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AWAKENING, PART TWO
Watched the episode again last night.
Little things....
My two year old son is fascinated with Tom. And misses him in the second act after he's gone. Misses him in other episodes too. Kinda puts the lie to the strongly held belief I've always had that contrary to Network Executive Dogma, kids don't need animated shows to be about kids. Of course, my son is just two. My five year old has no problem with their being no "little girl" in the show.
Goliath says "What sorcery is this?" for the first time. We wound up using it over and over in the series, til it became something of an in-joke. But the truth is, we could never come up with a better line that said the same thing.
Goliath's "suicide" at the end of Act One, is still one of the most startling things I've ever seen in a cartoon. That was Gary Krisel's idea (my boss Bruce Cranston's boss). And I've always admired him for it. It's also the reminder I use to keep me humble when I'm listening to notes from the higher ups. Michael Reaves and I were just going to have the Magus offer to cast his spell on Goliath as something of a consolation prize. "Best I can do" kinda thing.
Love that Chernabog moment where Goliath says "I've been denied everything, even my revenge!" Man, Keith David is great.
The way it's edited you'd never know the problem the last fight in the Viking's camp caused me vis-a-vis Broadway. As you may recall from Part One, during the Viking's initial attack, Broadway stopped for a snack, and then opportunistically used the turkey leg to bonk a Viking. A nice little comedic beat. Well, in Part Two, we wanted to contrast that by having Broadway land in front of the roasting spit by the fire -- so that the audience again thinks he's just thinking about his stomach. But that after the massacre, the much more serious Broadway immediatlely starts using it as a weapon. That's pretty much what you see. But that's not what we received in Animation. What we got was a virtual replay of the scene from Part One. Broadway lands with a big grin and starts to eat. Then he gets attacked and uses the spit as a weapon. It took judicious editing to keep Broadway from feeling too one-dimensional. And even then as the series progressed, we started to downplay Broadway's appetite (another good Gary Krisel suggestion). We brought it up again in Hunter's Moon, Part Three to show how far the character had come. Yeah, great kitchen, but an even better library. That kind of thing.
We had a similar problem with Hudson's sword. We were supposed to make a big deal of him using it for the first time in the battle at the Viking camp. But some of the animation in both Parts One and Part Two showed him using the sword and/or having it by his side before that. That's what retakes are for, I guess.
Xanatos' first appearance... I'm really curious to know how many people, seeing this for the first time knew that Xanatos was the bad guy. I thought it was a little too obvious myself. There's a look he gives Goliath when he's taking the gargs' questions in the Great Hall that I thought absolutely tipped his hand to the audience. But we did try to create a guy who looked like he should be the hero of the show. Handsome athletic Bruce Wayne type up against scary monsters. And Jonathan Frakes is terrific.
(There was a while when Gary Krisel thought maybe we should have Xanatos -- or another rich guy, a pre-Renard if you will -- actually be the gargoyles modern benefactor. I'm glad that's one bit of advice I didn't take from Gary.)
We also get the first look at Owen. Jeff Bennett. Man. What a great cast we had. Wasn't Owen just fascinating from moment one? I didn't know he was Puck way back then, but I sure did know there was a story behind him.
Love that moment when they all Shatter out of stone near the top of Act Two. The sky spinning behind Goliath. The rotating camera for the others. Bronx leaning into the foreground. Still gives me a little thrill. Don't disappoint me Xanatos said. Well, it worked for me.
The first time we got the animation back on that sequence, their stone skins didn't really EXPLODE off them. In fact the first version of the footage had no stone at all. Those of you who have been to the GATHERING have seen that footage. We really had to push to make that concept of them exploding to life every night play visually.
There's an intentional this-ain't-Batman moment during the fight with the Commandos. Goliath gets tossed off the building. He's falling and he grabs for a flagpole, just like Batman would. But Goliath is so heavy, he rips the flagpole right off the building, and he has to use his claws to save himself. Back in those days, everyone was terrified that GARGOYLES was going to be perceived as a BATMAN rip-off. I actually had to write up a memo for the Marketing Department, listing all the significant ways the shows were different. This flagpole bit was our (me, Frank, Michael's) conscious reaction to the constant comparisons.
