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The Phoenix Gate

Comment Room Archive

Comments for the week ending June 15, 2009

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Siren> You're welcome. It's a nice piece of work, and I showed several friends as well. They all loved it. ^..^
Kerry (Kth) Boyd

Thanks Kerry! I am glad you enjoyed it :)

Rain > There are other hotels around, but staying at many of them will mean needing transportation. The only other hotel within walking distance is the Sheraton where the con was held in 2001, and their rates are going to be similar to the Hilton. Google maps shows a Holiday Inn Express about 1.0 mile south along CA-101, a Best Western 2.5 miles away in Burbank, and many other hotels within about a 20-minute commute. Your husband may discover, though, that the cost of a car rental negates any savings on the room rate. Good luck, and we hope you can make it. :)

69 days left until The 13th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles in Los Angeles, California!

Patrick - [<-- Gathering 2009]
"Sixty-nine!" - Bill & Ted's Excellent Adventure

Greetings all. I want to attend this summer's gathering (it'll be my 4th) but the room rates at the chosen hotel are too much for my husband (who is not a fan of the show and is just coming along to humor me) I to afford without getting a few roommates. My husband does not want to share the room and is quite steadfast on that; needless to say it puts me in a tough spot. I need to locate cheaper lodging as close to the con as possible. I looked online but didn't find much. Anyone know of a close motel or the like? Thanks!
Rain - [Purplesquirrel27 at aol dot com]

Since Spider-Man 3 has been discussed here, I thought I'd share this: http://thatguywiththeglasses.com/videolinks/thatguywiththeglasses/5-second-movies/8176-spid3

It's Spider-Man 3 in 5 seconds (though it's a bit longer).


Oh, wow. Thanks for the video link; it's awesomely funny. ^..^
Kerry (Kth) Boyd

I know this is OT but I remember the days when S8 had a section dedicated to Flight of Dragons (I miss it) and I got my hands on a pretty good DVD bootleg of it a year ago and started making some videos of it. I know a few of you "old timers" here may appreciate it. :) I hope Gorebash approves...he stars in it :D

Dungeons and Dragons: Satan's Game?


Fang's design looked fine to me in all the episodes, except "Metamorphosis". I wish he looked more like himself on that cover.

I don't like much artistic license/interpretation in a property that is already well established, with established character designs and art style. Added detail is fine, but keep the comic book covers and panels looking more-or-less like what we saw on the show.


I get the sense that Greg Guler still isn't 100% satisfied with his design for Fang. Most of the other mutates seemed to be pretty settled into their final designs and distinctive in their appearances by "Kingdom." Fang just struck me as a little shaggy, not quite as well defined, and a bit of a headache for the animators. His look in "Kingdom" is very different from his look on the "Louse" cover and even that seems slightly different from how he looks on the trade cover.

Looking at the cover art again, I do agree that Yama is a bit taller and bulkier than I think of him being and look kind of like a drawing of Goliath that was reworked into Yama after the fact. It's certainly not a dealkiller and I like the cover overall, but it does seem a little off to me.

Demonskrye - [demonskrye(at)gmail(dot)com]

Don't get me wrong, I still love the cover-the aspect that I do like about it is the more detail to the characters-and that they're a tad more "bulky" -and I mean that in a good way ^_^. We've seen Talon evolve. I can get used to the changes. No biggie.

Since Dingo was, I believe, originally scheduled to grace the cover of BG#5, this could be the group shot meant for BG#6 . . . but of course, it would be awesome if this was entirely new artwork for the Trade :)

Myself, my giddyness in seeing the cover has really reminded just how much I've enjoyed the miniseries spinoff to date, especially considering the fact that 'Bad Guys' wasn't my original preference for Greg to do.

I was, if I remember right, preferring TimeDancer before the comics first debuted. Since then, 'Pendragon' and even Greg's now-titled-but-never-really-developed 'Heroes of Ulster' have taken high grounds along with 'Bad Guys' . . . no doubt to my fascination in Arthur and Cuchulainn's involvement in the Stone of Destiny story. And with TimeDancer's "pilot" concluding Clan Building, I've been - all things considered - a happy camper.

