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Rewatched "The Hound of Ulster" yesterday, but I didn't have any new thoughts on it, so I skipped it over - and "Walkabout" today.
Things that struck me about "Walkabout" this time around:
I'd noticed this before, but Bronx growls at a kangaroo near the beginning. I wonder what he dislikes about them. (I also spotted a koala up in a tree - that I *hadn't* seen in past viewings.)
I was amused by Elisa's description of Dingo as "not one of the good guys" - since that could so easily be tweaked to "one of the bad guys". I don't know if you'd come up with the name for that spin-off at the time, of course.
Goliath at one point says "Aye, for now" - probably the one occasion where he says "Aye" - he usually leaves those Scottish-toned words to Hudson.
During the battle with the Matrix in the Dreamtime-world, Goliath imprisons it briefly within a dome that looks a lot like the domes it was producing in the waking world, and conjures up a shield with a sun-design upon it - a strange emblem for a gargoyle to bear.
Maybe Bronx just had never seen a kangaroo before...
Rewatched "Grief" on DVD today.
The only new observation I have is that, this time, I noticed how Keith David did the "aged-up" Goliath; his voice sounded, while recognizably Goliath's, much older. I thought it another "mark of honor" for the "Gargoyles" voice cast.
Yeah. Keith - and our whole cast - were just amazing.
Rewatched "M.I.A." today. One detail stood out to me this time; the human Londoners grouped in the background at the very end are the same ones we saw in Act I staring at the gargoyles in shock and alarm, when Leo and Una are confronting Goliath outside their shop. It made a pleasant touch, I thought, to see that those people have now recognized (judging from the way they were shown at the conclusion) that they didn't need to be scared of the gargoyles.
Yep.
Rewatched "Sanctuary" on DVD today. New observations.
Elisa writes Macbeth's name as "MacBeth". Not quite as serious as the infamous "Servarius" error in "The Cage", but still a bit unfortunate.
I was amused to note that Demona barely even registers Elisa's presence in the middle of her fight with Macbeth, even though Elisa's calling out to both of them - until just before Elisa shoots her. She does finally spot the detective and aim at her, but Elisa takes her down before she can do more than that. Apparently her feud with Macbeth tops even her hatred for Elisa.
I felt a sense of near-horror, though, as I noticed how Demona and Macbeth's fight was damaging the library, with several books apparently getting damaged or destroyed.
And the silhouette of a gargoyle against the moon in the newspaper photograph bears an uncanny similarity (obviously coincidental) to the Bat-Signal.
Those typos drive me nuts.
I rewatched "Golem" on DVD.
Not many new observations or insights, but I was impressed by the late Robert Culp's performance, the way he switches the tone of Renard's voice when he's in the Golem's body. It still sounds like Renard, but tougher, more vigorous.
I don't know if I've mentioned this before, but I found the scene where Janus was petting Bronx on the head charming. (And all the more impressive, given that he's just encountered his first gargoyle beast only minutes before. He clearly picked up on Bronx's nature quickly.)
Bronx is very lovable.
Rewatched "Monsters" on DVD today. (Appropriate timing, I thought, since November 30 is St. Andrew's Day, dedicated to the patron saint of Scotland - and on that day, I was watching Scottish gargoyles encountering Scotland's most famous monster.) A few fresh thoughts on it.
When Elisa describes herself to the man at the souvenir stall as "not really the adventuring type", I found myself thinking of her statement in "High Noon", "I'm no hero; I just do my job". Certainly, whatever her incliations, she's had plenty of adventures.
I wondered whether Elisa's remark about theme parks doing "robot Nessie-type" stunts five times a day was Disney poking a bit of fun at itself - we'd see something similar in "Bushido".
And when Elisa says at the end how some legends need to stay that way, she looks in Goliath's direction as she speaks, making me wonder if it was just the Loch Ness Monster she was talking about. Certainly Elisa's been zealous about preserving the gargoyles' secrecy - maybe too zealous, in light of "Revelations" and "Mark of the Panther".
She wasn't just talking about Nessie.
I've now rewatched "Heritage" and "Kingdom" on DVD. No new thoughts on "Heritage", but I still really enjoy the gargoyles bringing Cagney to the clock tower to look after him in Elisa's absence. I thought it appropriate that it was Broadway who found the kitty (he's the one of the four left behind gargs who's closest to Elisa). And I liked Hudson's rapport with Cagney, while missing Bronx. Including Cagney rubbing affectionately against Hudson - he's got no problems with gargoyles (though Maggie's another story).
I found myself wondering how that containment unit was still functioning after Fang ripped the cables apart to transport it. (To make up for it, I noticed this time around - and really liked - the way they did Talon's voice while he was stuck in there.)
As you pointed out in your ramble, Xanatos's security system does far more damage to the castle than to the gargoyles - I cringe as I see it blowing pieces of the castle apart (small wonder that, by the time of the Double Date story, Owen was getting fed up with all those repairs!) - but Xanatos's lines made up for it.
Xanatos is just so much fun...
A postscript thought I had on "Shadows of the Past". Both it and "Future Tense" - the first and last episodes in the Avalon World Tour respectively - have Goliath being beset by terrifying magical illusions, but at last realizing that they're not real and confronting the person or people behind the illusion. I don't know if this was intentional or not, but I think it gives a great element of symmetry to the World Tour.
