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Todd Jensen writes...

You mentioned that you have a project planned in which Theseus will be a major character. Just out of curiosity, what sort of project is it? Is it a proposed television series, a movie screenplay, a stage play, or something else?

Greg responds...

It began when I was a kid. Originally, it was going to be a comic book Universe. Now, who knows?

Response recorded on August 19, 2000

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Aaron writes...

"I've seen the movie. What's this post in reference too?"

Check the archives. ;) I've always wanted to say that.

But seriously, do you remember the bit in Dead Again where Kenneth Braunagh asks Andy Garcia what Kenneth's 40s doppleganger whispered to him before he was executed, and Andy says "He kissed me."

I asked if that was the answer to the old what did Titania whisper to Fox question, and asked if you knew what movie I was riffing on. Hope this clears things up.

Greg responds...

Yep. Sorry, I was so slow.

"Check the archives." <grumble, mumble, grumble>

Response recorded on August 18, 2000

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Todd Jensen writes...

One little Arthurian note about your theory that the grave at Glastonbury really contained the bodies of Lancelot and Guinevere rather than Arthur and Guinevere. I noticed that Roger Lancelyn Green went for the same notion himself. (And it's not a bad way of explaining the grave, either, once you a) recall that Lancelot turned monk at Glastonbury after Arthur's passing and so was in the area in his final days, and b) go for the notion of Avalon being a faerie island - as it's portrayed in "Gargoyles" - rather than just an old-fashioned name for Glastonbury).

Greg responds...

Yep.

You and me should start a R.L. Green fan club.

Response recorded on August 18, 2000

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Laura 'ad astra' Ackerman writes...

The questions keep on coming in!

Have you every seen the cartoon Exosquad? It was the first cartoon series with a serious running plotline I saw. It did not have quite the breath of Gargoyles [what does?], but it was interested in a much smaller timeframe- a devastating war and the events of the last half century or so that created it. Aside from a running story line the thing that most reminded me of Gargoyles in it was the complex theme behind it. It did deal a bit with accepting the strange and different and the consequences of hatred, but even more it dealt with the idea of mankind as beings who can create far beyond their ability to take responsibility for their creations. If you had not heard of it before Gargoyles, did anyone bring it up when you were working on Starship Troopers? [btw, I am greatly enjoying that series and was very happy to see your name at the beginning of a few ep] Whoever came up with Exosquad has probably read Heinlein. As the only member of my family who has not yet read Starship Trooper or The Moon is a Harsh Mistress, I can only guess that the use of exosuits, jump troops, and pirates descendent from abandoned penal colonies were borrowed from Heinlein- almost as explicitly as Roughnecks does. If you can get your hands on some copies of the series I highly recomend it.

Greg responds...

> The questions keep on coming in!

No kidding! I thought I'd never get through "June 27"! Were you guys having a contest of your own that day to see how many questions you could post?

Anyway, I've seen one episode of Exosquad. Unfortunately, it was a middle episode and I couldn't keep all the characters straight. I didn't stick with it. But I've heard great things.

But no, I don't recall anyone mentioning it while we were working on Troopers. There's no doubt however that Heinlien orginated the ENTIRE powersuit, sci-fi jump troops, space marines idea. (I'm not sure about the pirates.) It may all seem old hat today -- heck, we even borrowed from it in Gargoyles more than once -- but it all originated with Heinlein.

I've never read "The Moon is a Harsh Mistress" either, by the way. But I've read a lot of other Heinlein. He's definitely one of my all time favorite Science Fiction authors.

Response recorded on August 02, 2000

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Charles writes...

How did you or one of your fellow creators come up with the idea for Thailog's name? I realize it is Goliath spelled pretty much backwards.

Greg responds...

I was at a sound mix session for the edited version of AWAKENING. We kept playing scenes over and over to make sure the sound was right. We'd listen to it and then rewind to listen again. I kept hearing the word "Thailog" over and over and over again. It was driving me nuts. Finally, I realized it was "Goliath" SAID (not spelled) backwards. Right then and there, I came up with the idea for Goliath's evil clone. I knew what he looked like (inspired somewhat -- believe it or not -- by what John Byrne did to the Fantastic Four's costumes after their trip to the Negative Zone and by Darkwing Duck's nemesis NegaDuck) and I knew where he'd come from and I knew what he'd be named: THAILOG. It just sounded so great.

Response recorded on August 02, 2000

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steven s (repost by Aris) writes...

Just watched "the edge" .In the scene when the gargs are fighting the steel clan, goliath says to brooklyn "No doubt for us to lead them back to our new sanctuary" meaning xanatos wants to find out where the Gargoyles live.

But at the end of the episode, when the gargs turn to stone they are outside on top of the clock tower. Don't u think that would be a easy place for xanatos to find the gargs? seeing as they would be visible from say a chopper?
I think it would be a lot safer if the gargs turned to stone indoors.
thanks in advance.Keep up the episode reviews, i enjoy reading your opinions on them.

Greg responds...

