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The Phoenix Gate

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Comments for the week ending July 12, 2004

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Macbeth's first meeting with Angela would have been in Paris. He probably didn't know much about Demona's past because she's not the type who tends to share. When he first appeared in New York in "Enter Macbeth," he didn't seem to have a clue that Goliath and Demona were ever an item. He told Goliath "I want your queen," mistakenly assuming that Demona was part of the clan. Macbeth's no dummy, though. If Elisa could look at Angela and figure out within ten seconds whose child she was, surely Macbeth would also be able to put two and two together and come up with four.

10 days left to reserve your hotel room at the Delta Centre-Ville (deadline is July 20 at noon).
10 days left to pre-register for The Gathering 2004 (deadline is July 20).
26 days left until The Gathering 2004 in Montreal, Quebec!

Sunday, July 11, 2004 02:20:50 PM

I was wondering if anyone knew... When did Macbeth find out about Angela? And how much did he know about Demona's life before she met him? (And when did he find out about her and Goliath?)
Dernhelm - [springsprite@email.com]
Okla. City
Sunday, July 11, 2004 10:33:17 AM

PATRICK - If he's making his announcement in French, shouldn't that be "Comte de Comte"? :)

Watched my tape of "Vows" this afternoon. The episode that introduced time travel and the Phoenix Gate into the Gargoyles Universe, not to mention meeting Petros Xanatos, finding out about Xanatos's background, and discovering that the Illuminati isn't just a delusion of Matt's. (The moment that Owen asked Xanatos about the advisability of wearing an Illuminati pin in public during the first viewing, the thing I immediately found myself wondering about was what Matt would have said about that had he only known.)

I liked the visit to 10th century Scotland, including the "Norman ambassador" part. Note that Xanatos and the ambassador shake hands in an odd sort of way, each gripping the upper arm. I've heard that the Freemasons have a special handshake of their own, and wonder if that could be the inspiration for that scene (since the myths and legends about the Freemasons are a major source of Illuminati mythology).

I also sat up and took notice, the first time that I saw this one, when the Archmage was talking about how, once he had both the Grimorum and the Phoenix Gate, he'd need only the Eye of Odin to achieve the "ultimate power" - I didn't suspect what was coming, but took notice of the Eye of Odin reference, so soon after "Eye of the Beholder".

I liked Hudson's role here, assisting the time-travelling Goliath and revealing that he already has his suspicions about the Archmage.

Goliath's confusion about the verb tenses when he's explaining about how he came back to 975 to Hudson reminded me this time around of a scene in Douglas Adams' "Hitchhiker's Guide" series which similarly discusses how one of the worst parts of time travel is the confusion over the verbs - though that might be just coincidence.

Xanatos is, as usual, Xanatos - having the chutzpah to invite Goliath to his own wedding, and as the best man at that (if with good cause), and being quite pleased with setting up the scheme that made him a very wealthy man.

Another great bit: where Demona-1995 is telling Demona-975 about the Phoenix Gate: "Do not share it with-" - she catches herself in the nick of time and then says simply "Do not share it!"

A bittersweet episode, in spite of all the fun that Xanatos is having, with Goliath both giving what advice he can to the Demona of 975, and then discovering in 1995 that Demona hasn't learned from it at all, realizing at last that it's over between them for good.

I really feel sorry for the Justice of the Peace that Xanatos has officiating at his wedding; he finds himself attending a ceremony with two gargoyles present, after which they, the newly-weds, and the groom's father all vanish for a moment in a burst of "phoenix flame" and reappear just a bit afterwards. Poor man!

"City of Stone" is coming up, and this time around, I want to pay especially close attention to which Weird Sister gets which lines, in light of Greg Weisman explaining about how each of the Sisters represents a different facet of their nature (and especially after he brought up how, in "Avalon Part Three", it's significant that it's Luna - the Weird Sister representing Fate - who tells the Magus, in their final battle with him, "There is no future for you here.").