It was indeed intentional.
Rewatched "Shadows of the Past" today.
Bronx was definitely not enjoying the wild boat ride through the stormy seas - his response put me in mind of the "series Pitch"'s description of him as angst-ridden and not fond of adventures.
I really enjoyed the little animation details in this episode - Elisa cautiously climbing up the path from the shore, grabbing hold of the stone wall at one point to steady herself, or Bronx slipping a bit when he starts climbing up the cliff.
The entrance to the rookery looked different than it did in "Awakening Part One" - apparently those doors and the gargoyle-like face over them were removed by Xanatos to New York, along with the rest of the castle. The depiction of the now castle-less cliff - with a huge gap - brought home just how much of it Mr. X had removed.
I really like the illusory Demona's words to Goliath "Join me in the dark" - it's an illusion of her, of course, but those words capture so well in metaphor what she's been trying to get him to do (when not simply trying to kill him).
This time around, looking at the giant skull-like shape left over from the Archmage's battle with the gargoyles in "Long Way Till Morning", I tried to work out (but wasn't certain) whether it was a real skull (if so, it belonged to something really huge) or just part of the cave sculpted into the likeness of a skull. I'll have to pay closer attention to it, the next time I watch "Long Way Till Morning".
The animation on that episode was just lovely..
Rewatched the "Avalon" triptych on DVD today. A few new observations.
The Magus's lyre in the "flashback on Avalon" scene looks a lot like Merlin's lyre in "A Lighthouse in the Sea of Time". Obviously not the same one, but evidently both wizards share a common taste in musical instruments.
Princess Katharine and the Magus's telling Elisa "Little is known of the Sleeping King" struck me as all the more appropriate since in 995, nearly all the major works on King Arthur had yet to be written (Geoffrey of Monmouth's "History of the Kings of Britain", the oldest extant start-to-finish account of Arthur's life, wouldn't be written for over a hundred years). There were one or two, like Nennius's "Historia Brittonum", but that was about it.
A detail that I hadn't spotted before: a couple of gargoyle-like sculptures were "guarding" the bridge leading to Arthur's resting-place within the Hollow Hill.
King Arthur and Goliath have both used a mace while fighting Macbeth (Goliath did so in "Enter Macbeth") - one of a few points in common they share (others are awakening in the modern world from a long enchanted sleep, and having scheming illegitimate sons).
The Archmage's boast that he could destroy Goliath with "just a word" struck me as apt, since all the "enhanced Archmage"'s spells were one-word ones ("Vessel", "Revert", "Ice", etc.).
It's difficult not to smile at Elisa's "Souvenirs" question after Season One of "Young Justice". Fortunately, she was asking it in a lighthearted tone.
Certain elements run through my work, I suppose...
Rewatched "The Price" on DVD yesterday.
This time around, I noted the Macbeth-robot's "trophies" line, and how that continued the "hunting" imagery I'd been paying close attention to in the series during my 25th anniversary viewing. Because trophies are one of the reasons why someone would be hunting. (As far as I can tell, it's the only time that was given as a motive for hunting gargoyles - and, of course, it doesn't count, since it was all part of the misdirection tactic.)
Yep.
Rewatched "The Cage" on DVD today (and "Protection" yesterday, but I had no new thoughts or observations on it).
I noted, this time around, Elisa's joke about webbed feet during the family dinner scene at the start, followed by Peter Maza's "and a great duck impersonation" line followed by a quacking sound, and wondered if that might have been intended as a tribute to the Disney Afternoon's "duck shows" - both "Duck Tales" and "Darkwing Duck".
It's not NOT a tribute.
Rewatched "Upgrade" today.
Continuing the "animals/beasts/hunting" terms used for gargoyles - I noticed Dingo's remark to Wolf "I hope you're not planning to eat your catch" and Hyena's I wonder if gargoyles taste like chicken." This is the first time anyone was actually suggesting eating the gargoyles - they'd hunted them for other reasons - control, sport, revenge (I found myself suddenly comparing Gillecomgain's vengeful pursuit of Demona with Captain Ahab's pursuit of Moby-Dick - in both cases, to get back at the quarry for a lasting physical injury, whether facial scars or a missing leg), but this is the first time anyone seemed to consider eating the gargoyles. And, naturally, it'd be the Pack who'd be the ones to consider that.
Hyena also addresses Lexington as "flying rat".
When Broadway foils the most crimes, saying "You just gotta know where to look", I thought again of his detective interests in "The Silver Falcon" - and which resurfaces again in "Protection", the very next episode.
Not just the Pack, but Hyena specifically. Not sure the rest of the Pack has her appetite.
I rewatched "Double Jeopardy" today - a few new thoughts.
Elisa's again driving along a lonely road by the coast, far from Manhattan, just as she'd done in the immediately preceding episode ("Revelations") - but this time, we know why she's out there (a warning about a power plant emergency - actually a hoax, courtesy of Thailog).
Broadway tells Elisa, as he and Lexington head off to Gen-U-Tech, "We're on the case". His way of phrasing it invokes again his interest in detective work (cf. "The Silver Falcon").
All the dates on Sevarius' video documentary about Thailog are written in the "British format" - i.e., "15 NOV", with the day first, then the month. Something you don't often see on American television.
Dates are hard.
