
JURGAN - Yes, I thought that as well.
Todd Jensen
posted @ Sun, Sep 15, 2024 2:22:31 pm EDT from 68.99.93.213
A Station Eight Fan Web Site
JURGAN - Yes, I thought that as well.
Todd Jensen
posted @ Sun, Sep 15, 2024 2:22:31 pm EDT from 68.99.93.213
The feel of "oh, crap, all the villains together, how will our heroes win" was much more present in Avalon. The Archmage, Demona, and Macbeth had all been serious threats in the past, and while we'd never seen the Weird Sisters fight, it was easy to imagine how dangerous they could be.
Jurgan - [jurgan6 at yahoo dot com]
posted @ Sun, Sep 15, 2024 10:12:55 am EDT from 97.182.116.107
I remember Greg Weisman's remark of one villain team-up in "Gargoyles" that didn't quite capture the tone of such events - when Demona, Macbeth, and "Iago" were working together in "High Noon". He admitted, in the ramble on it, that he suspected the audience was responding to this alliance more in terms of exploring the interaction between the three (and particularly the question of why two sworn enemies like Demona and Macbeth would be working together) than in "How are the gargoyles going to defeat all three?", the question that such team-ups are most often intended to evoke.
Todd Jensen
posted @ Sat, Sep 14, 2024 8:40:06 pm EDT from 68.99.93.213
Fearsome Five were yeah my first exposure to say a Sinister Six, Masters of Evil and Injustice Gang.
Antiyonder
posted @ Sat, Sep 14, 2024 7:15:45 pm EDT from 68.119.3.1
One thing I liked about the dynamics of both the Justice Ducks and the Fearsome Five is that both groups work well with each other, barring the leader. Darkwing of course is too much of an egotist to play well with others and has to eat a lot of humble pie before he can actually step up as leader. And Negaduck is constantly trying to take all the ill-gotten gains for himself or steal their powers in another episode.
There's something inherently funny about both heroes and villains being hindered by their leader's worst traits.
Matthew the Fedora Guy
Ain't nothing crazy 'bout me but my brain!
posted @ Sat, Sep 14, 2024 2:11:42 am EDT from 135.180.3.149
Todd, you reminded me of one of my favorite team up stories, the Darkwing Duck two-parter "Just Us Justice Ducks." In the first part, the Fearsome Five are working together well- Megavolt thinks Quackerjack is funny and Liquidator helps Bushroot grow giant plants. Meanwhile Darkwing is so determined to get credit for capturing the villains that he drives all his allies away. But after he nearly dies (which is played as a serious threat, despite DW usually obeying cartoon physics) and the villains take over, he swallows his pride and admits he needs help. On the other side, the villains have started bickering- Quackerjack's chattering teeth are attacking Bushroot's plants, Liquidator is shorting out Megavolt's electricity, Negaduck is hoarding all the loot for hismelf. It's a good thematic throughline where the team that works together is always the one winning.
Jurgan - [jurgan6 at yahoo dot com]
posted @ Fri, Sep 13, 2024 10:59:02 pm EDT from 97.182.116.107
MATTHEW - Thanks for the latest commentary.
Not directly related to the center of your commentary (the effect events in each episode have on episodes to come), but your comments on the Sinister Six reminded me of one element that I've noticed in "villains team up" stories - where they wind up clashing with each other (and which helps the hero win). I noticed some of that with them in the first season; I particularly liked some of the "motive clashes" such as Vulture would rather be going after Norman Osborne than after Spiderman and Sandman doesn't even see the point of revenge schemes.
And, of course, Demona's alliances with first Xanatos, then Thailog, seemed ultimately destined to break up because neither of her partners would want to see her "wipe out humanity" schemes succeed.
Don Rosa once did a Scrooge McDuck story where Scrooge's main adversaries - Magica de Spell, the Beagle Boys, and Flintheart Glomgold - all teamed up against him. They comment in their strategy session that one of the strengths of their alliance is that their goals don't conflict with each other. Magica wants Scrooge's No.. 1 Dime; the Beagle Boys don't care about the dime, but want the rest of Scrooge's fortune; Flintheart just wants to see Srooge ruined, and he's ruined just as surely if the Beagle Boys and Magica make off with his wealth as if Flintheart is the one who takes it. [SPOILER] In spite of which - thanks in part to some ingenuity from Scrooge McDuck - Magica and the Beagle Boys wind up turning on Flintheart after all; Magica makes off with his very first coin, the Beagle Boys with everything else, and Flintheart's left crying, "Why me? What'd I do to deserve this? Don't answer that!" [/SPOILER]
Todd Jensen
posted @ Wed, Sep 11, 2024 8:17:21 pm EDT from 68.99.93.213
Onto the Season 2 rankings and we begin with Engineering 101.
Blueprints- 7/10. This begins the Master Planner arc and features some interesting callbacks to the episode "Persona." Unless you're big on Spider-Man lore, chances are you aren't going to think much Chameleon's partners in crime, something that the episode pokes fun of with Spidey completely forgetting who Beck was and needing to be reminded that they met once before.
