Charles> This a [I}Gargoyles[/I] comment room... hence the [I}Gargoyles[/I] banner at the top of the page... but welcome none the less. :)

Braniac> very interesting stuff you posted! I guess that's why they calkl you "Braniac" eh? :) BTW, is the OSU for Ohio State?
Battle Beast - [Canada]
I DID IT!!! I WATCHED ALL 485 BEST PICTURE NOMINEES IN ONE YEAR!!!
posted @ Sun, Oct 2, 2011 7:25:23 pm EDT from 173.181.83.112

Can't delete them, Charles, so best to go easy on that "Post Your Comment" button next time d:

Anyways, welcome to the Comment Room, have a cookie **points to cookie table**

Subject matter tends to vary any given day or week, but know that any of Greg's works (be it Gargoyles, Spectacular Spider-Man, W.I.T.C.H., and Young Justice) are fine to talk about here.

Just be sure you take advantage of the "Preview Your Comment" button and those SPOILER tags, especially for active shows where someone might not have caught the latest episode :)

Brainiac & Matt: Can never say much in a discussion regarding Biology, but I always enjoy reading them ;)

Masterdramon: [SPOILER] Definitely had a Coldfire feel from my end too, especially when we got three machines as the villains [/SPOILER]
Phoenician
"The suspense is terrible . . . I hope it lasts," -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Sun, Oct 2, 2011 3:08:10 pm EDT from 98.69.201.169

I didn't mean to have four posts for one comment!! SORRY!! How do you delete a comment???
charles - [charles.lott2@live.com]
posted @ Sun, Oct 2, 2011 2:43:34 pm EDT from 71.181.227.113

I don't know if this comment room is for Gargoyles or Young Justice? That being said, Friday's episode of Young Justice was outstanding!! Didn't see that plot twist coming!! I was also surprised to see Miss Martian and Super boy kissing again!! The reason i was surprised is, that their showing teenagers acting like teenagers when their in love!! What up with kid flash?? Is he blind when it come to Miss Martian and Super boy relationship??? Again OUTSTANDING EPISODE!!!
charles - [charles.lott2@live.com]
posted @ Sun, Oct 2, 2011 2:19:20 pm EDT from 71.181.227.113

I don't know if this comment room is for Gargoyles or Young Justice?/ That being said, Friday's episode of Young Justice was outstanding!! Didn't see that plot twist coming!! I was also surprised to see Miss Martian and Super boy kissing again!! The reason i was surprised is, that their showing teenagers acting like teenagers when their in love!! What up with kid flash?? Is he blind when it come to Miss Martian and Super boy relationship??? Again OUTSTANDING EPISODE!1
charles - [charles.lott2@live.com]
posted @ Sun, Oct 2, 2011 2:18:45 pm EDT from 71.181.227.113

I don't know if this comment room is for Gargoyles or Young Justice?/ That being said, Friday's episode of Young Justice was outstanding!! Didn't see that plot twist coming!! I was also surprised to see Miss Martian and Super boy kissing again!! The reason i was surprised is, that their showing teenagers acting like teenagers when their in love!! What up with kid flash?? Is he blind when come to Miss Martian and Super boy relationship??? Again OUTSTANDING EPISODE!1
charles - [charles.lott2@live.com]
posted @ Sun, Oct 2, 2011 2:18:01 pm EDT from 71.181.227.113

I don't know if this comment room is for Gargoyles or Young Justice?/ That being said, Friday's episode of Young Justice was outstanding!! Didn't see that plot twist coming!! I was also surprised to see Miss Martian and Super boy kissing again!! The reason i was surprised is, that their showing teenagers acting like teenagers when their in love!! What up with kid flash?? Is he blind when come to Miss Martian and Super boy relationship??? Again OUTSTANDING EPISODE!1
charles - [charles.lott2@live.com]
posted @ Sun, Oct 2, 2011 2:16:40 pm EDT from 71.181.227.113

Sorry for the double post

The Young Justice wiki says that character's name is "Bette" and they get into who she was named after on that page. http://youngjustice.wikia.com/wiki/Bette
Richard Jackson
posted @ Sat, Oct 1, 2011 6:23:08 pm EDT from 112.165.34.146

>The Geek. Beth is the name of Greg Weisman's wife. Typing "Beth" and "DC Comics" in Google, I didn't come up with any significant characters, but there is a precedent of Greg Weisman naming characters after members of his family, like Jon and Robyn Canmore are named after his brother and sister. And the mutates in the Bad Guys comic are named after his kids.
Richard Jackson
posted @ Sat, Oct 1, 2011 5:44:10 pm EDT from 112.165.34.146

In Homefront, was Beth (I think that was her name - the blonde girl that met Artemis at the Academy) an established DC universe character that we might have recognized?

For example, at Happy Harbor High (Targets episode), Wendy, Marvin, Karen, and Mal (the other students that were shown/spoke) were all cameos from existing DC Comics characters. So I was trying to figure if Beth was likewise someone I should have recognized.
TheGeek
http://www.squidoo.com/thegeeklens-cartoons
posted @ Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:13:23 pm EDT from 98.204.100.195

**Peeks out from the darkest corner of the CR**

Hmm... What an interesting week in the CR so far... Poor grammar, trolls and a back log of unanswered questions...

It seems I missed the big guy's birthday, so I'll say this while I still can...

Happy belated birthday GW!

Back to lurking in the corner for me...
The One Known As Mochi - [shogi.keima.08@gmail.com]
Current Mood: (>_ _)> Zzz...
posted @ Sat, Oct 1, 2011 1:00:14 am EDT from 72.199.83.177

Sorry for the double-post, but Gorebash posted in the middle of me writing my last response...

Gorebash: I'd say that Goliath's vice is the same as Demona's - a temptation toward vengeance. He's just a lot better at controlling the impulse...most of the time.

Angela's...a bit harder to peg down. Early on, her biggest character flaw was probably her naivete, but most of that has dissipated by the time "Clan-Building" rolls around (though not completely; see her obliviousness to how much flaunting her new relationship with Broadway is hurting Brooklyn for the clearest example). Though I suppose that's not really a "vice" in the strictest sense of the term...
Masterdramon - [kmc12009@mymail.pomona.edu]
"Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? Caught in a landslide, no escape from reality..." - Freddie Mercury of Queen
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 11:47:26 pm EDT from 134.173.90.46

Brainiac: "Homefront" was certainly the most...intense episode so far, though I wouldn't stay that I like it better than "Terrors" overall. Still, FANTASTIC episode in terms of exploring Artemis' character, and the ending...well, I won't say anything other than that I can't wait for next week's.

[SPOILER] Getting to see Red Torpedo, Red Inferno (anyone else getting flashes of Coldfire with her?), and pre-Batgirl/Flamebird versions of Barbara Gordon and Bette Kane was quite a delight, as well. Methinks Greg W.'s channeling some of his ideas from his cancelled Red Tornado miniseries into this show; not that I'm complaining, mind you. [/SPOILER]
Masterdramon - [kmc12009@mymail.pomona.edu]
"Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? Caught in a landslide, no escape from reality..." - Freddie Mercury of Queen
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 11:42:10 pm EDT from 134.173.90.46

Jurgan: So then what would you say Angela and Goliath's vices are?
Gorebash
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 11:40:44 pm EDT from 71.243.10.214

A part of the most recent response from Ask Greg (http://www.s8.org/gargoyles/askgreg/search.php?qid=13534):

"Typically, companies run out of interest before I do."

Sad, but true. But on a lighter note, what did everyone think of tonight's YJ episode? Do you once again have a new favorite, Masterdramon?
Brainiac - [OSUBrainiac at gmail dot com]
There is balance in all things. Live in symmetry with the world around you. If you must blow things up and steal from those around you, THAT'S WHAT RPGS ARE FOR!
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 11:25:38 pm EDT from 174.101.230.22

I'm not sure I see how protection and a father/daughter relationship are vices. I suppose they could end up as obsessions, but I don't see them as anything like the others you listed.
Jurgan - [jurgan6@yahoo.com]
"And the dealer wants you to think that it's black or it's white/ Thank God it's not that simple, in my secret life." -Leonard Cohen
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 10:39:53 pm EDT from 75.76.235.156

For some reason I never thought of gargoyles as being susceptible to drug addiction. I couldn't imagine Goliath having a drink. Now I'm thinking about the whole spectrum of reasons people drink, smoke, do drugs, etc. and how they might apply to individual gargoyles.

Maybe Fang. Maybe Thailog. Maybe the trio would experiment a little. I don't know. A gargoyle doing drugs, even drinking or smoking, just feels foreign to me. I think they would find other vices like gadgets (Lex), food and tv (Broadway, Hudson), women (Brooklyn), power (Thailog), revenge (Demona), protection (Goliath), establishing a close father/daughter relationship with her biological father (Angela).
Gorebash
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 4:58:51 pm EDT from 207.206.236.245

Matt> Pardon me, I forgot the double-zero. That should be ~500 MYA, not ~5 MYA.
Brainiac - [OSUBrainiac at gmail dot com]
There is balance in all things. Live in symmetry with the world around you. If you must blow things up and steal from those around you, THAT'S WHAT RPGS ARE FOR!
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 4:11:00 pm EDT from 137.183.232.22

Brainiac> Interesting stuff. I guess we just don't know enough about gargoyle pysiology to really know for sure. We all seem to agree that stone sleep would largely mitigate the effects of drinking (assuming any effects even existed).

