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Gargoyles

The Phoenix Gate

Comment Room Archive

Comments for the week ending July 17, 2011

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Blast my soul, those Gargoyles Abridged videos are hilarious...
Matt - [Saint Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Queen? We have no queen..." - Goliath, "Enter Macbeth"

I'd stick with the characters listed on Greg B's page. There are still some extra inserts (most of which are marked or simply in the MST3K Mantra category) that you can pick and choose which ones are worth following. However, most of them are directly involved with the plot in some fashion.
Brainiac - [OSUBrainiac at gmail dot com]
There is balance in all things. Live in symmetry with the world around you. If you must blow things up and steal from those around you, THAT'S WHAT RPGS ARE FOR!

Which Formspring accounts should I follow if I want to get better updated? There seems to be a lot, and personally I'd prefer to follow the canonical characters anyway. Some of the others, particularly the self-insert characters, don't really fit well to me.
Anonymous

would help if I pasted the link.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9bYZOTdo8c

Greg Bishansky
"Cartman gets ten million dollars and Michael Bay gets to keep making movies. There isn't a God." -Kyle

After, what, seven months, we have a new episode of "Gargoyles Abridged."
Greg Bishansky
"Cartman gets ten million dollars and Michael Bay gets to keep making movies. There isn't a God." -Kyle

I know we're talking about the licensing for the comics, but when dealing with DVD releases - even shows like M.A.S.K. are out(or about to come out on DVD. JEM! is about to come out on DVD. Almost anything and everything that could be out is out...with the sole exception of Many of the Disney properties. The only exceptions might be shows like Eek The Cat or Earthworm Jim - but We're not talking the quality of Disney here. Disney couldn't even be bothered to do a decent job on The Tick(which they have the rights to). It baffles me that a company so immersed in animation could be so out of touch with their fans.
Wingless

CHIP> I'm sure they won't.
Algernon
Man, 2010 was a crazy year. Remember when the monolith turned Jupiter into a star? Good times.

Anonymous and anonymous> I'm pretty sure they won't object if you decide to pay them.
Chip - [<------The League of Extraordinary Nerds Here!]
"An explanation of cause is not a justification by reason." C. S. Lewis

anonymous --> everyone on that formspring also has a life outside of formspring. maybe that is the reason why their story has progressed slower than you want it to. it would be a good idea not to complain about a slow down in free entertainment they are putting their own free time into unless you are prepared to pay them for their time.
Anonymous

Back to the Formspring thing: does anyone think there may too many characters to keep track of? Not only the canonical, or canon-in-training ones, either. Maybe that's also contributing to the story slow-down. Heck, I'm still wondering when the Terry Chung and the New Olympians arc is going to start up again. Again, just trying to put out some thoughts...
anonymous

D. Taina> Too true. For certain, the props should go to you. Your contributions have always been invaluable.
Matt - [Saint Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Queen? We have no queen..." - Goliath, "Enter Macbeth"

Matt: And I'm the one who put together those pictures. It was pretty cool seeing them in the article. That made my day!
D. Taina
"The story is told -- though who can say if it be true..." -Shari

Greg Bishansky - Oh dear god, that's a miserable, depressing theory that just epitomizes all that's wrong with Hollywood. I forgot the timing of that Variety article. It was one year ago yesterday: http://www.variety.com/article/VR1118021704?refCatId=13

So the Variety article was July 13, 2010. BOOM! asked for the license "after Comic-Con", which occurred July 22-25. BOOM! tweeted their infamous "@Demona_Gargoyle hrmmm...THAT sounds like an idea! :)" tweets on August 5.

If our only evidence that the movie could be blocking Gargoyles is a license request being ignored a few weeks after the movie's announcement, then maybe we're not in bad shape. In other words, we won't know when/if the movie shelved and who knows how Disney would react to a licensing request now. Not that BOOM! is necessarily interested anymore. Sigh.

Landon Thomas - [<- Gargoyles News Twitter Feed]

Brainiac> I also noted that the article cited the GargWiki which was pretty cool, especially since I'm pretty sure I'm the one who put at least one of those pictures on the Clocktower page.
Matt - [Saint Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Queen? We have no queen..." - Goliath, "Enter Macbeth"

Gore: What I would recommend off the top of my head...

http://gregxb.blogspot.com/2011/04/so-geeky-but-loving-geekiness.html
http://www.fanfiction.net/cartoon/Gargoyles/
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Gargoyles
http://thatguywiththeglasses.com/videolinks/thatguywiththeglasses/nostalgia-critic/8726-gargoyles

I'm sure there's also a couple of Facebook groups that it would be prudent to link to as well, but I'll let someone who actually uses Facebook take care of those particular links, LOL.