This is another big setup episode but some of the setups aren't that large, sometimes because they're limited to this arc and others because they couldn't be explored due to the cancellation. A big one introduced is Miles Warren's arrival at ESU, while he brings much-needed funding for the Connors he'll bring something far worse soon enough. The big kiss between Gwen and Peter from the last episode doesn't go far because of their mutual nervousness and Norman and Liz getting in the way.
Destructive Testing- 6/10. It's a shame that Kraven only appears in two episodes, he and Calypso could've had such a big impact on the series, especially since he's integral on setting up Warren's own path of villainy and discovering Curt's secret as the Lizard. Otherwise the only other big parts he contributes is a distraction from Peter's search for Eddie, the revelation that the Master Planner was the one to bring him to New York, and the setup for the team up next episode.
The biggest parts of continuity actually comes from the side plot of Midtown's football team winning the championship though it results in a serious leg injury for Flash. This bit of drama is going to affect both Flash and Liz soon enough.
Reinforcement- 10/10. It's Round 2 against the Sinister Six and the obligatory Christmas Episode. The Master Planner organizing a new Six and declaring that this is the Age of the Supervillain will have major impacts once we get around to the gang war arc. We get an introduction to Blackie Gaxton, and "Patch" as Spidey starts to learn more about how the criminal underworld works and we see first hand what Tombstone meant about Spider-Man scaring off the ordinary criminals.
A nice nod of continuity is the Six changing their tactics as attacking all at once didn't work (though Electro's trigger happy method is still a problem) and Spider-Man acknowledging that it was the Symbiote that beat them. Unfortunately they still haven't gotten the teamwork thing down, besides Electro's shoot first and think later attacks there's also the fact that Kraven and Mysterio as the newcomers haven't worked out the cohesion thing at all.
On the civilian side of things, Peter and Gwen's own relationship isn't looking too strong, not helped by Flash milking his injury to Peter's consternation and his own lack of focus.
Oh, a shame that neither Dr. Kafka or Cletus got to be big players in the future.
Shear Strength-6/10. The Master Planner Arc closes out with the reveal that Dr. Octopus was the Master Planner and sometimes I wonder if they should have revealed that closer to the end of the episode to maximize the shock. While the episode is fine on it's own the unfortunate part is that the Master Planner's master plan is thwarted on the same episode of its reveal and unlike other closing episodes, this one doesn't naturally shift into the next arc. Despite Peter's efforts to save Gwen, it's Liz that steps forward to start their relationship as she's grown tired of Flash's immaturity. Also unfortunately this is the only time we see Norman's more hands-on mentorship of Peter and Morris Bench. Honestly the only other big impact is Otto abandoning Electro at the end, finally done with him as he proves to be a bigger liability than asset. Given that Electro was unconscious at the time, I can only imagine the shock (he) over the fact that the villain he respected most would leave him to die.
The Master Planner Arc encompasses four episodes while the rest of the season's arcs are three I sometimes wonder if that was the right call. The Symbiote Arc from the season one was four episodes and gave the season a proper feeling of finality. I've discussed this when I did a more in-depth review but I often wonder if this arc should've been trimmed and the extra episode should've gone to the gang war or Goblin's return arc. At the same time, I enjoy each episode and wouldn't want to do away with any of them. No easy answer I guess.
Matthew the Fedora Guy
Ain't nothing crazy 'bout me but my brain!
posted @ Wed, Sep 11, 2024 7:54:13 pm EDT from 135.180.3.149
Been binging the Beetlejuice animated series on TubiTV the last few days.
Next though as I tend to watch fluffy shows, going to check out Shimmer and Shine which Greg did write a few episodes of in S2.
Antiyonder
posted @ Wed, Sep 11, 2024 6:25:43 pm EDT from 68.119.3.1
Matthew> Actually the episode premiere several years before Scrooged.
Currently on YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_uHgQgIjyF8
Antiyonder
posted @ Tue, Sep 10, 2024 11:47:32 pm EDT from 68.119.3.1
MATTHEW - That must have been quite a scene. I wonder if it was intended as time travel, or an alternate universe where Batman lived during the Civil Sar era. (I once came across an "alternate universe" take on Batman which placed him in Arthurian Britain - in it, Bruce's family was banished from the kingdom because his baby sister was born about the same time as Mordred - a sort of variant on the May Day Decree. Morgan le Fay, recognizing that the young Bruce would be a danger for her, sent some bat-demons to attack his family, slaughtering his parents and his little sister - and thereby achieving the almost impossible and making his origin story even more traumatic - not to mention that the big challenge Bruce had to face when assuming his "Batman" persona was that he was scared of bats thanks to the bat-demons.)
