A Station Eight Fan Web Site

Gargoyles

The Phoenix Gate

Ask Greg Archives


: « First : « 100 : « 10 : Displaying #274 - #283 of 481 records. : 10 » : 100 » : Last » :


Posts Per Page: 1 : 10 : 25 : 50 : 100 : All :


Bookmark Link

Gipdac writes...

1a) Did Goliath know Jon Canmore and John Castaway were the same person? b) Did Elisa?

Greg responds...

1a. Not at the time of "The Journey".
1b. Ditto.

Response recorded on October 08, 2003

Bookmark Link

FanForLife writes...

I was wondering, when exactly did Goliath actually admit to himself consciously that he was in love with Elisa? Actually said to himself, "I love her?" Was it at a specific moment in the series, and if so what scene/episode? Thanks!

Greg responds...

That's a darn good question. I'm sure he hadn't figured it out by "Sentinel". It might, in fact, have been in "Hunter's Moon, Part III" after she returned from the dead. Maybe right after the Praying Gargoyle was smashed. Or maybe after he returned to the castle. It wouldn't surprise me if it was as late as that.

I'd be eager to hear what all of you think on this question.

In any case, he certainly knew by "The Journey".

Response recorded on August 22, 2003

Bookmark Link

Vanity writes...

Greg:
This question or line of thoughts may be dismissed by many as hindsight or 'if party "A" knew that party "B" would have acted as such party "A" would have/not done what ever they had done, or something else entirely.
That being said I am not interested in mere allocations of ideas or energy as it is parted to its situation(s). But rather the logical processes which make it happen. (not why did "X" do this instead of this, but how did "X" come to believe that what he/she did was what he/she wanted done in order to further the cause of or to accomplish the objectives of his/her agenda. Even when other noticeable paths of achieving that endeavor where evident and obvious.

--Case point--
-Demona--most irrational
-episode-Temptation--enlightening

Demona not by magic or trickery was able to persuade Brooklyn to believe that humans were bad for gargoyles. How? Through persuasive speech mixed with vived illustration, preying on the emmotion, and excellent visual situations highlighting her position.(the murder, troubled household).
1) she has Brooklyn to the point where he will steal the magic book and lie to Goliath.

Knowing that she has plenty of time in the world to accomplish her goal of a human-free world, why did she rashly cast a 'wierd-spell' on Goliath?
When I first saw this episode age 12 or 13 I had myself thought I knew what she was doing, I was wrong. I easily recognized then her potential ability to persuade the other impressionable minds of the clan with simmilar illustration and glib of tongue. (Lexington's encounter with the Pack) With the help of Brooklyn, "subverting" the clans' mind with tongue not sword.

Still, had she not wanted to wast the time and energy in that long term process she still could have stalled on her plan to 'open Goliath's eyes' why not study the book find a more meaningful spell. Since I do not know exactly all the power held in its pages I cannot give an example, however; I am sure there would be one in there somewhere.

Or even use this oppurtunity to find other usefull information, Brooklyn as a 'double-agent'.

When in the situation present without the liberty of hindsight, I know that what we do is what we do, but again I stress that I am not interested in her decision, cast a 'wierd-zombie' spell fine. Why? "Open Goliath's eyes". So we are here again at the point where all the preperations for planning will eithere pay off big time or backfire. In planning though she must have decided that it would be easier, faster, better to cast a wierd spell than to expend her resources into other side projects ultimately perhaps harvesting a greater chance of sucess through diplomatic channels and patient subversion. This is where I need your help. I reason that she must have chose to cast the wierd spell on Goliath so to accomplish her objective more quickly. Why does she reason that speed is the best way to accomplish her plans?

If it was not just speedily accomplishing her goals that motivated her irrational behavior then what was it?

Greg responds...

Well, I think most would agree that Demona is her own worst enemy. She is extremely intelligent, but also extremely passionate, and she often, often lets her passions rule her brain -- though she rarely, if ever, admits to that.

She may have justified/rationalized that speed was the key. She may have justified/rationalized that Goliath posed such a huge threat both physically and as a "corrupting influence" on the clan that he needed to be dealt with immediately.