We felt the Gargs being on the ledge was a classic example of them hiding in plain sight. (Compare Poe's "The Purloined Letter".) I don't think Xanatos was checking every building in town. I don't think, frankly, it occured to him that they'd be quite that easy to find.

Still, largely the gargs were still operating out of a custom that wasn't designed to safeguard them even back in the tenth century. It might not have been wise, but it was their WAY.

Response recorded on August 01, 2000

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Fenrir writes...

Greetings Mr. Weisman!

On 12/29/99 you said:

"Who said any of this was the Archmage's plan? Well, he did. But he was an arrogant bastard. So do you trust him? Where did he get the plan? By observing his future self carry it out. Where did his future self get the plan? By observing HIS future self carry it out. Maybe there's something larger going on here... "

I myself have dubbed this sort of time-travel story The Archmage Paradox, but anyways: Was your statement intended to be a hint of something from a future series? Or even from your intended Season Three? Just curious.

Greg responds...

Not from season three, but yes, eventually.

And I believe what you are flatteringly referring to as "The Archmage Paradox" is actually what is known as a "Working Paradox". That is as opposed to a "Non-Working Paradox" like the kind where a guy goes back to kill his own great-grandfather. A Working Paradox is also sometimes known as a Circular Paradox (for obvious reasons), or a Heinlien Paradox -- since Robert Heinlein's short story "All You Zombies" is the ultimate example of such a paradox. It's a great story by the way. Everyone should read it. It was a real influence on my view of time travel.

Response recorded on July 26, 2000

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Chapter XVII: "A Lighthouse in the Sea of Time"

Written by Brynne Chandler Reaves & Lydia C. Marano
Story Edited by Michael Reaves

Well, I watched "Lighthouse" again last night with my family. First thing I noticed was the bad "Previously" recap. This is all my fault. The recap features Macbeth, because I wanted to make sure the audience knew who he was. But that blows out the first act surprise reveal that he's behind it all. Up to that point in the story, you'd be thinking Xanatos. But because of the dopey recap, you know it MUST be Mac. Later in the season, after I got hammered over these recaps by the folks on the Disney Afternoon e-Mailing list, I learned never to put anything into the recap that wasn't revealed in the first five minutes of the show to follow. But here's a perfect example of me screwing up my own mystery.

We introduce archeologists Lydia Duane and Arthur Morwood-Smythe. Dr. Duane was named after writers Lydia Marano and Diane Duane. Professor Morwood-Smythe was named after writers Arthur Byron Cover and Peter Morwood. Arthur is Lydia's husband. Peter is Diane's husband. I don't know anyone named Smythe.

Macbeth episodes, at least up to this point, seem to be cursed with mediocre animation. (Of course, everything's relative. Mediocre on Gargs was still better than most series got. But relative to our expectations, this ep is pretty weak.) I bet Elisa would have really looked cute in that red baseball hat if the animation had been even slightly better.

I don't know how clear it is in the prologue. The idea there, was that the wind was blowing through the lyre. The haunting sound drew the archeologists further into the cave. They read the warning which indicates that the seeker of knowledge has nothing to fear, the destroyer everything. They are supposed to hesitate, look at each other, decide that they are seekers not destroyers and then open the chest. Merlin's clearly put a safety spell of some kind on the chest. An image of the old man appears and basically checks to confirm whether the archeologists are in fact seekers or destroyers. Satisfied, the spell disipates. But you can imagine what would have happened if a Hakon type had stumbled in.

Anyway, it never felt like all that came across. Did it?

Brooklyn (re: Broadway): "Ignorance is bliss." In High School, I had a classmate named Howard Bliss. We had chemistry together with Mr. Miller. Mr. Miller once asked the class a question that we all should have known. No one knew the answer, and our own idiocy generated laughter among Miller's students. He just shook his head and said: "Ignorance is bliss." He forgot that he had a student named Bliss. It generated more laughter. I don't know why I told you that. But it's what I thought about when Brooklyn read that line.

There's a semi-heavy-handed "Read More About It" feel to the clock tower conversation regarding Merlin. Goliath practically quotes those public service announcements, saying there are many books about him in the library. I don't mind. I had wanted to cite a few actual books -- like Mary Stewart's THE CRYSTAL CAVE -- but our legal department wouldn't give us clearance for that. Very short-sighted.

A connection is made between Merlin and the Magus. This was not an accident, as at that time, I had planned to have the Magus journey with Arthur on his Pendragon quests to find Excalibur and Merlin. I later changed my mind. But the Magus does at least play a Merlin-esque roll in the Avalon three parter.

I always wonder who was playing in "Celebrity Hockey" that night.

Macbeth's standard Electro-Magnetic weapon was my idea. I didn't design it exactly, but I did make crude little drawings of something that looked vaguely like a staple gun, with two electrodes that generated the charge. I was always proud of that weapon. It was uniquely Macbeth's (and Banquo and Fleances'). Set him apart from all the concussion, laser and particle beam weapons we used elsewhere. (I did the same kind of thing on the Quarymen's hammers.)