Also, if we are talking about early chordates, we'd have to go back a lot further than 5 mya.
Matt - [Saint Louis, Missouri, USA]
"... And if we did it before, we can do it again." "And we will. Together." - Goliath and Elisa, "The Edge"
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 3:58:52 pm EDT from 99.92.109.252

WARNING! INCOMING BIOLOGY DISCUSSION! FLEE BEFORE THE SCIENCE GEEK!

As far as getting drunk and overall toxicity, gargoyles could perhaps have a slower metabolic rate for ethanol overall since stone sleep takes care of so much. This could lead to gargates being more susceptible to intoxication and alcohol poisoning along the same lines as canines and their far slower metabolism of theobromine (the potentially lethal alkaloid component of cacao plants, tea leaves, and kola nuts). Regardless of the level of susceptibility, I doubt a gargoyle's hangover would be identical to that of a human's - it would most likely result in a weak or drained/"healed but not whole" sort of event as most of the physical issues would be corrected upon awakening. There is some evidence that the various alcohol dehydrogenases humans possess all evolved from a means of metabolizing excess retinol, better known as vitamin A. In addition, the ancestral form of the modern ADH enzymes can be traced back as far as 5 million years ago to early chordates (which gargates definitely are descended from, just as we are). As such, it's unlikely that gargoyles would lack the capability to metabolize ethanol to at least some degree.

Concerning the sustainability of long-term effects, I'd also point out that while I could buy a gargoyle missing the conditions typically caused by physical damage, such as emphysema or cirrhosis, a genetic disease brought on by carcinogen exposure (like lung cancer often is) would most likely NOT be corrected by stone sleep. There's no evidence that stone sleep's regenerative powers include correcting DNA mutations (DNA damage such as physical breaks in the strand, yes, but mutations are another matter). I'd also hesitate to say that a gargoyle would be unable to suffer the addictive effects/behaviors that can lead to abuse of cigarettes or alcohol, though that's dealing with psychology and chemical receptors rather than DNA and genetics.
Brainiac - [OSUBrainiac at gmail dot com]
There is balance in all things. Live in symmetry with the world around you. If you must blow things up and steal from those around you, THAT'S WHAT RPGS ARE FOR!
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 3:33:38 pm EDT from 137.183.232.22

Actually reading again the answer from Greg that I just posted, it seems that the side effects implied were more long-term in their nature . . . such as lung disease in the case of cigarettes, liver problems for alcohol . . . the post really doesn't suggest one way or another if gargoyles have the ability to "hold" their own when it comes to simply consuming the stuff . . .
Phoenician
"The suspense is terrible . . . I hope it lasts," -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 1:49:20 pm EDT from 24.206.36.236

Gorebash> Interesting (and somewhat funny) article. Thanks for the link.

I should say though that just because gargoyles can and do eat human food doesn't mean certain foods couldn't have different effects on them. Dogs eat human food all the time, but giving them chocolate is toxic.

I think there are two different questions here. Can a gargoyle drink alcohol and experience the same effects as it has on humans? And assuming that is a yes or a mostly yes, would Demona drink it?
Matt - [Saint Louis, Missouri, USA]
"... And if we did it before, we can do it again." "And we will. Together." - Goliath and Elisa, "The Edge"
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 1:49:14 pm EDT from 99.92.109.252

It'd be interesting to know how alcohol influences their sense of balance. If alcohol has the same effect on Gargoyles like on humans, they most likely would loose their ability to glide. Demone would never risk to be this vulnerable... Now if I could imagine any Gargoyle drinking alcohol well... Maybe Thailog enjoys a good wine every know and then? Haha...
Neill - [neillgargoyle(at)gmail.com]
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 1:37:20 pm EDT from 87.151.98.190

Comet: Yeah, Greg Wesiman basically implied that back in 2009:

http://www.s8.org/gargoyles/askgreg/search.php?qid=11446
Phoenician
"The suspense is terrible . . . I hope it lasts," -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 1:30:15 pm EDT from 24.206.36.236

I think Gargoyles can get drunk like humans, but can stand more alcohol and also don't ever have a hangover because the effects of the alcohol get neutralized while stonesleep. But that's just the way I see it. Maybe I'm wrong.
Comet
I'm shipping off...to find my wooden leg!
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 1:14:19 pm EDT from 80.187.110.203

http://www.s8.org/gargoyles/askgreg/search.php?qid=13684

Someone asked Greg why Marina Sirtis always does an American accent on his shows, but I've never viewed Demona's voice as a straight up American accent. I always thought it was more of an idiosyncratic accent that can't really be defined by nationality.
Richard Jackson
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 1:00:10 pm EDT from 112.165.34.146

Matt: Not sure about reptiles, but birds do get drunk eating fermented fruit. In fact it's the season in Australia for birds to do just that right now: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/09/29/drunk_parrots_in_oz/

It seems to me that gargoyles would be affected by alcohol similarly to humans. I say that because they consume the same food we do so I think we can assume their bodies metabolize food similarly to humans thus they metabolize alcohol similarly to humans.
Gorebash
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 12:28:55 pm EDT from 207.206.236.245

Great point, Supermorff.

Anyone have any idea how alcohol affects (or doesn't) reptiles and birds?
Matt - [Saint Louis, Missouri, USA]
"... And if we did it before, we can do it again." "And we will. Together." - Goliath and Elisa, "The Edge"
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 12:20:04 pm EDT from 99.92.109.252

Or maybe alcohol actually affects gargoyles differently, or even simply tastes different. Gargoyles not only aren't humans, they also aren't mammals, and may have evolved to handle those sort of toxins differently.
Supermorff
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 11:36:21 am EDT from 62.25.109.195

Masterdramon> I know. But I also know what *I* think it looks like. And I'm sticking to it!
Battle Beast - [Canada]
I DID IT!!! I WATCHED ALL 485 BEST PICTURE NOMINEES IN ONE YEAR!!!
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 11:19:13 am EDT from 173.181.75.65

I think Demona is an exception to what your average gargoyle prefers to drink. She has lived for over a thousand years and probably tasted nearly every beverage that has existed within that time. I think after a while it becomes repetitive and food and drink lose their entertainment value. The only purpose for drinking left is, in her case, a dry throat. I also suspect she avoids alcohol to keep her sense sharp.
Gorebash
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 10:56:57 am EDT from 207.206.236.245

Rebel> To a gargoyle hatched and raised in medieval Scotland, clean and filtered drinking water probably is pretty fancy.

To me, the idea of a gargoyle drinking alcohol or smoking or whatever seems to be tiptoeing to the "humans with wings" angle. Aside from exceptions, like Broadway, I don't see gargoyles paying much attention to food beyond its ability to sustain them. Another gargoyle that stands out in this respect is Lexington, but not with food, but technology. I don't think it concerns most gargoyles. The species seems a bit more primal. Fine dining, technology and all the other luxuries are outside their ways for the most part. Although, it is worth noting that Demona is a gargoyle most adapted to the ways of humanity.

Todd> It is a shame. But I only partially blame the trolls. Most of the blame should rest on those who feed the trolls. As regulars in the Room, they have seen trolls come and go and should know better. If no one responded when a troll came through, we wouldn't have these problems.
Matt - [Saint Louis, Missouri, USA]
"... And if we did it before, we can do it again." "And we will. Together." - Goliath and Elisa, "The Edge"
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 9:36:48 am EDT from 99.92.109.252

Two trolls in one week - and they derailed some great discussions, too.

I guess most of us were expecting Demona to be a heavy drinker in light of all the internal turmoil in her life. Maybe gargoyles are less tempted than humans to hit the bottle in such situations.
Todd Jensen - [merlyn1@mindspring.com]
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:46:03 am EDT from 4.244.0.117

Matt > Well she has that big house and all that treasure. It seemed natural she might prefer something fancy.
Rebel
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 4:48:23 am EDT from 69.134.102.225

Really, guys? Really!?!

If someone is acting like a troll, then stop acting like you are feeding him. If you make a claim or opinion and someone doesn't agree with you, get over it. Your case has been made. And if you think someone is acting stupid or childish or foolish, don't call them a retard. Using this word really only gives them a pysiological excuse for their behavior and shows your lack of maturity and class.

Please, let's move on.

Personally, I'm not surprised at all that Demona prefers water. What gave anyone the impression she likes alcoholic beverages in the first place?
Matt - [Saint Louis, Missouri, USA]
"... And if we did it before, we can do it again." "And we will. Together." - Goliath and Elisa, "The Edge"
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 4:28:51 am EDT from 99.92.109.252

Man I wish I had some tortilla chips right now.
Rebel
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 4:19:08 am EDT from 69.134.102.225

so I was invited by Dtaina to this discussion since I'm a low profile Gargoyles fan... I took the time to read the whole penis thing...

honestly.... who CARESSSS

Its not a subliminal lets get the kids's minds dirty by placing random phalus all over the buildings! if it isn't blatantly ovbious at first glance then....

