And I agree wholeheartedly. The Quarrymen were nerfed and exaggerated at the same time. It made them seem like plain rioters with hoods on, not experienced hunters which Im sure the writers wanted them to be.
Valonsire - [akosman at hotmail dot com]
-=V=-
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 10:10:34 pm EDT from 24.15.123.216

XD I was cracking up when the Quarrymen brought out the AA cannons. I was like, "WTF?! How did the police not even notice?"

And how the hell did they even get those in the city in the first place?!
Valonsire - [akosman at hotmail dot com]
-=V=-
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 10:07:51 pm EDT from 24.15.123.216

Actually, the Quarrymen only appeared in five of the twelve episodes that followed "The Journey": "The Dying of the Light", "And Justice For All", "Generations", "For It May Come True..." and "Angels in the Night". And in two of those episodes they had only small parts (in "And Justice For All", we get a glimpse of a Quarryman as an extra in the riot scene; the Quarrymen appear in Act One of "Generatons" and then disappear for the rest of the episode).

I think that the Quarrymen seemed more prominent than they were in the Goliath Chronicles because almost every episode revolved around the public fear and hatred of the gargoyles, even episodes that didn't bring the Quarrymen on stage (such as "Ransom", "Broadway Goes to Hollywood" - where they were mentioned as Jackal and Hyena's employers, but never appeared, and "A Bronx Tail").

And I agree that one of the big problems with them in the Goliath Chronicles was the lack of consequences to their over-the-top actions; nobody in New York seemed at all concerned with their being out-of-control vigilantes who must have broken numerous laws in their attempts to kill the gargoyles. Even the public fear of the gargoyles wouldn't explain this; if Batman used the same tactics on the Joker and the other criminals in Gotham City that the "Goliath Chronicles" Quarrymen used on Goliath and his clan, he'd probably be in a padded cell in Arkham Asylum in a hurry.
Todd Jensen
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 10:06:32 pm EDT from 4.244.210.210

Asatira: Not just any cannon, but an anti-aircraft gun! And we got a fun speech from Castaway about how if they hurt any civilians, these would be "acceptable losses."

One of the things I love about the comic. We've seen Castaway on only a handful of pages in the new material, but those few pages have done more for me than any TGC episode ever did.
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75 at gmail dot com]
"DO NOT INTERRUPT! There! Happy now? Look what you did. Now you don't get to go on the murder crusade!" -The Monarch
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 10:01:46 pm EDT from 76.27.172.55

i like the fact that in the show, Xanatos loved and got married to fox. Then they had Alex. To me it makes them seem nicer then what they used to be.
Becky - [beckybug1991 at aol dot com]
Becky :)
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 9:23:53 pm EDT from 71.7.116.47

Michael> "What episodes in TGC featured the Quarrymen?"

What episodes aren't they? That's what was a major problem with TGC, they over-used the Quarrymen as their major big bad and had the worst sense of continuity (like the public completely forgetting that gargoyles can talk or proved themselves in some way) so the Quarrymen became two-dimensional villains who did things to antagonize the clan more than anything else. Hello! They used a small cannon in one episode! Thankfully, we've been seeing and will hope to see a more balanced and complicated presentation of the group.
Asatira
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 9:17:30 pm EDT from 68.190.20.172

i understand Greg. I agree
Becky - [beckybug1991 at aol dot com]
Becky :)
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 9:15:31 pm EDT from 71.7.116.47

What episodes in TGC featured the Quarrymen?
Michael Ejercito - [mejercit at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 8:18:02 pm EDT from 66.214.144.141

Tale Spin was a Disney Cartoon with three characters from the Jungle Book (Baloo, Louie and Shere Khan). The show has been described by some as a pilot noir type story (infact, while it's produced in the 1990s, it is set in 1939).
Antiyonder
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 7:25:39 pm EDT from 96.239.199.233

Either Demona, or Xanatos...

Who's Shere Khan? Someone in the comics?
Valonsire - [akosman at hotmail dot com]
-=V=-
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 7:22:29 pm EDT from 24.15.123.216

On the note of characters who are amoral, I'm not sure if anyone here ever saw Tale Spin on a regular basis, but would the show's version of Shere Khan qualify as a character who is amoral. I mean some episodes would have him in an antagonist role while some he would be helpful to the protagonists.
Antiyonder
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 7:19:19 pm EDT from 96.239.199.233

Becky> The great thing about "Gargoyles" is that the characters are so complex, there is no right answer to that question. Depending on the situation and the story, the answer changes.
Greg Bishansky - [<---- The Twelfth Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"Oh Lord, please help our athletes bring home the gold. Enough gold so we can melt it down and buy back our economy from the Chinese."
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 7:04:39 pm EDT from 75.56.245.4

in your guys opinion, who's goliath's biggest eneamy?
Becky - [beckybug1991 at aol dot com]
Becky :)
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 6:54:32 pm EDT from 71.7.116.47

The Quarrymen could be more of a threat than the Goliath Chronicles made them. For one thing, the very element that might make them seem less dangerous than Xanatos or Demona (their being ordinary citizens), could give them a different style of menace. The gargoyles would be pitted against frightened people who aren't out to endanger Manhattan, but just want to keep their families safe and have been duped into believing that the gargoyles are threatening them. What do you do when attacked by people like that?

(Though it's likely that the Quarrymen most often in the front lines will be Castaway and his hired mercenaries like Banquo and Fleance, instead of people like Sarah Browne. A bit like the scene in "A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court" where the Yankee's followers are worried about fighting the people of Britain in the civil war at the end of the book, and he assures them that they'll only be fighting the knights; the non-knightly part of the population will be watching from the sidelines and not take part in the battle.)
Todd Jensen
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 6:42:33 pm EDT from 4.244.213.143

also, I hope we haven't heard the end of Macbeth. That guy was a badass incarnate.
Valonsire - [akosman at hotmail dot com]
-=V=-
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 6:17:41 pm EDT from 24.15.123.216

Well Im glad that the comics differ from TGC. If everything you guys say is true, then the comics are sure going to be great. And Xanatos, I should've known he wouldn't let up. He is in the Illuminati after all.


Brook> NOOO. MEH NO WANTZ SPOILERZZ
Valonsire - [akosman at hotmail dot com]
-=V=-
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 6:16:10 pm EDT from 24.15.123.216

so does Broklynn find love in the comics? If so good for him. Do goliath and elisa end up together in the comics? they probley do, but i was just curious
Becky - [beckybug1991 at aol dot com]
Becky :)
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 6:10:14 pm EDT from 71.7.116.47

Sorry for the double post. Clicked on add your chat by mistake.

Chip> I think part of the reason that many prefered or thought that Brooklyn and Angela would end up together is the handsome guy usually gets the beautiful girl. And while I thought the pairing would happen on that alone, I took an instant liking to Broadway being her mate.

And as far as the trio separating, aside from his trip to London, Lex does spend a bit of time with Alex.
Antiyonder
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 6:06:46 pm EDT from 96.239.199.233

I suppose another way of putting it is that Xanatos is simply a lesser evil. The clan knows where they stand with him (he doesn't hate the Gargoyle race and would never attack them during the day).
Antiyonder
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 6:02:11 pm EDT from 96.239.199.233

Valonsire> Heck, Xanatos is the primary villain of the current issue arc (#7,8, &9) He's certainly not a "good guy". Just because he's not going out of his way to antagonize the clan, doesn't mean he's not going to use them...especially when they're right there, living in his house.

As for Angela and Brooklyn, yeah, I used to be in the same boat as you...but look at their personalities, I mean, Brooklyn HATES Demona, whereas Angela hopes to redeem her mother. That alone is a huge stumbling block for them. I know a lot of people wanted Brook and Angela to get together at the time, but I think it's only because she was the only available female around you know? I feel certain that Katana is a much better fit (Even though we haven't seen her yet) and now we've got even more female characters to love, like Coco.

And my esteemed colleagues have already pointed out that the Trio, as it were, doesn't really exist as such any more. Even before the Comics began.
Chip - [Sir_Griff723 at yahoo dot com]
"A great many of those who 'debunk' traditional...values have in the background values of their own which they believe to be immune from the debunking process."--C.S. Lewis
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 5:47:01 pm EDT from 68.164.2.49

Brook> Still you could always get the trade as a gift for anyone interested in the series who probably won't commit to getting the issues.

Anyway, as you will see in #3 of Gargoyles and #3 of Gargoyles Bad Guys John Castaway has some small but good character moments. The Bad Guys mini as a whole I'd recommend if you want to see the former antagonists trying to go straight (4 issues out so far).
Antiyonder
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 5:30:31 pm EDT from 96.239.199.233

Right, forgot bout that. I'd love to own them as individuals though... I'll make it, somehow...

Another question: If I counted right, we get:

1 x 2-issues
3 x 3-issues
1 x 1-issue
= 6 Episodes.

Quite few. Still better than nothing, but if I remember correctly, This takes place in 1, 2 weeks (flashbacks not counted in).
I'd love to know if Greg actually "removed" any, ergh . I forgot how he called them... you know, EPs who didn't need to exist for the continuation of the series. I mean, if the output is as small as it was last year, there's not much need putting out EPs that are less important than the big ones - has Greg ever said somethig about this? I'd LOVE to see some in depth character evolving like we saw it in "Revelations" or "Silver Falcon" (more on Brooklyn though... I know I might be one of the few, but Broadway allways was my least favourite of the clan).
Brook
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 4:10:18 pm EDT from 84.191.189.232

Brook> The earlier stories are available in Trade Format if you still want to check them out (Gargoyles Clan Building Volume 1).
Antiyonder
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 3:52:01 pm EDT from 96.239.199.233

P.S.: Still missing Journey (OK, I can guess how that play out ;) ) and Invitation only!! D'OH!!!
Though - I really like what I see MUCH MORE than I expected.
Brook
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 3:32:44 pm EDT from 84.191.226.175

Guys,

Thank you SO much for the awnsers on this.

I'm justreading into the comics (yep, they were sold out here aswell, so it took me some time to track them down :D ). The current trilogy is AMAZINGLY told - the only thing I didn't like that much is Shari repeating the line "The story is told... etc" OVER AND OVER again - the rest is totally rad!!! Brooklyns face when Broadway and Angela tell him they'll stay, Goliath and Elisas kiss... fanboy fanatsys come true! :) After reading a bit into TGS back then (years ago), I was a bit disappointed - it was all fan fiction, ye know... Now, seeing these new episodes, with everything Greg wasn't allowed back in the TV days, really made me want to see more...

I'm totally pumped for the TIMEDANCER EPs comming up, but a bit let down that we have to wait 1year+ for any new storys after that...

I don't drag Disney down, not their fault. Though, slightly disappointed.

Any ideas how to help Greg getting the stuff out?

Thx a lot.
Brook
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 3:30:49 pm EDT from 84.191.226.175

As I said, I honestly can't wait to get the comics. I am seriously drooling over all the new stories and arcs in the comics. I will be buying them soon. I hope that you guys haven't over exaggerated the comics for me (although with Greg being the writer, I doubt that's even possible :)

I also understand that without having read the comics, it puts me at a huge disadvantage when discussing.

PS: How many pages does each issue have?
Valonsire - [akosman at hotmail dot com]
-=V=-
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 3:15:37 pm EDT from 24.15.123.216

Valonshire> Seriously, ignore TGC. And "Gargoyles" has always been different from other series. Just because Xanatos is their host hardly makes him one of the good guys. Especially in the current story arc.

The dynamics have changed, but the gargoyles are sharing living space with one of their nemesis. It's a very interesting situation.

Seriously, buy the comics. We need all the sales we can get.
Greg Bishansky - [<---- The Twelfth Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"Oh Lord, please help our athletes bring home the gold. Enough gold so we can melt it down and buy back our economy from the Chinese."
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 2:53:01 pm EDT from 75.56.245.4

Valonsire: "Now, speaking of lexington and xanatos, does anyone else think that the quarrymen and the rioting public are far less exciting enemies than Xanatos and Demona and Macbeth?"

I think you're basing your Quarrymen opinion on The Goliath Chronicles (i.e. season 3 of the cartoon). In the comics Greg has removed all Quarrymen stories from timeline beyond the first TGC episode. I used to think the Quarrymen were annoying and derivative, but since Greg is rebooting their mythos, I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt. In actual canon, their group really hasn't been used much yet.
Landon Thomas - [lumpmoose at googles dot email dot service]
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 2:51:00 pm EDT from 216.250.163.157

Greg> Well I'm not reading the comics at the moment, but Im planning on buying them in the near future. Im sure that I am missing alot of stuff and that I sound like a total idiot right now. To tell you the truth, Im getting all my stuff from the Show and some from the Goliath Chronicles, which aren't authentic anyway.

I quote, "I mean, I feel as if all the hardcore villains have turned good". When I said that, it was based on the fact that the Pack really isn't the Pack anymore, with fox married and dingo being a hero. Thailog I never really viewed as a "main" villain since he only appeared like once or twice in the show. Demona... if Im correct... is not in the comics so far, and Xanatos is helping the gargoyles since they rescued his son... far from being an "enemy" when you think about. Macbeth is not their enemy anymore, he even vouched for the Gargoyles on Night Watch.

So really who else is there? The hunters? no they broke up. Quarrymen? Please... they're just a bunch of citizen soldiers trying to take down gargoyles. Sevarius? not really... Oberon? Last time I checked he didn't have any hard feelings towards the gargoyles. Thailog is probably the only hardcore villain right now.
Valonsire - [akosman at hotmail dot com]
-=V=-
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 2:41:38 pm EDT from 24.15.123.216

HA! Guess Greg B beat me to it. Greg, I knew you wouldn't be able to resist responding to that.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Many a small thing has been made large by the right kind of advertising." -Mark Twain, 'A Connecticult Yankee in King Arthur's Court'
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 2:21:34 pm EDT from 70.237.209.38

I'm tempted to just let Greg B nip this one in the bud, but I can't see how all the villains have turned good or whatever. Thailog certainly isn't a good guy, neither is Sevarius, Coyote, John Castaway, Coldsteel, Demona or a host of other minor villains (Dracon, Hyena, Jackal, Wolf, Banquo, Fleance). As for Fox, Xanatos and Macbeth, I think their characters have been portrayed in a very realistic light. They were never villainous for the sake of it, they had motives. And just because they have called a truce with the Manhattan Clan doesn't make them angels anyway.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Many a small thing has been made large by the right kind of advertising." -Mark Twain, 'A Connecticult Yankee in King Arthur's Court'
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 2:20:50 pm EDT from 70.237.209.38

Valonsire> Are you reading the comics? Nobody "turned good." Well, maybe Macbeth. But Xanatos is still one of the villains. And I'm sure Demona is too.
Greg Bishansky - [<---- The Twelfth Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"Oh Lord, please help our athletes bring home the gold. Enough gold so we can melt it down and buy back our economy from the Chinese."
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 2:18:25 pm EDT from 75.56.245.4

Litwolf> I know what you mean when you say that the whole revenge thing is getting a little obsessive and boring after a while, but remember, if they did do a spin off for her, then it would definitely involve macbeth, thailog, and demona in her human form, and also she would be able to narrate her feelings more often, so she won't only be operating as an insane redhead, but it would give us time to realize other parts and facts about her... maybe lol


Now, speaking of lexington and xanatos, does anyone else think that the quarrymen and the rioting public are far less exciting enemies than Xanatos and Demona and Macbeth? I mean, I feel as if all the hardcore villains have turned good and now some measly bad guys have come to take their place. But hey, that's just my opinion.
Valonsire - [akosman at hotmail dot com]
-=V=-
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 12:29:40 pm EDT from 24.15.123.216

Or, well, Lexington will help found the Lexington-Xanatos Corporation. Not really sure whether it's a real partner situation, a merger, or what.
Kerry (Kth) Boyd - [Kth_dragon at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 9:32:05 am EDT from 71.56.36.35

Valonsire> The trio as such wasn't the same even at the end of the show, and the comic has furthered this trend. Not that they're fighting or anything, just all wanting to go their own way and not have to all be together all the time. Gargoyles is very much about personal development, and over time teenagers do all go their separate ways.