Rewatched "Revelations" on DVD.
The "creatures/beast" theme: Mace Malone describes Goliath as "a majestic beast". (The evidence, though, indicates that he recognizes Goliath as a sentient being rather than a mere "beast".)
This time around, when I saw Mace Malone's fate, I found myself thinking of the depiction of his ex-partner Dominic Dracon in the "Religion 101" radio play, searching everywhere for those diamonds in a way that indicated that he'd suffered a severe mental shock at the end of "The Silver Falcon". Though I recognize that the radio play isn't canon, I'd felt that it did seem like a probable consequence for DD, after discovering that those diamonds had never been in the Silver Falcon - and Mace Malone's own fate, frantically trying every door, convinced each time that this was the one which would get him out of the Hotel Cabal and to freedom, felt like a parallel to it.
I like that observation.
My thoughts on rewatching "Outfoxed".
Not much new to say about it, but I spotted two things. First, just after Goliath heads off in pursuit of Fortress-Two, we get a shot of it flying towards the Twin Towers. From a hindsight perspective, an unsettling moment.
I noticed, also (continuing my examination of the "monster/beast/creature" terminology used by humans towards gargoyles during this rewatch) that both Renard and Vogel call Goliath "creature". Renard, of course, soon recognizes that Goliath's a sentient being, capable of understanding him when he speaks about the importance of taking responsibility for your actions. I'm not so sure whether Vogel came to the same realization, though.
Ultimately, I think he did.
I rewatched "High Noon" over the weekend. ("Outfoxed", as well, but I'm giving it a separate entry.)
What struck me most about this episode this time around was that it was almost a "Shakespeare villain team-up" - Macbeth (and Demona, whom you could describe as a "Lady Macbeth" analogue) team up with Iago (more accurately, a gargoyle analogue for Iago, who's only called that in the voice actor credits). I doubt that Shakespeare should have objected to that, since he'd written at least one crossover himself ("A Midsummer Night's Dream", which blends Greek mythology with English fairy-lore).
I still like the touch of Hudson and Broadway learning to read from the newspaper - poor Broadway's still finding the word "right" a challenge (cf. "The Silver Falcon"). Again, I'm going to have to look through some books on the history of the English language to find out how so many words which sound like "-ite" came to end, in written form, with "-ight". It's probably one of the biggest challenges to someone learning written English.
Broadway's excited cry, as he and Hudson enter Macbeth's library, "Look at all these books!" struck me all the more, when I thought that, to someone who'd been born (well, hatched) and grown up in the 10th century, a library that size would indeed seem miraculous. What a difference the printing press has made!
"Iago"'s cry as "Othello" and "Desdemona" recover control of Coldstone, "I am besieged!", grabbed me this time around - such a dramatic way of describing the struggle within.
And this time, I also noted Coldstone's statement that, as long as "Iago"'s trying to recover control, "no *living* gargoyle" (emphasis mine) is safe from him. It brings home, I think, his awareness that he's now an "undead gargoyle".
Glad you liked it, still, after all these years.
Rewatched "City of Stone" today (all four episodes). A few things that stood out to me this time.
Continuing the "gargoyles being called beasts" thread: the granary guards in Part One call Demona's clan "filthy beasts". Gillecomgain doesn't use the term "beast" for Demona, but does call her a creature and a monster.
(By contrast, the "breastplate gargoyle" comments about their old home, after Demona and her clan have to abandon it following Duncan's attack, "The hunting there was good" - probably one of the few occasions where gargoyles are talking about being the hunters rather than the hunted.)
Demona's clan uses nets twice in this multi-parter - once against the granary guards in Part One, once against Canmore's army in Part Four. The nets being in Parts One and Four gave a nice sense of "bookends".
A detail that I can't believe I missed before: Demona was bearing the Hunter's mask at her belt, as if a trophy, after the battle with Duncan. (The young Canmore grabs it from her during his attack upon her.)
Demona calls Bronx "my pet"; I looked up your remarks on gargoyle beasts in the archives and found that gargoyles don't see gargoyle beasts as pets, but as equals. Maybe another sign that Demona thinks far more like a human than she'd admit (or than it would be safe to tell her)?
I like the touch of the various new kings (like Macbeth and Lulach) being hailed as "High King of Scotland" - the "high king" part conveys all the more a sense of Scotland as a collection of recently-united chiefdoms (which it would have been at the time in actual history).
We tried to get a feeling for the actual history into the piece.
Rewatched "Vows" today. A few new things that came to me.
I was hesitant about mentioning this, in case it comes across as an idea, but - from the way Goliath addressed Demona as "my angel of the night" at Prince Malcolm's wedding, I wondered if this was the first time he'd called her that.
When Xanatos referred to his getting the old coin that was the foundation of his fortune as "ancient history", I thought, "well, medieval history, to be precise".
I wonder how Prince Malcolm and his court must have perceived the Norman Ambassador's departure - he rides off just before the wedding, not staying to see Princess Elena, whom he'd escorted to the castle, wedded (even though he'd presumably be the closest thing to a representative of her father there). At least it doesn't appear to have caused a diplomatic incident between Scotland and Normandy.
The Archmage addresses Demona as "you stupid beast", continuing the pattern of unfriendly humans using such terms for gargoyles, that I've been paying close attention to this time around.
