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It occurs to me that I repeated a question you had already answered. I asked why some villains work with the Light even though the Light may not be working towards their best interests. Your original response was something like: not everyone understands what the Light's motives are. Sorry for the repeated question.
I want to get the Audio Play of "Rain of the Ghosts"...but it's impossible to get if you don't own a credit card or are from outside of the US...is there a chance to sell it on Amazon? (it would solve your problem with low sale rates if it were just easier to buy it)
It's been on Amazon for years now and is still available. Hope you had a chance to get it. Or can get it now.
What's the smartest observation that you've ever seen a fan make about one of your shows?
Geez, there have been so many... and yet of course nothing comes to mind at the moment. That's not a comment on the fans, who are fantastic, but on my crap memory.
My guess is it was something at one of the GARGOYLES BIOLOGY & CUSTOMS panels at the old GATHERING OF THE GARGOYLES conventions. Those rocked! Check out some of the Gathering diaries in the archives and you might find some cool stuff recorded.
Out of curiosity: what do you think the members of the original team from Young Justice majored in, assuming they went to college. Like, what does Dick and/or Wally or Roy plan on majoring in/studying?
Wally majored in Physics.
Roy/Will didn't go to college.
Dick majored in, uh... philosophy, maybe? Haven't thought about it too much.
I want to start off by saying Im a big fan of your work and I cant wait for Season 3 of YJ!
One thing I've noticed in regards to Young Justice is that there aren't any new characters (characters that haven't already appeared in the comics). I can only think of two other DC tv shows off the top of my head that have introduced a new character. Batman Animated Series (If I remember correctly, Harley was introduced for that tv show) and The Batman (Because I know Cash and Krank weren't in the comics) So I know it isn't completely out of the ordinary for a tv show to introduce a new character. But as far as I know, Young Justice hasn't released a new character.
So here's my question. Are you guys just not allowed to introduce new characters, you guys decided to stay within the limits of the already set DC Universe, or both.
If I'm wrong and there has been a new character you guys introduced then which one (s) are they?
We've had a few new characters (e.g. Tommy Terror, Tuppence Terror, Olympia Savage, Coral, Beluga, and, of course, Kaldur'ahm). But generally we work very hard NOT to introduce new characters. That's not a rule from on high or anything. It's just that the DC Universe is so vast after 80+ years, that it seems ridiculous not to utilize it whenever possible.
Hi Mr. W, I've been a big fan of Young Justice since I was 12 (I'm currently 16) I really love your work on Young Justice and I was wondering if all the original voice actors/actresses will be back for season 3. If that question was a spoiler than my backup question is, what was your most memorable moment from working on Young Justice.
Thank you for reading x Ruman
We always bring back previously cast voices if they are at all available to us. We only recast if we have no choice.
How do gargoyles mate ritualistically? I am writing a story and I want to use it in my fanfiction on how they mate. Is it like humans or is there a whole ceremony?
I wouldn't call it a formal ceremony. But flight is involved.
How powerful is Superboy relative to the Justice League? For example, is his strength greater than Aquaman or Martian Manhunter's and does he match up to Captain Marvel?
He's stronger than Aquaman and Martian Manhunter (though the latter could augment his strength with telekinesis.
As for Captain Marvel, it depends which season you're talking about.
Why would Black Beetle be stronger than Blue Beetle? Are not all scarabs made equally?
No. Warrior Scarabs are more powerful than Scout Scarabs. Black was a Warrior. Blue was a Scout.
Well first, thanks for taking the time to answer these questions and congratulations on YJ Season 3.
1) Is Superboy the physically strongest on the Team at the moment? It feels somewhat ambiguous with the introduction of wonder girl and the ease with which Aqualad knocked him out.
2) Would M'gann have been powerful enough to defeat Despero or Black Beetle with her powers if it hadn't been for her previous trauma?
3) How do inhibitor collars actually work? On enemies like Blockbuster or Mammoth, I get that they disable superstrength, but they would have those as an extension of their size anyway. Do you have any particular idea behind the collars' mechanics?
Thank you for your time.
1. As of the end of Season Two, yes.
2. It's a hypothetical. There's no way to know now.
3. Vague, vague ideas about neural centers or somesuch pseudo-science nonsense.
Was the original Jim Harper in the All-Star Squadron? If not, and the clone Guardian was never in the Justice League, why was his suit in the Museum of Justice in Cornered?
