter.
Vashkoda writes...
"There will always be a Hunter...." If I ask you who the next one would be after Robyn, I'm sure to get a "not telling" reply. So for a bit less-revealing an answer, will the next hunter also be descended from Canmore?
Greg responds...
With a set up like that, how can I NOT answer with: "I'm not telling."
Todd Jensen writes...
Speaking of the Canmores and Macbeth, by the "present-day" portion of "Hunter's Moon", were the Canmores still aware of their ancestors' old feud with Macbeth, or had they forgotten this by now, to focus purely on Demona and her race? (I rather suspect the latter, in view of Jason Canmore's confession in the Lost Scene of "Hunter's Moon" that the family had forgotten what started the feud with the gargoyles to begin with).
Greg responds...
Yeah, the latter. They didn't even know that the original Hunter wasn't even a Canmore. They certainly didn't know about Gillecomgain being scarred by Demona as a boy. And that all this had largely been a result of that little incident. An incident which Demona had forgotten by the end of the tenth century.
Todd Jensen writes...
In "The Journey", Banquo and Fleance are portrayed as working for Castaway, who is really Jon Canmore in disguise. Was this intended as a bit of irony, in light of the fact that they'd earlier worked for Macbeth, who was an enemy of the Canmores' ancestors Duncan and Canmore?
Greg responds...
A bit.
Brian writes...
Can Gillecomgain smell? In City of Stone part 2 he tries to smell a rose but then he looks sad and steps on it. Did Demona damage his nose?
Greg responds...
No. He's just a lousy human being.
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