Masterdramon - [kmc12009@mymail.pomona.edu]
"I see the bad moon a-rising..." - John Fogerty of Creedence Clearwater Revival

Landon: yeah, but we're not supposed to know that.

HEY, EVERYONE! I'm feeling like I'm missing out on a bunch of other locations across the net where Gargoyles fans congregate. For example I hadn't even known about the Gargoyles Club on DA (http://gargoylesclub.deviantart.com/) until an accidental Google result earlier today.

SO! Please, if I'm missing something under the "Other Sites" tab, share the link in the CR here so that others might not be as lost as myself.

Gorebash

ALGERNON> Don't get me wrong, I suspect this thing is in Development Hell, and I don't think it's ever coming out, but I don't think it's been shelved just yet.
Greg Bishansky
"Cartman gets ten million dollars and Michael Bay gets to keep making movies. There isn't a God." -Kyle

GREG B.> Interstingly, I don't think there's been any news on I Can't Believe It's not Gargoyles since last year's Variety article, not even baseless internet rumours. I suppose it's too much to hope that this beast has already been banished to the Ninth Circle?
Algernon
Man, 2010 was a crazy year. Remember when the monolith turned Jupiter into a star? Good times.

LANDON> <<So either Disney actually isn't paying attention or they don't want to license Gargoyles and/or other properties at the moment.>>

I suspect it's even bigger than that. Remember that "not based on the show Gargoyles" movie that was announced as being in development a year ago? Remember the very realistic fear that Disney wouldn't want two competing brands with the same name to create confusion?

I have this theory that Disney's complete non-response to Boom! is because of this abomination. Now, personally, I suspect that this movie is going to stay in Development Hell, but until they actually shelve it, we're not going to see anything new.

Yes, I blame Zoe Green and her oh so "original" concept.

Greg Bishansky
"Cartman gets ten million dollars and Michael Bay gets to keep making movies. There isn't a God." -Kyle

Dang, that is one sweet NYC pad! I'm afraid I can't quite cover $23.5 million right now, though.

I noticed Cat cited the GargWiki for the Clock Tower artwork. Nice.

Brainiac - [OSUBrainiac at gmail dot com]
There is balance in all things. Live in symmetry with the world around you. If you must blow things up and steal from those around you, THAT'S WHAT RPGS ARE FOR!

Gorebash - "It's not that Disney isn't paying attention so much as the price Disney wants for the Gargoyles license makes it difficult for anyone other than Disney to publish Gargoyles comics."

That was true in the SLG era of 2009. In the BOOM! era of 2010 when they sent in requests to license Gargoyles, Disney ignored them. So either Disney actually isn't paying attention or they don't want to license Gargoyles and/or other properties at the moment.

Landon Thomas - [<- Gargoyles News Twitter Feed]

Anonymous: No news about the comics coming back. It's not that Disney isn't paying attention so much as the price Disney wants for the Gargoyles license makes it difficult for anyone other than Disney to publish Gargoyles comics. So why doesn't Disney publish it themselves (or through Marvel now that they own it)? They probably have a lot of other things on their plate and short of someone high-up in the ranks at Disney or Marvel taking a personal interest in pushing such a project through you're probably unlikely to see anything happen in the immediate future.

I think Greg's mentioned before that if there was an option to write a novel (or more comics, or something else) he'd be very interested. The problem is nobody seems to be willing to invest the substantial amount of money it would take to license and produce a novel (or more comics or whatever). If there was a large interest from consumers (us type) in such a thing (we're talking tens of thousands of people taking the time to voice their interest) then maybe someone would be willing to take that step, like SLG did.

Which leads to a greater issue.

I say it time and again, it's a constant that whenever the show is brought up in conversation the reaction from people is "I remember that show! It was awesome!" People liked the show and still like it. But how do you collect and focus all this positive energy?

A web site, right? Try this exercise (I did last night after my post about Twitter):

Think about all the television shows you watched as a kid. Shows that are now at least 15 years old if not much more. Shows that haven't been on the air in quite a long time and are far from mainstream.

