A Station Eight Fan Web Site
: « First : Displaying #10 - #19 of 131 records. : 10 » : 100 » : Last » :
Posts Per Page: 1 : 10 : 25 : 50 : 100 : All :
For the GargWiki's timeline, I was wondering if you would please share the dates and descriptions from your timeline of the events of "Bad Guys"?
Thanks!
I'm feeling generous, so:
Saturday, June 15th, 1996
That evening in Ishimura, the gargoyles hold a council meeting with their human neighbors. Yama is banished until his honor can be restored.
Sunday, October 27th, 1996
Robyn Canmore is arrested.
Friday, November 1st, 1996
The Director gives the Hunter Robyn Canmore a choice between staying in prison or leading an elite squad of desperadoes on dangerous missions. Robyn chooses the latter.
Tuesday, November 5th, 1996, 7:00pm AEDT
In Australia, Dingo and Matrix defeat the Tasmanian Tiger. They are then defeated by Hunter. She offers Dingo a choice between prison and charter membership in her new Redemption squad. Dingo reluctantly elects to join. Matrix chooses to sign on as well.
Friday, November 8th, 1996, 7:07pm UTC+09
Vinnie tries to find the train to Ishimura. Hunter, Dingo and Matrix coerce the gargoyle Yama into joining their team. They head for Paris.
Friday, November 8th, 1996, 9:27pm EST.
Sevarius poses as âFredâ to sneak into the Labyrinth past Al, Benny, Tasha, Claw, Shari and Thug. He reveals himself to Fang, whom he calls Fred Sykes.
December 22nd, 1996
Dingo, Matrix and Yama train in the Squadâs headquarters beneath the Eiffel Tower. Hunter walks past Notre Dame and remembersâ¦
Wednesday, December 31st, 1996
After midnight, the Redemption Squad arrives in Manhattan to investigate Anton Sevarius, ensconsing themselves at the Casablanca Hotel. After sunrise, Robyn Canmore visits Jason Canmore at Rikers and John Castaway (a.k.a. Jon Canmore) at the Quarrymen Brownstone. John washes his hands of her. Dingo and Matrix go off on their own to pursue Sevarius before sundown. After sunset, Yama and Hunter follow them into the Labyrinth but split up. Hunter is about to be attacked by Fang. Yama rescues Hunter, but Fang shocks both unconscious and takes them to Sevarius, who has already mutated Thug, Tasha, Erin and Benny. They are rescued by Dingo and Matrix.
Thursday, January 1st, 1997
The Squad prevents Fang from releasing Sevariusâ CV-1997 virus on Times Square. Later, they discover that Sevarius has escaped and Tasha has hanged herself. Yama nearly executes Fang, but Hunter talks him out of it. Thug takes Erin and Benny back to the Labyrinth. Hunter is forced to admit Fang to the Squad.
Saturday, January 3rd, 1997
Hunter briefs Dingo, Matrix, Yama and Fang on their mission to attack an Illuminati Society stronghold.
Monday, January 5th, 1997
Dingo, Matrix, Hunter, Yama and Fang approach Eastcheap Isle, when their battle-copter Redemption is blown out of the sky. Matrix saves them. Seven robots attack. Fang abandons them. Yama destroys Robot #6 but is targeted by Robot #7. Hunter and Dingo destroy Robot #1. And, while Matrix armors up around Dingo, Hunter also destroys Robot #2 â" but is targeted by Robot #4. Meanwhile, Fang destroys Robot #5 and then saves Yama by destroying Robot #7. Dingo/Matrix saves Hunter and destroys Robot #4. Hunter destroys Robot #3. Yama destroys the newly-arrived Robot #8 and the two Sentry Robots #9 and #10. They enter the islandâs interior and battle Points, Doll, Bardolph, Quickly and Pistol. But Dingo recognizes Pistol as an associate of his former mentor John Oldcastle, now known as Falstaff, King of Thieves. Falstaff, the Illuminatiâs treasurer, welcomes the squad to Eastcheap and, with the help of Fiona Canmore and Thailog, tries to convince them to change sides. The Squad plays along, but Falstaff is not fooled. A battle results in Falstaff submerging his island/ship. The squad survives, adrift. Meanwhile in Paris, the Director confers with his assistant Dolores and his superior Monsier Le Maire.
Second question--and given the snafu with the last one, the first one with my name...
Upon first reading "Bad Guys #4", I was rather surprised to see Dingo acting so forcefully in order to prevent Yama from killing Fang in righteous rage. I know acts like that are standard behavior for heroic characters, and that the point of the series is to feature the transtion of these no-longer-villains into actual heroes, but I wouldn't have thought that Dingo was at the "revenge killing is bad and must be stopped" phase yet, particularly given his past as a mercenary--until the moment occured, I would have thought that his reaction would have been to think "good riddance to bad rubbish".
So to sum up all this in the form of a question: why do you feel Dingo was so adamant in preventing Yama from killing Fang?
