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at the time of "The Reckoning" i can see why the Manhatten clan and the Labyrinth clan remained seperated, but why are they still seperated in 2198? i would have thought that two small clans in close proximity to each other would've merged after a while... any reason they remained seperate?
Different priorities. And by 2198, neither is that small anymore.
you said that Samson's egg was one of many in the Manhatten rookery. about how many eggs were in this rookery? i assume that most of these eggs came from other clans, am i correct?
Not necessarily, no. You can do the math for yourself if you really feel like it. I don't have my timeline with me, and I'm feeling lazy at the moment anyway.
Ding, dong, the contest is dead! I have MANY 2198 questions, but in a genuine effort not to annoy you, I'm going to post them one at a time and very spread out.
Does the Order of the Guardian in Ishimura have anything to do with the Guardian Tom?
if you don't mind i'm going to shorten the Gargoyle Minority Protection Act to GMPA for simplicity.
1. did any countries that contained gargoyle clans object or refuse to comply with the GMPA? i'd imagine that America, Britain, and Japan would pretty much whole-heartedly agree, but i'm not sure about China, South Korea, and particulary Guatemala.
2. did France agree to have a gargoyle clan instated at Notre Dame before or after the GMPA? did they agree at all or did the gargoyles just move in? i guess Canada was in ok with the QFI clan, huh?
3. did the United Kingdom have a lot of weight in the decision to instate the GMPA since they have two native clans, another being created (Wyvern), and at least four other clans in the world have United Kingdom origens?
oh, please feel free to correct me if any of my info is wrong, i'm sure you will though :)
1. Nothing is simple.
2. You're talking about years past 2198. France bid for the clan.
The Haida people own Queen Florence Island. They made the offer.
3. Nothing is simple.
by 2198 are all the 12 clans "full" clans, as you've called them? what i mean is, are all the clans roughly the size of 1996 London or Ishimura clans?
Roughly. Or larger.
A few questions, now, about "Gargoyles 2198":
1. I've noticed a few parallel elements in it with "Future Tense", as follows:
Demona joining forces with the resistance movement.
The LXMs serving as a parallel to "Cyber-Lex".
Coyote-X as a parallel to the Xanatos Program (artificial intelligences out to conquer the world, both derived ultimately from Xanatos - although I doubt that Coyote-X has any direct connection to Xanatos, he did originate the Coyote line of robots).
Were these three elements intended as parallels to "Future Tense", a la the destruction of the clock tower in the original series?
2. What sort of occupation do you imagine the Space-Spawn making on Earth? A really tyrannical regime of the sort where Earth's population is reduced to slave labor, or a more remote occupation where they pretty much let the Earthlings go on with their lives, though now as subjects of the Space-Spawn Empire?
3. How is it that Coyote-X is out to conquer, first the planet, then the galaxy? I will confess that I have something of a problem with the notion of a robot or artificial intelligence out to conquer the world; such a goal strikes me as more fitted to an "organic being" with such emotions as greed, ambition, arrogance, etc., than to an artificial intelligence, which I simply can't imagine developing emotions (truth to tell, my own thoughts on machines are pretty much the same as those of Goliath in "Outfoxed" - machines know only what they are programmed to know; it's living beings, such as humans and gargoyles, who are capable of making decisions, and choosing between the right thing to do and the wrong thing to do). I didn't have any problems with the Matrix undertaking this route in "Walkabout" since it was portrayed here as merely a logical extension of its programming (to bring about order to the terrain of the world; it was merely misinterpreting its mission) rather than being motivated by power-lust. However, I'm not certain as to how Coyote-X developed its goal. (Of course, artificial intelligences could have come a long way by 2198, and maybe by that time they have developed emotions and the weaknesses and failings of living beings like humans and gargoyles). Of course, I doubt that you want to fill us in on the details yet, but I just thought that I'd mention it.
1. Yes and no. I love playing with the Future Tense expectaions. But on another level, it's just the characters telling me what they want. I know what Lex does in the late nineties early "oughts". I know what that leads to in turn. I know Demona well enough to know that she's sure not gonna like the Space-Spawn after they steal all the Gargoyle Eggs. And I know what happens to Coyote and how he's going to evolve and upgrade. So maybe Puck was being a bit prophetic. After all, the characters are deciding things for themselves. And he wasn't half wrong.
2. In the immortal words of Abe Simpson, "A little from column A and a little from column B."
3. Well, artificial intelligence has come a long way by 2198. Thanks in no small part to Coyote, Coldsteel, Lexington, Matrix, Fox and Anastasia. (An odd group. But there you go.)
What happened to Nick Maza's parents?
How many generations away is he from Elisa?
Can we assume that he is descended from Beth and Natsilane?
You can assume whatever you're in the mood to assume. Doesn't mean you're right or wrong.
1) You've said that, "no one knows how many biological generations removed from Goliath [Samson] is....Frankly, it doesn't really matter." I guess technically doesn't matter, but for us fans who really care, could you tell us whose son he is?