A few that came to my mind include M.A.S.K., Mysterious Cities of Gold, Spartakus and the Sun Beneath the Sea, Pinwheel (especially the animated shorts).

That was a nice bit of fond remembering. How was it for you?

Now, how motivated are you to, right now, to google up some of those shows and see what kind of online presence there is? In a casual situation, without the benefit of being directly asked to (and reminded that you can) search the internet, you're probably not very motivated. And I think that is true for a vast majority of people who are, on occasion, reminded of some show they loved growing up.

Although last night I did search for 10 years ago there was nothing online about that show and that was probably the last time I searched for it. Last night I find a bunch of episodes IN ENGLISH are on YouTube and that in 2008 it was released in French on DVD. Hopefully that's a sign of a possible English release soon. (MCoG was released in French before an English release several years later.)

So then, how does one try to focus that positive energy if the motivation for those with said energy to seek out the online collective is weak?

Gorebash

Anonymous - BOOM! wanted to make a Gargoyles comic series last year but Disney never responded to their request for a license. Disney also retracted BOOM!'s Pixar properties license. So there's an ongoing question about the future of Disney licensing their properties to other comic publishers.

Disney owns Marvel. Greg Weisman asked Marvel if they're interested in a Gargoyles comic series and they currently are not. There is however at least one Marvel editor that is a fan of Gargoyles.

Over a year ago, Dan Vado mentioned a desire to make some sort of "ultimate edition" rerelease of the SLG's Gargoyles comics but he hasn't made a peep about it since.

That's all we have to go on so far.

Landon Thomas - [<- Gargoyles News Twitter Feed]

The clock tower in real life?
http://offbeathome.com/2011/07/gargoyles-clocktower-apartment

The comments section is full of nice "Gargoyles was awesome!" comments too.

Gorebash

Hey everyone,
I was just rereading the gargoyle comics and i'm really starting to miss them. I was wondering if there was any new news about them coming back? Is Disney still not paying attention?
I was also wondering why Greg never wrote a novel for the series? Is it because of the same issue as with the comics, the license is to expensive?
Thanks for all your help

Anonymous

Gore et al.> As GregB said, the reason we haven't already added the Twitter Theatre and Formspring stuff to GargWiki is because of our strict rules against fanfiction, which we have in place so that GregW can actually go to the site if he wants to (and sometimes he does).

I was actually pondering this recently. A number of other wikis have separate canon/fanfiction wikis. Could we make a similar Gargoyles fanfiction wiki, to document published Gargoyles fanfiction? Not to allow people just to make up their own characters, but to document big works like Twitter Theatre, Formspring, TGS, Rhapsody, maybe a few others? Maybe use it for the 'outside references' that Masterdramon just mentioned?

Supermorff

Hey Gore, as long as you're here...would it be possible, perhaps, to get any new avatars into the Comment Room? I, for one, would be incredibly ecstatic to have a Matrix image to post under; everyone else in the Redemption Squad is already represented, after all. :D

Thanks a million!

Masterdramon - [kmc12009@mymail.pomona.edu]
"I see the bad moon a-rising..." - John Fogerty of Creedence Clearwater Revival

Search Twitter for "Gargoyles". Lots of people out there watching it on XD at 4am and still loving it 15 years later. It's nice to see that.
Gorebash

Alex: Since Lexington mentions possibly getting the Clock Tower running again and then (IIRC) never does, my guess is that the whole thing has been broken for long enough that the maintenance staff has given up on attending to it. Elisa and the Clan probably handle basic clean-up themselves.

Greg B.: While that was my initial reaction to Gorebash's suggestion as well, at second glance I'm wondering if the GargWiki shouldn't have a single page chronicling "notable outside references to Gargoyles" or some-such, including links to such things as FF.Net, DeviantART, Twitter, Formspring, TV Tropes (Xanatos Gambit and all), Doug Walker's review, etc.

Just me spitballing here, LOL. But it might gain us more traffic, if nothing else.

Masterdramon - [kmc12009@mymail.pomona.edu]
"I see the bad moon a-rising..." - John Fogerty of Creedence Clearwater Revival

Hello! I was just wondering, doesn't the Clock Tower get any maintainance, and, if so, how have the gargoyles and their stuff been kept from being seen?
Alex - [ledar10@hotmail.com]

Gorebash> You could always replace that Twitter Theater link with one to Greg's blog post.
Brainiac - [OSUBrainiac at gmail dot com]
There is balance in all things. Live in symmetry with the world around you. If you must blow things up and steal from those around you, THAT'S WHAT RPGS ARE FOR!