At first I was sorry that Brooklyn didn't end up with Angela, but after reflection I decided that their personalities wouldn't have meshed very well anyway, and Broadway was the better mate for her. It also broke the "rules" that the leader (or second, in this case) was always the one to get the girl, and that the heavyset guy never does (since he's only around for comic relief).

Lexington will likely be poking around more intensely at technology, the internet, etc. Eventually he becomes a partner in Xanatos' company, so he's heading in a very businesslike direction. Greg's keeping very quiet on the romance front for him, especially since it's still a touchy social issue.

Brooklyn will have his 40 years to mature, and come back older, wiser, and with a family he loves 5 minutes later. He'll have to learn to interact with everyone all over again, but I know he'll be happy to see his clan again, and more than happy to be able to introduce them to Katana and Nashville (and eggy Tachi LOL).

Becky> They do. Elisa has a bit of a denial problem for awhile, and Goliath is slow to admit it to himself, but they do end up facing the issue. So now they're officially a couple.
Kerry (Kth) Boyd - [Kth-dragon at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 8:45:57 am EDT from 71.56.36.35

Valonsire > Oh, I didnt realize you still havnt read the comics. When you do, youll see that BrooklynAngela is not to be. Broadway and Angela are unmistakibly together.

Hmm... the idea of Demon carrying a series by herself might be interesting. Like maybe one about all her years alone. I mean, we have those 3-4 episodes of flashbacks but those are just concentration on Demona and McBeth. However, I think I would get bored really fast of "Revenge! Must have my revenge on the humans!" I got my fill of Demona from the show and was actually very happy that the comics took a break from Demona.
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 6:33:10 am EDT from 71.206.9.183

hmm interesting. she's not all bad especially to her daughter Angela. they have a special bond in a way. At least Demona has a soft spot for Angela, in my opinion
Becky - [beckybug1991 at aol dot com]
Becky :)
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 1:01:51 am EDT from 71.7.116.47

Im not sure, but on the note of Demona...

I actually grieve for Demona. She acts tough and harsh, but inside she's so fragile it seems. She is all alone, and she knows that she is the one to blame, but cannot bring herself to come to terms with it... Impossible as it is, I would like to see if Demona can ever be redeemed, and accepted into the Manhattan clan.
Valonsire - [akosman at hotmail dot com]
-=V=-
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 12:31:26 am EDT from 24.15.123.216

ment to spell Goliath sry typed to fast
Becky - [beckybug1991 at aol dot com]
Becky :)
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 12:20:24 am EDT from 71.7.116.47

I like demona, not one of my favorites but i like her attatude and personality. So in the comics (i don't own any) do Elisa and Gowlith end up together?
Becky - [beckybug1991 at aol dot com]
Becky :)
posted @ Sun, Aug 24, 2008 12:17:54 am EDT from 71.7.116.47

Well actually, since most of the show was based on Goliath, I don't know who I would like to see more... My only regret is that after Hunter's Moon pt. 3, Goliath and Elisa's love didn't get much attention. I was really looking forward to both of their love growing and all that jazz (although I dont know If their love is shown in the comics, which I still have to read.)

to answer your question... I would say.... Demona or Coldstone/Desdemona
Valonsire - [akosman at hotmail dot com]
-=V=-
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 11:39:12 pm EDT from 24.15.123.216

Valonsire: "I just cant contemplate the fact that Brooklyn will all of a sudden be so much older than the rest of the trio, and he'll become separate and the trio will become a duo instead (lexington and broadway)"

I think after Hunter's Moon the trio was already starting to break up. Broadway begins to seriously court Angela. I won't rehash the Amp/Lex theories but Lexington going off to London almost by himself indicates that's he ready to explore the world and discover himself without his two brothers hanging around. And there's been many hints of Brooklyn feeling lonely and boxed in. With what's happened and what we know will happen, issues #1-12 indicate a symbolic and literal breaking of the trio and a coming of age for all three. It's Greg's masterful story-telling that's been revealing this so subtly and organically.

(Disclaimer: I didn't see the #9 play.)

Brooklyn's been my favorite gargoyle for a long time (probably thanks the Jeff Bennett). Griff might have eclipsed Brooklyn for me if he had more episodes.
Landon Thomas - [lumpmoose at googles dot email dot service]
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 11:38:03 pm EDT from 216.250.163.157

Im just excited for it because Brooklyn is my favorite character and Im glad he's gonna get a chance for some alone time from the Clan and strike out on his own. He gets to be the main character and will be able to get stronger and come into his own. In support of what Greg has said, I believe that he can hold his own by being in a series all his own. Broadway is my least favorite of the Trio so I wouldnt want to watch something dedicated to him and Lex, I love him and it would be cool to see him go on journey and discover himself (like his true sexuality), it would be a really techo-crazy show, which would be hard for me to follow. So thats why TimeDancer is the spinoff I am dying to see! ^_^

Who would you like to see hold a series all on their own?
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 10:32:40 pm EDT from 71.206.9.183

Honestly, I don't think I favor the whole timedancer thing (but if it comes out im still going to read it). I just cant contemplate the fact that Brooklyn will all of a sudden be so much older than the rest of the trio, and he'll become separate and the trio will become a duo instead (lexington and broadway)

But I do support that he will finally be able to find love.
Valonsire - [akosman at hotmail dot com]
-=V=-
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 10:14:35 pm EDT from 24.15.123.216

Valonsire > Well, the comics are not out yet but, even if they werent, its still called cannon-in-training. Basically, its all in Greg's master plan but hasnt been actually set down as drawn material for us to drool over. But, even if there werent plans for TimeDancer to be released, we still have The Journey/Nightwatch episode/comic which show Broadway and Angela sharing a kiss plus Greg's persistant word that there was never any romantic waves between Brooklyn and Angela.

But its still gonna happen. Issue 10, 11, and 12 (the last three of the main Gargoyles series) are going to be about the beginning of TimeDancer so Im hoping that the last one will show a really quick summary of Brooklyn's travels and then have him popping back to Manhattan with his family, much to the confusion of the rest of the Clan.
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 10:09:07 pm EDT from 71.206.9.183

But I thought Timedancer wasn't going to happen? Or is Greg still planning to do it?
Valonsire - [akosman at hotmail dot com]
-=V=-
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 9:19:54 pm EDT from 24.15.123.216

Im happy that Broadway and Angela are together (mostly because theyre characters I dont like ^_^ ). Im glad that Brooklyn ends up with Katana. Thats why I was so excited to read TimeDancer; because I wanted to see the romance growing between them. Brooklyn has been looking for love in all the wrong places (Maggie, Angela, Dehila) but all he had to do was go back in time to find it ^_^
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 9:05:13 pm EDT from 71.206.9.183

I didn't like how Angela ended up with Broadway (or at least in the Chronicles he did). I would have preferred it was Brooklyn, but he was already leader so I guess he can't have everything
Valonsire - [akosman at hotmail dot com]
-=V=-
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 8:52:26 pm EDT from 24.15.123.216

I like Golith, he's ok in my opinion. my second favorite character would have to be Angela
Becky - [beckybug1991 at aol dot com]
Becky :)
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 8:47:52 pm EDT from 71.7.116.47

My favorite gargoyle would have to be Goliath. I just like the way he almost never uses slang and talks proper XD, plus hes the leader and most badass.

But I also like Hudson's accent.
Valonsire - [akosman at hotmail dot com]
-=V=-
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 8:30:19 pm EDT from 24.15.123.216

My favorite gorgoyles charater is Broklynn. He remins me of myself a little.
Becky - [beckybug1991 at aol dot com]
Becky :)
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 8:08:56 pm EDT from 71.7.116.47

I hope your right
Valonsire - [akosman at hotmail dot com]
-=V=-
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 7:49:46 pm EDT from 24.15.123.216

Valonsire: Don't lose hope because the situation really isn't that dire. There's a chance that if SLG can rework the Disney deal, Gargoyles will fare much better in graphic novel form anyway. Graphic novels are welcome in regular bookstores as well as comic shops and many long-time comic fans don't even bother with single issues anymore. SLG itself has expressed an interest to move to 100% graphics novels because they're so much easier to produce than 'monthly' issues. And even if SLG can't seal the deal and Kingdom and BOOM! pass on the property, CreatureComics originally intended to publish the comics themselves after they got enough clout. Now they'll have 18 successful issues under their belt which will give them the ability to negotiate licensing themselves and/or shop around for other publishers (or just publish online). And if nothing else, the last two years have proven that Disney is willing to license Gargoyles. I think it's the best time to be a Gargoyles fan since the cartoon ended and there's a lot to look forward to.

My own dirty little hope is that Dan Vado will convince Disney to drop the approvals process altogether in exchange for removing all Disney labeling from the product and switching the copyright to Touchstone or Buena Vista or one of the other brands Disney uses when they want to obfuscate their involvement. Dan could use Greg's history as the director of series development during Disney's golden period of afternoon programming and his continued employment in animation production as evidence that he knows how to make kid-appropriate material and is the best steward for Gargoyles. Then Disney could set the licensing fee back to the original price and still save money because they wouldn't have any administrative costs beyond negotiating the license. Disney would profit more than they are now and be protected from any future controversy generated by the comic since their name's not on it and they never saw it. Anyway, that's just my pipe dream.
Landon Thomas - [lumpmoose at googles dot email dot service]
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 2:33:45 pm EDT from 128.101.32.234

Chip> As twisted as it sounds, Sevarius might just go down in scintific history as a pioneer as the father of gargate studies. To the best of out knowledge, he's the first and so far only human scientist to properly study gargoyles. If he can just keep those pesky crimes against humanity under wraps, he'll probably have a portrait somewhere by 2198.
Algernon
"Mary had a little lamb, It's fleece was white as snow and everywhere that Mary went THERE WAS A SCARY GUY CALLED HITLER!" -from the prophecies of Nostradamus.
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 11:06:29 am EDT from 213.94.183.150

It's actually kinda funny. I was thinking I got off too light this week since I only had 3 comics I buy released. But if they had Bad Guys it would have made 4... when it's issue 4...
Ozzie Arcane - [ozziearcane at yahoo dot com]
"Hello Booby! This is a trap!" - Eggplant Wizard
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 10:30:09 am EDT from 69.14.122.91

Ozzie > Haha, we've only been talking about BG #4 all the time since it came out three days ago ^_^ Id talk to your comic shop about getting more in stock.
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 8:46:07 am EDT from 71.206.9.183

Wait a minute. Bad Guys #4 is out? Blast it! I didn't see it at the comic shop, he must not have ordered enough copies.
Ozzie Arcane - [ozziearcane at yahoo dot com]
"Hello Booby! This is a trap!" - Eggplant Wizard
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 8:42:47 am EDT from 69.14.122.91

Its not impossible to spread the word; just a bit difficult. Ive tried to tell my friends about Gargoyles but they werent too interested in getting involved with a new fandom. But, I remember when I picked up the book version of Clan Building Vol 1 from Borders, the cashier and I had a brief conversation about how happy we were that Gargoyles was getting a second chance in comic form. It made me happy because it was the first Gargoyles fan Id ever met in real life.

So we cant give up yet! SlG hasnt given up on us! In a year, they want to offer a proposal to Disney for Gargoyles graphic novels. We still have a chance for new material! And the current comics havnt even finished yet. We've got six more to enjoy (and I know that Im going to enjoy the Timedancer ones more than anything in the world ^_^ ) So dont lose faith, Valonsire.
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 8:08:36 am EDT from 71.206.9.183

Matt -- Don't forget T-Shirts. Hot Topic randomly and amazingly gave us T-Shirts!

Seriously, "spreading the word" is a lot more easier with recruiting material such as 2 DVDs, 12+ comics (including a TPB), and T-Shirts. Not to mention the annual Gathering!

Seriously, how'd you folks do it before? XD
Phoenician
"The Suspense is Terrible . . . I Hope it Lasts" -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 3:56:26 am EDT from 70.162.223.238

Spreading the word is much easier said than done. Many people who hear about it will be like "Oh yea I remember that show..." and then let it descend into the deep of their minds. How do we know that the people we spread the word to people who will have an actual IMPACT on the it?

I shall not loose hope. I will do anything in my power to help further our cause. Forgive me if I sound a bit fervent, but I do not back down when I pledge myself to something.
Valonsire - [akosman at hotmail dot com]
-=V=-
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 3:07:30 am EDT from 24.15.123.216

Don't lose hope. If we had lost hope in 1996, we wouldn't have had 12 Gatherings, 2 DVD sets, and more than a dozen comic books with all new stories.

We have to keep hope and we have to keep SPREADING THE WORD. All is not lost and we still have some momentum, so just imagine what we are still capable of doing! Maybe by this time next year we'll be in an even better place than we were a year ago, maybe in a decade Gargoyles will be a huge franchise, perhaps bigger than it ever was. But we don't know the future, all we can do is try our best. Things will be fine, Gargoyles is not "over". Not if we don't let it be.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Many a small thing has been made large by the right kind of advertising." -Mark Twain, 'A Connecticult Yankee in King Arthur's Court'
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 2:49:22 am EDT from 70.230.165.27

You all have very good points. I think I should leave "her" alone due to all of your valid reasons....

I just feel very... "depressed" for lack of a better word, that Gargoyles is slowing down. I just can't believe that it may just be over. There are whole companies that are stopping us, and we can't do anything about it...

*sigh* If anything, we cannot lose hope...
Valonsire - [akosman at hotmail dot com]
-=V=-
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 2:39:18 am EDT from 24.15.123.216

A minor correction to an earlier poster: nayrusavatar is a she.
Spen
"Come along. You belong. Feel the fizz."
posted @ Sat, Aug 23, 2008 1:08:33 am EDT from 66.43.205.110

Demonskrye>My copy had the same printing error as yours, the missing "time." Oh, well. At least this time you can clearly tell what was supposed to be there.
Meg
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 11:50:41 pm EDT from 70.116.31.208

*BAD GUYS #4 REVIEW*

All I can say is....HOLY SCHMECK!
Warcrafter - [grafixfangamer1 at sbcglobal dot net]
Don't hate me cause I'm a nerd, hate me cause that's all I am.
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 11:47:55 pm EDT from 69.231.204.44

I was browsing the unanswered questions and saw a question that sparked a thought...Sevarius coined the term Gargate (as far as we know) in the Gargoyles Universe.

Let's assume that when Dr. Sato was let in on the secret of the Manhattan and Labyrinth Clans, Xanatos let Dr. Sato have all of Sevarius's notes on Gargoyle Biology left over from when Anton worked there. (Assuming he doesn't now...since Sevarius is "freelancing up a storm")

Thus, Dr. Sato reads what Sevarius wrote when he needs to learn more about his new patients. The term "gargate" gets drilled into his head.

Years from now, when gargoyles and humans are at relatively more peaceful relations with man...(or not, it doesn't matter I suppose) Dr. Sato publishes a paper on Gargoyle Biology and Gargate gets used by the majority of the scientific community. Thus the term Gargate becomes more than just canon...but the way scientists of the future will view Gargoyles and Gargoyle Beasts.
Chip - [Sir_Griff723 at yahoo dot com]
"A great many of those who 'debunk' traditional...values have in the background values of their own which they believe to be immune from the debunking process."--C.S. Lewis
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 11:22:39 pm EDT from 69.3.220.117

I'd imagine that like any homeless shelter, people disappear from the Labyrinth quite often without giving any explanation. Some might return, others might not. New York's a huge city.
Patrick - [<-- The Gathering 2009]
"A little nonsense now and then is relished by the wisest men." - Willy Wonka
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 11:11:57 pm EDT from 99.147.60.131

Demonskrye> Yes we have seen Thug before. He was the one guarding Fang when Sevarius busted him out. http://gargoyles.dracandros.com/Thug I figure he was the first to be kidnapped. Sevarius and Fang prolly dragged him off, and it was hours before Talon noticed Fang or Thug was missing.

