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Spectacular Spider-Man, The
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Matthew writes...
This is about pretty much all the series you've worked on. I've noticed that most of your series has a large cast of recurring characters (and that despite this characters tend to be very well delineated.) Now for Young Justice, WITCH, and Spectacular Spiderman that may be just because they were pre-existing properties and already have large casts. However, Gargoyles also had a large cast.
Was this a because of conscious choice?
Do you perfer working with a large cast of characters?
Greg responds...
I do. I like creating worlds that feel real and populated.
Greg Bishansky writes...
Another Spidey question. This one is both Spectacular related, and about your Amazing Spider-Man back-up story.
When you wrote and produced "Spectacular Spider-Man," you tried to get to the core truths of who each and every character was. Well, I need to ask you about who Betty Brant was in your series. We've never seen much of her besides Peter trying to ask her to the Fall Formal, and Ned asking her out on a date. She didn't even have a single line of dialogue in the entire second season.
I ask, because in the comics, and this is something that often seems forgotten by most people, Betty Brant is a pretty horrible human being. It's not something I was even really conscious of until my friend, Josh Bertone, started writing a series of articles documenting the history of this character.
She was pretty bipolar when she dated Peter. Constantly flipping out at him if he so much as glanced at Liz Allan, or another human being who lacked a penis. And then, turning around and playing around with both him and Ned Leeds.
She later married Ned and then abandoned him on their honeymoon. Had a one-night stand with Peter, and was later on having an affair with Flash Thompson that lasted for months and months. Which was driving Ned nuts, although, his brainwashing at the hands of the Hobgoblin arguably made things worse. But the affair started well before this Hobgoblin business. Hell, she had the nerve to ask him if their marriage meant anything to him as he was walking out on her, and he replied with "more than it means to you" and he was right.
Of course, Betty now blames the Hobgoblin for all of her marriage's problems and never once really acknowledged any wrongdoing on her part. It's almost Demona-esque how neatly she's able to deflect any feelings of guilt.
And finally, there was Betty's appearance in the back-up story for Flash Thompson that you wrote (loved that story), and when Betty first sees Sha Shan, she is mad. I think I'll quote my friend Bertone, who said it better than I could:
"The icicle speech balloons are a cool callback to the Ditko days but take a look at that scene again. Betty isn’t responding to Sha Shan…Betty starts it! Betty doesn’t greet Sha Shan with an apology or any remorse. No! She’s mad at Sha Shan! Why? What did Sha Shan do to her? It’s not like they had a Betty/Veronica relationship. Betty stole Sha Shan’s man! Sha Shan has a right to be mad! Betty doesn’t!
"Betty Brant is the only woman who will have an affair with your boyfriend and then somehow be mad at you as if she was the victim. What a horrible person."
The above isn't a criticism of the story, or how you used Betty. It's a criticism of Betty as a person.
So, I have to ask. Would your interpretation of Betty, had the series gotten more in depth with her have been this terrible, awful individual? In the comics, she makes Sally Avril look as cool and fun to be with as Mary Jane by comparison! If so, I'd say Peter dodged a major bullet there, when Aunt May put a stop to this in "The Invisible Hand." Come to think of it, May never liked Betty in the Lee/Ditko run either. Betty is definitely not the girl you bring home to meet mom.
Greg responds...
I think the thing to keep in mind about ANY character in a shared corporate universe is that multiple writers, editors and artists have had at him or her, with different agendas - often agendas that had little to do with the character him or herself - and more to do with how that character plays with, in this case, Spider-Man/Peter Parker.
Me, I'm fond of Betty. Probably originates with her being THE girl in the 1960s Spider-Man cartoon. I clearly like her more than either you or Bertone, but I haven't tracked each and every appearance. I just try to get to the heart of who I think she is. To me, in the Lee/Ditko era, she was a high school age girl who dropped out to work, because she had to. So she wasn't mature, but she was extremely competent. One of the few human beings who could handle J. Jonah Jameson. That to me is the fundamental TRUTH of her character. Anyone who can hold her own with Jameson and put up with his... crap, has to have something solid in her. The fact that Lee/Ditko occasionally played her as a jealous harridan ... seems more indicative of the tropes of romance comics of the day than with anything inherent in who she was. And what other writers did with her in the post Lee/Romita era (after she had already been reduced to the fourth or fifth most important non-Aunt May girl in Peter's life) carries even less weight with me.
