A TOUCH OF CANMORE IN THE NIGHT...

For those of you who missed the controversy over the following set of questions... You're lucky.

These questions waited a long time in the queue, but were deleted...

What follows is a bit difficult to read, so here's a primer.

<Lynati lists topics -- or perhaps they are old questions -- inside these carrots.>

[She then quotes ASK GREG inside brackets.]

Then she asks new numbered and lettered questions inside parens, e.g. 1a).

MY NEW RESPONSES FOLLOW IN ALL-CAPS.

From Lynati:

I'm in a Canmore mood this evening. Err, morning.

<Of Fiona's relationship to Robyn and her siblings, posted at two different times>

[Fiona is the twin sister of Jason, Robyn and Jon's grandfather. That is, she's their great aunt.]

DID YOU CUT AND PASTE THIS QUOTATION OR RETYPE IT YOURSELF? DID I REALLY MAKE THAT GLARING AN ERROR, SUBSTITUTING JASON FOR JACKSON.

[But I'm pretty sure that Jackson is Fiona's twin brother. That Jackson was the father of Aron who was the father of Charles
who was the father of Jason, Robyn & Jon. And I know Fiona's great-grandfather was Angus.]

This second list would make her their great-great-aunt. When you have a chance, will you look it up in your Canmore-bloodline list and clarify for us:

(1a)Is she Jackson's twin brother, or Aron's?

THE TWINS, JACKSON AND FIONA CANMORE WERE BORN IN 1888.

(1b)How many "great"'s properly belong in front of her name in relation to Robyn?

IN 1908, JACKSON'S SON ARON CANMORE WAS BORN. FIONA WAS HIS AUNT.

IN 1936, ARON'S SON CHARLES CANMORE WAS BORN. FIONA WAS HIS GREAT AUNT.

IN 1964, CHARLES' SON JASON CANMORE WAS BORN. FIONA WAS HIS GREAT-GREAT AUNT.

IN 1966, CHARLES' DAUGHTER ROBYN CANMORE WAS BORN. FIONA WAS HIS GREAT-GREAT AUNT.

IN 1972, CHARLES' SON JON CANMORE WAS BORN. FIONA WAS HIS GREAT-GREAT AUNT.

<At the time of 'Hunter's moon' were Jason, Jon and Robyn Canmore the only descendents of Canmore? Do they have any other family out there that they are unaware of?>

[There are probably a lot of Canmore descendants. They probably know some and don't know others, just like anyone. But they were the three who had carried on the tradition of the Hunter.]

(2a)Were Robyn and her siblings chosen to continue the Hunter tradition, or did they get a choice?

THEY WERE CHOSEN. AND THEY HAD A CHOICE IN THEORY, BUT GAUGE THAT RELATIVE TO WHAT YOU SAW IN "HUNTER'S MOON".

(2b)As they were trained by the "Canmore clan", does that mean that a large part of the family knows about "the Demon" and
the pledge to hunt her down, or is it kept a secret from anyone not pledged on the Hunter path?

IT DEPENDS ON HOW YOU DEFINE "CANMORE CLAN". IF YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT ANY AND ALL OF THE DESCENDANTS OF DUNCAN & CANMORE -- THAN NO, I DON'T THINK MOST STILL KNOW ABOUT DEMONA. BUT IF YOU'RE REFERRING TO THE BRANCH OF THE CLAN THAT RECREATED THE HUNTER TRADITION, THAN YES, MOST KNOW.

(2c)Were any of Robyn's cousins (and second cousins, etc.) offered the choice to become Hunters, and if not, did they receive similar training anyway?

I TEND TO THINK THAT THE MANTLE OF THE HUNTER FALLS ALONG A DIRECT LINE OF DESCENT AS OFTEN AS POSSIBLE.

(2d)Was Fiona Robyn, Jason, and Jon's primary teacher and trainer?

NO. BUT SHE PARTICIPATED.

[But I've charted so many Canmores that I get confused sometimes, and I don't have that chart with me. I can't remember for
sure. Ask me again later. ]

[She [Demona] was hunted (a) because she was the only one left (as far as they knew) and (b) because of a little mishap with
Canmore and one of his sons that I haven't told you about yet.]

(3a)Will you tell us about all of the Canmore's you have charted at 2002 (or whichever con is "next" by the time this post gets
through), including the above-mentioned "incident" that you have not previously told us about?