But I don't think it was any of that.

I think she was mad at him.

I think she felt betrayed.

I think she wanted vengeance.

I think she wanted to feel superior to him.

I think she wanted to justify all the damnéd choices she had made over a thousand years.

I think she took personal satisfaction out of turning him into a plaything.

I think she made a big mistake.

I think she threw away an incredible opportunity, as you outlined above.

Just my opinion, though.

Response recorded on June 18, 2003

Bookmark Link

Stephaneus writes...

Hi Greg Happy New Year all

Vanity(don't you mean Gruouch??)

Know this is about Awakenings (which I think is the best episode in the whole series). Goliath caught Hakon's sword. What is the deal. Hudson's little dagger in Long way to morning cut a statue in half. But Hakons double edged long sword could only scratch Goliath. He's tough and rugged but come on now. And I really loved Hakon's reaction "Fight men they're not invincible" If that isn't invincible what the hell is? Why should Goliath even dodge weapons they just bounce off anyway?

Why did you let that happen? Catching a sword without it even hurting him seriously at all!!

Super Stephaneus

Greg responds...

I don't know what you're referring to vis-a-vis Vanity/Gruoch...?

As to your Awakening question, Hakon's sword did hurt Goliath. Cut down to the bone. He just toughed it out. Cuz he's Goliath. That's who he is. You expected him to cry?

And Hakon's sword could certainly cut THROUGH bone. But he would have needed to put more power behind the swing to do that. Given his position on that tower, Hakon did the best he could, but it wasn't good enough, and Goliath's been in enough fights to know what he can and cannot take. He stopped the blow with his hand before it could gain enough momentum to do serious damage.

What Hakon saw, before he spoke his line, was the Goliath's blood. We made a point of that, and even convinced our S&P exec to let us show the blood. Which is very rare for cartoons. If Goliath had been invincible, there would have been no blood. And the sword would have bounced off his hide. Which it didn't. Weapons don't bounce off our gargs.

Hudson doesn't have a dagger, by the way, but a sword. And a lot of Gargoyle muscle behind his swing.

And you, Super, have a lot of attitude, bordering on disrespect. Just so you know, it's really off-putting.

Response recorded on June 17, 2003

Bookmark Link

Vanity writes...

In Hunter's Moon on the Hunter's airship when Goliath and Demona reaching for the laser rifle was he going to shoot her.

Greg responds...

I'm pretty sure the answer is no, but I can't recall the scene at the moment. Odds are he was simply trying to keep the weapon away from her.

Response recorded on June 11, 2003

Bookmark Link

Artemis writes...

This isn't really a question, but rather a corrective comment.

Obviously Goliath wouldn't know, but I don't know about you, but Thailog is NOT Goliath's son. They are brothers. Until I went to a genetics seminar with my AP bio class, this would never have crossed my mind.

Anyway, to the point. The reason Thailog can't be Goliath's son is because of genetics. Thailog's genes came from Goliath, which in turn came from Goliaths parents. Now, therefore, technically Thailog has the same parents as Goliath (since all his chormosomes can be traced back through Goliath's parents).

There's more to it that, but I wanted to keep it it terms understandable. Another simpler way to make the argument is that since Thatilog has the same genes as Goliath, they're sort of like identical twins, born years apart (and of course identical twins are siblings of each other). It's the same with the labrynth clones as well, they are bothers of the gargs they were cloned from.

Delilah is a whole different story. I can't explain that one, but i guess she's a half sister to both Elisa and Demona, but I can't prove it genetically.

Sorry if I seemed to have a "you're wrong, I'm right" attitude, but I just wanted to let you know what the real world truth was. Now Gargoyles Universe truth, well, I can't tell you what's right and wrong, that's for you to decide.

Thanx for listening to my lecture :)

Greg responds...

Actually, I found this post very interesting and informative. It doesn't change the emotional reality of how Thailog and Goliath feel about each other. But it's good to know. And I appreciate -- greatly -- that you weren't trying to make me look foolish, just filling me in on an obvious gap in my knowledge.

It's over a year since you posted this, so I don't have any idea if you're still hanging around. But Thank You, Artemis. It is appreciated.