Its like people that sees Jesus on a toast!! You know that has a name, its called "Pareidolia"

Pareidolia (play /pærɨˈdoÊŠliÉ™/ parr-i-doh-lee-É™) is a psychological phenomenon involving a vague and random stimulus (often an image or sound) being perceived as significant. Common examples include seeing images of animals or faces in clouds, the man in the moon or the Moon rabbit, and hearing hidden messages on records played in reverse. The word comes from the Greek para- – "beside", "with", or "alongside"—meaning, in this context, something faulty or wrong (as in paraphasia, disordered speech) and eidōlon – "image"; the diminutive of eidos – "image", "form", "shape". Pareidolia is a type of apophenia.

you can read more about it in Wikipedia...

Anyway, that you were so quick to associate a penis with a random image speaks volumes about your physique LOL

And before you accuse me of not knowing what a phallus looks like, let me inform you that I'm a married woman so... there

so please please stop wasting your time in a Gargoyles forum with such trivial matter and stop

http://cdn.animalpolitico.com/blogueros-el-congal-postapocaliptico/files/2011/07/trollface.jpg

I also take the chance to salute my fellow Gargoyle fan boys and girls!!
Kaoru - [filtrodeinternet@gmail.com]
I workship Eiichiro Oda's work
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 1:32:08 am EDT from 201.172.152.219

Battle Beast: For the record, the "priest erection" is actually the guy's knee.
Masterdramon - [kmc12009@mymail.pomona.edu]
"Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? Caught in a landslide, no escape from reality..." - Freddie Mercury of Queen
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 1:20:07 am EDT from 134.173.90.46

Long time lurker, but here is my two cents:

CJ - I watched that video a few times and quite frankly, the design of those pipes don't suggest anything phallic to me. They look just look like big black piping of some sort. *shrugs* I'm just not seeing what you supposedly see.
BrooklynX
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 12:50:14 am EDT from 75.26.171.205

In regards to my previous post, I though you were talking about the "priest erection" controversy, and not the "cover penis". To me, BOTH look phallic.
Battle Beast - [Canada]
I DID IT!!! I WATCHED ALL 485 BEST PICTURE NOMINEES IN ONE YEAR!!!
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 12:33:50 am EDT from 173.181.68.45

Ok, so I looked at the video, and the clip is just too short to be conclusive. That and my computer monitor is crappy. So I will watch my DVD and see it in a better light. But as of right now, I don't see ANYTHING that REMOTLY looks at all phallic.

CJ/Anonymous> You don't have to be a troll and bully us into agreeing with you. We don't agree, so live with it. You could make the suggestiona nd see what we say, but don't insult us or act like and indiot because we don't agree. Sheesh.

On the other hand, the clip from The Little Mermaid DID look like an erection. No argument there. That one I saw clearly and I think it is what some say it is. I know what the artist said it was, his excuse, etc, but to me it does, did and always will look like an erection. :/
Battle Beast - [Canada]
I DID IT!!! I WATCHED ALL 485 BEST PICTURE NOMINEES IN ONE YEAR!!!
posted @ Fri, Sep 30, 2011 12:29:16 am EDT from 173.181.68.45

And another...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJFHVIsWj58

I wonder if a penis ever tried to eat Cagney's food.
Greg Bishansky - [<--- Greg's Blog of Clue-by-Fours]
Elisa Maza, why don't you just take that "sodie pop" can and stick the straw right into New York's eye!
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 11:31:26 pm EDT from 68.199.5.105

For the record, I never implied that he was a homosexual. He did that just now with his post. He's the one who's been insulting me from the beginning for no reason.

And also for the record... Greg Bishansky and I are NOT the same person! :P Just wanted to make that clear just in case there were any doubts!

Hey, let's talk about how Demona prefers water, as revealed on Ask Greg. How many of us thought she liked to drink a cup of wine after a hard day's work? Maybe it had something to do with Formspring Demona's love of Bloody Marys? I wonder how she's going to explain that one now?
D. Taina
"The story is told -- though who can say if it be true..." -Shari
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 11:31:23 pm EDT from 74.213.101.133

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kLNdMY1JlR0
Greg Bishansky - [<--- Greg's Blog of Clue-by-Fours]
Elisa Maza, why don't you just take that "sodie pop" can and stick the straw right into New York's eye!
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 11:26:48 pm EDT from 68.199.5.105

Guys.

The penis was in your hearts all along.
Harlan Phoenix
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 11:12:08 pm EDT from 216.96.98.184

Did i seem borderline obsessed when I wrote my first post here and my question in the questions section plus a youtube post? I posted on two sites, and that makes me obsessed? I must've been EXCITED and SHOCKED to tell everyone what I saw and get their opinion! And I would've stopped there until people started attacking me personally. Don't tell me people are saying I see penises everywhere because I seem obsessed. They did that to put me down and imply homosexuality. The very first comment on my youtube post said that, and it was by none other than your D. Taina.

Look, all I wanted was to generate a discussion and to see if I was right or wrong in people's eyes. I like Disney a lot and I enjoy secrets. I NEVER notice the hidden things within films or video games, whether intentional or not, and so I was stunned when I saw what I saw and just had to let others know. But now I'm disappointed because nobody wants to consider what I saw and dismisses it without any substantial thought. Maybe I was looking for a I'm-half-right/half-wrong answer, but I didn't get it. Personal attacks hurt my pride, and I have a spine so I stood up for myself.

But if this discussion continues to degenerate, perhaps I should just take down my youtube post and ask that a moderator delete all my comments, here. I didn't mean to cause trouble; I aimed to have a fun debate and that's all.
CJ - [nakedblade@hotmail.com]
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 11:00:54 pm EDT from 216.40.134.106

Incidentally, I've been told my penis looks like that pipe on the Fortress II.

For a second, I thought someone filmed me.
Harlan Phoenix
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 10:56:09 pm EDT from 216.96.98.184

CJ: Let me ask you just one, simple thing: Why in the Hell are you so bloody invested in this issue?

So you saw a penis in a couple seconds of animation. So other people didn't. What's the big deal?

Honestly, people aren't claiming you "see penises everywhere" or such just because you noticed what looked to you to be a phallic symbol in a cartoon show. They're claiming it because you seem borderline obsessed with making everyone else see it, for no discernable reason.
Masterdramon - [kmc12009@mymail.pomona.edu]
"Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? Caught in a landslide, no escape from reality..." - Freddie Mercury of Queen
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 10:45:32 pm EDT from 134.173.90.46

Yes, D. Taina, there are other ways to insinuate bad or weak things about other people, rather than mere name-calling. You started this when you suggested that I see penises everywhere, but you miscalculated when you didn't think I'd call you out on that and return fire. So don't act like you're going to take the high road. You've already lowered the debate into the gutter, and it would be hypocritical of you.
CJ - [nakedblade@hotmail.com]
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 10:38:15 pm EDT from 216.40.134.106

Did you read my comment where I said I apologized if I seemed like I was suggesting the animators drew a penis on purpose? I said that I didn't know if they intended that or not, so forgive me if it seems I implied that. I don't wish to imply that, at all. Thanks for reading carefully and for not putting words in my mouth, Greg.

Let's leave the "real" people you claim support you, and I'll leave my "fake" roommate who I claim supports me out of this, Greg. You can bet I have more friends than just a roommate, plus family, who will be happy to flood this comments section to tell you off, if that's what you really want. But what you want is to act like I'm the only one who believes my eyes, and that's simply not the case. I'm here in Gargoyles-lover territory, which takes a lot of courage, because it's obvious many will be blindly supporting the image and attacking me however they can, including calling me names. Yet, your response is to call people "retard"? And you don't even apologize for it. Show some class.

So you say you never saw a penis, and you still don't see it? Perhaps you haven't seen a penis before, either, Greg. Perhaps you and D. Taina are the same person because you BOTH suggested I see penises everywhere, though I'm heterosexual and know what one looks like, possessing one. (Thanks for not attacking anyone's sexuality, Greg and D. Taina.)

The "I-don't-see-one/I-see-one" debate isn't working out. Do you agree that the pipe on the right is supposed to look like the pipe on the left? Do you agree that the pipe on the right has the top portion that is significantly more rounded, as opposed to elongated, than the one on the left? Do you agree that there's as much of a phallic look to the pipe on the right as there was to the vertical piece shown on The Little Mermaid video cover? Start there, Greg. Then I'll listen to you.
CJ - [nakedblade@hotmail.com]
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 10:35:28 pm EDT from 216.40.134.106

CJ: You really shouldn't talk about personal attacks. I don't know what a penis looks like? You don't think that's a personal attack? I'll choose to take the high ground on that.

As for The Little Mermaid? It's common knowledge that the artist was working at 4 AM under the pressure of a tight deadline and unintentionally painted what you saw. Go to Snopes.com and read up on the controversy.
D. Taina
"The story is told -- though who can say if it be true..." -Shari
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 10:23:20 pm EDT from 74.213.101.133

The thing is, you came in here seemingly determined to kill any credibility you would have otherwise had. You come in declaring that the animators drew a penis. Well, I've looked at your video and there is no penis there unless you want there to be. I never saw it, and I still don't see it. And I looked where your description told me to look.