Todd Jensen
St. Louis, MO
Saturday, July 10, 2004 08:32:26 PM

Todd: << Technically speaking, according to Greg Weisman, the building in "The Silver Falcon" isn't the Chrysler Building, but a made-up building that simply happens to have similar architecture. >> The caveat being that there is NO other building in NYC that has those same distintive architectural features, so in reality this explanation is just Greg trying to cover for the fact that someone didn't do their research. :P

Le Count von Count proclaime: Il ya vingt-sept jours au le Gathering en Montreal!

Pour les anglophones dans l'audience:

11 days left to reserve your hotel room at the Delta Centre-Ville (deadline is July 20 at noon).
11 days left to pre-register for The Gathering 2004 (deadline is July 20).
27 days left until The Gathering 2004 in Montreal, Quebec!

Saturday, July 10, 2004 01:35:51 PM

ABBY - Technically speaking, according to Greg Weisman, the building in "The Silver Falcon" isn't the Chrysler Building, but a made-up building that simply happens to have similar architecture. (From the perspective of chronology, it couldn't have been the Chrysler Building anyway; the Chrysler Building was built in 1930, six years after Mace Malone supposedly hid those jewels in the "silver falcon".)

Watched my tape of "Eye of the Beholder" today. I regularly watch it on Halloween, for obvious reasons (although I recall that somebody here once - I forget who - pointed out that it also makes a potentially great Valentine's Day episode on account of the romance elements in it).

The episode accomplishes a number of things. We find out that the Eye of Odin isn't just a jewel but something more than that - which definitely interested me when I first saw this episode (though even then, the revelation of the Eye's true nature on the Avalon World Tour took me completely by surprise - and I'm a Norse mythology buff!). Even more importantly, Xanatos and Fox get more development, especially Xanatos, where he realizes how he feels about Fox. (One of the best touches here about that is where his plan is to have Goliath and his clan take the Eye of Odin away from Fox. Owen correctly points out that the gargoyles would be just as difficult to get the Eye away from as Fox would - but it's clear enough that that's not the real point. The real reason why Xanatos wants them to get the Eye from Fox isn't so that he can eventually get the Eye, but because the Eye is killing Fox and this is the only way to save her life.)

One of my favorite little bits: that rolling soda can in the store that Fox is ransacking, which Elisa finally steadies with one finger.

This was a good episode for "background characters": Mr. Jaffe (the shopkeeper), Officer Morgan, Travis Marshall, Xanatos's commandoes, Brendan and Margot, and Vinnie (who's here talking eagerly about "a costume over a costume") all show up.

The trio get perfect costumes: Lexington as a pilot (reference to "Her Brother's Keeper"), Broadway wearing his detective outfit again (actually, it'd have to be a new one after what happened to the one in "The Silver Falcon"), and Brooklyn as a pirate, fitting his swashbuckler nature. (After seeing Broadway eating his hat, I hope that that costume wasn't a rented one.)

Goliath gets off a rare (but here it works) wisecrack when he says to Xanatos, "I don't suppose you have a Plan D?"

A few other great moments: Goliath and Elisa dancing together at the Halloween party (I'm trying to figure out now if I started suspecting here what was to come for them), and the Xanatos-Goliath exchange: "So now you know my weakness." "Only you would regard love as a weakness." And this is the first time that Goliath and Xanatos work together.

Really a great episode.

Todd Jensen
St. Louis, MO
Friday, July 9, 2004 07:24:17 PM

I thought the world tour was great for Gargoyles because you could watch those episodes out of order and it still worked. Since, for whatever reason, Gargoyles had a tendency to air out of order, it allowed for the casual viewer to catch an episode without having to worry about what episode was on the previous day or week.

Whereas if you tried to watch season 1 out of order, you got screwed out of a great story progression.

On the downside, I think it alienated the more die-hard fans of the series who wanted more development of the trio, Hudson, Xanatos, and the rest of the NYC-based cast. Those who had seen all the episodes, had the whole storyline in their head, and wanted to see it continue in a linear fashion.