Response recorded on June 05, 2003

Bookmark Link

Peter Mason writes...

Anonymous writes...
The Weird Sisters had Demona and MacBeth steal Coldstone so Goliath wouldn't notice the disappearance of the Eye of Odin, the Phoenix Gate and the Grimorum and so he wouldn't go looking for them, but what I don't understand is why were the Weird Sisters afraid that Goliath would go looking for the talisman? I mean he'd never find them considering that the Sisters would have taken the talismans to the Archmage on Avalon where Goliath could never reach them.

Greg responds...

But Goliath did reach them, so the potential was there.

In fact, one could easily argue that the Archmage's greatest mistake was delaying for Goliath's arrival.

recorded on 10-17-01

Are you saying that the Sisters through their connection to fate foresaw the possiblity that Goliath would come to Avalon and had MacBeth and Demona steal Coldstone to try to prevent it from happening?

Greg responds...

Not that I'm disagreeing -- because your not off the mark -- but I think you're overthinking it.

Goliath presented a potential threat, so he was misdirected.

Response recorded on April 03, 2003

Bookmark Link

FanForLife writes...

Hi Greg. Just wondering--was the part in the Journey where Goliath went to see Elisa the first time the two talked or saw each other since the kiss at the end of Hunter's Moon 3? If not, when did they first see or talk to each other after the kiss? Thanks!

Greg responds...

Elisa and Goliath kiss on the morning of October 27, 1996.

Goliath goes to see Elisa just after Midnight on October 29, 1996.

I find it hard to believe that they didn't see each other at all on the 27th or 28th. But it's very possible that they had no time alone to discuss what had happened.

Response recorded on February 14, 2003

Bookmark Link

Corrie "Cormak" McDermott writes...

Hi Greg,
I have some questions about Goliath and Elisa.

1. You've said that Goliath started falling in love with Elisa pretty early on. And that he fell in love with her before he even understood how attractive she was physically. By Elisa's reactions in various episodes it seemed that she knew he was falling for her and she tried to deny the truth for a while. Not only his feelings but hers as well. Obviously by what happened in Hunter's Moon I , II and III she realized that she was in love with him and she let him know. Did she fall in love him because of the way he has protected her and his personality?

1a. Did she find him attractive physically?

1b. or both?

2. I've read your comments that Elisa and Goliath would realize that their relationship before it really started was impossible and they would date members of their own species, possibly at a Halloween party. Would this party have been the first time they dated since the breakup?

2a. Also would it be at this party that they would both realize that they still loved each other?

2b. or would that have been later on down the road?

3. Does Elisa know that Goliath was watching her and Jason in her apartment? (Hunter's Moon Part II)

3a. If not, would Goliath ever tell her?

Greg responds...

1. Well, I think Elisa probably thinks he's good looking too, but yes, it's who he is inside that really attracts her. In my opinion, anyway.

1a. I think so.

1b. Both, yeah. I gotta start reading ahead.

2. I think so. But it's not a party so much as a night out. At least in my mind.

2a. Yes.

2b. I don't think they ever stopped loving each other, but they tried to let logic and reason dictate their feelings. By the end of this Halloween adventure, they'd realize that it was pointless to supress their feelings. Certainly unfair to their dates.

3. Not sure. Don't think so.

3a. It seems unnecessary now.

Response recorded on January 30, 2003

Bookmark Link

Chapter XLII: "Sanctuary"

Time to ramble...

This episode was directed by Dennis Woodyard, written and story edited by Cary Bates.

The one word title, as usual, was one of mine. I thought initially that we'd be even more focused on the Cathedral. That we might play a Quasimodo character. Heck, if Disney's "Hunchback" movie was going to have living gargoyles bouncing around, then I could have a Quasimodo swinging from the bell-ropes.

But the story, thank goodness, rightly evolved into a family drama with Goliath, Elisa, Angela, Demona, Macbeth and Thailog (and Bronx) providing us with one very ODD family. Quasimodo went away in favor of Thailog.

And we had to work a bit to make sure the thematic idea of the heart as a Sanctuary worked its way into the picture. Thank God for that French minister, eh?