P.S. Thank you for answering my previous question, from what I gather through reading, your Gargoyles Time Travel worked similarly to the theory in Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban, predestination...Bart's story never seems to address that in the comics. xD Looking forward to S3 in Earth-16b!
He was a hero, and he donated his suit. They accepted the donation.
I thought you might be amused to learn that not long ago, the Titan Comics "Doctor Who" comics did a story where the Doctor (the Christopher Eccleston version) and his friends were tracking a living gargoyle (actually, a human who was turned permanently into a gargoyle - long story) through the woods at night, and encountered a young woman also searching for the gargoyle, who was wearing a red jacket, black t-shirt, and blue jeans. The jacket had a different design than Elisa's, but the overall look of her outfit was close enough to make me wonder if it was intended as a "Gargoyles" tribute. (Then again, Ellen Yin's similar outfit in "The Batman" turned out to be - apparently - a coincidence.) I hope it was intentional - meaning that someone working on that comic still remembered "Gargoyles" after all these years.
That'd be nice. Also, the ninth doctor is my favorite.
Hi Greg, huge fan of young justice and can't wait for season 3. I was just wondering with static being in the show, how that came to be. Was there any issue getting him in the show since he is a milestone media character, and how were you able to convince them to let you use him? In theory can you use any milestone character you want? Can you use the wildstorm and vertigo characters in the show if you want to or is there certain restrictions?
Things change over time. And I never know why.
We wanted to use Rocket and Icon in Season One. At the time, it wasn't any kind of problem, that I can recall.
In Season Two, we wanted to add Static, which was also not a problem.
In Season Three, we wanted to add Hardware and Holocaust and Amistad, and suddenly there was a problem with us using any Milestone characters, at all, including those we'd already been using for years.
And then suddenly there wasn't a problem. I never quite understood what had changed or what had changed back. I'm just glad we still have access to the Milestone characters, cuz I love 'em.
We used one Wildstorm character in S1, but I'll admit I'm not as familiar with those characters and so we haven't really tried to use any more of them.
Vertigo... I guess it would depend if they were creator owned or company owned.
When superboy went to college,what did he major in?
Hm. I'm thinking... Mechanical Engineering. But I reserve the right to change my mind.
Have you seen the new Ducktales reboot? If so what are your thoughts on it?
I have not. I hear good things.
Just wanted to let people know that at the end of this month, we're going to shut down the ASK GREG a question function for the time being. I don't have anything new coming out any time soon, and I believe everyone has had time to respond to (or question) my latest output. And in any case you've got a little more than a couple weeks yet to get your burning questions in.
I've been very busy working on Season Four of YOUNG JUSTICE, and I simply haven't had times to answer questions at the rate any of us would like. And the back-log has just gotten ridiculous. So we'll cut off questions for the time being, and I'll try to cut down on some of that back-log in time for the release of YJ S4.
I'm not on Twitter that much these days either... and I've even cut down on convention appearances, but I still jump on Twitter when I'm at loose ends, so you can potentially find me @Greg_Weisman.
Why did Jaime Reyes keep quiet when the scarab was about to kill impulse? he stayed all the time trying to do anything but when he is about to kill his "best friend"(?) he just shut up- (it could be just something that have no sence but for me this is important) thanks (sorry for the mistaes, i'm portuguese)
Are you talking about when he wasn't in physical control of his own body? Because if so, that should answer your question.
No one else could hear him but Scarab. Or are you asking why he didn't say anything to Scarab?
I'm sorry, I guess I don't quite understand your question.
I checked the archives and I couldn't find this question so,what do you think of new 52 superboy?
I haven't read it/him.
Hi, if possible, I'd like some clarification on a topic from S2Ep5 that I can't find an answer to. When assigning a squad to handle Queen Bee, Nightwing states that she has the ability to control men's minds, thus getting him in trouble with the girls for justifying their squad. However, I was under the impression that such a justification would not be accurate, given Batman's previous statement that her powers work "on some women." I believe this was proven to be the case in the comics as well, though I may be misremembering. If so though, did Nightwing mean to imply that the all-girl squad is also all straight? Or was it that he was generalizing or had forgotten the extent of Queen Bee's powers? Thank you for your time, and I hope you're enjoying work on YJ3, which I very much look forward to.
