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dph_of_rules writes...
A few weeks ago, we had a discussion in the s8 cr about the size of gargoyle clans and what would/might constitute a full gargoyle clan.
1)Do you have a formal definition of what a full gargoyle clan is (in terms of size and/or egg laying capacity)?
1a)If so, would you share that definition with us?
Greg responds...
I have no fixed definition, as location and resources define the appropriate size of any clan. So the "definition" would differ from place to place.
I think I've said in the past, that in Wyvern in the tenth century, a normal clan ranges from about 40-80 individuals (not including eggs).
Adam writes...
Hi Greg. It's great to see Gargoyles back. Anyway, I have a question about when the Wyvern Clan split between 988 and 994. What I would like to know is why didn't the departing Gargoyles take any of the eggs with them? The new clan would have missed out on an entire generation of the clan. Or did they do something like take more of Bronx's generation(978) with them? I guess that would make sense. Thanks.
Greg responds...
The why had to do with the difficulty of establishing a new rookery. Otherwise, I think you answered your own question.
Wesley Nichols writes...
What happened to the young gargoyles that were of Bronx generation? were they killed in the massacer or did they survive?
An Ask Greg Helper responds...
Greg Weisman says:
There were a lot of gargoyles you didn't see. Kids. Females. Beasts. We couldn't show them all, and frankly, I don't think they would have let us show the kids. Eight year olds getting massacred is a pretty tough thing to put into an afternoon cartoon show. To be honest, that wasn't an envelope I even thought to push.
Wesley Nichols writes...
You mentioned that the Wyvern Clan was created mostly from members of the Manhatten clan, who are themselves decended from the old Wyvern Clan. Does this mean that we would meet more survivors from the clan as the series progressed?
Greg responds...
No, that's not what it means.
Wesley writes...
Where the young Gargoyles (Bronx's generation) of the Wyvern clan killed by Hakon and his vikings as well? Or did they somehow escape?
Greg responds...
All that were there were killed except the guys you know about.
Zoma Dragon Friend writes...
I am new to the Gargoyle World and just have one question. Who are the named members of Wyvern Clan. (I told you I was new). I have been trying to get them all straight but there are relations and mates and...yeah...You have probably answered this question a million times, but I do not want to search 1,000 questions about them.
Greg responds...
Okay, so here I am, for some reason, rewarding your laziness...
The thing to keep in mind is that with the exception of Goliath, the Wyvern Clan had no names. But using names we NOW know them by...
Goliath
Demona
Hudson
Brooklyn
Lexington
Broadway
Bronx
Coldstone/Othello
Coldsteel/Iago
Coldfire/Desdemona
There are others of course that you can spot in footage whose names we still don't know.
The Wyvern Clan generated three other clans: the Manhattan Clan, the Avalon Clan and the Labyrinth Clan.
And in the future a new Wyvern Clan will be founded.
Man Mountain writes...
Hey Greg!
Was the destruction of the other clans by humans, around the time of the Wyvern massacre, organized or just a "good" idea catching on?
I still get chills (and angry at Hakon and the Captain) when I watch that scene and hear the stone crumbling...
Thanks!
Greg responds...
Just to be clear, I never wanted to give the impression that all over the world clans were being destroyed at the exact same time. But the mid to late Middle Ages were a dangerous time for gargoyles. But I'm sure some clans were destroyed centuries before the Wyvern Massacre and some clans were destroyed centuries after, and as we know some clans survived.
Hardwing writes...
1)Well based on the fact that Goliath rested on the highest tower of the castle and Demona, Hudson and a gargoyle I couldn't identify below him, I assume it was tradition that the gargoyles took their sleeping places after their status in the clan, correct?
2)Had the other gargoyle resting beside Demona(not Hudson) any special status in the clan? Or for Goliath?
Greg responds...
1. Generally. We tried not to be too anal about it though.
2. I'd have to look again.
matt writes...
Wyvern
1. you mentioned a LONG time ago that Castle Wyvern was built so quickly (only four years, 971-975) because there was a lot of help from the Archmage and gargoyles, and because there was existing ruins on the site to build on. who built the structure that would become those ruins?