It's fun to listen to B.J. Ward voice both sides of the confrontation between Fleance and Duane.

Banquo's model sheet showed him squinting out of one eye. Some episodes, not so much this one, but some took that to mean he only had one eye. So he walks around looking like Popeye for the entire episode. (His big lantern jaw helps accentuate that.) There are a couple of Popeye moments in this ep. But more in his next appearance I think.

It was my idea to just have Mac's mansion rebuilt without explanation. I don't exactly regret it, but it's kinda cheap. We burned it way down. He has it rebuilt. It makes sense. But we usually dealt with consequences more than that.

When he rebuilds it, he installs those cannons. They were supposed to be giant-sized versions of the hand-held E-M guns. But they don't come off that way. Instead they fire at the gargoyles. And mostly seem to destroy the various turrets of Macbeth's own place. Ugghh.

As in "Leader" we get another scene of Goliath and friends confronting Owen at the castle. Looking for Xanatos, when in fact Xanatos isn't the threat. It made sense in both episodes. And it's always nice to showcase Owen a bit. But after two of those in four episodes, I wasn't gonna do that again. (At least not until KINGDOM.)

I love the "Macbeth Theme" that Carl Johnson created for the villain, which is featured at the end of ACT ONE.

Macbeth opens the "second scroll" and starts to read Merlin's seal. This caused tons of fan confusion, as he read "Sealed by my own [i.e. Merlin's] hand". No one seemed to get that he was reading that. They thought Mac was saying that he [i.e. Macbeth] had sealed the scroll. Of course that notion renders the whole thing confusing as hell. But it never occured to us that anyone would take it that way.

We also introduce Jeffrey Robbins and Gilly in this episode. Gilly is of course short for Gilgamesh, one of the legendary characters that Robbins once wrote about. It's just a bit odd, because Gilly is a female.

Robbins is a very cool character. Wish we had had the opportunity to use him more.

I like how when Robbins and Hudson are introducing themselves, Robbins gives his first and last name. Hudson says, I'm Hudson, "like the river". An echo of how he got the name. And a reminder that names aren't natural to him. Even if they are addictive.

John Rhys-Davies is just fantastic as Macbeth. I love his speech to Broadway. It accomplishes everything we needed it too. That line about the "human heart" by the way is a reference to the Arthur/Lance/Gwen triangle.

I also love his line: "I'm Old, but not THAT Old." This was a little hint to what we'd reveal in CITY OF STONE. Sure Macbeth's from the eleventh century, but not the fifth or sixth. It's like someone saying to someone my age, "So what did you do during World War II?"

Lennox Macduff. That was a cool touch. Also a hint as to how Macbeth feels about Shakespeare.

I like the Phone Book scene too. Hudson says "Hmm. Magic Book." Robbins replies: "Aren't they all." Great stuff.

By the way, as Robbins goes through the phone book, scanning names, he passes "Macduff, Cameron". One of my college roommates was Cameron Douglas, who was really interested in his Scotish heritage. That was a mini-tribute to him.

My daughter Erin reacts to the fact that Macbeth threatens to use Merlin's spells on Broadway. She points out that Macbeth had promised to let Broadway go after he had the scrolls. She's surprised he hasn't kept his word. My wife at that point reminds Erin that Macbeth is the villain. Erin gets that. But you can tell it isn't quite sitting right with her.

Later when Macbeth DOES let everyone go without a struggle, Erin is clearly not sure what to make of him.

And on one level, that's exactly as we wanted it. Macbeth is a troubled guy -- a hero who's devolved into a villain. A suicidal villain on top of that, though we hadn't revealed that yet. But he is a villain. Later, it's debatable, but here he's taken to being an ends-justify-the-means kinda guy. And even his ends are hazy at best.

I love Broadway's "precious magic" speech. It's so wierd hearing poetry from the big galoot. But that's so Broadway. The soul of a poet. Bill Faggerbakke was a huge help.

And I love Robbins "They are lighthouses in the dark sea of time..." speech. I love that it's not exactly the title. Brynne and Lydia did fine work on this one.

I wonder what happened to that lyre?


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Ambrosia writes...

Greg, you could write a book: 101 Ways to Live a *Really Long Time*.
It seems everyone is at least a thousand years old in the gargoyle universe :)

Anyway, my question is, how were you planning on introducing Theseus? More meddling from the Weird Sisters? Or did he just eat really well, excercise and refrain from smoking?
:)

Greg responds...

I never said I was planning to intro Theseus. Theseus is a major character in another project of mine.

I'm sure eventually, Theseus would make an appearance in the Garg Universe. Either in TimeDancer or in flashback, but I don't have any specific plans for that right now, other than perhaps in dealing with the "truth" behind Shakespeare's "A Midsummer Night's Dream". And I'm rethinking that these days.

Response recorded on July 10, 2000

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James Park writes...