NOPE.

(3b)If not, will you tell us about most of them?

NAH.

Hmm...maybe you should just sell copies of the Canmore family list at the Gathering.

IT'S A THOUGHT.

<So what happened in Paris, 1920 that was so significant to the Atlantis and Gargoyles universes? >

[Come to G2002 and find out.]

<origination of the word "Gargoyle".>

[The etimology of the word gargoyle goes back a long way. It evolved at least in part from an Atlantean word. That's all I want
to say at this time. But hold tight. More will be revealed at the Gathering 2002 in Virginia Beach.]

<Who created the Praying Gargoyle? >
[If you come to G2002, you'll find out.]

<How powerful is its magic?>
[Potentially, very powerful.]

(4a)So, was the Praying Gargoyle created on Atlantis?

IT WAS CREATED BY ATLANTEANS -- BUT I'M NOT SURE IF IT WAS LITERALLY CREATED IN ATLANTIS.

(4b)Did the first gargoyles develop on Atlantis?

NO. GARGOYLES PREDATE ATLANTIS. AS DO HUMANS.

(4c) What did you have for lunch today?

NOTHING. TOO BUSY ANSWERING QUESTIONS.

(4d)In 1920, were Fiona Canmore and Demona fighting over the possession of the Praying gargoyle?

NOT REALLY, THOUGH IT PLAYED A ROLE IN THEIR CONFLICT.

(4e)If yes, and the Praying Gargoyle was hidden this year, was there any particular reason that Demona had to wait 60
years to reclaim it, or did she just figure it was too good a hiding place to leave the statue in until she needed it?

THE PRAYING GARGOYLE WAS DESTROYED IN 1920. IT TOOK 60 YEARS TO REGENERATE.

And, while I'm here...

(5a)...Does Demona really "know every remaining gargoyle" as she claims in "the reckoning", or was this just another one of her "I am right about everything (and therefore there can be no more gargoyles than I know of)" delusions?

IT SEEMS CLEAR TO ME THAT SHE DOESN'T KNOW EVERY REMAINING GARGOYLE, AS SHE CLEARLY DOESN'T KNOW ABOUT AVALON.

(5b)Which clans is she actually aware of at the time she makes that proclamation?

I'M NOT GOING TO TIE MY HANDS BY LISTING THEM AT THIS TIME.

(5c)As Angela learned about Demona's immortality in "Sanctuary", why was she crying after Demona's "death" in the reckoning?

IT'S ONE THING TO KNOW SOMETHING INTELLECTUALLY, IT'S ANOTHER TO TRULY ABSORB IT. ALSO, AS I'VE STATED MANY, MANY TIMES BEFORE, THE MANHATTAN CLAN KNOWS THE BASIC RULES REGARDING DEMONA AND MACBETH, BUT THEY ARE NOT AS SURE AS I AM THAT DEMONA CAN NEVER BE KILLED EXCEPT UNDER CERTAIN CIRCUMSTANCES. THIS IS ALL NEW TO THEM.

(5d)Did Angela and Goliath honestly believe that Demona was permanently killed by the roller coster collapse/fire, even
knowing that Demona is only able to truly die at Macbeth's hands?

THEY JUST WEREN'T 100% SURE.

(5e) Was Angela not aware of that stipulation?

SEE ABOVE.

(5f)Since Goliath knew, did he deliberately keep the knowledge that Demona would survive from Angela?

SEE ABOVE.

(5g)Have I forgotten something that makes a flaw in my reasoning here?

ONLY THAT YOU ARE THINKING IN ABSOLUTES. MOST PEOPLE (AND GARGOYLES) GO THROUGH LIFE WITH SOME DOUBTS, INSECURITIES AND UNCERTAINTIES. EVEN IF THEY ARE TOLD SOMETHING, THERE'S ALWAYS ROOM TO QUESTION IT.

Yes, I plan to attend the Gathering in 2002.

The last question is, will you have read this post by then?

OBVIOUSLY, NOT. BUT AT LEAST I GOT TO IT BEFORE G2004.

Chapter XLII: "Sanctuary"

Time to ramble...

This episode was directed by Dennis Woodyard, written and story edited by Cary Bates.