Brooklyn is the one most vocal about going to Goliath's rescue at the end; I wonder if Demona's involvement and his feelings about her had a lot to do about that.
I still think it's a pity that the original ending got onto the DVD; I hope that the Disney + version uses the corrected ending. (That's the main thing I miss from my old "Gargoyles" tapes.)
<sigh> That damn ending...
Rewatched my DVD of "Eye of the Beholder" today. I didn't find as much new to notice with this one, unfortunately, though I was delighted to note the moment where Xanatos placed his hand on Goliath's shoulder while pleading for his help at the castle - meaning that he had an opportunity (which he used, obviously) to plant that tracking device on him. I'm glad that the episode played fair with that.
Brooklyn's eyepatch as part of his pirate costume seems all the more appropriate after the ending of "Clan-Building".
Goliath echoes "Re-Awakening" when he speaks of Manhattan as "my castle, my city".
Lots of echoes in this one - backwards and forwards...
New observations from rewatching "The Silver Falcon" today.
One line of Broadway's dates the episode: he mentions that Lexington and Brooklyn "have dibs on the VCR". I wonder how many of us remember VCRS, and how many of us have forgotten them thanks to DVDs and Blu-Rays.
Elisa's line about Broadway "living out a movie fantasy" brought "Deadly Force" to my mind this time (of course, it helps that Dracon's back in this episode). Fortunately, Broadway's wish to do that has less disastrous results this time.
I also spotted, this time around, the parallels between Matt's entering the remains of the Silver Falcon night club and Broadway and Elisa's later arrival - and how both Broadway and Elisa say "I've had better nights".
And this episode continues "A Lighthouse in the Sea of Time" , showing us that Broadway's begun to learn how to read, and has progressed enough to be able to read Mace Malone's note (and correctly figure out its meaning). In "Lighthouse" he'd initially been drawn to reading because of its ability to take you to other places and times; now he finds that it can be used to convey useful information. (And the poor guy has the word "right" in that note, though he manages to figure it out. It got me wondering - and I'll have to look it up - how so many English words which rhyme with "ite" are written "-ight" - bright, fright, fight, flight, night, sight, knight, tight, etc.
Even DVDs and Blu-Rays are losing ground to streaming...
I always thought that for a new reader - which I can't quite remember being - words with the -ight formation would be tough. So would "tough".
Rewatched "The Mirror" today. A few new thoughts and observations.
I saw Demona's snarl at the "Dracula's daughter" in a new light this time. Dracula was a human before he became a vampire - and, naturally, Demona's going to regard any suggestion that she's related to a human - even a human who's become another "mythical creature of the night" - as the ultimate insult.
Not on the scale of Coldstone or the "Hunter's Moon" scheme, but Puck engages in a bit of "blending science with magic" when he uses the satellite dish and the television antenna atop the Twin Towers to help him turn all the humans in Manhattan into gargoyles and back again.
Bronx gets turned into an Irish wolfhound (or close to that kind of dog) - appropriate, in light of "The Hound of Ulster".
Ah, memories...
Rewatched "A Lighthouse in the Sea of Time" - a few fresh thoughts.
I remember your mentioning that you'd intended to have Goliath list a few specific books about Merlin, with Mary Stewart's "The Crystal Cave" as one of them, but weren't able to clear the rights for that. It recently struck me as particularly unfortunate you couldn't mention "The Crystal Cave", since it was published in 1970 and "Lighthouse" first aired in 1995. Goliath could have given it a 25th anniversary tribute.
Continuing the "'beast and monster' terms used for gargoyles" thread that I've been paying particularly close attention to for "Gargoyles"' own silver anniversary viewing, I noted that Macbeth addressed Broadway as "beastie" (evocative of Robert Burns, though Broadway's definitely not "wee, sleekit, cow'rin', timorous" and there didn't seem to be any panic in his breastie) and Goliath as "monster".
I spotted a drawing of a Celtic cross at the top of one of Merlin's Scrolls, when it was unrolled and the writing was visible.
Yeah, I wanted to acknowledge some of my influences, but Disney legal said no.
I rewatched "Legion" today.
When Goliath and Lexington were reunited with Coldstone near the start, I suddenly found myself thinking of your mention of a (rejected) outline for a live-action adaptation of "Gargoyles" you'd written which had Goliath, Lex, and "Othello" as the gargoyles who'd be awakened in the modern world.
This time around, also, the Xanatos Program felt like a foreshadowing of "Future Tense".
I also wondered (just a wondering, not a question) whether the ivied balcony in Coldstone's memories (where he's standing while Iago's "pouring poison in his ear" about Desdemona and Goliath) was supposed to be an actual feature of Castle Wyvern before the massacre, or just a symbolic construct.
Yeah, one thing I'd have loved to do was to better integrate the Coldtrio into the early episodes.
I think maybe the castle might have had some kind of ivy. Maybe. Guess I'd have to research that.
I rewatched "Metamorphosis" today. A few things that struck me this time around.
When Derek and Elisa had their "Xanatos as the reincarnation of Snidely Whiplash" exchange, I thought "No, he's a lot more dangerous than that."
I noticed the pigeons clustered around Goliath just before he awakened; you'd think they'd be staying well away from the clock tower by now. (Though they do fly off in a hurry once the gargoyles wake up.)