Also...I don't think the four newbies are going to be the last. Sooner or later Sevarius is going to get to test his Gargate Mutagen...which would explain a lot about the human DNA in the Labyrinth Clan as of 2198. What do you guys think?
Chip - [Sir_Griff723 at yahoo dot com]
"A great many of those who 'debunk' traditional...values have in the background values of their own which they believe to be immune from the debunking process."--C.S. Lewis
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 11:07:20 pm EDT from 69.3.220.117

Demonskrye> Greg, you let Sevarius mutate you kids? I'm shocked!

Mutating (or to be correct, splicing) becomes a fad of sorts in Batman Beyond. I just figure Greg would keep up and ahead with the times.
Antiyonder
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 10:56:39 pm EDT from 96.239.199.233

Michael> I doubt a police report was filed. Like the first three mutates (Maggie, Fred and Claw), these people were homeless and they were probably totally off the grid (living in the Labyrinth). Odds are that no one in the "real world" noticed they were gone in the first place, much less knew about their dissappearance from the Labyrinth. I guess some of their fellow Labyrinth inhabitants and/or Talon, Maggie and Claw might've noticed, but I don't think any of them would've seen much point in filing a report...
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Many a small thing has been made large by the right kind of advertising." -Mark Twain, 'A Connecticult Yankee in King Arthur's Court'
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 10:49:59 pm EDT from 70.230.165.27

Got my copy of Bad Guys #4 today. I'm too tired at this point to read all of the responses, so forgive me if I repeat anything that was already said.

BAD GUYS #4 SPOILERS!! PROCEED AT YOUR OWN RISK!!!

Really great issue, probably the best one yet. I'm digging the darker tone to the story, as it give the book a bit more of a separate identity from the main series. Karine's artwork on this issue is really super and I'd even say it looks better than her previous work on the book. There's a lot of little subtle stuff in the art which comes across really well. (Though I must admit I didn't notice the Matrix tendril peeking in on Sevarius either.)

Cover: A Guler cover always makes for an extra awesome comic and this is no exception. My guess for the in-continuity explanation as to why Fang looks so different on the cover is that it's an artist's rendition of him, as Fang probably hasn't had mug shots taken since he was mutated. Of course, we also know that the covers aren't canon, so it's probably just Guler taking another stab at refining Fang's design.

Comic:

"Gigantor" is a nice introduction to Fang's sense of humor for readers not already familiar with it. I wouldn't be surprised if Fang destroyed that first robot by blowing off its head as well, thinking that doing that while saying "Head's up!" is funny.

I appreciate the large amount of play given to Fang's ability to shoot electricity from his wrists. Hopefully it's enough to keep any new readers from being confused when Fang shocks Dingo and Hunter a few pages later.

I am also certain that next issue, we will see that there's a robot behind Fang that is the acutal target of Yama's shurikens. Much as I'm sure Yama would like to take Fang out, Hunter seems to have convinced him otherwise.

I like the panel of Fang's face being smashed into the wall. Fang getting clobbered is a nice bonus, but mostly it's just that it's a good drawing.

Nice to see Matrix using his unique abilitiesto do things like check numerous passageways at once.

I almost hate to bring this up, but does anyone else's copy have a small mistake on the page where Hunter is waking up the cell? On mine, Yama's word bloon in the second panel says "Ah, good. You've been unconscious for some" and then there's a blank space at the bottom. I assume he's supposed to say "for some time." Anyway, it may just be my copy and it's not a big deal, certainly nothing like "Gargoyles #6."

Greg, you let Sevarius mutate you kids? I'm shocked! I jest, of course. It's great to know they got to pick their forms and approve the designs.

Have we met Thug before? I haven't been watching the backgrounds of previous issues all that closely, so I'm not sure.

Sevarius is really nasty here, possibly more so than he's ever been. The involvement of children certainly steps things up a nothc and it's more obvious than ever that he doens't care in the slightest for the well being of his creations.

My best guess for Sevarius's client is Thailog, since I don't know that he has the stones to use DNA that Thailog obtained for his own purposes or those of another client unless he has plenty to spare. And I agree with the idea that the human DNA he intended to mutate Yama with is his own. Using Elisa's DNA would be more than a bit weird and Anton is certainly egotistical enough to want to spread his DNA around.

The look Sevarius gives Fang after he "informs" Tasha that she's probably never going to be human again. Is it just "Time to get going now" or "Please shut up before you ruin my fun completely"? Sevarius did seem to enjoy tormenting Maggie and Claw with the possibility of a cure, so he may have been a little irritated at Fang for making it clear that cures aren't this doctor's thing. I like the idea that even Sevarius can't entirely tolerate Fang.

As for why the Squad didn't think to check Sevarius for any concealed keys to the cell they're putting him in, I'm guessing it's the same reason they didn't take the time to free the mutates then and there: they were in too much of a rush to get to Times Square and stop Fang and the virus. It may have made the difference in ensuring that Sevarius stayed where they put him, but I don't know if it would have been enough to prevent Tasha's fate.

Do we know how Tri is related to Terry? Older brother? I'm guessing they're skipping the usual plans of native New Yorkers because Terry's just become old enough to stay out and watch the ball drop and he wants to see it live and in person.

Nice job on the drawings of Fang with the gas mask and when he puts it on, Karine! You are really rocking this issue.

The nature of Dingo and Matrix's connection - as shown by Dingo's blackouts when Fang shocks them - is very interesting and I hope we get to learn more about it.

Matrix is still very much a logical computer program. Hunter may claim she needed a second to consider whether or not to save Dingo, but Matrix knew he was never in any danger of not being saved.

I did accidentally catch one spoiler while checking other conversations here, so I did know that one of the mutates was going to commit suicide, but it's still extremely effecting. I think Benny curled up into a ball is what really drives it home.

Just so I'm clear, Sevarius was in one cell, Tasha was in another, and Thugs and the kids are in the same cell or two or three separate cells? I don't think there's any way the art could have done a better job of clarifying this since the cell walls need to be open so the other mutates can see Tasha's suicide. I just want to be sure that I'm correct that there was no way the other three could have physically prevented Tasha from hanging herself.

Fang has his most sympathetic moment and his most inappropriate moment in the space of two panels. He's clearly affected by Tasha's death at first, but almost immediately, he falls back into the bad (in the case, truly tasteless) humor which I'm now guessing is his defense mechanism. He's a jerk, no doubt about it, but he also is (or was) a human being and it's good to know that his character is not going to be one dimensional.

After some thought, I've decided I like the slight indication of what Hunter might have whispered to Yama. Any more direct and it would have been too much. I think I can safely say that this will not be the new Titania's whisper.

OK, so Fang is part of the team now. Which brings up two questions. One is why does the Director want Fang? Aside from his unique physical abilities, Fang doesn't have a ton to offer and his unreliable personality seems like it would outweigh whatever strengths he brings to the team. And the other, what's the stick and what's the carrot? Fang does have quite a bit to fear. Hunter could easily turn him over to the proper authorities, the Labyrinth, or Yama, and Fang is far too much of a coward to deal with what they might do to him. (I doubt Talon would be a merciful as he's been with Fang in the past considering everything he's done now.) But what could anyone offer Fang as an incentive? What does this guy really want?

END SPOILERS

I'll freely admit that Bad Guys would not have been my first choice for which one of the spinoffs to do. But with the last few issues, it's really been a good read and I'm looking forward to seeing how it ends. Great job, everyone.
Demonskrye - [demonskrye(at)gmail(dot)com]
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 10:46:14 pm EDT from 146.115.115.33

BG #4 does have an interesting plot.

I wonder if a police report was filed by the new mutates. After all, they were kidnapped.
Michael Ejercito - [mejercit at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 10:25:51 pm EDT from 66.214.144.141

Thanks for the various tidbits and background info, Karine.

YouTube> Frankly, I love the those episodes are posted on YouTube. I do think the episodes that have already come out on DVD should be removed, but the episodes that have not been released for profit by Disney yet should stay up so that everyone can still see them. If anything, those episodes can show Disney that there is a market to relelase those episodes. After they are relelased on DVD, they should be removed from YouTube. So, I hope the Season One and Season Two Volume One eps are removed, but I think it'd be a sad day for myself and for Gargoyles if the Season Two Volume Two episodes were removed before they were released on DVD.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Many a small thing has been made large by the right kind of advertising." -Mark Twain, 'A Connecticult Yankee in King Arthur's Court'
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 9:55:43 pm EDT from 70.230.165.27

"Who's everyones favorite gargoyle?"

Demona. I find her character more interesting then the rest of the gargoyles who tend to be goody two shoes. That and I have a thing for villain chicks.
Ozzie Arcane - [ozziearcane at yahoo dot com]
"Hello Booby! This is a trap!" - Eggplant Wizard
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 9:54:54 pm EDT from 69.14.122.91

Sorry for the double post. Anyway, since we're talking about YouTube, I was wondering if anyones checked out the anime on the Funimation Account (loaded by the company themselves):

http://www.youtube.com/user/FUNimation

So far they've loaded episodes of:

- Blue Gender
- Kiddy Grade
- Peach Girl
- Slayers
- Mushi-shi
- Rumbling Hearts (I've only watched this one for the moment, and despite my preference for the more lighthearted programs, I'm enjoying this anime)
- Suzuka
Antiyonder
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 9:28:38 pm EDT from 96.239.199.233

Tabby> As Meg said, it's the only way for some to view the second half of season 2. Besides, I purchased several shows despite seeing them online such as Captain N, Super Mario Bros 3 and Avatar The Last Airbender (Season 1 to be precise. I'm getting Season 3 next month and Season 2 in October).
Antiyonder
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 9:20:07 pm EDT from 96.239.199.233

So, I'm rereading all the comics, trying to look for more details I always miss because I read so voraciously each time a new comic comes out. And I noticed something I wanted to ask people's opinions on:

Issue 3, Invitation Only: Right after Demona picks up the Crystal is the first page with Shari on it. There is a panel showing a lot of people in the Labyrinth.

Do you think the two children running around are Benny and Erin? Similar long hair on Erin, but very different art styles so I could be wrong. What do all of you think.

Becky - A question I have been asking myself a ton lately. Today my answer would be a split between Delilah/Staghart. I just love their designs and their personalities intrigue me and I just want to keep watching them develop.
UncleDeadly
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 9:16:43 pm EDT from 69.232.218.52

Sweet! Thanks for the post Karine. I'm horrible at picking up on all the little clues in comics so it's great to have the creators so accessible.
Landon Thomas - [lumpmoose at googles dot email dot service]
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 9:14:29 pm EDT from 216.250.163.157

GregX -- I'm strangly happy to say that I totally understood you the first time ;)

That, and I can see some similarities . . . especially in the wings. Course, the color gets me thinking Coldfire a bit more though.

***SLIGHT SPOILERS***
Karine -- At first I was confused to read your post regarding Dingo & Matrix finding the good doctor's lair . . . I thought, 'well, we saw Matrix split itself and search every tunnel. Simple logic, no?'

But after scanning the pages again, I too caught Matrix peeking in during Sevarius's rant. Very cool, indeed!

***END SPOILERS***
Phoenician
"The Suspense is Terrible . . . I Hope it Lasts" -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 9:09:09 pm EDT from 70.162.223.238

::re-reads previous comment::

Um, three-fourths into it. And this is why I suck at math. ;)
Greg Bishansky - [<---- The Twelfth Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"Oh Lord, please help our athletes bring home the gold. Enough gold so we can melt it down and buy back our economy from the Chinese."
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 8:42:11 pm EDT from 75.56.245.4

thanks for that link to the website. Who's everyones favorite gargoyle?
Becky - [beckybug1991 at aol dot com]
Becky :)
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 7:18:36 pm EDT from 71.7.116.47

Okay, I could be off, but I think there was a small "Gargoyles" parody in the season finale of "The Venture Bros." It's on the Adult Swim website, and will be airing on television on Sunday night.

*** Spoilers ***
At the end of the episode, the Monarch shows up in a (really stupid) suit of robotic armor. At first I was thinking Iron Man, but then the razor sharp wings popped out. Very Steel Clan/Xanatos armor-ish.

The design of the armor evokes the Steel Clan design a bit also (except or the color and the helm) but with a Monarch Butterfly motif instead of gargoyle. But the gauntlets are similar, the chest piece is slightly similar. The boots, claws, knee pad.

I could be off, but if it was intentional, it's really cool.

It's in the fourth segment, about three-thirds in:

http://www.adultswim.com/video/?episodeID=8a2505951bc80ed4011beaa85dc6019e

*** End Spoilers ***
Greg Bishansky - [<---- The Twelfth Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"Oh Lord, please help our athletes bring home the gold. Enough gold so we can melt it down and buy back our economy from the Chinese."
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 6:56:24 pm EDT from 75.56.245.4

Thanks for your comments, Karine. I hadn't even noticed that narrow Matrix strand in the background until you pointed it out.
Todd Jensen
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 6:45:02 pm EDT from 4.244.213.42

Also, you are aware that for many of us, the youtube videos are the only way we can see the second half of season two, right?
Meg
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 6:17:05 pm EDT from 70.116.31.208

Seeing the episodes online is what rekindled my interest in Gargoyles enough to fork over the cash for the DVD's. I don't know how many others out there have a tendency to buy things they like after seeing them online for free, but there you go.
Tabby
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 6:15:52 pm EDT from 72.77.244.211

Surprisingly, the videos have been up for a year and Disney hasn't taken them down yet. The videos do infringe copyright but I actually hope they don't get taken down this time. Most of them have 20K+ views and in my opinion that's 20K more fans that would have forgotten the series if they weren't up. I think the increased attention will counteract any lost DVD sales. And it may spark more interest in the comics. Online distribution works--just look at the success of Dr. Horrible. But I do agree that it's tacky to upload episodes that are already out on DVD; I'd prefer if they were just the episodes that haven't been released yet.

Valonsire: You could try contacting Youtube, but I think Disney itself has to submit the DMCA take-down request since they own the content: http://help.youtube.com/support/youtube/bin/answer.py?answer=58127 You could try sending an email to Disney, especially their legal department if you can find an address.
Anonymous
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 4:21:40 pm EDT from 160.94.194.6

The YouTube episodes have been up there a while. Dont email; Id just leave it. Besides, some poor college students who cant afford Gargoyles DVD sets like to enjoy them between classes (like me ^_^ )
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 4:17:35 pm EDT from 71.206.9.183

Omg... your right. Aww man, I feel so foolish... I was just so happy that I finally found Gargoyles after all the time I searched and I wanted everyone to enjoy them... but your correct.

Maybe I should mail Youtube and tell them of this? Im sure that by doing this he is breaking some copyright laws...
Valonsire - [akosman at hotmail dot com]
-=V=-
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 4:06:29 pm EDT from 24.15.123.216

Valonsire> I know people have differing opinions of this, but the problem with the episodes being up on YouTube is that certain people will be less likely to actually buy the episodes that are available on DVD, making it almost certain that we'll never get the rest released. I don't like being a killjoy, but I hope that Nayrusavatar is forced to take the episodes down.
Phil - [p1anderson at go dot com]
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 3:46:22 pm EDT from 134.215.196.82

Hey guys, firstly, I have to say that I used to watch Gargoyles when I was young and I was so grieved when they didn't show it anymore. I was even more sad when I found out the Toon Disney was playing in on such HORRIBLE hours. Also I was so disappointing when I heard that the comics are not going to be licensed again...

