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RESPONSES 2001-9 (Sept)

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Anonymous writes...

By 2198 how many fae are off Avalon?
Care to give a few names?

Greg responds...

Very few.

Puck. Alex.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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matt writes...

after the first season, why was it decided to put Goliath's voice over the original opening theme music? i remember the first time i heard it i liked it cuz it was new, but now i think i prefer the just music version, so i'm curious to why it was done.

Greg responds...

I probably prefer the music-only version as well. Though I think Gary Sperling did a great job writing the naration and Keith did a fantastic job reading it.

It was my idea, nevertheless I was really on the fence about it. It seemed that it might help new viewers understand the basics of what was going on. Is there anyone out there for whom this was true?

At any rate, I didn't think it was ideal, but I didn't think it hurt too much either. The final decision was made by my boss Gary Krisel.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

When did you decide there were gargoyles living in New Olympus and Loch Ness?
When did you decide there were gargoyles in Xanadu and Pukhan?
When did you decide that there was going to be a gargoyle clan in New Camelot?
When did you decide that Paris, Queen Florence Island and Wyvern were the sites of future clans?

Greg responds...

Years ago. By 1996 at the latest.

Years ago. By 1995 at the latest.

Years ago. By 1996 at the latest.

Years ago. By 1996 at the latest.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

Is the Ultra-Pack still around in 2198?

Greg responds...

Not saying.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

How similar is Coyote-X to Ultron?

Greg responds...

Not very similar at all, I think.

The one thing I 'homaged' was the whole numbering system, though we modernized the idea into computer style upgrades.

Ultron is an influence, obviously, but I think the differences between the two, both in terms of goal and style speak for themselves.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

What was the difference between the original NO show and the latter one that became part of the gargoyles universe besides Sphinx being Terry's girlfriend and Xanatos appearing? Were all the characters there including Helios, Jove, Borea and his son, Chiron, Ekidna, Taurus, Talos, Sphinx, Medusa and Terry and his mother?

Greg responds...

There were no differences except Xanatos.

Sphinx and Terry were always slated to be Romeo and Juliet.

The problem you're having is that I talk occasionally about brainstorming sessions and ideas from them. But that doesn't mean we have entire separate versions of these shows developed. In the first (and really only) version of New Olympians, the leads were Terry, Sphinx, Talos and Taurus, with all the supporting characters you mentioned, plus Proteus of course. (Oh, and Boreas has two sons.) And it's Kiron not Chiron.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

Have you seen Batman Beyond?
What do you think of it?
I've been told that the design of Terry McGinnis from BB is similar to that of Terry Chung of the NO any truth to that?

Greg responds...

Yes.

I think it's very well made. And I like certain things about it. But it just feels more Spider-Manish to me than Batman.

Well, there's no final model for Terry Chung, but from what I've seen, no. For starters, Terry Chung is Chinese-American. Terry McGinnis isn't. And Terry Chung wears contemporary clothes. Terry McGinnis wears... well... clothes from beyond.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

I the original version of New Olympians that you made was Ekidna Medusa's mother?
Was Sphinx in the original? If so what role did she serve?

Greg responds...

Yes.

Yes.

The exact same role.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

Are there any other sentient races native to our solar system besides Lost race,Gargoyles,Humans,Fae and New olympians? If so care to list a few?

Greg responds...

If there were, I wouldn't list them. But there aren't. But if there were, I wouldn't list them.

(All this of course ignores our recent discussions about the misuse of the term 'sentient'.)

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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matt writes...

when Demona returned to Wyvern in City of Stone and saw the humans taking the eggs from the rookery and putting them in that wagon to take away, why didn't she try to stop them? grief stricten or not, until i saw "City of Stone" i would've thought Demona must've run off and never returned cuz she would've saved the eggs! but then we see her just almost ignore the fact that the humans are running off with her children! she doesn't know why the remaining gargs are stone and she probably can't help them in any way, but don't you think she could've "saved" the eggs? why didn't she? and whats really weird is in "The Reckoning" she says to Angela, "typical humans... they steal our children" but what did SHE do to stop them? i guess shes pushing blame on the humans again...

Greg responds...