I spotted a few animals in cages in Sevarius's lab that I don't think I'd noticed before, though I'm not certain what they were; they were too small to be jungle cats, and the wrong shape for bats.
I'd have to look at the episode again to see if I could remember what they were.
Rewatched "Leader of the Pack" on DVD today. Elements that particularly stood out to me this time:
We see all the gargoyles awakening from their stone sleep, one by one. An appropriate way, I thought, to re-introduce them in the first episode of the second season.
Hudson displays his tracking skills in examining the traces of the fight between the Pack and Lexington, Brooklyn and Bronx at Pack-Media Studios. In fact, I've noticed him using that skill a lot - all the way back to "Awakening Part One", where he notes that the Vikings' horses' prints are too light.
Yep, Hudson was our experienced tracker.
New thoughts on "Re-Awakening", after my rewatch.
I don't know whether this was intentional or not, but when Goliath and Elisa were having their conversation about the shopkeeper and why he doesn't leave the neighborhood, I found myself thinking of "Othello"'s suggestion, in the flashback, of abandoning the castle and letting the Vikings have it, and Hudson's response. I don't know if you intended those moments to be thematically connected, but they did feel that way to me this time.
It still strikes me that the fact that the gargoyles' resolution to protect the city and its inhabitants comes at the end of the first season says a lot about how different "Gargoyles" was from most super-hero series; the gargoyles are able to have plenty of adventures and experiences - thirteen episodes' worth of them - before making that vow. The series was rooted in their being gargoyles - ancient "mythical" beings with their own culture and world-view - re-awakened in the modern world, trying to make sense of it - and often making mistakes in the course of their attempts - rather than just crime-fighters.
That was all intentional.
Rewatched both "Her Brother's Keeper" and "Re-Awakening" today, as part of my "Gargoyles" 25th anniversary review. New thoughts on "Her Brother's Keeper" (ones that came to mind when I rewatched it).
Broadway's concerned remarks about Elisa near the beginning (including "If cops were meant to fly, they'd have wings") indicates that Elisa had shared with them how she was following Xanatos by helicopter before embarking on it.
Derek's remark to Diane that working for Xanatos "could be the start of a whole new career for me" feels all the truer in hindsight - though he obviously wasn't thinking in terms of running an underground sanctuary for Mutates and homeless people when he said it.
I spotted the clock's hands moving at one point in the episode; apparently Lexington had indeed gotten it working again.
But was it telling the correct time?
I rewatched "Lnng Way Till Morning" today.
I'm not sure if I noticed it (or commented on it) before, but I spotted two parallel elements in the flashbacks (beside the obvious "Goliath and Hudson pitted against someone who made a poison dart attack upon a human friend"). The scene where Demona wounds Goliath parallels the Archmage's attack on Prince Malcolm; on both occasions, Hudson tries to block the attack, but to no avail. And in both the past and present parts of the story, Demona comments on the gargoyles going underground where their wings will be no use (though in different moods).
Continuing the study of how often "beast" imagery gets applied to the gargoyles: the Archmage calls Goliath a "beast".
October 31st and you're not watching "Eye of the Beholder"?
I rewatched "The Edge" today - appropriately, since today (October 30) is, according to some sources, Dostoyevsky's birthday, and Goliath was reading his work in the episode.
I spotted more "hunted like animals" remarks (I'm keeping close watch for those in the 25th anniversary review) from Xanatos during his conversation with Goliath at the castle. (I don't recall any of that imagery in "Deadly Force". I think that Macbeth addressed Goliath as "beastie" in "Enter Macbeth", but I'm not certain - if he did, I must have temporarily forgotten my resolve to keep track of that element.)
I also couldn't help thinking, this time around, how convenient for the series it was that Elisa only got a partner *after* the gargoyles moved out of the castle and into the clock tower.
Yeah. It was too convenient, which is why we gave her Matt.
Rewatched "Enter Macbeth" today.
I can't help womdering what must be going through Hudson's head as he watches a Donald Duck cartoon, thoughtfully stroking his beard. The spectacle of a duck grown to human size, wearing clothes and speaking (kind of) could be an even bigger argument for not believing everything you see on television than the revelation of the Pack's true nature.
U remember in your ramble on "Enter Macbeth", your daughter spotted what looked like the Mona Lisa in Macbeth's mansion. This time around, I noticed a portrait of a man apparently in 18th century attire, who reminded me of portraits I'd seen of Bonnie Prince Charlie.
The doors to Macbeth get it both coming and going; they first get broken down when Bronx escapes, and when he returns with Goliath, they demolish a second pair of doors. (Of course, it becomes academic after the whole mansion gets burned down.)
Lexington talks about getting the clock working again; I wonder if he ever succeeded before the Canmores blew the place up.
1. Donald is a mystery to us all... ;)
2. I think Macbeth owned a lot of expensive art.
3. Yeah, so much destruction.
4. He never did.
Features I'd just noticed about "Temptation", this time around.
1. When Broadway tells Goliath that Brooklyn had gone on a joyride, he makes motions with his hands suggesting someone gripping a motorcycle's handlebars.
2. Demona, when she talks about the events of "The Thrill of the Hunt", uses the phrase "hunted like animals" - which not only continues the "humans seeing the gargoyles as beasts" thread that I'd noticed all the more in "Awakening" and "The Thrill of the Hunt", but also put me in mind of the Hunters - no wonder she uses that description!