Perhaps he knew (or believed he knew) that all the women on that mission were straight.
In one of the issues of the tie in comic for young justice,Wally takes Superboy to Forever 16. Is that a Pun? Why did you decide to name it that
I wouldn't call it a pun. It's more of a pastiche on the real-world Forever 21 and Urban Outfitters retail chains. (The full title of the store is "Forever 16/Suburban Outfitters".)
As for why we chose 16... have you seen our show?
1. As of the end of the SLG comics, do either Macbeth or Demona know about what they did during the weeks that they were controlled by the Weird Sisters? Do they know about their actions in High Noon, how they were forced to attack the innocent people (inc Katharine, Mac's only remaining relative, and Demona's children) on Avalon, etc?
If not, what do they think happened to them between their fight in New York and waking up in Paris?
If either does know, how do they feel about the Weird Sisters as a result?
2. Do Macbeth and Demona share the "anguish" mentioned by the Weird Sisters in CoS4 the same way they share physical pain? For example, on their wedding night in Paris, could Demona feel Macbeth's emotional pain as if it were her own?
If not, how does that part of their link work?
3. Is the shared pleasure part of Demona and Macbeth's link physical, emotional, or both?
Thank you. :)
1. Largely, they do not.
1a. It's perplexing.
1b. I doubt either of them are terribly fond of the Weird Sisters in any case.
2. Emotional pain? That would require enough selflessness to acknowledge that anyone else has emotional pain.
2a. You're assuming that anguish isn't physical?
3. Have we established shared pleasure?
Hi, Greg. I read this article today that some criticisms of Young Justice: https://comicsverse.com/young-justice-why-i-wont-watch/. While I didn't agree with most of what the writer said, he did make at least one criticism that I had never stopped to consider. He pointed out that the team's mission didn't make sense because the missions they undertake don't seem to be any less dangerous than the missions the league takes on. So, yeah, fighting space monsters is dangerous, but is being left alone in a foreign country, or fighting a cabal of the world`s greatest super-villains any less dangerous? How do you respond to that?
I haven't read the article and don't intend to, but I respond to your question by saying, "Watch the show." This is all explained in universe. At some point, you either buy into it or you don't.
But having said that, I'll also make the point that we don't get to see most of the League's missions. How do you know how dangerous they are?
I have some questions about Star Wars Rebels.
1. What was it like to work with Star Wars legends like Anthony Daniels, James Earl Jones, Frank Oz, and Billy Dee Williams?
2. Do remember any of the characters that you created the idea for? Which ones were they?
3. Did you read A New Dawn in preparation for either Rebels or the Kanan comic?
4.How did you get the job to work on Rebels? (My dream job is to work on Star Wars someday).
5. Did you work with Jason Fry on the Servants of the Empire book series since one of the books adapts "Breaking Ranks", one of the episodes you wrote.
Thanks for answering all these questions, I really appreciate that you make time like this for fans, it means a lot to me at least. The Force will be with you....Always.
1. Anthony Daniels was great. Spent quite a bit of time with him, when we recorded up at Skywalker Ranch. Even took a long - and somewhat harrowing car ride with him. But unfortunately, I wasn't present when Misters Jones, Oz and Williams recorded their parts (which to me was a minor Geek Tragedy).
2. When I came aboard, the five leads and the Inquisitor were already part of the package, but I believe I helped flesh them out. I gave them all last names, for starters, and created Zeb's curse word: "Karabast!" Nearly every other character that appeared in Season One was a group effort between myself, Dave Filoni, Simon Kinberg, the writing staff and the rest of the Lucasfilm brain trust.
3. Not in preparation. I was asked to read it to give feedback in order to make sure that we were all depicting the characters and their histories consistently across all media.
4. I interviewed for it multiple times at Lucasfilm and Disney. (I assume they read some of my writing beforehand, and I know they had my resume in front of them when we spoke.)
I read a recent answer from you about super-breath and, while I certainly agree that it's kind of "out there" in terms of plausibility, I feel that some of your objections are flawed.