I think you've answered your own question. And at any rate, I'm currently not inclined to interpret for you. I will simply say that we put on the screen what we intended, fully aware of the ramifications.

I'll leave it to you to interpret. (Particularly since I've covered this before.) Try raising it as a topic in the comment room.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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Gipdac writes...

*Macbeth/Demona/Hunter/2198*
1) Do the Canmore siblings (The Hunters) know about Macbeth (What, with his still being alive and all)?
2) Have they ever tried to hunt him?
3) Does Macbeth have any descendants living by 1996?
4) Do the Canmores (at least the ones descended from Jon) still hunt Demona in 2198?

Greg responds...

1. Not saying.
2. Not saying.
3. Not saying.
4. There are no more Canmores, at least not of that line. But the Castaways still hunt her. Her and all gargoyles through the Quarrymen.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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matt writes...

when Puck transforms the human population to gargs why is it that Elisa and the three teen girl gargs in the subway not have brow ridges or horns of any kind? every other gargoyle we've seen except for the English gargs had either horns or brow ridges or both, but these transformed humans had neither. in fact, besides the pointed ears and color difference (which Elisa didn't even have) their bodies from the neck up looked very human, not gargoyle. was it cuz you wanted these characters to be physically attractive to human viewers even as gargs? cuz i think physically Desdemona is more attractive than Demona or Angela and Des has big old horns, so why make these characters as gargs so human looking?

would you have objected to the animators giving Elisa a beak or a frill or any of the other non human features of gargs?

Greg responds...

Yes, I would have objected to Elisa getting a beak, because she wouldn't have looked viserally like Elisa. Other changes that were less significant would not have bothered me.

However, I loved the design they came up with and didn't question it.

As for the girls in the subway. MINOR, minor characters. There wasn't as much time to do all this stuff as you seem to think. We just had to get it done.

Don't read too much into it though. We all think that Desdemona is attractive. Frank in particular likes drawing attractive females. I think Demona and Angela and Elisa are pretty hot too. Among other characters.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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Alissa writes...

Morning Greg. I have a little confusion going on reguarding dialog in episode "Hunter's Moon" 3. I was confused between the conversation going on over justice and vengance.

Scene Elisa's apartment after the clock tower bombing.
"The law?! What about Justice?"- Goliath
"I'm sorry but you don't want justice. You want vengance."-Elisa
"What?"
"Look at what this feud has cost us already."-Angela

I followed it just fine until this line "That's exactly why we must have vengance!"-Goliath
I thought he wanted justice? Goliath said Justice. Elisa said vengance. They(The clan)contradicted him then he worded about vengance. Am I missing something or is Goliath? Could you explain to me the scene here. Thank you :)

Greg responds...

No. That is, I could. But I don't see any point. It speaks for itself. If you're asking whether we made a mistake, the answer is no. That is to say, we didn't forget and feed Goliath a word we didn't mean to.

I'll leave it for you to interpret why Goliath switched words.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

What was the original cast of Pendragon? I know the Magus and Arthur was there, but what about Griff? How did you reach the present cast of Arthur, Griff, Merlin and Blanchefleur? Did Griff come after the airing of MIA?

Greg responds...

Calling it 'the original cast' isn't quite fair. I was brainstorming and briefly considered having the Magus survive and travel off with Arthur.

But by the time the idea for Pendragon (the spin-off series) solidified, I already knew that the Magus would make the ultimate sacrifice at Avalon and that in any case, I didn't need two magic users in the small group.

I knew early on I wanted Arthur and Griff and eventually Blanchfleur and Merlin. I knew I wanted Arthur to find Excalibur and then search for Merlin. I knew what I had planned for Blanchefleur and Percival/Duval. And yes, Griff turned out to be so much fun in MIA that I wanted to include him as well. But I can't put everything in a precise order for you. We were working on all these episodes (including Pendragon and MIA simultaneously). And the ideas were just coming to me then, fairly fast and furious.

But none of this came after the AIRING of MIA. Things aired LONG after the stories were written.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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Jim R. writes...