A double-edged sword. But I suppose without it, the climax of the E&G relationship (in terms of the timeline within the 2 seasons) in Hunter's Moon would have felt forced, since we wouldn't have had much exposure to, or reason to believe in, their developing relationship.


Gorebash - [`]
Friday, July 9, 2004 02:31:27 PM

My two latest books are now at the printers! Clickie or go to http://www.eskimo.com/~vecna/new_stuff.html for a sneak peek of the gorgeous covers, with art by CrzyDemona and Spike!
Christine - [< book covers!]
Friday, July 9, 2004 01:45:12 PM

World Tour>>When I started watching the show, it was already syndicated and the episodes were aired so out of order it was hard to figure out what was going on at first. A number of the World Tour episodes were aired together, but it never seemed too long because we never saw them all together, and non-Tour episodes would be mixed in with them ("The Gathering" and "Hunter's Moon" came before "Bushido" or "Future Tense," for example. It was hard at first to get an appreciation of the continuity the writers were striving for).

"The Silver Falcon">>I recently read that the Chrysler Building, which features the architecture and falcons used in this episode, was the tallest building in the world when it was completed, but lost the title to the Empire State Building only a few months later.

Inspired mainly by this episode, I watched "The Maltese Falcon" for the first time this past weekend. (possible spoiler ahead): I knew Broadway's line, "When someone messes with your partner, you're supposed to do something about it," is almost a direct quote from the movie (Bogart's character actually says, "When someone kills your partner..."), so I was watching for it. I was kind of hoping it would come in a fire escape scene like it does in "Gargoyles," but it does not. It's an interesting movie though; Bogart's character is different from the one he has in "Casablanca."

Minneapolis, MN
Friday, July 9, 2004 09:50:15 AM

Multiple Descriptions>> Of course, this would mean that if Greg wrote a book set in the old days, it would feel like a Russian novel! So many "names"!
Good night all...
Er... (looks at watch)
Good Morning

JJ Gregarius
Tampa, FL
Friday, July 9, 2004 12:42:27 AM

My vacation is over, so let's get right to business, shall we?

That Little Revelation about Lex> I was wondering if anything concrete had come up about Lex's sexuality on way or the other. That seems pretty concrete. I'll try not to bore everyone with dicussion about something that was revealed a year or so ago, but it does certainly raise some interesting ideas. I remember a discussion several years ago in the comment room about how lonely and isolated Lex would probably feel with Broadway and Angela being a couple and Brooklyn returning from the events of TimeDancer with a whole family. I imagine that the fact that he's gay would only increase these feelings for poor Lex. I recall Greg mentioning that homosexual relationships among gargoyles are tolerated, but no celebrated by the clan. That would also explain why he hasn't told the rest of the clan yet, assuming he's even aware of his sexuality himself.

JJ Gregarius> My father once told me that, in his view, sexuality is more a spectrum than a matter of black and white. There are some people at the absolute extremes, but a lot of people fall in the middle. I tend to think this is true and it's probably true of gargoyles as well. On some level, Lex may feel attracted to the female gargoyles in "The Mirror". He may also feel a strong desire to fit in with his brothers - the only gargoyles his age left on the planet, as far as he knows. But you're probably right that Lex can't be categorized quite so easily. Heck, we could probably spend weeks discussing Goliath and Elisa's sexuality, given that their attracted to members of another species.

Also, lovely theories on homogeneous gargoyle culture accross the world. I imgaine some deeply rooted gargoyle traditions began very early on - maybe even way back when the earth's gargoyle population was concentrated in a very small area - and were kept alive by emissaries as the clans started to divide and spread. I'm guessing that as the clans became more spread out geographicly, they started integrating some human customs with their own (and vice versa) and were physically unable to maintain contact with more distant clans. But the strongest traditionas would remain intact throughout gargoyledom and clans that were still close enough to send emissaries continued to do so. I remember Greg saying that new clan usually formed when existing one grew too large and groups splintered off to seek out new protectorates, so I imagine those clans would have maintained very close ties.