There's a moment during the fight where Goliath is facing a Commando, and from off-stage Xanatos rescues Goliath by firing his laser at the wall and dumping the masonry on the commando. But that scene gave us nightmares, because it looked like the laser beam was coming from Goliath's eyes. Like he was Cyclops of the X-Men. This made us nervous, because the concept was so new, we were afraid that the audience would think that maybe Gargoyles have all sorts of "cool" super-powers like that.
One line got cut from Part One that would have helped a bit in understanding Lex's character. In Part One, during the initial battle with the Vikings, we had Lex investigating a catapult, fascinated with how it works. That little scenelet got cut from the script for time. But I still miss it.
Anyway, please feel free to post your own responses here on the episode. Both how you felt when you first saw it, and what strikes you now looking at it again.
"Awakening, Part One"
My kids and I have started watching the 66 chapters of Gargoyles from start to finish, so I thought I'd give a shot at rambling on each episode as we view them.
So starting at the beginning...
Random thoughts:
In the original script, there was a bit that came right after Princess Katharine reprimands the Captain for inviting the Gargoyles into the Great Hall. She says something to the effect of: "To allow beasts in the dining hall..." Right then, we were supposed to cut to a shot of one of those hounds that you can see milling about in the initial establing shot. The hound was supposed to grab a chunk of meat off of one of the nobles' plates. This would further establish Katharine's hypocracy, but also embarrass her further, lending believability to the things she says and does thereafter. I recall that the scenelet got animated, but not well. Frank refused to include it in the final cut. He may have been right, given what we had to work with. But I still miss the moment I envisioned in my head.
Katharine and the Magus are so nasty in this episode. Boy, did they go through some changes.
I'm also struck by just how much the Trio grew from this first appearance. They're kinda medieval ninja turtles here. But they show potential. I still love their exchange with Tom as he tries to get names out of them and they are baffled as to why names would be important.
I do wish we could have seen more Gargoyles flying around. (It really would have been nice to catch a glimpse of the Coldtrio, but frankly, they hadn't been designed yet. We knew they were coming, but we didn't have time to design them before they were necessary.) But it would have been great to see more beasts, more females. More young and old. But I guess we did all right.
The cliffhangers are interesting too. In both, the threat is the Gargoyles themselves. Princess Katharine says something nasty about gargoyles, just as Goliath enters the Hall. He growls, clearly having heard her statement. And we go to commercial... I could never have gotten away with that by even episode 2. But this early on, we didn't know the gargs well enough to know how they'd react. Clearly they had our sympathy. But would Goliath go berserk? Obviously, not. But that was the tension in that beat. Same thing happens between Acts II & III. The threat seems to be from Brooklyn, Lex and Bronx. Of course, they're bluffing. Annoyed with the humans, they are simply trying to put a scare into them. But the audience doesn't know that yet, so I can get away with the second cliffhanger being a Garg threat as well. Of course, by the end of the episode, we know just how noble they are. And that's a great cliffhanger I think. Goliath roaring to the heavens filled with grief over the death of his "Angel of the Night". 'SCool. (But how many of you really thought she was dead?)
There are also moments that are fairly mundane to us now. Elisa pulling up in her car. Goliath first breaking out of stone. Demona stepping out of the shadows. I'd be curious how all those moments made you guys feel the very first time you saw them, particularly those of you for whom this was in fact the first episode you ever saw.
I invite you to post your comments here on Awakening, Part One.
OnyxStar writes...
I guess this is sort of a reference question. My favorite quote comes from Gargoyles (Awakenings I). Goliath says, "It is the nature of mankind to fear what they do not understand." I'd like to quote that in a college essay I'm writing, but I don't know who to attribute it to. Did you guys come up with it, or is it some famous quote I'd never heard of?
Thanks a lot for all your time and effort, and good luck with the new series.
Greg responds...
Although I'm sure similar things have been said over and over by multiple people, I'm not aware of a specific source for the quotation. If you want to be absolutely certain, you'd probably have to ask Michael Reaves, the writer of that episode.
Blaise writes...
Hi there! Me again.