1. Yep.
2. She's got a history...
I also rewatched "The Thrill of the Hunt" and "Temptation" today. Things I noted this time in "The Thrill of the Hunt".
1. Lexington, angered about the Pack's treachery, cries that they're like animals. I thought that appropriate, given the Pack's "animal names".
2. The Pack continue the "referring to the gargoyles as beasts" practice from "Awakening" and even speak of hunting them, such as Wolf's cry "Let the hunt begin!" - the talk about hunting them also made me think of the Hunters (though they wouldn't be introduced until Season Two, of course).
3. When Brooklyn and Broadway arrive at the end to tell Goliath and Lexington how they'd seen a report on the news about Fox and Wolf's arrest, they come gliding in from outside the castle - so apparently they weren't watching television with Hudson when they found out, but somewhere else. (I won't ask where, but this detail struck me for the first time.)
4. Dingo's cry of "Stone me!" upon seeing the photographs of Goliath felt like a particularly appropriate response to a gargoyle.
1. Yep.
2. Common themes running through the series, I think.
3. Or they were watching t.v. earlier.
4. :)
To celebrate the 25th anniversary of "Gargoyles", I watched "Awakening" (all five episodes) on DVD yesterday, and thought I'd share a few things I hadn't noticed before (or hadn't noticed enough) that struck my fancy.
1. When Goliath sends the trio and Bronx to the rookery, Bronx looks ashamed of himself - in a way that reminds me of times when dogs I'd known looked guilty over something.
2. When Xanatos tells Owen "Make the offer now" at the ruins of Castle Wyvern, I suddenly wondered whom he bought Castle Wyvern from. I won't ask here - it's obviously a "No spoilers" answer - but I was struck by the fact that this was the first time I wondered that.
3. I spotted what looked like a "foliate head" (or "Green Man"-type head) carved over the archway the gargoyles are standing beneath when the Commandos showed up in the courtyard, and a couple of winged figures on one of the tapestries. (I'll have to check for other unusual and remarkable features of the castle in later episodes, as well.)
4. Many of the human characters repeatedly call the gargoyles "beasts", both in the medieval scenes and the modern (Princess Katharine's protest at allowing beasts in the dining hall, Mary calling the gargoyles beasts, Bruno asking "Where's the beast?" while pursuing Goliath and Elisa).
5. Goliath asks Elisa, when they first meet, "What were you doing in my castle?" Despite Xanatos having bought it, he clearly thinks of it as still his - as if laying pipe for the arc about the gargoyles having to leave the castle and Goliath resisting it.
1. The dogs I've had get that shamed look based on my reprimanding tone more than based on what they've done. As opposed to the cats I've had (and have), who at best stare at me as if to ask, "Are you talking to me?"
2. An interesting question.
3. Art Direction was pretty awesome on the show.
4. All very intentional.
5. We tried to keep each character's POV clear.
Something I recently saw at the Phoenix Public Library reminded me of the fears you'd mentioned that "Gargoyles" would be perceived as a "Batman: TAS" imitation. I spotted a few copies (four in all - someone on the library staff must have had fond memories of the series) of the "Gargoyles Season Two Volume Two" DVD there, and noted that the blurb on the back called the gargoyles "Gotham's guardians". Well, Gotham *is* an old nickname for New York (going back to Washington Irving), and there's the alliterative appeal, but it still makes it look as if somebody confused the gargs with a different nocturnal crime-fighter.
Eh. Maybe. Or maybe, as you said, people were looking for something alliterative.
I also recently read the "Oral History of Gargoyles" online, and enjoyed it. My favorite part was when you mentioned how "Gargoyles" was initially inspired by "Adventures of the Gummi Bears", only instead of "cute, cuddly multi-colored bears" it would have "cute, cuddly multi-colored gargoyles". I know you were talking about the original comedy development take on the gargoyles, but I laughed aloud at the "cute, cuddly" part - they're definitely not the adjectives I'd use for describing Goliath. "Majestic", yes, "awe-inspiring", yes, but not "cute" or "cuddly".
Goliath wasn't in the comedy development so... cute and cuddly wasn't a job requirement for him.
I thought you might like to know that I recently found a small book on gargoyles at the library (part of a series of books on mythical monsters), which included a few paragraphs on "Gargoyles". It gave a summary of the series (if a bit inaccurate, I regret to say - it made it sound as if the gargoyles' turning to stone during the day was part of the Magus's curse and stopped happening when they awakened in the modern world) - and also mentioned the Gatherings; it even included Station 8's comment room in the "Internet sites" section in the "Further Reading" at the back.
It also included much information about architectural gargoyles, including the mention that "true gargoyles" (that is, waterspouts designed to look like gargoyles) keep rainwater off the buildings they're mounted on, and even the non-waterspout gargoyles serve a similar function (the rain bouncing off them). So even real-world architectural gargoyles protect - if in a different way than the ones in the series.
The book was written by a Hayley Mitchell Haugen, and was published in 2007.
Very cool. Thanks.
Hello! You most definately get this alot but i am a huge fan, and this question is of a personal nature, although not too personal i think.