One of my favorite quotes is the one by Jeffrey Robbins at the end of Lighthouse in a Sea of Time. The one

The written word is all that stands between memory and oblivion. Without books as our anchors, we are cast adrift neither teaching, nor learning. They are windows on the past, mirrors on the present, and prisms reflecting all possible futures. Books are lighthouses erected in the dark
sea of time.

1) Who wrote this? I have it currently attributed to you, but do you know who actually wrote it?

2) Didn't oral traditions serve the same function (in at least some ways--keeping customs and histories alive) as books in certain cultures, like Native American, and others?

Greg responds...

1. No, not me. It was either Brynne Chandler Reaves or Lydia Marano or both. The title itself, "A Lighthouse in the Sea of Time", comes I believe from a Barbara Tuchman book. (Can anyone confirm this?)

2. Probably, yes.

Response recorded on July 10, 2000

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Todd Jensen writes...

An additional little thought, inspired by your comparing Coldstone to the Frankenstein monster. As somebody who's read the original book by Mary Shelley, and quite liked it, I feel that while Coldstone certainly has a strong echo of the monster in him, as you've pointed out, I feel that Goliath does as well, although more in a contrast than in a similarity.

Like the monster (as portrayed by Mary Shelley in her book; alas for the way that Hollywood weakened the character by turning him into a mute, shuffling brute), Goliath is a noble being who appears threatening towards humans and is shunned and feared by so many humans whom he seeks to help. Also like the monster, Goliath is a thoughtful and eloquent being, and well-read with a taste for the classics (the Frankenstein monster reads Plutarch's Lives and Milton's "Paradise Lost", while Goliath reads Shakespeare and Dostoyevsky). The big difference is that the Frankenstein monster is all alone, with nobody to befriend him, and becomes embittered towards humanity thus, while Goliath has the clan and Elisa, which undoubtedly helps him. They're almost foils, in a sense. (Of course, Goliath also isn't an artificial creation, either, as the monster was). Just a little thought that had occurred to me.

Greg responds...

I like that analysis. Very sweet.

By the way, it always blew me away that the VERY FIRST BOOK the Monster ever read in "FRANKENSTEIN" was Milton's Paradise Lost. I hadn't read FRANKENSTEIN until college, and also not until after I had read Paradise Lost. (Of course, I knew the basics of both stories long before I actually read the books.)

I couldn't imagine having to teach myself to read with PARADISE LOST. Not exactly FUN WITH DICK AND JANE or Doctor Seuss, you know?

Response recorded on July 10, 2000

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Todd Jensen writes...

About what time did Oberon and Titania get married? Was Shakespeare corect about them being a wedded couple during the time of Theseus?

Greg responds...

Ask me again some other time, I'm currently in a re-think on Midsummer. I'm not sure how it's gonna come out.

Response recorded on July 10, 2000

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Faieq Ali writes...

My brother asked me this ages ago and I didn't have the answer at the time, so maybe you could help me.

If, before 1995 (when Demona got the ability to turn to human), a hunter or someone else, shattered Demona during the day, what would happen? Would she crumble to dust and die or what?

Greg responds...

It never happened. It's moot. You're looking to establish parameters to the Macbeth/Demona spell by creating non-existant hypotheticals. To paraphrase Ralph Waldo Emerson, a petty consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds. Get over it.

Response recorded on July 10, 2000

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Anonymous writes...

What did Artemis in Greek mythology look like? We know Apollo was a guy with flaming hair.

Greg responds...

Apollo's a guy with flaming hair? Since when? Not in any depiction I've ever seen.

As for Artemis, I think she was beautiful, athletic, lithe, dark of hair, haughty, virginal, sympathetic but not empathetic, proud, tall, regal, capable of kindness, of love, of regret, afraid of change, loyal, protective, dangerous, with a hell of a temper, intelligent, struggling, untouchable...

A goddess.

Response recorded on July 07, 2000

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Joxter the Mighty writes...

Ahhh... So THAT'S why the Miranda episodes of Bonkers were better. Not sucking up here Greg, they were jsut genuinely better for the most part. Thanks for explaining that.

Greg responds...

I agree, at least story-wise, conceptually better for sure.

Response recorded on July 07, 2000

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Aris Katsaris writes...

Hmm, now that I think of it, I'm not even certain if 'revelatory' is a real word...

Anyway on the Theseus business, something a bit less... deep: In "A Midsummer's Night Dream" it is said that Titania had an... affair (ahem) with Theseus - would you say that's true in the Gargoyles Universe?

Greg responds...

Probably.

Response recorded on July 07, 2000

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Chapter XVI: "Legion"

Story Editor: Michael Reaves
Written by Marty Isenberg & Robert N. Skir

I just watched "Legion" again. Time to Ramble.

From the memo I posted earlier this week, you'll see that the never used on screen names of Othello, Desdemona and Iago were my idea. But I've always wondered if that's the case. The outline that Marty and Bob wrote immediately prior to that memo had all the Othello elements very, very present in the story. All they didn't do was NAME the characters. I always wondered whether they and/or Michael had the Othello story specifically in mind, consciously or un-, and I just capitalized on it.