About a week ago in the Comment Room I asked about Arthur's stepbrother, Kay, and why he had not been mentioned in the TV movie "Mists of Avalon." I was just curious to ask would you make any notion to tell about Kay or any of Arthur's relatives in a Pendragon spinoff?

Greg responds...

In flashback, at least, yes. I always was fond of Kay.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

I meant his New Camelot knights not that of old Camelot.

Greg responds...

Oh.

Well, still, no.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

Care to list the names of Arthur's knights?

Greg responds...

All of them?

No, I do not care to do that.

(Do your own research, pal.)

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

Is Morgana at the Gathering on Avalon? What about Nimue?

Greg responds...

One is. One isn't.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

Was the number of the search for Merlin episodes suppose to be around the number of World Tour episodes?

Greg responds...

I haven't quantified it at all.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

Does Duval or the Illuminati know where Merlin is?

Greg responds...

No.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

It seems from the answers that you've given that you don't have any plans for the Green Knight is my assumption true? If so why don't you have any plans for him?

Greg responds...

I do have plans for him. Now.

I didn't when I first started that "Guess the Arthurian survivors" contest YEARS ago. Because, I had forgotten about him. But halfway through the contest I remembered him. And in the intervening years (YEARS) I've had plenty of time to figure out what to do with him.

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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Anonymous writes...

What exactly is your version of Roswell Conspiracies about?

Greg responds...

A skip tracer tracking a bail jumper, who's also being pursued by other factions and is in pursuit of something herself. They wind up joining forces with each other and with one of the factions.

(At least that's the main story in my version of the pilot. For more details, ask someone who was at Gathering '99 in Dallas.)

Response recorded on September 11, 2001

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LIFE IN THE REAL WORLD

This is something I wrote YEARS ago. But I don't think it's here in ASK GREG, or if it is, it's only in the old archives. Vash dug it up recently, and I thought I'd reprint it here, verbatim, I've added a few notes in [brackets]:

Life in the real world.

I know I've said this stuff before. Please read this carefully. I have a real fear that this might sound defeatist or condescending, but you can't possibly succeed in "saving" the show if you don't come to terms with these hard truths. I don't know what you've been told by other people. But I do know a few things about today's animation market. I've told you before that I did not believe that Gerry Leybourne was single-handedly responsible for not renewing the show. Dean Valentine is also not single-handedly responsible. Neither is Eisner. If the fans insist on looking for a VILLAIN to blame, they stand no chance. [Neither Leybourne or Valentine are at Disney anymore.] You say you're looking for a straight answer. But really you've been given and have ignored straight answers and what you are looking for is for simple answers. There are none. Here are some (but not all) of the many factors that have probably played into the non-renewal:

1) Quantity. A normal syndication package for any children's show is 65 episodes. If you don't make it up to 65 then you are considered something of a failure. If you make 65, then you have created a show that can have ongoing library use. That's a success. Anything above 65 is gravy and NO SHOW makes more than 65 episodes without significant financial incentive. They made 78 gargoyles (including Chronicles). The financial incentive for the last 13 was that ABC needed a boys action show with some "Marquee" attached to help fill out it's Saturday Morning line-up. You'll notice that no new episodes were made for syndication. There was no financial incentive in syndication. So they didn't make any more for syndication. [These days a syndication package can be as few as 39.]

2) Ratings. The ratings for Goliath Chronicles are, or so I'm told, lousy. Forget about the why for a moment, and just absorb this fact. If the ratings are lousy, we've just lost the financial incentive to make any more beyond the 13. On that level, Goliath Chronicles objectively failed. Gargoyles did a bit better in its day, but it never broke out and knocked down the competition. Aladdin did better business for Disney. And they're not making any more new Aladdin tv episodes either.