So recap: Trade Paperbacks of Clan Building: Volume II & Gargoyles: Bad Guys, AND the first season of the Spectacular Spider-Man on DVD all this summer . . . I think I'm gonna need a second summer job ;)

"The Suspense is Terrible . . . I Hope it Lasts" -- Willy Wonka

Greg Weisman, Greg Guler, and Karine Charlebois will be at The Gathering in August, so if anyone would like to get their Bad Guys Trade Paperback autographed... ;)

71 days left until The 13th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles in Los Angeles, California!

Patrick - [<-- Gathering 2009]
"A little nonsense now and then is relished by the wisest men." - Willy Wonka

I think the variation is a good thing... I guess I'm used to it from regular comics (Batman, X-Men etc.). As long as I like the artist, I'm OK with these kinda "minor changes".
I agree with Rebel on EVERYTHING she says!!

The characters look different from the interior art and the cartoon, but they match Guler's previous covers:

Yama: http://gargoyles.dracandros.com/Image:BadGuys2.JPG
Hunter: http://gargoyles.dracandros.com/w/images/8/8c/BadGuys3.JPG
Fang: http://gargoyles.dracandros.com/w/images/9/9c/BadGuys4.JPG
TPB: http://gargoyles.dracandros.com/w/images/f/fd/BadGuysVolOne.JPG

So it's at least consistent for Guler, who should get extra leeway as the character designer anyway. I personally prefer artistic interpretation in comic art. Plus they look badass.

Landon Thomas - [<- Gargoyles News Twitter Feed]

I like the cover, but yes, Yama & Fang look really wrong. Yama Looks like Goliath with larger horns and slightly different hair. Fang maybe looks like he's aged. Would like to think they can fix it*crosses talons*

Per Patrick's suggestion, I e-mailed Hot Topic.

Thank you for emailing hottopic.com! Unfortunately we do not know when we
will be getting those items back in stock. It is important to us that we
are always on top of the latest trends so I have passed on your items to
the buying team. They look into the past sales to determine if they will
bring back the items and if they will be something that will excite our
customers as a whole."

Anthony Tini

Bad Guys Cover > Meh. Robin and Matrix look fine, but Yama, Dingo, and Fang don't really look like themselves. Dingo seems to have too many lines and shadows on his face, Fang looks sorta mousy, and I don't remember Yama being that huge--he has a slighter build. Plus, like Supermoff said, his face shape is wrong. Also, if I remember correctly, Yama doesn't even have wing fingers. He has a totally unique wing design.

Bad Guys cover> I really like it... but I really wish Yama had a more angular jaw so that he'd look less like Goliath. Don't get me wrong, I can tell the difference, but at a glance it's not obvious, especially for new readers for whom Goliath might be the only gargoyle they recognise.

I see stripes on the wall behind them. Are they supposed to be in a police line-up room, or is that just a coincidence?


I've just noticed another tidbit from the interview: The Last Tengu In Paris premieres the week before Comic-Con. That makes THREE new comics coming out in July, not to mention the Spectacular Spider-Man season 1 boxset on July 28 and Bad Guys a week later. I won't be getting anything done next month.
Landon Thomas - [<- Gargoyles News Twitter Feed]

The Fourth Wall> I agree that it's probably just something that was added in for the trailer. As Todd mentioned, the lettering and the balloon look a bit different from the others. And the only character in "Gargoyles" I could really see breaking the fourth wall is Puck.

Bad Guys Cover> It's looking good. I'm glad it's not just one of the wanted posters. I'm wondering if it's a cover to and issue we haven't seen yet, or a completely new piece of artwork for the trade.

Demonskrye - [demonskrye(at)gmail(dot)com]

@ Rebel & Todd: I second the assumption that this is a bit included for the commercial only - basically, it wouldn't make any sene whatsoever in the comics.

(@ Rebel: If you dislike the breaking of th 4th wall, but are adventurous enough to see how it is done well, I encourage you to watch the austrian film FUNNY GAMES, which got an OK-but-not-as-brilliant-remake in FUNNY GAMES US, or pick up some post-modern novels of A.B. Casares, M.Z. Danielewski or Borges. It still has a bit of cheesyness with todays standarts (which we were overexposed to by modern media), but they're at times really breathtaking when they occur.)

BAD GUYS COVER: I want this!!

I agree with Rebel on EVERYTHING she says!!