2a) Is the 2198 Deliah the original Delilah's daughter, granddaughter, great-granddaughter, or great-great-granddaughter? (my question is--which is she?) b) "Being genetically part of both races has left Delilah feeling like she's not truly a part of either." Assuming she's not Deliah's daughter, at most she could be 1/8 human. How is this significant enough to make Deliah feel uncomfortable? c) Do Delilah and her descendants age at the same rate as gargoyles, or does their human heritage alter this?
1. No. I don't know anymore. It doesn't matter.
2. a. I'm not telling.
b. I'm not telling.
c. I'm not telling.
Is there any thing going on between Samson and Delilah considering their names and all?
Care to list some of Coyote's cyborg and robot operatives
Who leads the Illuminati in 2198? Duval?
Is the grail still in the hands of the Illuminati?
Not answering this now.
Who leads the Quarrymen in 2198? Castaway's descendents?
What are Dingo and Robyn's descendents doing?
How much has Owen/Puck matured by 2198? A lot?
Owen is. And Puck's not around.
Well, it's certainly a relief to have the Gargoyles 2198 contest finally over with; I'm amazed that it took us so long to get the last two answers right. Well, now for a few comments on "Gargoyles 2198"'s overall description.
A number of elements in it certainly surprised me. For example, while I had suspected for a long while that the Space-Spawn would be playing a major role in the spin-off, I hadn't expected that it would open with them actually conquering the planet. Likewise, I was certainly surprised at the reason for Owen being unable to become Puck in the series (Alex being in Space-Spawn captivity), though it did make sense (I'd had my own speculations for the reason for the "block on Puck" before the contest began, though I won't mention them here because of the rules - suffice it to say that none of them involved Alex being held prisoner by anybody).
Another element in the spin-off was one which I'd perhaps "half-anticipated", and which did strike me as logical, but which I hadn't been seriously expecting in "Gargoyles 2198"; the notion of Samson and Delilah working together. Now, before the contest had come out, I'd been speculating for some time over whether Samson would have some connection with Delilah - given their names, it would be almost impossible not to have something like that happening - but never gave it any serious thought since I obviously didn't seriously believe that the original Delilah whom we met in "The Reckoning" would still be around at the time of the spin-off (even when it was "Gargoyles 2158" rather than "Gargoyles 2198"). Of course, I hadn't counted on the possibility of a namesake descendant, but it certainly struck me as a good solution.
And I've got to admit, you found a way to have the Illuminati stoop to a new low in the spin-off; they certainly were shady even in the original series (deals with organized crime, the Hotel Cabal, supporting the Quarrymen), but now they've become out-and-out quislings.
All in all, the spin-off certainly looks promising. I don't know if you'll ever get it made, but it should be interesting.
Questions follow in a separate post.
Thanks. I'm glad it intrigued you. I know you're more of a fantasy/myth guy then a Science Fiction Guy. Hopefully the show would still have a balance of both. But by definition that balance would lead more toward tech in this one.
YEESSS!!! The contest is over! Strike! Ok, so let me think for a question...
How will the future in 2198 look like? Dark (like in Blade Runner) or the shiny-super-hero-future with no wars, no deseases etc.?
Ok, thank you for awnsering. Hope you will read this before the Gathering ( Sorry, can't come :-(. The 23 June is my birthday, and to fly from Berlin to LA is a toooo big birthday present :-((((() Anyway, hope you have, or had, some fun there. Greet Jonathan Frakes from me ;-)
Jonathan was in Israel during the Gathering, so I didn't see him.
The future looked bright in March of 2198. Not perfect, but pretty shiny. With a lot preserved intentionally from nature and older periods.
Things took a dark turn with the arrival of the Space-Spawn.
The show states that gargoyles can withstand very cold tempretures, but how about hot? I'm asking cause Goliath and co fly close to the Magma in two volcanos and seems fine. BTW, can volcanos be like that and not be active?
On Avalon they can. I'm not an expert otherwise. But I also never said they were NOT active.
Gargoyles raised in Scotland don't do quite as well in the heat. But they are generally pretty tough cookies. They can take most anything for brief periods of time.
1.How old is the Space-Spawn race?
2.What is their name for themselves?
3.Did you plan to introduce specific members of the Space-Spawn?
4.Are they as long lived as Nokkar?
1. Old enough.
4. Individually? No.
How does Coyote the robot end up like the Machiavellian schemer that he is in Gargoyles:2198?
With help. And multiple upgrades.
Is it a coincidence that both New Camelot and the Master Matrix are in Antarctica?
What does the Master Matrix and the LXM robots have to do with the Matrix that we see in Walkabout?
Wouldn't gargoyles 2198 also tie your hands on certain arcs in the gargoyles universe?
That's a risk. It's also one of the reasons I moved the setting from 2158 to 2198. I wanted to get far enough into the future that most everyone from the original would be dead no matter what.
By now the 2198 contest has probabyl ended so a few questions
1.Why doesn't Oberon involve himself in the war afterall the head of his honor guard has been taken hostage along with Titania's grandson?