Is that selective on my part? Damn straight! But we were always selective on SpecSpidey. Had to be. Too much inconsistencies in the canon for us to do otherwise.
So, what did we decide?
Well, first of all, we wanted a sixteen year old Peter, as he was in the early days of Lee/Ditko. But no one's going to buy - in a modern context - a sixteen year old Betty working full-time for Jonah. So we made her nineteen or twenty (can't remember, but something like that). So we gave a nod to the original Betty/Pete relationship, but as you saw made it awkward because of an age gap that would be insignificant in ten years (at age 26 and 29) but is just too wide at 16 and 19. We had fun with that. But we also started to build the Betty/Ned relationship too. We did have a couple Betty/Ned scenes written and recorded for Season Two, but they wound up getting cut for time before being animated... mostly because (a) we were long and (b) they were scenes we could sacrifice. Ned and Ned's relationship to Betty would have been important in season three, and we wanted to set it up, lay some pipe, etc. But there were always things we needed for Season TWO that were more important. So we figured we'd worry about Season Three if and when we got there. And of course we never did.
As for that one Betty and Sha Shan scene in the comic, I think you're overthinking it. The two are both cold to each other. They have an unpleasant history. No one's apologizing. No one's asking for an apology at this point. Neither "started it". Looks must have come before words. And looks said it all. The words were simply the "icing" (pun intended) on the cake.
Personally, I can't see Betty with Flash long term... though I guess that's the longest relationship she's ever had - mostly by default. Now, I see them as good friends. Maybe occasionally friends with benefits, but these two are never going to be much more than that in my mind.
Of course, to me the perfect girl for Flash was always Sha Shan. (Someone who could kick his ass - at least figuratively, if not literally.) So what do I know...
Zeke Hero writes...
Greg,
First of all, I'd like to say I'm a huge fan of your work since Gargoyles made my young mind snap from "short attention span" to "give me more character-driven serial fiction!" during the Disney Afternoon days (jeez, I'm old...). When I heard you were doing Spectacular Spider-Man, I knew I was going to be in for a treat and while the show only got two seasons, DAMN were they exactly what I needed out of a Spider-Man show.
I've read the questions posted and have sat here making sure I won't ask an *eye-roll*-worthy one or something that will inspire the "no comment"-of doom, so here goes:
Gargoyles and Young Justice both have a family quality to the teams of characters that are our protagonists. We're introduced to a small band of 6-7 heroes by the writers and over the course of adventure after adventure we the viewer comes to feel as much as a part of that "family" as they do with each other. My question is (and I am in NO WAY fishing for spoilers or hints or what have you) what are your feelings on shows that expand these bases down the line? I remember, for example, that when Avatar added Toph her initial episodes didn't seem to gel with the audience I was viewing the show with and it felt like (to us) that the character didn't fit into a narrative we'd become accustomed to, yet by the end of the season (and this was our fault for not trusting the writers), Toph was a great piece of a larger cast that grew organically. Do you feel that adding, say, Angela as a new member of the Gargoyle family can hurt the narrative established with an audience burned time after time by artificial 90's cartoon storylines or does the idea of getting to add, say, the Wonder Twins (again, not fishing hence why I use these guys) offer up an opportunity to you as a writer for a left turn in the plot that you get to have a "trust us, we know what we're doing" stance with your audience?
(man that was a huge run-on senence...)
second question
When you and Brandon were mapping out the season (I saw the great behind the scenes video from SDCC), what was the best ah-ha moment (related to something we've already seen, not a spoiler or fishing trip) that you as a team came up with? Mostly I'm just looking for an anecdote about working as a team, you could even be vague and pronouny.
Third and final quesiton
You've now gotten to work on Marvel's Spider-verse, and the entire DC universe. I've noticed that in both cases you've gotten to go your own way on certain characters you've gotten to use (e.g. Silver Sable was a villain on Spider-Man with a relationship to Silvermane). Which comes first in cases where this occurs? Do you riff on story ideas and go, "we need a psychic badass" and then go, "let's use Psimon, but let's tweak him a little" or do you (or someone on the team) say, "Man, we REALLY need to use Abra Kadabra and I think I know how we could do that!" Since both shows have shown you dipping into a huge pool of characters, what about a character makes them a "semi-blank canvas" character that you can take as an opportunity to fit within your storybeats versus a character that you feel is fully-formed and just needs an artistic tweak to fit your plot?