REBEL - I think that Brooklyn's breaking-the-fourth-wall moment was created specially for the promo; it probably used an actual panel from the comic, but edited in a new speech balloon. (I thought that the speech balloon in that last panel looked different from the others.)
Todd Jensen

Nice! I look forward to getting those autographs for Clan Building Vol. 2...and I'll add Mecha Nation to my Comic-Con shopping list when I get a chance! (>^^)>
The One Known As Mochi - [shogi dot keima dot 08 at gmail dot com]
Current Mood: (>T.T)> Animal Crossing: Wild World... Nook is insane...

Just so I don't spread bad rumors, this is what I was thinking of: "Various comic books I was scheduled to do had their plugs pulled, which is really too bad." http://www.comicon.com/ubb/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=537671#Post537671 So forget my baseless "cancellation" comment about Mecha-Nation earlier.
Landon Thomas - [<- Gargoyles News Twitter Feed]

I think the most surprising part of that interview is that:

1) Mecha-Nation is back on.
2) It'll be out in July(!).
3) It's now published by Ape Entertainment rather than SLG.

This is the last info on Mecha-Nation: http://blog.newsarama.com/2008/07/17/slgs-progeny-promo-art/ and it was also shown at Comic-Con 2008. I then remember it being canceled or postponed, but I might be wrong.

Landon Thomas - [<- Gargoyles News Twitter Feed]

New Greg interview with Toon Zone: http://marvel.toonzone.net/specspidey/interviews/weisman2/

Unfortunately, there's a massive season 2 spoiler about 2/3 of the way through. Here's the interview without the spoilers:

Greg Weisman Talks The Spectacular Spider-Man

The Spectacular Spider-Man is swinging high on Disney XD and, to celebrate the premiere of the second season of the acclaimed series, Marvel Animation Age has caught up with The Spectacular Spider-Man supervising producer/story editor Greg Weisman to talk about what lies ahead for the animated web-slinger, without spoiling any of it, naturally. It's all yours Greg!

MAA: Let's drive right into it! After the hectic final arc of The Spectacular Spider-Man's first season - including the introduction of Venom, Aunt May's heart attack, and Peter and Gwen sharing their first kiss - what can fans expect with the first episode of the second season?

Weisman: Nothing special. We were totally fried. So we just hacked out the first few episodes of Season Two. Kidding, kidding. (Man, if that gets quote out of context, I'm in BIG trouble.) Anyway, we get the second season rolling with a literal BANG. Pete's got a list of things to do involving Eddie Brock, Aunt May, Gwen and Harry, but folks like Mysterio, Tinkerer, Liz Allan and Norman Osborn are pretty determined to get in his way.

MAA: What kind of themes will The Spectacular Spider-Man be exploring for the second season? Also, as you can expect, fans are anxious to know which baddies will be popping up for the second season. Care to drop some hints on who'll be facing off against the web-slinger?

Weisman: Well, we'll see ***SEASON 2 VILLAIN ROSTER SPOILER REMOVED*** Thematically, the show hasn't changed. We're still all about "The Education of Peter Parker." Our boy still has a LOT to learn.

MAA: Now, the first season of The Spectacular Spider-Man received major applause from both fans and critics. In fact, it was called a love-letter to both the classic Spider-Man comics and the fans. Does the high acclaim of the first season increase the pressure to match or exceed what came before in the second season? Did you set out to top the first season when producing episodes 14 - 26?

Weisman: We did want to top ourselves -- and I think (biased opinion here, of course) that we succeeded. But it's not really about pressure from fans. They don't put any more pressure on us then we put on ourselves. This show is very important to everyone on the crew

MAA: The second season of The Spectacular Spider-Man has already aired in Canada, and in a host of different international territories. Is it frustrating having to wait for the second season to air in the United States, knowing that a good chunk of the audience may have already illegally viewed these episodes?

Weisman: Extremely. But that's the biz, I guess.

MAA: As a quick follow-up to the previous questions, are you worried that having the second season readily available online will hurt the ratings for The Spectacular Spider-Man when Disney XD debuts the new season? Are you hoping they'll still tune in when the series premieres?

Weisman: I'd be lying if I didn't admit to that concern. But these are still great episodes, so hopefully they'll still do well.