Consider volume, for instance. Yes, his lungs aren't any bigger than a baseline human's, but they're much stronger and more durable than a baseline human's lungs would be. While liquids and solids are practically incompressible, gasses are not (have you ever checked the air pressure in your tires?), and pressurized air is widely used in society (aerosol spray containers, for instance). Given the assumptions, it is consistent with physics for Superman to hold a greater volume of air in his lungs, it would simply have to be at a greater pressure than a human would be able to endure.
On the subject of coldness, the air in his lungs would be under tremendous pressure. Rapidly forcing all of that high-pressure air out into a lower-pressure environment would have a cooling effect, though probably not to extent typically shown.
I apologize if I'm coming off as pedantic. I agree that it isn't very plausible, but it feels like your primary objection is that gasses are incompressible, and they are not. Imagine you have two tanks, one made of titanium, the other tin, and you pump air into both of them at the same steady rate until they burst. Which tank will burst first, and why? Thank you for your time.
So he's capable of super-inhalation in order to pressurize the air in his lungs? That just doesn't work for me. I can't get my head around it.
And, as you said, the air wouldn't be as cold coming out as it's depicted.
The fact that gases can be pressurized is well known to me. But that's not the source of my objection. I don't see any system for this that makes sense, any biological system to actually pressurize the air in his finite lungs, let alone making it cold enough to actually freeze things when he exhales.
Look, I don't think you're being pedantic. Or - rather - no more pedantic than I'm being. I just can't buy into it. It seems like a silly addition to his power-set, like someone once said, "Okay, we've got him shooting heat from his eyes, let's have him shoot cold from his mouth."
Mostly, however, it's just that he's powerful enough. He doesn't need that, too. At least not in YJ.
Do you feel like answering the first two questions now? Or maybe just the second one since it doesn't require research?
At this point, I'd say these are all NO SPOILERS questions.
Response to my latest novel, War of the Spark: Forsaken, has been understandably negative, particularly as a result of how the character of Chandra Nalaar was depicted in the book. My response is a bit late in coming, but here it is:
After reading the materials that preceded my work on Magic: The Gathering, I was particularly intrigued by the burgeoning relationship between Chandra and Nissa. I felt that it should culminate in the War of the Spark books. In lieu of bringing them together, as it was not a relationship that WotC planned to pursue, my goal was to write something that honored Chandra's feelings for Nissa and Nissa's feelings for Chandra, something that would give closure to their relationship in a sad but satisfying and understandable way. I believe that if readers had seen my original ideas for the chapter in question, they might have gotten a better sense of what I was trying to accomplish. They might have liked it better. Or maybe they wouldn't have. In any case, through the mutual creative/editorial process with WotC and Del Rey, we ended up with the final product that was published in Forsaken, which clearly didn't meet anyone's expectations or delivers on my intentions. And for that, I am truly sorry.
English isn't my native language, but i really want ask you some questions.
I know you are color blind and maybe this question is more suitable for Phil Bourassa, but since both are currently working in Young Justice: Outsiders, maybe you should ask him if you can´t answer...
1)Why decided make the Bart's eyes green? In all the comics his eyes are yellow (except in New 52 where were red and that Bart at the end wasn't Bart). His yellow eyes were an important part of his design, even his googles are amber color in order to hiding his eyes color because were so unique what could reveal his secret identity. His eyes were the first thing we saw clearly in Bart´s debut in Flash #92 (and i thought he was a girl because this close up of big eyes and hair locks looked like an image from a romantic comic XD) Change the yellow for the green, is like turning Superman blond.
2) I've noticed the Reach Scientist's dress look like a hijab with a niqab, and according to Young Justice wiki, i'm not the only who think that. So Is this intentional?
2-a) All the Reach women dress like her?
It´s a bit hard to see a woman with a "hijab" being ignored, despised and silent by a man (although she was smarter).
3) Why Traci 13 was redesingned like caucasian to the season 3? She was asian american in the comics and Young Justice had being doing a great work including divertsity in the members of the Team
I love Young Justice and i'm very happy for the season 3. Thank you very much for your great work
For the record, I'm red-green color deficient, not full on color-blind.
1. Maybe because of my color deficiency, I wasn't aware of Bart's eye color. I can't speak for Brandon, Phil or our color specialist James Peters, but it is certainly possible they weren't aware of that detail either.
2. Not that I know of.
2a. Not necessarily. No spoilers.
3. Look again. Thirteen/Traci Thurston is biracial in Young Justice. Her father is Caucasian. Her mother is Asian. I think that's always been true in the comics.