I also strongly agree with your theory on how gargoyles may have been know by elaborate epithets. Any one gargoyle probably had many descriptive phrases and nicknames attached to him. His rookery siblings may call him one thing, the elders of the clan call him something else, the younger members of the clan have still another title for him, the visiting gargoyles from the clan over the hill know him as something else, his mate has her own names for him, and all of these can change depending on where he is and who they're talking to. My personal solution for my single fanfiction (linked to below), was to use the descriptions on nicknames in the dialoge and substitute regular humans names for important characters in the rest of the text.

World Tour> While I do remember some frustration on my part and the part of the Gargoyles fandom at the time with the length of the World Tour (It went on long enough for fanfics to be written forseeing or hoping for its end. I particularly recall one in which, upon returning to Manhattan, Goliath expresses a desire to chuck the skiff off a skyscraper and Bronx makes a rude guesture towards it with his hind leg.), I still enjoyed it. I think one argument in favor of it's length is that any frustration we felt as viewers was mirrored by the frustration the characters must have felt and not knowing when their journey would end and not having any news from home. Still, I think knowing how long it goes on increases the viewer's enjoyment of the World Tour by easing the stress and uncertainty a bit.

Thursday, July 8, 2004 10:19:29 PM

I can't remember now what I first thought of the Avalon World Tour, alas, although I enjoyed most of the individual episodes. (I can't even recall whether I was wondering impatiently just when they'd get home.) It could have helped that I liked the elements about "real legends" in the form of the various Oberati that they encountered.

Watched my tape of "The Silver Falcon" today. I understand now that it was apparently intended as a spoof (of a sort) of "The Maltese Falcon", though I didn't pick up on that when I first saw it (the fact that I've never seen "The Maltese Falcon" probably helped here).

One thing that stood out to me this time around was when Hacker was explaining to Elisa about how Matt got kicked out of the FBI because "the higher-ups thought he was a bit obsessive". It occurred to me this time around that, in light of what we find out later about Hacker being one of the Illuminati, that line has a delicious ambiguousness (and the best sort of ambiguousness, one that you don't even suspect is there if you don't know that Hacker's in the Society). I wonder which "higher-ups" Hacker was really talking about, even though he obviously wanted Elisa to think that he meant the ones in the FBI. (I also still wonder how many "Gargoyles" viewers must have thought it appropriate that a conspiracy buff like Matt would have once been in the FBI, though maybe the jokes about Matt's similarity to Mulder have gotten overused in the "Gargoyles" fandom.)

Another fun little bit that gains more significance in hindsight is when Elisa's talking to the CPA who's really Dominic Dracon in disguise and they're looking at the photograph of Mace Malone and Dominic. The CPA says, looking at Dominic, that he hasn't been able to identify the "sharp-looking feller"; after seeing this scene in light of the CPA's true identity, that line becomes quite amusing, with Dominic praising his own appearance.

Of course, lots of "Gargoyles" fans have probably brought up the link back to "Deadly Force" with Elisa taking good care to lock up her gun this time, so I won't say anything more about that (beyond the fact that it's great to see the characters in the series learning from their earlier mistakes).

Cleopatra's Needle shows up in the series twice in a row; Goliath and Elisa face Demona here in "The Mirror", and now Elisa and Broadway encounter Hacker and Pal Joey in this ep!

The thing that still really gets me about the scenes up on the silver falcon structure is how high up it is. I get dizzy just thinking about it. I definitely wouldn't want to be in Elisa's shoes for that scene.

And Mace Malone's prank on the Dracons reminds me of a story that Herodotus once told about an ancient Babylonian queen named Nitocris, who left a message before she died that if any king who came after her needed money, he could take all that he required from her tomb. Many years later, one of her successors, the Persian king Darius (who ruled over Babylon) eagerly broke into her tomb to claim it, to find no wealth there, but just a note saying "If you were not so consumed by greed that you would stoop to robbing the dead, you would not have broken into my tomb." Clearly Nitocris and Mace Malone had a very similar sense of humor.