The Goldencup Bakery Building, which semi-secretly houses a defense department hi-tech research and development installation is modeled after the Silver Cup Bakery Building -- which actually exists in Brooklyn (as I recall). That Building was trashed in the original HIGHLANDER movie in the final battle between Connor and the Kragen (who was played by a pretty damned horrific Clancy Brown). Small world.

I was always worried that the whole Othello, Desdemona, Iago, Cassio (whoops, I mean Goliath) backstory was a bit vague in this episode. Did anyone have problems getting it?

I don't think I'd like to be one of those Goldencup Guards. Coldstone punches one of them out. That's gotta hoit. He just seems fairly unstoppable in that Xanatos-program controlled sequence. I like how that plays.

Matt says to Elisa: "You never let me drive." My wife's reaction: "Was that in homage to me?" My wife, you see, almost always drives when we're together. She gets carsick when anyone else drives. And I don't much care.

Speaking of Matt, we've got that line about him spending six months reading RECAP manuals to justify why a normal detective would be in charge of RECAP in the first place. Just trying to avoid either adding a superfluous character and/or making the situation seem artificial.

Another appearance of the Scarab Corp. Logo, even though Scarab is never mentioned by name. Oh, well...

Coldstone flees the Goldencup. Goliath and Lex pursue, and Coldstone attacks them. Then he immediately stops, when he sees it's Goliath. The problem I always had with that scene is that the lighting made it obvious that it was Goliath from moment one. (Not just to us, but to Coldstone.) If Goliath had been in shadows, it would have played better.

Minutes later Lex asks Goliath if it's wise to take Coldstone into their home: "He hasn't always been your friend." This was, theoretically, a reference not simply to the most recent attack, nor even only to the events of "Reawakening", but also a reference to the pre-Massacre backstory of the actually non-existent love triangle (or square or pentagram if you include Demona) that caused Goliath and Othello to fight way back when. Lex remembers those days too. Othello was always a bit of a hot-head.

I love Goliath's response: "Without trust there can be no clan." And I love that this is part of a Lex/Goliath exchange. It fits in perfectly with the message they taught each other in "Thrill of the Hunt". Gotta take some chances on occasion. Or else you'll always be alone. It's an anti-Demona mentality. Or rather a mentality that is strikingly un-Demona-esque.

From the moment Coldstone premiered in "Reawakening" I knew (that if we survived to a second season) we'd discover that he was created from three Gargoyles. Tried to work that conceptually into the design more, but we never quite achieved it. So basically that becomes something that the audience has to take on trust.

Which brings me to the title "Legion". It's a one-word title which usually is a tip-off that it's one of mine. I know it's a biblical reference. Some possessed guy with a demon/devil inside who goes by the name "Legion". But that's not actually where I got it. When I was a kid, I saw this tv movie based on Mary Shelley's FRANKENSTEIN. It starred Michael Sarazan or Chris Sarandon. (I always used to mix those two guys up.) It was trying to present a more realistic believable version of the Frankenstein story. I was pretty young. And I don't remember too much about it. I do remember that I was supposed to be asleep -- past my bedtime in the days before my parents gave up and I began going to bed long after they were asleep. But instead of being asleep, I was watching it, in the dark, with the volume turned as far down as possible, me sitting right by the set, so I could flip it off if I heard my parents' door opening. (This was long before remote controls were common.) Anyway, the one scene that I really remember is a scene where they put the Monster under hypnosis. The voices of all the people who "donated" body parts begin to speak. And one of them quotes the "Legion" thing from the bible. But I didn't know that. That is I didn't know back then that he was quoting anyone or anything. It just seemed like a very powerful, poetic and humanly true statement. So it wasn't until college that I read that passage in the bible and realized where it was from. Can anyone cite the actual quote? I can't remember where exactly it's from, and I don't feel like searching right now.

Anyway, all this is relevant because Coldstone was ALWAYS our Frankenstein character from the "IT'S ALIVE!" moment to the "Legion" stuff here.

Coldstone calls Hudson "Mentor". That's a "name" I've been long considering for Hudson's "designation" in the DARK AGES prequel spin-off.

Coldstone shoots Goliath at point blank range. Goliath gets up unharmed. A far cry from what happened to G in "Long Way to Morning." Now in the outline and script, it says that Coldstone uses his "concussion cannon" as opposed to his laser cannon. But nothing in the as-aired episode makes that distinction. And so it just looks irresponsible to me. Like suddenly we're saying violence has no repercussions. Did that bother anyone else?

I love the dark comedy of Coldstone going bonkers at Ellis Island. Fighting with himself. I think Michael Dorn did a terrific job playing all four aspects of CS's personality. Which of you figured out what when? I'd like to know.

The Trio has the Recap visor. Now all they have to do is find Goliath, Hudson and Coldstone. How will they do that? "Three guesses?" A very elegant way to explain how in a huge city, they're able to locate three gargoyles.