Here's a Q that's been rattling around in my head for some time. We all know NOW that the cloaked figure riding out to meet the Vikings in "Awakening: Part 1" is none other than the Captain of the Guard. However, he speaks in a voice that sounds like Jeff Bennett's (sp?). In fact, I'm quite positive that was Mr. Bennett's voice. This, as well as the robe being white, make me think that suspicion was intentionally being thrown on the Magus.
1) WAS suspicion being intentionally thrown on the Magus?
2) If so, why?
Thank you!
Greg responds...
First off, that's not Jeff. That's Ed Gilbert doing Jeff, because...
1) Yes, we were intentionally trying to throw suspicion onto the Magus.
2) Why else... to fool you.
Todd Jensen writes...
Something that I've been wondering for some time about that secret passageway that Demona used to sneak into the great hall of Castle Wyvern in "City of Stone Part Three". How did she manage to conceal it from everyone else when the castle was being moved from Scotland to New York? I'd think that it would be extremely difficult to have hidden it while the castle was being transported stone by stone.
Greg responds...
I think so too. Maybe the transport wasn't quite as stone by stone as it looked to be. Or maybe in the replacing of stones the supervisors of the reconstruction didn't put two and two together and realize that by attaching stone A to stone B they were creating a secret passsage, and so neglected to alert Xanatos or Owen.
Aaron writes...
Just out of curiosity, was MacBeth's Paris home based on an actuall house? Thanks.
Greg responds...
Not that I'm aware of, but it's possible that our layout artists used some reference for it.
Aris Katsaris writes...
One of the scenes that most intrigued me, was the final action of Demona in the Hunter's Moon incident: throwing the container in the air, a deed through which she risked the annihilation of not only humans but her own race as well, including her daughter.
I always considered this a very nihilistic action of hers (I hope I'm using the term correctly) as if she was saying "I won't choose to destroy the world myself, but if the glass breaks and the virus escapes and we all die, so be it." Others in the fandom see it as just a way for her to buy some time and manage to escape. If so it was a very risky way indeed...
Your thoughts (and Demona's thoughts) on the issue?
Greg responds...
I can't put either argument any better than you just did, so my answer would have to be: ALL OF THE ABOVE.
lisa writes...
when demona told brooklyn about what she did during the centurys what did she tell him,did she tell him about macbeth?
Greg responds...
In "Temptation"? No. I think people have the notion that Demona and Brooklyn had a lot going on off-screen and/or between scenes of that episode. (Again, Christine, I've heard the rumors.) But it ain't true in the cannon. What you saw was largely what took place.
Todd Jensen writes...
Something else that I've been wondering lately, about the betrayal of Castle Wyvern by the Captain of the Guard and Demona. There was one snag in it (aside from the use of the common enemy as allies in settling an internal dispute - always a Very Bad Idea) that I found myself suddenly noticing. Demona and the Captain's plan was to have the Vikings take away all the humans while the gargoyles were absent (foiled by Goliath deciding to pursue the Vikings with only Hudson), believing that then the gargoyles would have the castle all to themselves. But - did those two *seriously* believe that Goliath would, upon coming home to find that the castle had been sacked and the humans taken prisoner, just say "Well, that's that," and do nothing about it? I certainly can't imagine him just letting the humans be led away by the Vikings and do nothing about it, even if the massacre of the bulk of his clan hadn't taken place.
Greg responds...
I think that was a miscalculation.
But I believe that Demona believed that once the humans were gone -- long gone -- she could convince Goliath not to send the clan. The danger of being more than a night's glide from the castle was too great -- as proven by the Viking's ability to sack the place while they were all away.
I think she and the Captain were, of a measure, kidding themselves. But all that self-delusion is hardly out of character for either of them.
Goliath probably would have sent a small expedition. Himself, Hudson, Coldstone. Left Demona in charge back at the ranch. Anyway, that's my guess. We'll never know.
Aris Katsaris writes...
Is there a special story behind the flute of Puck that was seen in "Gathering, Part I"? Or the harp seen in "Lighthouse in the Sea of Time"? Were you planning to do stories on either or both of the two?
Greg responds...
I had planned on using the flute in THE GATHERING, PART TWO -- and it's probably a mistake that I didn't. I wanted Puck to use it to temporarily subdue Oberon, but it got away from me somehow.