During the "Previously..." recap the following exchange was heard between my eight year old daughter Erin and my five year old son Ben, after Angela learns (in that scene from "Monsters") that Goliath is her biological father:

Benny: He IS her father. He laid the egg.
Erin: Girls lay eggs.
Benny: His wife laid the egg.

ROMANCE

Enter, for the third time or the first (or, depending on your point of view, maybe this one doesn't count either), Ms. Dominique Destine. She tells Mac, "We have all the time in the world..."

This for me (and I know for Bond expert Cary) was a very memorable line from "On Her Majesty's Secret Service." And always a good sign that a relationship is going to come to a bad end.

Elisa tips her hand, which she can do cuz no one is awake, about how she really feels about Goliath here. "The most romantic city in the world and Goliath isn't awake to share it with me." (Or something like that, all quotations are approximate.) That's what she'd like to do, I'd wager. Soar over Paris with G. the way they soared over Manhattan in "Awakenings". Now had he been awake, do you think she would have made that request? Or would she in fact be distancing herself from him simply BECAUSE she had that impulse?

After her adventure on the Loch, it's nice to see Margot on a pleasant little stroll through Paris.

THE GARGOYLE WAY

Why is Goliath so resistant to parenting Angela? After all, though they're really more like younger brothers, he does his fair share of parenting the Trio.

He falls back on "The Gargoyle Way", but that's certainly inadequate, as Diane Maza will later point out. Yes, he's only one of her rookery fathers, but he's (a) the only one there and (b) the only one left alive except for the two souls trapped inside the AWOL Coldstone.

Ultimately, I think the answer is that Angela's sudden obssession with her "BIOLOGICAL" parentage makes him nervous because of the obvious extrapolation to what comes next. If she's obssessed with me as Daddy, then what happens when she learns who Mommy is?

And that's the key. He's divorced Demona. His wife who laid the egg. It took centuries and months, but after "Vows" he moved on. Now he sees Demona as a nemesis. A painful one to be sure, but a nemesis none the less. He's afraid of what the knowledge will do to Angela. He's afraid of what Demona will do with Angela, should Angela share that knowledge. And is he perhaps afraid of what -- under Demona's influence -- Angela might become?

THE CATHEDRAL

There's some nice animation in this episode -- but none of it is at Notre Dame. That sequence put us through fits in retakes and editing. Ugghh. It's still painful to look at.

But there's some nice stuff going on...

Demona says: "In here my love." to Goliath before she realizes its not Thailog. What did you all think of that line? At this point we had only seen one silhouetted monster from a distance. And since you knew Demona was in town, we intentionally tried to lead you to belive that she was the Monster at Notre Dame. Were you expecting Thailog? Or did you think that Demona was addressing G as 'my love'?

Goliath's arrival is a shock to her, so what did you think then?

Then Thailog's arrival is supposed to be a bigger shock to you guys. Was it?

I love hearing Thailog say: "My angel of the night."

Demona has a good line too: "Jealous and paranoid."

Later, we set up Nightstone Unlimited and their two "human" identities, Alexander Thailog and Dominique Destine.

At this point in production, we knew that Fox was going to have a baby but we had not named it yet. I couldn't think of a better first name for Thailog and later I couldn't think of a better first name for Alexander Xanatos. At first this bugged me. But I began to realize it made perfect sense. Xanatos had programmed his "first" son well. If X would pick Alexander, why wouldn't T have picked it as well. And there's something so symmetrical about both his kids being named Alexander.

TOURISTS

Elisa sits at a french cafe talking out loud to herself. Ugh. Very awkward. Obviously, we couldn't come up with a solution we liked better. I'm sure it occured to me to do it in voice over, but just chucking a V.O. sequence in the middle of an ep is very awkward too. Suddenly, the movie is POV Elisa, and we weren't doing that here. (Cf. "Revelations" and Matt's VO narration.)

I do like her last line though, coming as it did from a long time Superman scripter, Cary Bates: "This is a job... for the Gargoyles!"

THE WEDDING NIGHT

We had Macbeth use the Lennox Macbeth name instead of Lennox Macduff because we thought it would be too confusing to give him an entirely different name to any new viewers. And it makes sense that he has multiple aliases. But it still bugs me and I think in hindsight, I wish we had just been consistent.

