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Hey Mr. Greg,
Ummm here's my question...it's kinda dumb but I was wondering Why was there hay in the Clock Tower when Elisa was crying. Was there a reason or just there for effect?
Thanky very very much too.
Honestly, I don't remember. Why was there hay?
This is gonna drive me nuts.
1) I was reading FAQ and in the timedancer section you talked about an antagonist called Calaban. Who is Calaban?
2) In the FAQ for bad guys, you mentioned an antagonist named Falstaff. Who is he?
3) Thanks a bunch
For both these guys, I have no intention of revealing my intentions at this time. But if you want a look at the original sources...
Caliban appears in William Shakespeare's THE TEMPEST.
Falstaff is introduced in Shakespeare's HENRY IV, PART ONE. He reappears in HENRY IV, PART TWO and is spun-off in THE MERRY WIVES OF WINDSOR. He dies off-stage in HENRY V.
Greg,
I have asked this before, but I can't find it in the archives.
1) In "Shadowss of the Past" we saw a whole bunch of slaughtered gargs from Goliath's clan. Why was the only female represented Demona?
2) Who was that one gargoyle with the rather big nose that pushed Goliath?
3) I also know that before the massacre, the wyvern clan broke up into two groups. Did more females go than males? That doesn't seem to make a whole lot of sense.
Thank you for you time. And I was good of you to give blood. I did too :)
1. Limited resources. We just couldn't design the whole clan. Our designers drew up a few random gargoyles, unfortunately all male, and we had neither the time or the money to balance things out.
2. I don't recall Goliath getting pushed.
3. No. Gender-wise there was a fairly equal distribution.
Watched "Protection" last Saturday with my wife and kids. Here's a ramble:
CAST
I'm immediately struck by our large supporting cast. Probably because so few of our regulars (Elisa, Goliath, Broadway only) appear in the episode.
THE CROOKS: Dracon, Glasses and Pal Joey. (All very fun to write for.)
THE COPS: Matt, Maria, Morgan. (All three go undercover and do a bit of play-acting, which is also fun.)
THE CIVILIANS: Art, Lois, Dave, Mr. Jaffe, Travis Marshall. (Each is characterized rather quickly, but memorably, I think. It was particularly cool to play off the Matt/Jaffe relationship previously referred to in "Reawakening".)
As for our regulars, we intentionally reduced the number of 'goyles in this one so that we had the space in our short 22 minutes to focus on other things. Goliath and BW seemed the appropriate two to bring along for various reasons -- established most obviously in "Deadly Force" and "The Silver Falcon".
I liked how Goliath reacted to the perversion of the concept of "Protection" and how the movie-savvy BW shakes his head but takes it in stride.
ELISA
Okay, I figure we didn't fool many of you into thinking that Elisa had actually gone bad. I was pretty sure we wouldn't. At least not the older fans. So I tried to fool you another way in the first few minutes. Glasses tells Dracon about a lady cop, but doesn't mention who. Chavez accuses Elisa, but Elisa pleads her innocence. Did anyone think that Elisa was being framed?
My daughter did. But in a way that I hadn't considered, despite the fact that "Double Jeopardy" was part of the same tier and naturally led to her conclusion.
--Erin: "That's not Elisa, is it?"
--Benny: "Yes, it is."
--Erin: "Yeah, that's not her. She never dresses like that."
--Benny: "It's a wig. How'd she get her hair like that?"
--Erin: "It's a clone."
A clone? Of course! That's the problem with introducing so many concepts. Too many options for the viewer. Did anyone else think clone? Erin maintained this idea right until the end of the episode. She kept saying with increasing frustration: "That's not Elisa. It's not."
SPEAKING OF NEW CLOTHES...
I loved Elisa's new outfit, I only wish the animation -- the character modeling -- in the episode had been better. It's not always very flattering to her. Sometimes it seems to WAY flatten her out. Other times, it makes her huge. (Yes, I'm focused on her breasts. I'm a heterosexual male. What do you want from me?) But it never makes her look real. Still, it's just nice to see her wearing something -- ANYTHING -- different. I wish we had had the resources to give her more clothing options in general.
DIALOGUE
Some nice lines in this one...
Elisa to Goliath: "What are you, a puppy?"