MAA: Now, the series has jumped from TheCW4KIDs to DisneyXD. Are you worried that some fans may not get the new channel, or may just forget about the network change? Are there any big plans on the network's part to give the new episodes a big push upon the premiere?

Weisman: Geez, are you trying to depress me? Yes, obviously, a producer worries about everything that might go wrong. Might. But I try not to buy trouble. We'll just have to see how it plays out. As for the network's plans, you'll have to ask them.

MAA: With all of the chaos involving The Spectacular Spider-Man moving to a new channel, the late premiere of the second season, all of that, has put this series in a rather unique situation. Has this added complications been rough on you and the production team?

Weisman: Well, we all got laid off, which wasn't fun. But we still hope to be back to do a third season. But the network change had no effect on production of Season Two at all.

MAA: Despite any problems for the series, The Spectacular Spider-Man has amassed a strong and dedicated fanbase, probably one of the most dedicated I've ever seen for a Spider-Man series. Why do you think fans have latched on to this series in such an impassioned fashion? Did this come as a surprise to you?

Weisman: I wouldn't say a surprise. It's exactly what we were hoping for. But it's a huge relief that the fans have (largely) responded as positively as they have. As for the why, I think it's as simple as this: all of us working on the show are HUGE Spidey-Geeks. We tried our damnedest to create the kind of Spectacular Spider-Man that we'd like to watch. To the extent we succeeded, it makes sense that what worked for us, worked for the fanbase.

MAA: Production on the second season finished way back in January 2009 and, for now, the creative team behind the series have moved on to other projects. Are you still hoping for a third season for The Spectacular Spider-Man. What can the fans do to help lock down new episodes of The Spectacular Spider-Man for the future? Should they all tune in to the second season premiere?

Weisman: That wouldn't hurt. Buying related merchandise, like the DVDs and the Hasbro toys would probably help too. Because, we all would REALLY like to do more seasons.

MAA: As a follow-up question, is there anyone currently looking to continue the series outside of Sony? Is there a chance the series could move elsewhere for production for a third season?

Weisman: For production? I don�t think so. But that�s business stuff. I�m just the creative guy.

MAA: If The Spectacular Spider-Man remains at 26 episodes, and is not picked up, do you have any moments from those 26 episodes that you're especially proud of?

Weisman: A lot. Too many to single out. Though ***THE BIGGEST SPOILER OF SEASON 2 REMOVED*** is a favorite, I guess. Frankly, I'm proud of every single episode.

MAA: Let's briefly change the topic for a moment. As we inch closer to the end of this Q & A, care to tell us about any other projects you 're working on that you'd like to inform us about? Anything interesting in the works?

Weisman: Vic Cook, Greg Guler and I are working with artist Antonio Campo and Ape Entertainment to produce a comic book called Mecha-Nation. This is an original property, created by Vic and developed by Vic, Greg G. and myself. The first issue should be out in time for San Diego Comic-Con. I've also written an episode of Batman: The Brave and the Bold and hope to write another soon. I have a few other projects in the works, but most aren't ready to discuss.

MAA: Oh, and the Gargoyles fan in me has to ask - any new DVD or comic book developments? (sorry, sorry - I'm sure you get asked this countless times every day, but well...couldn't help it!)

Weisman: Our second trade paperback, Gargoyles: Clan-Building, Volume Two, will be out in July in time for Comic-Con. And Volume One is still available on Amazon and elsewhere. Our spin-off trade paperback, Gargoyles: Bad Guys: Redemption will be out in August in time for the Gathering, i.e. our annual Gargoyles convention. This year our convention is in Los Angeles at the Universal Hilton. It will also feature a number of panels on Spectacular Spider-Man, including many voice actors, writers, artists and production people from both series. For more information, check out gatheringofthegargoyles.com/g2009/. If you're a fan of either show, you won't want to miss this. It's a small con, so the ratio of fan to pro is better than any other convention you might attend, bar none. Finally, your ADULT readers might check out: bluemugproductions.com for something completely different: a mature-audiences-only Internet comic, which will premiere the week before Comic-Con.

MAA: And speaking of DVD, can you spill any hints on when we can expect The Spectacular Spider-Man: The Complete First Season on DVD (and perhaps Blu-ray)? Any details on what bonus features will be included?