And as for the insulting, no one was insulting you until you came back and agreed with yourself... and then, once caught, told us it was your roommate. I don't pretend to speak for everyone else, but I don't think most of us buy that. You're not the first person to do this and get caught.

And I saw the comments on your YouTube video before you disabled them. No one was attacking you, but they were flat out saying you were wrong. You say you want to have a debate, and in a spot you control, you shut out all dissenters, and then here you resort to inventing someone to back you up.

You hurt your own credibility. Now, if you want to go through life seeing penises everywhere, more power to you. But, I think, that says a lot more about you than it does about the product.
Greg Bishansky - [<--- Greg's Blog of Clue-by-Fours]
Elisa Maza, why don't you just take that "sodie pop" can and stick the straw right into New York's eye!
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 10:11:28 pm EDT from 68.199.5.105

Really, this is what we're discussing? Is this what the comment room has come to? This is a sad conversation.

I do agree, however, that I wish people wouldn't use the word "retard" as a pejorative. I've worked with enough mentally handicapped people not to find it funny (with the exception of satirical use, like in Tropic Thunder, but simply insulting people doesn't count).
Jurgan - [jurgan6@yahoo.com]
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 10:08:32 pm EDT from 75.76.235.156

Look, D. Taina, you're just as guilty of refusing to see how the pipe in any way, shape or form looks like a phallus. You failed to provide a single reason to dispute why the head doesn't look like a head, why the shaft doesn't resemble a shaft, or why the testicle doesn't resemble a testicle. Your youtube post stated that you even refuse to believe the Little Mermaid controversy when even the Disney Company conceded that the drawing on the cover of the video looked phallic. How are people supposed to argue with YOU? You don't want to look, or maybe you don't even know what a penis looks like. If I was good with technology like Greg B., I'd trace the outline for you.

(And how am I going to allow comments on youtube when we've got guys like Greg B. stooping to calling people "retard"? Ad hominem attacks are the lowest form of debate. Stop addressing me personally, and start addressing what I saw. Otherwise, it's just not worth debating you because you aren't capable of reason.)
CJ - [nakedblade@hotmail.com]
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 9:48:24 pm EDT from 216.40.134.106

I tried arguing with him on YouTube and directing him to the GargWiki website to take a look at the full panorama of Fortress I. But there's just no arguing with someone like that. Now I see that he disabled comments...

I guess some people are going to see what they want to see. Now if you'll excuse me, I'm off to watch Mark of the Panther to take a look at the huge vagina that Goliath and Diane fell into... which was full of cobwebs and spiders. Is Disney trying to tell us something?!
D. Taina
"The story is told -- though who can say if it be true..." -Shari
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 7:42:54 pm EDT from 74.213.101.133

Sorry for making my roommate seem shady. We share a computer andI tried to defend his idea. sorry.
Anonymous
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 5:21:36 pm EDT from 216.40.134.106

Yes, you're quite right. I'm not sure how the IP thing works, but I did find out that my roommate posted here to defend my comment. (I told him and everyone I knew about my "discovery," and we share the same computer.) If I could remove his comment, I would. Apologies. Greg is right about the concern.
CJ - [nakedblade@hotmail.com]
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 5:13:02 pm EDT from 216.40.134.106

And here we go.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v661/gregx/LyingRetard.png

You lied, you got caught.
Greg Bishansky - [<--- Greg's Blog of Clue-by-Fours]
Elisa Maza, why don't you just take that "sodie pop" can and stick the straw right into New York's eye!
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 5:07:08 pm EDT from 68.199.5.105

CJ> I'm not accusing you of a dirty trick. I am flat out pointing out that you committed a dirty trick. Your IP is visible if you highlight your info. We know that was you.
Greg Bishansky - [<--- Greg's Blog of Clue-by-Fours]
Elisa Maza, why don't you just take that "sodie pop" can and stick the straw right into New York's eye!
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 5:03:47 pm EDT from 68.199.5.105

Interesting comments, everyone, but please don't accuse me of resorting to dirty tricks. My email address is present and open for all to see or to contact me, right? The only thing I need to apologize for is for maybe seeming too bold. I do NOT wish to state that Disney or its artist(s) intended to make that pipe thing appear phallic, as I honestly don't know. But I did find the picture noteworthy enough to mention here, where its best fans can analyze or joke about or criticize or defend, etc. Great series, by the way!
CJ - [nakedblade@hotmail.com]
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 4:45:40 pm EDT from 216.40.134.106

CJ & ANONYMOUS> We can see you're the same person. No need to come back under a different guise to agree with yourself. You're not fooling anyone.
Greg Bishansky - [<--- Greg's Blog of Clue-by-Fours]
Elisa Maza, why don't you just take that "sodie pop" can and stick the straw right into New York's eye!
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 4:10:23 pm EDT from 68.199.5.105

Haha. Yeah, it does! At least, it looks as much like one as the Little Mermaid one. What do you guys want to say yep that's one? The right color? More length? Really?! Love is blind, I guess.
Anonymous
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 3:19:03 pm EDT from 216.40.134.106

Geee, Rebel... now that you mention it...
Matt - [Saint Louis, Missouri, USA]
"... And if we did it before, we can do it again." "And we will. Together." - Goliath and Elisa, "The Edge"
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 2:53:16 pm EDT from 99.92.109.252

Those tubes don't resemble penises anymore than the hole that Goliath and Diane fall into in "Mark of the Panther" resembles a vagina.
Rebel
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 2:42:57 pm EDT from 69.134.102.225

If Fortress I resembles anything it's the Chrysler building.

Having now watched this six seconds of footage at least three times the only thing that stands out to me is the ridiculous radar-looking thing between what I believe are massive exhaust tubes. It looks like the designer paired a parabolic radar antenna with some kind of camera/sensor in a spherical housing. The antenna blocks the camera from looking forward and the camera blocks the antenna from looking behind.

Anyways, I guess what this guy is on about is the port-side exhaust tube looking a bit phallic. Not only does it not look like a penis, but there's a second tube across the way. If it was some kind of hidden penis thing then these animators kicked it up a notch with hidden diphallia and have rightfully earned some kind of internationally recognized award. Or, perhaps, we've stumbled upon the real reason they closed down Walt Disney Animation Japan.
Gorebash
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 1:42:12 pm EDT from 207.206.236.245

Some people have *way* overactive imaginations.

Anyway, a belated happy birthday, Greg!
Spen
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 1:01:01 pm EDT from 66.43.205.35

Happy birthday, and I hope it's one to remember. Your Disney Gargoyles TV show has newly been discovered to be victim of a Disney artist's "subliminal message," a.k.a. a penis. Season 1, episode 4, "Awakening: Part 4 of 5." It's on youtube as "Disney Penis: Gargoyles." http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwciaJ7fa_0
CJ - [nakedblade@hotmail.com]
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 12:42:21 pm EDT from 216.40.134.106

Thank you all for the birthday wishes! They are much appreciated!
Greg Weisman
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 4:00:06 am EDT from 68.183.95.134

A very Happy Birthday to Greg Weisman! May all your wishes come true!

My wish is that Greg would collaborate with Lauren Faust. You can thank the MLP/Garg stuff for inspiring that!
Anonymous
posted @ Thu, Sep 29, 2011 1:54:14 am EDT from 173.58.171.116

****A giant cake appears on the table as Blaise's voice booms through the Room.****

HAPPY BIRTHDAY MR. GREG WEISMAN!

****Candles appear on the cake and burst into flame as the echoes of Blaise's voice die away.****
Blaise
"Some days you're the pigeon. Some days you're the statue."
posted @ Wed, Sep 28, 2011 11:37:59 pm EDT from 76.208.140.67

Happy Birthday, Greg!
Harvester of Eyes - [Minstrel75@gmail.com]
posted @ Wed, Sep 28, 2011 7:35:28 pm EDT from 97.102.10.159

Happy birthday, Greg Weisman!