Demona kicks Macbeth into unconsciousness, and Erin asks: "Why didn't she get hurt?"

And that's a very fair question. As usual with D&M's Corsican Brother connection, we tried very hard to be faithful to it, but it was very hard. And we wound up being a bit inconsistent. The best I can suggest is that when Demona knows she's going to hurt M and it isn't just on impulse, she can more or less steel herself against the magical feedback. It's still painful. But she doesn't show it as much.

The Gargoyles wake up and Elisa says: "Look alive, guys!" Well, they do now, don't they?

I love how Thailog slips Mac the gun and then later yells at Demona, "Didn't you search him?!" He's an evil genius that one. And passive-aggressive too.

Thailog's plan is brilliant, I think. So elegant. So simple. And if not for Elisa, so effective.

Mac's suicidal tendencies resurface. Demona's legendary temper gets the better of her common sense.

Thailog really comes into his own in this ep. Sure, Xanatos said he may have created a monster, but now Thailog has outsmarted X, D and M. Who the hell is left to outsmart?

And he has some great lines too:

"You and what clan?"

"Teamwork is so overrated."

"Aren't you spunky?'" (Another Lou Grant reference of course.)

To be fair, he couldn't immediately know that Angela was blood kin, but still doesn't his reaction to her give you the creeps? When X says Angela is lovely in "Cloud Fathers" I don't think anyone thought he was being salacious. But T? Yeah, baby.

Of course, Goliath finally gets the picture after this one. Up to this point, he was thinking Demona's the lost cause but maybe Thailog is salvagable. Now he knows better. At least about T anyway.

BATTLE

There's a lot of water in that water tower. It looks cool though. The animation here makes up for the Cathedral stuff.

I love Goliath's two-handed punch.

I love Demona's punch-drunken sway, as she makes her move to, as Mac says, "put us out of our misery..."

But I've always wondered why the background painters put multiple pictures of Elisa on the wall of Macbeth's chateau. Odd, that.

When I was young, I used to love MASH, particularly back in the Wayne Rogers days. (And, yes, Wayne is a friend of my dad's now. But they didn't know each other back then so I was unbiased.) But one thing that used to drive me nuts was the repetition of the following exchange:

<LOTS OF SHELLING IS ROCKING THE HOSPITAL. SUDDENLY, IT STOPS.>

Hawkeye: Do you hear that?
Someone else: Hear what?
Hawkeye: Silence! The shelling's stopped!

This was fine the first time they used it. By the twentieth time it got VERY old.

But we do a version of it here after Elisa shoots Demona ending the battle.

Why? When it used to drive me nuts? It's amazing what I'll pay tribute too.

KEITH meet MR. DAVID

I love playing Thailog against Goliath, because I love those Thailog/Goliath exchanges where Keith plays both roles. That's one of the main reasons we created Thailog. To enjoy listening to Keith go to town.

1st Epilogue:

Goliath: "She has done you a favor, Macbeth."

That line should be a bit of a shock when G first says it. But it makes a lot of sense after he explains. And I love the look that Goliath and Elisa share. They aren't even pretending they don't share those feelings. They just won't act on them.

And how about Goliath actually telling a joke: "Just make sure you get a good look at her at night." Word.

2nd Epilogue:

One of the things I like about our series is we didn't have to end each episode the same way.

This one ends rather darkly. Goliath won't acknowledge the obvious. He just broods. Angela turns to Elisa: "Elisa, I have to know." And Elisa confirms that Demona is Angela's mother, because it's ridiculous to either lie or to not confirm the obvious that Angela has already figured out. But she knows G didn't want A to know that. So everyone is left unhappy as we sail into the fog.

And Erin ends the episode saying: "I think Elisa should be her mother."

(Me, I've always seen them sharing a more sisterly relationship. But I thought Erin's idea was sweet, and certainly came out of the sexual tension between E&G.)

Anyway, that's my ramble. Where's yours?



: « First : « 100 : « 10 : Displaying #274 - #283 of 481 records. : 10 » : 100 » : Last » :