The one word title, as usual, was one of mine. I thought initially that we'd be even more focused on the Cathedral. That we might play a Quasimodo character. Heck, if Disney's "Hunchback" movie was going to have living gargoyles bouncing around, then I could have a Quasimodo swinging from the bell-ropes.

But the story, thank goodness, rightly evolved into a family drama with Goliath, Elisa, Angela, Demona, Macbeth and Thailog (and Bronx) providing us with one very ODD family. Quasimodo went away in favor of Thailog.

And we had to work a bit to make sure the thematic idea of the heart as a Sanctuary worked its way into the picture. Thank God for that French minister, eh?

During the "Previously..." recap the following exchange was heard between my eight year old daughter Erin and my five year old son Ben, after Angela learns (in that scene from "Monsters") that Goliath is her biological father:

Benny: He IS her father. He laid the egg.
Erin: Girls lay eggs.
Benny: His wife laid the egg.

ROMANCE

Enter, for the third time or the first (or, depending on your point of view, maybe this one doesn't count either), Ms. Dominique Destine. She tells Mac, "We have all the time in the world..."

This for me (and I know for Bond expert Cary) was a very memorable line from "On Her Majesty's Secret Service." And always a good sign that a relationship is going to come to a bad end.

Elisa tips her hand, which she can do cuz no one is awake, about how she really feels about Goliath here. "The most romantic city in the world and Goliath isn't awake to share it with me." (Or something like that, all quotations are approximate.) That's what she'd like to do, I'd wager. Soar over Paris with G. the way they soared over Manhattan in "Awakenings". Now had he been awake, do you think she would have made that request? Or would she in fact be distancing herself from him simply BECAUSE she had that impulse?

After her adventure on the Loch, it's nice to see Margot on a pleasant little stroll through Paris.

THE GARGOYLE WAY

Why is Goliath so resistant to parenting Angela? After all, though they're really more like younger brothers, he does his fair share of parenting the Trio.

He falls back on "The Gargoyle Way", but that's certainly inadequate, as Diane Maza will later point out. Yes, he's only one of her rookery fathers, but he's (a) the only one there and (b) the only one left alive except for the two souls trapped inside the AWOL Coldstone.

Ultimately, I think the answer is that Angela's sudden obssession with her "BIOLOGICAL" parentage makes him nervous because of the obvious extrapolation to what comes next. If she's obssessed with me as Daddy, then what happens when she learns who Mommy is?

And that's the key. He's divorced Demona. His wife who laid the egg. It took centuries and months, but after "Vows" he moved on. Now he sees Demona as a nemesis. A painful one to be sure, but a nemesis none the less. He's afraid of what the knowledge will do to Angela. He's afraid of what Demona will do with Angela, should Angela share that knowledge. And is he perhaps afraid of what -- under Demona's influence -- Angela might become?

THE CATHEDRAL

There's some nice animation in this episode -- but none of it is at Notre Dame. That sequence put us through fits in retakes and editing. Ugghh. It's still painful to look at.

But there's some nice stuff going on...

Demona says: "In here my love." to Goliath before she realizes its not Thailog. What did you all think of that line? At this point we had only seen one silhouetted monster from a distance. And since you knew Demona was in town, we intentionally tried to lead you to belive that she was the Monster at Notre Dame. Were you expecting Thailog? Or did you think that Demona was addressing G as 'my love'?

Goliath's arrival is a shock to her, so what did you think then?

Then Thailog's arrival is supposed to be a bigger shock to you guys. Was it?

I love hearing Thailog say: "My angel of the night."

Demona has a good line too: "Jealous and paranoid."

Later, we set up Nightstone Unlimited and their two "human" identities, Alexander Thailog and Dominique Destine.

At this point in production, we knew that Fox was going to have a baby but we had not named it yet. I couldn't think of a better first name for Thailog and later I couldn't think of a better first name for Alexander Xanatos. At first this bugged me. But I began to realize it made perfect sense. Xanatos had programmed his "first" son well. If X would pick Alexander, why wouldn't T have picked it as well. And there's something so symmetrical about both his kids being named Alexander.

TOURISTS

Elisa sits at a french cafe talking out loud to herself. Ugh. Very awkward. Obviously, we couldn't come up with a solution we liked better. I'm sure it occured to me to do it in voice over, but just chucking a V.O. sequence in the middle of an ep is very awkward too. Suddenly, the movie is POV Elisa, and we weren't doing that here. (Cf. "Revelations" and Matt's VO narration.)