Again, thank you so much for this board, your time, and this show. You've contributed so much to quality animation and, I hope you see the compliment here, but when I and my friends push Gargoyles on to newbies, we usually describe it as, "It's like the Wire, but with Shakespere, monsters, and the NYPD"
Greg responds...
1. I don't see how expanding the cast ORGANICALLY hurts the narrative.
2. I don't know that we had a single "Ah ha!" moment on YJ. But when things are working, they just begin to come together.
3. We've worked it from both directions. Ultimately, we ALWAYS try to be true to the spirit of the character - though sometimes we are intentionally introducing the character at a pre-classic stage. Silver Sable is a perfect example. We had long term plans for her that would have eventually brought her closer to the Sable from the comics. But we liked this backstory for her - and connecting her to Silvermane helped preserve the coherence of our universe.
SO WHERE HAVE I BEEN? Updates & Debunks
Hello everyone,
Haven't posted here in a while, and since I did a bit of message board lurking this morning, it seems to have led people to believe all sorts of odd things, so...
Where have I been?
Well, in early June, my family and I went to the Oregon Shakespeare Festival in Ashland, Oregon.
We saw seven plays in four days. Six of them (Henry IV, Part Two, The Language Archive, To Kill a Mockingbird, Julius Caesar, Love's Labours Lost and Measure for Measure) were just stellar productions. Everyone was great, but I'd like to particularly single out Susannah Flood in both Language Archive and Mockingbird, Dee Maaske in Mockingbird and Michael Winters as Falstaff in 2HenryIV.
Coming back from that, I was understandably swamped and didn't have time to post.
Next, I went to Minneapolis for the always great ConVergence convention. I did about thirteen panels. Some of which, like Gargoyles and Spider-Man and Young Justice, I felt qualified to be on. And some, like Dexter and Galaxy Quest, my only qualification was being a fan of whatever we were talking about. This was my third ConVergence, and it continues to be the best run convention I've ever attended. And now that the Gathering of the Gargoyles is no more, it has become my FAVORITE convention to attend.
Returning from ConVergence, I then got quite ill. In fact, I'm still home sick today. (Home sick as opposed to homesick, clear?)
So THOSE are the reasons I haven't posted. Nothing nefarious.
Next topic: YOUNG JUSTICE UPDATE.
We have aired episodes 101-109 (i.e. Season One, episodes 1-9).
(Yes, episode 110 accidentally was posted on Cartoon Network's website, but I'm going to pretend that never happened.)
Episodes 110-115 are in the can, i.e. they are completed and ready to air.
Episode 116 awaits only the final on-line, i.e. the final review of the episode. This has been delayed ONLY because I've been out sick this week.
Episode 117 will have it's sound mix on Friday. (I hope to be back at work by then.)
Episode 118 has been edited and work progresses on scoring and sound effects.
Episode 119 is ready to begin post-production.
Episodes 120-123 are being animated in Korea.
Episodes 124-126 are in layout in Korea, while we finish the final color models here in the States.
Episodes 201-202 (i.e. Season Two, Episodes one and two) - Are fully recorded and are in storyboard. (201 was written by me. 202 by Nicole Dubuc.)
Episode 203, written by Kevin Hopps, is almost fully recorded. We have one actor left to pick up, who has been out of town. It is also in storyboard.
Episode 204, written by me, will record this week. It is also in storyboard.
Episode 205 - Brandon Vietti, has turned in his draft of the script. I have to read and edit it.
Episode 206 - The outline, written by Peter David and edited by me, went out Monday for notes, which are due tomorrow.
Episode 207 - Kevin Hopps turned in his outline, which I need to read and edit.
Episode 208 - I'm writing this one. I'll start the outline, after I've edited the outline to 207.
Episode 209 - Jon Weisman turned in his outline, which I need to read and edit.
Episode 210 - Kevin Hopps is working on his outline.
We do NOT yet have a pick-up beyond episode 210, but our bosses have told us to start blocking out episodes 211-220 in anticipation of one.