What will the run time of Outsiders be? Will it be longer than Invasion?
I assume you mean per episode.
We no longer have a set time constraint for lenth of episodes, as we did back on our cable days. Of course, we have budgetary constraints, so the episodes are still approximately the same length. But some ran a litttle longer than others, as we can now edit each episode to its ideal length and not to some arbitrary fixed length.
Is Talia al'Ghul on Earth-16 multiracial (Arabic/Chinese on both her parents' sides) like in the comics (at least pre-Flashpoint)?
Talia is biracial or multi-ethnic or something. (I'm not trying to be dismissive, but I'm honestly not sure of the appropriate term these days.)
Ra's is Arabic. Melisande is European.
But where are you getting Chinese? (And, no, Sensei is NOT Ra's father on Earth-16.) There's a SPOILER, I guess.
1. What is the name of Barbara Gordon's mother on Earth-16?
2. Is she still married to Jim Gordon?
1 & 2. No Spoilers.
1: Does Peter Parker ever grab fast food/something from a convenience store/food stand/whatever, while in costume?
2: What are the eyepieces of his suit made of? Are they lenses like in all the pre-MCU movies? Mechanical irises like the MCU? Just cloth?
2. Spectacularum. Or is it Spectacularite? I always mix up those two.
I saw from a recent response that you love Ghost Rider. What do you think about the way the character was handled in the 4th Season of "Marvel's Agents of SHIELD"?
It's not particularly wise for me to answer this kind of question. I'm trying to work in this industry. But, briefly, the version they created fulfilled a need in that show and looked cool. But it didn't have too much to do with what I view as the classic version of the character. Which is just fine.
A thought occurred to me about Captain Marvel.
First, let me say, I'm not trying to get you into trouble. I'm really not. But I was wondering...
When ten-year-old Billy transforms into Captain Marvel does he gain an adult libido?
(I'll understand if you want to steer clear of this question.)
I'm gonna say yes. But its not uncontrollable. In any case, as of Season Three, Billy is 18-years-old, so his libido is already "adult" enough.
Could you/would you be interested in spearheading a push to create new merchandise for the Gargoyles franchise? In the interest of proving it as a still-viable money-making franchise for a possible reboot/proper season 3 but also for us fans that are lacking modern representations of those beloved characters. I myself went well out of my way to aquire an enamel pin (unlicensed I'm sure) only to have ANYTHING featuring Goliath in my possesion.
I think spearheading merchandise is premature. Our best bet right now is that Gargoyles will soon be streaming on Disney+.
If fans (old and new) binge that, we'll be in much better shape on all fronts, including merchandising.
I was wondering can Gargoyles with Feathered wings fly, like Zafiro from the Mayan clan or Staghart of the London clan.
No. Just glide.
Hi Greg, just bought your audio story of Rain Of The Ghosts, fantastic original story, and not to mention love hearing our favorite voice actors in your story, and it was amazing, gonna go find the second book and read it.
I also wanted to ask, Timedancer is one of my most favorite spinoff ideas based onto Gargoyles, and the sheer idea of Brooklyn Time traveling is awesome! I wanted to know, just like you did with Rain Of The ghost Audio story, would you be able to do Timedancer like that? Bring in the old voice actors (Jeff and Thomas ect) and bring in new ones to voice the new characters that would have been in Timedancer?
Thanks for the kind words about Rain.
To answer your question, I'd love to do an AudioPlay of Timedancer, but I don't own Gargoyles or TimeDancer, so that's not an option at this time.
If someone else were to come along and revive the Gargoyle Series, what would your opinion be if they had full Creative Control?
Disappointment, if not outrage.
What were you expecting?
I am a huge fan of Gargoyles. However, there is something that I was always curious about. What did Cu Chulainn shout when he was charging the banshee in the episode The Hound of Ulster. It sounded celtic to me but I don't know for sure. I cant find a script and this I would really like to know what he said.
It is - as I recall - a gaelic expression put in the script by Diane Duane and Peter Morwood (or maybe by Michael Reaves). I'm afraid I can't remember the exact words, let alone their spelling. And my Gargoyle scripts are all in storage. Wish I could be more help.
I would like some clarification.