3) Shelf space. The Disney Afternoon, as we know it, is dead. The rise of FOX, the WB and UPN ate up almost all of the existing independent stations that aired the Disney Afternoon or (in lieu of the full two hour block) the individual shows that made up The Afternoon. We've known this was coming for awhile. Existing contracts kept the Afternoon alive through the end of this season. But after that it is gone in it's present form. Now, as I understand it, Disney has made a deal with Kelloggs to do a reduced version of the Afternoon. I think it's supposed to be an hour and a half long, with one new show and two library shows. The new show for next season is 101 Dalmations. For fall of 98, it's supposed to be HERCULES. There isn't room for new Gargoyles in syndication. ABC has similar problems. As a broadcast network, they've committed to air 3 hours of FCC/Kid friendly programming per week. That means 3 hours of their morning have to be reserved for that kind of programming, because unlike Fox, they don't have any other place in their schedule to air this FCC stuff. That only leaves them with about one and a half hours to fill their morning. They have an existing commitment to the Bugs Bunny cartoons that they air for an hour. That leaves them with one half hour slot to fill. Given Goliath Chronicles ratings, it just doesn't make sense to fill that one slot with a show that's failing, when you can take a chance on something new that might succeed.

4) Resources. The fans seem to regard Disney as this Giant that can do whatever it wants, and that's true up to a point. But Disney TV Animation has limited resources. There are only so many talented animators and storyboard artists out there. There's only so much money they can spend without profits to justify the expense. From Disney's point of view, Gargoyles had its shot. You and I may quibble about how that shot was handled. Whether it could have been handled better. I think everyone would acknowledge that mistakes were made. But not intentionally. EVERYONE at Disney wanted the show to be a huge success. IT WAS NOT. I wish I could tell you different. Creatively, I'm very proud of the show. We touched a substantial group of people. But an even more substantial group preferred POWER RANGERS on a consistent basis. They cleaned our clock. Disney has to decide how to allocate limited resources. If Gargoyles had 78 shots to be a hit, and didn't quite make it, you can see why they might think it's time to allocate their resources to something else.

5) Quality. Resources came into play with Goliath Chronicles. The decision was reached to allocate priority resources to shows and home videos that they believed had a better chance to break out. That's why Chronicles looks the way it does. In my opinion, the show is inferior to the original on almost every level. This doesn't mean that a lot of good people didn't work their butts off to make it as good as it could be. But limited resources result in limited success. The resource issue was the major reason why I walked away. I regret it now. The animation has been weak, but I should not have passed up the opportunity to tell twelve more of my stories. But that's spilled milk. Eric Lewald was under the gun from the moment he came on board the show. There wasn't adequate time to make the show at its previous quality level. There wasn't even adequate time for Eric to become as familiar with the show as I'm sure he would have liked to. I tried to help. I was paid to consult. But...

6) Time. Along with limited resources, the main reason Chronicles isn't up there is Time. The show didn't get a go ahead until late november '95. I began "The Journey" in December. Eric didn't really come aboard until January '96, as I recall. Look at where we are now. It's late February [1997]. Do you really want to see the GARGOYLES episode that would result if it started from scratch now and had to air in September [1997]? I WOULD NOT.

7) Expectations. I do believe that Disney in general views the show as a disappointment. They had tremendous high hopes for it. They rushed 52 episodes into production for it's second year despite my warning that they'd have to air a lot of reruns in between new episodes. The reruns, the weaker stations we were on and many other factors, including series content resulted in a solid but decidedly unspectacular performance. I do believe that the high expectations that many at Disney had for the show, led to greater disappointment in its real failure to break out and its perceived failure in general. That disappointment doesn't make a lot of people feel inclined to make more.

8) Strategy. O.k., I'm not at Disney anymore, so I'm not privy to their strategy meetings, but from outside observation, it doesn't seem like Gargoyles fits in their overall strategy plans. Maybe it never truly did. Now we can be mad about this. We can even try to change it. But first and foremost, we should be glad they made the show at all. Next we should realize that if it doesn't fit their plans, they aren't going to be too inclined to change them IN THE SHORT TERM.

9) Management. (The one I suppose you've been waiting for if you still insist on playing the blame game.) There has been a lot of management shake ups at Disney. Jeffrey Katzenberg, Rich Frank, Gary Krisel and Bruce Cranston all left. So did I. We were all supporters of the show. But Eisner didn't leave and he was a supporter too. I haven't talked to him recently. I don't know what he thinks about the show. Maybe he's disappointed. Maybe he's not. Maybe for him it's just the resource issue. Gotta take a shot with something new. Maybe he's not involved in this decision in a significant way. No way to know. But I wouldn't be so quick to label him a villain. It doesn't hurt to let him know that you love the show, but it can't help to blame him for its demise.