Episode 211 - We've broken this story. I still need to find time to write up the Beat Outline, though I have it all on index cards.
Episode 212 - We've got the basics of this one down, but we (i.e. myself, Brandon and Kevin) still need to finish breaking the story.
Episodes 213-220 - We've got a very clear sense of the arc and what things need to happen, but we haven't started on these yet.
NEXT TOPIC: DEBUNKING YJ RUMORS
False Rumor #1: YJ IS A GREG WEISMAN PRODUCTION
Everywhere on the Internet, all I see is that YJ is Greg Weisman's show. That's just blatantly false. This is a VIETTI/WEISMAN production. Just as Spectacular Spider-Man was a COOK/WEISMAN production and Gargoyles was a PAUR/WEISMAN production. I am not, nor have I ever been, a one-man show on ANY project I've EVER worked on. EVER. And in particular, on YJ, it's extremely unfair to Brandon to leave him out of consideration. Brandon is heavily involved in every aspect of production, INCLUDING SERIES DEVELOPMENT AND STORY. He's been right there with myself and Kevin Hopps breaking every single episode. It's been a team effort from day one. Many of the series' best ideas came/come from Brandon. And this is aside from the fact, that of course, Brandon can write - but I cannot draw, which arguably makes him MORE important to the production than I. I am exceedingly proud of this series and my own work on it - though certain very vocal fans seem to think I shouldn't be - but that doesn't change the fact that Brandon and I are a team.
False Rumor #2: YJ WAS RUSHED INTO PRODUCTION
Another blatant misconception. Look, Brandon and I are both perfectionists. Neither of us would deny that we'd LOVE to have more time on each and every episode. But that's not the same as being rushed. Let's make a comparison: on Spectacular Spider-Man, I basically had one week to develop both the series and the entire first season. Then Vic Cook came aboard, and we raced to get into production in less than two months. Brandon and I had seven months to develop the series, break the first season (which granted had twice as many episodes as the first season of Spidey) and head into production. The show isn't and never has been rushed. That's not to say the schedule isn't tight. But we haven't aired a single episode that wasn't ready to air. And we won't.
False Rumor #3: YJ ISN'T AIRING NOW BECAUSE WE'RE REWORKING EPISODES BASED ON INTERNET CRITICISM
This is my favorite. I love it the most because the first person I saw who posted this rumor also said that I'd deny it. So here I am denying it, which of course serves to PROVE that he or she was correct, see? Let's be clear: for better or worse, this series is COMPLETELY unaffected by internet criticism BECAUSE of schedule. Everything of any significance was set and DONE before even the pilot movie aired last November, so we couldn't address fan concerns even if we wanted to. And, honestly, we don't want to. We don't in part because there is way less consensus than some people seem to think. For example, for every post I see expressing hatred for "Hello, Megan!", I see a post that likes it. And personally, I like it. Brandon likes it. So why would we change it, even if we could? In fact, even Season Two is moving forward more or less disregarding "fan" criticism. Brandon and I always had very clear ideas for what we wanted to do in Season Two (and even Season Three, should we get one) and those ideas haven't changed. As with every series I've co-helmed, all we can ever do is write and produce to OUR OWN passions - and then just cross our fingers and hope enough people share our passions to make it a success. Anything else is doomed to failure, because if we're not passionate about it, it'll show in the work, and then no one will like it. And just to make it clear: WE LIKE OUR SHOW!! Doesn't mean you have to - but don't try to tell me I don't.
So why aren't we airing new episodes now? That's a fair question that I don't have an answer for. After all, we have six unaired episodes in the can, with four more on the verge of completion. It's a Cartoon Network decision. Some fans have argued that they shouldn't have started airing ANY episodes until ALL episodes were in the can. But that too is a decision above my pay grade.
My best guess - and that's all it is - is that CN will air new episodes - starting with 110 ("Targets") - in September. The good news is that the later they wait, the more weeks they can go uninterrupted by reruns. I do know that Season Two (i.e. "Young Justice: Invasion") will begin airing as part of DC NATION in March of 2012. And by then ALL of Season One will have aired. So do the math.
People have asked me if I'm bummed about losing momentum by this delay. But the thing is we've ALREADY lost all momentum. So as long as they PROMOTE us whenever they finally do start airing us again, then pragmatically I'm good. Yes, I'll admit to a certain level of frustration in that I want our stuff to get out there, but if CN has a plan to make the most of the episodes, then more power to them.