Anyway, I just found out (and I want people to know) that a blessed soul on Youtube has uploaded all the episodes of Gargoyles, ALL of them. The quality is GREAT and there isn't any missing episodes or ANYTHING! His name is "nayrusavatar" (without the quotes) and I am so glad that he posted them. I just wanted to share this with all of you in hopes that this can make up for the missing Season 2 part 2 DVD collection

Keep faith my friends, gargoyles will live on.
Valonsire - [akosman at hotmail dot com]
-=V=-
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 3:14:47 pm EDT from 24.15.123.216

Haha, thats what I love about reading comics and graphic novels: you always find new things each time you read it. Like I didnt at all pick up on Yama pointing at Redemption or Matrix popping up behind Sevarius. Excellent job, Karine! I love the comic and your style! I wish I could draw half as well as you. And I think that it is totally hilarious that Benny and Erin got to chose their own animals. Love it!
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 2:44:48 pm EDT from 71.206.9.183

I'm gonna have to skip the room for a little while longer. Turns out the store which I'd just started a new subscription to had (possibly) interpreted "Gargoyles" and "Gargoyles: Bad Guys" as the same thing, and it wasn't ordered this month. The guy I talked to will order it for me, so I'll have to wait.
Asatira
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 2:04:03 pm EDT from 66.191.158.234

Karine> Your art has ALWAYS been terrific... I can't draw stick man or even a pay check these days... (Ha ha ha to me...) even at your very WORST you are (to me anyway) 100x better than ANYTHING I could EVER do!

Bravo, Karine!

I can't imagine how hard it is to draw all of those characters so precisely every issue and make them look as good as the TV show.

Way to go! (I'm heaping praise because you really deserve it!)
Battle Beast - [Canada]
That is all I will say.
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 2:00:58 pm EDT from 75.152.98.8

Give the man a prize! :)
Karine - [kanthara at gmail dot com]
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 12:58:53 pm EDT from 24.203.63.247

Hunter said "Redemption" to him, which Yama points to?

And are you referring to Matrix popping up while Sev says he loves drama?
Matt H
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 12:47:53 pm EDT from 67.162.246.164

BAD GUYS #4 SPOILERS!!!!
___________________

Answers to questions, because I have them, to clarify things that may not be clear:
Tasha's Suicide: Notice that she has a long sash around her waist. It's not there when she's hanged. Also notice that the room has a dropped ceiling.

What Hunter Whispered: Look at the page again. The answer is on the page. It's subtle, but it's there.

Tasha's relation to the kids: Look at issue #2. I drew Tasha as a black woman. Robby's toning is subtle, but it's there.

Terry Chung?!: Yes, it IS Terry Chung on Tri Chung's shoulders. If he looks too young, that's my mistake. I did not notice in the references at the end of the script that his age was written in. Also, he appeared in issue 4 of the main book, and I didn't recognize the kids as being 12, more like 8, from Nir's drawings. I just went and looked at the script again and did the facepalm thing. Basically, I was working from memory rather that read script description. So, sorry guys. My bad.

Kids' Mutations: Greg was looking for armoured creatures, as Sevarious said. Erin and Benny chose their own animals. My designs were sent to them for approval. Erin prefered the version of the turtle with hair; my thinking was that the mutation was still early and she would eventually lose all the hair (like our Mutate friends looked different in "Metamorphosis" and "The Cage").

I'm glad the difficult emotions I was trying to convey in my drawings read well -- Hunter's horror and disgust at the notion of being infected with gargate DNA, for example -- and I'm also glad you caught that Fang's lightbulb joke was a defense mechanism. He's a jerk, yes, but that... that went too far and he had to step back and protect his vulnerability by being a jerk.

My favourite line of the book is "I'm not! I'm really not!"

Also, I'm surprised none of you have noticed HOW Dingo found the Squad and the mad scientist... Go look at your books again! ;)

And thanks, guys... I really appreciate the comments about the art getting better. I really do try to be better with each issue.
Karine - [kanthara at gmail dot com]
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 11:30:12 am EDT from 24.203.63.247

About how Tashe hanged herself: She had a cloth sash or something around her waist, which wasn't there after she died. I assume that's what she used.
Matt H
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 11:27:07 am EDT from 67.162.246.164

Litwolf: Ah, okay. I'll have to take another look then.
Landon Thomas - [lumpmoose at googles dot email dot service]
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 10:11:19 am EDT from 128.101.32.234

Slight Spoliers

Landon > The kids arent in Thug's cell. He's hugging Erin through the bars because their cages are right next to each other and, because Benny has no one to hug him, thats why he curled into a ball. Its difficult to tell but, if you look on the floor, you can see the bars between the cages and where they connect to the floor.

As for how Tasha killed herself, maybe she had a belt? Maybe she tore some of her clothes? Honestly, I dont think I want to the know the details in her suicide.

End of Slight Spoilers
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 9:46:24 am EDT from 71.206.9.183

Welcome Becky! If you're interested in the comic books, this link will bring you to the publisher's website where you can order them: http://www.slgcomic.com/Disney-Comics_c_9.html


*** SPOILERS ***

Blaise wondered how Tasha was able to hang herself. I think this is an important question because it's also unclear how Erin and Benny were able to get into Thug's cell. The only explanation I can think of is that when Sevarius escaped he handed rope to Tasha through the bars then herded Erin and Benny into Thug's cell. I don't know why he would want one of his own creations to commit suicide (I'm sure he doesn't have a problem with it morally, but it seems wasteful). And I don't know why he would risk opening Thug's cell at all or care about them being together. This question seems glaring enough that Greg might answer it in a future issue, or is it worth an Ask Greg question?

*** END SPOILERS ***
Landon Thomas - [lumpmoose at googles dot email dot service]
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 9:34:08 am EDT from 216.250.163.157

Is it here we ask for editing abilities on GargWiki? I remember someone asking that a week ago. Ive registered my username (Litwolf) and now would like to help edit the Wiki. Thanks!
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 8:31:41 am EDT from 71.206.9.183

Elisa mentioned Bigfoot in "The Silver Falcon". Dracula and vampires have been alluded to a few times.

And Goliath mentioned the Holy Grail in "Sentinel", but that's evidently going to show up, on-stage, in "Gargoyles" #9.
Todd Jensen
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 7:42:43 am EDT from 4.244.213.74

Demonskrye>Yeah, but my point is that the licensing fee was (ostensibly) also to cover the administrative costs of Disney having to approve the comic, etc. Probably it would be LESS for Kingdom to make Gargoyles, for sure, but somewhere someone has to approve it (and they'd be tacking on production costs as well), and I doubt it'll be significantly cheaper than it was for SLG. And that profit is still relatively chump change to Kingdom...so while SLG might be willing to take on a small profit because they probably need all the money they can get, Kingdom might not think that small a profit (relative to their other properties) is worth it. I hope I'm wrong, of course.
Meg
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 1:05:17 am EDT from 70.116.31.208

Well, I guess its true that Angela's DNA could be from 'Bash' and not 'Monsters' and you who have said it doesnt matter is also right. Somebody else mentioned that it might have come from 'Monsters' since Sevarius would have had to test her DNA to know that she's Goliath's daughter so that stuck in my head.

Ohs wells ^_^

Becky > Welcome to the Comment Room (though it feels weird to welcome someone when Ive only been here three weeks ^_^ )
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Fri, Aug 22, 2008 1:04:17 am EDT from 71.206.9.183

Ic. Thanks for the welcome and the cookies. I'v never read or seen in person the Gargoyles books.
Becky - [beckybug1991 at aol dot com]
Becky :)
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 11:25:31 pm EDT from 71.7.116.47

Landon -- Jason wasn't the first to make the "Alligators in the Sewers" line . . . back in "Thrill of the Hunt," Jackel made the same comment to Hyena reading about Gargoyles in the Daily Tattler.

Becky -- Welcome to the CR! Have a cookie **Points to Cookie Table**

As you can probably see, we're talking about the latest release of Gargoyles story with the recent release of the comic, "Gargoyles: Bad Guys #4, "Louse!" But be careful, Spoilers are everywhere!
Phoenician
"The Suspense is Terrible . . . I Hope it Lasts" -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 11:21:58 pm EDT from 70.162.223.238

hi guys i'm new here, sup?
Becky - [beckybug1991 at aol dot com]
Becky :)
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 10:46:34 pm EDT from 71.7.116.47

*** SPOILERS ***

Ha! I didn't catch the 'alligators in the sewers' reference. Since Jason mentioned that in Hunter's Moon, I guess that's another point in the 'all things are true' column, along with Elisa's 'UFOs, Loch Ness or secret societies' line from The Edge. Can anyone remember any other myth references from the series that have yet to come true?

Did anyone else think from the solicitation summary that we'd get the lightbulb contest winning entry in #4? Instead, we get another unfinished lightbulb joke and another hidden whisper. Sometimes I think Greg is just mocking us. ;)

Nothing to add except that Karine's getting noticeably better with every issue.

*** NO MO SPOILERS ***
Landon Thomas - [lumpmoose at googles dot email dot service]
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 10:33:49 pm EDT from 216.250.163.157

That's what I thought when I saw Thug. :)
Chip - [Sir_Griff723 at yahoo dot com]
"A great many of those who 'debunk' traditional...values have in the background values of their own which they believe to be immune from the debunking process."--C.S. Lewis
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 8:31:37 pm EDT from 68.164.6.81

Matt>

I figure it's because Thailog didn't intitially clone Angela in "The Reckoning". If he had any of Angela's DNA left, he could have cloned her then. He didn't. Even if Demona objected, that wouldn't have stopped Thailog.

Plus at the Gathering, Greg said that BG#4 hints at what Thailog has planned for the "Bash" DNA samples.

That is Terry Chung. Greg and Karine said that they would be appearing in this issue at the Gathering
Chip - [Sir_Griff723 at yahoo dot com]
"A great many of those who 'debunk' traditional...values have in the background values of their own which they believe to be immune from the debunking process."--C.S. Lewis
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 8:30:31 pm EDT from 68.164.6.81

SPOILER

So, Thug living in the Labyrinth... alligators in the sewers anyone? Ha!

END SPOILER
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Many a small thing has been made large by the right kind of advertising." -Mark Twain, 'A Connecticult Yankee in King Arthur's Court'
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 8:27:59 pm EDT from 70.230.165.27

SPOILERS

I'm not sure why everyone is convinced that Angela's DNA used in "Louse" came from "Bash" and not "Monsters". I mean, it hardly matters, but what evidence is there that points to one more than the other?

As for the kid on Tri's shoulders, he looks way too young to be Terry, but maybe an explanation from Greg will help.

END SPOILERS
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Many a small thing has been made large by the right kind of advertising." -Mark Twain, 'A Connecticult Yankee in King Arthur's Court'
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 7:42:05 pm EDT from 70.230.165.27

* SPOILERS*

I'm not certain that Terry was the child sitting piggy-back on Tri's shoulders in Times Square. We know that he's twelve at the time of the late 1996 events, which is a bit old for such an activity.

* SPOILERS END *

The New Year's Eve setting, incidentally, reminds me of a creativity demon that I had several years ago, which had the trio go to Times Square to see the ball drop, and taking Bronx with them. Once the ball drops, all three of them start singing "Auld Lang Syne". Bronx raises his head and howls in accompaniment, a long, mournful howl. At last the trio stop singing and look at him; Brooklyn mutters "Everyone's a critic."
Todd Jensen
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 7:24:23 pm EDT from 4.244.215.79

Like many others, I got my copy of BG#4 yesterday. And, wow. Just ... wow.

***SPOILERS***

My reactions are pretty much similar to everything everyone said below -- Tasha's suicide was gripping, Curry & Belushi came in loud and clear, and their characters are MOST definitely "louses" -- but I do want to mention that like others, I too am wondering what Greg's kids think about their cameos. Knowing that they did watch the series with him (especially for his episodal rambles), I'd be quite curious indeed to know their reactions.

That, and knowing Benny one time visited this CR a few years back (I think he took on a Bronx-avatar), I think it'd kill me if he jumped in one day and posted "I'm a Roly-Poly!"

That's all for now.

***END OF SOILERS***
Phoenician
"The Suspense is Terrible . . . I Hope it Lasts" -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 6:01:30 pm EDT from 70.162.223.238

* * * * BAD GUYS SPOILERS * * * *

"Robyn's reaction seems really really pronounced" - I thought so, too. I don't think she's over the old prejudices yet.

Fang is a real jerk. And by "jerk," I really mean another word that ends in "hole."

Sevarius is not in top form here. He should have learned by now to do the mad science BEFORE the hero comes out unconsciousness, and gloat about it AFTER. Seriously... what did he think was going to happen when he approached an unrestrained Robyn or Yama?

Why does it matter whether Angela's DNA came from "Monsters" or "Bash"? It's not like there's been any change to it in the interim. Also, just because he used some of it for this experiment doesn't mean he didn't save some for the future.

Re: Erin and Benny - Wow. Helluva way to give your kids a cameo. I hope it don't scar them for life. :P

Re: Tasha - The only moment in the comic so far that's really shocked the hell out of me.

* * * * END SPOILERS * * * *
Patrick - [<-- The Gathering 2009]
"Can we say 'hell'?" / "Hell yes, it's the INTERNET!" - Statler and Waldorf
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 5:34:18 pm EDT from 99.147.60.131

Bad Guys #4 Spoilers


Like everybody else, I really loved this issue. It was frightening in and of itself, but it has a lot more frightening implications for the future. As someone else said, the full gravity of the situation doesn't seem to have hit little Benny and Erin yet. When I heard there were going to be new mutates, I just assumed they would be more cool winged cat-like people, which would be awesome. Hell, given the opportunity, I might even CHOOSE to be mutated into one of those. Despite how much Maggie seemed to hate it, I never felt that it was such a bad fate. I'm in agreement with Fang...if I were turned into a creature like that, Sevarius could keep his cure.

But the situation of the new mutates is radically different. Whereas the first mutates were turned into strange, yet beautiful and powerful creatures, these new mutates are genuinely more like monsters (perhaps with the exception of Thug...his situation is BAD, but it's not AS BAD as Benny's, for instance) in my opinion. Seeing the old mutates in the cartoon for the first time didn't horrify me, but seeing these new ones did horrify me. Especially Benny. And his childish innocence about the whole thing ("I'm a roly poly bug") makes it even more horrifying, because you KNOW it hasn't really hit them yet and they've probably got a lot more pain in store. I can't imagine what Erin's going to feel like when she's older and all the other girls are going to prom and having boyfriends and going to the mall and she is stuck in a hideous half-turtle body. Benny is going to feel so lonely down the road when his teen hormones kick in and he realizes that he's an ugly bug mutant and no sane (human) girl is ever going to want him. Plus the trauma that Tasha's suicide must have caused them. I imagine that's going to leave a severe emotional mark. The comic doesn't make this clear...was she their MOM? Or just a fellow Labyrinth resident? Also, if she wasn't their mom, I wonder how their real mom (who would be living in the labyrinth, presumably, if they still have one) will react when she sees them. Man. Life is gonna be BAD for those two, even IF everyone around them is completely supportive. I think things will be easier for Thug. His mutate form isn't as hideous, and plus he seemed pretty stoic despite the situation, contrasted with Tasha. Things will be better for all of them if more "ugly mutates" are created, since they won't feel so alone, but I'd hate to see more people suffer such a fate. Yeeeeeeesh.

Yama and Robyn were really interesting in this issue as well. Robyn has definitely been making a lot of progress in getting over her prejudice against gargoyles, but this issue shows that there's definitely still some prejudice left (okay...I imagine most people, whether prejudiced against gargoyles or not, would still be horrified about being changed into a half-human half-gargoyle creature, but still, Robyn's reaction seems really really pronounced). I liked Yama's reaction to that..."Whose DNA specifically?". That was so funny. Plus his "Which human?" reaction. I think it's cool that he cares more about the individual's DNA, rather than the species as a whole. Almost as if he wouldn't mind being mutated with the DNA of certain humans, but certain others would upset him a great deal. I think some of the things the other characters might have said may have pissed Yama off a great deal. Firstly, Robyn's utterly horrified reaction to the idea of being mutated with a gargoyle (as contrasted with Yama's own understated reaction to being mutated with a human) and plus Dingo's comment that he saved Robyn from a "fate worse than death".