Weisman: All I know is that it should be out sometime this summer. I believe a specific date will be announced very soon.

MAA: Now, to wrap up, can you tell us why fans should tune into the second season premiere of The Spectacular Spider-Man at 7:00pm (ET) on June 22nd, 2009, on Disney XD?

Weisman: Uh... cuz our show kicks @$$! (He says with total objectivity.)

The Marvel Animation Age and would like to thank Greg for his participation in this interview, and his work on the show. Cheers Greg!

Note: Interview performed before the official announcement of the The Spectacular Spider-Man: The Complete First Season DVD release and the official announcement of the second season premiere of The Spectacular Spider-Man on Disney XD.

Landon Thomas - [<- Gargoyles News Twitter Feed]

I have started watching the series on DVD again. I started at "Awakening" and now I am on "Temptation."

I won't be able to watch the rest of the series after season two vol 1., unless I download them some how.

This gives me an Idea to make my own DVD set...

I did it for WINGS (1927) (a three disc set with Bonus features) so I should be able to do it for Gargoyles...

Hmmm... got my creativity demon juices flowing...

Battle Beast - [Canada]
That is all I will say.

I just noticed that's Greg Guler's pencil art on the cover.
Landon Thomas - [<- Gargoyles News Twitter Feed]

Greg B uploaded the new Bad Guys trade cover: http://gargoyles.dracandros.com/Gargoyles:_Bad_Guys_-_Redemption

It's also on SLG's site with pre-order info: http://www.slgcomic.com/Pre-Order-Augsut-SLG-Comics_df_444.html

More new info on there: it'll be digest-size (which I assume is the same size as Clan-Building vol. 1) and is slated for the first week of August, plenty of time for the Gathering.

Landon Thomas - [<- Gargoyles News Twitter Feed]

Sorry, I feel I should clarify something:

"and thus, she isn't yet filled with hatred for all humanity"...at least not to the extent that present-day Demona is.


The trailer for Clan-Building 2 looks really good. I'm really looking forward to seeing Demona again. Plus, the fact that this is a younger Demona (and thus, she isn't yet filled with hatred for all humanity) will be interesting. I look forward to her and Brooklyn's interactions. I wonder if something Brooklyn says/does will end up pushing her towards being the human-hater of present day? Also, am I mistaken or does it seem that Brooklyn and Demona are fighting alongside each other at 0:40? I'm really looking forward to this.

The only thing that I'm not sure I'm gonna like is that "breaking-down-the-fourth-wall" moment there at the end where Brooklyn tells the kids to "hit those books". In general, I don't like it when characters break down the fourth wall--I find it cheesy. Then again, if *anyone* from the Manhattan clan was going to break down the fourth wall, it would probably be Brooklyn. I wonder if that's actually in one of the issues, or if it's some kind of extra?


Why don't you call or e-mail Hot Topic to ask, "What's up with that?" Nobody here is going to have anything but opinions and conjecture. My guess would be that Hot Topic only purchased a fixed quantity and they've exhausted their stock. Like most stores, they are constantly rotating in new merchandise.

73 days left until The 13th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles in Los Angeles, California!

Patrick - [<-- Gathering 2009]
"A little nonsense now and then is relished by the wisest men." - Willy Wonka

Looks like you Gargoyles t-shirts are no longer available at Hot Topic or 80sTees. What's up with that?
Anthony Tini

Gorebash - Please check and/or respond to your fershlugginer e-mail!!!!!
Greg Weisman

By 12 (considering Alex growth), he'll likely have outlived his dad in twistedness!! o_O
I agree with Rebel on EVERYTHING she says!!

By 12, Alex will probably be running his own Ponzi scheme.
Landon Thomas - [<- Gargoyles News Twitter Feed]

Patrick> By the time this recession hits the Gargoyles Universe, Alex will be 12, so that explanation might be a bit beneath his age level. ;)
Demonskrye - [demonskrye(at)gmail(dot)com]

Hopefully David and Fox didn't have any investments with Bernie Madoff. But if they did, at least they'd be able to explain it to Alex...