Matt gets to show that, though he may be a conspiracy nut, he's still got some good brains when he finds a way to persuade Glasses into freeing Elisa from the rubble.

And Broadway gets to re-enact one of his favorite movie scenes (though it's not much fun for Dracon).

Todd Jensen
St. Louis, MO
Thursday, July 8, 2004 08:13:34 PM

"World Tour">>

Peruse the forum at

I believe that was what William Maune was referring to earlier

Witness that some first-time views of Gargoyles (on ABC Family) dislike the concept. Others who tolerate it still dismiss most of the stories as fillers. After persuing Ask Greg and talking with fans here, I must admit that seems odd, proving the importance of context and perspective. More episodes that illustrated how all of the heroes and mythologies tied into the storyline would have helped immensely, but what can you do, eh?

In any event, it seems many fans do not enjoy the anthological nature of the World Tour and cannot appreciate the many interesting stories therein (Hence my Deep Space Nine comment). They just can't wait to get back to New York.

Then again, I am working with a rather small pool of data. Kinda like a flawed focus group.

JJ Gregarius
Tampa, FL
Thursday, July 8, 2004 03:15:35 PM

It's been so long, I can no longer remember what order I saw the episodes of Season Two in the first time around. All I can recall is that my college schedule was so crammed at the time, I wasn't able to watch every day anyway. I just made copius use of the VCR timer and watched the tapes on the weekends.

Triskadekaphobes may want to avoid looking directly at the countdown today...

13 days left to reserve your hotel room at the Delta Centre-Ville (deadline is July 20 at noon).
13 days left to pre-register for The Gathering 2004 (deadline is July 20).
29 days left until The Gathering 2004 in Montreal, Quebec!

Thursday, July 8, 2004 06:55:00 AM

I agree with you, Todd. In fact, my first viewing of those episodes was in reruns, so there were no long periods of episodes in between for me. I've heard complaints about the World Tour episodes for years, and i could never understand why such a fuss was made over them. Ahh well. There's one question answered about the Gargoyles fandom. Yeah, I would have hated waiting around for new episodes right in the middle of the Tour.

Started yet another video.....last Sunday. I'm just gathering clips right now, but it is going to be on Coldstone and the song is 'Feel so Numb' by Rob Zombie. I figure that with all the different personalities jumping in control so often, it's gotta be numbing to be thrown into a situation where you don't know what is going on. That's my take anyway. I realized that I never listed the songs for my videos so here they are:

1. Demona's Rage to 'Bodies' by Drowning Pool
2. Goliath & Elisa to 'I'll see it Through' by Texas
3. Evolution of the Pack to 'Beautiful People' by Marilyn Manson
4. Gargoyles video 4 to The Conan the Barbarian Theme
5. Puck to 'Voodoo Child' by Jimi Hendrix
6. The Steel Clan to 'Thunderstruck' by AC/DC

I could not think of a title for video number 4, so it is just listed as Gargoyles video 4. It's kind of an extended version of the opening to Gargoyles.

Ok, I'm gonna see if the insomnia bug has crawled away from me.

Nickerous - [nickerous@yahoo.com]
Thursday, July 8, 2004 01:31:53 AM

More to say about the World Tour tomorrow, when I've more time, but I think that it seemed longer than it was because of the long periods of reruns in between. It was divided into thirds, with one-third (the Avalon three-parter to "Grief) in November and December, then a lot of reruns in January, then another third ("The Hound of Ulster" to "Ill Met By Moonlight") in February, then more reruns in March and April, then the final third ("Future Tense" followed by the homecoming in "The Gathering") in May. If the World Tour episodes had all premiered together without reruns in between, it wouldn't seem so long, I believe.
Todd Jensen
St. Louis, MO
Wednesday, July 7, 2004 07:28:07 PM

When the World Tour first screened in Australia, they were playing Season 2 out of order, even leaving episodes out. All of the original Avalon episodes were never palyed, so you can imagine my complete surprise to find Goliath, Elisa, Bronx and some strange garg-chick floating around in a boat.
The shock of the new meant that I wasn't bored with the
World Tour, although I didn't like some of the episodes as much as the others.
Thankfully, some years later, my family got pay-TV and I got to see all the episodes, in order, on the Disney Channel.