Elisa to Glasses, et al: "You tough guys just gonna stand there all night?"
Goliath to Elisa & Dracon: "Money and power sound very appealing."
Dracon to Elisa: "Keep the jar."
Elisa to Broadway: "Keep the jar."
Dracon to Goliath: "So she's your woman. You have good taste."
Broadway to himself: "Why are bad guys always in such a hurry."
Broadway to Pal Joey: "Sorry, Pal."
Broadway's slightly dated black & white movie gangster lingo.
All of Dracon's on-going Honey, Sugar, etc. references and Elisa's reaction to them. Makes me smile still.
JALAPEÑA
You've all heard this story, right?
Okay, BRIEFLY...
Keith David used the exclamation "Jalapeña" all the time. More or less as a replacement for Halleluia. It was an expression he had gotten from a female jazz singer (whose name escapes me at the moment -- as it usually does for some reason). One day in the control booth, voice director Jamie Thomason turned to me and said, "I bet you can't get that into a script." I said, "I bet I can."
Shortly thereafter, poor innocent writer/story editor Gary Sperling turned in a perfectly normal script. I then added this entire "Jalapeña" subplot. (I had to add all this stuff about room service, jars, etc. to justify the last word in the episode.) I fell in love with the idea. I thought it would give us a curse word, basically. (That's how BW uses it in the ep.) Most everyone else hated it. But directors Frank Paur, Dennis Woodyard and Butch Lukic didn't know how far I planned on taking it. They thought it would be a one episode thing, so they indulged me here. In fact, they suggested the massive "Jalapeña!" echoes at the end of the episode. ("If you're gonna do it, do it!")
Jamie would later goad me by saying things like, "Yeah, but I bet you can't get Hudson to say it." And so one by one, everyone said it. Again, I thought it was fun and useful.
But eventually the art staff literally revolted against it. Frank told me I HAD to stop. So what you'll notice is that starting with this episode we ramp up and begin to use the word a lot. And then it peters out and disappears entirely from the show -- until "The Journey" my farewell episode. I put one "Jalapeña" in that. Disney executive Jay Fukuto asked me why I had done that: "I thought Frank hated it." That's why I did it, to annoy Frank and gratify myself.
Frank and I are all good again now. We look back on our Garg days and realize that we didn't even know how good we had it. But I'd say that in 1996 our relationship had deteriorated a bit. The stress of doing 65 episodes had taken a bit of a toll. We weren't at each others' throats or anything. But we were just a bit on edge. Like I said, ancient history. I'd love to work with Frank again now. But there you have it.
DRACON & GLASSES
Lots of loyalty from Glasses. These second banannas always fascinate me. Of course, Xanatos usually treats Owen with the utmost respect. Dracon isn't quite as good a boss. He has a line of contempt after Glasses tells Dracon that the shopkeep [Matt] wants to meet with the boss. Dracon to Glasses: "And he knows it's not you." You wonder why Glasses puts up with it.
I love how quickly Dracon adjusts to the Gargoyles too. The concept of controlling them is so appealing, it submerges his fears. He quickly starts referring to them as Guests, and then as Partners. He even puts a hand on Goliath's shoulder -- briefly.
BOMBS OVER BROADWAY
This guy seems to deal with bombs a lot. This time he hold it in his teeth, which I thought was cool.
THE GROCERY STORE
Poor Mr. Jaffe. He gets robbed all the time. Then he has to put up with a Werefox attack. And now a particle beam battle.
And what's with those giant bags of flour? Who buys those?
And I wish those hidden cameras had actually been hidden.
I'm not in love with the battle choreography here. Elisa gets the jump on Dracon, which is okay, I guess, as he was hoping he could trust her. But then Dracon gets the jump right back. She should have been better prepared. It's all a touch clumsy.
Goliath's roar is interesting. Usually we use more effect and less Keith. This one is more Keith. A lot more Keith.
G's eyes are glowing as he takes Dracon into the air. But you'll notice they stop glowing just before he drops Dracon. This is a clue that he never really intended to let Dracon die. His anger has already ebbed. And after all, "Gargoyle justice is not human justice." Had this been Gargoyle justice, you get the sense that Dracon would have wound up, dare I say it, "Street Pizza."