GOREBASH> Probably not since, for all intents and purposes, it's fanfic. And fanfic doesn't belong on the GargWiki. I think it would set an unwise precedent to post it on there.
Greg Bishansky
"Cartman gets ten million dollars and Michael Bay gets to keep making movies. There isn't a God." -Kyle

The Gargoyles forum on Free Forums appears to have been shut down "due to inactivity". Anyone want to try and resurrect that?

GregXB: Any chance of putting a page up on the wiki that lists out all the formspring accounts like you did in your blog post back in April? I think the formspring stuff is incredibly fun and something that needs to be shared a bit more, but with the exception of your blog post, there's no point of reference for people who aren't "in the know" and I think that needs to be changed.

Gorebash

Todd> I believe that that is the idea, yes. He's being portrayed as a member of the Third Race, and he doesn't have normal caucasian coloring, but rather dark blue skin. I think--based on one of his answers, specifically Mab's nightmare spell one--that the implication is that he's Oberon and Titania's kid.
Chip - [<------The League of Extraordinary Nerds Here!]
"An explanation of cause is not a justification by reason." C. S. Lewis

MASTERDRAMON - Is the Atlantes on the list of people asked about Greg Weisman the one (or based on the one) from "Ariosto Furioso"?

(For those who haven't read the poem, Atlantes was a wizard - and a fairly villainous one, at that, though also an overprotective guardian to his foster-son Rogero, one of the major characters in the poem - who rode about on a hippogriff. Ariosto - the author of the poem - invented hippogriffs, in fact; I wonder what he would have thought of Buckbeak.)

Todd Jensen - [merlyn1@mindspring.com]

Paladin> Yup. He's still here from time to time. :) It's still his site. Welcome back! Did you have a cookie?
Battle Beast - [Canada]
I DID IT!!! I WATCHED ALL 485 BEST PICTURE NOMINEES IN ONE YEAR!!!

A belated "Thank you" to Greg B. and Wingless. Interesting. I had noticed that on my tapes, "Turf" appears in the beginning of Season 2.
Arlo
Gargoyles need not apply.

Thanks. That explains a lot.
Matt - [Saint Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Queen? We have no queen..." - Goliath, "Enter Macbeth"

Matt: The "Gargoyles/Spectacular Spidey" role-playing community located on the social-networking site Formspring, links to which can be found in this post from Greg B.'s blog...

http://gregxb.blogspot.com/2011/04/so-geeky-but-loving-geekiness.html

In short, it's a bunch of Weisman-iacs (am I allowed to coin this term?) getting together and running with the concept of the Gathering 2009 radio play, keeping the two universes connected as they role-play out various plotlines from the Master Plan and of their own creation. Overall, if you want to call it fanfiction, then its easily produced some of the greatest fanfiction I've ever seen in this fandom, as each and every current character actor does an excellent job at capturing the essence of whomever they are portraying, and answering the questions posed to them accordingly.

Anyway, as one of the standard questions asked to many in the group is, "What is your opinion on [so-and-so]?", I decided to go a bit meta and ask each and every one of them over the course of the past two months or so, "What is your opinion on Greg Weisman?"

I then post the answers to the CR with regularity, in the hopes that once the queue opens back up I might compile them all and send them to the big guy himself. Given how incredibly complimentary virtually every single player - from Venom to Merlin - has been in their responses, I'm sure he'll get a kick out of 'em. :D

Masterdramon - [kmc12009@mymail.pomona.edu]
"I see the bad moon a-rising..." - John Fogerty of Creedence Clearwater Revival

What are you people talking about?
Matt - [Saint Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Queen? We have no queen..." - Goliath, "Enter Macbeth"

Chip: Indeed, just before posting that last post my computer went wonky, and I ended up having to redo the whole thing from scratch. Obviously, I wasn't paying close attention when I did. XD

[That, or it's Mab's unending reign of nightmares affecting me, LOL.]

Masterdramon - [kmc12009@mymail.pomona.edu]
"I see the bad moon a-rising..." - John Fogerty of Creedence Clearwater Revival

Masterdramon> Actually, What officer Morgan Morgan said was this:


"He's that truck driver Mysterio attacked last year and Spider-man pulled him out of the river, right?

I read about him in the paper...*yawns*

Oh boy...I did NOT get enough sleep last night..."