You announced at Comic-Con that Traci Thirteen would be part of the cast of Outsiders. Yet, you referred to her as Thirteen. Is her code-name on the show Thirteen or Traci Thirteen?
Thirteen. I don't think I ever said her name in the show was going to be Traci Thirteen. I may have said she was based off that character. But I think we've been very consistent about calling her Thirteen, even at conventions.
In the DC Comics storyline, "Brightest Day," Black Manta's real name is David (last name unknown; presumed to be Hyde). Does his "Young Justice" animated counterpart share the same name as well...?
#NoSpoilers here either.
Greg..once you told us(gargoyles fans) Thor, the Norse God of Thunder, and a member of the Third Race is dead.
Does Odin feels sad by this?
Because Thor was his favorite son.
#NoSpoilers - I'm not even going to reveal if Thor was his favorite son in the #Gargoyles Universe.
1.you said Artemis knows Nightwing's secret identity in seasone 2 so why in the episode 'depths' while waiting for Wally, Artemis and Kaldor he pulled the picture from "homefront" that he took of her in Gotham Academy and repeated the same sentence? did they not laugh about it?
2.Why in the episode 'Depths' Nightwing performed on Artemis mouth to mouth? I saw that you answered that he did CPR because her heart stopped but did the mouth to mouth was necessary? he's her boyfriend's best friend and he knew she not really dead so...?
1. They weren't laughing that day. It was a down moment for reflection.
2. He had to make it look good. Like he was trying everything.
I know this isn't a forum, but I would like to respond to another poster who asked if Demona was ticklish by saying:
Would you really want to find out?:)
I'm not touching this one (or her).
This question goes back to the age old question: why does Superman need the Justice League? Or, why does Thor need the Avengers?
Have you ever decided against using a DC character as a team member because he or she was too powerful? If so, can you tell us which heroes you nixed?
Nope. Quite the reverse. We began YJ with a Justice League that include 16 members including two Green Lanterns, two Hawks, Captains Atom and Marvel, Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, Flash, Martian Manhunter, Aquaman, Zatara, Red Tornado, Green Arrow and Black Canary, so that when they arrived on the scene it would truly feel like the gods coming down from Olympus.
And the League only expanded and got more powerful from there, adding Doctor Fate, Icon and others of tremendous power.
Hi Greg, big fan of your work and excited for the new season of Young Justice after quite a break.
Now for the questions:
If you could magically pick another one of the shows you've worked on to bring back, but could only pick one, which would it be?
2. Why this one? Unfinished stories, fond memories of working in it, etc?
3. Realistically, considering factors such as all the politics, the fan base, etc, in your opinion which show would you say would be most likely to come back (even if it's a one in a million chance) and which is the least likely?
1. Gargoyles would be my first choice.
2. All of the above. It's still my baby.
3. Gargoyles is most likely, especially with it appearing soon on the new Disney+ streaming service. Spectacular Spider-Man is the least likely, as the contractual problems between Disney, Marvel and Sony make it nearly impossible.
Would you ever make a scooby-doo show?
If someone asked me too, sure. I love Scooby.
Why doesn't superman sound more like ma and pa kent if he landed in Kansas when he was a baby?
Do they sound different? You've never heard Martha speak, and only heard a couple of lines from Jonathan. I didn't notice any significant difference in dialect, especially when you consider that Clark has spent recent years in Metropolis.
hey mr greg weisman i was just wondering were you aiming a little older and just had to keep it appealing for kids
We talking Young Justice? Gargoyles? Shimmer and Shine? Every series is different in its demographic targeting, sometimes even from season to season. In most cases, we tried to target multiple demographics simultaneously by writing in layers.
In Enter MacBeth, MacBeth refers to Demona as the Gargoyles' queen. But wouldn't she or even someone of her clan from the past have told him a bit about Gargoyles and their clans and that they didn't have kings or queens? Or did she leave him to believe she was their queen?
I think you're taking his statement too literally. He saw her as the leader of the gargoyles, which she was during the key moment of his natural life. He views leaders in terms of kings and queens, so used that language. (Also as a chess metaphor, I seem to recall.) But he wasn't speaking or thinking about her this way literally.
Why does the YJ WIKI look so much better than the Gargoyles WIKI? Don't you have the same people working on it?
I don't have ANY "people working on it." Fans are in charge of both sites. I like both wikis for different reasons. I refer to both often.