You see there is someone close to me who keeps trying to "shame" me because i like to watch cartoons, such as Young Justice/Ducktales/Star vs the forces of evil
Just to name a few. As well as animated movies, this person believes that animation is solely for little kids, and i shouldnt be watching any of them just because im a young adult.
I have tried to get this person to watch some, you know give it a chance and all that, i tried getting him to watch the Gargoyles dvd i bought! but he is hellbent on not doing so. So my question is, how do i explain to this person that not every animated show and movie isnt just for kids?
I know getting him to do a complete 180 on this subject is just wishful thinking lol but i'm mostly asking just to maybe tell him a more indepth response, especially if it comes from someone who works in the industry.
I'm not sure how to convince your "someone." But if you're a young adult, I think it's fair to say, "I disagree with you strongly. Animation is a medium. It is not by definition for kids or adults. It all depends on the content. And even if some of the stuff I watch IS for kids, how does that affect you in any way? Please respect that I know what I like and watch what I like."
Or something like that.
hello mr Greg Weisman im a really big fan of Gargoyles and i was just wondering did you make Gargoyles for kids ? or did you make it for a older aduience and just had to make sure it was appealing to kids ?
We made it for everyone. Our primary target audience was (by decree of TPTB) boys, ages 6-11. But we made it for everyone. All genders, all ages, etc.
did you know that your show is awesome?
I kinda feel like it's awesome. It is to me, at least. It's the kinda show I would like to watch. But I'm happy to have you and others confirm that. Very happy.
Um... which show are we talking about?
Hi Greg,
Thank you for your work and Gargoyles, it gave a mature 13-year old kid a great show to watch and escape with when his world around him was falling apart.
I wanted to ask you about Goliath and his character ARC. he's such a complex character who spends so much time in grief and, carrying burdens from his past balancing good and evil, broken hearts and forbidden romances, an evolution of "Clan" and family.
Season three opened all of these new possibilities with new clans popping up all over the world after Avalon, and so my Question is, What would it take for Goliath to get his happy ending? Was there ever a plan to really wrap up Gargoyles, because the universe really is so deep and expansive everyone could have gotten 10 episodes plus about their own struggles and triumphs.
I even got to read Brooklyn's Comic Arc from "Clan Building" by Greg Weisman, and had even more love for what could have been! Thank you for answering if you get the chance!
I think you're referring to Season Two having "opened all of these new possibilities with new clans popping up all over the world".
There is no plan to wrap Gargoyles forever. I don't do final endings. But that doesn't mean I don't have an end to Goliath's story in mind. But revealing whether it's a happy ending or not, would a spoiler.
Glad you liked the show and the companion comic!
Dear Greg,
You are really amazing!! I love how you have all made this! Sorry for my bad English, because I come from the Netherlands and english is not my mother launguage. Sorry.
I have a lot of questions. My first question is: How was your first day working here?
Thank you for your time!!
Your sincerly,
Laura
Working... where?
I'm sorry. I know English isn't your first language - though you're doing better than I would do at ANY other language, but I don't know which series you're referring to. Or whether you're talking about ASK GREG.
Did you ever think the show would be the inspiration for someones actual deed poll name change?
I don't know which series you're referring to. And I don't know what "actual deed poll name change" refers to.
I haven't posted in years, (too far behind in reading), but I just had to post my daughter's reaction to Future Tense.
My daughters, 9 and 6, and I have been watching Gargoyles from the beginning. Most evenings they greet me when get home from work with, "Do we have time for an episode?!?". They are not just hooked, they are obsessed. Miriam, my little one, is seriously considering being Elisa for Purim.
(I told her from the start I wasn't making a gargoyle costume. I learned my lesson from our watching of Avatar two years ago when I somehow found myself having agreed to make them water and air bending costumes because they are no longer cheaply available to buy. Hours and hours later they came out pretty dang good, especially considering I don't actually know how to sew. Their friend went as a earth bender...he wore a green t-shirt with the earth bending symbol silk screened on it - cheaply available on the internet :| .)
We watched Future Tense a few evenings ago. Miriam spent the whole episode tense and near tears asking, "they're going to use the Phoenix Gate, right? They have to use the Phoenix Gate right?" I had to sit with my arm around her. When we got to the end she smiled a big smile and told me it was a really good episode but too scary to watch again. She repeated her assessment a few days later to a friend, (the earth bender). The girls had him watch the first episode of Awakenings yesterday.
As for the big one, she assured me she wasn't scared the whole time.
Thank you for the shared experience with my girls!
I haven't posted in about a year, either.
I love to hear about fans watching the show with their kids. And I'm so gratified that the kids appreciate it and are becoming a new generation of Gargoyles fans. And Future Tense IS scary!!
Not a question. Just letting you know, my six year old daughter loves Gargoyles and was ranting that the bad guys were being mean to the Gargoyles. She'd make a great advocate for them. And she loves what you guys did with the comics. I had to change some of the words that my daughter does not need to learn yet. But that's okay. I hope someday you will be able to keep up the good work.
Thank you so much. That really makes my day!
You know, when we first focus tested GARGOYLES, the moderator asked the kids, "Did you like Goliath?" The kids all said yes. Then: "Did you like Demona?" The kids said no. The focus testing folks then advised us to take Demona out of the show. We had to explain to them that the kids didn't like Demona because she was THE VILLAIN! (Duh.)
Congrats on Young Justice being continued. Always great if fans fighting for the favorite shows succeed.