I don't know Gerry at all. I've never met her. I'm also a little vague on her responsibilities at Disney, thought I've heard she's responsible for scheduling ABC's Saturday morning. But before you blame her, or even guess at what she personally feels about the show, reread all the above, particularly the section on shelf space, strategy and ratings. Now she may not like the show. I have no idea. Neither do you. If she doesn't care for the show, I'd personally be curious to know what she bases her dislike on. Goliath Chronicles? Gargoyles? Both? Whatever, she's entitled to her opinion.

I've met Dean. I've heard that Gargoyles isn't his thing. I've heard that he believes that it may not be Disney's thing either. But I don't know any of that. And again, Dean's personal view of the show is, positive OR negative, way down on the list of reasons not to make more. See above.

Buena Vista. Mort Marcus ran Buena Vista at the time I left Disney. I have no idea if he's still there. Mort was a big early supporter of the show. He was also very disappointed when it didn't perform up to expectations. Buena Vista is taking its next shots with Dalmations and Hercules. But even if the Afternoon had survived, there wouldn't be any new episodes of Gargoyles in syndication. Look at the Disney Afternoon's history. A new show premieres with new episodes. Over the next few years, the reruns move down through the Afternoon. That's cause they couldn't afford the MILLIONS of Dollars that it would take to make new episodes for early time slots that don't deliver very many kids. If there aren't any (or many) butts sitting in front of the t.v. then advertisers don't want their products advertised there, in which case they don't pay much for commercials. So networks won't pay much for the shows, so the shows operate at HUGE budget deficits. Gargoyles operated at a huge deficit. Ultimately, I'm sure it will make an overall profit for the company. It may have already. But let's not pretend this was the LION KING.

Other divisions. Some did better than others. But no one is clamoring for more gargoyles product, so none of the other divisions are clamoring for more shows.

SO WHAT DO WE DO?

We begin by admitting, at least to ourselves, that in the short term, we lost the battle.

Then we go on and try to win the war.

We have one big chance and a general small chance. Both are long shots.

The Big Chance is the Touchstone Live Action Feature. If this ever gets made and if it succeeds, then there will be renewed interest in the show.

The general chance is that television is cyclical. He-Man rules until DuckTales comes along. Rescue Rangers rule until Batman comes along. Soft and quirky is big now. But times change. And Gargoyles has a marquee. (It's a trifle damaged, but it's real.) There's a chance it could come back.

The best thing we can do is keep the flame burning. Keep executives, particularly if there's any executive turnover, informed that there is a fan base for the property. Write letters to Buena Vista, to Eisner, to ABC, to Disney TV Animation, to Touchstone. Write letters to local stations, asking them to air reruns. Write letters to the Disney Channel for the same thing. If the reruns are airing in the U.S., we have a much better chance of someday making new episodes. Keep these letters respectful. Don't try to assign blame. My god, what difference does that make. If I thought it would help I'd take 100% of the blame myself. I certainly deserve some of it. Just let people know that you loved the show. Praise it's virtues. Show "Deadly Force", "Lighthouse..." and "The Green" at grade schools. Make the GATHERING a yearly event. Increase it's budget and scope on a slow and steady basis until it becomes an important event. (Don't try to get too big too fast. If you go bust early on, you won't get a second chance.) Keep the fan base excited about the show. (This to me is the main virtue to the whole fanfic thing, which I have many mixed feelings about. If it keeps the fans interested, great.) Don't let the fans marginalize themselves with hostility or esoterica. If they get territorial they keep new fans out. No new fans. No new episodes. Prove to Disney that you are part of that great consumer demographic that they are hunting for. BUY STUFF. Buy all the stuff you can find. Prove that the show can still make money for the company. Buy all the videos off the shelf. Then write Disney's home video division and have them make more. More copies of existing tapes and more episodes on tape. Show those taped episodes to new fans. Particularly young fans. Adults and college kids are great too, but if kids don't like the show, we are doomed. Try to convince Disney records to release Carl's music on C.D. Buy animation cells from authorized Disney dealers. Talk it up.