And RIP Charles Canmore who died on September 28th, 1980 under mysterious circumstances... He was taken from us far, far, FAR too soon!
D. Taina
"The story is told -- though who can say if it be true..." -Shari
posted @ Wed, Sep 28, 2011 7:07:35 pm EDT from 74.213.101.133

Happy B-day Greg W! None of us would be here without you.
Algernon
Man, 2010 was a crazy year. Remember when the monolith turned Jupiter into a star? Good times.
posted @ Wed, Sep 28, 2011 6:36:22 pm EDT from 86.40.255.52

A most Happy Birthday to the Wise Man.
Brainiac - [OSUBrainiac at gmail dot com]
There is balance in all things. Live in symmetry with the world around you. If you must blow things up and steal from those around you, THAT'S WHAT RPGS ARE FOR!
posted @ Wed, Sep 28, 2011 6:19:11 pm EDT from 174.101.230.22

Happy birthday, Mr. Weisman!
Harlan Phoenix
posted @ Wed, Sep 28, 2011 5:07:59 pm EDT from 216.96.98.184

GOREBASH> Fun pics, though I can't help thinking Twilight would look better as a London Clan style Garg like Una.
Algernon
Man, 2010 was a crazy year. Remember when the monolith turned Jupiter into a star? Good times.
posted @ Wed, Sep 28, 2011 3:06:39 pm EDT from 86.40.148.117

Thanks for posting those, Gore. The "Gargs into Ponies" were extremely well done. I loved em. I loved MLP back in the day, too. It was fun watching the MLP movie 20 years later with my two little cousins and watching them have the same fun as I did watching it at that age.
Battle Beast - [Canada]
I DID IT!!! I WATCHED ALL 485 BEST PICTURE NOMINEES IN ONE YEAR!!!
posted @ Wed, Sep 28, 2011 2:17:36 pm EDT from 173.181.90.242

Gorebash: Awesome pics! Who know that Gargoyles and My Little Pony would join forces one day?
D. Taina
"The story is told -- though who can say if it be true..." -Shari
posted @ Wed, Sep 28, 2011 12:55:13 pm EDT from 74.213.101.133

Gorebash: This here proud Brony would like to thank you as well. Out of all those, Flutter-goyle and Huds-pony are definitely my favorites.
Masterdramon - [kmc12009@mymail.pomona.edu]
"Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? Caught in a landslide, no escape from reality..." - Freddie Mercury of Queen
posted @ Wed, Sep 28, 2011 12:30:10 pm EDT from 134.173.89.173

Gorebash > Thanks for posting those. I hope the blogger does Rainbow Dash as a gargoyle.
Rebel
posted @ Wed, Sep 28, 2011 11:52:58 am EDT from 69.134.102.225

From distant interwebs comes a little something for every pony and every brony.

Demona as a My Little Pony with a Phoenix Gate cutie mark:
http://tealcustoms.deviantart.com/art/Demona-50004128

Apparently I got my tattoo in the wrong location.

The Manhattan clan in illustrated form:
http://nebulan.deviantart.com/art/Gargoyles-My-Little-Ponies-103806463

Twilight Sparkle as a gargoyle:
http://jubilteese.tumblr.com/post/9562311962/my-little-gargoyles-friendship-is-something-i

Fluttershy as a gargoyle:
http://jubilteese.tumblr.com/post/9600327615/more-ponies-as-gargoyles-fluttershy-now

Applejack as a gargoyle:
http://jubilteese.tumblr.com/post/9634453936/applejack-doesnt-make-the-best-gargoyle-twilight
Gorebash
posted @ Wed, Sep 28, 2011 11:41:42 am EDT from 207.206.236.245

Greg B., I'm not really bothered at all about a 200+ question backlog that's developed in just a couple weeks. Each show Greg's worked on has carried with it a large and dedicated fan base. Ask Greg provides a unique opportunity for those fans. Writers who are on Twitter or who have a blog typically won't get to every question that fans throw at them, but with Ask Greg, for good and for ill, they all get through.

What surprises me is that Ask Greg isn't packed with even more questions. I suspect by the time season two of Young Justice rolls around we'll see massive numbers unless Greg decides to close the queue.

I also think fishing for spoilers is a pretty natural thing to do when your a fan of a show that's still in production. It shows people are excited and interested and can't wait to see what happens next.

And as long as Ask Greg remains a popular place for fans of Greg's it means each one is getting a dose of Gargoyles as they come through, which isn't a bad thing. Although I think I need to work on a way to stick the dvds, comics, and sculptures plugs into the latest responses page. Every little bit and all.
Gorebash
posted @ Wed, Sep 28, 2011 11:08:17 am EDT from 207.206.236.245

Happy 48th, Greg! :D
Masterdramon - [kmc12009@mymail.pomona.edu]
"Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? Caught in a landslide, no escape from reality..." - Freddie Mercury of Queen
posted @ Wed, Sep 28, 2011 10:59:54 am EDT from 134.173.89.173

Happy Birthday, Greg!
Todd Jensen
posted @ Wed, Sep 28, 2011 10:13:22 am EDT from 198.209.226.130

Happy Birthday, Greg!
Matt - [Saint Louis, Missouri, USA]
"... And if we did it before, we can do it again." "And we will. Together." - Goliath and Elisa, "The Edge"
posted @ Wed, Sep 28, 2011 9:37:38 am EDT from 99.92.109.252

Oh, totally meant to post this last night after midnight: Happy Birthday, Greg Weisman :D
Phoenician
"The suspense is terrible . . . I hope it lasts," -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Wed, Sep 28, 2011 9:14:46 am EDT from 74.162.151.13

I wonder what the people asking for spoilers are thinking. Are they just too impatient to wait for the next episodes?
Todd Jensen - [merlyn1@mindspring.com]
posted @ Wed, Sep 28, 2011 7:51:32 am EDT from 4.244.0.80

Todd Jensen- I'm not sure the PITT CREW would be unthinkable these days. Especially if they start out as a splinter group of PETA or Greenpeace. Although it's doubtful that PITT wouldn't go beyond trying to forcibly relocate the clan at present since they like everyone else don't know Gargoyles are sentient.
Vinnie - [tpeano29@hotmail.com]
God Bless you All!
posted @ Wed, Sep 28, 2011 2:51:13 am EDT from 99.156.196.41

darn Renard . . .
Phoenician
"The suspense is terrible . . . I hope it lasts," -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Tue, Sep 27, 2011 11:09:00 pm EDT from 98.69.193.229

Queue: Dang, I really need to finish up what's probably just going to be my half-way-through review of Bates and Weisman's Captain Atom run . . .

. . . and a two-year backlog has not been seen since before 2006, Bishansky -- I'm not even going to joke about those days >_<
Phoenician
"The suspense is terrible . . . I hope it lasts," -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Tue, Sep 27, 2011 11:08:22 pm EDT from 98.69.193.229

Is anyone else bothered that in less than two weeks, the Ask Greg backlog is already up to two hundred questions? And most of them have no substance or are fishing for spoilers?

At the rate they're going, we'll have a two year backlog. Again.
Greg Bishansky - [<--- Greg's Blog of Clue-by-Fours]
Elisa Maza, why don't you just take that "sodie pop" can and stick the straw right into New York's eye!
posted @ Tue, Sep 27, 2011 10:59:08 pm EDT from 68.199.5.105

In the midst of that run-on sentance, the poster made a comment that Broadway should get a mate with "girth" like his own and a love for food as well.

One of the things I liked most about Broadway and Angela getting together was that, even though IMHO it was the only possible matchup, Angela saw through his stomach and saw his heart inside.

Lets face it... Brooklyn is the jock, and Lexington is the computer geek. Broadway was the only real choice. It would be too easy to have Angela fall for the jock, and can you really picture Angela with Lexington?

Another great feature of Gargoyles that I've come to love and respect. You just don't know what will happen.
Battle Beast - [Canada]
I DID IT!!! I WATCHED ALL 485 BEST PICTURE NOMINEES IN ONE YEAR!!!
posted @ Tue, Sep 27, 2011 7:16:49 pm EDT from 173.181.92.95

Thanks, Bishansky! :)
Battle Beast - [Canada]
I DID IT!!! I WATCHED ALL 485 BEST PICTURE NOMINEES IN ONE YEAR!!!
posted @ Tue, Sep 27, 2011 7:10:33 pm EDT from 173.181.92.95

Please forgive me for reposting this, but a lot of people might have missed this post in the recent troll incident - and we obviously want to move away from that incident.

Bishansky makes a good point about the hypothetical Castaway being better suited to 2198 than to 1997 - and linked to my earlier post about how many of the stories in "The Goliath Chronicles" would have made more sense if they were "X-Men" rather than "Gargoyles". From the public's perspective in 1996-97, the gargoyles aren't a racial minority, the way that mutants in "X-Men" are. They would see the gargoyles as simply weird, frightening monsters that seemingly came out of nowhere. They'd probably feel about them almost the way that Hrothgar and his household in "Beowulf" felt about Grendel: a terrifying alien presence that threatens their world. (Note the Jogger's comments about them in "The Journey": "What are they? Dinosaurs? Aliens? Demons?" I think those questions would echo what most of the public are thinking at that point.)

Eventually, as the public learn more about the gargoyles, their thoughts on this species will shift, and those who hate and fear them will have different reasons for hating and fearing them, reasons closer to the motives of conventional racial hatred and bigotry. But in the early days, it'll be fear of apparently hostile predators. While "The Goliath Chronicles" depicted the Quarrymen as nearly all the kind of mercenaries and thugs who'd be working for regular "big bads" in other animated series, I think that most of them in the present-day period would be ordinary New Yorkers who see those hammers as probably the only defense their community has against those winged monsters (though we do know that there are folks among them like Banquo and Fleance, who are more likely motivated by the thought of the next pay check - or getting their own back after past fights with the clan). A PIT Crew-like organization would be unthinkable in this setting for a long time, as unthinkable as a group of Danes in Heorot arguing that Grendel was misunderstood and they should try talking to him.

And good point, Bishansky, about the fans who think too much like humans when they approach gargoyle culture.
Todd Jensen - [merlyn1@mindspring.com]
posted @ Tue, Sep 27, 2011 6:11:32 pm EDT from 4.245.84.190

Vilma: Some troll came into the Comment Room pretending to be Greg Weisman and claiming that he was shutting Station 8 down. Considering that many regular members here have met Greg W. (and in Greg B.'s case, are good friends with the guy), this was supremely and transparently pathetic, particularly as this is Gorebash's and not Greg W.'s site to take down in the first place.