I really liked Rain of the Ghosts and Spirits of Ash and Foam. Will you write Masque of Bones now things are going well again? The book series is as good as Gargoyles was both in quality, imagination and depth of characters and story arc... books so brillant should be continued. PLEASE!
Thank you.
I still plan to get back to Masque of Bones and the Rain series someday, but unfortunately I just can't afford to do it now. I need to make a living, and with no one interested in publishing and paying me to write the book, I need to focus on other (paid) work instead. Sometimes real life is uncooperative.
Well, this is more of a thank you for Young Justice, I am SUPER stoked it's coming back, it is a really amazing program and helped me through some tough times when I was a teen, and I remember thinking, "things might be bad, but at least I don't have to save the world as well". And now, I'm enlisting into the US Army as a combat engineer and am thrilled to be starting a new chapter in my life. The excitement of Young Justice will definitely motivate me through Basic. And thanks again for this show.
Wow. Thank YOU for your service! Glad we could be part of your life!
Hey Greg the topics on my questions are about popularity. The other day I was thinking abiut gargoyles, and W.I.T.C.H and I always wondered why it didn't get a far better mainstream appeal.
This was odd for me as gargoyles being your baby, it does have brilliant writting and well developed characters.
I mean sure it does have a relative big following , theres a fan hosting this very site. But on the whole of dinsey propierties Gargoyles is a bit on the obscure side of things. I apologize if that comes as an insult. By the standards of a 90's disney cartoon your show is reasnably well rememebered, sure.
But had the fanbase being larger, the comic would've lasted longer I think.
I rather consider this a paradox. A brilliant show with great writting doesn't gett that much attention. Consider for a second how ducktales got a revival, and gargoyles is still waiting despite our best wishes as fans.
I think I found the reason.
Gargoyles lacks escapism.
I'm not saying that's a bad thing. You love your show and just how things are. Nothing wrong with that. I don't want you to change what you love.
Gargoyles are supposed to be feared and disliked as the whole point of them is a statment against prejudice. That's the entire point.
But it does affect their popuilarity.
Say people might want to be like Nightwing or spiderman as teens with incredible lifes. But I think few people would want to be a gargoyle hiding from the world.
People admire Goliath but I don't think anyone (mainly the kids of the audience) would like to be him nor Hudson or Lexington.
X-men has also the prejudiced characters. But there's a line of kids that would love to be like Wolverine or even Mystique.
I think it's safe to say that nobody would like to be in Puck's shoes.
Xanatos, Fox and oberon were probably the closes to escapist characters given their confort. But I think that's a stretch give the gargoyles are the focus.
So my question is what do you think?
I simply disagree. There's plenty of escapism in Gargoyles. More, I'd argue, than in X-Men. Why would someone want to be Wolverine and not, say, Brooklyn? (I mean from an escapist, point of view.) Is it because Wolverine is a badass? Well, so is Goliath.
Young Justice Season One Review
I didn't have to work Labor Day, so I spent it binging the second half of season one. I'm of two minds on the season as a whole. Thematically, it was about team-building, specifically through trust and revealing secrets. M'gann was hiding her grotesque (by Earth standards) real body is the best example I can remember, but there were others. In the last couple episodes they spent a lot of time baring their souls to one another, and they became a stronger team as a result. There were little character traits early on that got expanded over time. M'gann's catchphrase was annoying until we learned where it came from (a sitcom by those hacks Brandon Weisman and Greg Vietti). Red Arrow was obnoxious and I couldn't stand him, but then we find out it wasn't his real personality but conditioning from The Light. It ends on New Year's Eve, a great time for reflection.
On a plot level, though, I'm not as enthusiastic. The individual episodes generally had pretty good plots (the Halloween ghost story was one of my favorites), but the season long arc seemed kind of weak. Mainly, it's that there was a very long build-up to a masterstroke that was resolved very quickly. In the last episode, Vandal Savage and Thom Adcox (I don't remember that character's name) takes control of the entire Justice League. HOLY CRAP HOW ARE THEY EVER GOING TO- the Young Justice team frees them all in about ten minutes. It struck me as an anticlimax. Then Savage just left and talked about "phase two" of the plan. You've often referred to "Big Bads," a reference to Joss Whedon's standard plot structure, but in a typical season of Buffy the Big Bad would be utterly defeated at the end of the season. Maybe The Light are more like Wolfram and Hart from Angel. Well, it's not a big complaint from me. I enjoyed the season by and large, I just felt that they foiled The Light's plan too easily. On the plus side, I love Savage's monologue about survival of the fittest. He also referenced being thousands of years old but didn't explain further. I imagine if I knew DC comics I would know a lot about him, but instead I'm willing to enjoy the ride.
I already have season two, so I'll start watching it soon. Since it's called "Invasion" and Savage ominously referred to "phase two," I'm guessing it involves some sort of alien infiltration and Savage is worried that the Justice League has made humanity too soft to resist. I could be totally wrong, of course, but I'm eager to see where it goes.
Rating: 3.5/4
Feel a bit damned by faint praise. But I respect your opinion... though I don't really agree with it. Glad it largely worked for you.
I know this isn't a forum, but I would like to respond to another poster who asked if Demona was ticklish by saying:
Would you really want to find out?:)
I'm not touching this one (or her).
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