Fang was interesting here too. Being a bit of an optimist at times, I really want to see some good in him. I want to see a deeper level to him. And to be honest, I do. His horrified expression after seeing Tasha dead (and right before he makes that tasteless joke) could be interpreted in multiple ways...it could easily mean "Oh shit, I'm really in trouble now", but it could also mean "Oh shit, I've just helped KILL this woman". I prefer the latter...a bit of genuine guilt rather than fear of being "caught". His tasteless joke could just be because he's an asshole, but it could also be because he uses humor as a defense mechanism when he doesn't know what else to do. I hope it's both. The fact that he saved Yama (a guy who had, only five days earlier, nearly decapitated him) when he could have just flew away seems to indicate that he's not a complete scumbag. I hope so. Maybe I'm reaching too hard, but I really want to see some depth in him and I feel like we're getting that. The fact that he almost turned a crowd of people into mutates contradicts the idea that he might have some good in him, but then again he might feel that he's not doing anything bad to them...after all, he has said before that he, personally, LIKES being a mutate.

I have more to say, but no more time to say it. ttyl
Rebel
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 4:54:39 pm EDT from 198.202.242.180

****A loud sound, something like an explosion, shakes the Comment Room. Blaise then appears in front of the fireplace, blowing his nose into a handkerchef.**** Sorry for the sneeze...I'm fighting a cold.

TODD> A belated Happy Birthday!

BATTLE BEAST> My condolences to you, and hopes that things will improve.

GARGOYLES: BAD GUYS>

*********SPOILERS!! SPOILERS!!**********

-There were a number of scenes in this issue that just made me say, "Oh...my god."
The first one was, of course, the revelation of the "New Mutates." This is shocking, because we've seen at least three of them (Tasha, Benny, and Thug) as humans. It becomes even more shocking because of the nature of their mutations. The original Mutates, despite having six working limbs and enough eel DNA to channel electricity, don't seem anywhere near as strange as these four. Perhaps that's because their main body ("anthropomorphic big cats" if you will) is still...I don't know. Beautiful? Acceptable? My point is, in comparison what happened to these four seems even more outlandish and strange. Tasha at least is a mammal (albeit not a pretty one), but Thug is now reptilian, and so is Erin I think (a turtle with hair it looks like). But Benny's the weirdest out of all of them. HE'S A FRICKEN' INSECT! How the hell did Sevarius manage that? You know, it's strange--out of all the things I willingly suspend my disbelief for, this one takes the cake. Are insects even considered vertebrates? Still, if Sevarius can isolate and manipulate the genetic code for hexopodial limbs, I guess it's not too much of a stretch for him to do this, too.
The next shocking thing would seem to be the kids' reactions to their predicament--they don't seem that phased. Benny actually seems somewhat proud of being a "roly-poly bug." Erin is more interested in arguing with her brother.
The final shocking thing about this scene to me is...those are GREG'S KIDS! Good god, man! What did they do to you? ;-)
-Of course, all of these shocks pale in comparison to the suicide. It's a very powerful scene (despite, or maybe because, we don't see the noose or anything). The shocked reactions of the squad (minus the largely emotionless Matrix), and the reactions of Thug and the kids are well done. Poor Benny can't hug Thug, so he goes into the wood louse version of a fetal position. As if they weren't traumatized enough--homeless, then mutated, now witness to a suicide. I ask again: Greg, what the HELL did your kids do to you?!
Unfortunately, "Fridge Logic"--what you think about after the fact, usually while looking through your fridge for a snack--leaves me wondering how exactly she hung herself.
At any rate, those were the big ones for me. The rest of my impressions will be listed, more or less in the order they occurred.
-Fang takes out the robot with a double blast of both gun and electricity. Nice. I liked the "Gigantor" reference.
-I love Fang's expression in the 4th panel of page 3. I knew that Fang would get a cliff-hanger, but I never thought the (apparent) threat would be from Yama. Given later (earlier) events, that resonates all the better, though.
-"5 Days Ago." Wow...that doesn't sound like a lot of time in the grand scheme of things, does it?
-Fang's line about sending Robyn packing "in pieces small enough to pack" made me go "Yikes!"
I wonder if Robyn quite took in the irony of her life being saved by a gargoyle.
-I was tickled to get a confirmation that a gargoyle's sense of smell is better (or at least more sensitive) than a human's. Yama knows Fang isn't a gargoyle just by the scent. "Fish," eh? I wonder if that's from Fang's genetic make-up, or his diet.
-I was a bit surprised when Yama's attack seemed to knock out Fang. Of course, it didn't.
-Matrix and Dingo are fun! I found Matrix's line about "taking matters into my own nanobots" a rather interesting twist on the old phrase.
-I'm ashamed to admit that I had forgotten that Sevarius knew Robyn previously.
-It never occurred to me that Thailog could be the client Sevarius spoke of until others mentioned it. Whether it is or not, this new client has certainly helped the good doctor out--right down to apparently providing a lab with holding cells in New York's sewer system (how many "Labyrinths" do they have down there?).
-As others have mentioned, we now know what motivates Sevarius: science, money, and...DRAMA!!!!! That last part actually becomes important to the plot, what with Sevarius's device set to go off at exactly midnight and no way to speed it up (much to Fang's annoyance). Of course, mutating all the people in times square, while dramatic, also seems a little...stupid. I mean, cameras are rolling, police are there..is no one REALLY going to notice thousands of people spontaneously mutating? But screw logic, this is...DRAMA!!!!!
He even numbers the carrier virus after the new year number (1997).
-And now the term "gargate" is cannon. Sevarius wonders what would happen to a human mutated with gargate DNA, and vice versa...and I'm wondering how many of us, like Matt, have paused to consider that, over the years.
The reactions are intriguing. Robyn is disgusted (maybe even afraid?). No matter how she interacts with Yama, the old prejudice still has it's hold. Yama, on the other hand, just calmly inquires into the identity of the "donor." That surprised me--when it's a normal animal, nobody inquires beyond species, but with a sentient questions of identity arise. We learn the name of the gargoyle (and with it, one of the uses the samples are maybe being put towards), but Sevarius never mentions the human.
-Dingo (wearing Matrix) saves the day! Hands up everyone who saw that coming.
-Oh that Sevarius.... As soon as they left him in the cell, with that smug look on his face, I knew he'd escape somehow. Tasha immediately jumps on the idea that now Sevarius HAS to cure them. Poor lady....
-Spot the cameo in Times Square! Naturally, we have Brendan and Margot. Tri Chung, and I guess his little brother Terry, are there as well. And Karine's roster of garg-fans.
-I understood that Fang's electric attack reset Dingo's memory back a couple of seconds on the first incident. As if Dingo didn't need another reason to be wary of joining with Matrix.
-"Damn drama." No, I will not get tired of every minor profanity that shows up in these books! Of course, the suicide will kind of steal the thunder....
-"Flamin Gallah." We just don't use that insult enough.
Poor Dingo, though. His partner made a logical decision (and a good impression of the New Year's Ball) that left him in free fall. And even though Hunter saves him, his momentum is enough to swing him face-first into a wall. By the handkerchief a few panels later, I guess he got at least a bloody nose.
-Love the Eyrie Building in the back ground.
-Go Yama! I wonder how Fang's attacks hold up against Taro's electric fans.
-I enjoyed the dicotomy between Fang's first reaction to Tasha's death, and his immediate switch to a joke (in extremely poor taste). A defense mechanism, I guess. Not a good one, since it nearly gets him beheaded. Fang's enthusiastic support of Dingo's "He's not worth it" line is in character and extremely funny. Hunter's reaction intrigued me the most, though. Her expression when Yama tries to kill Fang, and then her calming Yama down by...whispering something in his ear.
Great, as if "What the #$^& did Titania whisper" wasn't enough, now we've got "What the #$^& did Hunter whisper." You better answer ONE of those SOON, Greg! ;-)
-Now Dingo gets some confirmation that Hunter isn't the top dog, after all. I wonder if her boss's interest in Thug and the kids was altruistic or pragmatic.
-"Guess who made the team!" Fang almost seems like a high schooler who just made running back. The rest of the team seems less than thrilled, especially Yama (who's furious).

Good one.

**********END SPOILERS!! END SPOILERS!!********

Now I've got to head out and get some more tissues. Until next time, farewell. ****Blaise pauses to sneeze, and pops out of existence.****
Blaise
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 4:47:13 pm EDT from 206.170.104.36

Litwolf> I'm pretty sure that Sevarius planned to use his own DNA to mutate Yama. After all, he has an ample supply of it...and it's the kind of thing he'd do.

I'm also pretty sure that that's Angela's DNA collected from "Bash" not Monsters.
Chip - [Sir_Griff723 at yahoo dot com]
"A great many of those who 'debunk' traditional...values have in the background values of their own which they believe to be immune from the debunking process."--C.S. Lewis
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 4:33:27 pm EDT from 72.244.125.101

I think the Angela DNA was collected by Thailog in #5. I don't think it came from "Monsters"
Greg Bishansky - [<---- The Twelfth Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"Oh Lord, please help our athletes bring home the gold. Enough gold so we can melt it down and buy back our economy from the Chinese."
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 4:32:27 pm EDT from 75.56.245.4

I love my comic book store. They had BG #4 (plus, the new Buffy comic for my mom)! Im so happy I didnt have to wait to order it. Here is my review;

SPOILERS AHEAD! YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED!
Review of Bad Guys #4 Louse:

It's nice to see that Fang didn't desert. And Yama, the mountain. He's certainly as quiet as one. Not that Fang deserves any thanks see as he probably just decided he had a better chance of surviving the robot attack if he stuck with the Squad.

Then comes the flashback, picking up right where we left off. Are you sure Fang wasn't mutated with a possum? Cuz he plays dead like one.

I know what Dingo's thinking: "Why didn't Matrix pull off that trick hours ago?" ^_^

And four new mutates. Pretty damn scary. Though Im glad Benny and Erin were lightening things with their Roly-Poly/Pill-Bug debate. And it's even scarier to see Sevarius going to a larger scale of mutation.

Yama made me laugh, with how he wanted to know which gargoyle and human DNA Sevarius was playing with. Now I wonder two things:

(1) If he had Angela's DNA from the Loch, why didn't he clone her when Demon and Thailog were ordering clones of the Clan? Why mix Demon and Elisa when he had some Angela laying about?
(2) Who is the human DNA he has? My first thought was Elisa from when he got it on Halloween but I don't think he'd waste her DNA when Thailog seems to want it for something.

And, the Redemption Squad needs to think outside the box if they didn't think Sevarius would have a key to the lab and cells somewhere on his person. That would have been the first thing I looked for before I throw him into a cell.

It took me a little bit to realize that Fang's shocks were messing with Dingo's memory but I laughed out loud when the dots were finally connected.

Return to the lab to find Tasha. I knew how desperate she was when she kept begging Sevarius for a cure but that still chilled me.

And I gave Yama a standing ovation when he gut-punched Fang. I wanted to do so myself when he started his 'light bulb' joke.

A real eye-opening issue of Bad Guys. More Mutates, Fang on the team, Sevarius still at large with the knowledge of the mutating virus. This series is certianly keeping us on our toes!

END OF SPOILERS!!!

I was so happy to finally sink my teeth into some new Gargoyles. Its been so long! Now we just need to keep our eyes open for Clan Building #9. When's that come out? Begining of Sept?
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 4:20:10 pm EDT from 71.206.9.183

Meg> The reason Kingdom Comics might be able to make a better profit on a "Gargoyles" comic is that Kingdom Comics was started by and is - as far as anyone here understands - owned by Disney. And since Disney doesn't need to pay licensing fees to itself, there's no concern about the company making enough money to cover the licensing fee. Licensing fees would still be a concern for Boom Studios or any other comics company that may pursue the license.

Battle Beast> I found it fascinating to learn about your Dedo's life. Again, I doubt it has any effect on how much you miss him right now, but it does certainly sound like he had a very full and interesting life. And if you inherrited his longevity genes, you'll likely outlive us all. Thanks for sharing.
Demonskrye - [demonskrye(at)gmail(dot)com]
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 3:59:57 pm EDT from 146.115.115.33

Sorry for the double post.

I want to post about Bad Guys #4>

I loved the issue. I thought Sevarius was particularly evil.

Now he is kidnapping kids and freakishly mutating them? It reminds me of the mutants from ninja Turtles. It's just really creepy.

"Benny and big sister Erin" ? Ha ha ha!! That was great. I loved that. And the fact that the one hung herself was even more creepy...

I liked the part where Fang drops the virus and Matrix Catches it... "poof!" that was my favorite pannel of this issue.

The fact that Sevarius would mutate no o nly children but a whole population of people... wow.

Really good story. Loved the drawings... except for the cover. I thought it looked too "Claw-ish", not really like Fang...

I'm gonna go read it again.
Battle Beast - [Canada]
That is all I will say.
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 3:18:48 pm EDT from 75.152.154.98

Thanks everyone for all of your well-wishes and hugs. It really helps.

My Dedo being 111. Yah, it was a really long life...

He was born in Austria in 1896 and emigrated to Canada in 1909. He joined the Canadian Army and served in World War I in France at Vimy Ridge.

In his 20`s he bootlegged moonshine and was kicked out of a coal mine job for doing so. He worked in an opal mine in Australia for a year and was kicked out for stealing an opal (they never caught him for the other six he took!) Incidentally, we have all six Opals... years later they were cut and cleaned... he took them by... ugh... swallowing them... anyway, we have them and they are worth a lot of money. In his thirties he studdied to become a barber when he came back to Canada... he lived in Australia for only a year...

He worked as a barber for the rest of his life. He worked at a street corner in Edmonton where Mayors and even some primiers (like Governors) came so he made a lot of money. He was well respected. He married my Nana after her first husband died of pneumonia in 1936 at the age of 36.

Nana and Dedo were married for 56 years. (Nana died in 1996 at 96 years.)

Dedo was in World War II for the allies, again serving with the RCAF (Royal Can Air Force)

He was also in Korea. He has the Victoria Cross, Distinguished Flying Cross, Two Purple hearts and a Bronze Star for saving some Americans in Korea and a bunch of other ribbons and medals.

Nana and Dedo loved to travel, and to date they had been to over 100 countries.

Anyway, Thanks for letting me post that. Hope it`s interesting. Because I sure think it is.
Battle Beast - [Canada]
That is all I will say.
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 3:11:57 pm EDT from 75.152.154.98

Just to play Devil's Advocate for a moment, Kingdom Comics might not decide to pick Gargoyles up (if that's even an option) because they may decide it's not profitable. The comic would still (presumably) have to be approved by someone somewhere, as I'm sure all Disney products are. If the total administrative costs were enough that SLG wouldn't make a real profit, who's to say Kingdom would? If the admin costs are the same, I actually think Kingdom would be less likely to invest in something that would net them a very small profit.

With that being said, while it would be great if Kingdom would pick up the title (it would instantly get more marketing/cred), I'll be content if we just get SOMETHING more in the future.
Meg
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 2:53:43 pm EDT from 70.116.31.208

Chip > I hope you're right. That would be great.
Rebel
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 2:04:33 pm EDT from 198.202.242.180

I thought Greg said in his "Bad News" post, that as of yet no one from Kingdom Comics of Boom comics had approached him about Gargoyles

That indicated to me that he was probably willing to do Gargoyles for them, but they weren't interested in having Gargoyles in their lexicon.

And knowing Greg, he may approach them about doing Gargoyles...right? I mean, that's how he got hooked up with SLG.