So yeah, sad and pitiful trolling attempt, now over with. Moving on.
Masterdramon - [kmc12009@mymail.pomona.edu]
"Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? Caught in a landslide, no escape from reality..." - Freddie Mercury of Queen
posted @ Tue, Sep 27, 2011 3:14:17 pm EDT from 134.173.89.173

wow what the H. E. double hockey sticks is going on in here??
vilma - [vilmaxiii@yahoo.com]
posted @ Tue, Sep 27, 2011 11:29:12 am EDT from 72.93.88.87

A little search of past comment rooms with his IP address reveals orange "Greg" is actually Merc with a Mouth.

http://www.s8.org/gargoyles/comment/archive/index.php?archive_date=2010-04-19
http://www.s8.org/gargoyles/comment/archive/index.php?archive_date=2010-04-05
http://www.s8.org/gargoyles/comment/archive/index.php?archive_date=2009-09-07
http://www.s8.org/gargoyles/comment/archive/index.php?archive_date=2009-09-14

Hi Merc!
Gorebash
posted @ Tue, Sep 27, 2011 9:03:56 am EDT from 207.206.236.245

Of course, the real Greg Weisman would know that this isn't his site to take down.
Greg Weisman
posted @ Tue, Sep 27, 2011 3:08:47 am EDT from 68.183.95.134

Oh, "Greg!" What kind of car were you driving when you were producing "Spectacular Spider-Man?" Remember when I came down to the studio in Culver City, and we went to lunch while you were in production. We took your car...

What kind of car was that? ;)
Greg Bishansky - [<--- Greg's Blog of Clue-by-Fours]
Elisa Maza, why don't you just take that "sodie pop" can and stick the straw right into New York's eye!
posted @ Tue, Sep 27, 2011 1:43:21 am EDT from 68.199.5.105

I'd normally respond to the troll myself with a video of Thaal Sinestro, but Greg B.'s handling this far more amusingly than I ever could. XD
Masterdramon - [kmc12009@mymail.pomona.edu]
"Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? Caught in a landslide, no escape from reality..." - Freddie Mercury of Queen
posted @ Tue, Sep 27, 2011 1:38:57 am EDT from 134.173.89.173

The site will be up until New Year's after that I'm taking it down for personal reasons
Greg Weisman
posted @ Tue, Sep 27, 2011 1:38:01 am EDT from 75.118.125.132

One more question, "Greg." Do you remember what we had for dinner the last time we ate out together? What was it, and how did you like it? ;)
Greg Bishansky - [<--- Greg's Blog of Clue-by-Fours]
Elisa Maza, why don't you just take that "sodie pop" can and stick the straw right into New York's eye!
posted @ Tue, Sep 27, 2011 1:37:29 am EDT from 68.199.5.105

@Bishanky I email them and phone them. It's not that hard
Greg Weisman
posted @ Tue, Sep 27, 2011 1:35:17 am EDT from 75.118.125.132

So "Greg," how do you commute to the studio every day when you live in Ohio? ;)
Greg Bishansky - [<--- Greg's Blog of Clue-by-Fours]
Elisa Maza, why don't you just take that "sodie pop" can and stick the straw right into New York's eye!
posted @ Tue, Sep 27, 2011 1:30:46 am EDT from 68.199.5.105

I'm shutting the site down
Greg Weisman
posted @ Tue, Sep 27, 2011 1:23:59 am EDT from 75.118.125.132

Young Justice is getting new episodes every Friday through October 21st: http://www.worldsfinestonline.com/news.php?action=fullnews&id=1134
Landon Thomas - [<- Gargoyles News Twitter Feed]
posted @ Tue, Sep 27, 2011 12:55:24 am EDT from 76.17.205.202

Bishansky makes a good point about the hypothetical Castaway being better suited to 2198 than to 1997 - and linked to my earlier post about how many of the stories in "The Goliath Chronicles" would have made more sense if they were "X-Men" rather than "Gargoyles". From the public's perspective in 1996-97, the gargoyles aren't a racial minority, the way that mutants in "X-Men" are. They would see the gargoyles as simply weird, frightening monsters that seemingly came out of nowhere. They'd probably feel about them almost the way that Hrothgar and his household in "Beowulf" felt about Grendel: a terrifying alien presence that threatens their world. (Note the Jogger's comments about them in "The Journey": "What are they? Dinosaurs? Aliens? Demons?" I think those questions would echo what most of the public are thinking at that point.)

Eventually, as the public learn more about the gargoyles, their thoughts on this species will shift, and those who hate and fear them will have different reasons for hating and fearing them, reasons closer to the motives of conventional racial hatred and bigotry. But in the early days, it'll be fear of apparently hostile predators. While "The Goliath Chronicles" depicted the Quarrymen as nearly all the kind of mercenaries and thugs who'd be working for regular "big bads" in other animated series, I think that most of them in the present-day period would be ordinary New Yorkers who see those hammers as probably the only defense their community has against those winged monsters (though we do know that there are folks among them like Banquo and Fleance, who are more likely motivated by the thought of the next pay check - or getting their own back after past fights with the clan). A PIT Crew-like organization would be unthinkable in this setting for a long time, as unthinkable as a group of Danes in Heorot arguing that Grendel was misunderstood and they should try talking to him.

And good point, Bishansky, about the fans who think too much like humans when they approach gargoyle culture.
Todd Jensen - [merlyn1@mindspring.com]
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 10:20:07 pm EDT from 4.244.0.30

Some aspects of gargoyle behavior/culture probably arise from instinctual urges. Some aspects are probably arise from learned behavior. Viewing the whole clan as one's parents or viewing the whole rookery as your children is probably an instinctual urge. Not using names for individual clan members is probably a learned behavior (judging by how easy it was for the gargoyles to adopt the convention of using names).

I think human culture will have an influence on gargoyle culture, to the extent that the behaviors being influenced are *learned* behaviors rather than being instinctual urges. But aspects of gargoyle culture which stem from a gargoyle's instincts, like viewing the whole rookery as your children or viewing the whole clan as your parents, or feeling a drive to protect something, or the tendency to live in clans rather than live solitary lives, etc., *those* types of things are things that I don't see changing. Could I imagine a gargoyle wearing blue jeans and a tank top? Unfortunately, yes, because I don't think there is anything in a gargoyle's mind that naturally compels them to wear loincloths. But I don't see gargoyles ever drifting towards nuclear families, or living without clans, or living without protecting something, or fearing that which they don't understand, etc.
Rebel
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 10:07:26 pm EDT from 69.134.102.225

Masterdramon makes a lot of good and interesting points. And it all isn't just an educated guess about the future, we've already seen it in the series. Traditionally, gargoyles don't use names, but those that have significant contact with humans have started using them. At first it is just humans giving certain notable individuals names, like Goliath, but eventually the gargoyles are naming themselves and each other. Still, keep in mind that in a society where gargoyles and humans have equal standing, as in Ishimura, this can go both ways. Greg has said that the concept of bushido has its roots in gargoyle culture and was adopted by humans. Also, some aspects of gargoyle culture are unlikely to change simply because of the differences between the species. A lot of talk is given to the idea of gargoyles raising their children individually rather than collectively. This might work in small clans with few hatchlings, but in full clans with dozens of eggs in each generation, it might often require marking an egg for ten years or conducting a DNA test to determine parentage for certain. Sure, sometimes the hatchlings physical appearance is so striking that there is little doubt (as Elisa noted in Angela), but I suspect that more often than not, there might be suspicions, but a bit of doubt too. Notice that Elisa never pointed out that Broadway is Hudson's biological son (though maybe if she had seen Hudson's mate, she might've made the conclusion). My point is, gargoyles just don't think this way. The move to raise the hatchlings individually would require a big change in thinking and a lot of work of the clan. And the hatchlings would really be no better for it. If the whole clan raises the hatchlings, that means the hatchlings' parents are already raising them, why would they go through all the effort to limit the care their offspring receives? Honestly, and I'm speaking as an amateur evolutionary biologist here, if every human female in a community gave birth at the same time at the same intervals like gargoyles do, I suspect we would've evolved the same system as gargoyles have. In fact, many real world species do this already, especially those that form tight-knit social systems as gargoyles do.

Anyway, all of this is one more reason I despise the "humans with wings" movement. Not to mention how boring that makes the gargoyles. Would anyone watch a show called: "Humans... with wings" about a bunch of people who pay their bills and go to the grocery store and buy designer jeans, but they can glide to the mall to do so... no.
Matt - [Saint Louis, Missouri, USA]
"... And if we did it before, we can do it again." "And we will. Together." - Goliath and Elisa, "The Edge"
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 9:45:42 pm EDT from 99.92.109.252

**Notices Bishanky's comments regarding Cecil**

Holy crap... That has to be one of the longest run on sentences I've ever seen! The poor grammar is killing me...
The One Known As Mochi - [shogi.keima.08@gmail.com]
Current Mood: (>**)> It hurts to look at bad grammar...
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 9:01:47 pm EDT from 72.199.83.177

Greg B.: While I agree with you generally - gargoyles raising their children individually based on biological relationships or taking names like Alice and Steve is something that just makes me cringe and is one of the main reasons I no longer read much "Gargoyles" fanfiction - I do think that a greater influence of human culture on gargoyle culture is going to be pretty much inevitable by the time 2198 rolls around.