Patrick - [<-- Gathering 2009]
"A little nonsense now and then is relished by the wisest men." - Willy Wonka

Wingless> Well, we are talking about a guy who looks on failures as an opportunity. Xanatos Enterprises may be a diverse enough company to weather the economic downturn reasonably well or at least not get pummeled any worse than anyone else. I'm guessing Xanatos would lose some money and maybe have to make some tough business decisions. But I feel like he's smart enough not to lose his head or start screwing over valued employees just to make short term money.
Demonskrye - [demonskrye(at)gmail(dot)com]


THIS: http://www.quizilla.com/quizzes/277612/which-gargoyles-character-are-you

is bald and way too obvious... we need a new/good "What kinda GARGOYLES-character are you?" quiz... :(

I agree with Rebel on EVERYTHING she says!!

I was throwing some variables in here. The economic slowdown has to be affecting Xanatos enterprises in some ways. No doubt he has backup plans for certain situations, but it's hard to plan for everything. This was a "What If" scenario in here. For one, I would find it hard to believe that a company as large as Xanatos Enterprises not being publicly traded(or at least portions of it).

I tend to agree with Phil; I don't see Xanatos swindling his employees. He has a more long term view of things than the average CEO. It's his company, so the "make it look like the company is making money and get the golden parachute before anyone realizes what you've really done" strategy isn't going to really work for him. Plus, if Xanatos is planning on living forever, he is presumably going to need the company to be around as a source of income for the foreseeable future, since he can't just sit around for a few hundred years waiting for his pocket change to become insanely valuable. And he uses Xanatos Enterprises to work on his various "side projects," which I'm sure he'll also need to do in the future. If it comes out that Xanatos cheats his employees, the company isn't going to be able to function, regardless of whatever regulations may or may not effect it. I suspect that Xanatos works to negotiate contracts that are in his and his company's best interests, but that his employees are compensated fairly for what they do. If he doesn't play fair, the talent goes elsewhere.

It probably doesn't hurt that Xanatos Enterprises likely works on some pretty cutting edge products which certain employees might see as a perk in and of itself, or that individuals like Dr. Anton Sevarius are given a little more free reign to conduct their experiments than they might from most companies. But if employees feel like they're being cheated financially, it may outweigh the excitement of getting to work on the latest and greatest tech or mutate the homeless.

Demonskrye - [demonskrye(at)gmail(dot)com]

Wingless> I suspect that Xanatos Enterprises is a privately held corporation, meaning that shares of stock are not publicly traded on the New York Stock Exchange. That means the Securities Exchange Commission (SEC) won't be investigating Xanatos Enterprises. The only way he can be ousted as CEO is if the shareholders vote him out, and I suspect he's the only shareholder. (Fox and maybe Petros could have a minority interest, but I doubt it.)

Besides that, I don't see Xanatos cheating his employees out of their retirement investments. He may be amoral, but it seems that he sticks to his commitments.

Phil - [p1anderson at go dot com]

Ten seems to like me.
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75 at gmail dot com]
"Don't make me angry, Gaius. You wouldn't like me when I'm angry." -Number Six ("Battlestar Galactica")


74 days left until The 13th Annual Gathering of the Gargoyles in Los Angeles, California!

Patrick - [<-- Gathering 2009]
"A little nonsense now and then is relished by the wisest men." - Willy Wonka

8th again
VickyUK - [vickyfanofwwe at aol dot com]

Clocking in at number 7.
KingCobra_582 - [KingCobra582 at gmail dot com]
Grr. Arg.

Vinnie - [tpeano29 at hotmail dot com]

Fifth. ^..^
Kerry (Kth) Boyd


On Xanatos: Good question. I doubt everyone at Xanatos Enterprises has similar thought as Owen . . . "Service is its own reward"

Litwolf: Safe travels . . . no doubt you'll look for things Gargoyles related if/when you get the chance ;)

"The Suspense is Terrible . . . I Hope it Lasts" -- Willy Wonka

3, III, Three, Third!

Here's a thought. With the current economic situation, I have to wonder how well Xanatos Enterprises would be doing. Would David Xanatos be found out to be one of those crooked book cooking types-cheating his employees out of their pensions and eventually be ousted from being CEO of the company? Would the company survive or go bankrupt? Where would the Gargoyles go next IF this all happened?

Any Ideas?


"What if this wasn't a hypothetical question?"