But yes, the flute definitely interested me, and I would have done something with it eventually.
The harp, I hadn't given any real thought to. But it could probably come into play down the road in Pendragon.
Todd Jensen writes...
Something that I've recently been wondering about Demona's genocide attempt in "Hunter's Moon". The plague that she used the Fulfillment Spell and Sevarius's carrier virus to create would have wiped out all of humanity if released, and the entire gargoyle race as well were it not for the protection of the Praying Gargoyle. Since humans and gargoyles are clearly not very closely related from a biological standpoint, a plague capable of wiping out both species must be very far-reaching in its range. So, if Demona had released her plague, would other species (say, most mammals) have been killed by it as well? Or did it only work on sentient species?
Greg responds...
I think it was limited to sentience. How that would have effected chimpanzees, gargoyle beasts, dolphins, whales, etc. I'm not sure. Hard to say what a combination of science and sorcery would consider sentient. But I think rats, cats, dogs etc. were safe.
Ash writes...
1) What are the Matrix's abilities? Can she simply replicate nano-robots inifinately? Or can she crank out toaster ovens, listen in on police broadcasts and surf the WWW?
2) Does the Matrix really want to do good, or does she think that the "law" that Dingo told her about was merely a missing peice of her programming?
Greg responds...
The most interesting thing about your questions to me is that you identified Matrix as a she. This never occurred to me, since Matrix was voiced by Jim Cummings in "Walkabout" and by Jeff Bennett in "Bad Guys". Also, Matrix's basic body shape was male, i.e. there's no sense of female mamary glands in the design. Still, even with all that there's no particular reason to identify it as male. Hmmmm.....
1. Yes.
2. At first, just the latter.
Excelsior writes...
In "The Price," after Hudson escapes Xanatos's dungeon, Xanatos bitterly comments that he now has no one to test the Cauldron of Life's magic on. Ever the good servant, Owen volunteers and sticks his hand into the cauldron without a second thought.
Now, I know Xanatos isn't the most practical being on Earth, but couldn't he have just dipped one of his little lab animals into the brew, or even one of his lower-level lackeys?
Greg responds...
Owen didn't give him the chance. I think Owen was feeling a little jealous of Xanatos' praise of the Macbeth robot. He dived right in, so to speak.
Of course, both men knew that "Owen" really had nothing to lose by dipping his hand. That's why both had such mild reactions to Owen's hand turning into stone.
Andrea "Elisa Maza" Ivanovs writes...
Hi Greg,
Hope you're alright and survived the GWT well. ;)
Here's my question: it's about the aging of Gargoyles. We all know they live longer than humans, but e.g. in "Awakening", the whole Clan Wyvern is seen, but there's no Gargoyles as old as Goliath and Angela look in "Grief". Do they die fighting before they get that old, or do they never after all?
Thank you for your time!
Greg responds...
In the Dark Ages, it was rare that a gargoyle lived into old age. It was a violent time. But also, lets remember that Wyvern had a clan of about 40 gargoyles and beasts. We didn't get to see them all. We barely saw a quarter of them.
Aaron writes...
Probably irrelevent, but... In Reawakening, when Xanatos says "It's alive! Aliiiive! I've always wanted to say that." does Demona know what he's talking about, or does she just think he's being goofy. In other words, does she get the reference?
Greg responds...
It's probably funnier if she doesn't.
Zeliard writes...
Hello mr. Weisman!
In "Eye of the Beholder", Xanatos used put a transmitter on Goliath to find him. Does that mean that Xanatos knew that the Gargoyles lived in the Clock Tower, since the transmitter was still attach on Goliath until the next day?
Greg responds...
I'd have to look at the episode again, but I think you have the timing off. I think he planted the transmitter earlier Halloween night.
Snow writes...
In watching Bushido, I noticed among other things that the village/town of Ishimura seemed to be located in a fairly flat area of Japan, not located among many hills or mountains. Living in the country for a while, it seemed to me that a tiny away place like that would be somewhere up in the mountains...
Therefore I was wondering how much researching of other countries was done for these Avalon-traveling episodes?
Greg responds...