Look at the London Clan, in comparison to the Manhattan Clan's current state, for where I think the wind appears to be blowing for the gargoyle population as of 1997...for good and for ill. Their clothing, while still largely unconventional by human standards, is nevertheless still far more modern and covers much more of their bodies; they do business, and presumably pay taxes; they live on a grand estate with modern utilities, albeit adjusted to accomodate gargoyle lifestyles. By necessity of having to manage such a large clan without detection in the modern age, they have taken on far more "human-esque" customs than the comparatively nascent Manhattan Clan.

The establishment of the Gargoyle Nation, and the "traditionalist" movement that appears to have spurred the creation of the New Wyvern Clan should mitigate the effects to some degree, but I do, unfortunately, believe that it is inevitable that some basic tenets of gargoyle culture will have eroded by 2198. Looking at the progression of similar minority groups throughout history, it seems to be the inescapable result of continuous gargoyle interaction with modern human society.
Masterdramon - [kmc12009@mymail.pomona.edu]
"Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? Caught in a landslide, no escape from reality..." - Freddie Mercury of Queen
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 8:55:10 pm EDT from 134.173.89.173

While I'm here, and I know I've talked about this before, but there are always different kinds of bigotry... there is a huge portion of the fandom that hates the gargoyle species. Well, that's hyperbole, but they engage in a different kind of bigotry... in fan writing and in fan art, they strip away the gargoyles' very culture and in an attempt to "christianize and civilize" they turn them into humans with wings.

It's an altogether different kind of bigotry. Looking different is okay, but thinking fundamentally different is not. And I find it just as creepy as the looking different variety of bigotry.

I have no doubt in my mind that the Quarrymen of 2198 will include among it's members, people who fear them because of their unique culture. The notion of a gargoyle having many mothers and fathers is so alien that it would be downright freakish to some. Hell, it is to many people in this fandom... who love the gargoyles!
Greg Bishansky - [<--- Greg's Blog of Clue-by-Fours]
Elisa Maza, why don't you just take that "sodie pop" can and stick the straw right into New York's eye!
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 8:13:34 pm EDT from 68.199.5.105

Greg B>"The character you're describing would fit in better in 2198. Not in 1997."

That's a pretty good point. I didn't consider that.
Harlan Phoenix
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 8:08:59 pm EDT from 216.96.98.184

Harlan> The character you're describing would fit in better in 2198. Not in 1997.
Greg Bishansky - [<--- Greg's Blog of Clue-by-Fours]
Elisa Maza, why don't you just take that "sodie pop" can and stick the straw right into New York's eye!
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 8:04:33 pm EDT from 68.199.5.105

It's said that bigots hate the targets of their bigotry for what they are, not for what they do, so Castaway and his followers hating the gargoyles for being gargoyles, looking upon their batlike wings, tails, and turning to stone in the daytime as all unnatural, is possible.
Todd Jensen - [merlyn1@mindspring.com]
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 7:59:59 pm EDT from 4.244.0.30

Algernon>"So we're left with what appears to be some English indutrialist who just decided pour his money into an anti-gargoyle hate group because... he's just a jerk, I guess."

As terrible a character as he is, countless cultures, folklores, religion, and everyday society have it ingrained that man has dominion over non-human animals. Even examples of sentience don't always give sentient non-humans a fair shake at complexity (consider our own Anansi or the biblical snake). Consider that Zeus would take animal forms to seduce women. There's a strong arguable undercurrent that animalistic creatures given sentience is something that is paradoxical and WRONG and human intelligence lacking human boundaries is dangerous (and a symbol Zeus thought powerful enough for his own escapades).

I can completely believe someone could be offended by gargoyles just by basic existence. TGC Castaway would be interesting as "well read upper class socialite preserving humanity's right to exclusive higher sentience." The pieces are all there. What's more non-animal than an organized industrialist, likewise an orator?

You could even contrast him with Elisa. Elisa comes from a pretty religiously diverse family. Castaway and Elisa's particular slants could open up showing how both sides of the spiritually minded viewed gargoyle sentience (if you played Castaway with vague but strict religious beliefs, given the snake as that prior good example), so that could be played fair with.

You could make the argument that a concept as rigid as "a living embodiment of all that is exclusively human" is too caricature-ish to fit into Gargoyles, but showing him GETTING THERE or implying how he did (more likely) could give him some depth.

As terrible as Castaway was, I think the notion of simply being appalled by non-human civilized intelligence inherently COULD make for an interesting idea, and I think could make the pay off for acceptance all the more powerful when people shake off that notion of humanity being so cosmically unique and important.
Harlan Phoenix
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 7:56:01 pm EDT from 216.96.98.184

Oh, I agree.... but I figured others would point out the atrocious grammar. It was painful to read.
Greg Bishansky - [<--- Greg's Blog of Clue-by-Fours]
Elisa Maza, why don't you just take that "sodie pop" can and stick the straw right into New York's eye!
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 7:33:57 pm EDT from 68.199.5.105

Punctuation: It's not just a good idea, it's the law. Or it should be.
Patrick
"A little nonsense now and then is relished by the wisest men." - Willy Wonka
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 7:27:46 pm EDT from 76.190.228.74

BISHANSKY - I found the construction of those two ideas-masquerading-as-questions even more painful than their disregard for the rules. (I'm clearly not the only one, too.)

Another problem with Castaway's behavior in "The Goliath Chronicles" that would exist even if these were mutants rather than gargoyles he was hunting: he seems to jump back and forth between being concerned with public perception and behaving as if he was an open super-villain. At the start of "Angels in the Night", he goes to a lot of trouble to paint himself to Margot as an honest businessman whose company the gargoyles tried to sabotage with total disregard for the public safety. Then he follows that by attacking a passenger train with lots of humans on board to get at Angela and Bronx (who were already in police custody and therefore supposedly no longer a danger to the public). I wonder how he would have tried explaining that act afterwards (maybe he really *did* intend to get rid of all the human passengers even if the rest of the clan hadn't shown up, to eliminate possible witnesses). I can't imagine other villains concerned with maintaining a good public image (like, say, Lex Luthor, or Tombstone in "The Spectacular Spider-Man") making that kind of blunder. (The Castaway of "Clan-Building" showed a lot more sense, in things like ordering Quarrymen on Halloween patrol to leave their hammers at home, to avoid embarrassing clashes with costumed trick-or-treaters.)

Although I do wonder whether the notion of the Quarrymen attacking the train was a late addition to the script, after Greg Weisman talked the "Goliath Chronicles" production team out of using their original ending of the clan and Elisa running away from New York. That could explain the problems with it.
Todd Jensen - [merlyn1@mindspring.com]
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 6:55:21 pm EDT from 4.244.0.30

That part about Hudson who should be Goliath's father is ... simply ridiculous. :O
Comet
I'm shipping off...to find my wooden leg!
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 6:41:02 pm EDT from 80.187.111.69

lol, D. Taina d:
Phoenician
"The suspense is terrible . . . I hope it lasts," -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 6:21:33 pm EDT from 98.69.174.168

GXB: . . . 436 words before a period comes into existence >_<

Of course, part of me would really get a kick out of GregW's potential smarta** response . . .
Phoenician
"The suspense is terrible . . . I hope it lasts," -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 6:20:37 pm EDT from 98.69.174.168

Greg B: 437 words before a period is too much!
D. Taina
"The story is told -- though who can say if it be true..." -Shari
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 6:11:14 pm EDT from 74.213.101.133

And here are two more posts with ideas masquerading as questions... and very blatantly.

http://www.s8.org/gargoyles/askgreg/search.php?qid=13735
http://www.s8.org/gargoyles/askgreg/search.php?qid=13736

Don't these people read the rules? But, for the lulz, and trust me... these are very unintentionally funny, I'm going to post these here, because I know Todd is going to wipe them.