Anywho that's my 2 cents.
Chip - [Sir_Griff723 at yahoo dot com]
"A great many of those who 'debunk' traditional...values have in the background values of their own which they believe to be immune from the debunking process."--C.S. Lewis
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 12:49:50 pm EDT from 72.244.125.101

Like the rest of you, I am not informed on the situation. But, I see no reason why moving the comics to Kingdom wouldn't be a very viable possibility. I hope that Greg will drop by and tell us whether that is a possibility or not, and if it isn't, I hope he tells us why.

Based on what little info we have, I have some thoughts about it. Maybe it's a very good possibility to move the comics to Kingdom, but for some reason, Greg would rather wait for SLG...maybe, as someone else suggested, stricter S&P is a concern if the comics get moved to Kingdom. If this is the case, then I fully support that. I'd rather wait longer for graphic novels from SLG than get watered-down comics immediately from Disney. Or, maybe Greg would prefer to stay with SLG out of loyalty to them. If this is the case, I'd be a little saddened. If we can still get the same story quality (in other words, we don't have to worry about Kingdom having stricter S&P), then I hope the comics get moved to Kingdom...for one we'd probably be getting new stories again relatively soon rather than having to wait a year (after #9 comes out, anyway), and plus I bet the schedule would be less erratic...it'd probably take a lot less time for Disney to approve an in-house comic (simply because it probably wouldn't get pushed to the back-burner so much). And, if the comics had an artist who could get their work in on time, we might could even get them...MONTHLY. But who knows? Maybe publishing the comics through Kingdom isn't even a possibility, for whatever reasons. I hope Greg will drop in and give us a rundown of whether this is something that could happen, and if not, why not. Also, until he mentions something about it, I hope Greg doesn't mind us speculating on this, and why or why not it might happen.
Rebel
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 11:41:38 am EDT from 198.202.242.180

Kingdom Comics> It's certainly a possibility and you're correct to point out that, since Disney seems to own Kingdom Comics, they wouldn't have to split the profits anymore, making the comic a potentially more profitable venture. But (and I am kind of playing devil's advocate here) Kingdom Comics also currently has a very specific mandate. Their job as it stands is to create original graphic novels and producing new material based on Disney's live action films. Neither of those are categories that "Gargoyles" can fit into. It is possible that Kingdom Comics might look at expanding their goals sometime in the future, but I kind of doubt they're going to start looking at publishing comics based on other Disney properties when they haven't even started doing what they originally set out to do. As far as I know, Kingdom Comics had not yet published a comic, announced an upcoming title, or revealed any writers or artists they're bring on board. While Kingdom Comics could end up being a potential new publisher for "Gargoyles," I think it would be a while before we saw any new material if that turned out to be the case.

Also, keep in mind that Disney still seems perfectly willing to spread out its various comics licenses. Not to long after Disney announced the formation of Kingdom Comics, they made a deal for Boom Studios to publish Pixar and Muppets based comics. Aside from what we already know about the financial issues, what may have hurt SLG's Disney deal is how eclectic it was. Gemstone has the classic Disney comics characters, such as Mickey, Donald, and Scrooge. Kingdom Comics had live-action films and original projects for Disney to develop into films. Boom Studios has Pixar and the Muppets. SLG had...an older animated film based on a classic children's book, a cult classic live-action film from the 80s, a much loved Disney theme park ride, and an animated TV shows from the 90s. If Disney is looking at moving its comics licenses around (which I'm not entirely convinced of), I think their goal is less consolidating everything into their own publishing company and more making it so every licensor has a clear piece of the pie. This publisher does classic Disney comics and this other one does comics based on live-action films and that one has Pixar and Muppets licenses and that one over there has animated films and that last one does Disney TV comics.
Demonskrye - [demonskrye(at)gmail(dot)com]
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 10:53:07 am EDT from 146.115.115.33

If Kingdom Comics does decide to do "Gargoyles", I wonder if they'll have more rigid Standards and Practices than Slave Labor Graphics - as in, not allowed to do

* SPOILERS FOLLOW *

a Mutate, despairing of a cure, hanging herself.

* END OF SPOILERS *
Todd Jensen
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 10:27:53 am EDT from 198.209.226.130

Matt > You know, youre right. I remember that that is what everyone thought would happen at first; that Gargoyles would leave SLG and be taken into this new Disney publisher. I put a question into ask Greg for him to answer about what would change if the Gargoyles comic got moved to Disney. But now that idea seems to have been forgotten. Not sure why. Disney wouldnt have to split the profits with SLG if it went to this Kingdom publisher so they would make more money off Gargoyles.

Is this Kingdom publisher up and functioning yet? Maybe the Disney publisher isnt ready yet and its too early to be thinking about titles. But still, you would have thought that Greg Weisman would have mentioned the possibility of Gargoyles being under a Disney comic publisher. Whats up with that?
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 10:05:03 am EDT from 71.206.9.183

I could be wrong here, but isn't it also possible that since Disney is starting up their own comic book branch (Kingdom, I believe), that they would begin to publish Gargoyles directly? Personally, I think that is the best option, and I think Disney would be fools not to publish Gargoyles. I mean, they own the property, are starting their own comic line, known that Gargoyles is successful as a comic book and already has a loyal and built-in fanbase. Why wouldn't they publish it?
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Many a small thing has been made large by the right kind of advertising." -Mark Twain, 'A Connecticult Yankee in King Arthur's Court'
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 9:43:20 am EDT from 70.230.165.27

^_^ Yeah, Demonskrye explained that much better than I did :P
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 9:41:03 am EDT from 71.206.9.183

Brook> For the time being, the comics will end when the "Clan Building" arc and the "Bad Guys" miniseries finish out. Depending on how quickly the remaining material is completed, it may all show up as single issues or some of it may only be available in the TPBs. There is no guarantee at this time that there will be another licensing agreement down the road. I believe that Dan Vado will pursue it if he thinks it's at all financially viable. I don't know if you saw this, but Greg is going to be writing two new comics not related to "Gargoyles" for SLG, so they're obviously getting along well. The trick is going to be finding a way to release the material so that it's sufficiently successful and everyone is making enough money.

Greg has explained that the license is ending because SLG's current licensing fees were not sufficient to justify the expenses on Disney's end and the sales number for the comics did not allow SLG to pay a higher licensing fee and still make a reasonable profit. It's not a case of anyone at Disney saying "We hate 'Gargoyles,' so lets kill the comic." Were that the general feeling about the property, it would have been much easier for Disney not to give SLG the license in the first place. Keep in mind that we would have never had any new "Gargoyles" stories if someone at Disney hadn't told Slave Labor about Greg's desire to revive "Gargoyles" in comic book form.
Demonskrye - [demonskrye(at)gmail(dot)com]
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 9:28:16 am EDT from 146.115.115.33

Brook > As I understand it (and someone please correct me if I am wrong) is that Clan-Building and Bad Guys will be finished (four more comics for Clan-Building and two for Bad Guys, now that Louse is out). In a year, SLG Publishing will talk with Disney again about Gargoyles graphic novels.

So we've got six more comics to enjoy and then a chance for more Gargoyle-goodness in a year. We havnt given up yet!
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 9:18:56 am EDT from 71.206.9.183

Just a quick one:

I just came back here for the first time in weeks, and saw Gregs post about Disney ***** up Gargoyles once more.

Hm. Bummer.

Though, I'm sure this has been discussed - to what extend does this mean we won't get any more Gargoyles?

Does it end after Clan Bulding and Bad Guys, or is it just up to the next sales contract (in a year or what he mentioned) to re-appear?

Thx a lot.
Brook
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 9:02:32 am EDT from 84.191.232.210

Battle Beast> -..- *hug*
Kerry (Kth) Boyd - [Kth-dragon at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 8:36:11 am EDT from 216.57.96.1

Todd> You're right. My mistake.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Many a small thing has been made large by the right kind of advertising." -Mark Twain, 'A Connecticult Yankee in King Arthur's Court'
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 8:06:53 am EDT from 70.230.165.27

BATTLE BEAST - I'm sorry about your dedo's passing.

* SPOILERS *

MATT - I thought that Tashi had been mutated into an armadillo (or armadillo-like being) rather than an aardvark.

* SPOILERS END *
Todd Jensen
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 7:48:32 am EDT from 4.244.208.7

Battle Beast> Sorry to hear that all that has happened to you. My condolences.
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra582 at gmail dot com]
Grr. Arg.
posted @ Thu, Aug 21, 2008 2:43:34 am EDT from 75.42.216.211

Battle Beast> I'm so sorry to hear everything's just piled up on you. I hope things turn around for the better soon.
Asatira
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 10:44:31 pm EDT from 66.191.158.234

!*!*!!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!* SPOILERS !*!*!*!**!*!*!*!*!

My Review For Bad Guys #4, "Louse"...

Well, I just picked up my copy. It was the last copy on the shelf (though the clerk couldn't remember how many copies they got in, so maybe that doesn't mean much). Anyway, on to my review...

I love LOVE the 'Daily Tattler' cover. It is fun, relates to a minor series detail and most of all, it is colorful, which has been one of my main complaints about the Bad Guys covers so far, they've been too drab. So, yeah, very cool.

The content itself is spectacular. The writing is awesome. I love how the Louse theme plays throughout. What is most striking to me about this issue though is how contrasting it is. Dark at times, light at other times... I guess you could say this issue is very black and white... hahaha... But seriously, the light moments and the dark are mixed so well.
Lets start with the lighter moments I loved: Dingo and Matrix's relationship is a lot of fun to watch. I particularly loved Matrix "dumping" Dingo in Times Square and laughed out loud at Matrix as the ball dropping at midnight. Sevarius and Fang are hilarious. It can be hard at times to 'hear' the voices of some characters, but the way Sevarius is written (not to mention the spectacular job Tim Curry did with the character in the TV series) allows me to hear him so well. He is such a ham. I love how the science is fun, the money is better, but his biggest motivation is the drama. Good stuff. Fang is just fun to watch... sometimes. I found myself hating him one moment and laughing at his antics a few frames later. I guess he really puts into perspective that some jokes are funny and some are just so inappropriate. His sheepish "I'm not! I'm really not (worth it)!" and sarcastic "Guess who just made the team?!" are a lot of fun. His (again, and thankfully interrupted) lightbulb joke was so awful it almost makes me sick.
Which leads me to the darker moments. Mere hours before I went to pick up my copy of this issue, I was talking to a coworker about Gargoyles and its continuation in comic form. He is a comic fan himself and liked that the Gargoyles comic allowed the series to gain a darker edge. Of course, I found out after reading the book just how dark it has gotten. Suicide and a near-execution. Yikes. Heavy stuff. Not that I'm complaining. I love that the series is so realistic. Tasha's suicide is just so sad. But I can believe it. I can see what drove her to it. I don't think it was her only option or that she should've done it, I guess I can just sympathize. In many ways, I see Tasha as the Maggie that almost was. Maggie the Cat wanted to be human again, desperately so, but she discovered she probably never would be and it was only through Derek's support that she was able to keep going. Maybe Tasha didn't have anybody. Which makes it all the more tragic and upsetting. Fang sees the tragedy for a moment and then turns it off. Maybe he is using humor as a shield, I don't know, but making a joke like he did at that moment was one of the most despicable things in all of Gargoyles. It really made me hate him a bit. Which is why I can totally understand why someone as honorable as Yama would attack him and even feel like killing him in cold blood. I mean, Yama nearly decapitates Fang. Woah. This whole scene is so powerful and really changed my mindset on something. I used to think that the relationship between Fang and Yama would be this funny, almost brotherly, series of wise-cracks and rebuttals, but they'd always be teammates and perhaps, deep down, even friends. Now I can see that there is some very serious and ugly background here. I don't know if they will ever really get along, cooperate maybe, but friendship? It'd have to really be down the road. And my thoughts of Fang are so altered now too. He used to be a smart-ass, but now I just think he's an asshole, sorry about the language.
Anyway, for good or bad, Dingo and Hunter talk Yama down from executing Fang. We get another "whisper in the ear" moment (damn you, Greg!). I like to think that Hunter reminded Yama of his quest to regain his honor and that killing Fang in cold blood wouldn't be honorable at all. Maybe Yama thought of Sora and proving himself to her, his clan and himself.

Details I liked in "Louse":
- The close comradery between Hunter and Yama. The irony here is so fun and yet so believable. I love that Yama questions Hunter's inaction when attacked by Fang and how he calmly calls her fragile. I love the looks the give each other throughout the issue.
- I found the remark Yama makes about scents to be really interesting. We finally make clear how important the sense of smell is to gargoyles. Yama instantly knows Fang isn't a gargoyle, even though he doesn't look all that different from, say, Leo. Instead he reeks of fish, humanity and ozone, due to his genetic make-up and abilities. Good stuff. Very interesting.
- I like how Sevarius mentions the name Robyn Correy. A name I didn't expect to hear again much, but a nod toward the two meeting before.
- The new mutates are interesting. I wonder who this client is that wants an army of armored mutates? Story for another day, I suppose. Meanwhile, we get an aardvark, woodlouse, turtle and crocodile (the shape and tooth placement of Thug's snout leads me to think Sevarius used croc rather than alligator DNA) mutates. Glad the survivors are off to the Labyrinth. It'll be fun to watch what they do down the road.
- Happy to see the term "Gargate" finally used in the series and I can't blame Sevarius for wondering what would happen to a human mutated with gargate DNA and vice versa, not that I think it is a good idea to experiment, but can't help but be curious. It was neat to see Sevarius putting the cell samples he extracted from Angela in "Monsters" to use. And threatening to inject Hunter with garg DNA is one way to really piss her off apparently, not that I'm surprised.
- Dingo/Matrix's short circuits were really funny.
- Hunter's radio briefing with the mysterious "Sir" is cool too. I like how she knows that Fang isn't a good fit, probably in part because the animosity between him and Yama. I also really like how Dingo questions WHO isn't a good fit. Himself? Thug? I like that Dingo thought Thug might be joining up. Instead it is Fang, to Dingo's surprise and Yama's fury. I gotta say though that we are (for the moment) missing a scene here. I hope down the road we get to see Hunter offering the carrot and stick to Fang. I can hear him now... "Oh, maaaan!"

Awesome issue. Bad Guys continues to pull my emotions every-which way and keeps me desperate for more. Can't wait for #5!

!*!*!*!* END SPOILERS*!**!*!**!!
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Many a small thing has been made large by the right kind of advertising." -Mark Twain, 'A Connecticult Yankee in King Arthur's Court'
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 8:52:57 pm EDT from 70.230.165.27

Just briskly skimming through the CR... I have class in 15 minutes...

Hmm... No money for BG #4 yet... The wait for me to pick up a copy is going to be horrible...

Battle Beast >> Have a cookie... (>^^)>O

Ooo... Spoilers... So tempting to read... Must avoid... (>**)>

Off to class...
The One Known As Mochi - [shogi dot keima dot 08 at gmail dot com]
Current: (>X_X)> In so much pain...
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 8:50:44 pm EDT from 67.101.237.11

Battle Beast> My sympathies on your various troubles, most especially the passing of your great-grandfather. 111 years is certainly a very long life, but I doubt it means you miss him any less. My best to you and your family.
Demonskrye - [demonskrye(at)gmail(dot)com]
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 8:40:20 pm EDT from 146.115.115.33

Battle Beast - My Condolences for your loss.