Things wrap up. Chavez of course is still largely in the dark. But you'll notice that things were staged so that you could believe that Matt may or may not have been in the dark too. Since this episode was part of the same tier as "Revelations" we didn't 100% know for sure whether or not Matt would know about the Gargoyles by the time this aired. So we tried to play it ambiguously here.
ELISA & GOLIATH
Jalapeñas aside, I like the final scene between E&G. They reaffirm their mission and their love for each other. The first explicitly. The second implicitly.
Also we use the scene to justify why Dracon would buy something that I knew the audience wouldn't. "The corrupt are the first to believe that others can be corrupted." If you never thought for a moment that Elisa was dirty then there's hope for you yet. Either that, or your hopelessly cynical about the rules of television.
But did you still think she was a clone?
Anyway, that's my ramble. Where's yours?
In the 2198 contest you said that gargoyles were experimented upon, but we never saw any gargoyle getting experimented upon or were you saving this for the third season?
Well, one could argue that the creation of the clones counted as experimentation on Gargoyles, but, yes, I did have further plans.
I asked this before
Lady Leto writes...
Dear Greg.....
This is a respond to one of your ramblings. You asked:
'Is there anyone out there for whom City of Stone was your first Gargoyle experience? If so, I'd love to hear from you. Did you have a clue as to what was going on?'
Well I was getting my Dad to watch it with me for the first time. And throughout the whole thing he was asking me many question, most of them pointless like do all Gargoyles have tails? And kept on me about names. (Hudson right, nothing is real to humans till they have names.) So yes even with the flashbacks, "Previously" segment, and a hard core garg fan, he was very confused. I think next time I try to get him into Gargoyles I'll start at the beginning.
Also wanted say that it is really cool how you answer all these question. (I have been to the Archives.) It must take alot of time! And you even put up with the not so great questions! I just wanted to say thanks!
Greg responds...
You're welcome. Too bad about your dad. I was afraid of that. Did it at least intrigue him enough to make him want to see more? Or did the confusion just alienate him from the series?
I finally got my dad into the series! I picked an episode by random, it was Revelations. And he liked it! He doesn't like cartoons at all. We watch an episode each week. His favorite character is Hudson, and episode is 'The Mirror' (he thought Puck was really funny!). Well anyway, maybe I can talk him into going with me to the Gathering in 2003 (since we live in Tampa).
I'd love to see you both there.
For those of you who don't know, the site for G2003 has been chosen: NEW YORK CITY, site of the first two Gatherings ('97 & '98) and, obviously, the setting for the series.
But, hey, Lady Leto, how about grabbing your dad and heading for Gathering 2002 in Williamsburg, VA. It's a lot closer to you both physically and temporally.
More Space-Spawn questions...
1) Will there be any main individual Space-Spawn characters in Gargoyles 2198?
2) If so, will there be more than one?
3) Are they necessarily all villains?
1. Yes.
2. Yes.
3. Not saying.
1.Did you intend the first part of the 2198 contest to be the opening prologue for gargoyles 2198?
2a.Do the other four spinoffs have opening prologues?
2b.Have you written all four if they do?
3.If so could you share with us the opeing prologues for Timedancer, New Olympians, Bad Guys and Pendragon?
1. More or less.
2. Not written out. (And there are five other spin-offs.)
3. Not interested in Dark Ages, are you?
[In prep for my ramble on "Protection", here's the memo I faxed to Story Editor/Writer Gary Sperling. (Actually, I'm retyping it -- old typos and maybe some new ones included -- because I don't have a computer file. Just the hard copy.) You'll notice that it's more abbreviated than usual. Note the date. I was on vacation at the time. Plus, the outline may have been in better shape. Also note that the episode's original title was "Undercover". But we realized that Elisa wasn't so much going undercover, and that we'd save that concept for what eventually became "Turf". Besides the one word title, "Protection", was hard to resist given our on-going themes.]
WEISMAN 12-29-94
Notes on "Undercover/Protection" Outline...
BEAT SHEET
ACT ONE
1. Restaurant blows up. Keep very brief.
2. Glasses joins Tony in the limo. Glasses has heard that dirty cops are muscling in on their protection racket.
3. News report to Gargoyles. PRoTECTION RACKET. Goliath wants to see Elisa. She hasn't stopped by in days. Where has she been?