****

hi greg weisman my name is cecil and im writing to tell you that im still and always will be a fan of the show and love watching the second and third season of the show on youtube but what i didnt like was the writers and the producers coming up with the idea that broadway and angela should be a couple im sorry but i dont see the chemistry between the two characters dont get me wrong i love the character of broadway he's terrific but he's not a suitable mate for angela i think you should hook broadway up with a female gargoyle thats the same large girth and is into food as much as he is and as good a fighter as he is what about hooking him up with one of angelas rookerie sisters on avalon and as for angela she should hook up with gabriel let me tell you greg angela and gabriel make a nice couple thats who the producers and the writers should've made a couple let me tell you the first time i saw them together i have to say their chemistry is and always will be amazingly flawless it was evident in the episodes the three part avalon trilogy and the episode i'll met by moonlight because in that episode i'll met by moonlight it was evident that gabriel and angela have feelings for each other in the conclusion and at the ending of the avalon trilogy where they say goodbye to each other and it is my belief in ill met by moonlight that the producers and writers wand writers were hinting at them becoming a couple in the scene where gabriel and angela are holding each others hands while oberon is chasing after them and goliath in flight look at that episode on youtube and you'll see what i mean and if there is a possible future where angela has three children named artus lancelot gwynevere the father of those children should be gabriel not broadway but if there is a future where she had those supposed children it would probably be in a future on an alternate earth as shown in the episode future tense please take this idea of gabriel and angela as a couple into consideration when you bring the show back on tv on disneyxd as for ophelia being gabriels mate i think she should hook up with one of her rookery brothers on avalon now for some questions and some loose ends to tie up from the comic series and tv show when you bring back the show to tv 1.Will we learn the identity of the son and daughter of oberon and titania when and hopefully if the series returns and when they meet their halfsister or sister janine fox reynard and nephew alexander will they train janine in the ways of magic and her mystical heritage like puck is training alexander. 3. Will demona return to her original format of stone by day warrior by night once puck removes the spell. 4.Will all gargoyles clans be made immortal like demona in the forseeable future. 5. Will there be another gargoyles world tour which will include hudson, lexington, broadway, janine fox reynard and alexander taking their first trip to avalon along with othello a.k.a coldstone and desdemona a.k.a coldfire goliath and angela and bronx. Will othello/coldstone,desdemona/coldfire,iago/coldsteel ever return to there original forms i'm sure you could use the phoenix gate to go back in time to retrieve the original bodies from castle wyvern and put their spiritual essences back in their original bodies.6.Is gabriel ever going to discover that othello/coldstone and desdemona/coldfire are his biological parents because the first time i saw him on the show i said that he is coldstone and coldfires son 7. Will we meet the other clans of gargoyles as mentioned which im sure will happen in the second world tour. 8.Will we see merlin king arthurs mentor who was revealed to be oberons son and will we meet oberons other son as well as queen mab and arthurs old enemy morgana le fay who i believe is also one of the children of oberon. thank you for hearing me out and take all these ideas and questions into consideration. Here's my mailing address Cecil james P.O.Box 100686 Brooklyn N.Y.11210.

****

and...

****

Hi Greg its me again with at least two or more questions 1.Will you include Brooklyn his mate katana and their son and daughter nashville and toichi on the second world tour. 2.Do you think they'll meet up with a gargoyle clan in say india? 3.
How about a big brother little brother relationship between nashville and alexander as well as a friendship between toichi and alexander. 3.I want to know if you plan on having Oberon removing his banishment spell on Puck because he should continue to train alexander and divide his time between avalon and the mortal world I also think the manhattan clan a.k.a the avalon clan should divide their time between avalon and the mortal realm so that their would be more interaction with the rest of their clan on avalon. I dont think Hudson should be Broadways father I think it would be better if you made hudson goliaths father because that relationship is showing why they are so close which would make him angelas grandfather and the future children of Gabriel and Angela artus lancelot and gwynevere will be Hudsons greatgrandchildren and othello/coldstone and desdemona/coldfires grandchildren.I'm sure as you read this you can see I'm a big fan of the show again I ask you to take these ideas into consideration.

***

I think my favorite part was his rant on how, since Broadway is fat, he should be with a fat female.
Greg Bishansky - [<--- Greg's Blog of Clue-by-Fours]
Elisa Maza, why don't you just take that "sodie pop" can and stick the straw right into New York's eye!
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 5:56:11 pm EDT from 68.199.5.105

Angels in The Night would still make no damn sense as an X-Men story. Anti-mutant predjudice in the Marvel Universe is fueled mainly by the fear that mutants are going to rise up and either eradicate or enslave regular humans. The general public seeing the X-Men themselves as outlaws and terrorists who are little better then Magneto's Brotherhood. So laying a trap that hinged on the X-Men risking their own lives to save endangered humans would be kinda out of character for someone like Creed.
Algernon
Man, 2010 was a crazy year. Remember when the monolith turned Jupiter into a star? Good times.
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 5:54:23 pm EDT from 86.41.106.250

Earlier today I found myself quoting Gargoyles... so it got me thinking, what are the Gargoyles quotes that have really stuck in my head even after all these years that I can almost hear spoken by the original characters and it just had an emotional impact....

For me, it's...
Xanatos: Pay a man enough, and he'll walk barefoot into Hell.
Goliath: I have been denied everything, even my revenge!
Hudson: Movies, television, video games... these days, it's hard to tell what's real and what's not.
Archmage: Fulmanos Venite (sp?)
Demona: You served the human. Now you can serve me.
Brooklyn: Yeah, use the Force, Lex.
Hudson: Fine lass, then I shall be the Hudson as well
Hudson: True immortality isn't about living forever. It's about what you do with the time you have. When all your scheming is done, what will be your legacy Xanatos?
Goliath: In my experience, human problems become gargoyle problems.
Goliath: There's no such thing as "a little" vengeance.

I'm sure there are one or two others, but those are the big ones for me that immediately came to mind.

How about the rest of you?
TheGeek
http://www.squidoo.com/thegeeklens-cartoons
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 5:25:14 pm EDT from 98.204.100.195

At the very least, "...And Justice for All" would've made a lot more sense in an X-Men cartoon (it still would've sucked, but not headbanging-ly so). All throughout Goliath is being regarded as a persecuted minority who is unlikely to avoid conviction despite flimsy evidence because most jurists would be prejudiced against him; this might be an issue that a gargoyle would have to face in perhaps a hundred years, but certainly not in 1997.

But substitute in Cyclops instead? Now it makes a little more sense, even if the episode itself is still meh-tastic.
Masterdramon - [kmc12009@mymail.pomona.edu]
"Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? Caught in a landslide, no escape from reality..." - Freddie Mercury of Queen
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 5:21:00 pm EDT from 134.173.89.173

TODD> Hmm... I haven't seen the 90s X-Toon in ages and I haven't really read any of FOH's comicbook appearences. That said, Animated Graydon Creed did have some actual motivation for his villany, over the top as it was at times. Being the human child of two mutant parents would probably have given him issues enough without those parents being Mystique and Sabertooth. Mix externalised self loathing with a heavy dose of psychological and physical childhood abuse and it's easy to see where Creed's anti-mutant hate crusade is coming from.

TGC Castaway by contrast, doesn't seem to have any motivation for his vendetta against the Garg's. The TGCverse seems to regard him as a completely different individual from Jon Canmore. So we're left with what appears to be some English indutrialist who just decided pour his money into an anti-gargoyle hate group because... he's just a jerk, I guess.

Still, it might be interesting to go through the Quarrymen centric eps of TGC one by one and see if they make more sense with X-Men analogues.
Algernon
Man, 2010 was a crazy year. Remember when the monolith turned Jupiter into a star? Good times.
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 1:54:40 pm EDT from 86.40.155.57

Todd's posted twice so in honour of next week's finale...

Matt Smith! Geronimo!

Todd> I think that's fairly accurate. A number of the newer writers (and the Chronciles story editor) had previous worked on the X-Men cartoon, so that was probably an influence. Can't say whether the stories themselves would have made more sense in the other series since I don't remember any of the stories from TGC.
Supermorff
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 11:09:44 am EDT from 62.25.109.195

Does anyone here think that the post-"Journey" stories in "The Goliath Chronicles" would make more sense (though they'd still have some plotholes) if they were "X-Men" stories with mutants (and particularly the X-Men) in the role of the gargoyles and the Friends of Humanity in the role of the Quarrymen?
Todd Jensen
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 10:11:04 am EDT from 198.209.226.130

Just for you, Algernon...David Tennant!
Brainiac - [OSUBrainiac at gmail dot com]
There is balance in all things. Live in symmetry with the world around you. If you must blow things up and steal from those around you, THAT'S WHAT RPGS ARE FOR!
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 8:25:09 am EDT from 137.183.232.22

Christopher Eccleston!
Algernon
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 7:52:17 am EDT from 78.143.160.1

Eight.
Todd Jensen - [merlyn1@mindspring.com]
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 7:25:14 am EDT from 4.244.0.45

Seven...
Comet
I'm shipping off...to find my wooden leg!
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 7:15:31 am EDT from 80.187.111.13

(6th)Sixth!!!!!!
Vinnie - [tpeano29@hotmail.com]
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 3:39:29 am EDT from 99.156.196.41

I plead the fifth
Greg Bishansky - [<--- Greg's Blog of Clue-by-Fours]
Elisa Maza, why don't you just take that "sodie pop" can and stick the straw right into New York's eye!
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 2:29:59 am EDT from 68.199.5.105

Four!
Chip - [<------The League of Extraordinary Nerds Here!]
"An explanation of cause is not a justification by reason." C. S. Lewis
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 2:23:05 am EDT from 96.35.213.38

True... but the third time is the charm.
Matt - [Saint Louis, Missouri, USA]
"... And if we did it before, we can do it again." "And we will. Together." - Goliath and Elisa, "The Edge"
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 1:13:18 am EDT from 99.92.109.252

Now don't be sad, 'cause two outta three ain't bad...
Masterdramon - [kmc12009@mymail.pomona.edu]
"Is this the real life? Is this just fantasy? Caught in a landslide, no escape from reality..." - Freddie Mercury of Queen
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 12:12:07 am EDT from 134.173.89.222

FIRST!
Phoenician
"The suspense is terrible . . . I hope it lasts," -- Willy Wonka
posted @ Mon, Sep 26, 2011 12:00:06 am EDT from 74.162.156.188