Kenner's Coldstone toy is a lot of fun. With it's window into Coldstone's soul. And the spinner that allows any of the four personas to take over at random.

Xanatos doesn't even appear until the VERY END of Act Two. And it's not even really Xanatos, just a program designed by him. Normally, I'd say that wasn't playing fair. But I feel like his presence was obvious all-along. (And did David personally design that program. Or did he just put his stamp on it, management-style?)

There's a moment when Goliath, thrilled to see his rookery sister again, hugs Desdemona. She is immediately annoyed, because she knows that hug is prone to misinterpretation. It's a nice little touch in the animation.

I always wondered what if anything Demona thought about that ancient conflict way back when. Was Iago playing her as well? Trying to make her jealous of Desdemona? I think maybe he did try. But wouldn't it be cool if she didn't credit it for a second. If she just knew intuitively that Desdemona didn't present any threat at all to her relationship with G? Because, I feel the opposite is true. That Demona knew intuitively that Elisa DID present a threat. Say what you want for Demona, but her subconscious knows her man.

I love that moment where BOTH Iago and Xanatos are whispering in Othello's ears. Poor slob never stood a chance.

We've got a nice little Xanatos tag in this one too. Certainly not a doozy as in "Leader" or "Metamorphosis", but it's got a nice little kick to it, I think. And that's THREE episodes in a row. X had been busy.

And then I love the last beat back at the clock tower. Goliath has confiscated Coldstone's body, to keep it safe and "among friends" should he/she ever wake up again. I wanted to keep it in the corner from that point until "High Noon". Always present and visible. We didn't for two reasons. First, we figured it would be a bit confusing. The Batcave can get away with the giant penny and other souvenirs from Batman's cases, because there ARE multiple souvenirs. But just having one immobile gargoyle in the background, as cool and creepy as that is, would be horribly distracting for any audience member who missed this one particular episode. And second, we had our tier system. What if "Legion" wasn't ready as scheduled. We couldn't have Coldstone sitting around the clock tower in later episodes that we'd be forced to air first. Talk about disconcerting. So we invented a back room. Where Coldstone, the Grimorum, the Gate and eventually the eye could be stored.

Comments welcome, as usual...


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Todd Jensen writes...

I read your ramble to Aris on Theseus this morning, and quite enjoyed it. One part of it that I found interesting was your bit about how Theseus, in his team-ups with Hercules, would help keep his tendency to go berserk in check - the reason why I found that interesting was because I noticed that you included that bit in your "Grim Avenger" story for Disney's Hercules, where Theseus gets Hercules to calm down after he's going full-vengeance after the Minotaur.

Greg responds...

Yeah. Though of course, that was a reversal on the very un-Theseus-esque way we were playing the Grim Avenger earlier in the story.

Response recorded on July 05, 2000

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Graymonk writes...

Thank You for answering my New Olympian questions. I it appreciated a great deal.

Since you are a Shakespeare fan I was wondering if you had seen either of the following Shakespeare related plays
1) "Rosencrantz and Guilderstern are Dead" by Tom Stoppard
or
2) "Goodnight Desdemona (Good Morning Juliet)" by Ann-Marie MacDonald
If you have seen either play, what did you think of them?

Thankyou very much,

Greg responds...

I've seen Stoppard's play. Not MacDonald's.

I love the Stoppard play. I particularly love the movie he wrote and directed based on that play. It's an amazing piece of work. I'm a HUGE Stoppard fan. Though I haven't seen close to everything he's done. I think both ARCADIA and SHAKESPEARE IN LOVE are completely ****ing brilliant.

Response recorded on July 05, 2000

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Greg "Xanatos" Bishansky writes...

Hi Greg

I was thinking today about the Quarrymen and the Ku Klux Klan. One of my favorite quotes in "The Journey" was Goliath's "Brave words for a man who hides his face behind a hood".

We were discussing the Klan in US History today and I got really worked up and went into a rant about how if the Klan are a bunch of cowards who are too afraid to show their faces. I'm half Jewish so I take everything the Klan does personally (I would even if not). And then I thought about Goliath's quote, and it really spoke to me in that scene. It was brilliant. I applaud you for it.

Did you have these sentiments in mind when you wrote "The Journey"?

Greg responds...

Absolutely.

Response recorded on July 05, 2000

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Todd Jensen writes...

Thanks for responding to my comment on the "how Gargoyles and Batman are different" business. While I'm at it, your answer reminded me of something that I'd wondered once about the Canmore trio. Did you ever see them as a sort of "twisted version" of Batman, in the sense that they become gargoyle-hunters after seeing their father getting killed by Demona in front of them when they were children, that element being a parallel to Bruce seeing his parents getting killed in front of him when he was a boy? (I brought this one up in the comment room once and rather unnerved some other posters there who didn't like the thought of Batman being similar to the Hunters, but I am emphasizing the adjective "twisted" here).

Greg responds...

You're right, of course. In fact, Macbeth and the Hunters (and Xanatos too, a bit) were all and always twisted riffs on the Caped Crusader.