2. where the ruins the ruins of a castle or something else?
3. before Malcolm and Hudson formed their alliance, was there a rookery already existing under the ruins?
4. did the Wyvern Clan roost at these ruins before the alliance with Malcolm?
5. do the ruins have anything to do with all the artifacts, carvings and structures in the Archmage's cave?
6. both Demona and Angela discovered carvings of humans attacking gargoyles in the Archmage's cave. what did those carvings mean? why were they there? were they meant to be recorded images, like a history or were they prophetic...?
7. when the New Wyvern Clan is founded, where will they roost? will they rebuild a structure or just live on the cliffs or...?
thanks Greg!
Greg responds...
1. I'm not answering that at this time.
2. It depends on how you define castle.
3. Yes.
4. Yes.
5. Yes.
6. I'm not answering that at this time.
7. Rebuild a structure.
Todd Jensen writes...
A question about the gargoyles' time living with the humans in Castle Wyvern between 971 and 994. In "Awakening" at the beginning, all the humans living in the castle, except for the Captain of the Guard (and Tom, but he wasn't a regular inhabitant) were, from what we can tell, hostile towards the gargoyles.
Now, since gargoyles and humans had been living side by side for 23 years, I found myself wondering a little about this. I know that prejudice can often take a very long time to overcome, but I still find it a matter of mild concern that after living with gargoyles for 23 years, with ample opportunity during all that time to see what they were really like, the humans would still be so hostile towards them. (Katharine did get conditioned to fear gargoyles due to Prince Malcolm's foolish use of them as bogeymen when she was a child, of course, so her attitude is believable.)
Of course, I suppose that it would require the entire "Dark Ages" series all the way down to the Wyvern Massacre to give a real answer to this question, but I did think that I'd comment on it. (And if after 23 years of sharing their home with the gargoyles, nearly all the humans still disliked them, I can see how it is that Demona is so cynical and pessimistic about peace between the two species. On the other hand, since Katharine and the Magus did abandon their old attitudes after the massacre and even dedicated the rest of their lives to looking after the orphaned eggs, there is hope.)
Greg responds...
There's always hope. I think the prejudice was subtle and on-going, because nothing had ever been done about it.
Most humans in the castle weren't looking to slaughter the Gargoyles or even kick them out. But they took the Gargoyles' defense of the cliffside for granted... enough years had passed that the camaradery of the great battles they shared had been -- not forgotten -- but dampened.
And the leader sets the tone, and for the reasons you listed above, Katharine was not sympathetic to or fond of the Gargoyles. So those Lords looking to curry favor would tend to being dismissive. I also think that the Gargoyles still represented a mental wildcard to the humans. A great force in their midst that they couldn't fully control. It was disturbing. And then there are the archers, who do their jobs well, but who may have had chips on their shoulders because they weren't sufficient to guard the castle... and because their own boss seemed to respect the Gargs more than his own men.
The idea was little things contributing to on-going tension ... and a leader who was part of the problem, not part of the solution.
Anonymous writes...
Were there more Scottish Gargoyles then Goliath's clan out there?,
Greg responds...
Yes.
Anonymous writes...
Almost every gargoyle clan we've meet in the show or that you've us about protects something. The Guatemalan clan protects the rain forest. The Loch Ness clan protects the Loch Ness Monster, the Manhattan, London and Ishimura clan naturally protects New York City, London and Ishimura respectively. And the Avalon clan protects Avalon while the Labyrinth clan presently protect the homeless of New York.
1. So what does the New Olympus clan protect? Mount Thanatos? The whole of New Olympus? Or have they abandoned their duty much like the London clan when they lost Griff(since you did say they were isolationists)?
2.What does the Pukhan and Xanadu clans protect?
3.What exactly do New Camelot and New Wyvern clans protect?
4.What abou the Queen Florence Island Clan(after they've been freed from their stasis)?
5.What about the Notre Dame Clan?
Greg responds...
1. I think they have become too insular. It's something I would have made an issue of, given the chance.
2. Pukhan Clan is more interested in protecting their concept of justice. Xanadu Clan protects the endangered Gargoyle Beast species.