I presume there was a problem copy/pasting that.

Chip - [<------The League of Extraordinary Nerds Here!]
"An explanation of cause is not a justification by reason." C. S. Lewis

A variety of assorted "Greg Weisman" responses that I've had in the can for a few days...

Officer Morgan Morgan: He likes Mustard Seed.

Prospero: He plans to use me.

He ALWAYS planned to use me, it is OBVIOUSLY the next step, STOP suggesting to him that he should use me, LOGICALLY you can see that he would have gotten around to using me, Caliban, and Ariel as well.

Stop thinking that you should get credit for the idea too. Because if you think that you should, you're an idiot...

Caliban: You have no idea what he has in mind for me, so it's a little odd to be challenged on the point.

Cobweb: He likes mustard seed.

Peaseblossom: Cobweb answered this. He likes Mustard Seed.

Atlantes: I despise mortal bards.

Amar (Oberon's changeling son): I don't know who that man is.

Paul/Paw (Sevarius' new, cybernetically controlled Mutate): ::searching....::

::searching...::

Results found: His shows seem to have trouble with their third seasons.

Masterdramon - [kmc12009@mymail.pomona.edu]
"I see the bad moon a-rising..." - John Fogerty of Creedence Clearwater Revival

Arlo: Definately the DVD has them right. There's confusion with the numbering of the episodes. I think part of it was with the production of the actual episodes back with the second season. Some were completed in advance of others and assigned numbers when they were completed. Thus "Turf" has the GG-24 and often airs between "Leader Of the Pack" & "The Mirror" - which, of course, makes no sense, since "Turf" shouldn't come until after "The Gathering Pts 1 & 2" Which are eps #57 & #58 and "Turf" is actually #60 (Yet the GG#s for "The Gathering" Eps 1 & 2 are #58 & #59. The best way to make sense of it is to look at the list at Gargoyles fan Website Episode List: http://www.gargoyles-fans.org/reviews/index.htm
I had this battle with Canada's Family Channel back in the year 2000 and just as I got them to straighten the order around, they took the show off the air. Somehow I think we'll have a tougher time convincing Disney XD

Wingless

The order on the DVD is the correct order. I believe Greg Weisman insisted on that order.

And if you check the timeline...

http://gargwiki.net/Timeline

Greg Bishansky
"Cartman gets ten million dollars and Michael Bay gets to keep making movies. There isn't a God." -Kyle

That's cute, Matt.

So I came across this when I was reading the reviews for S2V1 on Amazon:

'My one complaint is that the episodes in this release are not exactly in order. When I watched it all the way through the first time it across as jumbled. I watched the series as it aired on TV so I knew which episodes followed which ones. However, two episodes stood out as being the worst offenders. When I switched them the series flowed much better. Probably because I was paying attention to those little details that I love so much.

Leader of the Pack
Metamorphosis
Legion
####
A Lighthouse In the Sea of Time
The Mirror
**The Silver Falcon**
Eye of the Beholder
Vows
City of Stone Parts 1-4
High Noon
****
Outfoxed
Revelations
Double Jeopardy
Upgrade
Protection
##The Cage##
The Price
Avalon Parts 1-3
Shadows of the Past
Heritage
Kingdom

The list above reflects the changes I made. The titles are in their original order but the **** and #### corresponds to where I moved the episodes to make it flow better. I swear there are a few more not in their proper place but they aren't as obvious as these two.

The Cage I recalled being much closer to Metamorphosis but the placement of it is rather rough. Mostly what caused the change is that the orginal placement had it after Double Jeopardy where Thailog appears. The "good" doctor is in that episode. Yet in The Cage when Elisa is arguing with her brother saying "Nobody died that night" (in Metamorphosis) she didn't tell him she had seen the doctor alive and well during the Thailog incident that occured after that night. Major flag (as far as I'm concerned because the I don't believe the writer would have made that mistake), so The Cage had to come before Double Jeopardy.

The Silver Falcon was a little easier. Broadway is learning to read after The Lighthouse in the Sea of Time episode. In High Noon he is struggling with the word "right" and Elisa helps him. In The Silver Falcon he starts making the same mistake with "right" but corrects himself. So Silver Falcon comes after High Noon not before.

I just hope whenever the release the next set Disney will pay more attention to the episode order.'