4. ChAvez asking Matt same question. As MATT brings in #3 to question him about restaurant bombing. Elisa arrives late. Matt: "Where you been?" Don't crowd me Bluestone. Asks for time alone with #3 Matt gives it. Elisa starts to talk obliquely about her moving in. Chavez interrupts and suspends her while she's under investigation. Maza protests that she's innocent. HAs to turn in badge and gun.
5. Elisa storms outside. Goliath and Broadway follow.
6. #3 calls Dracon.
7. Pool Hall - reveal Elisa.
ACT BREAK??
Glasses and #3 comes in.
8. Pursuit.? or HUSSLES ELISA OUT.
9. Goliath and Broadway intervene. CHASE.
Elisa pulls the rug out from under G. She leaves w/Glasses.
Goliath says she's under a spell. BW says maybe there's another explanation.
10. Glasses and Dracon. Elisa in the next room. Send her in. You guys get to work.
Elisa and Dracon.
11. Grocery Store: MATT (disguised) and owner. Matt and Glasses.
12. Some phony store. Maria, Morgan and #3. After #3 leaves they make reference to one of their plans is sure to nail Dracon.
13. Goliath and Broadway have gone bad at Dracon's Penthouse.
ACT BREAK
Finish out 13.
Intercut:
14. Broadway helps Maria and Morgan against #3 (and Glasses?)
15. Matt and Elisa nab Dracon. He's ready with men and bomb.
Goliath and Elisa work together to diffuse situation.
(Matt and Goliath relationship should be vague.)
Elisa gets her shield and gun back.
16. Reveal clearly what everyone probably knows by now. Elisa was undercover. BW figured it out and tipped off G. Some PROTECTION TAG.
DRACON OUT ON BAIL?????????
Here's a new ramble for ASK GREG & the DCV...
As usual, I watched the episode recently with my family.
And as usual, everytime my five year-old Benny, sees Xanatos and Fox, he tells his seven year old sister Erin, "You were her. I was Xanatos and you were Fox." [All quotations (both from my kids or from the episode) are approximate.]
ATTITUDES
This is a big episode for attitudes.
Xanatos and Fox pit multiple individuals against each other in life and death circumstances and regard it all as a game.
Lex still hates the Pack.
Dingo is disgusted with the Pack's life of crime, and then even more disgusted with what his teammates do to their bodies. Cool lines like "Save the horrorshow..." or "I hope you don't eat your catch..." or "You're barely our species..." or "I still can't get over what you three did to yourselves..." or "I'm a partner in a freakshow..." or "...after they went Frankenstein on me..." all help distinguish him, perhaps for the first time. We had a notion of where Dingo was going. And this episode helped bridge the gap to "Walkabout". And eventually to the development I did with Gary Sperling, Bob Kline, Troy Adomitis, Doug Murphy and Patrick Archibald on "BAD GUYS," which some of you have seen at the Gathering.
How the mighty have fallen. My point-of-view and Dingo's matched up. The Pack were beginning to feel pathetic. The problem with villains is that after the heroes keeps beating them over and over, you need to find a way to keep them competitive. This episode (reflected in its title, which may or may not have been one of mine, but which I latched onto EARLY and stuck with) was always part of my plans for the Pack. Intro them in the first season as humans. This was necessary, because the world of our first season was MUCH more normal. I wanted to weird the world up in small steps. Don't intro Oberon first, intro Puck. That kind of thing. So once the science was established, we'd upgrade.
This dovetailed nicely with the need for Goliath to 'upgrade' one of his warriors to Second-In-Command. Goliath had been Hudson's second. Demona had been Goliath's. But it was past time to name a new successor. We always had Brooklyn in mind for that roll, but I remember asking Gary whether he felt we had succeeded in establishing that without ever having stated it. He felt we had. What did you guys think when you first saw the episode?
The battle at the bank. On my tape, there's an animation glitch where Dingo hits his head and then seems to intentionally hit his head again. I'm hoping it got fixed for later airings.
Anyway, the battle winds down. No one's done very well. But the Pack is on the run. Erin at this point says, "There's no messing with the big boys." Proving that the Pack was no longer competitive.