2.What ever happened to Natsilane's parents?
3.Is the Delilah, Samson and Zafiro relationship in anyway like that of the trio? Who exactly is Samson's mate going to be?
4.What is the proper name for the Space-Spawn
5.How did Coyote become so devious?
1. Are you sure Oberon is still alive?
2. I'm not answering this now.
3. Well, there are three of them. But no two groups are exactly the same. Samson likes Delilah. Delilah likes Samson. But whether they ever become mates is an open question.
4. As opposed to Space-Spawn?
5. Iron supplements.
This is something that I should be posting later, ideally, since you haven't yet gotten to the Avalon World Tour episodes in your ramblings, but I finally decided that I needed to let this out of me soon, so I'm doing so now.
I've noticed, over the years since I discovered "Gargoyles" fandom on the Internet, that many people didn't like the Avalon World Tour for various reasons (the length of time, the absence of Hudson and the trio, the focus on myth and fantasy aspects rather than more "mundane" elements like crime-fighting, etc.). On the other hand (while I may have had my moments of wondering when Goliath, Elisa, Angela and Bronx were going to get back to New York), I quite liked the World Tour. To a certain extent, I'll admit that I'm biased - my tastes naturally run towards fantasy/myth elements. But after doing a little thinking on this one, it increasngly struck me that, aside from all that, something of the nature of the Avalon World Tour was a must for "Gargoyles" at some point.
The reason for this is that the World Tour served a very crucial purpose (besides the general one that you mentioned of expanding the "Gargoyles Universe"). It made it clear that Goliath, his clan, and Demona weren't the only gargoyles left. And that was a crucial step. Because if they really had been, the gargoyle species would have been almost irrevocably doomed to extinction, with only seven members left, only one of those seven a female, and that one estranged from all the rest and very unlikely to reconcile with them. Goliath and the others would have been the "last gargoyles", not only in the sense of being the only ones left, but also in the sense that no new gargoyles would come along after them.
If that had been the case, it would have obviously made a rather depressing series. Admittedly, having the main character be the "very last of his kind" wouldn't necessarily be utterly melancholy - Superman is the very last Kryptonian, and his story's an upbeat one, on the whole. But the situation there's different; Superman's alien origin is treated more as a plot device to explain his abilities, so his being "the last of his kind" doesn't appear quite so melancholy. Goliath and his clan's "gargoyleness", however, was treated in the series from the start as a crucial part of them and their very nature, rather than a similar handy plot device to allow them to serve as effective protectors of New York. And also, it was clear enough from the start that an important part of the series would be the gargoyles seeking to make peace with humanity, to overcome the fear that so many humans view them with. Such a quest would have been futile (in a sense) if they were the last of their kind - the understanding on humanity's part of the true nature of gargoyles would come too late to avert the race's extinction - the best that the gargs would be able to hope for in such a situation was that they might be able to live out their last years without the general human population hunting them down, but still aware that there would be no new gargoyles after them. Not very happy.
So there'd obviously have to be gargoyles living in other parts of the world to ensure a future for the species. And Goliath and his clan would have to come into contact with those other gargoyles for the audience to see that they weren't the last. But the clan's situation would make that tricky. For one thing, there'd be the obvious transportation problems - they can't simply hop aboard the next plane bound for London or Japan. And given how secretive gargoyle clans would obviously have to be in modern times, even if Goliath and Co. had a mundane means of transportation to wherever it was that one of these clans was living, they would certainly not be likely to find out about these other clans easily. The only solution to both questions that wouldn't feel contrived was magic - as in the magic of Avalon that sends you where you need to be. That way, Goliath could be brought to the locations of the clans in London, Guatemala, and Ishimura in a convincing fashion.
So I think that the Avalon World Tour was indeed a practical must for the series, to allow the crucial moment when the clan can learn, as Hudson put it in "The Gathering", "We're not alone. We're not the last."
Hey, pal, I'm with you.
From moment one, we wanted to present an OPTIMISTiC world view, that mirrored Goliath's own. (Not that he hasn't had a bad moment or mood or two.)
The World Tour was a necessity from that stand point for all the reasons you stated.
Plus it was a necessity given some of my future plans. 2198 immediately comes to mind. But there was other stuff too.
in your most recent (and long awaited) batch of questions you said that a garg living at the poles in a 6-month day, 6-month night cycle would eventually adapt. do you mean the garg would adapt to be flesh for six months and stone for six months, or adapt so that occasionally the garg would be awake in daylight or asleep at night?
It's all more complicated than that. It has to do with the Master Matrix and New Camelot, etc.
is Delilah and Samson just a concidence or does Broadway and Angela's naming of their son have anything to do with Delilah?
is anything ever just a coincidence in the Gargoyles universe?
Few things are just a coincidence in the garg universe, but Samson wasn't named by his Rookery parents to intentionally be Delilah's mate. And in the current development (2198 as opposed to 2158) Samson is no longer the son of Angela and Broadway. He's either their grandson or great-grandson. No one knows. Or cares.