I do like her last line though, coming as it did from a long time Superman scripter, Cary Bates: "This is a job... for the Gargoyles!"

THE WEDDING NIGHT

We had Macbeth use the Lennox Macbeth name instead of Lennox Macduff because we thought it would be too confusing to give him an entirely different name to any new viewers. And it makes sense that he has multiple aliases. But it still bugs me and I think in hindsight, I wish we had just been consistent.

Demona kicks Macbeth into unconsciousness, and Erin asks: "Why didn't she get hurt?"

And that's a very fair question. As usual with D&M's Corsican Brother connection, we tried very hard to be faithful to it, but it was very hard. And we wound up being a bit inconsistent. The best I can suggest is that when Demona knows she's going to hurt M and it isn't just on impulse, she can more or less steel herself against the magical feedback. It's still painful. But she doesn't show it as much.

The Gargoyles wake up and Elisa says: "Look alive, guys!" Well, they do now, don't they?

I love how Thailog slips Mac the gun and then later yells at Demona, "Didn't you search him?!" He's an evil genius that one. And passive-aggressive too.

Thailog's plan is brilliant, I think. So elegant. So simple. And if not for Elisa, so effective.

Mac's suicidal tendencies resurface. Demona's legendary temper gets the better of her common sense.

Thailog really comes into his own in this ep. Sure, Xanatos said he may have created a monster, but now Thailog has outsmarted X, D and M. Who the hell is left to outsmart?

And he has some great lines too:

"You and what clan?"

"Teamwork is so overrated."

"Aren't you spunky?'" (Another Lou Grant reference of course.)

To be fair, he couldn't immediately know that Angela was blood kin, but still doesn't his reaction to her give you the creeps? When X says Angela is lovely in "Cloud Fathers" I don't think anyone thought he was being salacious. But T? Yeah, baby.

Of course, Goliath finally gets the picture after this one. Up to this point, he was thinking Demona's the lost cause but maybe Thailog is salvagable. Now he knows better. At least about T anyway.

BATTLE

There's a lot of water in that water tower. It looks cool though. The animation here makes up for the Cathedral stuff.

I love Goliath's two-handed punch.

I love Demona's punch-drunken sway, as she makes her move to, as Mac says, "put us out of our misery..."

But I've always wondered why the background painters put multiple pictures of Elisa on the wall of Macbeth's chateau. Odd, that.

When I was young, I used to love MASH, particularly back in the Wayne Rogers days. (And, yes, Wayne is a friend of my dad's now. But they didn't know each other back then so I was unbiased.) But one thing that used to drive me nuts was the repetition of the following exchange:

<LOTS OF SHELLING IS ROCKING THE HOSPITAL. SUDDENLY, IT STOPS.>

Hawkeye: Do you hear that?
Someone else: Hear what?
Hawkeye: Silence! The shelling's stopped!

This was fine the first time they used it. By the twentieth time it got VERY old.

But we do a version of it here after Elisa shoots Demona ending the battle.

Why? When it used to drive me nuts? It's amazing what I'll pay tribute too.

KEITH meet MR. DAVID

I love playing Thailog against Goliath, because I love those Thailog/Goliath exchanges where Keith plays both roles. That's one of the main reasons we created Thailog. To enjoy listening to Keith go to town.

1st Epilogue:

Goliath: "She has done you a favor, Macbeth."

That line should be a bit of a shock when G first says it. But it makes a lot of sense after he explains. And I love the look that Goliath and Elisa share. They aren't even pretending they don't share those feelings. They just won't act on them.

And how about Goliath actually telling a joke: "Just make sure you get a good look at her at night." Word.

2nd Epilogue:

One of the things I like about our series is we didn't have to end each episode the same way.

This one ends rather darkly. Goliath won't acknowledge the obvious. He just broods. Angela turns to Elisa: "Elisa, I have to know." And Elisa confirms that Demona is Angela's mother, because it's ridiculous to either lie or to not confirm the obvious that Angela has already figured out. But she knows G didn't want A to know that. So everyone is left unhappy as we sail into the fog.

And Erin ends the episode saying: "I think Elisa should be her mother."

(Me, I've always seen them sharing a more sisterly relationship. But I thought Erin's idea was sweet, and certainly came out of the sexual tension between E&G.)

Anyway, that's my ramble. Where's yours?