Wednesday, July 7, 2004 06:54:35 AM

To be honest, while I did enjoy the World Tour episodes in general, when I first watched them I was ready for them to get home around "Mark of the Panther". (My personal favorite episode of the tour is "The Green". I don't know why I do, but it just struck me as being the best of the bunch with MIA being a VERY close second.)
Wednesday, July 7, 2004 02:03:48 AM

Post length>> Can everyone read this? I fear I have too many ideas for a comfortably-sized post. :(

World Tour>> First, it would have helped if new adventures with the remaining Manhattan gargoyles were interspersed with the "World Tour". Second, I think the "World Tour" suffers from "Deep Space Nine" syndrome: while the World Tour is neat, it is radically different from the format we had grown to associate with Gargoyles, much as Deep Space Nine was nothing like the Next Generation.

Gargoyles and Names >> Interesting and logical ideas.

I have another approach. To discuss my idea, I must first suggest a solution to a riddle: Note that before humans, gargoyle clans filled the world, yet each clan had very similar cultures. I have a method for letting the clans stay this synchronized with each other, provided that we allow that gargoyles do not usually have inter-clan warfare, as suggested by the friendliness the various clans on the World Tour showed to Goliath and Angela, and that some gargoyles are very adventurous like Griff and Brooklyn.

Each clan might send emissaries to trade and share information with other clans nearby. In this fashion, stories and ideas can spread from clan to clan across the gargoyledom with little interruption, due to the inter-clan peace. This is similar to the method the Internet uses to send information from one computer to another anywhere in the world. (For the geeks here, you could almost say that this is like a primitive form of USENET over sneaker net) A gargoyle could know quite a bit about foreign lands.

So, what does this have to do with names? Presumably, even then, gargoyles did not use human-style names, yet somehow they communicated with their distant cousins, an odd conundrum, but one that can be resolved. Notice what Hudson in "Awakenings" when he opposes human-style names: "Why must humans name everything, *give it limits*?" (approx. quote) Also (IIRC), recall from "Ask Greg" that in the stories of their clans, gargoyles can use specific descriptive phrases to refer to important individuals. From this, I suggest that the ancient gargoyles could have wide-spread traditional descriptions for places and gargoyles, with the understanding that there are many other possible descriptive phrases. Words cannot *define*, but they can most certainly *describe*.

Traditional gargoyles like Hudson cannot wrap their minds around definitions of things. However, by modern times, the traditional gargoyle method has been mostly lost: The loss of communication across the gargoyledom has caused each clan to forget many of the traditional descriptions from far away. As modern gargoyles feel the need to talk of the world, they must use the human's names. This is one reason why most modern clans do not continue the "nameless" gargoyle tradition, IMHO.

JJ Gregarius
Tampa, FL
Wednesday, July 7, 2004 01:41:06 AM

Any idea if any TV ratings for Gargoyles have been posted somewhere? Curious as to how well Gargoyles has been doing...
Troy, NY, USA
Tuesday, July 6, 2004 11:08:37 PM

ABC Family Jetix Gargoyles Schedule Changes Starting Weekend of the 17th

Gargoyles will only be on at 11:30 AM on Saturday. The 11 AM slot is being replaced by X-Men and the Sunday airings are being replaced with Best of Power Rangers. Thus, this is the last weekend Gargoyles will be on four times. This weekend finishes the World Tour with The Gathering starting on the 17th. I wonder if the World Tour has been affecting the ratings. I like the episodes, but I've noticed many comments elsewhere each week wanting the World Tour to be over already.
William C. Maune - [Meteo@ToonZone.net]
Columbia, MO, United States
Tuesday, July 6, 2004 08:52:44 PM