3. New Wyvern is very traditionalist. So they protect Wyvern and it's surroundings. By contrast, New Camelot is very internationalist.
4 & 5. Haven't gotten that far in my thinking yet, but at the least they'll protect the Island and Paris, respectively.
matt writes...
how far is Wyvern, Scotland from Loch Ness, Scotland?
more like ten miles? twenty miles? fifty miles? or more?
Greg responds...
I can't answer this question easily. For starters, Wyvern is a fictional location on the West Coast of Scotland. So where exactly are we measuring from? Secondly, Loch Ness is about thirty miles long. So where exactly are we measuring to? And are we measuring as the crow flies or along practical routes that a car or horseman might have to take?
Nevertheless, I'll give it a shot. As long as you understand I'm not being held to this. In particular, I've done no research to back up this stab at Wyvern's location.
I'm taking out my map and I'm measuring (roughly) the distance as the Gargoyle glides between the Point of Ardnamurchan (at the western end of a western Scotish Peninsula) and Castle Urquhart (which I believe is the model for the fictional castle where Sevarius set up his operation) on Loch Ness.
I come up with approximately 83 miles.
Anonymus writes...
Will you ever give the no-name Wyvern clan members who were shattered names?
Greg responds...
It's not too likely, as they didn't have names.
Gipdac writes...
I could be wrong, but in Vendettas I think Hudson called Hakon "Hakon the destroyer of clans". So, did Hakon have a reputation for smashing gargoyle clan or so it just the one?
Greg responds...
I don't know if that's an exact quotation. I think he called him, "Hakon, Clan-Slaughterer". But I might be mistaken.
In any case, Hudson was referring to the Wyvern Clan.
matt writes...
1. you said the London Clan has a library and thats how Griff knew Goliath looked like "scottish stock". does the London Clan know that there was/still is a Loch Ness Clan in 1996?
2. does the London Clan know about New Olympus?
3. does the London Clan know about the Wyvern Massacre before Goliath arrives during the World Tour?
4. does the London Clan know about Macbeth's alliance with Demona's clan 1000 years ago in 1996?
5. is the London Clan aware of Demona at all in 1996?
6. does the London Clan know that Avalon exists before Goliath arrives in London?
6b. before 1996, does the London Clan know that King Arthur is sleeping on Avalon?
ok ok ok, enough questions, sorry if i'm bugging you... see you at the Gathering cuz i'm gonna make it this year!!!! is the date when you read this June 4th, 2002? just a guess!
Greg responds...
1. I'd guess that they know there WAS. Not sure if they know there IS.
2. I doubt it.
3. I doubt it.
4. Possibly.
5. Possibly.
6. Yes.
6b. Yes. But didn't you?
Try September 8th, 2003.
matt writes...
1. was the New Wyvern Clan founded at Wyvern because thats one of the only places that the Gargoyles knew there was once a clan, but wasn't currently? were the Gargoyles attempting to colonize all places associated with Gargoyles in the past (Notre Dame)?
2. did Scotland make a bid for a Gargoyle clan or did they see the place as theirs to colonize?
3. in 1996, does Xanatos own any of the land surrounding where Wyvern once stood?
4. when Gargoyles recolonized Wyvern, did they attempt to populate it with Gargoyles of Wyvern/Scottish descent, or did they care?
5. how far is Wyvern from Loch ness?
Greg responds...
1. The new Wyvern Clan was, at least in part, a spin-off of the Manhattan Clan, so the "nostalgia" was much more personal.
1a. Not in particular.
2. The group felt they were returning home, so to speak.
3. I haven't thought about whether he owns any land there.
4. It was mostly Wyvern descent, because it was mostly gargs from Manhattan who were of Wyvern descent. But not exclusively. Nor was there any attempt to achieve anything like "clan purity".
5. I don't have a map handy, but you can find Loch Ness on a map at home. The fictional Wyvern's on Scotland's west coast.
Adam Carlson writes...
how many eggs can a gargoyle female lay at one time? during there life time?