I'm not sure adamant is the word. He just didn't think Fang was worth it. And I think Dingo had already gotten on board with the general "Thou Shalt Not Kill" thing. Even before Hunter co-opted him into her fight.
Bad Guys was an excellent story, but I do have one question about one of the protagonists. Yama makes a point at the end of the story to note that each Bad Guy has an inner need to redeem himself or a greater purpose found in redemption. Matrix, however, is distanced from the rest of them almost immediately in terms of motivation as his mission is simply to preserve "law and order."
Now, I'm not knocking this at all; Matrix is my favorite protagonist in the book. But I think the distinction is interesting.
1. Does Matrix understand the concept of redemption?
2. Will he eventually find a reason why his own redemption might be necessary?
1. Good question. One that we'll explore given the opportunity.
2. Have to answer #1, before we can get to #2.
1. Were any of the Falstaff's Band of Thieves members Illuminati or are they just minions or henchmen?
2. If they are members of the Illuminati, what is the rank of:
A. Falstaff (John Oldcastle)?
B. Pistol?
C. Mistress Quickly?
D. Bardolph?
E. Points?
F. Doll?
3. What's the real name of:
A. Pistol?
B. Mistress Quickly?
C. Bardolph?
D. Points?
E. Doll?
4. Did Dingo know any of the Band of Thieves besides Falstaff and Pistol?
5. Why did John Oldcastle (Falstaff) strangle Dingo's mom?
6. What did the Redemption Squad plan on doing with Mistress Quickly?
1. Not saying.
2. Not saying.
3. Not saying.
4. No.
5. Not saying.
6. Not saying.
So I've been lurking a bit, and I see folks are questioning the accessibility of the Gargoyles comics.
And I know I shouldn't do this, but I'm going to defend my own work here instead of just letting it stand on its own.
I totally reject the notion that the comics aren't accessible to new readers, unfamiliar with the GARGOYLES property. Now, granted Clan-Building, Volume II is pretty inaccessible IF you haven't read Clan-Building, Volume I. But in fairness to me, the Clan-Building arc is published in two volumes for commercial reasons, not creative ones. It's not two six-issue arcs; it's one twelve issue arc. So if you read Clan-Building in it's entirety OR if you read Bad Guys in it's entirety, I think both these arcs are extremely ACCESSIBLE.
And, yes, I've seen the reviews that claim that they're not. But I notice that those reviews are written by people who ARE passingly familiar with the cartoon and are making the ASSUMPTION that the books would be inaccessible to new readers. But I don't buy it. I've been doing this for a LONG time. And I know how to fill in my reader and/or viewer, introduce new concepts, etc.
Every issue in sequence introduces all the necessary information to a new reader that said reader would need. Does a reader benefit if they know all the backstory? Of course. But they don't have to know that backstory to enjoy the comic.
Let me take a specific example -- one that a reviewer specifically brought up. At the very end of issue #2 of Bad Guys, Sevarius appears. The reviewer (who knew exactly who Sevarius was) thought that I was blowing off new readers, because I gave NO backstory or introduction to Sevarius in that issue. But I'd argue that no introduction was necessary at that point. We've seen a mysterious figure descend into the Labyrinth, taser a guard, shed a disguise and confront Fang, claiming to know his real name and stating that he is Fang's "maker". That's ALL you need to know at that point as a new reader. It's perfectly okay if you DON'T know who this guy is. It's intriguing enough on that level. And in the very next issue (or chapter if you're reading the trade) Hunter gives all the backstory on Sevarius that you need to appreciate his role in issues/chapters #3 and #4. Yes, a hardcore fan is going to get extra juice when Sevarius pulls off his disguise because they'll recognize him. But even if Sevarius had been a brand new character, I wouldn't have handled his introduction any differently.
Look at Tasmanian Tiger. He is a new character. I hope he's at least a little bit intriguing. But is a new reader lost because they DON'T know that this is his first appearance? Readers, whether they are hardcore Garg fans or complete newbies, know as much about TT as they need to know -- and no more.
Yes, there are resources on the web -- BUT I don't count on those AT ALL, with one exception. And that exception is if people wonder why I'm ignoring Goliath Chronicles. And a new reader isn't even going to KNOW about Goliath Chronicles, so it's NOT an exception to him or her.
Otherwise, I use the tools I have within the book to explain what an audience needs to know. Someone familiar with the property may THINK the reader needs to know more, but I flat-out think they're wrong. My proof is anecdotal but it exists. I know people who've read the books and enjoyed them even though they never saw the show. Has it interested them in finding out more about the original series? Yes. And that's good and fine. But there's a difference between a new reader being intrigued and WANTING to learn more and a new reader being confused and NEEDING to know more to get what's going on.