DEMONSKRYE - Greg revealed at the 2003 Gathering that Lex is gay.
Todd Jensen
St. Louis, MO
Tuesday, July 6, 2004 07:37:19 PM

::Demonskrye enters the room wearing sunglasses, a large hat, and suitably light clothing::

I'm still on vacation until tomorrow evening, but I'm posting to fill a lull.

The Mirror> It's been too long since I've seen it for me to make any meaningful comments. Like most people, I count it as one of my favorite episodes. I'm in the camp that's not fond of the gargoyles-turned-human designs.

Lex's Sexuality> I feel like I must have missed something given JJ Gregarius's reference to Greg's revelations on the subject. Could someone clue me in?

Lynati> Very cool site that will probably come in handy when I get home and my boyfriend want reference for turning Ice Storm Brooklyn into regular Brooklyn.

Runta> If you're still around, I haven't seen "Future Tense" in quite a while. (In fact, I think I missed it on ABC Family this week. But if I remember right, both Brooklyn and Demona have some form of shoulder armor in this ep. So it's probably just more comfortable for them to rest their "wing talons" on their shoulders than trying to wrap their wings around the armor. I'm not sure if Greg has ever addressed this, but that's what makes the most sense to me.

A Thought> When I'm trying to sleep in an unfamiliar bed, my mind tends to wander. The other night I was thinking about Gargoyles, specificly the scene where Hudson gets his name. A lot has been said about the eloquence of Hudson's argument for not naming things and the weakness of Elisa's reply. But I don't think (and correct me if I'm wrong) that anyone has talked about how the gargoyle "no names" philosophy ties in to the rest of their traditional lifestyle. Between their strong protective instinct and the limited transportation available in 10th century Scotland, gagroyles probably didn't travel very far in their lifetimes. So of course there's no need to name the river because a) it's close enough that you can point at it or b) there are only one or two rivers in the area, so everyone knows what you mean. Furthermore, clans seem to be relatively small and everyone usually hangs around the castle or the surrounding area. So it's pretty easy to point out or indentify who you're talking about, name or no. So Elisa's insistance that things need names isn't just part of her human world view, it reflects a more global one. If you're going to see more than two rivers in your lifetime, you probably need to be able to keep them straight.

Tuesday, July 6, 2004 01:51:15 PM

keep in mind that since Gargoyles hibernate during the day they are avoiding the hottest temperatures completly. and there are many animals who live in extremely cold enviroments without body fur. whales, and artic fish are two examples. perhaps along with the thicker hide of a gargoyle, they have a layer of blubber/fat. insulation works in hot and cold enviroments of course...
Tuesday, July 6, 2004 01:42:38 PM

Thick skin, or a well-adapted internal thermostat? Elephants, hippos, and rhinos have thick hides, but they all spend a good part of their day trying to avoid overheating, and not a one could survive in the arctic. That gargoyles experience no discomfort over such a wide range of external temperatures must mean they have the most efficient warm-blooded metabolism on the planet.

A topic, perhaps, for the gargoyle biology panel at The Gathering next month. ;)

15 days left to reserve your hotel room at the Delta Centre-Ville (deadline is July 20 at noon).
15 days left to pre-register for The Gathering 2004 (deadline is July 20).
31 days left until The Gathering 2004 in Montreal, Quebec!