Todd Jensen
posted @ Tue, Sep 10, 2024 10:28:08 pm EDT from 68.99.93.213
Todd> Yes, Abraham Lincoln appeared in a pre-title sequence of Batman: The Brave and the Bold, Batman personally appeared to thwart his assassination...
From a John Wilkes Booth wearing steampunk power armor. Obviously there's some multiverse shenanigans at play.
I never saw that episode of Real Ghostbusters, but I can imagine some clever jokes there considering Billy Murray's role in the movie "Scrooged."
Matthew the Fedora Guy
Ain't nothing crazy 'bout me but my brain!
posted @ Tue, Sep 10, 2024 10:14:29 pm EDT from 135.180.3.149
Sorry to hear about his passing as well - and thanks, Antiyonder, for supplying us with the details about his work.
Abraham Lincoln appeared in "Batman: the Brave and the Bold"?
I remember that "Real Ghostbusters" episode. It showed a good familiarity with "A Christmas Carol", including Scrooge's scepticism about the Ghosts of Christmas, speculating that they were the result of indigestion and that there was more "gravy than the grave" about them (though in the original book, he says that about Marley's Ghost).
Todd Jensen
posted @ Tue, Sep 10, 2024 9:44:43 pm EDT from 68.99.93.213
Antiyonder > Sad to hear that about Renaday. He was also the second choice to play Xanatos, per a Voices from the Eyrie episode, if I recall.
Also worth noting is that Renaday (who started out in Disney's props department in the late 1950s) played Eddie Valiant in a few very early proof-of-concept clips for 'Who Framed Roger Rabbit' (with Paul Reubens as the voice of Roger), long before Robert Zemeckis came on board to direct: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4QQ8bPDNNm4
Craig
posted @ Tue, Sep 10, 2024 7:56:29 pm EDT from 107.122.189.109
So, RIP to Peter Renaday, voice of Cyperbiotics Commander, Fortress-1 Captain and William Greene (Father of Billy and Susan).
And of course the original voice of Master Splinter from Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.
Also, yeah he had three portrayals of Abraham Lincoln being in Disney's Hall of Presidents, ad well as voicing him in Animaniacs and Batman The Brave and the Bold.
I especially like his voicing of Ebenezer Scrooge in The Real Ghostbusters episode X-Mas Marks the Spot.
Favorite part is where he asks Peter (Playing the Ghost of Christmas Past) "I'm dreadfully sorry. Was I suppose to be learning something?".
Antiyonder
posted @ Tue, Sep 10, 2024 7:31:48 pm EDT from 68.119.3.1
Thank you all for the birthday wishes, takes some of the sting off that I'm now on the wrong end of thirty.
Anyway, I'll start up the next arc of the Spectacular Spider-Man rankings tomorrow.
Matthew the Fedora Guy
Ain't nothing crazy 'bout me but my brain!
posted @ Tue, Sep 10, 2024 1:55:37 am EDT from 135.180.3.149
Matthew> Oh yeah, Happy Birthday. Missed a bit of what you said about it being now.
Antiyonder
posted @ Mon, Sep 9, 2024 7:21:04 pm EDT from 68.119.3.1
Oh yea sorry I should say Happy birthday, Matthew ð¥³!!!!!
Margaret Stephens - [realdemonamay at gmail dot com]
The real living insane one
posted @ Mon, Sep 9, 2024 6:35:15 pm EDT from 24.145.45.208
7th in line today.
Margaret Stephens - [realdemonamay at gmail dot com]
The real living insane one
posted @ Mon, Sep 9, 2024 6:33:56 pm EDT from 24.145.45.208
Sixth!
Happy birthday, Matthew! I'm 40. Don't worry, you're still practically a kid. ;)
And thanks for sharing that article, Todd. The formatting of that site hurts my brain with all the ads, but the content of the article was good. Always nice to see Gargoyles get some media attention.
Craig
posted @ Mon, Sep 9, 2024 2:28:33 pm EDT from 12.74.53.36
Happy birthday, Matthew!
Todd Jensen
posted @ Mon, Sep 9, 2024 9:04:24 am EDT from 68.99.93.213
Fourth!
Happy Birthday, Matthew!
And I'm also 42 (43 next May).
Matt
"And, thus, given no choice, we waited..." - Alesand, "The Reach"
posted @ Mon, Sep 9, 2024 8:15:49 am EDT from 204.184.178.1
Matthew> If it makes you feel less old, I'm 42 (43 Next April).
Antiyonder
posted @ Mon, Sep 9, 2024 3:57:00 am EDT from 68.119.3.1
I have to say I'm not looking forward to turning 36 today.
Can we reverse a bit of time? Not a lot, maybe just a year or three.
Matthew the Fedora Guy
Ain't nothing crazy 'bout me but my brain!
posted @ Mon, Sep 9, 2024 12:05:23 am EDT from 135.180.3.149
First!
Jurgan - [jurgan6 at yahoo dot com]
posted @ Mon, Sep 9, 2024 12:01:04 am EDT from 97.182.116.107