And, if there are 36 eggs taken to Avalon, how many gargoyles lived at Castle Wyvern before the massacure.
Greg responds...
1. One. Two on EXTREMELY rare occasions, maybe. Maybe.
2. Three or four tops.
3. I've answered this before, and I don't remember what I said exactly. About forty. But nearly half the clan migrated to form a new clan sometime before the massacre. So there are more eggs than you'd expect from the small numbers that were massacred.
julio writes...
sorry greg about my last question's I mess up on them so
here they are again
1.where they any gargoyle beast in wyvern besides bronx before the wyvern attack
2.if they where any other beast how many where there
Greg responds...
1. Yes.
2. I don't have an exact number in mind.
julio writes...
hey greg ibeen watching gargoyles for seven years and I
to thank you in your great work with gargoyles any way
I have some question's about gargoyle beast
1. how many gargoyle beast lived in wyvern before the massacre besides bronx
Greg responds...
1. I don't have an exact number in mind. More than four. Less than ten. Or so it seems to me at this moment.
matt writes...
1. after i first saw "Awakening" i figured that the rookery of castle Wyvern was behind a door that opened into the same courtyard that the refugees were staying in. if you look at it the Trio and Bronx appear out of that rookery door into the courtyard after the massacre. in "Shadows of the Past" however, we see that if the rookery had been below the castle (or in it) it would've been taken to New York with teh rest of the castle, and it was actually left behind in Wyvern. i'm just curious as to where the rookery actually is (was). below the castle or what? this question isn't intended to find a mistake in the show, just to clarify for me...
2. was there more than one entrance to the rookery?
3. was it a large sequence of caves below the castle and the lands surrounding it?
4. was the rookery in the same place before Castle Wyvern was built?
thanx Greg!
Greg responds...
1. The rookery was beneath the castle proper in a cave. Or rather, the castle was built OVER the rookery.
When Xanatos moved the castle, he moved some of the rock that supported it. We have -- to my knowledge -- never made it clear just how deep into the rock the rookery cave was. It's possible that Xanatos scooped it up too. Or that it was in essence exposed by the removal of castle and "foundation" rock. If X did scoop it up, it's possible he was forced to "fill" the cave in order to create stability. I've never really thought about it before. But I'm not sure why you're sure that the Rookery was left behind in Wyvern. What it comes down to is that it no longer exists as it once did.
2. Probably.
3. It was one largish cave chamber directly below the castle.
4. Yes.
Justin writes...
Greg,
I have asked this before, but I can't find it in the archives.
1) In "Shadowss of the Past" we saw a whole bunch of slaughtered gargs from Goliath's clan. Why was the only female represented Demona?
2) Who was that one gargoyle with the rather big nose that pushed Goliath?
3) I also know that before the massacre, the wyvern clan broke up into two groups. Did more females go than males? That doesn't seem to make a whole lot of sense.
Thank you for you time. And I was good of you to give blood. I did too :)
Greg responds...
1. Limited resources. We just couldn't design the whole clan. Our designers drew up a few random gargoyles, unfortunately all male, and we had neither the time or the money to balance things out.
2. I don't recall Goliath getting pushed.
3. No. Gender-wise there was a fairly equal distribution.
Anonymous writes...
New Wyvern clan
Why are the new Wyvern clan anti-technology? How did they get to QFL?
Greg responds...
Anti-technology may be a bit strong, but they emphasize a more traditional lifestyle without technology. Concessions are made when it's important, I suppose. That includes boarding transportation to an event important to the entire Gargoyle Nation.
Anonymous writes...
Where did most of the original members of the New Camelot Clan come from?
Where did most of the original members of the New Wyvern clan come from?
Where did most of the original members of the Paris clan come from?
Greg responds...
Earth.
Anonymous writes...
Care to explain why the gargoyles in the British isles are so different since in London we have animal headed ways, in Loch Ness aquatic gargoyles and in wyvern the generic ishimura/guatemala kind?
Greg responds...
'Generic ishimura/guatemala kind', huh? Don't agree with that.
But no, I don't currently care to explain it.
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