Anyway, I think that's it for now. I'll get back to answering questions on ASK GREG as soon as I can find the time. (But keep in mind that San Diego Comic-Con is fast approaching. Note: Young Justice has a panel scheduled for Sunday, July 24th at 10am, with a signing to follow. I'll also be signing Gargoyles comics (and whatever else anyone might want) at the SLG Booth from 11:30am to 12:30pm on Thursday, Friday and Saturday (July 21, 22, 23).
Matthew writes...
Not a question, but I thought you might want to read a very positive review of Spectacular Spider-man:
http://www.intergalacticmedicineshow.com/cgi-bin/mag.cgi?do=columns&vol=spencer_ellsworth&article=042
Greg responds...
THanks!! That really was a great review!!
(I'm on a roll today!)
Laura 'ad astra' Sack writes...
Silly little question- Do you ever feel the urge, (or give into the urge), to slip something into a script purely because you know something about the actor? Like writing a song into a scene because you know the actor sings, (but maybe not telling them that they're going to be doing Sondheim or Gilbert & Sullivan till after they agree to sing 'some ditty'), or make them speak a foreign language because someone is fluent (but perhaps has a horrid accent)? Someone has a great cackle? Find a reason to have it come up. Someone is afraid of canaries? Put on on the character's shoulder for the whole episode. etc The only example I can think of now would be to have M'gan spout a long series of made up equations to see if Danica McKellar's head explodes in the face of nonsensical math. (Or replace of a series of made up equations with her own theorem at the last moment and wait for her to notice.)
Or does "Jalapeno!" qualify as such evil?
Greg responds...
Jalapena definitely qualifies.
Thailog qualifies in general. (How can I write for Keith David and never give him the chance to laugh?!)
I would have loved to do musical episodes of Gargoyles and/or Spectacular Spider-Man, but in the former I couldn't think of a smart way to make it work (pre-Joss Whedon's "Once More With Feeling") and in the latter, we didn't get enough episodes...
But it was fun doing the two musical episodes of W.I.T.C.H.
The Spectacular Spider-Man Season 3 writes...
Can't you just talk to Sony, so that they would let you supervise the Spectacular Spider-Man, Season 3? So that they could change their mind to let Marvel use Spider-Man for the Super Hero Squad Show season 2 finale, Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes season 1 finale, and main character for season 2 of Avengers and season 3 of Super Hero Squad, i'm tired of him being in just comics and video games, please bring back The Spectacular Spider-Man!
Greg responds...
There's no one left at Sony for me to talk to. They closed the entire television animation division there.
You'll just have to talk to Marvel about all of the above. I've got ZERO pull, believe me.
(I mean, really, if I did, don't you think I would have done a third season of SpecSpidey?)
Jeff writes...
First of all, many thanks for bringing us a great Spidey series. Just a few questions to put my mind at rest, as it bothers me to have my favorite stories left unfinished. Since the show is unfortunately canceled, I wanted to ask how would it have ended for the following characters.
1. Eddie/Venom (Would he have made peace with Peter: brothers again? Anything else?)
2. Gwen or MJ
3. Norman
4. Harry
5. Carnage: was he planned for an appearance?
Please I'd really appreciate if you can go into detail with these, especially first 3.
Greg responds...
As I've stated MANY times before, I don't see any advantage TO ME in vomiting out what my plans would have been absent the execution of said plans. All that accomplishes is to hold the ideas out for all sorts of second guessing.
Jamie writes...
Hey greg,first of all, you're awesome, i remember when i was only 5 and i would re enact your gargoyles haha good times.
If you were to compare Young Justice and your other works, would young justice be in the top 5?
How many views are you having on Young justice ?
Greg responds...
Wow, did you just make me feel old...
Yes, YJ would be in my top five, along with Gargoyles (of course) and in no particular order, Spectacular Spider-Man, W.I.T.C.H. and Captain Atom.
Edward writes...
Is the Green Arrow short in continuity with Young Justice since you were/are involved with both?
Greg responds...
I was also involved with W.I.T.C.H., Starship Troopers, Gargoyles and the Spectacular Spider-Man, and none of those are in continuity with Young Justice.
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