Quite a bit, but I don't know that I agree with your assessment of Ishimura's locale. Gary Sperling wrote and researched that show. Not everything makes it onto the screen, but we try...
Zeliard writes...
Hi mr. Weisman!
Here are my impressions on the lost moments of "Hunter's Moon 3". First, it was the missing link. When we saw Elisa, Matt and Maria Chavez talking, Elisa was angry toward Jason. At the dam we saw Elisa trying to stop Goliath and Jason. I always wondered why she wasn't angry anymore toward Jason; the lost moment explained all.
It most have shocked Elisa, falling in love with someone who was gonna kill her friends, espacially Goliath. If Elisa shot Jason or called for backup, the incident at the dam could have been prevented, but her heart told her otherwise. The lost moment really took me; this is probably the most dramatic scene since Broadway's "death" in Future Tense. Shame I had to imagine the whole scene in my mind.
Greg responds...
It killed me to cut that scene. It was beautifully written and it contained the theme of the whole three-parter in a nutshell. And full of emotion.
But I had no choice. There was nothing else I could cut...
Fan writes...
I noticed there was considerable space between "Enter Macbeth" and the "City Of Stone" miniseries that explained his and Demona's history. Was it your intention to keep us guessing or did the storyline just work out that way?
Greg responds...
Are those options mutually exclusive?
Airwalker writes...
In CITY OF STONE 3 Owen mentions that he and Xanatos should search the Grimorium for a solution. But at that point Xanatos didn't have the book in his possession plus Goliath is stone so he can't ask him to get it for them. Did he have a copy of the Grimorium somewhere in his possession that he could search through?
Greg responds...
I'd have to look at the episode again, but they may have been discussing options, some of which would have to wait until Goliath woke up.
Zeliard writes...
Hello mr. Weisman!
1.You said that cetain scenes of "Avalon part 2" had been cutted because the episode was too long. Will tell us what was those missing scenes?
2.Why the Archmage chose Demona and MacBeth as allies?
Greg responds...
1. Stuff with the Archmage-Plus mentoring the original Archmage and guiding the Weird Sisters.
2. His "future" self told him too.
Airwalker writes...
Just wanted to make a small comment on AWAKENINGS 5:
When Demona revealed her name to Goliath in AWAKENINGS 5, I know it's supposed to be this huge dramatic moment:
"I have a name too Goliath. You should know it before you die. I am..... Demona!"
But the moment that she said that, all I could think was "She's named after a city in Southern Israel?"
Greg responds...
I wasn't aware that Demona was the name of a city in Southern Israel. What's the etimology there?
It's kinda hard to imagine. "Hi, I live in Demona." Any fans from Demona out there?
Anyway, I think it was the whole scary demon association thing that she was going for. I never thought it was our most effective moment. But a city in Israel?
Airwalker writes...
In HIGH NOON when Broadway and Hudson attack Macbeth, Demona feels his pain from across the house. Yet later when Demona is in a fight with Elisa 2 feet way from Macbeth, he feels absolutely nothing. Why is that? Does the spell that allows them to feel each other's pain only apply when she is in her Gargoyle form?
Greg responds...
No.
I'd say that Macbeth must have been feeling something, but that he was steeling himself against the pain. (Something he couldn't do when he didn't know the blows were coming.) I realize this is a bit of a cheat, but that's my story and I'm sticking to it.
Zorlond writes...
Good evening, Greg. My question is something I know you've skirted before, but the question wasn't very specific. Okay, question is:
In The Green (think that's the name), Jackal's imagining the things he's going to do to the Aztec Clan and the Tourists. One of those things is re-carving Goliath's face to resemble Jackal's. If Jackal had actually done that, would Goliath wake up looking like Jackal? Wake up with his own face? Not wake up at all?
Hopefully this specific question isn't a repeat...
Greg responds...
He probably would not have woken up. It probably would have killed him.
Celano writes...
Hey Greg!
I noticed this a long time ago, but apparently, I was the only one. When Puck and Demona are in the alley in The Mirror, they are passed by an obese blue female she-Goyle who is dragging her giggling beaked Goyle-child. What I'm curious about is, why does she have a beard???
Greg responds...
I never noticed any beard. Are you sure?
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