Wolf yells, "This isn't over!" sounding very much like Hakon to my ears.
Lex wants to pursue, but Brooklyn already the subconscious leader of everyone's choice, says, "Helping Goliath is more important."
Hudson gooses Goliath to choose a second. Refuses the job himself. This is another example of Hudson being the guardian of tradition. He knows they live in a brave new world. But he wants to preserve what worked in the old one as well.
Erin says, "I think Goliath's going to choose the red guy." Meaning Brooklyn. I am briefly horrified that my own kids don't reliably know the names of the lead characters. (Of course, before last week, we hadn't watched the series in a year. But still...)
I love the idea of Coyote's head knocking on the door of the Pack's ship. For starters it's so odd to get a knock while in flight. Second, how did he knock. Why with his forehead of course...
The trio begin their competition. Bronx is disgusted.
The new Pack is revealed. What was everyone's reaction? The Coyote-Head had laid out the options, but were you at all shocked at the upgrades when you first saw them?
I like the creepy Addams Family moment with Jackal's arm. I like that this Wolf and Dingo are now competitive in strength with Goliath.
I find it interesting that we had Goliath say, "What manner of trickery is this?" instead of "What sorcery is this?" I mean, who were we kidding, right?
Hudson then brings up the Archmage's sorcery. Just a reminder that the Archmage existed for what we knew was coming in Avalon.
I don't know if this was fixed for reairing, but their's a big mistake in this first battle. Goliath spots COYOTE the robot flying off and goes off alone in pursuit. This was supposed to be him spotting just the little head. He goes off after the head, thinking he'll find Xanatos or something. Then the giant Robot steps forward. Would have been a much better reveal.
I love the interaction as the Pack chooses a leader.
Cree is great reading: "Coyote, honey..." and "I find him very attractive." Hyena's attraction to Coyote was a fun running gag. But did it influence her choice of upgrades?
Jackal is grossed out, proving as ever, that he's just a tad saner than his sister. "Well, that's sicker than usual." He sides with Wolf, just for that reason.
Leaving Dingo with the deciding vote.
More animation errors that I hope got corrected eventually: Fox's lips don't move. So suddenly we're hearing her internal monologue.
Note that Broadway actually foils the most crime in their nightly competition. We did that on purpose. To show that was never the point.
Xanatos says, "Clever move." to end an act.
Then we come back, and he's confident saying, "I think I've still got the edge." Of course that line was a literal reuse of the line from "The Edge". We had a lot of so-so animation in this episode. It forced us to cut the show tight enough that we had to add footage. So we reprinted the shot of X&F playing chess and reused the old line to fill the space.
Final battle.
Everytime Hyena's hand folded backwards, Erin would say: "Eww, that's disgusting!"
CONTINUITY: Just as Lex dislikes the Pack, Bronx seems to particularly dislike Coyote. He's always chewing on that bot, forcing Coyote to threaten to "send this puppy into orbit!"
I love Hyena's line: "I wonder if Gargoyles taste like chicken?" Can't help thinking she'd sincerely like to know.
Frank Paur had this idea that when Wolf got angrier, he'd morph even wolfier. But the animation never quite worked on that. It was a great idea, but the transformation doesn't play dramatically, so it just looks like the model changes part way through the fight.
Coyote's demise was heavily influenced by the first Terminator movie. We keep destroying the darn bot, but it just keeps getting up.
Morgan reappears. I was never wild about his "Hospital, Machine Shop or Vet" line. It's okay, but it seemed a bit too flip.
Goliath, like the production staff, had his choice in mind all along. Brooklyn. By now the trio's come around to the same idea, except Brooklyn himself, who suddenly realizes the weight he'll be carrying around. A prelude to "Kingdom", as he says to Goliath, "Be careful. I'm in no hurry to take your place."
(Nice moment in their when Hudson pets Bronx. It has nothing specific to do with anything else, but it's a nice touch.)
Fox & Xanatos make such a cool couple. I love that he doesn't mind losing to her. Happier to have found a true equal.
And I love that chilling, funny ending: "Care to play again?"
Ever wonder about their next game?
Anyway, there's my ramble. Where's yours?
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