As for the petition, hell, make copies. Send it a lot of places. Buena Vista for sure. Don't worry about whether or not it's read cover to cover by the president of the division (Mort Marcus, I think). It'll make an impression. But I don't see why you shouldn't send it to Gerry too. Send it to Dean Valentine at Disney T.V. Animation. Send it to Barry Blumberg (at the same place). Have someone in every market send it to their local ABC affiliate. Gerry isn't giving you bad advice there. If the local stations want the show, they'll make their voices heard at the network. (But remember, you need locals to send it to local stations. A petition postmarked Newark won't be taken very seriously in Cleveland.) Send it anywhere you think it might help. But you might want to read it over first. If it's full of hostile and antagonistic attacks, then we've marginalized the petition. Also try to make sure that there's no doubling up. If people signed the petition twice and Disney figures that out, then they'll figure the entire document is compromised, and they'll freely ignore it. If it's a rational statement from real existing fans than I promise you it'll make a positive impression.

But I don't want to kid you. We are probably past the point of no return, at least for this coming fall [1997]. I appreciate that you refuse to give up, and I'm not telling you to. But if you want to save yourself some heartbreak, I think you might want to start focusing on the long term instead of the short term. Even if we could change everyone's minds overnight, we've all but run out of time to put new episodes of any quality on the air by September. I don't like saying that, but I figure it doesn't help anyone to beat around the bush.

Now let me say in advance that most of this won't work. Sorry. The odds are against us. I take some consolation in knowing I was involved with 66 episodes that I can be proud of. I told the stories I wanted to tell. Not nearly all of them, but many. I ended it with Hunter's Moon and Journey, in a way that gave us some small closure but left it open in case I get another shot. A shot I'm longing for. All this offers some consolation. I hope you and the other fans feel the same. It's something to hold onto through what's bound to be a LOT OF REJECTION. There are no guarantees that we'll ever get the show back on the air in any form. But what I've written above is the most practical plan I can think of. If I can help in any way, let me know.

Otherwise, Good Luck. You are going to need it.

GREG


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THE FAQ

I just read through the entire ASK GREG FAQ. WOW!!!!!

JEB and GXB!!! THANKS GUYS!!!!

Four corrections:

1. In 2198 there are only twelve clans. Queen Florence is added later. Paris, later still.

2. "Hobgoblin of Little Minds" and "The Weird Macbeth" (formerly "Puck's Macbeth") were two different story ideas. The one described in the FAQ is "The Weird Macbeth". So far, I have given no details on "Hobgoblin".

3. There have been at least six writers (that I know of) on the Live Action Gargoyles movie.

4. I never worked on the Disney Tarzan Animated series. I was offered a job on it, but I was busy voice directing 3x3 Eyes at the time, so I had to pass.

But given all that information, I'm amazed that there's so little for me to correct. Again, thank you. (Now, let's hope people look at it.)


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Siryn writes...

Hey Greg!

A few Questions All about VInnie! ^_^

1. Jeff Bennett did Vinnie's voice, however were there any times when he did not do the character's voice? (For example, in "Awakenings" The very first time we see Vinnie is on his motorcycle. That yell that Vinnie does when he sees Lexington, is that Jeff's voice yelling or someone else?)
2. If the above is yes, who did Vinnie's voice as well as Jeff?
3. In the series, is Vinnie single, or is there a 'special someone' in his life?
4. How long did he work at each of his respective jobs for?

Thankyou so much Greg! ^_^

Greg responds...

1. I don't recall. It wouldn't surprise me if it was Jeff.
2. No one did "Vinnie's voice" except Jeff. But if you're talking about a grunt here and there, it's possible someone else might have done the character before we knew the character was Vinnnie. In which case, I definitely don't recall. But odds are Jeff was still doing those grunts.
3. He's available. (Didn't I just answer this?)
4. Well... I don't have my timeline here to give you the exact length of his tenure at Gen-U-Tech, but it was clearly short. I haven't given any thought as to how long he worked at Cyberbiotics before being fired.

Response recorded on September 09, 2001


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