Patrick - [<-- Allez-vous au le Gathering!]
Tuesday, July 6, 2004 12:44:39 PM

They also seem to have little need for clothing in the winter. NY gets pretty damn cold and they didn't shiver much. Brooklyn was the only one that complained.
Monday, July 5, 2004 09:14:36 PM

Lily: From what Greg described, its actually a "hyde". Kinds like on a Rhino. Its got to be pretty thick for Goliath, Angela, and Gabriel to survive gliding mere feet above a lava pool in the middle of a volcano, and flying through a tube of lava in "I'll Met by Moonlight"
Monday, July 5, 2004 08:03:22 PM

Don't play with fireworks! You could burn your hands! *Pouties that her thumb is burnt due to a sparkler*

Scales are a common for gargoyles, I've read it in a couple books here and there where the gargoyles do look more beasty, but the Gargoyles skin appears smooth, like human skin. Textures don't get all that complicated in cartoons like this, I know. I was just wondering what the texture is for these gargoyles.

Lily Doll - [lilmidnightlily@yahoo.com]
Monday, July 5, 2004 11:37:42 AM

Sorry for the double post. I wanted to repost this so more would read it.

Lynati> Thanks!!! Now I have CLEAR images of my Two favorite Gargoyle designs: "Daedalus" and "The Green One" (As you call them). Personally, I used "The Green One" when Ever I'd wtite a fan fiction; haven't fone THAT in years.

THE MIRROR> Ah, The Mirror! I was socked to see the outcome of the ep; I had NO CLUE that this "Puck" was so cunning!

Elisa looks good as a Gargoyle, but none of the Gargoyles look good as humans (I had a good long laugh when I saw Hudson, though.)

I would like to have seen some interaction between the humans-turned-gargoyles and Manhattan clan. Might have led somewhere.

SHAKESPEARE> This is the episode that got me hooked on Shakespeare. I mean, I was so taotally engrossed with the name "A Midsummer Night's Dream" that I read the play and then wento see it again and again and again.

In Fact, Edmonton's River City Shakespeare Festival put on "Dream" last year and I went to see it eight times!!

This year the festival is putting on "Merchant of Venice" and "Twelfth Night." I don't have tickets yet, and my time is running out to go see them, but I'll make it. :)

GREG W.> If you read this, thanks again for this episode!! You and possibly Michael got me hooked on Shakespeare, anmd I love it!! Thanks a bundle!!!

That is all I will say.

Battle Beast
CanadaMonday, July 5, 2004 10:33:28 AM

Battle Beast
CanadaMonday, July 5, 2004 10:32:46 AM

It's 10 AM on a Monday and I've only been awake for half an hour. Hooray for three-day weekends. :)

Does anyone know what happened to Blaqthourne & Crimson Fury? He's the fan who had all the episode scripts posted on his web site. That site used to be here:


But just recently it was removed due to inactivity. So if anyone has an e-mail address for him... let me know. If he's not planning to resurrect his site, I'd like to ask him if I can get the script files from him and host them at The Aerie. They were a good resource and I'd hate to see them lost.

16 days left to reserve your hotel room at the Delta Centre-Ville (deadline is July 20 at noon).
16 days left to pre-register for The Gathering 2004 (deadline is July 20).
32 days left until The Gathering 2004 in Montreal, Quebec!

Patrick - [<-- Go north (to the Gathering), young man!]
Monday, July 5, 2004 10:07:19 AM

Monday, July 5, 2004 07:44:38 AM

Demona Taina
Monday, July 5, 2004 02:03:47 AM



Monday, July 5, 2004 01:59:19 AM

The Sadistic Cow
Monday, July 5, 2004 01:13:58 AM

#6, TOP 10!!
ar, usa
Monday, July 5, 2004 01:06:21 AM

Monday, July 5, 2004 12:45:39 AM

JJ Gregarius
Tampa, FL, USA
Monday, July 5, 2004 12:44:45 AM

De-lurk for 3rd.
Troy, NY, USA
Monday, July 5, 2004 12:42:14 AM


I was looking through the Best Buy circular earlier and saw that the 1st season of Batman the Animated series is coming out this Tuesday!!! Yeah!! Now let me see some Gargoyles packaging and a release date!!

Monday, July 5, 2004 12:11:05 AM

Monday, July 5, 2004 12:03:37 AM