You don't need to KNOW Brooklyn's entire history to know he's hurting because he can't get a date, to know he's pining for Angela and to know he's trying to get away from Angela and Broadway before chapter 10 of Clan-Building comes along -- and he's thrust into the past. Everything you NEED to know about him is present in issues 1-9. One benefits from knowing more, but that doesn't make it necessary to know more.
Of course, the greatest blockade to accessibility is the non-linear structure of chapters 7-9. But that's not property-based or familiarity-based, that's me using a non-traditional structure, which I might have done on an issue of, say, Captain Atom or Spider-Man or whatever. Hopefully, if a reader has read the first six chapters, they're intrigued enough to want to follow along despite the difficult structure.
Remember, issues 1 & 2 are designed to introduce you to the world of Gargoyles and any relevant information about said world. I got slammed by one reviewer for opening the comic book series with that adaptation of "The Journey", but I thought it was essential for new readers. One could argue fairly that each succeeding issue isn't as accessible as those first two, but complications and characters were added gradually through those first six issues. Anyone reading the book in order would not have been lost for a minute. If we hadn't been plagued by delays and late deliveries (which I had no control over and did not anticipate) it wouldn't have been the same kind of problem.
Any comic book or animated series that employs serialization and continuity is subject to these difficulties. And the middle chapter of any story (including a twelve-part story like Clan-Building or a six-part story like Redemption) can be tough to follow without having read the first few chapters. But just as I feel you can enjoy, say, "Leader of the Pack" without ever having seen any episodes from Season One of Gargoyles, I think Clan-Building can be enjoyed without having seen ANY of the Gargoyles TV series. Is the same true for "Avalon, Part Two" or "Avalon, Part Three"? No. But I think it IS true for "Avalon, Part One" and/or the three-part "Avalon" series when considered as a single unit.
My point is, I'm very familiar with the dilemma, and I know how to compensate. Or in any case, I'm VERY aware of the need to compensate. One can argue that I failed, I suppose. It does become subjective at some point. But nothing I did was done without very conscious thought on my part vis-a-vis the needs of a new reader. So any reviewer who claims that I didn't care or didn't try to make the book accessible is just -- well, wrong. And I think they are making assumptions based on THEIR knowledge of the richness of the property. They get all these resonances and call-backs, etc., and ASSUME a new reader would be lost without them. But you know what they say about the word "ASSUME". The resonances and call-backs are gravy. (And if you don't know they exist you won't know you're missing anything.) The meat, in my opinion, is all right there on the page.
Could humans be turned into Gargoyles by the same process that was used on the mutates? Sevarius didn't say he couldn't do it but that he had no Gargoyle DNA to play around with. Would Gargoyle DNA too complex to use in the same way as the jungle cats, eels etc?
Clearly, you have not been reading the BAD GUYS comic book. So I'll refer you to the Bad Guys trade paperback, due out in August. Enjoy!!
Got Bad Guys #2 today and really enjoyed it. I'll have to read it again before I do any kind of review, but I have a question.
Toward the end we see Shari hanging out in the Labyrinth as "Fred" wanders through. Without making suggestions that may be construed as ideas, what is the time frame for this scene? Am I correct in assuming its sometime before Halloween?
Since we're on the subject, I'd like to fill in the Bad Guys timeline:
1) What date did Hunter recruit Dingo and Matrix?
2) What date did Hunter recruit Yama?
3) What date did Sevarius spring Fang from the Labyrinth?
4) What date did the Redemption helicopter get blown out of the sky?
Any other Bad Guys-related dates you'd like to provide would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks!
1. Tuesday, November 5th, 1996, 7:00pm AEDT
2. Friday, November 8th, 1996, 7:07pm UTC+09
3. Friday, November 8th, 1996, 9:27pm EST
4. Monday, January 5th, 1997
Others and myself noticed that Dingo's Pack armor seems to have disappeared in Bad Guys comic issue #1. Did Matrix completely absorb Dingo's armor so that Dingo's original Pack armor doesn't exist out of Matrix?
Yes.
SLG informed me today that Gargoyles: Bad Guys #1, "Redemption, Chapter 1: Strangers" will hit the stores on Thursday, November 29th, 2007.
Good news in and of itself, but what pleases me most is that it's out in November (if just under the wire). That means our goal of having some MONTHLY gargoyles product has been achieved. And since there's really NO reason why the already completed Gargoyles #7 shouldn't be out in December, that gives us a running start to STAY monthly! And don't forget the Trade Paperback, collecting the first half of "Clan-Building" which is also completed and approved and should be out in December or early January. C'mon! Tell me it's not a great time to be a Gargoyles fan! I dare ya!
Anyway, "Strangers" is by myself and Karine Charlebois with lettering by David Hedgecock and a cover featuring Matrix by Greg Guler and Stephanie Lostimolo. I hope you like it!
When does Bad Guys #1 come out?
End of November or beginning of December, 2007.
: « First : Displaying #10 - #19 of 131 records. : 10 » : 100 » : Last » :