What do you guys think of that? I always saw it that way too, and I wondered about those episodes. It does seem strange that Broadway needs Elisa to help him read "right" when he'd already figured it out in "The Silver Falcon." All the major episode lists list the same order that appears in the DVD, but they could have just taken it from the DVD. This guy is claiming they air in a different order on Toon Disney.

Arlo
Gargoyles need not apply.

hey, its been many years since i been here, just wondering if gorbash still running the show.
paladin - [lordpaladore@hotmail.com]

Not that it matters at all, but I find it funny that we are still waiting on Number 10, I believe.

Figures> My five year old niece is obsessed with Disney princesses right now. I gave her one of my old Demona action figures and explained that she was another Disney princess. When she seemed sceptical I admitted that she was really more like a queen than a princess and then she sat on my lap while I showed her various GargWiki pictures and played her a few YouTube clips. She now talks to me about Gargoyles but refers to Goliath as the "King", Angela as the "princess" and Broadway as the "prince".

Matt - [Saint Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Queen? We have no queen..." - Goliath, "Enter Macbeth"

Greg B> I was curious as to the comparative size. Thanks for posting that picture.
Brainiac - [OSUBrainiac at gmail dot com]
There is balance in all things. Live in symmetry with the world around you. If you must blow things up and steal from those around you, THAT'S WHAT RPGS ARE FOR!

Finally received my custom Demona in the mail. Here she is side by side with the old Kenner figure.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v661/gregx/Demona%20Custom/DemonaComparison1.jpg

And if anyone is interested in giving Anthony some business, here's his website.

http://anthonyscustoms.webs.com/

Greg Bishansky
"Cartman gets ten million dollars and Michael Bay gets to keep making movies. There isn't a God." -Kyle

COLIN COLE> Where does mortal magic come from? Well, where does electricity come from? Where does water come from? Where does heat come from? Where does wind come from? Same answer.

As for who can use magic? Those who are trained to do so.

http://gargwiki.net/Magic

Greg Bishansky
"Cartman gets ten million dollars and Michael Bay gets to keep making movies. There isn't a God." -Kyle

8TH!!!
Matt - [Saint Louis, Missouri, USA]
"Well, I'm back." -Samwise Gamgee, "The Return of the King"

Hey everyone,

So in the Ask Greg Archives, Greg frequently distinguishes between "human magic" and "Oberoni magic." The Grimorum is an item of human magic.

Do we have any idea where "human magic" comes from? What gives it its power, where its origins are, who can use it, and so on?

Thanks!

Colin Cole - [reliken@gmail.com]

6th
Chip - [<------The League of Extraordinary Nerds Here!]
"An explanation of cause is not a justification by reason." C. S. Lewis

(5th)Fifth!!!!!
Vinnie - [tpeano29@hotmail.com]

>scratches his head for a moment as the confusion, then figures out the correct number several seconds later<

And if the law don't get her, then I will...Four Little Diamonds!

Masterdramon - [kmc12009@mymail.pomona.edu]
"I see the bad moon a-rising..." - John Fogerty of Creedence Clearwater Revival

Yeah, I noticed after I put that up. Pity there's no preview filter to let you know when your need for sleep is slowing your mental processes. Hence, the name change.

Carry on, nothing to see here. At least I still included the right number at the end.

Not A Brainiac - [OSUBrainiac at gmail dot com]
There is balance in all things. Live in symmetry with the world around you. If you must blow things up and steal from those around you, THAT'S WHAT RPGS ARE FOR!

Ah, ah, Brainiac. Notice that Phoenician said the "Anonymous" posting at the bottom was him, with cookies accidentally erased. That means those two postings were from the same person and so only count as number 1. Thus, I'm number 2, and you're number 3.
Jurgan - [jurgan6@yahoo.com]

Oh, sorry for the double post, but people should see this. Using StumbleUpon earlier today, I found this list of the dirtiest hotels in America, according to voters.

http://www.tripadvisor.com/DirtyHotels

Anybody recognize number 1?

Jurgan - [jurgan6@yahoo.com]

FOUR the last time, Jurgan, the first prime is two, not three!
Brainiac - [OSUBrainiac at gmail dot com]
There is balance in all things. Live in symmetry with the world around you. If you must blow things up and steal from those around you, THAT'S WHAT RPGS ARE FOR!

I claim the first prime number!
Jurgan - [jurgan6@yahoo.com]

Darn the cookies!! >_<

**That was me down there**

Phoenician
"The suspense is terrible, I hope it lasts" -- Willy Wonka

First!
Anonymous