Response recorded on July 03, 2000

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Todd Jensen writes...

A comment on Pyro X's "Gummi Bears" question.

I actually saw a slight similarity between the two series myself, but more in terms of the overall situation of the title characters. Both Gummi Bears and Gargoyles were portrayed as non-human sentient beings who once lived alongside humans, until that came to an end through human hostility (in the Gummis' case, driving most of them overseas, in the Gargoyles' case, destroying most of their clans), leaving only a few scattered communities/clans left, which would only gradually begin reconnecting with each other and recovering what was lost.

(I might add that I recall the presence in the latter part of the series of some Gummmis from the Barbic Woods who were portrayed as particularly suspicious and unsympathetic towards humans, and can easily imagine many gargoyles in the Gargoyles Universe having a similar attitude).

Greg responds...

Yep.

Gummi Bears was a big influence.

Not to be confused with Care Bears. Puh-leeze!

Response recorded on June 29, 2000

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Chapter XV: "Metamorphosis"

STORY EDITOR: Michael Reaves
WRITERS: Brynne Chandler Reaves & Lydia Marano

The first appearance of Anton Sevarius and the MUTATES: Maggie the Cat, Fang and Claw. Derek had appeared before, but this was TALON's "first appearance" as well.

In our original development, the Talon character was called CATSCAN. He wasn't Elisa's brother. In fact, he was sorta Sevarius. That is, he was the scientist who created the mutagenic formula. At first he works for Xavier (Xanatos), but later -- when he realizes that Xavier was responsible for the "accident" that turned him into Catscan -- he tries to hunt Xanatos down, forcing Goliath to actually protect Xanatos in order to save Catscan's soul. This version of Catscan was basically the inspiration of my good friend Fred Schaefer, who was a Disney Development Associate at the time. Part of the team. Oh, and Catscan was a solo act, there were no other Mutates. And he didn't have wings either. He fired some kind of radiation bolt from his eyes.

Later, we began to prep Derek for the Catscan/Talon role. I don't remember if we knew Derek's fate way back in "Deadly Force", when he was introduced, but we definitely knew by "Her Brother's Keeper". One of the reasons we made him a pilot was to give him some flight background to justify how quickly we needed him to learn to fly. This was emphasized HERE by putting him in a glider.

Anton Sevarius became a separate character obviously. Michael Reaves, I believe, came up with his name. At first, I didn't like it. I thought it was too cartoony. Now I think it suits him.

Rereading my memo, it seems I was thinking of Brent Spiner to play Sevarius. I hadn't remembered that. Of course, no one else could be Sevarius except Tim Curry. And Brent was a perfect Puck for us too. So all's well that ends well. (But can you imagine if somehow the rolls had been switched?) Tim has some great lines here: "...Or has that changed?" is one of my favorites. He's so hungry.

FYI - That's Jonathan Frakes voicing Fang's one-liner in this episode. We couldn't afford to hire a separate actor for one line. So Jonathan stepped in. Of course, later Fang was taken over by Jim Belushi. But I don't think anyone noticed.

Gotta love the Snidely Whiplash reference.

As I mentioned in my last Ramble on "Leader", Xanatos' plans were getting more and more sophisticated. Here we had two humdingers in a row. The one in "Leader" is just a lot of fun. This one is cruel. Throughout the story, we (I think) tend to believe in Xanatos' mea culpa and his outrage regarding the Mutates ("They'll crucify you. And if they don't, I WILL!!"). Why? Because he's so darn likable we want to think well of him. (Who was fooled? I'd like to know.) Also his story rings true. When he tells Sevarius, "I've been in prison before." We know he has. We believe he could take it again. It's that touch of truth amid the lies that makes him so sharp.

And Owen was complicit. On one level, that shouldn't be surprising, yet there's something of the Mr. Spock about Owen. As faithful as you know he is, you don't actually expect him to lie.

And frankly, the plan is SO complex. I hope it's believable when all is said and done. We made a real effort to make sure that it could have worked, that if it hadn't gone EXACTLY as depicted it would feel like there would have been alternative scenarios that would have generated the same result. Of course the master-stroke is Sevarius' death. Our S&P executive raised an eyebrow over that, as she finished reading Act Two. Fortunately, she was the type who finished the script before knee-jerking us with an objection. We got away with depicting a violent death on-screen -- because it was fake. (But who was fooled?)

We tried to play fair with a number of clues throughout. We used Xanatos' own security team as the "hired mercenaries" that Sevarius was using. Only Xanatos checks Sevarius' pulse. When Matt and Elisa are later investigating the scene, there's no body and NO CHALK OUTLINE either. They have no idea that anyone even theoretically was supposed to have DIED there. And Sevarius is SO OVER THE TOP. That should have been a stylistic clue. It was way fun to do -- and it took great acting on Tim's part to act that badly and still make it play.

For once the script came in a tad short. So the board artist added the bit where the gargoyles break out of stone and we see the debris rain down on the people below. Pigeons fly off into the night. (Just a little touch of realism.) Very nice.