I can relate to the problems piling up though - I've one parent in long term care with Alzheimer's and a broken arm that isn't healing due to severe osteoporosis. My Father arrived home from a trip about 3 weeks ago visiting his 2 terminally ill brothers, and he himself ends up in the hospital. He's loaded with health issues and may end up in long term care...and/or may land up back at home with some limited home care(which would leave me to care for him the rest of the time). To top off the mess, just went 3 1/2 weeks without a fridge(think they might have finally fixed it-it's not even 3 years old et).
Life can throw wrenches at you - guess you just gotta hope all your bolts & nuts are tight enough to survive it. *leaves hugs*
Wingless
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 8:04:21 pm EDT from 99.245.254.123

Battle Beast> Well now my problems seem small by comparison. Humble pie. Keep holding on, man.
Chip - [Sir_Griff723 at yahoo dot com]
"A great many of those who 'debunk' traditional...values have in the background values of their own which they believe to be immune from the debunking process."--C.S. Lewis
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 7:39:48 pm EDT from 68.164.5.252

My car blew up on my holiday two weeks ago... it is stuck in another city being fixed. Not my new Beetle, but my other car. :(

I was let go from my job today. :(

My Dedo (Great Grandfather) had a stroke and passed away yesterday at the age of 111. (!) :(

My Computer died yesterday, too. Its motherboard went yersterday, and I have to send it in for repairs.

What next???

But I am happy BG is out... I am going to get it ASAP.

Sorry to lay all this down, but I'm really choked right now. It's a bad time... Thanks for listening. :)
Battle Beast - [CANADA]
That is all I will say.
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 7:36:30 pm EDT from 198.161.203.6

* BAD GUYS SPOILERS *

I'd like to thank Greg for the birthday present - I was delighted that this issue came out on my birthday.

My suspicions were proven right: Sevarius *was* planning to mutate the crowd at Times Square. (And trust Brendan and Margot to be there.) And with his usual over-the-top style (I especially liked the part where Fang complains about Sevarius insisting on the virus being released at exactly midnight).

And his mutating has definitely gotten darker than in "Metamorphosis" (which was dark enough, to begin with): two of his victims are children (Greg's children, at that), and one of the grown-up victims hangs herself! (I liked the touch of Benny responding to Tasha's suicide by curling up into a ball. And the argument between Benny and Erin, with Sevarius's own comment.)

I was glad to see one of my favorite moments from the leica reel: Fang shouting "You're welcome!" at Yama.

I'd almost forgotten that Sevarius and Robyn had met in "Hunter's Moon Part Two" - but I see that Sevarius hadn't.

So Thailog might be the client whom Sevarius was talking about? That certainly makes sense.

I thought when I read the the issue that the DNA from Angela had come from "Monsters" (back when Sevarius took samples from her and thus found out that Goliath was her biological father); now some of the remarks here have suggested that it came from the Double Date Halloween battle in #5. I wonder which it is.

Dingo's apparent memory lapse every time he got zapped by Fang startled me.

I liked Matrix's way of preventing the virus from being released, and Dingo's response to it. (And Dingo's indignant comment after rescuing Robyn and Yama - shades of Fang's own remark to Yama at the start of the issue.)

Trust Fang to be so insensitive about Tashi's fate. No wonder Yama almost cuts him in half. (Another nice touch: Fang's frantic "I'm not! I'm really not!")

And, except for the still-off-stage Director (and perhaps Matrix, whose response we don't get), nobody in the Redemption Squad is keen on Fang being the new member. Can't say I blame them; the guy's an obnoxious, cowardly loudmouth - and those are his good points!

I'm looking forward to finding out more about this figure from Dingo's past mentioned in the teaser - I hope (for reasons that I've given before) that his name will be Falstaff.

Again, a fine issue, and I'm glad it came out on my birthday.

* SPOILERS END *
Todd Jensen
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 7:28:52 pm EDT from 4.244.209.109

*** BIG BAD SPOILERS ***

Another great issue of "Bad Guys," it ups the ante even more from the last issue. Action packed, and a villain you want to see get beaten up. And great to see Karine Charlebois return after her absence last issue.

Sevarius is, as he's always been, a hammy bastard. But, what a hammy bastard. He destroys peoples' lives, and he has fun while doing it.

The new mutates, I didn't think it was possible, but this is even worse than the first four Mutates. Two of them are just children. Now, they're almost literally insects. It is very strongly implied that this is all being done on Thailog's behalf, which probably makes the clone the perfect employer for Sevarius. Yes, you could really feel Hunter's rage here.

And, when Tasha hung herself... damn. This is an advantage to not having the series on television. Wow.

The scheme to mutate the people at Times Square was just, well, if this is indeed Thailog behind it, he's really stepping up his game. Those poor tourists, because only tourists go to New Year's Eve in Times Square, us natives are at private parties getting plastered (I guess no one invited Brendan and Margot to a party).

We also get more hints as to what Thailog is planning with the DNA he stole from the gargoyles in #5 of the main book. It's not exactly what we thought it was, and knowing Greg, should that surprise us? He keeps throwing us more and more curve balls.

The action was intense, the story was good. It was fun seeing Fang announced as their newest recruit... and everyone looks so happy about it. #3 of "Bad Guys" alluded to Hunter having a superior that she reports to. #4 finally confirmed it. If it was her call, I doubt Fang would be on board.

Now that the team is together, I hope that in #5, ten years after seeing the "Bad Guys" leica reel for the first time, we finally find out what is on that island being protected by those giant robots.

A little comment, of course. I could easily hear Tim Curry and Jim Belushi's voices in my head as I read Fang and Sevarius. Those two are just so over the top, this dialogue is just natural for them. I loved it.

And, cameos, cameos, cameos.

Erin and Benny... Greg mutated his two kids. Cute. ;)

Quite a few at Times Square. Long time fans:
Jennifer L. Anderson... she's the one laughing, and the guy looking back with the "God woman, what is that noise" look amuses me. Funny if you've ever heard her laugh. ;)
Stephanie Lostimolo, the former cover colorist (and colorist for #5 of "Gargoyles") giving Eric "Gorebash" Tribou of Station Eight a noogie. Yup, witnessed that in person too.
Cindy Kinnard making her second cameo in the series, she briefly appeared in #5 at Xanatos's party.
Seth Jackson all the way on the right.

None of them native New Yorkers, because, as I said, only tourists go to Times Square for New Years. Come on people, why? You're not allowed to bring booze, and you'll be freezing your butts off for hours on end. Oh, and you never know when some creepy Rocky Horror Picture Show fan and his Furry thug of a buddy might decide to drop a virus on you!

Great issue, I loved it.

*** END SPOILERS ***
Greg Bishansky - [<---- The Twelfth Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"Oh Lord, please help our athletes bring home the gold. Enough gold so we can melt it down and buy back our economy from the Chinese."
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 4:01:44 pm EDT from 75.56.245.4

Just ordered my 3 copies from midtown comics. Gotta wait for them *sigh* but at least it's out. Woo!
Wingless
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 3:29:16 pm EDT from 99.245.254.123

I would try and make friends with my comic book store except that, whenever a Gargoyles comic has been released, Im away at college and there is no comic book store in my college's town. So its been easier for me to just order off the SLG website. Since Im going to back to college next week, thats why I have to wait and order so I can be sure Im on campus when it reaches my mail box.

Im bad with spoilers. I always read them and then want to know more! Thats why Im going crazy because your spoilers have wet my palette and now I want the comic in hand. ^_^
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 3:20:31 pm EDT from 71.206.9.183

Before Gargoyles #1 came out, I went to my local comic shop and asked them to make sure to order Gargoyles. (They assured me that they already intended to) and made sure that they would place two on my Pull-Hold. It was the first time I started going there in earnest since the Pokemon Card Game craze. (Which I am ashamed to say I was a part of...I've grown since then)

I befriended the managers and some of the senior staff (For a while they called me the "Gargoyles Guy") The stuff sold quite well in their store (and I had assured them that it was worthwhile to order quite a few.) Their sales didn't drop as much as other shops...so they still carry quite a few copies of every issue (except Bad Guys #2, they still can't figure out why they never got those.)

I did the same thing when Greg announced Bad Guys. Made sure that they were ordering it. Since then I've added a few more things to my Pull-hold and invested quite a bit of my personal money in the shop. Basically...I buttered them up.

(: That's why they're Spoilers silly if you don't wanna know...don't read 'em :)
Chip - [Sir_Griff723 at yahoo dot com]
"A great many of those who 'debunk' traditional...values have in the background values of their own which they believe to be immune from the debunking process."--C.S. Lewis
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 3:00:37 pm EDT from 72.244.125.229

Chip > You tease me with spoilers, you meanie! :P

I tried my local comic store around Christmas (looking for Gargoyles for myself and Buffy for my mom) but they didnt carry any Gargoyles. Maybe Ill stop in tomorrow just to double check. Maybe Ill get lucky *crosses fingers*
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 2:48:01 pm EDT from 71.206.9.183

Litwolf> I go to my local comic shop at 11:00 on the day any "Gargoyles" come out. (With the exception of "The Rock" and "The Lost", due to extenuating circumstances) I always have two copies on my Pull-Hold list. Since it came out today...I went there today. While I was happy to see my review in "Wanted: Posters" this was very, very dark. I'm surprised that Greg got away with as much as he did in this issue. I mean...Disney approved this? WOW!
Chip - [Sir_Griff723 at yahoo dot com]
"A great many of those who 'debunk' traditional...values have in the background values of their own which they believe to be immune from the debunking process."--C.S. Lewis
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 2:37:31 pm EDT from 72.244.125.229

How'd you get BG #4 so fast, Chip?! Your description describes it as very dark (which Im not too surprised about since its Bad Guys; I thought that this spinoff would get into some heavy stuff). Now Im all the more curious to read it! And I wont get to even order it til next Monday! *stomps around, very frustrated*
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 2:28:33 pm EDT from 71.206.9.183

***SPOILERS FOR GARGOYLES: BAD GUYS #4; LOUSE***
Wow...

This issue was really heavy. I knew Sevarius was slime...but now I believe that he is an evil man. I really kinda wish Yama could have shown him the business end of his Katana.

The man is twisted...really twisted. And I have to wonder...who is the client who asked about an army of mutates? Thailog? Demona? Xanatos? Taro? Or someone we haven't seen yet.

Robyn's prejudice (Which I've suspected/noted before) shows through when Sevarius threatens her with gargoyle mutation...and it hints at what Thailog has in store for those 8 DNA samples. Also, Yama notes her prejudice with an...unreadable expression.

God, I feel for those four mutates...especially Benny and Erin; I don't think the gravity of what has happened to them has hit them yet. (Of course Greg keeps it light-hearted by having his own kids be the mutates.)

Robyn is as infuriated with Anton as I was...and rightly so. Still, Dingo and Matrix show up before the worst happens...but were clearly to preoccupied to notice that Sevarius had goaded them into putting him in the cell.

That Terry...always noticing the flying anthropomorphic creatures...I do believe he may fall for one one day.

Fang's lightning attacks have a very...unusual effect on Dingo, due--I presume--to his linkage with Matrix. It was funny to see Dingo smack his face on the wall.

And then came the heavy part...poor Tasha...poor Benny and Erin. God...it's what Maggie would have done if Talon hadn't been there for her.

And Fang has no tact...what the hell was he thinking? Frankly...I'm with Yama...take his head off. But unlike when Titania whispered in Fox's ear, or when Angela whispered in Broadway's...I have a pretty good idea what Robyn said to Yama.

Something along the lines of "Everyone deserves to get a second chance...if you deprive him of that, how will you restore you honor?" only, put more eloquently.

Speaking of which, Dingo overhears Robyn's comminque to the Director...but doesn't really get time to chew on it before the newest member of the Squad joins them...and Yama looks absolutely thrilled.

***END SPOILERS***

I found this issue somewhat depressing, and I haven't had the greatest latest few weeks. My girlfriend of two years breaks up with me, we get the sour news on Gargoyles comic...and and to top it off, I get in a very nasty fight with my dad. And the darker tone of this issue...really took a toll on me emotionally. Don't get me wrong, It was still very cool and very well written...but now I see why the Redemption Squad gets the "grittier" jobs. This is a very different show than the main title.

The silver lining to my dark and gloomy cloud. Check out the "Wanted: Posters". Not much of a silver lining I suppose...but not to shabby either.
Chip - [Sir_Griff723 at yahoo dot com]
"A great many of those who 'debunk' traditional...values have in the background values of their own which they believe to be immune from the debunking process."--C.S. Lewis
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 1:38:34 pm EDT from 72.244.125.229

Quick question: BG #4 is out today and Gargoyles #9 is supposed to be out by the end of August, right? Do we have a date for #10, the start of Brooklyn's Timedancing saga? I know we've said that the release dates will probably be far apart to allow for a drawng out ending so I dont imagine that we'll see it out til Sept at the earliest but do we have a release date yet?
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 1:05:18 pm EDT from 71.206.9.183

1 quick phrase about bg issue #4: awesome and more than well worth the wait
dph_of_rules
Whatever happened to simplicity?
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 12:53:42 pm EDT from 98.20.171.252

Phil > As much as I love the idea of getting a glimpse of the new and improved Manhattan Clan, I believe I remember hearing somewhere that the Labyrinth Clan wouldnt even make an apperance so I dont think the Manhattan Clan would be there. Also, one of the things I like about Bad Guys is that it gives us a break from the main characters and the main plot of the series. With that being one of its strong points, I think Goliath's Clan will be avoided.

I see Hunter and Yama battling Fang, losing, and then Dingo and Matrix coming in and getting the situation under control. Im very curious to see how theyll bring Fang into the Redemption Squad, seeing as how he ditched the team against these giant robots in volume two. Whatever they bribed him with must not have been a big purssuasion.
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 11:53:55 am EDT from 71.206.9.183

So last night I re-read Bad Guys #1-3 in preparation for picking up #4 "Louse". Something occurred to me, and I don't know why I didn't think of it before. The Redemption Squad is in Manhattan. What are the chances of a guest appearance by the Manhattan Clan, or at least a couple of them on patrol? If Sevarius's New Year's Eve plans are high profile, Goliath and company almost have to show up. But maybe our favorite mad scientist is keeping it low key for a change.

Another related thought. The blurb on the letters page of Bad Buys #3 advertises Gargoyles #10 "The Gate". Apparently when it was printed, Greg thought we'd be farther along in the main title. This makes we wonder what the Manhattan Clan looks like by New Year's Eve. Is Katana there yet? Coco and Amp maybe? Questions like this make me almost sure that if Hunter and Company encounter Manhattan gargoyles, it will not be the whole clan but only a small patrol (my guess is Lex, Broadway, and Angela).
Phil - [p1anderson at go dot com]
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 10:05:11 am EDT from 134.215.196.82

Demonskrye> Fair Enough. And it's not like the two subjects are completely unrelated...Greg hinted at the Gathering that issue 4 of BG hints at what Thailog's up too with the Clan's DNA samples...bum-bum-BUM!
Chip - [Sir_Griff723 at yahoo dot com]
"A great many of those who 'debunk' traditional...values have in the background values of their own which they believe to be immune from the debunking process."--C.S. Lewis
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 9:12:05 am EDT from 72.244.125.229

D. Taina> Thailog meeting his end through some other means is certainly a possibility, but I'd hesitate to think that Brentwood will not kill Thailog simply because Future Tense Lexington didn't kill Future Tense Xanatos. Like I said, I'm fairly resistant to looking at the clones as being completely analogous to the Future Tense version of the main cast, one because the isn't enough of "Future Tense" to completely base the clones' lives on and two because that's boring. Maybe Burbank will end up killing Thailog, or maybe Burbank will die fighting robot Coyote. Maybe Brentwood will end up as a cyborg, and maybe Hollywoodd will be blinded somehow. I don't know. I would guess that the timing and nature of the clones' eventual deaths will not be related to how characters died in "Future Tense," but I couldn't swear that it won't be the case.