I was never too fond of Elisa's Zen Master joke. Still, in the comic book story I wrote before the Marvel comic book was cancelled, I created a Zen Master character. (Just compulsive I guess.)

My original plan for Gen-U-Tech was to abreviate its name as G.U.T.S. As in the company that twists yours up. (The full name is Genetic Undiscovered Technical Systems.) Instead it became Gen-U-Tech, which is probably better. But I can't remember who made the change. The script has plenty of GUTS references in the descriptions. But it may have escaped my notice that it has none in the dialogue. And the logos designed all read Gen-U-Tech, not guts. I wonder if Frank & Michael were slyly protecting me from a mis-step?

I like the conflict between Brooklyn & Broadway here. All the interplay with the trio is very well handled, I think. Were people really rooting for Brooklyn & Maggie to wind up together?

Not our best animated episode. Both the modeling and the animation leave a bit to be desired. Derek's ears look mid-transformation long before he's hit with that dart. Makes me cringe, but I guess if the audience isn't expecting him to get changed, they don't notice the subtle pointyness to the ears, until after the contents of the dart are revealed. But on a second viewing...?

Maggie Reed: "I'm from Ohio." As if that should explain EVERYTHING. I love that line.

"Morgan Reed", by the way, was one of our may early names for what eventually became Elisa Chavez, Elisa Bluestone and finally Elisa Maza. (I never waste anything.)

Observations from my daughter Erin:

1. "I like the click of their boots." [Erin complimenting the foley during the recapture of Maggie in the alley.]

2. "His hands ARE tied!" [My clever Erin catching the irony. Elisa says "My hands are tied." Brooklyn responds, "Well mine aren't." But then he turns to stone, prompting Erin's observation.]

3. "Hudson and Bronx always stay home." [Erin commenting on our proclivity for leaving Hudson & Bronx behind at the castle or clock tower when Goliath and the Trio go off. It is kind of a rip.]

Another great series of endings and false endings.

Xanatos tells Owen to bring him the "best geneticist on the planet."

The gargs arrive and fight the Mutates. Elisa arrives. Xanatos asks her to "stop this senseless violence". [Ahh, what a lovely bastard he is.]

Maggie makes the accurate observation that Brooklyn wants her to stay a monster. And yet despite that incite, she clearly still believes that both she and Brooklyn ARE monsters. She's as bound up in appearances as he is.

Talon names himself. It's kinda odd. But I think it works.

Elisa declares war on Xanatos. And for a split-second it registers on his face. Something has actually given him pause.

And then Owen brings in the best geneticist. I still wonder if it's immediately clear that this "new guy" IS Sevarius. He looks SO different. And Tim wasn't using the hoky accent anymore. Was anyone else confused, even momentarily? But anyway, it's another stunner Xanatos Tag. Did your eyes bug out? Or did you know by this time?

And finally, back to the Tower. Brooklyn is in a funk. But Elisa...

This entire episode is obviously a direct sequel to "Brother's Keeper". Right down to the end. In the end of that one, Elisa can do nothing but stare sadly out at the snow. But we're past that now. Now she cries. Xanatos doesn't wind up with the Mutates, though he correctly predicts there eventual return, but this is his clearest victory yet. The Mutates blame the gargs. Talon still believes X is his best chance at a cure. And he has an emotional and physical weapon against Elisa and the gargs. I was proud of us for ending a "cartoon" on such a relatively down note. Can't always have happy endings. How many people were surprised we ended it that way?

That's it. Comments welcome...


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Anonymous writes...

Is the comparision between the skrull and the space spawn and the kree and Nokkar's people accurate?
Were the Kree and the Skrull your source of inspiration for the Space Spawn and Nokkar's peopl?

Greg responds...

No, I don't think so. I have a fairly clear memory of what the Skrull look like visually. And I remember the Super-Skrull who had everyone of the F4's powers. Were the other Skrull shape-shifters? As for the Kree, I remember the name. Can't think of what they even looked like. Did they look like Nokkar? At any rate, I don't recall the relationship between the two alien races. So I don't think I was basing what we did on them.

Response recorded on June 28, 2000

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Aris Katsaris writes...

A brief thought on the Edge.

I was indeed quite surprised when the red robot was revealed as Xanatos... I had thought it was just an very advanced robot, possibly a recurring character, but I never thought it was Xanatos himself...

And ofcourse in 'Leader of the Pack' you used that eralier episode to your advantage... Now *everyone* expected Coyote to be Xanatos, and noone expected him to be a very advanced robot... Very intentional, I suppose?

Weirdly enough, though quite a bit older than Erin, I also felt a bit nervous in the Statue of Liberty battle... I tend to do that when in TV monuments/antiquities are casually endangered... A bit silly perhaps, but there you have it... :-)

Greg responds...

"Very intentional, I suppose?" Yep.

Actually, I know how you feel about the monuments. That's part of the reason why Planet of the Apes is traumatic. And why we stole from it for "Future Tense".

Response recorded on June 27, 2000


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