The reasons I like the idea of Brentwood killing Thailog are that it's a nice echo of Thailog's own relationship to Xanatos and it gives Brentwood instant villain cred. Plus, even though the comic is somewhat more permissive than the TV show was, I doubt any of our protagonists would be allowed to kill Thailog themselves, so it's a good way to thin out the rogue's gallery and give Brentwood a chance to shine. But again, I can't be certain that this will happen, and if it does, I'm thinking it will be many years down the road. Brentwood is still a young clone and, due to his initial programming, may take longer to learnt he ways of the world than Thailog did. And of course, Thailog needs to have the opportunity to be a major foe in his own right, or Brentwood killing him won't mean anything. Thailog stabs Goliath in the gut because he thinks it's amusing. Imagine what his serious plans are like.

Chip> I think the Comment Room can handle more than one conversation at a time. And while I understand your desire to get the conversation about BG #4 going, I wouldn't worry about it. People who get the comic right away are unlikely to hesitate to talk about it whether we have other conversations going or not. And since I'm probably not going to be able to get the new issue until Friday at the earliest, I'd be happy if I could still come in here and discuss other things.
Demonskrye - [demonskrye(at)gmail(dot)com]
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 9:07:04 am EDT from 146.115.115.33

It is may opinion that we should drop the subject of Thailog's impending death (at least for now, though it really is a fascinating subject...you know it's amazing that with only 11 comic issues Greg has gotten us buzzing about so many diverse topics) and clear the CR of subjects for the impending Louse soon to come into our midst.
Chip - [Sir_Griff723 at yahoo dot com]
"A great many of those who 'debunk' traditional...values have in the background values of their own which they believe to be immune from the debunking process."--C.S. Lewis
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 8:45:11 am EDT from 72.244.125.229

Happy birthday, Todd.

Maybe Brentwood might be Thailog's Tartantulus, eventually.
dph_of_rules
Whatever happened to simplicity?
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 8:17:53 am EDT from 98.20.171.252

D. Taina> So, by that theorem, Thailog, at some point years in the future, would be killed by Burbank.

Or maybe by Hudson himself, but I'm leaning more towards Burbank.
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra582 at gmail dot com]
Grr. Arg.
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 3:38:00 am EDT from 75.42.216.211

If "Future Tense" Lexington is really Brentwood and "Future Tense" Xanatos is really Thailog, then I don't think Brentwood will be responsible for the latter's death. If you remember, Xanatos died in a battle with Hudson and Lexington just kept his memory alive. Maybe Thailog will die by some other means, and Brentwood will keep his memory alive just to "run the show unmolested." He may even move back into the Labyrinth, for all we know. I think Thailog will live for many, many years.
D. Taina
"The story is told -- though who can say if it be true..." -Shari
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 3:23:47 am EDT from 206.248.112.51

Happy birthday, Todd!
Spen
"Come along. You belong. Feel the fizz."
posted @ Wed, Aug 20, 2008 12:35:56 am EDT from 66.43.205.110

****Lightning strikes the ground. A very crispy Blaise now stands in the charred spot.**** I only have time for a few quick notes.

FIRST OF ALL> Happy Birthday, Karine!

THAILOG AND BRENTWOOD> For some strange reason, I find myself resistant to the idea of Brentwood overthrowing Thailog. Maybe I just like Thailog too much and would rather have him die in battle with Goliath, or something similar, rather than be unceremoniously bumped off by Brentwood.
Instead, I find myself thinking of Brentwood as less the "Starscream" to Thailog's "Megatron" and more like the "Sauron" to his "Morgoth" (and with those references, I have firmly established myself as a nerd). What I mean is, maybe he'll be the loyal servant who survives his master's fall and rises up to take his place (and perhaps gain even greater notoriety than his former lord). Or not--I was wrong about the "Double Date" story, after all.

Until next time, farewell. ****Blaise dusts himself off, and calmly walks out through the door.****
Blaise
posted @ Tue, Aug 19, 2008 10:40:26 pm EDT from 206.170.104.36

Brentwood and Thailog > Im with Todd. While its an interesting and even plausible that Brentwood could do away with Thailog, I dont think he's at that level yet. Brentwood is still young, right? How old are the clones? Like not more than a year? I think he would wait a bit to see what other use he can squeeze out of Thailog before doing away with the older clone.
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Tue, Aug 19, 2008 9:27:35 pm EDT from 71.206.9.183

Todd Jensen:<I think we can assume that in Greg's plans, Thailog will be around for a long time.>

Or it could mean that Brentwood kills Thailog and keeps his memory alive, so no one actually knows he is really running the show. Who knows Brentwood might even decide to move back in with the other clones just to throw suspicion off him and keep Thailog in the limelight.
Vinnie - [tpeano29 at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Tue, Aug 19, 2008 4:07:02 pm EDT from 69.54.209.22

Sorry for the double post, but the last post was mine - I was typing from a library computer and had forgotten to fill in my name and color.
Todd Jensen
posted @ Tue, Aug 19, 2008 10:06:39 am EDT from 198.209.226.130

Thanks, Matt. I'd forgotten about Mace.
Anonymous
posted @ Tue, Aug 19, 2008 10:05:48 am EDT from 198.209.226.130

Todd> Definitely. I'm envisioning Brentwood turning on his former master years down the road. We know that Greg has Thailog in the role of "the big bad" for the time being and it's only going to be a real shock if we think Brentwood is nothing but Thailog's faithful lackey for a pretty long time.
Demonskrye - [demonskrye(at)gmail(dot)com]
posted @ Tue, Aug 19, 2008 8:52:37 am EDT from 146.115.115.33

I think Thailog will be around for some time as well.

And don't forget Mace Malone. He's dead now too.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Many a small thing has been made large by the right kind of advertising." -Mark Twain, 'A Connecticult Yankee in King Arthur's Court'
posted @ Tue, Aug 19, 2008 8:13:29 am EDT from 70.230.165.27

I doubt that Greg would be in that much of a hurry to kill off Thailog (even though Brentwood betraying him would be fun to see). So far, the only recurring antagonists whom he's killed off were the Archmage, Hakon, and most of the initial Xanatos Goon Squad (except for Bruno - but including, I suppose, the female blonde member). We know that he definitely wasn't keen on the Goliath Chronicles having Thailog die - and not just because it was somebody else doing it.

I think we can assume that in Greg's plans, Thailog will be around for a long time.
Todd Jensen
posted @ Tue, Aug 19, 2008 7:44:58 am EDT from 4.244.212.34

Matt> Your comments on how Brentwood might end up betraying Thailog gave me a really nasty creativity demon. What if, in preparation for creating his army of Thailog shock troops, Brentwood decides to test out the mind controlling technology he plans to use on them on Thailog himself? It'd be an even more complete role reversal, as Thailog would be reduced to one of an army of clones unable to do anything but "obey Brentwood."

Justin> It's an interesting concept, but not one that I think would fit into the "Gargoyles" universe. The nature of time travel in "Gargoyles" and comments Greg has made seem to suggest that there are no alternate futures, that all of time is fixed, both past and future.

Charisma> Unless there is a holiday during the week, new comics always come out on Wednesday.
Demonskrye - [demonskrye(at)gmail(dot)com]
posted @ Tue, Aug 19, 2008 7:38:02 am EDT from 146.115.115.33

Charisma : It comes out on the 20th.
Spen
"Come along. You belong. Feel the fizz."
posted @ Tue, Aug 19, 2008 3:25:43 am EDT from 66.43.205.110

I can't seem to find the exact date Bad Guys #4 is coming out, but anywhere near the 21st (my 21st b-day) is fine with me. But, wow, there's so many birthdays around here already. It seems like this is the most b-day wishing i've seen in here before. So happy b-day to all you lucky August birthday people out there.
Charisma82
"It is better to have a horrible ending than to have horrors without end."
posted @ Tue, Aug 19, 2008 2:48:20 am EDT from 64.13.117.74

The other day people were discussing "Future Tense" and brought up an subject I thought might prove interesting. The discussion was weather Puck, The Third Race or any character for that matter, in Gregs universe, could actually see the future.
Having read the first two Dune books, I wanted to bring up an idea presented in the series: prescience. The main character from the book, Paul Atreides, had the ability to see into every possible future. To see and thus control the future. For instance, plots against him always failed because he had already seen them in his visions.

Its ecentially perfect power. You could see a future where you won the lottery, or became president. Thus you knew how to make it happen.
But the twist in the book was, as they put it, "to know the future is to be trapped by it" Once Paul saw a future it had to play out exactally the way he saw it.
For instance, he and his lover Chani had been trying to concive a child for twelve years. But in every future Chani died shortly after childbirth.

In other words, the future was a trap. It was described as a life with no suprises.

I just thought it might make an interesting point of discussion here. And how it might work in Gregs universe.
Justin "Id Rather Be Pillaging"
"The mother of chaos was born in the sea.....but lies locked within the roots of the great tree"-from upcomming tale of mine
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 10:31:24 pm EDT from 98.227.89.128

Happy birthday, Karine!
Spen
"Come along. You belong. Feel the fizz."
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 9:59:34 pm EDT from 66.43.205.110

Happy Birthday Greg and Karine!
Purplegoldfish
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 8:01:39 pm EDT from 64.148.57.72

Very Happy Birthday to Karine and Greg B!

I'd love to see Brentwood kill Thailog and take over. I've got mixed feelings about Thailog. While I can see objectively his strengths as a villain -- his 'bastard' complex, his Xanatosian style, his being perfectly matched to Goliath -- I don't find him as intrinsically interesting as many of the other antagonists. A big part of this is that he basically seems more a comment on Xanatos -- he became the monster to Xanatos's spec. Brentwood though would surpass his programming by far and it would be interesting to see where he ends up. My only worry is -- we've guessed it. In fact, it seems so obvious that I'm assuming there's a good chance Greg will zig where we think he's going to zag.

Matt: Nice one on the bike ride!
Ed
"Case in point, 'Lord of the Rings.' Little Peter Jackson comes from New Zealand, says to me, 'Sir Ian, I want you to be Gandalf the Wizard.' And I say to him, 'You are aware that I'm not really a wizard.'... And he said, 'yes I am aware of that. What I want you to do is to use your acting skills to portray the wizard for the duration of the film.' -- Sir Ian McKellen, 'Extras'
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 6:55:52 pm EDT from 213.187.39.61

Another happy birthday to Greg B, Karine and anybody else whose gt a B-day in their near future.
Algernon
"Mary had a little lamb, It's fleece was white as snow and everywhere that Mary went THERE WAS A SCARY GUY CALLED HITLER!" -from the prophecies of Nostradamus.
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 6:51:01 pm EDT from 83.71.96.38

Jack Pumpkinhead> If I understand correctly, SLG will still retain the right to republish existing material. "Bad Guys" should be coming out in trade, as will the second half of "Clan Building," and Volume One of "Clan Building" should continue to be available. That being said, SLG might not go back to print on any of this stuff if they don't think it will make them enough money, so it may be worth your while to track down at least the first TPB now in case it doesn't get reprinted and becomes hard to find.
Demonskrye - [demonskrye(at)gmail(dot)com]
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 6:30:49 pm EDT from 146.115.115.33

Happy Birthday Greg and Karine
Chip - [Sir_Griff723 at yahoo dot com]
"A great many of those who 'debunk' traditional...values have in the background values of their own which they believe to be immune from the debunking process."--C.S. Lewis
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 6:21:16 pm EDT from 69.3.221.28

Question; seeing as the license wont be renewed, should I hurry up and order Bad Guys #2 (which I never got) and the 1st TPB off of SLgs webite as soon as possible?
Jack-Pumpkinhead - [jtjgundam at hotmail dot com]
'Lord what fools these mortals be."
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 5:33:13 pm EDT from 150.201.67.211

According to Diamond, Bad Guys #4 will be out this week, making a nice birthday present for a few people around here. I'm hoping #9 shows up in time for my September birthday.
Demonskrye - [demonskrye(at)gmail(dot)com]
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 5:01:50 pm EDT from 146.115.115.33

Happy birthday, Karine!
Asatira
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 3:47:58 pm EDT from 66.191.158.234

Happy Birthday to Greg B and to Karine Charlebois
Antiyonder - [antiyonder at yahoo dot com]
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 3:41:20 pm EDT from 71.120.226.102

Happy Birthday GregX
VickyUK - [Vickyfanofwwe at aol dot com]
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 3:34:08 pm EDT from 205.188.117.134

Thanks everybody. But I'd like to say Happy Birthday to Karine Charlebois as well.

::Rolls out a cake with Hunter's face on it::

You rock, Karine!
Greg Bishansky - [<---- The Twelfth Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles]
"Oh Lord, please help our athletes bring home the gold. Enough gold so we can melt it down and buy back our economy from the Chinese."
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 3:30:47 pm EDT from 75.56.245.4

****A little greeting-card appears on the banquet table. It opens up, and spits out Blaise.****

Add my voice to the others saying "Happy Birthday Greg B.!"

****Blaise dives back into the greeting card. The card then spits out some snacks and party favors.****
Blaise
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 2:29:34 pm EDT from 206.170.104.36

Let me join in on the birthday wishes -- happy birthday, GXB.

(Drops off Cake and Ice Cream)
Phoenician
"The Suspense is Terrible . . . I Hope it Lasts" -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 2:17:08 pm EDT from 70.162.223.238

Happy birthday, Greg B.
Asatira
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 11:14:39 am EDT from 66.191.158.234

Happy birthday Greg B!
Algernon
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 9:45:42 am EDT from 213.94.150.119

HB GB! Not HP! Gorebash, I need an edit button or delete button! :)
The Gargoyles Pulse
~ Anthony Tini
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 9:17:18 am EDT from 159.240.11.254

14th. HP GB! Hope it's a good one!

Also, hope we get some #4 this week! Would be nice!
The Gargoyles Pulse
~ Anthony Tini
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 9:16:11 am EDT from 159.240.11.254

Happy birthday, Bishansky.
Todd Jensen
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 7:32:52 am EDT from 4.244.213.149

And away we go on with the show!
Vinnie - [tpeano29 at hotmail dot com]
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 6:06:11 am EDT from 69.54.209.20

Lucky number 11th... I wake up early due to a nightmare and still don't make it here in time for the top ten. I hope that bodes well for this week in Gargoyles.

And Happy Birthday Greg B.
Matt - [St Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Many a small thing has been made large by the right kind of advertising." -Mark Twain, 'A Connecticult Yankee in King Arthur's Court'
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 5:31:30 am EDT from 70.230.165.27

10th in the name of Bad Guys #4: Louse
Chip - [Sir_Griff723 at yahoo dot com]
"A great many of those who 'debunk' traditional...values have in the background values of their own which they believe to be immune from the debunking process."--C.S. Lewis
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 4:38:25 am EDT from 69.3.223.3

9th.

And happy birthday.
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra582 at gmail dot com]
Grr. Arg.
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 2:14:09 am EDT from 75.42.216.211

8th!! Happy birthday GXB!!
dph_of_rules
Whatever happened to simplicity?
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 1:55:47 am EDT from 98.20.171.252

Seventh! @_@
Lynati
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 1:18:27 am EDT from 71.185.86.98

Sixth! Happy birthday, Greg B.!
Spen
"Come along. You belong. Feel the fizz."
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 12:53:29 am EDT from 66.43.205.110

Fifth. I hear you, Litwolf.

*hack*
bluewyvern
"Attend the petty jealousies and angers that prey upon your heart."
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 12:46:53 am EDT from 69.112.108.43

Fourth - Ugh, stuffy nose makes sleep difficult. I hate being sick!
Litwolf
<Be happy for me and for all who fly free.> - Tobias of Animorphs
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 12:32:17 am EDT from 71.206.9.183

Third~!!
The One Known As Mochi - [shogi dot keima dot 08 at gmail dot com]
Current Mood: (>T.T)> Tired...
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 12:26:49 am EDT from 72.199.216.234

Second!
Phoenician
"The Suspense is Terrible . . . I Hope it Lasts" -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 12:23:26 am EDT from 70.162.223.238

First~I think
Wingless
posted @ Mon, Aug 18, 2008 12:00:06 am EDT from 99.245.254.123